The Vital Veda Podcast: Ayurveda | Holistic Health | Cosmic and Natural Law
The Vital Veda Podcast is a show for people who intend to live the most evolutionary life at their highest potential, while experiencing total wellness and bliss.
Our host Dylan Smith brings you the most inspiring interviews with thought leaders and experts from around the world in the fields of health, spirituality, personal development and natural law.
Dylan Smith is an Ayurvedic practitioner, holistic health educator and exponent of Vedic wisdom. He is devoted to learning, sharing and radiating this profound knowledge for everyone to utilise and enjoy.
Enliven your natural capability to tune into your own body and mind, awaken your instincts and engage in life in a frictionless flow.
Find out more at www.vitalveda.com.au
The Vital Veda Podcast: Ayurveda | Holistic Health | Cosmic and Natural Law
Mantra Shastra Explained: The Timeless Science of Sound | Purnesh #148
Ever wondered what makes a mantra truly powerful? Is it the precision of pronunciation, the ancient lineage it comes from, or the sincerity of the heart behind it?
In this episode, Dylan speaks with Purnesh (formerly Swami Purnachaitanya), a teacher and practitioner who has spent over twenty years immersed in the Vedic tradition of mantra. Together they explore what mantra really is - not just words or sounds, but vibrations that carry & enliven consciousness itself. The conversation traces Purnesh’s own journey of initiation and study, the importance of authentic transmission, and how mantras can shape not only our spiritual practice but also our daily lives.
This is a grounded, heartfelt exploration of a subject often clouded by mystery and misconception. Whether you’re curious about starting a mantra practice or seeking to deepen your understanding, this episode offers clarity, wisdom, and inspiration for engaging with sound as a profound tool for transformation.
IN THIS EPISODE WE DISCUSS:
🕉️ Purnesh’s personal journey with mantra — from childhood fascination to deep study and initiation in India.
🕉️ What makes a mantra effective
🕉️ The difference between universal (prasiddha) mantras and specialised mantras.
🕉️ Mantra Shastra as a systematic, scientific tradition — and its connection to other Vedic sciences like Jyotish and Ayurveda.
🕉️ The inner symbolism of the Samudra Mantana (Churning of the Ocean of Milk) and its link to mantra practice and the 108-bead mala.
🕉️ Why meditation and emptiness are essential foundations for effective mantra practice.
🕉️ How modern seekers can responsibly approach mantra, initiation, and daily practice in today’s world.
ABOUT OUR GUEST: Purnesh
Purnesh (formerly Swami Purnachaitanya) is an internationally respected teacher of Sanskrit mantras and Vedic wisdom, with over 20 years of dedicated practice. Trained under Gurudev Sri Sri Ravi Shankar and later initiated into the Shaiva Agama tradition, he has mastered Vedic hymns, rituals, and the deeper science of mantra śāstra.
As a former monk, he travelled for more than 15 years across 30+ countries, teaching meditation, yoga, and mantras to diverse audiences from heads of state to prison inmates. His bestselling book Looking Inward has been translated into over 10 languages and is a practical guide to meditation and inner peace.
Now based in the Netherlands with his partner Rowena, Purnesh leads Just Be (justbe.org) and offers online courses on mantra practice, bridging authentic tradition with modern seekers eager to unlock the transformative power of sound and vibration.
RESOURCES:
- Mantra Mastery Level 1 program in English (20% OFF Discount Code: VITALVEDA)
- Purnesh's Website
- Purnesh's Youtube Channel
- Japa, Mantra, Sound Energy, Rites of Passage & Expert Guidance | Swami Purnachaitanya #102
- Sanskrit & Vedic Chanting: Vibratory Sounds of Cosmic Intelligence | Samadhi Collective w/ Kamala & Jahnavi #066
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This time on the Vital Vader Podcast.
Speaker 2:There are some mantras that are called prasiddha mantras, which you can say are multi-purpose, good for everybody, without anything to worry about In the end. If someone has so much of devotion and faith and love, then that mantra will give the result, Because if you can really see and feel divinity there, divinity will manifest. It will come to you in that form and people have seen this when you meditate or when you chant your mantras. You do it sincerely. Sometimes emotions may come up, all kinds of random thoughts may come up.
Speaker 2:So it's like you're getting rid of all these impressions, you may get beautiful experiences. So this is that churning with, and then all the treasures came out, the poison came out. You know, it's very beautiful to see the significance of these stories. So it's always good to start with a Ganapati mantra, and then I'll also add one mantra for Saraswati, so that the knowledge may flow nicely, and the mantra for guru, so all the gurus, the masters that we honor, the traditions and, of course, the Adi guru, lord Shiva himself, so that yeah that, whatever we may discuss, share it may benefit people and uplift them.
Speaker 3:Thank you, jai Stharajam Brahmanam Brahmanaspata Anashranvan Nothibhissi Dasadanam Sri Mahaganapataye Namah Saraswati, namastubhyam Varadhekam Aroopini Vidyarambham Karishyami siddhir bhavatume sada namaste sharadadevi kashmir puravasini, tvamaham prarthaye devi vityabuddhin chadehime ayim guru sarasvat yai namah gurur brahma gurur vishnur gur Guru Devo Maheshwara Guru Saakshat Param Brahma Tasmai. Sri Gurave Namah Sadashiva Samarambhaam Shankaracharya Mathya Maam Asmat. Sri Guru Paryantaam Vande Guru Paramparaam Om Gurave Namah. Sri Guru Paryantaam Vande Guru Paramparaam Om Gurave Namah. Om Namah Pranavarthaya Shuddha Jnanaika Moorthaye Nirmalaya, prashantaya Dakshina Moorthaye Namah.
Speaker 1:Where did you learn to chant mantras?
Speaker 2:Well the mantras came into my life at a very early age. I was fortunate to have parents who were spiritual, you can say, so I was raised a vegetarian. During their college days, actually, they came across the, the tm programs that learn meditation. And then, when I grew up, I remember there was a cassette an audio cassette, not the old ones that sometimes my parents used to play, and it had these vedic mantras recorded by someone in Europe, but very nice, and I used to love listening to that. So I didn't know what the mantras were. I didn't know it was Sanskrit, I just really liked the sound of it. And then I remember, many years later, when I came to India for the first time myself, I got to know that one of the main mantras that was chanted there was the Gayatri mantra. So when someone recited it there, I was was like oh, I know this mantra, and I started singing along. And then they were like oh, you know, but you should be actually initiated to chant that. And how did you learn? I said, well, there was this cassette that I used to listen to with my parents. So that was there.
Speaker 2:But then, as I grew up, during my high school days, that is when I was introduced to meditation formally, some of the other things, because that is when I met Shishiravishankar. I got to know about the programs of the art of living. So there I was introduced to to the bhajans. So some of the mantras they sing and his talks on, you know various scriptures. So then the that's interest in the, the Vedic knowledge, the Vedic scriptures, became more and more and I found a platform to discover it more. And then there I learned to chant some of the mantras. Then I ended up studying, amongst other things, sanskrit in university. So I was thinking that then I will learn more about this Vedic knowledge, these mantras, and I found out that that was really not much the case, just a linguistic course.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and of course we learned, like it was, languages and cultures of India and Tibet. So we also learned about the culture, about some of the traditions, but from books, you know, the, the western European perspective of Indologists. And then my Sanskrit teacher. I remember the first day we are introduced to the various professors, right, you get to meet them, get to know them a little bit, and they said, okay, this is your teacher Sanskrit, your professor Sanskrit, this old grey man, and he looked a little not too happy but I went with all my enthusiasm and then I went to ask of him that you know.
Speaker 2:So are we going to learn to chant some of these?
Speaker 3:Vedic mantras, because I had heard I had in India.
Speaker 2:I had already gone once to India. I had seen some of the you know, the pundits, doing the yajnas, the Vedic ceremonies, and it was amazing. So I went there with all my hope and asked him are we going to learn to chant some of these Vedic mantras? And he looked at me with this very stern face and he said of course not.
Speaker 3:So I was like it's not dead at all, you know but then so?
Speaker 2:but then I thought, okay, let me take, learn from here what I can and then after that go to india. So I I went to, went and did that after my studies, university studies. I spoke to uh shisharishankar and I said you know, I would like to come to the International Art of Living Center in Bangalore. I can, would like to volunteer, contribute to some of the projects, but also, if possible, learn more of these mantras. And he gave me that opportunity.
Speaker 2:So when I went there, I was after a little bit of, you know, effort, I underwent the Upanayana Sanskara, so the Vedic ceremony where you get the sacred thread and the Gayatri Mantra and you become, as per the tradition, also eligible to learn the Vedic mantras, and there were some very kind Pandits there whom I used to sit with and they would teach me.
Speaker 2:Very good Pandits so, from Rig Veda, from Yajur Veda. So I had a chance to learn quite a few of the Vedic mantras, like the Rudram, namakam, chamakam, quite a few of the Suktas, other mantras, and then in recent years I had the good fortune also to be introduced and welcome to a tradition also which has a lot of knowledge of Jyotish mantra Shastra. That is a tradition of that is now headed by Pandit Sanjay Rath from the Rajyotisha tradition of Puri Orissa and the tradition goes back to one of the direct disciples of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. It's it's a it's a long lineage and that is where now I got to learn even more of the proper mantra shastra you know, along with some of the Jyotisha, and it's just amazing because I've always had this urge to learn more.
Speaker 2:But then you look I mean, I'm sure you recognize this you look for books. Where can I find it? Nowadays you can google online, but there's only so much you can find. For some things you would need the proper guidance, but a lot of it also you need a teacher who can explain that. Okay, because a lot of this knowledge was it's not straightforward, you know it's presented in a manner where it may be cryptic, there may be deeper meanings and there's a whole practical aspect to it. Of course, I feel very fortunate that it's always come quite effortlessly to me, in the sense that sometimes I would hear a mantra once or twice and it would stick.
Speaker 2:I would remember, and even with the chanting one of my main teachers. He was a pundit. He's no longer alive. He passed away a few years ago in Bangalore, but when we recorded some of the mantras I had him check it also, is the Ucharanada pronunciation proper, the intonation correct? And he was so happy and he said you know your chanting, it's so nice. It's much more clear than many of my students and the pandits here, so that, of course, is a blessing. I can't say that I did anything for that, but it feels something that's very close to my heart and it makes me very happy whenever.
Speaker 2:I chant and you also mentioned to me it's in your Jyotish that mantra is like the main, yes, yes, so my teacher, pandit Sanjerat, also, when he looked at my chart and we discussed some of these things.
Speaker 2:Of course I already knew it, I didn't need someone to tell me that this is something that I'm so passionate about and I've seen that I have some skill in that. But he also said that, yeah, this is really something where you can say your dharma lies, where you can do a lot, you can contribute a lot, which is supported also, that energy is flowing in that direction.
Speaker 1:So you said when you went from the Bangalore to the Odisha, to so I've not been to Odisha physically. Sorry, that tradition I mean.
Speaker 2:So he had also come to Bangalore and I have a few friends who have been learning Jyotisha in the tradition from him.
Speaker 1:So that is how I was introduced to that knowledge, and then yeah, so when you say it was kind of next level mantra, you said or more, more fully mantra. Can you explain the difference? So sounds like in bangalore you're kind of just sitting with some pandits casually. How were you learning with them? Was it call and response? Was it just chanting?
Speaker 2:a lot of it was yeah the traditional uh style where um, because that is how they would teach there there's a proper gurukula, you know, a veda school. So when we would take up a mantra I would go there, and sometimes there were a few of us, sometimes I was alone, and they would take like one verse or one line or a part of it. They will chant it, I will repeat it two, three times, and like that we go through this part for a number of days and then they felt, okay, this is proper, we take the next bit and like that we would learn. So of course there are some books which has a lot of these mantras that I could use for reference, but the learning process was really that. So it was like call and respond. So I learned a lot of the, I mean these vedic mantras and all that there.
Speaker 2:But then when I was introduced to the, you can say the proper mantra, shastra. So then you know it's. It's such a vast science where you really start from the sketch. You get the building blocks, these different letters, these sounds, the aksharas. You know where have they originated from, what do they stand for, what do they embody, what happens when you combine them? And I mean basically, for me it feels a little bit like, of course, you have a great knowledge of Ayurveda, so I think you can really relate that. It's like, if you go deep enough into it, it's like the science of medicine on the level of karma. So it is a close connection with Jyotisha, of course. But then you can really say that, ok, some mantras are good for everybody, like some herbs are beneficial for everybody to include in their diet.
Speaker 2:Everybody should have lots of water, you know, fresh vegetables, all of these things. And then there are very specific things where you can say, okay, based on your prakriti. But then if we look on the level of karma, so your unique karmas that you have taken to this life, that have come together to form you in this life, this birth, so then you can say, okay, everybody has their you can say strengths and weaknesses. Some are your weak spots. So then if you attend to that, it can make your life a lot more comfortable. It can help you to be maybe more successful or to have less challenges, and that requires some very specific personal attention. So you say okay, because your specific problem may be or would be different from another person. So, like I have a headache, you have a headache, but for you it may be something in your digestion which is causing it. For me it may be the fact that I'm not sleeping enough, or some other genetic thing or who knows what. So then you can say, ok, a specific mantra can really work wonders because it can take away that specific karma that is blocking that.
Speaker 2:Like to give one example, because it may be a little abstract for people sometimes that say, someone has a problem where they have a health issue. They've been to so many doctors but they're not able to resolve it. The doctor doesn't know exactly what the problem is. They've tried so many things so that means they're going through some karma. They have to experience that, apparently, because it's not that these doctors are not good. They would have seen so many patients and help those people. So then, because I know such a story one of my friends he had that where then that person was introduced to a good Jyotishi mantra shastra person and they looked at his chart, they looked at some of the things and they said, okay, I can see what the problem is, I'll give you a mantra.
Speaker 2:You do this every day and it will help you to solve this problem. Now the person was not so much into spirituality and all of that, but they said, okay, let me try. What do I have to lose? So he started doing that. Then, after a few weeks or months or something, there was an interaction again. So the person asked that, did your problem get resolved? I said yes, yes, finally after all this time but it was not because of the mantra. Actually, what happened?
Speaker 1:is.
Speaker 2:I met a person and he knew a very good doctor, so he introduced me to him and when I saw him he knew exactly what the problem was. He gave me some pills. It was nothing hectic, no treatment as such required. I just took those tablets and within one week my problem was solved.
Speaker 2:So the thing is that it doesn't mean that the mantra will cure it magically, in the sense when that karma is taken away, then suddenly, when he Comes in front of the doctor or the right person is, then comes into your life, your problem gets solved.
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Speaker 1:So, as I see, is mantra. Shastra is like other shastras. It's a more sequential, elaborate science rather than kind of hearing. Oh yeah, I've heard of the gaitri mantra and the shiva mantra and I'm hearing these things occasionally. I'm just coming to learn them. But now I'm actually looking at a more elaborate, sequential and yes, yes.
Speaker 1:How do you say orderly structured?
Speaker 2:Very much. It's very scientific.
Speaker 1:Because I didn't know about that. I haven't studied Mantra Shastra, so I know that there's Jyotish Shastras for astrology and there's Vastu Shastras for architecture Of course there's Ayurveda Shastras, so there's a whole thing on mantras where you can unpack all the sounds and yes, yes, and and you start seeing the connections.
Speaker 2:Because if this, like if we look at quantum physics also now they say in the end it's all energy that's vibrating. So it's like different frequencies and the mantra shastra says that it's at in the end the foundation is sound, is vibration. So the the basic substratum you can say is om the pranava, that is the, the vibration of the universe.
Speaker 2:You know, and I think they've even measured some of these things, where in space there is a sound and if you would make it audible it's like om. But then from that, so that's the shiva, they say. But then from that shakti came the prakriti. You have the purusha and the pra. That, so that's the Shiva, they say. But then from that Shakti came the Prakriti. You have the Purusha and the Prakriti, so that manifested in these, you can say primordial sounds.
Speaker 2:And that is maybe you know that story of the Shaktipitas where they say Sati, you know, when she threw herself in the fire and Shiva became so desolate and he was carrying that body around and then Vishnu came and he cut it in so many pieces, it was scattered, so that Shiva could grieve and get back to himself, so that dissolution wouldn't happen. So they say pieces of her fell on the earth. And they have these temples where they say it's a part of the Devi's body, where it may be a nose or an ear or something. But if you see the actual Shakti Peetas, the found Peeta means like a center of that Shakti, that energy are those are the Aksharas, because they say there were 50 or 54 pieces. So these are the different sounds of the Devanagari, the Sanskrit alphabet, to put it like that. So each sound is, you can say, a part of the Shakti that has a specific vibration and that creates this entire world.
Speaker 2:And that is why, like, if you see, I can give one example, if it's not too complicated for people, but for example so these sounds are like bijas, they're like seeds, they have that potential to become a whole tree. They're like seeds, they have that potential to become a whole tree. And Ra or Ram we add that underscore M at the end is what they call the Agni Bija. It's connected to Agni and Agni is the fire. It is that which gives light and that gives a form to things Like. We can see forms and shapes because there is light. If it was all dark we couldn't.
Speaker 2:So they say Agni is that which gives a form, that manifests the things and the different aksharas that form the devi, that are part of the, that shakti, that energy, the cosmic energy. They can be divided in three groups where they say that the vowels are the soul of the devi. Then you have the consonants, which are the, the body, and the semi vowels which make up the mind, and they say that is how, if you see so many things that are alive, it's made up of these sounds. And and it's very scientific because if you see the, the soul, the consciousness can exist without a body. You can make the sound of a vowel like a, I, u, it doesn't need any support, but the consonants need a vowel. You cannot say K without the A.
Speaker 3:You know it won't come out.
Speaker 2:So the body needs the soul or the consciousness to exist, otherwise it falls apart. The mind also needs consciousness or soul. It cannot be on its own.
Speaker 1:Beautiful.
Speaker 2:But then if you see the words they used, so the vowels, they call it Svara in Sanskrit and Svara means the self, and Ra is that Agni Bija. So those sounds which manifest the self are Svara. If you see, akshara, the name for the letters, the sounds A is the first of the alphabet, ksha is the last. So Aksha, all the name for the letters, the sounds A is the first of the alphabet Ksha is the last so.
Speaker 2:Aksha, all the way from A to Ksha Akshara. So when those energies or sounds manifest, when they take a form, those forms are the letters. So like that, it's like you really can go deep into these things.
Speaker 1:And it's like yeah, yeah, it's too much. I'm sure a lot of people got a bit lost, but that's okay, because, particularly if you have a little bit of knowledge of sanskrit and at least the alphabet, that may may have been able to understand, but that's beautiful. So, yeah, I'm super excited because this is this is exactly what I want people to know is how to, I guess, navigate mantras. All right, so now you, you're studying these mantras, you're studying the essence, and I just want to say as well, like you said, the letters or the, is it the aksharas?
Speaker 1:yeah and the manifestation from the unified field of pure consciousness, which really is nothing, or you can say OM, and that's why, when people are chanting mantras that are Shakti mantras, or that are not just feminine mantras or Devi mantras, but mantras that have meaning, rather than kind of OM, which could you say is meaningless or just everything, it is everything Right.
Speaker 3:It's unmanifest as well?
Speaker 1:Yeah, or is it still manifest? It's manifest, it is. If it's a sound, then it means that, yeah, but that's the substratum. You can say Right.
Speaker 2:You can say everything exists in the space.
Speaker 3:So you cannot say the space is not there.
Speaker 2:But, then it's very difficult to give a quality to the space, except that it accommodates everything.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, because space is that first manifestation from the field of unmanifest. But that's why I always say, generally, I recommend to people to, as well as chanting mantras in this way, or these aksharas, to have some foundation of transcendence, like yogastha kuru karmani, established in being, perform action. And that action can even be chanting mantras, japa, and I see some people who, for example, their sadhana or their spiritual practice is just doing japa, and sometimes these people also need a foundation of transcendence of nothing, of just no mantra, no thought, and so that's that shakti and shiva together, that Purusha and Prakriti.
Speaker 2:Definitely I mean without meditation or without you know, being empty as you put it the mantra will not be so effective, because the whole point is that it's the power of consciousness that works. So just you know, on autopilot repeating a mantra is not going to get you much of results. You know, on autopilot repeating a mantra is not going to get you much of result. But if, if it's done with from that space where your mind is clear, your heart is full, you're fully present, then it makes a huge difference. That's why you see many of the mantras you know, like people may be familiar with some things like I don't know, like some stotras or lalitas asrana or things like that so this is they start with, to explain that it's like the thousand names of mother divine, and then stotras, yeah are like hymns of praise yes to different gods, or devatas as they call it.
Speaker 2:So they usually start with a dhyana mantra, which means a meditation mantra, to put it like mantra, which means a meditation mantra like that and that usually has a description of that energy right you know where, like for Dhanvantri, yeah, there may be a mantra that says you know, you could visualize him or imagine him to be like this, holding a pot of nectar, standing like this, looking very beautiful, you know. So it's not just something that, okay, you finish it off right here, was that? Then you sit and you put all your attention on that form and basically you meditate, you become empty can you give us an example of the dhyana mantra of um?
Speaker 2:like, for example, for one form of shiva. I mean, it continues more, but then it says that, okay, you could visualize him sitting on a seat like a lotus where he has five faces. That is the form of Sadashiva, and he has three eyes. He has things like that. So it starts with a mantra that allows you to visualize that form.
Speaker 1:And then it will kind of change at tempo or kind of so this is something that is done. You can tell that it's a different thing to what's going to follow for the rest of the Sotram.
Speaker 2:Yes, definitely, and sometimes it even specifies that it says Dhyanam or Dhyana Mantra. But the point was, of course, like you said, the main thing is then to meditate, so when the mantra comes from that space, that is why, even nowadays, if you see in many temples, when the priests are performing the rituals, they may be going on autopilot and I've spoken to right quite a few of them and for them it's like one. Of course there may be so many people, but it's also because people are in a hurry nowadays, you know they're in a rush. They'll say can you do it a little quickly? They don't really come usually with that space where they will take the time they want to sit.
Speaker 2:But then in the scriptures there are many such things where, for example, they say they. They put it like, for example, with the shivalinga, where, which means it is the, the bhava, the feeling of the Archika, the one who performs the ceremony or who chants the mantras, that turns that stone into Shiva. And that can be anything. If you say, okay, anywhere you go. If you come from that space of devotion, if you come from a space of meditation, sincere faith, then the divinity there gets awakened.
Speaker 2:That is when that real you can say worship happens, or that connection happens, or that real meditation happens. Otherwise it's just a stone, you know.
Speaker 1:Yes, so that is the most important I would say beautiful, so one of the key opportunistic times to chant mantras are during eclipses.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 1:So would you like to explain. Why is it so powerful to chant mantras during an eclipse?
Speaker 2:Well, the thing is that, without going too much into detail, the eclipse is a.
Speaker 1:It's good to go if you want to talk about what is an eclipse or what's happening.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so during an eclipse, what happens is like we have the sun, the earth and the moon right, and the sun and the moon are our you can say sources of, of light, of energy.
Speaker 2:Where the moon is very soft and gentle, of course it merely reflects the light of the sun, but it's a very cool, soothing light and the sun is very intense, you know. But then it makes life possible, it sustains life, and these grahashas, as they call it, these heavenly bodies, have a great impact on life on this planet, on our life. When we look at the tides, how the moon is connected to the water, also in our body, on our mind, it's the direct connection between the moon and the mind and the phases of the moon and the mind and the phases of the moon. That's why we see, during new moon or full moon, people, for example, with I mean you know this also with some psychological weaknesses, you can say usually feel it even more. That's why in old days they used to call them lunatics, the word luna is comes from moon, so then the crazy people will get more crazy.
Speaker 2:And the sun, of course. Without the sun, life would not be possible here. But then during eclipse, eclipse, what happens? It's like we can call it a disturbance in nature. Of course it's part of nature, but you see, even the nature gets a little confused Because what happens? Suddenly during the day it gets dark. For the animals also it's confusing. So it's like a small portal opens up where you can peep through, where you get access to a cosmic energy that otherwise is not available to you.
Speaker 2:And during an eclipse what happens is, of course, either the sun is on one side of the earth and the moon is completely on the other side, so then the earth blocks the sun rays that normally would fall on. The moon is completely on the other side, so then the earth blocks the sun rays that normally would fall on the moon and reflect on earth, so then we cannot see the moon because it doesn't have light reflecting on us. And the other way, if the moon comes between the earth and the sun, then this the moon blocks the rays from the sun, so then we cannot see the sun. So that is the solar eclipse, and this happens at least once a year.
Speaker 2:But basically, what happens if you would create a plane between the Earth and the Sun, then you see that the Moon is not in that same plane. It's a little higher or lower, but it orbits and the two places where it intersects, where it comes into that plane, where they're in one plane, that is when the eclipse happens. And this in Jyotish they call the, the Chayagrahas, or the notes that the shadow planets, which are Rahu and Ketu. So these are not physical planets, but they are the point where the eclipse happens. So they are the eclipse. You can say they are the shadow and they bring a lot of spirituality, but it is also because they bring chaos, so they disturb the status quo.
Speaker 2:It's like when in life yeah, in life most of the spirituality comes when we face challenges. That that is the reality. If everything is good is nice, who really thinks about god, or going inward or finding something that is eternal? But when we are shaken then you look for some support outside the world, so the world of worldly pleasures or or your normal daily life. So the thing is that these notes, the grau and ketu, they bring a lot of spirituality and that's why they say the time of the eclipse is a time very good for spiritual practices, so for mantras, for meditation, not for worldly things.
Speaker 2:So they say that time, if you can avoid doing especially important things, like starting any new endeavor you know, whether it's in your work or any relationship thing or any like anything of your sun-sahara life, you can say your worldly life. For that time they say it's better to sit and do your sadhana, your meditation, your mantras. It's not advised to sleep also. But that time you can say the mind is more vulnerable because it gets shaken because of these energies. But because of that you can say imbalance in nature, to put it like that you get access to, like much more spiritual energy. So anything you, any spiritual practice you do, the effect is multiplied manifold. It's what they call a punya kala for, or a very good time, blessed time for any spiritual practices, and then especially the meditation and the mantras, not that not the pujas or the homas.
Speaker 1:They say we don't do offerings to the to the devatas to the energies, but the chanting and the meditation is very nice even more chanting the meditation right, yeah, meditation, I just a safe meditation is like the safe thing, just go in and yeah, and there are many forms of meditation of course, which use a mantra.
Speaker 2:Right, right, right. So mantra meditation is very good.
Speaker 1:Yes, very interesting. So for one and we spoke about this in our previous episode but the topic of one wanting to practice mantra, yeah, because you've gone through, you know, a guru, parampara, like a teacher-student kind of initiation into this, and even in your whole time, like you started, you had to learn, be initiated before you could chant the Gayatri Mantra.
Speaker 1:So, for those who want to learn it, because this is currently, I think, a bit of a misunderstood area of spirituality or of sadhana, because people are giving out mantras- yeah, like it's yeah, right left and center and people are becoming jyotishis after a one and a half year course or even less, even like a two month course, and yeah, giving mantras out and with giving mantras there's a big responsibility. The one who gives mantra especially whatever you give to that student, then whatever they do with it is also your responsibility and your karma.
Speaker 2:It's like with the Vaidya If you tell them to take a medicine or a herb, it will impact them, of course. Right, right right.
Speaker 1:So I'm very curious to hear about how you're giving out mantras or you're teaching mantras, because that's what you're doing now. Like a big part of your work is. You've got a community and is it an app you're making or whatever You've? You've got a whole program where you're teaching mantras and I don't exactly know we.
Speaker 1:I'm excited to hear about more what you teach. But for those who want to because people ask me all the time and even I teach body treatments and one of the most powerful things that I have in my repertoire as a practitioner is the mantra for when I'm treating people and making medicines and everything. But I've been initiated into that so I can say to them you know, go get initiated by my teacher when you're ready. And there is one mantra that I can give and I will just share it. It's oh namah shivaya, which I can share with them. That's kind of the only, mostly one of them because there's some flexibility and things around that.
Speaker 1:My teacher kind of said that. But yes, and, and even people who are getting mantras from and they hear mantras on on spotify they hear mantras, yeah, in kirtan, in music events and I guess they can use it. But how would you, what would you say to someone who desires a mantra to practice during an eclipse, to practice in general for something and maybe to practice also as a health practitioner?
Speaker 2:Well, the thing is that there are some mantras that are called prasiddha mantras, which you can say are multi-purpose, good for everybody, without anything to worry about. These are mantras that are very powerful. So, even without an initiation, even without maybe chanting it in a certain intonation or rhythm, they are so powerful that they will still have good effects.
Speaker 2:They won't have any well, let's call it side effects where you say, like with certain food you can say that it's good for everybody, but then if you have a low BP, you know you need to take care of it.
Speaker 1:Or if you eat it wrong. If you use it wrong, you eat it wrong. You eat it while standing Exactly, yeah.
Speaker 2:Or if you have diabetes, then better to avoid it. So like that, with mantras also, there are many things we can check when it comes to the suitability, compatibility. But then these mantras are, you can say, good for everybody, they will not do any harm, and they are good also for overall, like so many aspects of your life. One of them is om namah shivaya or namah shivaya, the panchakshari five syllable one is namah shivaya and then you can add the om, it becomes six syllables. But this is a mantra that and these are mantras given to us by rishis or sages of a very high level.
Speaker 2:So they didn't create the mantras. They're called mantra drashta in the scriptures. That means they perceived the mantra, they saw it. So they had in their deep meditation. Their intuition would become so clear that they would feel that, okay, these sounds or this mantra has this effect, this impact. And so the different mantras are ascribed to different rishis, the ones who, you can say, taught it to the world. So these are rishis of a very high level. You can say, and these are mantras anybody can use, like Om Namah Shivaya, om Namo Narayanaya, om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya, om Gurave Namah. These are like some of the examples.
Speaker 1:What did you say? The?
Speaker 2:name Prasiddha.
Speaker 1:Prasiddha.
Speaker 3:Yeah, they're called Prasiddha mantras Prasiddha means.
Speaker 2:Prasiddha means that they are good for everything you can say Like Siddha means it's perfect, it gives you perfection, it takes you to the level of perfection, siddha. So this will take you there, but without any other mantras, could be called Kamiya Siddha, which means they will give you perfection of your desires. Therefore, specific purpose, specific result. So these mantras are good for anyone, that if you want to do a mantra on a daily basis, you can safely do it. They are very good. And then, of course, there are mantras If you want to do a mantra on a daily basis, you can safely do it. They are very good. And then, of course, there are mantras that you can say are good for a specific purpose, and they may also be, you can say, accessible to everybody.
Speaker 2:It's just that you won't need them on a daily basis, like if you say, the Mrityunjaya mantra, for example, is also a prasiddha mantra that you could do when you want to increase your health. If you're going through a difficult health situation or something like that. You may not need to do it on a daily basis, you know is that okay for people to chant?
Speaker 1:yes, definitely why, they're prasiddha okay, they're prasiddha, so that that is not a problem okay and they'll give good results.
Speaker 2:They will really help okay no side effects. No side effects only only good things, only good things.
Speaker 1:Even mispronouncing. That's why an always inward right.
Speaker 2:This you can chant out loud, even outside.
Speaker 1:So if you mispronounced it, then no ill effects.
Speaker 2:Of course.
Speaker 1:Because a lot of people don't have the beautiful pronunciation and Sanskrit knowledge that you do, but that's a simple mantra. Of course it may need a little bit of practice, but then, yeah, aim for that, to pronounce it correctly, of course because that was a big reason that Maharishi Mahesh Yogi used to teach to always chant inward, because If there was some mistake, it can create some effects.
Speaker 2:The thing is, it's great to chant the mantras mentally, but then usually we say that for some time do it out loud, because then what happens? It gets set in the proper manner. So the tune, the intonation, then if you start doing it mentally, even mentally, it will be in the proper what they call the chandas. It's the rhythm which is essential. It's one of the essential parts of the mantra. So if you do it mentally and you would make a mistake, then it's not that the mistake is not there, it's just that people won't hear it. But doing the mantra mentally is actually considered even a little more powerful, because your whole mind has to be there. You can chant out loud and think of your groceries and so many things, but if you do it mentally you need even more focus. So it's good to do the mantras like by yourself, not that you stand on the balcony and shout it to the whole neighborhood, of course, but you can chant it softly.
Speaker 2:It doesn't have to be very loud, but maybe do it for some time and if people feel comfortable then they can continue mentally.
Speaker 1:Just as Purnesh has been initiated into mantra with such contained authenticity. Initiated into mantra with such contained authenticity, you yeah, you have the opportunity to be initiated into a form of Ayurveda, an expression of Ayurveda called Marma therapy. And Marma are the storehouses of concentrated prana. They are these vital points on the body where acupuncture points come from. And you have the opportunity to be initiated into Marma practice with my teachers, the Raju Vedyas, Dr Harsha Raju and his family, in May 2026 in Australia, the East Coast of Australia.
Speaker 1:We're doing a very special retreat. This is not a course where you sign up to and you get a certain curriculum of Marma therapy. It's really an initiation into the practice, into the lineage of sukshma marma, subtle marma therapy, the storehouses of concentrated prana, mainly to do on yourself, so working to enhance your own prana within your hands. To what capacity can you heal yourself? And then that is the foundation to healing others, if that's something you want to do, if you are a practitioner or student. This is a more refined, advanced, eight-day retreat in Byron in May 31st 2026. And we fill up, we sell out and we fill up fast and we've just released it. So if you would like to learn more about that you can check out vitalvedacomau forward slash courses or check the link in the show notes.
Speaker 2:I also don't want people to worry. The last thing you want is people to become frightened or to get stressed. You know, even with the mantras, the thing is that of course there are so many. You can say do's and don'ts. We spoke about mantras that are good for anybody. Anybody can chant many. You can say do's and don'ts. We spoke about mantras that are good for anybody.
Speaker 2:Anybody can chant, but I don't want people to worry that you know if it's so much of devotion you've been chanting a mantra or singing it that, oh, you know what, if I'm doing it wrong, either that it is whatever sinful, or I get harmed, or nothing like that, in the sense that, of course, yes, it's good to to understand about some of these things. A lot of it really becomes important when you go deeper into it.
Speaker 2:It's like when it comes to the sadhana, like when you progress in your mantra sadhana, there are ways to really make a part mantra a part of you. It really becomes a part of your consciousness. You can say so. Then you want to look at so many things to make sure it's really compatible. But even my teacher has taught me, after teaching us, so many things about looking at all of the, the, the do's and don'ts, the doshas, the. You know the, the effects mantras can have. He also said that in the end, if the faith in the mantra is so strong, if someone has so much of devotion and faith and love, then that mantra will give the result because, in the end, the divine or the universe, how you want to call it, like that is, they know you know.
Speaker 2:So he will come and manifest in the same way if someone would worship a tree or a stone or a leaf or anything for that matter. If you can really see and feel divinity there, divinity will manifest it will come to you in that form.
Speaker 2:So I want to make sure that people also know that, that you know, don't worry, don't make the stress, but it's good to, yeah, to to understand a little, especially if you're interested in it. And actually the thing is that I was teaching in this mantra program. I was telling them about the story of the samudra mantra when the ocean, the milky Ocean, was churned, which of course, is when Dhanvantari appeared. So you are familiar with the story.
Speaker 1:I would like to take a moment to tell you the story of the Samudra Mantana. The story comes from the Puranas, the ancient mytho-cosmological texts of India. It is told most fully in the Bhagavata Purana, the Vishnu Purana and the Mahabharata. The story is called the Samudra Mantana, the churning of the ocean of milk. Once both the Devas, the shining celestial beings, the forces of light, and the Asuras, the darker counterparts, the obstructing forces, lost their strength, they longed for Amrita, the nectar of immortality. So they made a pact the ocean of milk, that vast cosmic ocean of unmanifest potential to bring forth hidden treasures, and above all Amrita, the nectar of immortality, for their churning rod. They chose Mandara Parvata, mount Mandara. Now the name Mandara in Sanskrit carries meaning manda means gentle, pleasant or slow, and ara means mountain. So the mandara is the mountain that brings delight or the mountain that uplifts. This symbolism in the myth is symbolizing the might, the great axis of awareness, steady enough to churn the depths of consciousness. But this is not just a cosmic symbol. There is a real mountain in India that tradition links to the story and it's called Mandana Hill. It's in the state of Bihar in eastern India. Even today you can visit it. The hill is covered with ancient temples and stone carvings depicting scenes of the Samudra Mandana. Pilgrims still climb it, honoring it as a place where the Devas and the Asuras once churned the ocean to bring forth treasures, and especially Amrita. As the rope they wrapped Vasuki, naga, the great serpent king, around the mountain. But when the churning began, the mountain started sinking into the ocean. At this point, vishnu incarnated as Kurma. The mountain started sinking into the ocean. At this point, vishnu incarnated as Kurma the tortoise, and held the weight upon its back, on the shell of the tortoise, patient, steady, enduring, like Shani Saturn, carrying great burden until the work is done. And so the devas and the asuras pulled alternately on Vasuki the serpent twisted, the mountains spun and the ocean of milk foamed.
Speaker 1:From the depths rose both treasures and terrors. The first was Halahala, a deadly poison so virulent it threatened to destroy the cosmos. Only Shiva could contain it. Out of compassion, he swallowed the poison and held it in his throat, which turned blue, earning him the name Nilekanta, the blue-throated one. Then came treasures Lakshmi Devi, goddess of fortune and abundance, the wish-fulfilling cow, kamadhenu, the divine horse, the moon, jewels, medicines and finally Danvandari, the celestial physician, the perfect health, expression of consciousness. This god arose out of the milky ocean bearing the pot of Amrita, the nectar of immortality.
Speaker 1:So this myth is more than history. It's a map of consciousness. The Kshira Sagara, the ocean of milk, is the unified field, the unmanifest ground of being where all possibilities lie latent. The Devas and the Asuras are the luminous and shadow aspects within us. Both must work together in transformation.
Speaker 1:Mandara mountain is the mind, the central axis of awareness. Vasuki, the serpent, is kundalini. Shakti, the coiled energy of consciousness that moves up the spine. Kurma, the toitus, is the stable support beneath or Vishnu's sustaining presence, the patience of Saturn, the poison. Hala hala represents the painful karmas and toxic residues that arise when we stir the depths. And Shiva's act of containing it is the supreme yogic act to hold the fire of poison within, not by suppression but by vast capacity. It is the power to sustain cosmic turbulence without collapse, to absorb and transmute what would otherwise destroy and to transform poison into protection.
Speaker 1:The treasures, lakshmi, jewels, medicines, the nectar, are the gifts of transformation. And Amrita, the nectar of vomitality, is unveiling of Amritatva, that timeless, indestructible current of being which flows beneath birth and death. The Samudra Mantana shows us that evolution is not about banishing the shadow. The devas need the asuras. Both light and dark must pull together to churn the unmanifest and bring forth nectar Within us. It's the same the poison must be faced, contained, integrated, and only then do treasures arise. That is why the Puranas tell us these stories, not as fantasies, but as mirrors of our inner work. That is the Samudra Mantana, a tale from the Puranas, a tale of gods and demons and at the same time a tale of us. And now back to the episode.
Speaker 2:But what many don't know is that the Devas, the gods and the demons, the Asuras, when they were churning there were 54 on each side, so that makes 108. And then they were churning, you know, with the snake Vasuki, the Miru, the cosmic mountain, and it was supported by Vishnu in the form of a tortoise, the Kurma. Now the thing is, I was telling them that when you do your sadhana, your mantras, it's good to have a proper seat, and then in our mantra tradition, so they teach us how to make a kurma asana, how to invoke that energy of Vishnu as the tortoise for you to sit on, because that gave the stability during the journey and you need this. So your mind needs to be stable when you do your mantras or when you meditate. So there are some mantras to do that.
Speaker 1:but then the interesting thing I was telling you, there are mantras to enhance that kurma energy, of, of stability. To invoke that in the seat where you're sitting, because kuruma is kind of often missed.
Speaker 2:He's just like yeah, he's a side thing, he's not so interesting.
Speaker 1:It's very, but it's very shunny saturn. It's like in the background. I'm not gonna be the face of things but I'm gonna support the whole exactly this whole big cosmic event of bringing up everything from the unmanifest to manifest.
Speaker 2:Exactly. But what many don't realize is that one of the deeper meanings of this story is that of your mantra, sadhana, because what happens is the ocean. The ocean is the consciousness, is the mind. So, and then to churn it, you have those 108 who are churning, and the miru is also the spine. So when your spine is straight, you have a proper foundation, which is your asana, and then which of course Patanjali also said in the Yoga Sutras, your asana should be steady, proper, but then the churning, they say, is with the miru, and when you have the rosary, the japa mala that we use with the 108 beads. So these are those 108 beads, and then there is one extra, which they call the meru, and when you are doing the japa, if you do more than one round, they say you should not cross it. You turn the japa mala around and then you basically it's like you reverse, you go back, so you go back and forth back and forth.
Speaker 3:This is the turning, yeah, right, and then and people have seen this when you meditate or when you chant your mantas.
Speaker 2:You do it sincerely. Sometimes emotions may come up, all kinds of random thoughts may come up. So it's like you're, you're getting rid of all these impressions, you may get beautiful experiences. So this is that churning, and then all the treasures came out, the poison came out. So it's very beautiful to see the significance of these stories and, of course, directly connected to Ayurveda, also because Dhanvantari came from that ocean, health, healing and consciousness came.
Speaker 1:So will you share with us about your program of sharing mantras that you're sharing?
Speaker 2:so one thing is that, yes, I recently started teaching some of these things because people are interested in it, so we thought, okay, we'll do it in an online format. So there, of course, you have to see what, what, how to structure, because it's a lot, like you said, that the knowledge is so vast. I'm also still learning.
Speaker 2:I'm discovering new things every day, but to make it digestible at the same time, to give people a good foundation if they're interested to explore this beautiful world of mantras more. So we have a level one program already which is completed. Now it is available so people can view the sessions. It's nicely recorded, it has the slides with the information, everything, and then every once in a while we do a live Q&A session online where.
Speaker 2:I can answer the questions. We can go into the topics a little more and there is an online forum also. They can put their questions and things like that. And in that first part we have covered, okay, what are mantras? The foundation, different types of mantras, the difference between, say, bija mantras or the vedic mantras, the mantras from the classical sanskrit texts like the puranas, and all of that. What are prasiddha mantras?
Speaker 2:what, what are not, and then also the, the akshara, so the, the sanskrit the devanagari that if they want, they can also learn how to read it in the original script, but also there is a systematic way to transcribe it, but then to know, okay, how to pronounce it correctly, so that people can chant the mantras.
Speaker 3:What are some?
Speaker 2:of the common Mistakes that happen in in pronunciation. We see around a lot and also to learn more about, okay, a personal practice. They get a prasiddha mantra for guru, that guru energy, which they can practice on their own, and many more things. And then, like that, soon, in a few months, I will start with a level two program where then we go deeper into different aspects of the mantras. The mantras also have limbs, they call the angas, we go more into that, the kurma, how to create that kind of asana then there is some more sadhanas that are added and like that for those who are interested.
Speaker 2:We go together on a journey to explore the deva nagari. You know the, the sanskrit alphabet is called deva nagari so that means nagari means the city and deva means that cosmic energies right so the the, the city where all these cosmic energies dwell is the Devanagari. So we go and explore that city together and, yeah, it's a wonderful journey, and so how do people find out about that? So that is on my website, we can put a link in the description.
Speaker 1:What is the?
Speaker 2:website. It's Purneshco, so P-U-R-N-E-S-hco. Okay, yeah easy and um yeah okay, wonderful they can find more there and we'll.
Speaker 1:We're giving a discount to people if they want to join or sign up, we can do.
Speaker 2:For those who are interested, we can give a special vital veda discount so that's just discount code vital veda exactly.
Speaker 1:Enter it. Yes, they'll get a 20% discount.
Speaker 2:Beautiful and yeah.
Speaker 2:And then also because we see in the world today. You know that I'm sure people also notice that even though life is getting more hectic, we have more social media ways to connect with people, at the same time people feel more lonely. You know they're struggling. There is a lot of impressions to digest, so that way also, you know, like mantras is one thing but, like you said, meditation is important and this Vedic knowledge is so valuable to learn how to just yeah, come back to your nature yourself. So also in the last one year with my partner, we have started a beautiful initiative called Just Be. Also we started in the Netherlands Soon it will be available globally also where it's a community where we come together with people.
Speaker 2:It's live, so it's not pre-recorded, but online. We meditate together, we discuss some of the knowledge. So, this is also. We've seen such a beautiful response.
Speaker 1:That's great. So that's live only, yes, live only. So that's a more present community connection.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and we've seen that the meditations are so powerful when you do it in a group. People have such beautiful experience.
Speaker 1:So if people want to join that, yeah, it's free.
Speaker 2:It's a free initiative, so just be Just beorg.
Speaker 1:Easy, yes, cool, and by the time this comes out, maybe you'll be in English.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, we'll make sure something is there, yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, for now it's just in Dutch. All right, Jai Gurudev, Jai Gurudev. Wishing people all the very best, Thank you. If Purnesh's Mantra Mastery Program resonates with you, I encourage you to leap into action. It's a five-week journey where you'll not only learn correct mantra pronunciation and the Devanagari script, but you'll also receive initiation. You'll explore varieties of mantras and build a powerful daily practice. Everything's recorded so you can go at your own pace, and there's live Q&As with Purnesh to support you. It's such a grounded way to deepen your connection with sound mantra, vibration and consciousness, guided by someone who lives and breathes. This tradition has been doing so for over 20 years. If you want to enroll, go to puraneshco slash mantra dash mastery and use the discount code vitalveda one word at checkout for a 20% discount.
Speaker 1:And if you enjoyed this episode on mantra, check out related episodes on the Vital Veda podcast. We recorded one with Purnesh and that's podcast episode 102 called Japa Mantra Sound Energy, Rites of Passage and Expert Guidance. That's episode 102. And there's another episode, episode 66, called Sanskrit and Vedic Chanting Vibratory Sounds of Cosmic Intelligence, with Kamala and Janavi from the Samadhi Collective, and episode 66 is actually our most listened to episode on the Vital Veda podcast, and make sure you subscribe, because we have an epic podcast coming up on the Vedic worldview on eclipses that astrological event of an eclipse, where we've interviewed a few people. One of them is Purnesh, who talks about the eclipses and he gives specific mantras for you to chant during an eclipse. Chanting mantras during an eclipse is one of the best things you can do during an eclipse. And we've got Dr Harsha Raju, a Vedic astrologer and Ayurvedic doctor. We have Laura Plum, all giving their view on eclipses and that's coming soon. So make sure you subscribe to the Vital Veda podcast.