Healthcare Facilities Network
The Healthcare Facilities Network podcast highlights the essential role of facilities
management in delivering high-quality patient care. Hosted by Peter Martin, this show brings you expert insights on the issues, trends, and solutions shaping the future of healthcare spaces. Learn from industry leaders and discover ways to drive positive change in your facility.
Healthcare Facilities Network
Balancing Safety and Stress: A Conversation with Ruben Garcia
Live from the ASHE Innovation Conference in Columbus, OH, the Healthcare Facilities Network sits down with Ruben Garcia — known to many as the Life Safety Guy and Market Director for Facility Management at CommonSpirit Health in Houston.
Ruben shares how his multifaceted background has shaped his approach to facilities management and why conversations around mental health and stress can’t be ignored in today’s healthcare environment. From staffing shortages and aging infrastructure to tighter budgets and nonstop operational demands, the pressures on facilities teams are growing, and so is the impact on their wellbeing.
In this episode, Ruben offers a candid perspective on how he manages stress personally and within his department, and why supporting mental health is becoming a critical priority for the future of healthcare facilities management.
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I went through a little mental health bout and so I felt you know what I need, this needs to be talked about more. You know, same buddy, jesse I was like, hey, are you good with us doing like a panel and seeing this submit an abstract? Could they accept it? We'll do it. We've got a couple other panel members and it was just one of those things. I just felt the need to just push the envelope and say, look, the younger generation is more apt to talking about it more openly. The older generation is. You know, we grew up on the. You just tough it out and keep it moving right and so having that, you know, that dynamic of it and trying to just bring that normalcy to it right, and it's just more about self-awareness and realizing that we live in our thoughts.
Speaker 2:There's a major crisis facing healthcare facilities management. We have aging employees, aging buildings and aging infrastructure. We've created the Healthcare Facilities Network, a content network designed specifically to help solve, for these three pressing issues in healthcare facilities management. We bring on thought leaders and experts from across healthcare facilities management, all the way from the C-suite to the technician level, because, at the end of the day, we're all invested in solving the aging issue. Thanks for tuning in. Look at our videos. You will find that, as a theme across our content, this is the Healthcare Facilities Network.
Speaker 2:I'm your host, peter Martin, happy to be joined by my guest, mr Ruben Garcia. Ruben, welcome, thank you. So I knew of Ruben before I met Ruben because Ruben, as you may know, has a great presence on LinkedIn, very creative videos, some of which we will talk about during this conversation. It's going to be a wide range of one. I also want to talk to Ruben about stress. Ruben did a great presentation at TAFN, the Texas Association of Healthcare Facilities Managers, back in. Well, you've done it twice right, right, yeah, on stress and it was really good, it was really powerful, it was really well attended and following that presentation I think that was what April or March, yeah, I asked if he'd appear and he willingly did so. My thanks to Ruben. One bookkeeping item. We are here at the ashy innovation conference. It's still hard to call it the innovation.
Speaker 1:I know right, it doesn't roll off that well. Yeah, you're right it does not.
Speaker 2:Um, so we're in Columbus, it's day one, it's the afternoon. We had a recording this morning interviewing now, and I thank Ruben for his time, uh, appearing on the network. So first, ruben, before we dive into the questions who are you? What do you do? What's your role?
Speaker 1:My name is Ruben Garcia. You know the life safety guy. I work for Common Spirit Health as the market director of facilities management, overseeing several hospitals in the Houston market down in Texas, and so that's my primary job, right, and I also, as a part-timer, am a life safety surveyor for AAAAC, so I conduct surveys, accreditation surveys, on behalf of AAAAC, and AAAAC only does surgery centers. That's a little bit of a unique difference. And then a business partner and I also have a couple of products that were released through regulatory concepts, and it's a couple couple devices that we use for the regulatory industry.
Speaker 2:So you may have seen Ruben's videos, the life safety guy.
Speaker 1:If you're calling yourself the life safety guy, you better be left yeah, yeah right, I know there's a lot of pressure I put on myself. If I'm gonna call myself the life safety guy, you know I better be doing some great things within life safety when did you start calling yourself the life safety guy?
Speaker 1:It's probably been a good six years, maybe now, maybe a little longer than that, I don't have a timestamp on that. Yeah, but it was just something that I was like you know that came about to it. It came about.
Speaker 1:I saw someone that named themselves the fire alarm guy and you know we said, hey, the HVAC guy or this guy when just refer to him as such, right, I was like you know what the life safety guy has a good ring to it and you know, I'm passionate about life safety and it's like let me delve into that and just, you know, uh, brand myself as a life safety guy and you know, now I gotta live up to it. Right now I gotta post content and keep consistent and, and what I do with that, with the linkedin, is obviously I create my own content, but I also am a repository for all things life safety. So if there was any great thing out there, any content that's life safety related, I'm probably going to repost it if I come across it right, and so that's what I'm trying to be as a repository for life safety, for life safety education, life safety networking and just really, like I said, all things life safety.
Speaker 2:So you've got like a very interesting career progression between your entrepreneurship, the development of products, working with hospitals, none of which are easy to do no, no, yeah, like right so, but tell me, on the entrepreneurial side, on the development of project side, what? What are the products that you have? I know you're here at ashy and you have, I think, two of your products, but what have you developed it, and why? Why did you develop them?
Speaker 1:so I developed them initially, uh, out of just necessity, so as being a surveyor and doing he'll see round environment of care, rounding, you know, with the one product of the gap checker. If there's anything that I say is that the main factor of these devices is the ergon, so you don't have to bend down with using these tools. Traditionally, if you're going to check, like, for example, undercut I know the audience can't see it, but if that was a fire door there you have to check the undercut every year. And so with the gap checker I got tired of bending down and I was like I got to bend down.
Speaker 1:And then also what happens is some folks tend to pencil whip, not doing that because they don't want to bend out. And so that came out of necessity and really that was it. And then the airflow checker, the second device, basically the same thing. I mean you have the old proverbial tissue test, right, that's not calibrated, and so it was just out of necessity. It was like I got to create something that's easier, effortless, I can just wind it down, check the undercut of it, see if the airflow is positive or negative and just really keep it moving.
Speaker 2:I think you find, like in this profession, sometimes you have the engineering line and it's really hard for some to cross over to kind of like the soft skill stuff that you need, yes, the creative stuff I got you, yeah, yeah. But, you kind of move between all of those different worlds? Yes, have you always been that way.
Speaker 1:A little bit. I would say yeah, I mean, I think as I'm getting older you evolve and kind of those soft skills come a little bit better right with experience and time. But yeah, no, that's an interesting question. It's just sort of, yeah, I've always kind of been all over the place.
Speaker 2:Yes, basically yes, when you were developing those products. You know you're saying it's kind of out of necessity, for what you were finding was an irritation, right? How long did that process? How long does that process take?
Speaker 1:you know from from the time, so the original I actually had a makeshift model that I never even considered to bring it to the market. So I had a. It was made out of wood and I just used it and then it was just really, uh, I don't know, it was maybe like three years ago where I just kind of had this epiphany and I was like you know what, I think this tool would be very useful. It's more about the helping folks out right and having that useless, uh useful factor. And from the beginning, you know, a business partner and I, uh, jesse blores, we uh, you know, we we created a little llc and we said, all right, let's, let's put this first device out and see what happens right, and see if we can help the industry. And so from beginning, from conceptualizing the idea to bringing it to market, it probably took us um, this is actually interesting it probably took us like three months really yeah and part and part of that was because the product is simple to make.
Speaker 1:It's not like, uh, you know, there's not a lot of, there's some machining, there's some manufacturing involved. I mean, there is that, but it was somehow. It just it kind of just happened for us already having a prototype that I had for several years. All we did was, uh, refine it, make it better and we put it out there interesting, and how is the reception to it then? Oh, it's been great.
Speaker 1:You know, we started with the gap checker, which is a fire door gap gauge, and then, uh, about nine months later, we released the airflow checker. The airflow checker is more popular because it's a more broader audience, more broader use. Uh, with nursing infection control facility managers, everyone wants to know if their room's positive or negative, right, yeah, and that has a deeper impact because the reality is, in hospitals, folks are getting hais right, hospital acquired infections. That's happening daily and then across the hospitals, and so ensuring that your airflow and pressure requirements are in check helps that right, helps eliminate that being a potential cause. And so, uh, yeah, it's, it's just been, you know, word of mouth coming to places like this at the Ashley Innovation Conference and networking with folks and showing the product and it's been great.
Speaker 2:Now you've kind of crossed over into the FM world, right. You've heavily on life safety, life safety guy Now your career. You're still doing that, but you're over a little more FM. How do you like that transition? How is that BAM?
Speaker 1:Actually that's where I started in the FM world and then that's where I got introduced to the whole gamut of life safety. So I was doing life safety before that fire alarm. When I got to healthcare that's when you go to you're like, hey, we have joint commission I'm like, okay, what's this? And then you start learning that they look at all the standards and everything within NFPA 101. I've been blessed.
Speaker 1:I got my start at Texas Children's Hospital and they had a, if folks remember, the BNP program, building maintenance program, which you would think is just a general maintenance program, but it was specific to fire safety and life safety and that was something that the joint commission once upon a time uh had as part of a process. And then if you had that bmp program, they would actually even remove findings. And then they stopped that some years back because I think cms deemed it to be kind of a conflict of interest. But from that bmp program, what texas chargers did? They didn't.
Speaker 1:A lot of folks dismantled that program because there was no incentive. But Texas Children's didn't do that and they actually expanded it and it was because of that I was fortunate to be in that program and it's the largest pediatric hospital in the nation. So they have a robust you know, world-class life safety program. I got plugged into it coming in as a firearm guy and then I was able to sharpen my and broaden my life safety skills with that. So I'm very thankful to have that opportunity, because it really is what catapulted me into the to being the life safety guy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, what did you want to do when you?
Speaker 1:were a kid. You know, when I was a kid I did, you know, when, you know it's normal like I want to be an astronaut or be something like this, mine was actually an architect, really. Yeah, interesting, it did pan out that way. You, and like a lot of us, when we get into the FM world it's sort of by accident or sort of not purposeful right. But yeah, that was something. When I was younger I was like you know what I'd like? To be an architect.
Speaker 2:Wow, yeah, that might be the first architect I've ever heard.
Speaker 1:Yeah, someone say that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, really hear that a lot. Um, so what I have to ask you know what's your thought on architects now?
Speaker 1:oh, don't get me started on that now. Now, no, uh, you know, um, they're great, you know we need to. We need someone's got to design it, right, yeah, yeah, so, uh, you know, I, I think, with where things are going now with ai, it's interesting to see how that potentially could play into the future of architecture and engineering, for that matter. Right, yeah, so, uh, yeah, no, I mean they're, they're necessary yeah, wait.
Speaker 2:So the last question about when did you decide I don't want to go the architect route?
Speaker 1:well, it probably fizzled out when I was a lot younger. I just remember having, like you know, when you go to school and say what do you want to be a tech?
Speaker 2:yeah, yeah, as I got older, you know, just didn't interest me as much yeah, funny though you, you work with architects all the time, so you're an architect adjacent. I think that, yeah, um, let's actually talk about that for a second. Not the um, not the architects, but um, relative with the Joint Commission life safety. So what are your thoughts on the changes? So by the time this comes out, it'll probably be two months or so. That'll be closer to that, yeah, yeah, closer to two months. The Joint Commission reduction of standards. So can you give a little bit of background? And what, if anything, do you think will be the impact on hospitals?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so obviously I don't work for them officially, right, anything do you think will be the impact on hospitals? Yeah, so, you know, obviously I'm not, I don't work for them officially, right, but my, my opinion is they've reduced their standards and, uh, I think it's going to be, I think the survey process is going to be a little more stringent, actually, do you? And? And the reason why? I think that is because by reducing the standards, it's more ambiguous, right, and so because of that, you know it's like before it was more prescribed, it was more tailored. You knew what, what the documentation, uh, was gonna, you know, be about, because they gave you the actual checklist and by taking that checklist away, it opens up for for other NFPA requirements, for example. And so I'll give you one example, like, if you're familiar with the, the EP system, the ECO 20305, which talks about the fire safety ITM requirements. One of them, for example, is a monthly checks of gauges. That's not an EP. Another one would be semi-annual fire alarm battery testing.
Speaker 1:So what I'm saying there is Joint Commission wouldn't ask you for those requirements, although they're required by CMS and NPA. They wouldn't require it, they wouldn't ask for it because it's not on the checklist, if you will. Now, with removing the checklist and being more broader, all things NAPA that are required are subjected to be asked about and asked for, and this is very similar to the way DNV surveys. So I have the luxury of having hospitals that some hospitals that oversee their joint commission accredited and some that are dv accredited. One of the stark differences is dv comes out every year as opposed to every three years, and they have some other, you know iso 9001 method, but when they they don't have a checklist for documentation and they will specifically ask you for all the little nuances that are not on the joint commission's checklist. And so I think what basically what's happening is I think joint commission is going to be more in alignment with how dnd does their survey process.
Speaker 1:At least that's my opinion. Uh, we'll see how it all turns out. I think this goes into effect sometime in january of 2026. So you know it's a big buzz going around a lot right now about it, because people either think that it's going to be more stringent or people think it's going to be more relaxed. So you just don't know, right? Yeah, all in all, I mean you still have to follow cms and and the cop. So life safety is life safety right. So I think it's just going to be a little. It's going to be. I think some people are going to be in for a rude awakening in the beginning that's interesting.
Speaker 2:Yeah see, you know much more than me. I thought they were doing kind of you were talking about to make it, some people say a little bit easier. That's kind of where my mind went.
Speaker 1:That's really an interesting, though an interesting thought on your part yeah, I think I think by making it broader and less standards now, it's like everything's a catch-all now. Yeah, so so you know you can cite it, because you're going to have more of a general citation that instead of like specific standards, do you think?
Speaker 2:since it's every three years with the joint commission does, does that make it even more difficult, since it's not prescribed and it's once every?
Speaker 1:three years, or I believe so, and I'm gonna have to go back to the difference between b and b and joint commission.
Speaker 1:But in the beginning I would say, man, I don't want to get surveyed every year, you know who wants to do. But what it does is it keeps you on your toes, it keeps you sharp, and the beneficiaries of that is the patient, staff and visitors. Right, because if you're keeping your compliance up to par all the time, which we all should be, regardless, right? I'm not saying there's a great hospital system to do that, but the reality is, when you're Joint Commissioner accredited, you sort of have this tendency to take two years off, right, so to speak. And then you start ramping up on that third year because you know you're in the window now, right, and when you're in that window, you ramp up. But you should be ramping up every year, right, and so that's one of the big differences there. And so to your point, I think, by them coming out, yeah, every three years on that two-year mark, who knows how it's going to be for them, right?
Speaker 2:There. Who knows how it's going to be for them? Right, there might be some angst around how the survey is going to come out. So you're not a therapist, right? No, and I am not a therapist. I'm not a therapist either. So we were just saying that right up front. But your presentation about stress was really great and it was really well received, right? I mean, you guys got really high marks for that at Tafem. So I say that right away, that at Tafem. So I say that right away. Ruben's not a therapist, nor am I. But what tell me? Why did you decide, or why did you think it was valuable to go up on stage at a conference? You guys were great. I mean, you were very honest. You threw everything out there. But what was it that made you decide? You know what we need to do a topic about stress at a healthcare conference.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know. So the topic was about normalizing, you know, mental health in the workplace, right, and you know it was one of those things, it was one of those epiphanies you know where I had it and and I went through a little mental health bout and so I felt, you know what I need, this needs to be talked about more. You know, when you go through your whole life and you never felt that, and then you feel that and you, you you're aware of it and that's the the beauty of it, to be aware of it so you can get out of that, that funk, right, if you will. And so, uh, going through my little bout, you know it made me feel like you know what this needs to be talked about in the workplace more. And so, uh, you know, uh, same buddy jesse, I was like, hey, are you good with us doing it like a panel and seeing this submit an abstract? Could they accept it? We'll do it. If not, oh, okay, you know it's okay. So we did that.
Speaker 1:And, uh, we got a couple other panel members and you know the reality is you say we're not, we're not therapists, right, but the one thing we all have in common is we're human and and that's where I felt because even I felt a lot of angst of even doing that, because, to your point, I'm like, I'm not a professional, this isn't life safety, this is mental health. I'm the life safety guy yeah, I'm not the mental health guy, but you know, it was just one of those things. I just felt the need to just push the envelope and say, look, the reality is, mental health is no longer taboo to talk about with the advent of social media and the Internet. You know the younger generation is more apt to talking about it more openly. The older generation is, you know, we grew up on the you just tough it out and keep it moving right and so having that, you know that, that dynamic of it and trying to just bring that, that normalcy to it right, and it's just more about self-awareness and and realizing that we live in our thoughts. You know we're mostly listening if we're not talking right, and so what does that mean? We're in our thoughts and our thoughts are moving around, and so it's just about acknowledging that.
Speaker 1:And when we say mental health, it has that negative connotation, right, it really does. And I don't mean it in the context of behavioral health. That's a whole other segment, although that does fall under the umbrella, but we're talking about everyday brain health. If I could change the word mental health to brain health, I think that would be better, because that's what we're talking about. We know that we moods trigger us, foods, trigger us sunlight, all these things.
Speaker 1:Once you become aware of that, then you become a better person, right, and so that's what the whole conversation about it's about normalize it, obviously, and, as an fm, there's, there's high stress, you know, and uh, it's. It's about how learn, how to cope with that learn and being okay when it's not okay. That's okay too, right, it's not Not everything's going to be hunky-dory all the time, right, and it's like you got to know that and you know you're going to weather the storms, and I would say, too, having a good group, having a good course, environment, the environment's everything on it, you know. And so, yeah, that's where it came from. It came from the heart, it just came from.
Speaker 1:This is something we need to do and, to your point, it was very well received the first go around and they sort of asked us to come back and sort of do a follow up sequel. And it's not a lecture, as you know, it's just more of a. It's almost like a podcast, right? Yeah, we're sitting up there, four people up there, yeah, and we're all given mental health is and how we combat it and what we do to, you know, be better yeah, see, I've never suffered from mental illness.
Speaker 2:My brother did. My brother actually ended up committing suicide back in 2000 and you know, thank you, and you know I would sit with him. And if you've never seen anybody you know go through it, it's horrific. But I remember he would describe it to me as he's like pete, I'm he. He described it as like being at the bottom of a pit and I'm looking up and I can't see anything. It's just all blackness. And it was, you know. It's so like I'm using the word frustrated. It's like your mind turning on, yes, and you can't. Like, no matter what he tried to do, he just couldn't get past it. It was horrific to watch man, yeah it. And so like when you bring that message, like when you first thought, okay, I want to create this. And then when you went to folks and say, hey, I want to do this, what was that reception like? Was it difficult to get traction? Did people? What did people say?
Speaker 1:yeah, no, it wasn't. It wasn't easy, you know, uh, for for all of us there, because none of us are therapists, right? Yeah, uh, except for one, one guy that's on there, and actually we reached out to a therapist to get guidance and that was tj. Okay, and so uh for him. I'm sure it was easy. For for other three, you know, for me, jesse and jackie were on that panel.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't think it was that easy, but I think we all just took a leap of faith and we knew that it needs to be talked about. And it was challenging at first and we, you know, we met almost weekly leading up to the conference to just in that process. What was so cool about that is we started kind of being vulnerable with each other and kind of creating, you know, a core, good conversation, and that helped lead us into the actual, you know, presentation. But we sort of kind of created a bond, if you will, within that, and so, you know, it was challenging at first but, you know, once you get through it, you feel better, right, I mean, with mental health, you know, one of the things that it's like are related to FM, like HVAC, you got to ventilate, right, and so your thoughts are in your head.
Speaker 1:You got to let them out. You got to let that negative energy out. You got to vent it out. And so you vent. We vent to our spouses, our friends, whoever. Even if you don't solve the problem, you feel better after you vent, right. And so, because you're letting that out, yeah and so, yeah, it was, you know, a little challenging in the beginning and uh, and we're excited because we're, you know, because we're starting to do that same presentation at various other state chapters. Great, we've got. I think in September we're doing a North Atlanta noise chapter, we're doing Oklahoma's chapter. In September we're having conversations with other chapters that are interested to get this conversation going at their respective state chapters.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. So if somebody from a chapter perspective is listening to this, should they reach out to reach?
Speaker 1:out For sure, yeah, and we're advocates of normalizing mental health. That's what we're trying to do here, and so we'd love to come out and spread the message.
Speaker 2:Now you know that there's various generations in the workforce right now. I'm sure you have the different generations, right, how do the and I'm just picking some Gen X, but how do the boomers, or those that are left, or the older folks, respond to that? Because, again, truly you know I'm 58, so I'm kind of above, like you grew up. You just kind of go with things. So I'm kind of above it, like you grew up, you just kind of go with things. How do they respond to that message, especially in, like healthcare, in a hospital where you got to fix your boilers? You know what I mean. It's not part, it's not how it was growing up. How do they respond? I'm picking yeah, yeah, so the boomers are more resistant as you would, imagine.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they are. I mean, some of them are coming around to the thought of it and, and I get it right, that's how you were trained and ingrained. I get it, I understand it. I may not agree with it, but I understand it right. Yep, but yeah it's. It's a little more resistant with the boomers, but I mean, I think they're starting to see and understand. The other thing about mental health is we do. We are in a time right now where, uh, it's a victimization kind of role, right, and some people could use it as a crutch. There is that I think the boomers might say, oh, it's no mental health, tough it out, man. You just do it right. And to a point they could be right because we are in that world where people may use it. But how do you discern that you can't right? So you have to treat it all as per face value. You can't just assume that someone's just leaning into the crutch of mental health as a way to cop out of something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's the scary part of it, right? Because you never know, like, if somebody tells you that you have to take them at their word, unless and until if you find something that proves it, right, right, and you don't want to gamble with somebody like that. You don't want to gamble Because the loss is a big loss.
Speaker 1:Yes, exactly, it's life loss.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly, it's life loss. Yeah, man, yes, yeah, that's really interesting. What do you think as you look at the industry today? What are some of the things you see that are causing stress, that you hear are causing stress? What are the stressors out there?
Speaker 1:Right now in the FM world, specifically, I would say, staffing. Staffing, as you know, you know about that recruitment and whatnot. You know the boomers are aging out, right, that's happening. There's, there's there's not a lot of folks to succeed that. And just in general, you know, things are tightening up and staff reductions are happening here and there and about across the nation, from what I hear. Yeah, and it's tough because they're asking you to do more with less, right, how do you do that in today's world? And you know the fm world's very demanding, and so you gotta have that technical skill competency as well, right. And so I think that's one of the biggest challenges right now is is a labor shortage now good, a good quality labor shortage? You know a lot of labor force, right, so that's what I see right now. That's one of the things in the fm industry that's.
Speaker 2:This causes some havoc and you guys in Texas I'm sure face it. I mean you've got competing industries down there Very competitive yes, I mean down where I'm at in Houston.
Speaker 1:We're home to the largest medical complex, the Texas Medical Center in the world, and there's stiff competition and it's like everybody's trying to compete for the talent. Right there, in a one-mile radius You've got all these big hospital systems, so it's very challenging.
Speaker 2:If you like this video, please like and subscribe to the network and, more importantly, share it with your colleagues in the healthcare industry. Together we can solve the aging crisis that's impacting all of us, all of us. Do you notice differences um generationally between, like, say, your millennials and your boomers and your gen xers, like and I guess I'm saying obviously we all have differences, but like specific to how they deal or verbalize kind of the stresses, the stresses of the job yeah, like, well, I'll say, my son uh happens, you know, is it following my steps?
Speaker 1:and he's the fm manager, uh, for a system in houston as well, for hda actually, and uh, you know, I get to see kind of his style, right, and and it's different, it's different. But you know, I try to give him some pointers on how I've been, but obviously we're all different, right, we're all unique, and so, uh, it's interesting to see the different leadership styles that he's developing and how he's going about. You know, he'll come to me with certain issues like how would you handle this? And, and it's, it's amazing because he's, I mean, he's very young and he's in that role already, but he's having to deal with personnel issues and you know, he's 24 years old, you know in that role and's been there, been in that role for three years. So I get to see that firsthand, a different generation of how they're handling, you know, today's FM world. That must be pretty cool. It is cool, it is, yeah, it is cool.
Speaker 2:So yeah, Like to have your son come up to you, and you know it's funny I was talking to.
Speaker 1:Jeff Shula, yeah, at lunch I thought you were going to say we just saw Mike at his time I'm like that's pretty cool. That's why I was like oh man, that's cool. I resonated with that that's right.
Speaker 2:Mike Canales and his son, Keith, who's just going into health care. But I was talking to Jeff and he was talking about his son and you're a parent, so you know this is true. The same goes for me with my kids, Jeff's.
Speaker 2:Like I tried to, how we did things and they look at me and they're like dad, that's how you did it. It's not how we did it, right, right, no, that's, that's true. Does, do you get that? Does he give that to you, even though you're working in the same field and you're the life safety guy and you've been doing it for far longer?
Speaker 1:yeah, no, they're definitely that's, that's true. Yeah, they've got their own thoughts and ideas of how they want to do it and you know, and good for them. You know, yeah, to stand on it, but, yeah, you know, not too much, but we run into that, I run into that as well. Oh, that's pretty cool did you?
Speaker 2:did your direction do you think influence him in his?
Speaker 1:oh, head path heavily. Yeah, does he like life safety? He does, does it? Yeah, he does yeah yeah he needs a different nickname I know right, or I was like I'm trying to think the life safety.
Speaker 2:Uh, guy junior, I don't know, that's what was going to say I figured that out, Well, that's awesome. So you talked about staffing issues obviously causing stress, pressures, Any other things that are feeding into that today. Or do you think if you had that not just you across the country if that staffing was figured out, just everything is a little bit easier?
Speaker 1:yeah, I think, because the more resources, the more you don't have so much on your plate, right, and so we're all running out of the perennial bandwidth. You know you only have so much bandwidth that you could do, right. Then that then the more you do, that creates burnout, right? We're talking about mental health, that that segues into that, and so we want to alleviate that and try to prevent that. And so I think staffing is one of, you know, the biggest issues, and staffing also from a perspective where there's not good, there's not a good succession plan sometimes, right, because there's no one to succeed into that role. That's the reality. So that's the problem too. You know it's not just staff. You know cuts or anything like that, it's that the talent's not there, yeah, and so I'm not sure what the solution is. You know we're losing the trades. You know that's been a conversation for the last few years and it's not getting better.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So I don't know. Imagine how it's going to be in 20 years from now. Yeah, that's where it gets scary. Right now we don't see it because it's just incremental, right, but 20, years could look pretty bad yeah, no, hopefully there's a, there's a turnaround somewhere.
Speaker 2:I want to ask you so you do the presentation at the chapter meetings without betraying anything. Do you get people, though, who follow up with you following the presentation? Oh, email you, yes, yes we get people.
Speaker 1:We've had people come up to us right after the presentation and just pour into us, really, and tell us man, I'm so glad you did that, and they'll give us their story, and so that's what it's all about, too, is it's just that one person you touch, you make a difference, make an impact, make them feel comfortable with the way they feel. That's what we're trying to do. So, yeah, we've had it multiple times. Each individual will get someone to jump in their email or, right after, come up to them and say, hey, thank you for what you did up there and being brave and being vulnerable and talking about this important topic. Do you think that?
Speaker 2:this topic is starting to get more traction. And can it ever get enough traction with all the competing? You go someplace like this, right, right. There's just so much people want to learn, not that that topic's right right, but where does it kind of?
Speaker 1:fit. You know it fits on like the way you make it fit, I guess, is you make it the general session right, so that it's not a good answer session? Yeah, so it's not a concurrent session. But yeah, no, I mean it's just, you know, some people are gonna be like, no, I don't want to, you know, hear about this, and some people will. But we've, you know, been uh blessed to going to be like, eh, no, no, I don't want to, you know, hear about this, and some people will. But uh, we've, you know, been uh blessed to have the general session at the TAFM. Uh, you know, meetings, conferences, and so either you're going to, you know, go in there and view it or you're out in the exhibit, right? So, yeah, I think I don't know if it's a concurrent session. You know you're just at the mercy of the other topics, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So yeah, no, you are, you are. Hopefully people select you. How do you personally manage your stress?
Speaker 1:For me. So you know, I go to the gym. The sauna is my best friend Really. Yeah, the sauna man, I have this infatuation with the sauna. So when I sauna man that I have this infatuation with the sauna. So when I get to the gym I go into the sauna and before I do my workout normally you go at the end, right. So I'm, I do a pre-sauna of workout, if you will. I don't work out in it, I just, you know, it's just where I go and I just like lose my thoughts and just kind of relax. It's almost like just a like meditation almost. I don't necessarily meditate, but I'm just in there. You know, sometimes there's other folks in there, whatnot. They may be chatting, but I just go in there and just relax. It's. It's that sweat I gotta start. So I stay in there for about a good 20, 25 I was gonna ask how long do you yeah?
Speaker 1:by 20, 25 minutes, I can get a real good. Just that's a long, profusely sweating, you know, and I feel like it's like it may even be a placebo for me, but it works. You know, like I get everything, all the toxins out, and I just feel better. Then I go do my workout and then I finish it all with Asana. So that's all. How long do you go in at the end? At the end, maybe like 15 minutes. Okay, yeah, not as long as the first time.
Speaker 2:But I get in there.
Speaker 1:It's almost like it's a pre-workout for me by starting off with it. But among that I have a good it's. I vent to them. Venting is very healthy, yeah, you know, just getting it out like hey, because it's in your thought, you're thinking of it out. But then when you talk it out, it's always good to get a perspective right. If someone else that says I don't know, maybe this, or you know what, this isn't this. So it may be that venting a strong circle. You know. Going to the gym, going for walks, you know, uh, getting some sunlight, we gotta get more sun. You know we gotta get outside more I'm sorry, did you see this?
Speaker 2:there was a statistic about vitamin d, like starting your day with sunlight, like 10 to 15 minutes of sunlight, if you can right right, and first thing in the morning.
Speaker 1:Yeah, did you see that? Yeah, yeah, no, I, I think that that's it's necessary. You know, we're, we're so boxed in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we don't even realize it because that's the modern civilization, right, but we're supposed to be outside yeah, that's what I just come say as you were talking um that thought hit me, it's like everything in your job is designed and I don't mean designed in a bad eye, right, but to keep you in right when really you want to be out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, everything's now. You got uber and uber eats and you don't. You don't even go out to get the food if you're not cooking right. It's like everything's just handed to you. You're just not enough.
Speaker 2:There's no incentive to go outside yeah, this is an old man rant. You know which I speak. Crazy when I see kids like young 10, 12, 13, you're on the motorized bikes, it's like pedal right, you know.
Speaker 1:I mean you're 10, 12, 13,. You're on the motorized bikes.
Speaker 2:It's like pedal Right, you know. I mean you're supposed to be pedaling around the neighborhood, you know? Whatever it is, it drives me crazy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's different.
Speaker 2:So you deal with the release kind of physically. Yes, it's by action and motion. Yes, a great venting session does work. I don't know why more people don't.
Speaker 1:I'm telling you that might be the number one thing is talk to someone. Yeah, Just talk. And if you're someone that asks about someone's mental health, be ready to listen, Because sometimes you ask right when I ask, sometimes I get you know, if I ask someone that I'll give them the context behind why I'm asking that, but be ready to listen to what I'll say, so do you ask that question day to day. No I wouldn't say day to day, but like, okay, I'm going to ask you how's your mental health?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I'm asking you how's your mental health today? It's the second time you used to keep the tables on me. I think it's good, though I honestly do Good. Yeah, I think I'm kind of like I've always been one to talk, so I don't think I keep stuff bottled in. Good, I feel fortunate, though, like I said, I know people in my family who've suffered from it and it's literally I just feel fortunate that I don't, because I've seen it and it's like, by the grace of god, right, you know, somebody gets it, somebody done, right, it's just as it can be as random as that.
Speaker 1:You're right. There is genetics that play into it as well yeah, I, I, so I do I.
Speaker 2:I think I've always been a two with that, because my brother started like 1993 was the first time it came up and before that I could. It was like you were saying right, mental, yeah yeah, yeah, right, yeah. But then when I saw that for the first time with him, I was like wow, yeah, you know because he was a big, strong guy and you know, and it was but man, it could take you, so but thank you for asking.
Speaker 2:I think my mental health is generally good and I think part of that is, like you know, I I talk if I need to. I don't keep. I don't keep things bottled in yeah.
Speaker 1:And so I've asked, like random people before too, and and some will pour in and some will give me that deer in the headlights, like what do you? What do you mean? You think I'm crazy? Well, yeah, so then I have to give them the context and I try to tell them well, no, I'm talking it in the context of just normalizing it, being self-aware, you know, and and oftentimes I'll be, oh okay, but yeah, it's a and, to be honest too, I have to be careful because that's a very, uh, almost like intimate question. Yeah, because it's, it's a. In a way, it's like we say the cliche, hey, how are you doing today? Right, and we say, oh, fine, even when we're not right, right, but it's more of saying no, how are you really doing?
Speaker 1:yeah and it's not to, for when you ask it, it's not to force someone to say, oh, I'm not doing good, it's just to really have them think like I am like, how is my mind working right now, you know is, is it healthy? And my, what's my state of mood, and it's just that, that self-awareness, right. And another thing about mental health that I don't like is it had we talked about the negative connotation. Why can't it be a positive connotation? Right, because when you go to the gym to work out physically, right, but where do you go to work your mind out? Right, and so it's like it could be a positive thing.
Speaker 1:I feel like there's so much negativity around it. They're like, no, it could be a good thing as well. You know, it just doesn't have to be the default negative thing you think about, because when you think of mental, you think of depression is what you think about. But it doesn't have to be depression. It could be motivation. That's still part of your mental health, and that's where we're trying to change that paradigm, where it's not just all, oh, how's your mental health? Oh, it makes you think. Oh, do you think it's bad? No, it could be good, it should be good, but sometimes it will be bad, and that's okay too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, now life on scale, right, everybody, everybody's got something. And I'd imagine too you know you were talking about asking the question sometimes it could have the negative connotation I'd imagine in the leadership position you're in, you have to think about that too, right, and then it's a it's a human question, right, right, but you don't want somebody to kind of turn that on you. So it's an interesting dance, yeah, it is.
Speaker 1:Another thing I wanted to share is, uh, going back to the fm world, when we had these conversations, that's happened. One of the things we implemented at our hospital site is all the leaders are required to take one mental health day off a month, and and the mental health day is just a random day to do anything, so it could be. It doesn't have to be the friday to have an extended week. It can't. It could could be a Tuesday, just to take it off, and it's just don't plan anything or plan something. So it's whatever you want to do, right, whether you want to go on a fishing trip or go somewhere, go walk in a park, or if you just want to do nothing, just take that mental health day so you can kind of reset.
Speaker 2:Is this a common spirit? Yeah, really, does anybody else do that? Not that I'm aware of. Yeah, I have not heard that. It's funny, you got me thinking. David emery is a um facilities director at intermountain health in utah.
Speaker 1:I met him he did that very guy. Yeah, he was the president, right, or?
Speaker 2:he still is he. He was the president. I went to one of their chapter meetings.
Speaker 1:Uh, last year great guy.
Speaker 2:I. I did a um and I so I ran into david this morning. I did a show with him last august. He has implemented um, a really interesting scheduling, um, uh scheduling program in his facility departments where his guys work. If you want it, it's from last august but I rented him this morning and he was saying his guys, I have my guy. He's like, my guys call me and say, hey, I got monday off, I'm so happy it made like day so they don't go five four, they don't go five by eight, they get their work done. It's very interesting. What he's implementing are the reasons he's implemented. It is because he's like I can't compete on salary so I need to do different things to give my team. But when you were talking about that, I'll bet you indirectly just having that day, having that scheduling, works for that. When you said everybody has to take one day a month.
Speaker 1:One day it made me think of that Wow, that's a different. Yeah, kind of similar to what that is, but yeah, because it's a break, it's a break Like that is. But yeah, because it's a break. It's a break like hey, look, you got to take the break and you know there's guys that don't want to take the break. Yeah, that's the ones that need the break the most. You know what I mean. So, yeah, it's like no, it's mandatory mental health day. Yeah, so if they don't take it, you make them they have to. Yeah, they got to hit that reset. And then you know, within reason, if there's something coming up joint commission or dv, that's different, right, but yeah, you got to get. You got to hit that pause and that reset.
Speaker 2:Are there other strategies or practices that you have in place to help your team manage stress, to deal with stress?
Speaker 1:Other than the mental health day off that we take, that's a great one. Yeah, you know, just checking in with them, you know, if nothing formal, just being personable, you know this. And even going back to this just to say this, you know, this is an old notion of you, remember growing up. They say, hey, you don't bring your personal stuff to work. How many times have we heard that all the time, oh, we go to work, you leave that at home. But I'll tell you, pete, how many times do we take work back home? Yeah, all the time, right. So that has to just be dispelled.
Speaker 1:This notion that you've got to keep work separate and work and home life separate To a degree, you have to right. But the reality is they mesh, yeah, they mesh. And you heard the saying all the time we spend more time at work than we do at home, and that's true. And so why wouldn't you want those to be integrated? Because they do. They are by default, whether we want to acknowledge it or not. And that's why I say, when they say, hey, like, don't bring your personal stuff to work, but I can bring work to home, that's okay, right. And it's like, no, it's not okay. That's why it's integrated. It's a work-life balance, a true work-life balance. But just being more personable with the team, you know, and I think that helps out. Checking in with them, I asked them personally hey, how's your mental? I I don't ask it. All I think is I don't want it to come off as ingenuine, right? Sure, because now I just come to oh, he's just asking. No, like asking him hey, how are you doing, how's your mental health?
Speaker 2:Like? You're so passionate about this. Have you done any like self-study to like? Is this kind of captured you in a way where you're going down that rabbit hole?
Speaker 1:No guy, no more. I'm like transition to the mental health guy, dr phil, yeah, yeah, no, you know, uh, just you know, podcast a lot of self-development. There's tons of podcasts on mental health. I'm always intrigued by those and just trying to glean something new and just be better. Right, but no, I haven't took like a formal uh path. But you know to go down there, rob, but I don't know. You know, it's interesting to see where this is going to take me. I don't even. It wasn't even something I fathomed just even a couple years ago. It wasn't something I thought I would get into and start talking about. So very interesting to kind of take that turn and be talking about it now.
Speaker 2:That's why I love doing these, because, like your answer right there, right, I never thought I'd be doing something Like you never know, you never know and like just be open to opportunities.
Speaker 1:You don't know where it's going to take. You don't know. This is one of those ones that I never in a million years what I thought, that you're talking about, mental health, you know it's like. But I'm glad I did, you know, and it feels good, it feels the feeling to be able to help spread that message, to be an advocate for it yeah, one of the.
Speaker 2:So I didn't see your first taffem um presentation, but I did see this one, and so the gentleman that I was sitting with had been to your first one, and when he saw that you guys were doing it again, he was so excited. He was like that thing was awesome and it was interesting to me because I read what the description was. I was well, it would be interesting to hear how they're going to handle it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's different.
Speaker 2:I've literally never seen one of those presentations and one of these engineering I know even like sometimes getting a soft skill session and you know communication right, they can look down upon it and forget, forget mental health.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, you're right, and I think because people are just resonating that, like I say, we're not therapists, but we're all human yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So what signs? So, ruben Garcia, life safety guy, mental health guy, common spirit director of facilities down in the Houston market, do you that we? We've talked about your team. Do you look? Or or are there certain telltale signs that you've seen in people that that indicate they may be dealing with stress?
Speaker 1:Is there like a telling? Yeah, no, I mean, the reality is we speak before we speak. Okay, and what I mean by that is right, it's body language, yeah, no-transcript. Right, because that's their normal personality. Now, if they're normal, a normal quiet person, that's hard to discern, right? Yeah, but you can still read some cues. Body language you can. It's just no, if you know your people, you're going to pick up on the body language. That's why it's important to be present, because if you don't, if you're not present, you're not going to be able to pick up on those cues, right, and someone will say, hey, what's up with him, he's acting a little different, or this is going on.
Speaker 2:That's that's when you pay attention so yeah, and it's really hard, these I mean you have to work at being present because we got yeah, you know these things, which I know they're peak consuming us.
Speaker 1:yeah, we live on our phones nowadays.
Speaker 2:yes, yeah, yeah, I mean and it makes it difficult to connect. Yes, and it's a crutch.
Speaker 1:Yes, it is.
Speaker 2:So yeah, there's lots of, so you work at that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I work at that. Yeah, I try to. You know, talk to the team If I see something's not right. We want to figure it out, yeah.
Speaker 2:Anything, ruben, that we didn't cover, or anything you know relative to kind of stress or thoughts or final thoughts, anything you think is important to get out there.
Speaker 1:Maybe not me, since I would just say, I just encourage everyone to. You know, ask someone today how their mental health is and be ready to listen.
Speaker 2:You know, just help spread the message is there any I know you can't divulge it other life safety products coming down the pike, or is yes, yeah, actually, I'm glad you asked that.
Speaker 1:So we have a third product that's in development. It's going to revolutionize the fire door industry. It's going to solve a major issue that's prevalent right now with fire doors and we're very excited to put this product out. Awesome, yes, so coming in march, march 2026 very interesting where's our target date do you think you'll hit it?
Speaker 2:I think we'll hit it we're on target, excellent.
Speaker 1:Um, where do people go to learn more regulatoryconceptscom regulatory concepts and if you, if you don't follow me on linkedin, if you want to get some life safety content, follow me on linkedin the life safety guy I try to post. I haven't been too consistent this year but I got to have that bandwidth right. I take my time when I do them and it's like I want to put something that's concise, that's easy to digest, and just put it out there, but most of the time I'm reposting other life safety content at peace.
Speaker 2:I was going to say mean you used to post more frequently than as you now. It is part of that kind of your about the role too, though I mean yeah, I just got a lot going on, you know.
Speaker 1:I mean my primary job is there's a lot going on there, you know, in the hospital, as you know. Like just that alone, right, yeah? And so not to mention my other endeavor. So I just try to balance it all out and sometimes there's not enough room to to prioritize that, but it is something that I do enjoy and and we'll be putting out more uh, here coming up, awesome, well, ruben garcia, market director, common spirit health life safety guy, entrepreneur, mental health advocate or brain health advocate, I do like, I do like brain health.
Speaker 2:I like that mental health really does. It just has that negative, you know it does yeah, I'm wondering if brain health, Brain health I like that Mental health really does. It just has that negative. You know it does. Yeah, I'm wondering if brain health like concussions would. We don't have that. Oh yeah, I know right.
Speaker 1:Now we're going to the science, right, yeah.
Speaker 2:But anyways, ruben, thank you. Oh, thank you. So it's Peter Martin for watching Healthcare Facilities Network, and if you're interested in a chapter for the presentation, give Ruben a call or an email. If you want to be a guest on a future episode of the Healthcare Facilities Network, go to healthcarefacilitiesnetworkcom and let us know who you are and what you want to talk about, because together we can solve this critical aging issue.