Change Your Story, Change Your Net Worth w/ Rod Khleif

The headlines say “uncertainty,” but for prepared investors it reads “opening.” We sit down with multifamily leader Rod Khleif to unpack how he lost $50 million in 2008, rebuilt faster the second time, and why apartments—not scattered single-family—gave him the operational leverage to weather storms. Rod goes deep on the difference makers: centralized maintenance, tighter demographics, and income-driven valuations that can turn tough cycles into launchpads.

From there, we get practical. Rod outlines the “law of the first deal,” a real phenomenon where the first acquisition is the slowest and scariest, yet the next two come quickly as confidence compounds. He shares a clear path for new and seasoned operators: play to your strengths, partner for your gaps, and build a bench of lenders, managers, and investors before you need them. With a trillion-dollar commercial “debt wall” approaching and adjustable-rate loans expiring, he expects more auctions, lender takebacks, and real pricing power for buyers who underwrite conservatively and move decisively.

Mindset isn’t fluff here—it’s infrastructure. Rod opens his trainings with goal setting that ties numbers to a strong why, then he practices daily gratitude for what he has and what he wants as if it already exists. That forward-focused habit kept him steady after achieving a long-visualized beach mansion left him oddly empty, and it led him to the Tiny Hands Foundation—providing meals, backpacks, and comfort to kids and families in need. His takeaway: achievement is a science, fulfillment is an art, and service accelerates both.

If you’re scanning the horizon for multifamily opportunities, this conversation gives you the map and the motor. Learn how to avoid the single-family traps that sank portfolios last cycle, position for distressed deals without reckless risk, and build habits that outlast any market. Subscribe, share this with a friend who needs a push, and leave a review to tell us your next bold step.

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Welcome to The Brad Weisman Show, where we dive into the world of real estate, real life, and everything in between with your host, Brad Weisman! 🎙️ Join us for candid conversations, laughter, and a fresh take on the real world. Get ready to explore the ups and downs of life with a side of humor. From property to personality, we've got it all covered. Tune in, laugh along, and let's get real! 🏡🌟 #TheBradWeismanShow #RealEstateRealLife 

Credits - The music for my podcast was written and performed by Jeff Miller. 

Transcript

Welcome And Sponsor Shoutouts

SPEAKER_02 0:35

From real estate the market as a whole, which then sometimes will affect the day. Right. The real life. We all learn in different ways. If you think about it, Wayne Dyer might not attract everybody and everything in between. Mission was really to help people just to reach their full potential.

SPEAKER_01 0:53

The Brad Wiseman Show. And now your host, Brad Wiseman.

SPEAKER_02 0:58

All right, we are back. Thanks for joining us every single Thursday at 7 p.m. We are much appreciative, right, Hugo? That's right. That's right. We're very appreciative of that. And I know you have there's a lot of things you have to do with your time out there and the fact that you listen to this show, whether it's in your car or watching it on YouTube or wherever you are seeing the show or hearing the show, we appreciate it. We also appreciate our sponsors. We've got first response contracting with John Sellers, 484-256-7136 and Comfort Pro, the H V A C company, 610-477-5512. So, yeah, so we have another great guest.

SPEAKER_00 1:34

All right. I'm excited.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

Yeah, I you should be.

Meet Rod Khleif And Florida Talk

SPEAKER_00 1:37

I know I read about him. You read about him? That's good.

SPEAKER_02 1:40

And you know, this guy here, you know, we're we're not doing as much about real estate anymore, but when I see somebody that kind of just stands out, that has done an amazing job of you know succeeding in the real estate realm and also about mindset, talks about mindset and and and those things, gets deeper than just the real estate part of it. And one of the things that really hit me is that one of the things it says is he lost 50 million in 2008.

SPEAKER_00 2:04

Oh, man.

SPEAKER_02 2:05

Yeah, that's a lot. That's a lot. And and it made me it hit home because my real estate in 2008 was absolutely terrible. So I just I was like, you know what? This guy is he knows what's going on. He knows real estate, and I wanted to bring him on. His name is Rod Cleef. What's going on, Rod? Oh, it's a pleasure to be here, brother. Let's have some fun.

SPEAKER_01 2:22

Yeah, and you're from Sarasota. You still in Sarasota? Yes, sir. I'm still in Sarasota. Yeah, I've got a home here, and I have a home in Miami as well, because I'm single now, and Sarasota's a singles wasteland. So I go to Miami on the weekends.

SPEAKER_00 2:34

That's funny. Now that's you know what?

SPEAKER_02 2:36

That's just worth the show right there. That was that was good. So, no, so you're still right because Sarasota's a little bit more laid back and and beautiful here, but oh good God, not a place.

SPEAKER_01 2:45

You know, I I I I I'm usually the youngest person by 20 years in most restaurants, and I just turned 66. So that shows you something.

SPEAKER_02 2:52

Oh my gosh, that's great. You know what, though? Florida's awesome. My parents are actually down there right now. It's it's just a great, it's a great state. The weather's amazing. And uh, how is the weather right now?

SPEAKER_01 3:02

Because up here it's I could literally be a poster child for the Florida Chamber of Commerce. I love it. I mean, I got two homes here. Hello. Yeah, you know, I got yeah, so no, I I freaking love it. Weather, it's cool today, but I mean I've still got shorts and flip-flops on. So cool as relative. Yeah, you know, you become a real puss when you live here for a while. So, you know, I 70, oh, 70 is a little chilly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:22

Yeah, I know. They start I when we go down, we have family that lives in Tampa, and I always joke around when we get down there and we're hanging out with family, family, and it's like, you know, it's 65 degrees at night, and they're putting like parkas on. They look like they're from Alaska. Yeah, I'm like, I'm sitting here going, this is unbelievable. You know, I'm ready to like put shorts and flip-flops on. But no, it's a great, it's a great state, and we're glad to to have you down there. And hey, what what do you like better though? The west coast or east coast?

SPEAKER_01 3:49

Uh Florida? Well, it depends. You know, I mean, I love the energy of Miami. I just walk down the street and I I love the energy, but yeah, I mean I have a I have a compound on the water here, six buildings. I'm in the video studio in one of the buildings right now, and I'm just super blessed. I mean, it's it's it's it's very zen and peaceful, two acres on the water, but wow, that's a that's a nice spot. It's slow as hell. It's so freaking slow. So, you know, I go back and forth every week and it works nice. I got a studio in my condo in Miami as well, so it's it's working really well. I do I started doing Saturday trainings for a few hours on Saturday, so I I I just converted my dining room to a really nice video studio there.

From Real Estate To Mindset Focus

SPEAKER_02 4:23

So that's awesome. It's amazing how we can do this from anywhere, right? Right? It's it's just incredible technology and everything. So let's dig into you know, the one thing that that you're known for is multifamily investments. I mean, you coach on this. I teach it. Yeah, you coach on it, you train on it.

Building The Biggest Multifamily Community

SPEAKER_01 4:40

And so I've got I've got the largest real estate podcast really in the world at this point for commercial real estate, which just blows my mind. And, you know, my students, I'll brag for a second. My students now own upwards, I think, of 300,000 units under my tutelage, which is really more than all my other competitors combined. And it's because of the mindset, it's because I, you know, I teach mindset. They actually freaking take action with what they learn. So yeah, it's it's it's it's such a blessing, honestly. It just blows my mind when I when I see these numbers climb. Yeah, it's a great. Well, how do you do the training? Are you doing one-on-one or is this group training? I mean, how does that work? Yes, all the above, all the above. So so my podcast, I mean, is really informative. Yeah, it's I've watched several episodes. Oh, thank you. So so there's that. And then I do boot camps every really month and a half. They're virtual, they're two days right here in the studio. You can do them at home in your underwear, and I don't charge much. I charge like$47 for two days of two days of training, and I don't sell anything there either. So it's just two days of training for$47. Now, I listen, I give them an opportunity to look into my coaching program, you know, save a call if you want, but I don't I don't sell. And so, you know, that's pretty much it. You know, I think the people on this planet that add the most value are the most successful. And I focus on adding as much value as I as I absolutely can. And uh, you know, and and we try to change it up as much as we can. But it yeah, uh, if they get into my coaching program, then it's it's group coaching, it's one-on-one coaching, it's Q ⁇ A's, it's it's it's a it's a course like a college course uh over a four-month period. It's it's pretty extraordinary. It's it's and we keep make and we keep changing it. But anyway, yeah, no, I appreciate you letting me mention it. Yeah, sure. But uh it's it's funny, you know. I it used to motivate me to have the Lamborghini and the Rolls Royce and the Bentley and all this stupid stuff that you know I used to think was important. But uh candidly, I when I tell you, and this is gonna sound again like I'm bragging, but I'm not, or I'm or it's gonna sound like I'm full of it, but I'm not. I I get so much pleasure from I I literally get love every single day at this point. I mean, I get I get gifts, I get cars, I get emails, I it just blows my mind. DMs. Now I get hate every day too, don't get me wrong. You know, no one should have owned 800 houses. You're the reason I can't buy a house. No, no, give me a break. That's such BS. Yeah, because you don't get out of your mom's basement, it's the reason you don't can't get out of here.

SPEAKER_02 6:55

Yeah, you're exactly right. I agree with that. So you know what's funny? In this country, if you can't figure shit out, there's something wrong. Please, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 7:03

My God, we live in the greatest country on earth. Yes, just go out there and do it. You know, it's funny, it's funny with my students. It's not the they're not the smartest ones that are successful. They're not the ones that started with money, they're not the ones that live in the biggest towns. They're the ones that basically change their story and then they just go take massive freaking action. Yeah, that's those are the ones that succeed, period. And and and I see it all the time. You know, everybody's got a story for why they're not successful, like the people that hate on me online. I literally every day I get it, but but much, much more love, by the way, thank God. But but you know, it's the people that that that that change that story or get rid of that old story that's holding them back because people have stories, you know, they're like circuit breakers, you know, they keep them from taking action. And it's the people that change that story and just go do it that are successful.

SPEAKER_02 7:47

Amen. I I agree with you 100%. Yeah, and it's funny because the people that put the energy on hate, that what you put out comes back and it just doesn't work. I just it's whatever you focus on grows. You got that? Yeah, that's pretty much positive or negative. Yeah, and it's and that's been that way for thousands of years.

SPEAKER_01 8:03

That's a change. I get people, I get people that call me and say, Hey, do I how do I get out of student loan debt? I'm like, wrong question. How do you make so much money that debt's irrelevant is the question you want to be asking. You know, they asked Mother Teresa if she was anti-war. She said, No, I'm pro-peace.

SPEAKER_02 8:17

Yeah, right, exactly. Yep.

SPEAKER_01 8:19

Whatever you focus on gets bigger.

SPEAKER_02 8:21

Yeah, yeah, before something, not against it. So true. So true. So let's go back a little bit because you know, the intriguing thing, you know, when I look to see somebody that's going to be on the show, I look to see, you know, where they came from, what they've been through. I always feel like the the setbacks are always more important than the successes because those are really the things that that make a person. Yeah, I think you're you're agreeing with that, yeah.

Training Model And Value First Approach

SPEAKER_01 8:41

No question. No, I'm putting my finger up because I'll tell you, when I do my boot camps, I had panelists come on. They're always my my students. Sometimes I have three or four billion literally represented by my my students on stage to answer questions, but I always try to ask the question, and I call them seminars, by the way, when it's not a failure unless you don't get back up or get the lesson. So that was a$50 million seminar. That was an expensive freaking seminar, don't get me wrong. But but so I asked the question of my panelists, my students, you know, tell me about a seminar, what you learned, because I I believe you learn more from that. And so I make that a real a real piece in my boot camps to to to bring that up. But yeah, you know, it wasn't any fun. It sucked, but but that's how you grow. I by the way, I've built 29 businesses so far in my career. I was blown away when I counted a few years ago, and several worth tens of millions of dollars. I've got two right now that are. However, most of them were spectacular flaming seminars, okay? You know, we we failed our way to success. Yeah, you know, I tell people don't fear failure, fear regret. If you're being in the same freaking place you are right now, two or three years from now, unless you absolutely love where you are right now. That's what you want to fear.

SPEAKER_02 9:45

Yeah, it's funny because what you say about 2008 is I I I lost my ass in 2008 also. Been in real estate my whole life and ended up having to sell a lot of things. And thank God I had the stuff to sell to six, you know, to keep moving forward and not losing my house.

SPEAKER_01 10:00

Thank God you're able to get out.

SPEAKER_02 10:01

Yeah, it was because I owned a bunch of real estate and and got out. But what I always say, you know, it it is when you say seminars, it's funny I use the term college. I never went to college, but in 2008, I went through my na master's degree in in fail in in life sucking. I went I got my master's degree, they had my master's degree. Yeah, yeah, you got that right. So I I get it.

SPEAKER_01 10:23

I used to tell people I have a PhD in results. That was like my Bernardocious comment there.

SPEAKER_02 10:27

Yeah. So so you lost 50 million, you said in 2008. You know, and one of the things that stuck out to me, you said you rebuilt your portfolio and your purpose. That to me actually sticks out more than the portfolio because I think the purpose part is more important than the portfolio.

Hate, Love, And Taking Massive Action

SPEAKER_01 10:46

I agree completely. You know, I never, you know, I never thought I'd be a teacher. My father was a PhD professor, taught at Columbia and Harvard, and I never thought I'd be a teacher. But you know, when I lost everything, I started my podcast, and because a friend of mine said, hey, we should podcast. I'm like, I don't want to talk into a fail phone, and because that's how you did it back then, video. And then finally I did it. And early episodes, I'm like, I'm never gonna sell you anything. I just want to add value. And that was the truth. And and I I used to take free phone calls from my listeners, and and now I'm a liar because I freaking sell everything, but you know, you want to make God laugh, you tell them your plans, right? But I never intended to. And and uh it just got a kind of a life of its own, you know. And and so, you know, people were asking me, hey, you should do something with this. And and so I wrote a book. I've got this best-selling book. I give it away. I've given I it's on Amazon, but I've given away tens of thousands of copies. You can pay like six bucks and get the physical copy. And people are like, Oh, you make money on that. No, it cost me an extra 30 to send it to you. I just hope you consider my boot camper coaching, which is why I do it. But yeah, but uh yeah, I give it away. And that's and so I did that first, and then people are like, you know, do a course, and then it just mushroomed into the and again, I'm blessed to say our program literally is the largest by student success than everybody else combined. And why do why do you think? I mean, because there's a ton of them out there. Why do you think it's because they do it, because they do it, because it's mindset and psychology. Like if you come to one of my boot camps, the first thing we do is goal setting on steroids. How do you get anything if you don't know what it is? You got to know what it is you want, and more importantly, why you want it. You got to create that burning desire or that hunger. And so that's the first thing we do is goal setting. And by the way, if you're listening and and you haven't done your goals, you should be doing it like three times a year at least. You know, people spend more time planning a freaking birthday party, Christmas party than they do designing their lives. Doing your goals is designing your life. And I do it, I did a goal setting workshop. If you go to rodsgoals.com, it's my workshop. There's a free guide you can download. I'm not gonna try to sell you anything, but go do your goals, have your spouse do it. If your kid's over 10 years old, have them do it. It's about an hour. You'll leave so motivated, you'll be coming out of your skin. Have them design their lives, design your life. Super important. So, you know, it starts with goals. And that's what I did when I lost everything is I reassociated with my goals. It's the same thing you would do to get started. And so it starts with goals, and then you got to make a decision, then you gotta, you know, and I don't mean dip your toe in the water. I mean you it's done when you make that decision. You you you you you you commit and you committed, and then you then you gotta take that first step, you know. And and and I get a lot of analytical people that that want to get into into what I do, and it's it's a lot of numbers, so it's that's great for them. But and you know who you are if you're listening, how you have to check off every single box before you make a move. You can't do that. You know, like Dr. Martin Luther King said, you take that first step in faith, the next step will be revealed. But you got to take that step. And so true. You know, a lot of people get locked in analysis paralysis. I see it with my students all the time. I call it the law of the first deal. It's the scariest, it's the hardest, it takes the longest. They're four months in, there's five months in, six months in. I'm kicking them in the butt. You got this, keep going, keep going. Then they get one, and next thing I know, they have three. I'm like, what just happened? Right? It's that it's but you got to take that first step. And you know, a lot of a lot of analytical people, a lot of people, period, fear failure. Like I said, I just talked about failure. I've had, I call them seminars, I've had scores of them. But the thing to remember is fear regret much more. And I'm sure you agree with me on this, Brad. I mean, there was this nurse, there was this nurse in Australia named Bronny Ware. She was a hospice nurse, and she took care of patients when they were about to die. And she asked him a question. She said, Do you have any regrets? And she wrote a book about it's like a bestseller, something like five or hertz of playing.

SPEAKER_02 14:22

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 14:22

Yeah. And and the number one regret is not living the life I could have lived, living someone else's life, not doing what I know I'm capable of. Fear that. Yeah. Don't fear failure. You can get up from failure, but but regret, oof, at the end of your life, my God, nothing worse than that, as far as I'm concerned.

SPEAKER_02 14:36

I agree with that 100%. Ed Milette talks about that a lot. Does he? Yeah, he does talk about that a lot. And I agree with you on that. You know, and the interesting thing too is when you talk about losing the 50 million, the the good part about when you lose money is that if you're the one that made it, you know how to do it again.

Seminars Not Failures: Lessons From 2008

SPEAKER_01 14:52

Oh, yeah. Oh, it's easier, much faster. Yeah. And I I recovered from it. I mean, it sucked. I'm sorry. I said you're not going to be able to do it. You could say suck, it's fine. I know you, I know your kids listen to this. Yeah. I mean, it was no freaking, it was no freaking fun, okay? But but you know, that that's how you learn. That's how you grow. I mean, and and and it makes you stronger. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger, right? And so, you know, but it was no fun for a while. I was hiding underneath a rock. And again, the first thing I did, reassociate with my goals, make a decision. Enough is enough. Get started, take that first step. I build a litigation support company out of the ashes of that, turned into a, you know, about a$10 million company that I sold a few years back. But but, you know, a lot of people have limiting beliefs. And and I'll share something with you. When I immigrated, I didn't speak English. And I if I Where are you from? Where'd you come from? I'm from I was born in the Netherlands, you know, wooden shoes, wouldn't we? Yes, I've been there. I was there. So, yeah, so so I got thrown into school. I didn't speak English, found out what bullies were for the first time, so I got my butt kicked occasionally. Then my mom, proud Dutch woman that she is, thought it'd be a great idea to send me to school in these wooden shoes. These are the actual freaking wooden shoes. Okay. And any blisters? Any and these leather shorts the Germans wear for. Oh my gosh. So I got my ass. Did you get beat up big time? Yes. And the bullies would chase me home, and she'd chase them off with a fly swatter next day, ass beaten. And I and I came up with this belief system that I wasn't good enough. And a lot of people have these limiting belief systems. I'm not good enough, I'm not smart enough, I'm not young enough, old enough, I'm not analytical enough. That was another one of mine. But here's the thing: there's a reason the acronym for belief systems is BS, because 99% of them are BS, but we believe they're real. I mean, I used to be afraid to raise my hand in front of Ted kids in the classroom, and now I speak in front of thousands of people a year, literally in flip-flops, typically. So, you know, if you're listening and you've got one of these belief systems that you're consciously aware of, drag it out into the daylight. Look at it with your adult rational mind, recognize that it's BS and it will dissipate, I promise you. Okay, but you got to pull it out consciously. Super important.

SPEAKER_02 16:49

No, I agree with you. No, it's that's funny. From the you're from the Netherlands, that cracks me up. And the wooden shoes, that's really funny. Didn't you get blisters from wearing those things? I don't understand it.

SPEAKER_01 17:00

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You you wear thick socks. I mean, they still wear them in in Holland, you know, they they walk through the mud in them, but oh my god, that was like crack cocaine for the bullies. Oh, good lord.

SPEAKER_02 17:10

That's great. You know, one of the one of the other things too that I that I thought was really cool that I saw on the it caught my eye was that, you know, in 2001, you also started a foundation. The tiny hands.

SPEAKER_01 17:21

Let's end, let's you want to end with that? Okay, we'll end with that. Because I've got a really good story about that that I'd love to share. That's compelling for anybody that wants success. So if you want success, stay to the end of this because it's a big piece of it.

SPEAKER_02 17:33

That's that's a good we'll we'll hit that then. Yeah. So then let's go into the the the book. I mean, how how long ago did you write the book?

Goals, Decisions, And First Steps

SPEAKER_01 17:40

Oh, I I bought, I wrote it, I wrote it literally uh once people were asking for information. You know, I took those free phone calls, I did hundreds of free 30-minute phone calls. I didn't have anything to sell, I just wanted to add value. You know, again, the people that are the most successful in the world, the ones that add the most value. Look at Jeff Bezos, look at Elon, and you know, they add the most value. But here's the thing I want to mention a couple quick things as it relates to the strategies I used when I lost everything, because they tie into the to the ones you want to use to get started. Play to your strengths is one of them. Okay, don't try to build your weaknesses. In my business, in the commercial real estate business, and I don't just teach apartments anymore. We do senior housing, I'm I'm buying assisted living facilities, we do student housing, self-storage, mobile home parks, retail, mixed juice, you name it. You want to play to your strengths, and it's a team sport. So there's lots of different hats you can wear. You could be the one that finds the deals, you could be the one that underwrites them, maybe you're analytical, maybe you could be the mouthpiece like Rod, like me, where you're building relationships with investors and brokers and sellers and so on and so forth. You know, you could be the project manager, the asset manager after you buy the property. So there's a lot of places, but build your strengths, hire a line or partner for your weaknesses. Why? Because when you're playing to your strengths, you love what you do. Some of the best partnerships I see in this business are an analytical introverted person with an extroverted outgoing person because you need both pieces. And so, you know, play to your strengths, hire a line or partner for your weaknesses. And the key is don't live someone else's life. So when you're doing that, you know you love it and you never work another day in your life because you're playing to your strengths and you're going to be passionate about it. And passions require to influence because when you love what you do, you're passionate, right? And so, you know, and you've got to influence people. And so, yeah, do what you do, operate from that passion. And when you have that passion, you know, it enhances your ability to influence, but it also it's the fuel, you know. You're not playing small, it breeds creativity, innovation, and minimizes or even eliminates fear.

SPEAKER_02 19:30

Yeah, and passion attracts attracts people. It attracts people that that want to be around you, want it, they want to get the energy that you have and and all those things.

SPEAKER_01 19:38

And and that's another piece. You want to be around people that want more out of life. Yeah, you know, I I'll tell you who you you show me your three best friends, I'll show you who you are in every aspect of your life. Your your your health, your happiness, your relationships, definitely your finances. And so a lot of people default to people they went to school with or that they work with. And those people might have their own limiting beliefs and fear, okay? And sometimes it's family. I'm gonna tell you, you know, and I'll tell you something. Uh, when I was losing everything in 2008 and nine, I was in Tony Robbins Platinum Partnership, high-level mastermind. It was like over$100,000 at that time. And I was around people that were killing it, okay? They were thriving in that crash. And they're like, get up, you puss, 50 million, schmillion, go make something happen. That's who you want to be around when the you know, the proverbial, you know what hits the fan. And so, you know, be very, very careful who you allow to influence you. And sometimes it's family, like I said. And and I will sell you, love your family, but proactively choose, you know, your peers.

SPEAKER_02 20:46

Yeah, no, that's important. Yeah. Your environment, you know, your environment is is who you hang out with, and and you'll become a product of it if it's not, if it's not the right environment. And it's not good. No, I I agree with you there. So what do you sp you said you specialize in in a lot of different things, but your big thing is multi-units, is that right?

SPEAKER_01 21:03

Well, that's yeah, that's where I started. I've kind of, you know, just very recently got into senior housing, and I'm looking at other asset classes, but yeah, I've owned, I own thousands of apartment units, and and my students, like I said, own upwards of 300. We're counting, we're at 270,000 that we're counting, and we know we're missing a ton. So I'm I'm guessing it's up to 300,000. And so, but yeah, I mean, uh it's it's a fantastic mechanism. People think that, you know, they see an apartment complex and they think one wealthy guy owns it. No, it's people put together a group of investors and they go out and buy it. My students have raised hundreds of millions of dollars for these things, and you know, and yeah, it's a little scary at first, but once you learn it, it's not. And and candidly, the same strategies that we teach at my boot camp, boot camps, I do one about every month and a half, are are the ones you'd use to buy these other types of commercial real estate as well. Now, I've owned 2,000 houses, okay, that I've rented long term. And I'll never own another house unless it's a third, fourth, fifth place for me. So that should tell you something, okay? Because multifamily is much easier. When I lost everything in 2008, I had 800 houses and I had several apartment complexes. It was the houses that pulled me down. Why is that?

SPEAKER_02 22:12

Now the go why was it the houses? What's the difference?

Why Apartments Beat Houses

SPEAKER_01 22:15

Let me explain. Yeah, and I was only at a 30% loan to value. Okay. I only owed 30 cents on the dog because I get hate all the time. Well, you were over leveraged. No, I was not. Okay. So here's why. So, first of all, they were two hours north of me and two hours south of me, up and down the Gulf Coast of Florida. Okay. Now that that was a problem, and I'll explain why in a second. But Florida has no state income tax. So property taxes are a little higher. Yep. I had properties in wind and flood zones, insurance, like flood and wind insurance. So those things impact. Cash flow in a big way. These were C class houses. So you know there's A, B, C, and D. A's the new stuff. D's the hood. Stay out of the hood. Ask me how I know. Okay. That's another topic. But these were C class houses. Older properties, tougher demographic, tougher tenants, and so a lot more maintenance. The maintenance killed me. I never really cash flowed. Okay. I broke even barely. But because of the maintenance, so let's say I had to send somebody to one of my apartment complexes, we could stockpile parts, plumbing parts, electrical parts, window locks, door locks, HVAC parts, you name it. And they could be in and out in an hour. A maintenance guy in and out in an hour. Well, if I had to send someone to an hour away to one of my houses, you can't stockpile parts for every house. So they got to go see what's wrong. They go find a Home Depot or Lowe's, which would be another hour-round trip. I don't know about you, Brad, but when Rod's happy rear-end tries to go and fix something, he ends up going to Home Depot or Lowe's more than once. And the same thing with maintenance guys. So what took an hour at one of my apartment complexes took all day at one of my 800 houses. And that killed me. But the last thing was I didn't pay attention to 10-minute demographics back then. And afterwards, I discovered I had a ton of contractors in my houses. You know, they had good credit and jobs and everything when I brought them in, but that work fell off a cliff. You know, painters, electricians, drywallers, roofers, you name it. And that work fell off a cliff in 2009. So they didn't have work.

SPEAKER_02 24:02

So you have basically all the same kind of clients losing their jobs at the same time.

SPEAKER_01 24:05

Yep, yeah. And I had retail and con and jobbers, contractors, you know, plumbers, electricians, drywallers, all that. Yeah. And so so that that was that was everything at a high level that went wrong. And so that's incredible.

SPEAKER_02 24:20

Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead. I want to hear something.

SPEAKER_01 24:22

I was at a 30% loan to value. By the end of 2009, my portfolio was upside down.

SPEAKER_02 24:27

It dropped more than 70%. Yeah. See, and that's Florida for you, though.

SPEAKER_01 24:31

Yeah, well, Florida, California, Nevada, all those states got killed in that crash. You got that right. Major, major price reductions. And I'll tell you, we're seeing them again.

SPEAKER_02 24:40

Well, you because you know, Florida's interesting. I I, you know, just because I've done real estate for 33 years, residential. Right. And, you know, it's funny. I watch and I study all the numbers across the country, and Florida is an interesting one where I call it the building machine. You guys have the ability to turn on or off new construction like that. But the problem is, is it doesn't turn off as fast as it needs to. Oh, no. Because what happens all the all the builders start building.

SPEAKER_01 25:08

We're overbuilt for apartments right now. Rents went up 30% in in the Tampa Met MSA, Tampa Metropolitan Statistical Area. 30%, I forgot if it was 22 or 23. 23, I think. 30%. I mean, just think about that kind of an increase. You're paying a thousand, now you got to pay 1300, okay? But anyway. Um now, of course, it's dropped back down, but but you don't think you're gonna see 2008 again, though.

SPEAKER_02 25:32

I wouldn't see that. That's a totally different situation.

SPEAKER_01 25:35

I don't at all. Now we're seeing a meltdown in multifamily because operators got that adjustable rate dead in there. I mean, my my attorney, I just had a call with him last night. He had six foreclosures that he's uh apartment complexes that he was dealing with with six clients last week.

SPEAKER_02 25:48

Do you think that that's really hit yet or no? We talked about this about a year and a half ago.

Florida Cycles And The Debt Wall

SPEAKER_01 25:52

It didn't hit yet. It's it's coming. Trust me, it's coming. You're gonna see properties go up for auction. I've got I'll give you an example. I've got an asset in San Antonio. We call them assets. It's apartment complex, 200 units. Right next door is a 300 unit. It sold for 43 million uh like three years ago. It's down to it's bit the bank now, it's down to 28. Wow. I'd love to buy it, but we're gonna not interested unless it gets down to 24, 43 to 24. Wow. So that's what's happening already. So the deals are coming. I mean, if there's ever a time to get in this business right freaking now, if you're interested, you know, get your butt to my boot camp. And that's because a lot of these low interest rates are expiring, right? Well, no, it's more than that. There's a bit there's this debt wall, okay? It's like a trillion dollars in commercial debt coming due. And there's a lot of people that got adjustable rate debt, which they they couldn't hold on. And see, here's the thing when debt comes due, it's not like a 30-year mortgage in a house. In commercial real estate, there's a there's a there's a balloon payment that is to put it in residential terms. It's we don't call it that in our world, but that's what it is. And you either have to sell or you have to refinance. Sales are down about 80, 90 percent right now. And refinancing, you have to meet debt service coverage requirements. And with the interest rates where they still are, they don't. So you we're seeing a lot of distress. But I mean, okay, but but here's the thing, I don't want to scare you. I want to get you excited because with crisis comes opportunity.

SPEAKER_02 27:09

Oh, it's absolutely opportunity.

SPEAKER_01 27:11

I got I got crushed by that wave in 2008. I'm surfing this one, baby.

SPEAKER_02 27:15

Now you're ready, you're ready, right? Exactly. Surfboard's all waxed up, you're ready to go, right? That's it. That's it, man.

SPEAKER_01 27:21

I I mean, you know, I I you bite hit me once, shame on you. Hit me twice. It's Rod's own fault, you know. Exactly. Well, you know what? We are gonna let me share one other thing. Yeah, go ahead. Okay, go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Oh, okay. Well, I I want to talk about something. You know, I also want to talk about the contribution piece because it's really important, but I want to say something. I'm gonna lose some of you on this. You're gonna think, oh, he's in foo foo land. But humor, stay with me because this is how I had 50 million to lose and how I got it back, so you can ignore it at your peril. I want to talk about gratitude for a minute, okay? Gratitude is the most important foundational emotion we have available to us, makes us stronger when we face adversity, strengthens our immune system, makes our heart stronger, even lowers our blood pressure, brings us closer to our spirituality, but it's also how you manifest everything you want in life. And I'm sure you agree with me on this. You could call it prayer, whatever, but but you know, I most mornings I'll sit in my recliner and I will just do gratitude for the people that I love in my life, my students, my family, the things that I have, but then I'll do gratitude for the things that I want as if I already have them. And I have gotten emotional with tears in my eyes, being grateful for things I don't even have yet. And I know I lost some of you on this, but this is how I had 50 million to lose and how I got it back. And so, you know, I would highly encourage you to incorporate that into your life. Gratitude fixes everything. Yeah, I love that.

SPEAKER_02 28:41

And Hugo, first time we've heard that. Yeah, that's right. Right. We Hugo and I are big on gratitude. We've had discussions about it and and all that, and talk about you know what it means for certain different people. But having I I like I've never heard it before. It's almost like forward gratitude. You're you're thanking you're having gratitude for something you haven't even gotten yet.

SPEAKER_01 28:59

That's how you bring it into your life. That's the way it works. You call it prayer if you like, but that's how it works. You know, if you listen to you know, all these people that talk about manifesting and the the the movie The Secret, it's all about it's all about the the law of attraction is as if you already have it. And and uh there's even a there's even a a clause in the Bible, and I I don't know it, or I I should learn it because I should use it, but but there's one that that basically says you want something, you act as if you have it. It's it's along those lines.

SPEAKER_02 29:27

Oh, interesting.

SPEAKER_01 29:28

But interesting. The one other thing I wanted to mention, the the last thing I want to mention, unless you've got a question.

SPEAKER_02 29:34

No, no, no. No, you go ahead. This is it's going great.

Distress, Auctions, And Upcoming Deals

Gratitude And Manifesting Outcomes

SPEAKER_01 29:38

So so I when I immigrated this country, you know, I ended up in Denver, Colorado. And we didn't have much growing up. I'm just gonna tell you that right now. I mean, I wore clothes in the goodwill all the way through junior high school until I lied about my age of Burger King when I was 14, told him I was 15 and got a job, so I get my own clothes. But I always knew I wanted to live on the beach, and there's no beach in Denver, it's in the middle of the country. And but I would visualize it. I would visualize the palm trees, this, this, the surf, the sand. 20, and this was when I was 18. When 20 years later, I built this incredible mansion on the beach. I mean, I owned the beach on one side. It was about a$10 million, so worth 10 million now. Beach on one side, I had my boats on the backside. It was a Gulf to Bay sliced through an island. Unthinkable when I was 18. And I mean, to describe this, there was a giant waterfall from the second floor balcony into the pool. You had to walk through the waterfall to get to the pool. It was in magazines, big spiral staircase up through the middle, wine cellar, elevator. On the second floor, I had aquariums built around the staircase that cost me almost 200 grand. So this gives you an idea of the house. Two months after I moved in, I worked for this thing for 20 years. Two months after I moved in, I'm floating in my pool at night and I'm looking at this testament to my ego. It was to prove to the freaking world I was good enough. I mean, if that didn't do it, forget it. You know, my family's inside sleeping. I had all the toys, the Maserati, the Mercedes, and all the stupid shit I thought was important, boats, jet skis. And I'm looking up at this thing and I got depressed. And I don't mean a little depressed. I mean I was really depressed. I'm like, what the hell? I've just achieved success. Like time sent thousand. How could I be depressed? And this is what I want to share with your listeners. There were three things happening. One was you should never achieve a big goal without having other goals lined up behind it. Like the good book says, without a vision, the people perish. I didn't know what I was gonna do next. So that was one piece. Second piece was it happiness comes from progress and growth. It's never about the goals. You know, you say they say the happiest days of a boat owner's life, the day they buy the boat, the day they sell the boat. You need the goals to create that burning desire, but it's never about that. Happiness comes from progress and growth. And if you do my goal setting workshop at the end of it, the one that's Rod's goals, is my my weekly planning process. And part of that process is to celebrate anything you did, acknowledge it, because even if you have slowdowns or setbacks, you'll still be happy because you're progressing. But the big thing that was happening, the third thing was I was totally focused on me. Rod, Rod, Rod. Show the world I matter, blah, blah, blah. Well, that's the year I met Tony Robbins. I went and saw him live, I don't know, it's about 26 years ago in Fort Lauderdale. And I saw that he fed families for the holidays. And I'm like, what a concept. Do something for someone else. And embarrassed to say I had to be 40 to get that memo. So I called my brother in Denver. I said, bro, let's feed five families because I was flying out there for Thanksgiving. So he called his church, found five families who really needed help. We bought food and toys and everything. And the third family changed my life, Brad. We go up to this house, it was not even a one-bedroom. And this woman was in there, Hispanic woman with five kids. She comes out, she sees the stuff on the porch, she starts crying. The kids come out, two of the older ones start crying. I start crying, and I was hooked. Now, what I'm gonna say next is not bragging. You need to listen, guys, if you're interested in success, because there's a real message here. Over the last 26 years, I've had over 150,000 children in my area for the holidays. I've provided tens of at-risk kids that wouldn't have a holiday meal. I've provided tens of thousands of backpacks filled with school supplies to local kids that don't have the basic supplies for school. Don't get me started on that pro that business. But and then I provided thousands and thousands of teddy bears to local police departments for officers to keep in their vehicles to bridge the gap with children if they're ever in a traumatic situation. Now, I bring this up because, you know, we've been taught to achieve to be happy. Tony Robbins calls it the science of achievement versus the art of fulfillment. Achievement's a science. If you want to learn commercial real estate, multifamily, get your ass to my boot camp, okay? I'll give you the blueprint and the map. You just got to go do it. But fulfillment is an art, okay? You got to figure out what juices you. For me, it's kids. It's also the elderly. Maybe for you, it's animals, the environment, whatever it is. Give back right now. Okay. Don't say, well, you had money, that's why you gave back. You want the money, give back. That's how you get the money. You know, I did a, I'll let I'll land the plane with this. I did a uh presentation for some of my warriors. I had a thousand participants at a three-day boot camp in Orlando, and I did a presentation, I brought, we called it the Hall of Fame Awards. There were like 15 warriors, those are my coaching students, 15 warriors up on stage, and we did a slide for each one of them, and I started to notice every single one of them does something to give back. Schools in India, schools in Latin America, human trafficking, uh, veterans suicide, veterans homelessness. And I looked at those thousand people and I pointed this to the deck and I said, that's what we call a freaking clue. Power moves to those who serve. So give back right now. If you don't have money, give of your time. Success will come faster. You don't do it for that reason, but that's why you do it.

SPEAKER_02 34:21

No, man, that's great. Great stuff. No, and it's called, just so we can get out, the the foundation's called Tiny Hands Foundation. Is that correct?

SPEAKER_01 34:29

TinyHandsFoundation.org. Every dime goes to the food and the backpacks. I I paid for it up until 2008 when I lost everything. In 2009, I spent 50,000. I fed fed 1,500 families and 3,500 kids. But but up until at that point, I started taking donations.

SPEAKER_02 34:43

No, and that's good. It makes it bigger. I mean, why not? You know what I mean? Plus, also you're giving you're giving the opportunity for somebody else to feel that, what you feel. That's it.

SPEAKER_01 34:50

I mean, we get hundreds of volunteers. It's it's it's pretty pretty extraordinary. And and I hope, again, that please guys know I wasn't bragging. This is how this is such a critical piece of success. I agree. Power moves to those who serve.

SPEAKER_02 35:03

I agree. And it's funny, I think it's something that we kind of learn as we get older, as we move along. I mean, it's it's not something that's always really evident, but you started doing it at 40, which to me, you sounded like you thought that was too old, but that's that's actually good. I mean, I think start if a lot of people don't get that at 40 years old.

SPEAKER_01 35:20

Well, I'll tell you, I I I I sometimes, you know, I've interviewed some of the largest operators on the planet here in my studio um in multifamily, 5,000, 10,000 units, and and I can tell if there was I was if if they're where I was before that epiphany that I had. And I feel sorry for them because yeah, they may have financial success, but they're not truly successful. And you know, they have to they have to base basically have that epiphany on their own.

SPEAKER_02 35:43

The art of fulfillment. I love that. That's really cool. All right, man. I appreciate you so much for coming on. Well, great time talking to you. We'll probably have you on again sometime in the future. I appreciate that.

The Beach Mansion And Empty Success

SPEAKER_01 35:54

Can I can I just mention uh if they're interested in my boot camp, sure, go ahead. Go ahead. Okay, yeah. So go to rodslinks.com if you're interested in learning this business, Rodzplurallinkspro.com or text links to 72345. There's a bunch of free resources there. My boot camp site's there. It's 47 bucks. I don't sell anything, and it's two days of training. So there's no freaking excuses if you want to learn this. Okay, I make it so there's no excuses. But yeah, it's Rod's links. Thanks, brother.

SPEAKER_02 36:19

Awesome, man. I appreciate it so much. We'll be talking to you real soon. All right. All right, all right, there you have it. Rod Cleef, uh, there in Sarasota, Florida. He's doing an amazing job. I mean, you definitely want to look him up. If you look up his name, it's spelled K-H L I yeah, L E I I F. Uh, you'll find him there. Plus, we're gonna have it all over our social media and you'll be able to find him there. So uh thanks again for listening every Thursday at 7 p.m. All right, that's about it. See ya.