What Does The Bible Say?

What Does The Bible Say About Morally Intolerant Christians?

June 07, 2020 Woodland Season 2 Episode 23
What Does The Bible Say?
What Does The Bible Say About Morally Intolerant Christians?
Show Notes Transcript

Parents are advised that as discreetly as possible, Fred and Arnie will discuss Bible passages involving moral issues of adultery, incest and homosexuality, including one verse that refers to sexual abuse of children. We hear a lot these days about how intolerant and hypocritical Christians are regarding supposedly normal human behavior. This is true not only today, but indeed in the past, even over the past 2,000 years. There are synonyms for normal which include common, usual, regular, standard, and natural. Sinful behavior is what is normal among grown-up people, and even adolescents, although not all commit the same sins. And it is true that every Christian has acted normally in his past according to Romans 3:23-24, but ideally, he has learned to reject sinful behaviors and labors to live "soberly, righteously and godly in this present world". Take about 30 minutes to listen in on this discussion of the false charge against faithful Christians by those in the world who want to normalize and justify their sinful behaviors.

Fred 
This is a presentation of the Woodland church of Christ meeting at 3370 Broad Street in Sumter, South Carolina. We meet for worship on Sunday at 10:30am, 5:30pm. We meet for bible study at 9:30am on Sunday at 7pm on Wednesday. If you have questions or comments on this lesson you may email them to Fred Gosnell at fgosnell@ftc-i.net  or to Arnie Granke at agranke440718@twc.com.

Arnie 
Good afternoon. This is Arnie Granke and Fred Gosnell with Woodland  church of Christ in Sumter, South Carolina. This is What Does the Bible Say? Let me begin first by addressing parents and saying that as discreetly as possible, this lesson will discuss Bible passages involving some moral issues, adultery, incest, homosexuality, including one verse that refers to sexual abuse of children. We will be as discreet as possible. We hear a lot these days about how intolerant and hypocritical Christians are regarding supposedly normal human behavior. And not just these days, but that was also true in the past. Indeed, over the past 2000 years. synonyms of normal, include common, usual, regular, standard, natural. Sinful behavior is what is normal among grown up people and even adolescents, although not all commit the same sins. And it is true that every Christian has acted normally, if you will, in his past. Paul writes in Romans chapter three and verse 23 and 24 saying  For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God, being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus. But ideally, the Christian has learned to reject sinful behaviors and labors to live soberly, righteously and godly in this present world as Titus chapter two verse 12 says,

Fred 
Yeah, well, we might ask, well, are we disciples perfectly sinless? Now? Of course not. When we err, Bible teaches that we seek forgiveness when we strive to do better. And John writes about that in first John, one, verses five through 10. He writes, this then is the message which we have heard of him, and declaring to you that God is light and in him is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with Him and walk in darkness, we lie and do not truth. But if we walk in the light as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. So we urge godliness in others as we want to be godly, but we're not perfect.

Arnie 
Well, many more normal people hate us for what you've just read. And call us by derogatory terms like haters, misogynist, gay bashers. transphobic, Bible thumpers, Christians, as in Christians, with as much vinegar in there as I can muster I suppose. Peter writes in First Peter CHAPTER FOUR beginning in verse one for as much then as Christ has suffered, for us in the flesh, arm yourself, likewise with the same mind, for he that suffereth in the flesh has ceased from sin, that he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh, to the lusts of men, but to the will of God, for the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles. When we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excessive wine, revellings, banquetings and abominable idolatries. Wherein they think it strange that you run not with them to the same excess of riot, speaking evil of you, who shall judge who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead. You know, even before Nero falsely accused Christians have torching Rome in the first century, the practitioners of every Sin which they could achieve popular political or legal acceptability have introduced into their lexicon. novel terminology vilifying saints. Let's talk about what God says about some of these moral issues. Why don't we start with adultery Fred.

Fred 
Okay. Well, of course adultery is the seventh of the original Old Testament 10 commandments and in Exodus 20, verse 14, there it says, Thou shalt not commit adultery. Then in Leviticus chapter 20, verse 10, there it says, the man that commiteth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. So it was a it was a capital crime

Arnie 
And pretty grave situation there. Jesus encountered a situation with a woman in Jerusalem, who was alleged to have committed adultery very possibly she had, as a matter of fact. And John Chapter eight re records that. Jesus beginning in verse one, Jesus went into the Mount of Olives. And early in the morning He came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him and he sat down and taught   them. And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery. And when they had set her in the midst, they say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. Moses in the law commanded us that such should be stoned. What sayest, thou? This they said, tempting him that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down and with his finger, wrote on the ground as though He heard them not. So when they continued  asking Him, He lifted up Himself and said unto them, He that is without sin among you let him cast a stone at her. And again He stooped down, and wrote on the ground. And they which heard it being convicted of their own conscience went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even under the last, and Jesus was left alone and the woman standing in the midst. Remember there was a large crowd there as well. When Jesus had lifted up himself and saw none but the woman, he said, unto her, woman, where are those thine accusers? Hath no man condemned thee? She said no man, Lord. She said, No man, Lord, and I and Jesus said unto her, neither do I condemn thee. Go and sin no more. What I notice about that two things that I would just very quickly mention, is when he's talking about condemning, its not can it's not talking discussing condemning the act it's discussing Whether he would condemn her to death. None of them had done so, and he said that he would not. He did certainly, did not condone what she was alleged to have, have done. The second thing that that's very prominent here is Jesus doesn't just give her a pass. He said, quit sinning, go and sin no more. So, you know, I think that there's a lesson in there in that regard.

Fred 
That, course, everywhere that Jesus went, His, His, His message was, was repentance. And He said that in  Matthew four 17, one occasion, said, From that time, Jesus began to preach and to say, Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. But adultery is listed as a work of the flesh. And it always results in condemnation. Paul writes about it in Galatians, five verses 19 through 21. And he begins he says, Now in verse 19, The works of the flesh are manifest which are these adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have told you in time past, that they which do such thing shall not inherit the kingdom of God. This is a serious problem that Paul talks about when he discusses adultery,

Arnie 
In statistics of surveys that have to do with inquiring, who has committed adultery and so forth are all over the chart. There's no way of no really accurately knowing. But it certainly seems that there's a significant number, not only in America, but all over the globe, that, that do that. And God certainly condemns that. Incest. Let's talk about that because a lot of people think that's not an issue today. And they're wrong. It is. Many behaviors of moral turpitude are being considered now since the Obama Supreme Court declared same sex marriage a civil right. Group marriage, people reason, If if it's okay to for two men to marry or two women to marry, why not three or four men? why not three four or five women? Why not men and women. Why not a group marriage? Then Then of course one of the one of the thoughts has to do with with pedophilia. Hey, why not? Why not men and boys, women and and girls women with boys What about what about beastiality? Doesn't rover need love to? You know?  Incest is is certainly one of those. One of those issues that we that we need to consider and it's listed as a capital violation also under Moses law. That word's not actually used, the word incest. But there are a number of passages. Beginning in in Leviticus chapter 20 and verse 11, the man that lieth with his father's wife hath uncovered his father's nakedness, both of them shall surely be put to death, their blood shall be upon them. And if any man lie with his daughter in law, both of them shall surely be put to death. They have wrought confusion, their blood, shall be upon them. You want to check out a passage? you have a passage there?

Fred 
And it continues in Leviticus 18, six through nine, there, Moses writes, he says, Now, none of you shall approach to any that is near of kin, the him to uncover their their nakedness, the term to uncover their nakedness that that indication is that that there are a husband can take his wife's clothes off. That's that's allowed. But it's not allowed for him to take anybody else's clothes off. And that's the, this phrase uncovered one's a nakedness. And he says, I am the Lord. The nakedness of thy father or the nakedness of thy mother thou shalt  not uncover. She is thy mother thou shalt not uncover her nakedness The nakedness of thy father's wife shall thou not uncover, it is thy father's nakedness. The nakedness of thy sister, the daughter of thy father or daughter of thy mother, whether she be born at home or born abroad, even their nakedness Thou shalt not uncover. So there were clear regulations against incest with family members.

Arnie 
Deuteronomy 27 also addresses that, beginning in verse 20. Cursed be he that lieth with his father's wife, because he hath uncovered his father skirt, and all the people she'll say amen. Moses was speaking to them and laying out what the law was going to involve. And they were required to agree to that and that's why they're, they're saying that's how it is. So be it. Cursed be he that lieth with any manner of beast and all the people will say, Amen. Cursed be he that lieth with, this sister the daughter of his father or the daughter of his mother, and all the people shall say, Amen. Cursed be he that lieth with his father, with his mother in law, and all the people shall say, Amen. So as you're looking at this, these passages, really list just about every possible combination of participants. No one that's a relative in any way is is a prospect for marriage or for sexual relations.

Fred 
Well, exactly.  Well somebody might say, well Fred and Arnie,  No, that's that's that's the Old Testament. We're not under that anymore. Well, Paul, Paul dealt with that and in the church at Corinth in First Corinthians five one through 13. There he writes, he says that it is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and he's talking to the church at Corinth, and such fornication as it not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife and you are puffed up and have not rather mourned and that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. For I verily as absent in the body, but present the spirit have judged already, as though I were present concerning him that hath done so done this deed, In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together in my spirit with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? Purge out therefore the old leaven that ye may be a new lump, as ye are  unleavened. For even Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us. Therefore, let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators. Yet not  altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners or with idolaters; for then, must ye needs go out of the world. But now I have written unto you not to keep company, If any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner or such an one, no not to eat. For what have I  to do to judge them also that are without, do  not ye  judge them that are within? but them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves, that wicked person. So they had had an individual that was in the church, there at  Corinth. He had his father's wife, they didn't say anything to him about it. Paul says were you puffed up about it?

Arnie 
Yeah, they seem to have accepted it didn't they?

Fred 
Yeah. But Paul says, No, this is this is not allowed. And he says As a matter of fact, he says, You've got to separate from this individual, you've got to have no social contact with him. And but he says, Now, that's not the case with people in the world. Of course, the people in the world those are the people we're supposed to be teaching. Right? So so you don't separate from them. But this individual, that's a brother, he says, you've you've got to do something about this because a little bit of leaven leavens the whole lump, so he's affecting the whole congregation in what he's doing, and this is just not allowed. You've got to do something about it.

Arnie 
Well, and you know, and so you've shown here that not only did the Old Testament cover these normal situations, as people would have us  believe, but also the New Testament does as well. You know, I would simply note here that that God declared incest for example to be and and other things as well that we're discussing to be immoral long ago. What's changed? I don't think anything's changed here just because we've sent men to the moon and, and you don't have computers that we can communicate with. hasn't changed man's basic nature and hasn't changed the rules that God has, has given him. Fred, we've got well, my my stopwatch has stopped here. And we're a little short of time. What do you say that we wrap it up? No, we're not short of time. No, we got 16 minutes. Oh, well, I was looking at my watch and I thought we had seven minutes there. Okay, well, let's let's go ahead and roll then let's let's talk about the subject of sodomy. Because that, you know, when we're talking about sodomy, we're talking about homosexuality and and there's a, a tremendous movement, both among males and females in regard to that, Looking for acceptability and, and all that kind of thing. And it's also one of those things that's listed as a capital violation of Moses Law. In Leviticus chapter 18 verse 22, Thou shalt not lie with mankind as with womankind, it is abomination. Abomination is something that that's absolutely unacceptable from God's point of view. Leviticus chapter 20, verse 13, is another passage that discusses that if a man also lie with mankind as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them. Nobody that puts them to death is going to be guilty of murder. They brought it upon themselves and God has has decreed that and this is one of those things. We've talked about adultery, we've talked about incest. This is one of those things that's listed in that list. There, along with beastiality and a number of other things as well.

Fred 
Yes. And uh, again and somebody might say, well, Fred and Arnie, there you go again. You're talking about the Old Testament. We're not under that again. Well, but we are under the New Testament and it's talked about in, in Romans is that in the New Testament? Yes, Romans chapter 1, 24, through 28 and 32. And there what we refer to today as same sex activity. Paul writes there and he says, He begins using, Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lust of their own hearts, to dishonor their own bodies between themselves, who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.  For this cause God gave him up on to vile affections for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature. And likewise also the men leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error, which was meet. And even as I did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient. For knowing the judgment of God that they wish commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them, that do them. So LGBT people, they change God's truth into a lie. They want this behavior to be accepted in our society as acceptable and normal. And of course, that's just not the case. God says different Paul Paul specifically talks about this and it remains Just as unlawful in God's eyes today as it was when Paul wrote Romans 1, 24 through 28, and 32.

Arnie 
Well, I would just mention here that it's interesting that the word here for for men is not actually men, it's males. So it this is, this is true regardless of the age of the individual. And the same is true with with the word women, the word for women is actually females. So there's there's not to be any kind of that carnal relationship. But you're right the LGBT people have have tried to turn God's truth into a lie and that makes them false teachers and and we certainly need to be aware of that. Paul writes to Timothy in First Timothy chapter one, beginning in verse eight. Remember Timothy was preaching in Ephesus at the time And Ephesus had a lot of this kind of problem going on. There in in that congregation, Paul writes, But we know that the law is good if a man use it lawfully knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man. But for the, for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for man slayers for fornicators, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for men, stealers for liars for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that  is contrary to sound doctrine, according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust. The the term here that that used that says, them that defile themselves with with mankind is not nearly that long in expression. I think the King James translators might a little bit a little embarrassed actually put what what this passage says. It uses a word that literally means males who bed with males. It's a euphemism for sodomites. They euphemized it so that so that it would wouldn't sound quite as bad but that didn't change the badness of the of the problem.

Fred 
Right and and of course, we find out from what Paul writes that some of the Corinthians, the church, there at Corinth, had a lot of problems. But some of those Corinthians before they became a Christians were in fact sodomites. And and the word there is arsenokoitus. And people have to look that word up and figure that out. It's number 733, in Strong's number, but he writes First Corinthians six nine through 11 he says now know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God. Be not deceived, neither fornicators, By the way, the word fornicators there, the Greek word is pornos, is the word we get pornography from, for our listeners.

Arnie 
yeah, they of course I didn't have videos back then. But but this is a word that literally means fornication, any kind of outlawed sexual relationship falls in that category in a generic way,

Fred 
Right. Whether it's done or whether it's, uh, expressed in graphic detail by a picture or whatnot. Remember, Paul said that those were words that were worthy of death, even those that were happy to see those kinds of things. So So anyway, Paul, Paul continues, he says,  Be not deceived  neither fornicators nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, There's our euphemism for sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but you're justified in the name of our Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of God. So, notice, Paul says, such were some of you. So some of these Corinthians had been sodomites before they became Christians. But they stopped their behavior once they obeyed the gospel,

Arnie 
or they should have!

Fred 
Well, Paul says such were for some of you. There was a time you were this, but you're not that like that anymore. So so people can stop that behavior. If they decide to, it's not something they're born with. It's not something that they're that they are born as it's something that they decide to do at some point in their life or whether they're taught by another individual when they're younger, or they decide to do it when they're older.

Arnie 
Some of the some of you may have noticed that there was a word in here That text in that context, effeminate and that's the Greek word malakos, it's number 3120. And it's a euphemism also it's a euphemism for a boy or an adolescent, who is used as a sex object by pedophiles. The word catamite used to be used in English for that. I haven't haven't ever heard anybody use that. So, but that's what that is. That's that sexual child abuse that's considered there. And you're exactly right, it changes can be made. Thieves had changed and become honest men and women, liars, drunkards, addicts, all kinds of ungodliness is characteristic of just about every kind of Christian. We don't we don't all sin  the same ways, or haven't all sinned in the same ways, but we all have sinned and come short of the Glory of God. And where do we stand? timewise now Fred.

Fred 
Nothing's changed. It's the same as it was before, but people can. People can change, but we've still got about four minutes left. Okay, okay.

Arnie  
Well let's let's talk then very quickly, about what what's called Affirming Churches. There are churches and denominations that identify as affirming. And what that means is they do not regard LGBT behaviors as being sinful. But clearly the Bible does. And that means that that puts them squarely in conflict with with God's word. Peter said in Second Peter chapter two and verse one, There were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who prively shall bring in damnable, heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them and bring upon themselves swift destruction, many shall follow their pernicious ways by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they would feigned words make merchandise of you, whose judgment now of a longtime, lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not. they, Wikipedia, by the way, has a rather lengthy list of some of these denominations throughout the world. On on every continent, if you put affirming churches there, you can probably pop that up on your computer and see who all surprisingly you may be surprised at that who's involved in that. And I would say for the for the last 30 years, the purpose of these affirming churches has not been to do God's will, by any any means, but It has been to promote approval and dominance of the LGBT agenda. It includes some things you'll probably recognize: repeal of some of sodomy law, recognition of same sex marriage as a civil right. parental rights as they call them. In other words, to be able to attain the right to adopt children, as you know, homosexuals are not born. They're recruited. Override the constitutional issues of conscience everywhere in the marketplace, in employment, organizations, government. You've heard of florists and how long have one minute okay, you've heard of florists and bakers and and Uber drivers and all kinds of people being sued by these people to make life as miserable as possible. They want government funded medical research. Under the we play you pay approach, and they certainly want to silence, silence and subvert Bible teaching on on godliness. Let's just just close up by noticing that it's not Christians that that simply choose to be intolerant of others and the things they do. But that zero tolerance for deliberately practicing sin is mandated by God. Thank you for listening. We hope to hear from your hope for you to hear from us and next Lord's Day, afternoon.