GB 147 Salt Heliotrope, ‘Autumn Joy’ Sedum, Watering Troughs for Plants TRANSCRIPT
23:50
SPEAKERS
Debbie Flower, Warren Roberts, Farmer Fred
Farmer Fred 00:00
Garden Basics with Farmer Fred is brought to you by Smart Pots, the original lightweight, long lasting fabric plant container. it's made in the USA. Visit SmartPots.com slash Fred for more information and a special discount, that's SmartPots.com/Fred. Welcome to the Garden Basics with Farmer Fred podcast. If you're just a beginning gardener or you want good gardening information, you've come to the right spot.
Farmer Fred 00:32
Today we tackle a widespread beautiful weed whose cousin is a rather desirable plant though. The weed is salt heliotrope, a close relative of the widely cultivated common heliotrope, and really, you don't want the salt heliotrope growing around your desirable plants. But on the other hand, one of the showiest plants right now is Autumn Joy sedum. We will tell you all about this one. It's the Plant of the Week. And, a primer on using livestock watering troughs for permanent plants, as well as using them for annuals. It's on episode 147 of the Garden Basics with Farmer Fred podcast, brought to you today by Smart Pots and Dave Wilson Nursery, and we'll do it all in under 30 minutes. Let's go.
Farmer Fred 01:20
We like to answer your garden questions here on the Garden Basics podcast. Debbie Flower is here to help us out, our favorite retired college horticultural professor. And Debbie, today's question comes from Connor, who lives in the San Ramon Valley of Northern California, over in the Bay Area. He says, "I'm growing hops," so we know that Connor likes beer. He says, "I'm growing hops in my garden patch, but a beautiful perennial salt heliotrope has popped up and formed a green carpet across the planting bed beneath the vertically grown hops. From what I've researched, this heliotrope is enjoyed by pollinators and is native to North America. It also seems to be acting like a mulch and protecting the soil from the hot sun. So I'd hate to remove it. But I'm worried it could be stealing nutrients from the hops. Are my assumptions fair? And do you have any suggestions for compromising?" Well, let's talk about plant competition, shall we? Hmm. All right, you've got this pretty ground cover. Right?
Debbie Flower 02:21
He sent a picture and it is very pretty. Yes.
Farmer Fred 02:23
And it's a case of they both need food and water. Right? And they're both going to get it from the same source. Which one do you want to get more of the food and water?
Debbie Flower 02:33
So if he wants to compromise, he's gonna have to compromise in one way by adding enough food and water for everybody to be happy.
Farmer Fred 02:41
I can't believe, though, that he planted this salt heliotrope. In judging by the picture, it looks like it spreads fairly easily. It reminds me of borage.
Debbie Flower 02:50
Oh yeah. I have borage. I planted it purposely. It's in the same family. This plant is in the same family. The salt heliotrope is in the same family as the borage. And the borage, I planted close to my vegetable garden, because it attracts bees. And it's nice to have something to feed the bees all year round. There's borage in bloom almost all year round, so that they have a habit of coming to visit. And then they'll find the other things in the garden that will benefit from their work. But I go out regularly and pull it out. It seeds prolifically. If I let all the seeds come up, that puts down there less than an inch from each other. And the plant is quite large. There are just seeds everywhere. And because it's near the vegetable garden, it's getting regular water. It loves that, as Connor's salt helitrope in his hops is getting regular water, so I am maintaining it. My compromise is that I leave some plants and I pull out a whole bunch of other ones.
Farmer Fred 03:49
According to the California Invasive Plant Council, Connor, salt heliotrope is considered an invasive, which means it will easily compete for water and nutrients with established plants. And I guess it's a poisonous plant too.
Debbie Flower 04:04
Oh, I didn't get that part. Oh, well to cattle, it causes liver damage and cattle prefer it over other things in the garden. So if it's around, they'll eat it before they'll eat other things. So if you're near, if you have any cattle of your own, or you're near cattle farmers, it would be a service to remove it.
Farmer Fred 04:22
Besides they'd be eating your hops or at least knocking them down.
Debbie Flower 04:26
Right, cattle just inhale what's what's nearby, and then they sit down and burp up what they just ate and then they chew their cud and that's how they digest it.
Farmer Fred 04:35
So even from just a competition standpoint, it probably would be best if you removed that salt heliotrope, but we come back to a way to do that, that you bring up quite often, and it makes a heck of a lot of sense. Instead of yanking out the plants just cut them back at the base. But can you do that with salt heliotrope? Or will you be out there every week doing the same?
Debbie Flower 04:56
Well. It can reproduce not only by seed, but Also by root pieces. Cutting it off at the base is not going to do it. However, if you visit or look at grape orchards, they often have grasses in their aisles, because some maybe have nothing in there. The aisle being the space between the rows of the vines, but a lot of them have grasses, which is also another great competitor in terms of taking nutrition and water. But they have it there because they need something to walk on or drive the equipment on, during especially wet periods. I'm not as worried about the competition as I am about this plant getting away from him. He can reproduce everything he said is true. It is native to the North America, it is a pretty plant. It probably is very attractive to bees, it is shading the soil, but it is also using soil and excuse me water and nutrition, that could be going to the hops, but if he takes it out what's going to be in the aisles. But if he doesn't take it out, where is this plant going to go? If he uses equipment that then goes elsewhere in his yard. I'm talking about shovels or rakes or power equipment or goes to someone else's property, the chances are it could be taking that plant to that other place in his yard or to the other property and then it will take off again. And that to me is the danger of this plant.
Farmer Fred 06:20
How about cutting it off at the base, carefully removing all those removed parts and putting it in the trash making sure not to drop any all the way to the trash, and then putting down maybe six inches of a straw mulch in that area because you'll get going to get the effect of it cooling the soil which seems to be one of Connor's goals with having this plant. Yes. And by six inches of straw mulch. You'd be denying those roots as they germinate of any sunlight and reducing their chances of surviving.
Debbie Flower 06:51
Yeah, I don't think they'll die with the first round of straw mulch. I think you'll have to be on top of it. Be checking it out, have extra mulch nearby that and be ready to cut the the new tops out that appear and cover them with some more mulch. But I think mulch would make a great if he removed the salt heliotrope one way or another, mulch will make a great replacement. I also believe that even if he pulls it out, he won't get rid of it. Because it will come up from the roots. Unlike the borage. I have the borage. Yeah, that would be a nice alternative potentially for him although it itches like crazy when you touches your bare skin, but it does not reproduce from stems or roots. The salt heliotrope can reproduce from root pieces.
Farmer Fred 07:32
This just sounds like a dressed-up version of bermudagrass.
Debbie Flower 07:35
Yeah, which is something that often ends up in in vineyard aisles which is what made me think of it.
Farmer Fred 07:42
Okay, so Connor, there you go. The quicker you get on this the better.
Debbie Flower 07:47
Yes. Don't let it go to seed, you may be too late for that. But don't let all those lovely flowers we see in the picture you sent go to seed because the more seed you get the more chance of it spreading.
Farmer Fred 07:57
And we'll have that picture on today's podcast. So you people can check it out to salt heliotrope. And in this particular instance, it is heliotrope curr....
Debbie Flower 08:11
Curassavicum
Farmer Fred 08:12
Amplexicali.
Debbie Flower 08:15
That's not the one he has.
Farmer Fred 08:17
We don't know which one he has.
Debbie Flower 08:18
Well I did some research and...
Farmer Fred 08:22
la dee da! research.
Debbie Flower 08:25
amplexacali has blue flowers. Okay, quite dark blue flower.
Farmer Fred 08:29
and these are kind of pinkish, these are whitish, pale.
Debbie Flower 08:31
Yeah.
Farmer Fred 08:32
And that is the currassivicum, which is still invasive.
Debbie Flower 08:37
Yes, it's still invasive, but it is native. I'm a big native fan of native plants because it provides what native insects and animals need and hopefully does grows better in my environment. But native is a relative term. Some plants are native to the US. Other plants are native to the Sacramento Valley. there's a difference in those. And native does not mean it won't be invasive, given certain conditions. Native plants can be invasive.
Farmer Fred 09:09
And I guess you couldn't even preserve it in a container to grow because it's a pretty plant because of the seed production and the seed will spread in the wind. Yeah, you're screwed, Connor, enjoy the beer. Thank you, Debbie Flower.
Debbie Flower 09:24
You're welcome Fred.
Farmer Fred 09:26
On today’s show we discussed a rather invasive weed, that, unfortunately, is very pretty. You may be tempted to keep it around. The salt heliotrope. You may have never heard of it. We have more info about salt heliotrope available, in the latest Garden Basics with Farmer Fred newsletter, on Substack. Also in the latest newsletter edition, more information and pictures about the plant of the week, Autumn Joy Sedum. And more details about growing blueberries in watering troughs. As the newsletter grows, so will the subject matter. So, yes, it will be a good supplement for the Garden Basics podcast, but there will be a lot more garden related material, pictures and maybe a mini-podcast or video garden tips, as well. It’s the Garden Basics with Farmer Fred Newsletter on Substack. And best of all, it’s free! There’s a link in today’s show notes. Or, just go to substack.com, and do a search for Garden Basics with Farmer Fred. That’s substack.com slash garden basics (one word). Think of it as your garden resource that goes beyond the basics. It’s The Garden Basics with Farmer Fred newsletter. Did I tell you it’s free? It’s free.
Farmer Fred 10:47
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Farmer Fred 11:47
From the garden e-mail bag, Robert asks: “I’m thinking about getting a few of those metal watering troughs for my winter greens, such as lettuce and kale. And, I might use them for next spring’s tomatoes, peppers and blueberries. Do I need to get the deeper troughs, or will the more shallow troughs work? And what is a good soil to use? Also, how would cane berries do in the troughs?” How about using both sizes of watering troughs? Winter greens are shallow rooted and would do fine in the smaller watering troughs, which are about a foot high, two feet wide and four feet long. The larger troughs are better suited for tomatoes, peppers and blueberries. Those troughs are two feet high, two feet wide, and available in differing lengths, usually in four and six foot lengths. These stainless steel, galvanized troughs are readily obtained from a good country supply store. And while you’re there, pick up some oil-based enamel tractor paint and primer for those shiny, sun-blinding silver troughs to match your surrounding décor. Especially if you’re house is painted Kubota orange, John Deere green or yellow, International Harvester blue, or Ford red or blue. Whatever you decide to plant, good drainage is important. Cut several one-inch holes in the bottom of the troughs. Don’t rely on that drain plug on the side of the trough to siphon off all the excess water in the soil. Also, raise the containers off the ground by a couple of inches to avoid clogging of the drain holes. By the way, don’t plant tomatoes and blueberries together. Give blueberries their own trough. Blueberries need a very acidic soil mix, with an ideal pH around 5.5. Use a one-third mix of camellia-azalea potting soil, peat moss, and small pathway bark, along with a handful of soil sulfur. Blueberries need consistently moist soil as well, along with good drainage. Because those metal containers can heat up here in the summer, place them where they can get some afternoon shade. For tomatoes and peppers, any high quality potting mix intended for vegetables will suffice. Caneberries, such as blackberries, raspberries and boysenberries, would do best in those deeper watering troughs. But consider your height and how you’re going to support those caneberries. Caneberries can get rather tall, so starting them two feet above ground level may put you at a disadvantage come picking time. The birds will thank you, though. Place those troughs near a fence in order to trellis those canes; or, build a trellis around the troughs to give you a place to tie the canes. Blackberries and raspberries can grow in many soil types, but prefer soil on the slightly acidic side, with a pH between just below 6.0 up to 7.0. Any good quality potting mix intended for acid-loving plants would be ideal for caneberries. According to the University of California’s “California Garden Web” page, raspberries require full sun for best growth and fruit production, but most cultivars may need some afternoon shade for best performance in California's hot interior valleys. Blackberries are well adapted to California, as most perform well both in hot inland areas and along the coast. They require full sun for best production. Although blackberries do well in a variety of soil types, they perform best in well-drained, sandy loam or loam soils.
Farmer Fred 15:40
If you're thinking of growing fruit trees, or maybe you already have your own backyard full of fruit trees, you probably have a million questions. Like, which fruit trees will grow well where I live? What are the tastiest fruits to grow? How do I care for them? What are the most important things to know when starting a backyard orchard? Well, the good news is: those answers are just a click away with the informative videos that you can find at DaveWilson.com. That's Dave Wilson Nursery, the nation's largest grower of fruit trees for the backyard garden. At DaveWilson.com , you'll also find planting tips, taste test results, fruit variety recommendations, and links to nurseries in your area that carry Dave Wilson fruit trees. Your harvest to better health begins at DaveWilson.com.
Farmer Fred 16:43
Every week we like to talk with Warren Roberts out at the UC Davis Arboretum and Public Garden. He is their Superintendent Emeritus, one of the wisest plant people I know, also kind of a wiseacre as well. But he knows his plants and today is truly a plant for autumn. I love today's plant, Warren, because it reminds me of a little umbrella that changes color as the season progresses. And this time of year, it's this rusty brown that's just so gorgeous, growing in the garden and it's a sedum and it's Autumn Joy.
Warren Roberts 17:20
Yes, the group of sedums include autumn joy, or sometimes putting the generic name, telephium. But one of the main parents of these groups of hybrids or selections is Sedum telephium. And Sedum telephium occurs right across from Europe eastward to Japan, it has really wide wide range and you're right, they kind of look like little umbrellas on leafy stems. And the leaves are usually kind of a pale green and fleshy it is it is a succulent for sure. The Sedum telephium itself has been known and grown in Europe for a long time. But then, as European culture spread, we can say invaded, but we could just say spread, to the east. Another species came into that cultivation and that sedum was sedum spectable. Spectable in Latin means, I think, means spectacular. And they look much the same as the Sedum telephium and one of the most famous hybrids of those two species is called Sedum autumn joy. The original name for this is hepesfoid which means Autumn Joy in German, I think, and, I guess, widely cultivated of these Autumn Joy has rounded clusters of pink blossoms that open in late summer and then age to a rusty coppery color that stays with them on right through winter. The leaves turn yellow and drop off. but the Sedums with the the seedheads, I guess you'd call them at that point, stay on in the garden and there a foot to a foot and a half tall, don't need any staking really. And as soon as the plant starts to go dormant. You look at the base of the plant of the stems and of these little rosettes, these little little tiny green roses coming up out of the ground. And those will be next year's stems.
Farmer Fred 19:43
So the plant does die back in the winter.
Warren Roberts 19:45
It does die back and then you have, once after a while these seedheads which looked very nice, will start to look a little bit disheveled and at that point I just clip them back to the ground. And already, you'll see the new growth coming up. So it's an easy plant, it's successful in most gardens. You know, it needs reasonably good drainage. And since it is native to areas that get some rain, a little irrigation in Mediterranean climate areas is a good idea, a useful plant in the perennial border and easily propagated by divisions. This is one of those over the back fence kind of plants has been shared amongst people. For hundreds of years.
Farmer Fred 20:30
You'd mentioned that it is a succulent, I guess it's in the Crassulaceae family.
Warren Roberts 20:35
It is in the Crassulaceae. The genus Sedum, which is a really big genus, is well represented in for example, in Mexico, and even in California and Oregon. It's a pretty widespread genus. The common name is stonecrop, I guess refers to the fact that it's often seen growing in rocks and looks like a crop I suppose. And at any rate, that's that's a bit of background, but there are many, many cultivars and hybrids of the these particularly these two species, Sedum telephium and Sedum spectable.
Farmer Fred 21:12
And Autumn Joy has a very colorful history throughout its growing season, changing colors and until fall when you get, like you mentioned, that sort of rusty coral look and it's just absolutely gorgeous. It is the Sedum, autumn joy. Check it out, you just might want one for your garden, no matter where you live. You might want two or three. Maybe your neighbor has them, take some cuttings, they root easily. Another great plant of the week from Warren Roberts, superintendent emeritus of the UC Davis Arboretum and Public Garden. Visit their website for more information, arboretum.uc davis.edu . Warren, once again thanks for a great plant of the week.
Warren Roberts 21:53
You're welcome, Fred. That was fun.
Farmer Fred 22:01
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Farmer Fred 23:26
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