Shameless Appeals for Applause: With A 66-Year Old ccTGA Heart Warrior

Ann Koplow is an extraordinary Heart Warrior, blogger, and musician. Born in 1953, she is one of the oldest child survivors of heart block requiring pacemaker insertion. Despite many mechanical failures with her pacemaker, Ann has continued to have an upbeat, positive attitude. In today's program, Ann shares with Host Anna Jaworski what it was like growing up with heart block, how her ultimate heart defect was finally diagnosed, how she helped other children in the hospital and more! You won't want to miss this fun and entertaining interview!

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Transcript

spk_0:   0:00
I had many, many fixed rate pacemakers, but I didn't let that get in my way.

spk_1:   0:11
Welcome to heart to heart With Anna. I am Anna Gorski and the host of your program. We are in our 14th season, and we're happy you're joining us today. I'd like to start this show by thanking our 1st 4 brand new patrons of the Hug Podcast network. The 1st 1 was Brenda Pigna Rowley. She's also our Web master and an amazing friend and supporter, former board member all around, fabulous person. French Dworsky might better half my awesome husband. Thank you for supporting Hope Podcast Network. Joseph Gorski, my firstborn, said, I really appreciate you supporting us and then Michael, even who is the host of heart to heart with Michael, also a fabulous supporter. Sound engineer. Hose all around, great guy. You guys are fabulous. Thank you for supporting the Hug Podcast Network, and anyone can become a supporter. Just go to AARP, a tree on page patri and dot com slash

spk_2:   1:07
heart to heart. Today's show features and cop Low, and our episode is entitled Shameless Appeals for Applause, A 66 year old c c T G a Heart Warrior. Yeah. Coppola was born in 1953. Her first surgery occurred at age 10 in 1963 on November 22nd she was at Children's Hospital in Boston for observation. They were treating her complete heart block with medication. They didn't know what her heart defect. Waas. But we'll learn more about that in this episode and was under observation because she was fainting and she was in complete heart block. Her heart stopped while being observed. So they decided to implant a pacemaker. And we'll be telling us about what was involved 55 years ago when people had pacemakers implanted and has been through so much in her 60 plus years. And she's going to share with us what her experiences have been like, how she found the right doctor at what plan she is making for the future. Welcome to heart to heart. With Anna and Koplove.

spk_0:   2:10
Hello. I'm shamelessly happy to do here.

spk_2:   2:15
So you got himself on the right foot, were laughing already. This is going to be great, but the first thing that I have to ask you is very serious. And that is when your parents discovered you had a congenital heart defect.

spk_0:   2:28
They found out that I had complete heart block very soon after I was born. Complete heart block is when the H and the vet trickles. There's no electrical connection between the two, so the ventricles are beating on their own. So they noticed that almost right away, and they took me to Children's Hospital in Boston. The doctors, the Children assume that I had a ventricular septal defect, and it was actually nothing they could do for a complete heart. Block the cannon. They were told to just take me home and treat me normally. They told my mother that I might faint, and she asked, How could you tell if a baby face? So there was a

spk_3:   3:09
lot of anxiety. I

spk_0:   3:10
think around me, and I was watched very closely. I would go to Children's once a year, but I was leading a pretty normal life. My heart rate got slower and slower as I grew. You can see it in my family pictures that help L. I start getting around the age of nine. They started giving me the ice April, which is this really yucky medicine that I had to have under my tongue. They kept observing me and was making me really sick.

spk_2:   3:39
The medicine you had to take made you sick?

spk_0:   3:42
Yes, They gave me a little. And the medicine baby feel really sick. And they kept bringing the end from Warren for observation. So I was in the hospital a lot when I was between the ages of eight and 10.

spk_2:   3:56
So you probably missed a lot of school then, didn't you?

spk_0:   3:59
I can public school because that was such a priority. I didn't miss all that much school until my first surgery.

spk_2:   4:07
So did they have teachers that went to the hospital to teach you, or were there people at a hospital that just worked with you?

spk_0:   4:16
No. Nothing like that. No, I just kept up. And I remember I would take the ice to pro under my son. When I was six grade, I would go into the bathroom and take it. I feel really sick, but it's

spk_3:   4:28
far as I was

spk_0:   4:28
concerned. I was still leading a really normal life, except for the time from the hospital.

spk_2:   4:33
Right. All right, well, tell us about that first surgery that you had.

spk_0:   4:37
I was in for observation at Children's Hospital. I had fainted a couple of times, but we thought it was because of the flu. And they had me there under observation. And I remember I was waiting for an E k G. I got up to get a drink of water because I was feeling lousy. And the next thing I d'oh my eyes and all these people were standing open today. What they discovered was that I had had a heart stoppage me not a complete stoppage because my heart started up again. But as soon as they realized that this was going on, then they decided I needed a pacemaker. But actually, that point no one had talked to me or my parents about peacemakers at all.

spk_2:   5:18
This

spk_3:   5:18
is not surprising.

spk_0:   5:20
Well, in retrospect, it's not so surprising because pacemakers were so huge.

spk_2:   5:26
Yeah, and you were a little girl.

spk_0:   5:28
I was just a little girl, you know, that was a skinny little kid. I think they just didn't think of it as something that was appropriate for a kid. But once my heart stopped, there was total question that they had to do that.

spk_2:   5:40
Today they often put the pacemakers under the clavicle. and in the upper part of the chest. But tell us where they had to put yours.

spk_0:   5:50
So they had to put it in the abdomen. That was really the only place for it.

spk_2:   5:54
And could you tell us about how big it was

spk_0:   5:58
trying to think of something that people really visualize healthy? The store people remember the original Walkman. That's about the size. Wait a bit for a child and really sticking out.

spk_2:   6:11
Yeah. Yeah. So could you feel it?

spk_0:   6:15
Could I feel the pacemaker? When I saw the pacemaker for the first time When they took the bandages off, I asked the nurse what? That was just a huge thing sticking out of my planning. And the nurse, That's your hips going from the surgery. I mean, because she just I wasn't prepared to explain to a kid. What? That Woz. Then no one talked to me about it. The next time they removed the bandages, the doctor was there and I said again, What's that? That's when they told me that's your pacemaker.

spk_2:   6:51
Oh, my goodness. That bus have been so scary that here, one of the grown ups somebody that you would have thought you could trust was not honest with you.

spk_0:   7:02
Yeah. I mean, I think the message to me was that this is something so weird and awful that grown ups would lie about it. In retrospect. But I've realized is that the day of my first surgery was November 22nd 1963. So that was the name that Kennedy was assassinated.

spk_3:   7:21
And I

spk_0:   7:21
think everybody was just freaking out.

spk_2:   7:25
Yeah, in shock.

spk_0:   7:27
Yeah, Everyone was in shock. I think nobody was on their best behavior. And I think also, they just didn't think that much about preparing Children. Four

spk_2:   7:36
surgeries. Yeah, we've come a long way and have it way

spk_0:   7:41
that yes, we have. We have come a long way,

spk_2:   7:44
and it's thanks to people like you. I consider you one of the pioneers. And you helped them to see you were just a guinea pig. You are a human being. You were a child who had a clear understanding that something was wrong with your body. But they weren't giving you the clear explanation that you needed to take away the scariness of it. And I think that we now know that that's not the right way to handle it.

spk_0:   8:10
I think doctors and nurses have learned a lot since then. They didn't let my parents stay overnight. I have all these memories of being in the hospital room with a monitor that made giant beeping noises. I still when I hear beeping noises from a robot that they use at the local supermarket, I

spk_4:   8:32
actually get freaked out because it reminds

spk_0:   8:36
me of the

spk_2:   8:36
heart monitor that

spk_0:   8:37
I was alone in the room with

spk_4:   8:40
takes this hot industry. We're offering us a mechanical hot and he said, now that I've had enough to give it to someone worthy, my father promised me a golden dressed twirling held my hand and asked me where I wanted to go. Whatever strive for conflict that we experienced in our long career together was always healed by humor.

spk_5:   9:01
Heart to heart With Michael Please join us every Thursday at noon, Eastern as we talk with people from around the world who have experienced those most difficult moments forever by the Baby Blue Sound collective. I think what I love so much about this CD is that some of the songs were inspired by the patient's. Many listeners will understand many of the different songs and what they've been inspired. Our new album will be available on iTunes. Amazon dot com. Spotify. I love the fact that the proceeds from this CD are actually going to help those with congenital heart defects Tonight forever, huh? You are

spk_1:   9:53
listening to heart to heart with Anna. If you have a question or comment that you would like to rest our show, please send an email to Anna Dworsky at Anna at heart to heart with anna dot com. That's Anna at heart to heart with anna dot com Now back to heart to heart with

spk_2:   10:12
and before the break, we were talking about your need for a pacemaker. Now I'd like to talk a little bit more about what it's been like having a pacemaker, especially since you had a fixed rate pacemaker.

spk_0:   10:25
I had many, many fixed re pacemakers, but I didn't let that get in my way. I wasn't so much an athlete, my sister, actually with the athlete of the family, and I was for of ah, scholar, I guess, But I did whatever I wanted to do. I didn't really feel like it slowed me down. I think if I've been an athlete, I would have been four aware. I still did whatever I wanted to do. And in the seventies, when disco came out, I really loved to dance and I became a disco dancer. I had that disco outfit. I would go to the discos, but I took lessons and I went through all the different classes of disco like Disco One. Just go to Disco three. And I made it to just go for and I was had

spk_1:   11:10
a

spk_0:   11:10
partner. That was really great. And we looked like we were in Saturday night fever.

spk_3:   11:15
Oh, my gosh, That is

spk_2:   11:19
so awesome. Do you have any photos of you in your costume with your partner?

spk_0:   11:24
You know, I don't. Oh, terrible. For a long time, I say that just goes around. But then I stopped being able to fit into it, so I don't know where that is.

spk_2:   11:33
Oh, my gosh. But you just painted a picture in my mind because who didn't love John Travolta back then and loved that movie, right? I could just see you doing it. And I could just see you up there boogieing. I

spk_0:   11:45
was totally living the disco dream.

spk_2:   11:48
Oh, my gosh. have fun. Is that Well, it's so nice to know that even though you had a fixed rate pacemaker, it didn't sell you down.

spk_0:   11:57
It didn't, as I've gotten older, more age appropriate

spk_3:   12:01
that I'm having trouble understanding that

spk_0:   12:03
I don't feel I don't feel self conscious about it.

spk_2:   12:06
There you go. There you go. I love your positive attitude, but I know that you've had a lot of adversity to overcome. Tell us about what it was like having pacemakers in the college, but late sixties, early seventies and in the eighties, I mean,

spk_3:   12:22
what were

spk_2:   12:22
some of the things that could go wrong?

spk_0:   12:25
I'm not sure about this, Anna, but I think everything that could possibly have gone wrong with my pacemakers went

spk_2:   12:31
loss of

spk_0:   12:32
the of 10 and 17.

spk_2:   12:35
Oh, no.

spk_0:   12:36
They told me that the PE figured would last a lot of years, and I remember saying to my father's Forget it, I'm never going back to that hospital again. Try to catch in five meters. But the reality was I was in and out of hospitals all the time. The pacemaker ran out of juice way earlier than expected. The moisture from the body got into the pacemaker. The wires broke several times That happened, like look for the wires. I have these scars that are really weird because they were looking for the wires that they can reattach them. I remember I remember when this kept happening. I remember one day's going in there sitting in the doctor's office, and the doctor called him on It said, The coppers are here with their lawyer as a joke because we were just in there all the time.

spk_2:   13:23
Oh wow.

spk_0:   13:24
And then the worst part was the pacemaker wires, which were so directly onto the heart during those dark days, came apart at the heart. Even before I left the hospital, I knew something was wrong, but I was afraid to tell anyone. Oh my God, Oh, this is really, really bad. And my fear was always that I might beat heart surgery again. No, I remember two on this one doctor that I trusted. I think there's something on my case maker, and they often would say to me, and you're just anxious and it's probably okay, and I'm being relieved you're going home. And then, sure enough, a week or so later, it became obvious that the wires had come apart of the heart that was gonna need heart surgery again. And that was in eighth grade. So that was only two years later, after the first heart surgery.

spk_2:   14:14
Wow. Did you have any limitations after you had your heart surgery as faras? Any physical limitations at school?

spk_3:   14:24
No. We just took a

spk_0:   14:25
long time to recover. That reminds me, though, of what happened when I had my first heart surgery. I really loved cast and really wanted a cat. But my mother was kind of a neat freak, and she didn't want a cat in the house. So when I had my first heart surgery, I woke up from the heart surgery and said to my mother, Quote unquote, what have I got to look forward to if I don't have a cat?

spk_3:   14:51
Oh, she tells

spk_0:   14:54
that story like it has. Tears were streaming down her face and she says, We'll get you a

spk_3:   14:59
cat. How much I know

spk_0:   15:01
how much I wanted a cat. When I woke up the second time, I said, I really want to catches every I already promised you can have a cat.

spk_2:   15:09
Oh,

spk_0:   15:09
so I

spk_3:   15:11
think

spk_0:   15:13
this second operation. I really wanted to color. Easy.

spk_2:   15:17
Oh, my God. This is so

spk_0:   15:19
when I woke up, I said, What if I get to look forward to it? I don't have a color TV, but, you know, at that point, it was a joke.

spk_3:   15:26
I

spk_0:   15:26
got a cat and I got a color keys. So I think I'm killing you. That story to illustrate that I did my best to get what I needed. I knew that having a cat would help you emotionally. And, you know, I don't know whether the color keep He

spk_2:   15:42
was Oh, it was a distracter. You know, that was the one day when Alex was in the hospital at 17. You have all these wires and all these people coming in and looking at you. And he had brought his tablet and he was playing games on his tablet. And I thought, You go, Alex. We were playing plants versus zombies. I'll never forget that. And that game actually has a tender spot in my heart because it was one thing that he could focus on to stop thinking about all the stuff that was going on around him. And maybe that's what your color TV was for you.

spk_3:   16:19
And I also

spk_0:   16:20
think that I was well known. It's the hospital from my positive attitude. They would actually send other kids, too. Talk to me. This isn't like 10 and 11 and 12 because I had such a positive attitude. I remember them sending a psychiatrist, him talking to be and then him saying that I seem very well adjusted. I think it would have been nice for pretty to approach me and say This must be scary,

spk_2:   16:47
Yeah, to acknowledge that

spk_0:   16:49
nobody, nobody said anything like that. And I think we're all survivors. We do the best that we can. I just looked forward to going home, but I would go into the hospital. I actually would have all these quarters because this is the time of payphones. If anyone remembers those and I would just love it up on quarters and I would call all my friends

spk_2:   17:11
Ah,

spk_0:   17:12
I would

spk_4:   17:13
get that connection. Sure I did

spk_3:   17:15
what I

spk_0:   17:15
needed to do

spk_2:   17:16
to get through this is

spk_0:   17:18
unscathed as possible.

spk_4:   17:22
Hi, my name is Jaime Al Croft, and I just published my new book, The Tin Man Diaries. It's an amazing story of my sudden change of heart as I went through a heart liver transplant. I can think of no better way to read It's in man diaries than to cuddle up in your favorite hearts. Unite the Globe sweatshirt and your favorite hot beverage, of course, in your hearts unite Globe Mug, both of which are available. The Hug podcast network, online store or visit Hearts. Unite theglobe dot

spk_5:   17:56
heart to Heart with Anna is a presentation of hearts, Unite the Globe and is part of the hug Podcast Network Hearts Unite The Globe is a nonprofit organization devoted to providing resources to the congenital heart defect community to uplift and power and enrich the lives of our community members. If you would like access to free resource, is pretending to the CHD community please visit our website at www congenital heart defects dot com for information about ch D, the hospitals that treat Children with CHD summer camps for CHD survivors and much, much more.

spk_3:   18:34
Okay,

spk_1:   18:35
And in this segment, I really want to talk to you about how you continue to surprise your doctors.

spk_2:   18:41
What problems C. C T g a heart warriors might encounter is agent. Finally I want us to talk about your blog's. So let's go ahead and start by having you tell us how the doctors talked to you about having a baby and what ultimately happened

spk_0:   18:55
when I was young. I remember doctors telling me I wouldn't be able to have Children, and then things just evolved. I actually left Children and found a wonderful cardiologists at Tufts Medical Center. Doctor keep Salem, who is still my doctor to this day, and he was actually the one who discovered that I had t t t okay. When I transferred some Children's to touch, she said, I want to figure out why you have complete heart block. He had all sorts of different theory is that he told me about I remember him saying it's possible. It's unlikely that it is really rare part, you said, and they discovered because he wanted to take a step back and look at it. That that was when they discovered that I had C c T g a

spk_2:   19:45
And what year was that? And do you remember?

spk_0:   19:48
Yeah, that was 1980. And I remember after I found out, thanks to my mother, you

spk_3:   19:53
know, you always

spk_0:   19:53
say two wrongs don't make a right. Well, looks like you were wrong about

spk_3:   19:56
that, because

spk_0:   20:00
the switch in the major vessels offsets the switch in the ventricle so that all the blood gets to the right place.

spk_2:   20:08
Right? Right.

spk_0:   20:10
But you asked me about having a child. So Dr Salem thought it would be okay for me to have kids. And I got pregnant when I was 44 years old. Wow. That's what we all said.

spk_3:   20:22
And

spk_0:   20:24
while I was pregnant, I actually booked at the research for C C T G A. And I found this article that was so awful because it said that people the C C T g A. The average life span was fifties and I was supporting

spk_3:   20:42
for Yikes.

spk_0:   20:44
So pregnancy went along. I was observed very closely. A month before the delivery date, I I found out for the first time that I had endocarditis. I remembered my doctor telling me that that's the one thing that he worried about. It was I would get endocarditis, never gotten it before. I was running a fever. He did the chest and then they called me and said, You have anger. Could I just come in to the

spk_2:   21:09
hard way. Ah, my goodness. That must have been scary.

spk_0:   21:14
It was very scary, actually, because the antibiotics that they gave me, they said, might make the baby death.

spk_2:   21:19
Oh, how far did name

spk_0:   21:22
but very scary. Nobody ever said, though. You must be scared.

spk_2:   21:27
Really? So company acknowledged that they just expected youto keep plugging away because you were such a positive person.

spk_0:   21:35
I waas and then I had my child. And actually, the day that I got off the antibiotics with day, my water broke.

spk_2:   21:42
Wow.

spk_0:   21:44
Yeah. So I remember thing to my doctor, Dr Sandra Love. After all this, why do you

spk_3:   21:50
think I

spk_0:   21:50
asked to be tested for endocarditis is just so weird. And he said, I think somebody up there watching over you.

spk_2:   21:57
Oh, definitely. It seems to me you definitely have angels watching over you in.

spk_0:   22:02
Well, he said I think someone up there is walking over you and this person that ideally not over my father. You died a few months before I got pregnant.

spk_2:   22:13
Oh, no.

spk_0:   22:15
He never knew that he was gonna have a grandchild. And that's the one regret I have in my life. I

spk_2:   22:20
think he was up there kind of orchestrating things for you in.

spk_0:   22:23
Well, I like to think that way, Anna, but I don't know whether the science would be ourselves, but I like to think that

spk_2:   22:28
there's so much that we don't know. I've I am a very strong proponent of science. But there are so many miracles that have happened in my life that I have to believe in faith and in God and my angels. And I don't think you'd be here today. And I don't think I'd be talking to you if it wasn't for a mixture of both science and some heavenly intervention. And I don't think you are a miracle.

spk_0:   22:53
Why, thank you, Anna.

spk_2:   22:55
And I think your son's a miracle, too. So, tell me, does your son have a hearing impairment?

spk_0:   22:59
He does not remember. When I was still pregnant, they checked his heart. They said, Your baby has a completely normal heart, and I remember thinking, Wow, that's incredible that I with my heart, I helped create this baby with a perfect heart.

spk_2:   23:16
Oh, what a beautiful story. That's so awesome. And at 44 I mean, there were a lot of perfectly heart healthy people who are concerned to have a pregnancy and their fourth decade because there's a higher incidence of down syndrome, there's a higher incidence of a number of birth defects. For some reason, it worked out in your favor. You made it through childbirth. Did you have to have a C section, or were you able to have, Ah, vaginal delivery?

spk_0:   23:44
They did a exception just because the labor went on for so long. They were not kidding around

spk_2:   23:49
right? I'm sure they didn't want to stress your heart any more than absolutely had Teoh, right? I know that a lot of my friends who have C C T g A or who have other serious congenital heart defects as they get into their fourth in their fifth decade and beyond they start having new problems. Can you tell me what kind of medical problems you've experienced as you've aged?

spk_0:   24:12
I would get an echo every year. I really felt like I was very stable. Everybody was very happy with how it was doing. I would say that in baby 2013 people were noticing that I was slowing down. I mean, it happened gradually that I wasn't even aware that, but my doctor started to get much more worried. People started talking to me about replacing mind heartfelt. Now my heartfelt had been drinking for a long time. My doctor just wanted to watch it to make sure it couldn't get any worse, but it took its toll. I actually went into a fit because my atria got really large, some luggage. I really never wanted to have open heart surgery because that's my bad experiences with the heart surgery when I was a kid. Sure, so I really wanted to avoid open heart surgery possible and some doctors thinking Billy Dee to have a heart valve replacement. But I didn't want to do that. So they tried different things. I gotta by ventricular pacemaker and again they watch me very carefully. But it became very obvious that I was really losing ground on my doctor. Talk to me about the possibility of maybe a heart transplant, and what made it very confusing with some of the doctors said You absolutely need a heart fails, you need to get a mechanical heart felt, and other doctors said no, it's gonna change the pressure in your heart and it's probably gonna make it worse. So can you imagine?

spk_2:   25:41
Oh, my goodness. Yeah,

spk_0:   25:43
Such different story. So I didn't know what to think. I consulted a whole bunch of specialist. Eventually, I went to the Mayo Clinic and I met with Dr Carroll Warren's and also Dr Durrani, the surgeon there. And they both said, You have to do this well right away. And I said, Well, my son is starting college. He's going to Edinburgh, Scotland. We're going to make a trip to Edinburgh before then. Can it wait till September? And this isn't my day? And I remember Dr Warren's paused and thought She says, Okay.

spk_2:   26:18
Oh, wow.

spk_0:   26:19
But during that time, I just got worse and worse have started retaining on a fluid. I remember going thio a concert and just having popcorn and just assault was enough to make the really sick sheriff. So by the time I thought that part failed, I really needed it.

spk_2:   26:39
Yeah. Wow, you have a 1,000,000 stories and we're gonna have to have you come back on the show. But it's almost time to go. And I have one more question for you. Okay? I understand from my producer David Franco that you have a blawg

spk_0:   26:55
gave it Franco, who also heads See CP gearing

spk_2:   26:58
Exactly Yes,

spk_0:   27:00
with my heart rubber.

spk_2:   27:02
Why don't you tell me about your blog's until our listeners how they confined your block and then I know you're going to share something special with us.

spk_0:   27:10
So I had blocked Daly since 2013. I have thousands of Post. The block is an Koplove dot wordpress dot com. It's called the years of Living nonjudgmental. EU can trying to just buy looking for my name, and it helped me get through. Ah, lot of the uncertainties sneaking up to the heart valve replacement in 2016 because I'm a group therapist and a mother and a singer songwriter. Block is all about that. There have been people with pay figures and also people with CHD who have found my block and they comment. I actually thought I was the longest surviving person in the world with the pacemaker. My doctor said that was a pretty sure bet, because getting the pacemaker in 1963 when I was 10. They weren't aware of anybody that had had a pacemaker longer than that. But my blawg. I actually heard from this woman. She contacted me and said I actually got, like, pacemaker in 1961 which was two years before me.

spk_2:   28:14
Wow. But still, that's just amazing. So is it an cop Low A N n k o p l o w dot wordpress dot com?

spk_0:   28:27
That is correct.

spk_2:   28:28
Okay, so that's how they confined your blawg. And

spk_3:   28:31
you're a singer songwriter.

spk_2:   28:33
So would you kindly serenade us with a song?

spk_0:   28:36
Okay. I'm just gonna sing the first verse and chorus of one of my soon to be hit songs. Okay? Called Shame With Appealed for applause. OK,

spk_2:   28:47
also ready. Okay. Already

spk_0:   28:49
I've made it to 80 65. Nothing stands in the

spk_3:   28:56
way of my passion and drive. The so are shameless appeals for up Moloch. There are true and real so shameless apiece for up Hey e, I love it. That

spk_2:   29:35
explains the title of this show. This has been so much, but thank you so much. And for coming on the show today and talking to us about wow so many different experiences of living with C c T g A.

spk_0:   29:50
Well, thank you for having me on the show Anna. It's been a real pleasure,

spk_2:   29:54
and the pleasure has been all mine. And that does conclude this episode of heart to heart with Anna. Thanks for listening today, my friends, please check out our patri on page. We'd love for you to become a patron of our program. Check out our hug Pockets Network page, or you can visit our website and be part of our network. You can get behind the scenes information, be invited to special recordings. Two Q and A's with our guests and even more check out hearts. Unite the globe dot org's for more information. And remember, my friends, you are not alone.

spk_1:   30:27
Thank you again for joining us this week Way. Hope you have been inspired on. Empowered to become an advocate for the congenital heart defects community. Heart to heart with Anna With your hose down, Jaworski can be heard every Tuesday at 12 noon Eastern time.