Trueface

Bill Thrall // Humility and Love

January 23, 2020 Trueface
Trueface
Bill Thrall // Humility and Love
Show Notes Transcript

On this weeks episode of the NEW Trueface podcast, Robby interviews Trueface Co-Founder, Bill Thrall on the principles of Humility and Grace and how they work together. As always, if you enjoyed this episode please share it with a friend and rate us 5 stars! 


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Robby Angle:   0:00
Welcome to the Trueface podcast where we discuss principles that help us live beyond the mass. My name is Robby Angle. I'm the president here, a Trueface and we are into a new year. 2020. It's really a new decade in the twenties, which is crazy, but we wanted to start off by launching this new Trueface Podcasts. Oh, there's a lot of you who have been listening over the years to this podcast. And obviously this one's coming at you sound and differently, and this is going to be the new wave of this new chapter of the podcast moving forward. We're gonna have some guests on here where, and we're going to talk about principles and then how those apply to our lives and you are part of the true face team. There's about half a 1,000,000 listens to this podcast over the past six years, which is just crazy and a lot of those are from you and me who have been listening and part of this team over the years, where were wrestling with these principles of grace and truth and identity and implying them into our lives. And it's It's changed my life. And that's why it's such an honor to be here today as the host moving forward. And one of the perks of working on this true face team is working alongside our guest today. Bill, Throw Bill. Throw, as you know, is one of the founders of true face. He turned 80 last year in 2019 and he has been a personal mentor of mine over the past few years and is just an incredible man. And so I am really, really excited to welcome Bill to the podcast. Bill, welcome to the new version of the true face. Podcast this. You've done a few 100 of these, but this is your first time on the new format?   

Bill Thrall:   1:51
Yes. Yes, it is. Robby. It's great to join you. Thank you, brother. Great to be here.

Robby Angle:   1:58
It's been a journey in transition and working together. And as I mentioned on the podcast with Bruce as I stepped into this role as president, one of the things that I was vetting and praying through is, how are Bill and Bruce and John going to empower and entrust me as a next generation leader with the keys to this thing that they have poured their time and energy and resource is into over the past 25 years as you started this thing about 25 years ago. And so far you have been, textbook for me, Bill on doing that on in trusting and empowering the next generation. And it's been It's been a really fun season with you and I am I'm

Bill Thrall:   2:41
So Amen. Robbie, I I feel the same way towards you. You know what I have said on several occasions when we have been together that you're a man that I believe sees the possible, and because of that you have the willingness to pay the price for the possible to become reality. And that's what we've been all these years. All of all these years, it's been a process of seeing a message of grace become a reality in the lives of thousands of people. So I see that in you. I hear that in you. I love coming alongside you with it, my friend.

Robby Angle:   3:19
It's it's gonna be fun. It has been so far, and I'm excited about this year on, and I'm excited about this new podcast and and I want to jump in.

Bill Thrall:   3:28
Well, one of the one of the things that that is foundational in our minds to understanding Grace is to understand this concept of humility in relationship to grace. In First Peter, Chapter five, he says, Clothes all of you with humility toward one another for God opposes the proud, but he gives grace to the humble somebody yourself. Therefore, under the mighty hand of God is that the proper time? He may exalt you. There's, like 17 tons of theology of most few statements. But but but the reality of what he's saying is that there's a promise here and the promise is amazing. He says that he gives grace to the humble. That's a promise. For years and years, we, Bruce and I and John, we struggled with trying to put a practical application on this amazing truth. And what we've learned is that for many, humility has been a behavioral dynamic. And if you have it, you know you can't talk about it or you wouldn't have it. And so you just have that that dynamic and and we think it's more truth in the fact that it's a relational, not a behavioral truth and and what he's saying is close yourself off with humility toward one another. Because God gives grace to the humble and therefore the humble are those who trust God with who they really are. And the humble are those who trust others with who they really are. The humble are the ones whose heart say, I am not enough When I'm by myself, I need you, whoever you are. And if your name is God, I want to trust you With me were evangelicals and so is evangelicals. We will preach the gospel as a principle of grace where I trust Jesus as my savior, and I will experience grace, and we believe that, and we should believe that it's biblical. But lots of us struggle with the application of grace when it comes to our lives. But the principle is the same. If I'm a person that could trust Jesus with my sin, I'd like to lose a person that can trust Jesus with my life, and God gives grace to those who trust him. And in one of the amazing dynamics of this whole truth of grace, is that the God who gives us grace his name is locked. It's amazing, he said. God is love. And so what happens is when I trust God and he gives me grace. I experience love and and and we know this and we know it biblically. I shouldn't say we know this, but we know what biblically that The great example that we belong to Jesus Christ is our love for one another. But for many, many, many Christians, at least lots of places we've been that there is no relationship with their understanding between grace trust in love. And and that's the That's the dynamic that were hope people will capture because that's where it begins. I cannot. No one, no one can have a relationship with God, a perfect trust. No one and God doesn't want us to trust him because he's an egomaniac. No, God wants us to trust him so that something can happen when I trust God. I will experience through his grace his law, and that's the That's the point. We want to make sure people capture God is love and he wants to love us. My simple statement is, wouldn't it be great if we'd let him? And and if we don't let him love us. It's because we don't trust him. Um, part of my life story is, is the application of this inn in principle in my relationship with my wife,

Robby Angle:   7:46
So you're saying that the primary outcome is experiencing his love. That's his nature. That's the design.

Bill Thrall:   7:55
That's right. In other words, way have a little saying that I have lots of little things. But but one of missus, the degree to which I trust you Even if your name is God, The degree to which I trust you is the degree to which I can experience your love No matter how much love you have for me it. And if your name is God, if I don't trust you, I could never experience your love. If people could just hear that and believe that and go, I really want to experience the love of God in others. Well, that's a good idea. Why don't you learn to trust them? Well, that would require your humility. That would be that would require your heart of hearts saying, You know, God, I really need you. I really need you. And so then therefore I can experience love when I trust The tragic reality is this In a lot of our cultures, especially with men, that macho thing is I don't trust anyone. Well, let me tell you something. The person who chooses to trust, um no one is the person who is choosing to be loved by no. Well, that's pretty. That's a pretty powerful reality.

Robby Angle:   9:13
Yo, if you are listening to this on two times speed on the treadmill or driving, you might want to hit that 32nd back quite a few times and put it to one time speed. Build these principles, um, are principles that are gonna take us a lifetime to grasp and experience. Um, how have they come up? I I interrupted you a minute ago about your how this is showing up in your relationship with Grace. Give me a handle as to what this looks like.

Bill Thrall:   9:45
You know? Well, um, like with my my wife. Um, five years into our marriage, I was a young C.P.A. In those days, young businessman and I came home from work, and she, uh when I met her at the door, she said, Bill, we need to go for a driver. Got something really important I talk to you about. And for the 1st 5 years she never greeted me like that. And I'm not real smart. But I knew something was up and my initial response to her saying that Waas what is she discovered that I've been hiding? That was my honest deep in my heart response. And we drove from my house in Phoenix to a little place in Scottsdale where we would meet to talk and she didn't say anything. I wasn't going to, and I was literally perspiring into my suit because I was trying to prepare every d Spence I could imagine to all the stuff I was hiding. And when we got there, she was unbelievably well prepared. Um, she prayed a lot about it, apparently, And when we got there, she said, Bill, I'm going to say some things to you that is really gonna hurt you that I know that But she said, You have to hear me and she said to me, Bill, I'm I'm really, really unhappy in our marriage. And I paused there with her and I thought, This isn't about me, it's about her. She's unhappy and I did a brilliant, Robbie. I did a brilliant male thing. I I kind of rehearsed with her. Why did you be unhappy? You know, we've got our own home. We have two kids. I've got a great job we're in the youth group or any of the youth group, that church. And And it kind of sounded like this. How can you be unhappy? You're married to me. Which was, of course, the seat of their happiness. But then she said something that God used to change my life. Thank God she said, Bill, Uh, would you like to know why I'm happy? And I said, Yeah. And she said, Bill, we can't be in a visitation ship. Only you get so love me. Why won't you let me love you? Why can't you trust me? And and I had never, ever in my whole life connected trust with love, and I'd never, ever, ever trusted my wife with me. And I never trusted her with my stuff. But God used her language to pierce my heart and and I couldn't help it. I just started dumping all the stuff that I was afraid she would have found out that I needed to defend myself with. And instead of holding back, I just kept telling her I cried like I'd never cried before. And I trusted my wife for the first time with me. And I humbled myself that day and God gave me Grace literally. My wife was Name is Grace, but I experienced love that day. I never knew that my inability to trust was robbing me of experiencing love. I grew up in a family. I grew up in a family, my parents when I was young. We're both really sick. But alcoholism? The state of Wisconsin took us away from our parents for a season. And so, you know, I I'm sure that I've got legitimate reasons for not being able to trust. But I love Grace. I love her deeply, and I knew she loved me, but I didn't know is how to experience love. And she did something that night. She did several things that night, but she did something that night that was profound because she made an application of a biblical truth. It says, Uh, love, love literally can handle CM, and and I I just never knew that I was so afraid. If she would discover who I really waas, I would be rejected, and I couldn't live with the possibility of her rejection. But I never knew what I was doing was hiding me from the thing I needed the most. And that was her love. So that night she listened and loved me, and I never, ever before had ever experienced telling anymore what was true about me. She scared me so badly that she was gonna leave the car. When I get to my junk, she passed a couple times. She would say, What would you do that? That's so stupid. But this is man. She she didn't have to know why I did it. But it began that night to be used of God to change my life. And that's really the miracle Grace. The miracle of grace is that in any moment, a trust in car changes the rest of her life. Always us. Every principle of grace that is believed changes our life forever. And and that's the That's the message that I think is critical for people to hear. Is it possible for me to trust God today with this? Because if I trusted with this in my shed, milady. He'll give me grace. Then any time I experienced Grace, my life will never be the same.

Robby Angle:   15:16
Bill, I'm I'm trying to get my head around these principles. Um, because I know and I'm thinking of my relationships because with those close friends with my kids with my wife, Emily, I I know. And I assume a lot of people listening know that we all have ceilings of experiencing love and how we can receive love and therefore receive experience grace that are limited compared to what they could be, right? I mean, I supervise all of us so in, in, in, trusting somebody in order to experience love and therefore be transformed by that grace. If I'm saying that right, is it is it Oh, it is it in sharing of my sin that unlocks that and builds trust, or I'm trying to understand what

Bill Thrall:   16:15
Yeah, looks like I e would say if this were obvious, it's imagine the sharing of my person Okay, including including my sin. What if I could learn to trust somebody with who I and, well, by the way, I'm all screwed up. Yeah, but I'm not just all screwed up the bill that met with his wife that night. Guess had a gracious heart. I love kids. I wanted to. I wanted to lead a young people to Christ. I had all kinds of ambition. But I also had this agenda of keeping myself protected from anybody really knowing me, because I had this dynamic in me. It's called shame, but I have this dynamic in me that convinced me that you would never really love me if you really knew me. Yeah, and what live we tell ourselves? It's It's a lie. No, just the opposite Love can handle Sin Jesus proved that it Calvary, you know, way everybody, everybody, most everybody keeps trying to get up every day to be a better person, so they'll be loved more instead of understanding. If you could just learn to trust, you'd be loved more and it's it's a matter of It's a matter of could be in convinced in my heart of hearts that my father in heaven loves me and and that I'm gonna learn to experience giving my father in heaven my person and with my person comes my drunk, and it also comes all of wonderful gifts, talents, ambitions and goals that he gave to me. And that's my purse. It was that It's not just giving God my junk. It's giving. Got my person He created me, gave me what I have What? What if this wonderful father in heaven wants to give me grace by releasing in me what he has created in me for his glory?

Robby Angle:   18:27
Wow, Now all right. My head is limited in its capacity to understand this stuff. So So, Bill, let me pause and take a minute to try to apply this, um and and help us listening to this, um, figure out howto apply this because I just heard a couple things. Um, again, the principle of all this is so rooted in our identity and our belief about ourselves and that and that allows us to either have a perspective that we need to do better to be loved or if we're freed in our identity in Christ. And we can trust others with our person in order to receive love free from the the exhausting attempt to do better to receive their love, which doesn't end up receiving their love anyways.

Bill Thrall:   19:20
exactly

Robby Angle:   19:21
And if I'm trusting other shame is the impediment to that. But you're saying that's not the That's a primary impediment, that the shame of how screwed up I am gets in the way of me being able to trust others. But you're saying what it looks like in our relationships with God and with other people. Is that trusting them, Not just with our our sin and going God, I'm an idiot, you know, these are my sins and other people. Hey, this is the last time I did this or looked at that or whatever. No, it's It's trusting somebody with my person, which is also the good, and it's really it's who. It's my emotions. It's my hopes. It's my dreams. It's my fears. It's my sin. It's just who I am that I'm choosing to trust you with witches can only be done if it's rooted in a security and who God says I am. That frees me from that right?  

Bill Thrall:   20:20
I was Robby. I was convinced for my early twenties. I was convinced that my sin I was going to keep me from ever enjoying God's purposes for my life. I was convinced to that, and I was. I was convinced that what he had created in me was lost because I couldn't trust him with that. It's I made a lot of people. Robby. It is amazing the number of Christians who are no longer believing the dream they have for who got says they are. They just don't know how to trust God with the person of who he says they are. I really went through a season after this experience with Grace, my wife, where I had to really say to God, God, I'm able and willing to accept who you have made me. I want to live out of that man. That was profound. It was life changing. That's what we're talking about, Robby.

Robby Angle:   21:27
That is so significant that to go to God as a practical step and say, Father, I want to accept how you made me so that I can live out of that. Absolutely. You say in applying everybody listening to this. That's something that if that's the foundation to the outcome of eventually experiencing his love and connection and love to those around me, I think that's a healthy that that is what I hear you saying is what we do with this today that we go first to the father and say, God, I can't do this. I I want to accept how you've made me

Bill Thrall:   22:08
and and to me, the best way I don't have is let your heart tell you the truth. How much you need to be loved and say to your father God, I'm gonna trust you with me with me. And I want to be loved and I wanna learn. Father, teach me. It's one of the prayers. I say a lot to a lot of people got teach me to trust you with me. He can handle that prayer you didn't stepper because he's nuts about us. And somehow we have this performance dynamic that robs us of the freedom to be who we really are. That's the application. I don't know how God teach me to trust you with who I am.

Robby Angle:   22:59
Bill, this has been such a blessing to me and ah, I've got notes for days and I can't wait to listen to this one again. I am so thankful for you. Your mentorship, your model, your leadership in my life and so many lives. And it is an honor. Um, to be on this journey with you and for everybody listening. I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did. And if you're listening to this thank you for being part of the true face team for supporting us for following us. If this is beneficial, please Like it on iTunes or wherever you're listening. Subscribe to it and share with friends. Thank you, Bill. And we will see you guys in two weeks with next.