Edniesha Curry is motivating, exciting, filled with wisdom and compassion. She joins us to talk about the importance of relationships in her success, as well inclusion, which can be a weighty topic, but she speaks to it in such a approachable and actionable way.
Edniesha is a former WNBA player with the Phoenix Mercury and the Los Angeles Sparks, and is currently an assistant Men’s basketball coach at the University of Maine. One interesting fact about Edniesha is that she’s currently one of only two women currently holding a full-time position as an assistant coach for any NCAA men’s Division I basketball program.
Edniesha Curry is motivating, exciting, filled with wisdom and compassion. She joins us to talk about the importance of relationships in her success, as well inclusion, which can be a weighty topic, but she speaks to it in such a approachable and actionable way.
Edniesha is a former WNBA player with the Phoenix Mercury and the Los Angeles Sparks, and is currently an assistant Men’s basketball coach at the University of Maine. One interesting fact about Edniesha is that she’s currently one of only two women currently holding a full-time position as an assistant coach for any NCAA men’s Division I basketball program.
Erol Senel:
Hello everyone, and welcome to Success Shorts, I'm Erol Senel. Today, we're joined by Edniesha Curry. Edniesha is a former WNBA player with the Phoenix Mercury and the Los Angeles Sparks, and is currently an Assistant Men's Basketball Coach at the University of Maine. One interesting fact about Edniesha is she's currently one of only two women presently holding a full-time position as an Assistant Coach for any NCAA Men's Division I basketball program. But Edniesha is so much more than her title, and that comes through during our chat. Like any good coach, Edniesha is motivating, exciting and filled with wisdom and compassion. I had a lot of fun talking with her, and the way she spoke to some heavy topics made them so approachable. So I hope you enjoy our time with Edniesha Curry. Let's go.
Erol Senel:
Edniesha, thank you so much for joining us today.
Edniesha Curry:
No, thank you.
Erol Senel:
And I'd like to kind of kick things off with a little bit of perspective from you, because we're kind of coming out of a really crazy period that has had a really big impact on you professionally and personally. So I'm kind of wondering, what have been some of the struggles that you've seen, from a coaching standpoint, in terms of the young men that you're coaching, but also how has this forced you to adapt and to change during these times?
Edniesha Curry:
This time has been crazy, but for me, exciting. It has given me time to reflect, it has given me time to educate the young men that I get to mentor and coach and impact daily about things outside of basketball. This is what this time has meant for me. And it has grown me as a coach and hopefully it has grown the young men that I've gotten a chance to impact in other ways with all the social unrest that we've had. So for me, it's been a great education experience and it has brought me closer to our players.
Erol Senel:
When it comes to everything that we've gone through, I think that it's really led to just an enhanced level of resilience, that I think we're all capable of now than prior to this period. But one thing about the generation that you're coaching, and I've kind of noticed this through different conversations, is they seem to be far more keyed in on the social component of this and trying to do something about that than I think older generations have been when it comes to this.
Edniesha Curry:
Yeah, I think they're just a little more engaged in the life they want. What people have to understand is the old way, the new way, however you want to frame it, these young people didn't grow up like that. So the idea of one is better than the other, for this generation, that's not a norm for them. They didn't understand it, don't want to be a part of it, and they felt the need to speak up. And I enjoy being around them because in order for things to change, at every level, you need people to speak up.
Erol Senel:
It's inspiring, what they're doing, because a lot of times the younger voices are discounted, but they're definitely not accepting it this time. I just wanted to thank you for sharing a little bit about that because we're all in our own little bubbles, and we assume that everyone is kind of experiencing things the same way, but it's interesting to hear just a little bit of the insight from a collegiate standpoint and what they're experiencing.
Erol Senel:
And I want to dig into your experience a little bit now. You've operated pretty exclusively within the realm of basketball, probably since you were a little kid, I'd imagine.
Edniesha Curry:
Yeah, pretty much.
Erol Senel:
A lot of onlookers can kind of look at that and see it as one dimensional, and I think that happens a lot with athletes is we just see them as athletes. But if you pull back the layers of Edniesha, there's just so much more there, and I've had the chance to get to know you over a few phone calls and it's been really wonderful. The leadership, you've done a lot of player development, you've gone on kind of like diplomatic missions overseas to promote basketball, and marketing, and all these other things. So I'm curious, when you think about all those things that you've done within this scope, what trait would you say that you've leaned on most to help you succeed in all these different assets?
Edniesha Curry:
My relationships with people. I've always known the power of people, the power of relationships, and I've always understood that I'm not a basketball player. And I was always taught that at a very young age, you play a sport, that's not who you are. It's like a job, but who you are as a person goes everywhere with you. When I go to the grocery store, I'm not going as a basketball player, I'm going as Edniesha Curry. And that was instilled in me at a very young age, and understanding the power of relationships and people, for me, just that insight just allows me to understand that if I'm in marketing, or if I'm overseas coaching, or where I am now at University of Maine, or when I'm working with the NBA, those are just platforms for me to use my gift, which is coaching, leading, impacting people. And it's just a platform for me to do just that, and I'm blessed that I can use a sport to do it, but for me, it's the relationships that I have gained, and I've impacted change through sport.
Erol Senel:
So when you think back at some of those relationships, what would you say are the relationships that have had the biggest impact on you in your own personal development along the way?
Edniesha Curry:
Accountability, being challenged, always pushed out of my comfort zone, but the most powerful thing is love. I can always go back to any of my coaches, any of my close mentors, that word and that feeling in that relationship around love stands out the most for me.
Erol Senel:
And that's interesting that you pulled out the love, because I remember when we were talking not too long ago, we were actually talking about the opposite of that, hate. And I believe it was your grandmother-
Edniesha Curry:
Yep.
Erol Senel:
Who said that, that was like the worst word. It wasn't any of the other swear words that were out there, but hate was the one. And when you think about the lack of love, or the impact that love has had on you, and then you look at where we are today, how do you feel we're getting it wrong when it comes to hate and love? And what are some ways that we can try to embrace that a little bit more consciously so that we can get to where we want to be with some of the bigger things?
Edniesha Curry:
I think it's understanding people, building relationships are hard. I'll use my grandmother and the word hate, and why she didn't want us to say that. I mean, this is a woman that grew up in the South, she experienced hate on a level that I couldn't even fathom. I can't even think about it. I don't even know how I could have handled that, but she still had so much love. And because she had that love, she was able to give that to us, and there's power in that, because she could have easily told us to hate. She could have easily said that, and had every right to tell her grandkids to hate, but she didn't. And that is a strength and a love and a care for people that goes unlooked sometimes. Even though it was done to her, and done to her family, she didn't want to pass on that to her grandkids, or her own kids.
Edniesha Curry:
It's so many things, because love takes patience. It takes a lot of patience to understand people, and people have to understand that loving people and caring for people does not mean that we will get along all the time. It does not mean we will be friends. There are certain people that you just don't get along with, but it does not mean you have to hate and wish ill will on them. You can turn your cheek and walk the other way. You don't have to go being evil or mean, and it's so hard for us. It's just natural for humans to be aggressive and be competitive. This is like our environment, "I've got to one over on you." It's really hard to have a misunderstanding and not say anything nasty.
Edniesha Curry:
And I love my grandmother so much for the lessons she's taught me when she was in my life. Like, "Okay, you don't like him or her, don't play on her porch. You don't want to be your friend anymore, okay, end it. Go find someone else." It wasn't like an ongoing conversation to say mean things about why are they... It's okay. You grow out of relationships, you grow out of people, but those lessons have to be taught. It seems to be very hard for us to dislike situations or dislike jobs and not need drama, I call it.
Edniesha Curry:
I don't enjoy it at all, so I can just be like, "Okay, we've said our peace, and this relationship is not working. Okay." And leave. And not feel any anger or anything where I feel like I need to hurt somebody behind their back or to other people. It's power in being able to walk away and move on. It's not easy. I'm not saying it's easy, but when you truly have no hate in your heart, and love, you tend to lean on the good pieces and grow from the bad pieces, and move on without the mean stuff.
Erol Senel:
Yeah. Hate is an absolute cancer when it comes to your mindset, so actually having a mindset where you're leading with love, and you can acknowledge the bad, but not letting it materialize into hate within yourself, which would then spread out.
Edniesha Curry:
Yep.
Erol Senel:
And in fact, everything else within you, it's a very healthy way to go. But you're right, it's not taught. We don't teach mindset in school. It's usually, it comes from great coaches, or it comes from having a wonderful grandmother like you had, that's where you get it. But it's a shame because I really feel like, unless you have those people in your life, you can really go down a path where you do have hate, and you do have bitterness, and some of those things. So I'm glad that you had the opportunity to heed your grandmother's words, but not only that, I think that probably played a role in the fact that you've gone into coaching.
Edniesha Curry:
Yeah, even when I fought it. It's crazy I'm here, and I'm using coaching as my platform, because I did not want to be a coach. I was running from it. I mean, when my coaches were telling me you were born to coach, it was like, they saw it came so easily to me, even at a young age, when they were trying to tell me to stop playing and coaching at 25, they were like, "This is you. This is your gift." I was like, "There's no way I'm doing this. I am not leading anybody's kids. They say something to me, I'm probably going to go crazy." And again, another lesson that kept popping in my head is my grandmother. She would always say, "When you're called to do something in your life, no matter what it is, you can't run from it." And I couldn't, no matter how far I ran from it, and then I just finally said, "You know what? Do what you're supposed to do." And I just bought in, I didn't fight it anymore, and I mean, here am now.
Erol Senel:
Coaching really is a calling, just like teaching is a calling in many ways. So you did hit on something as you were explaining a little bit about yourself and how you always saw yourself as Edniesha and not as an athlete, but one thing I did allude to there was the fact that I think we do look at athletes a little bit different than we look at other professionals. The perception that athletes are athletes, and we pigeonhole them as just that. Why do you think that is?
Edniesha Curry:
Because we're seen as entertainment. So sometimes, when you're looked at as just a product that makes another person happy, for whatever reason it may be, when we get outside of the way they don't see us, it's a problem, because their only relationship with us is they're going to buy tickets, and they buy these expensive tickets to see you, entertainment. That's it. When they see us in other fields, it's like, "I don't like you like this." And then you get those comments where they start saying, "Well, our tax money," or this or that, "We pay money for you to do this, not to do this." And that's where the fall comes, because that's the value of athletes for a lot of people. College, high school, you name it, there are people paying to see a sport, they're entertainment. And when you have money and people are paying for something, sometimes they lose the value in realizing that we are people that have our mind, and we're more than the 48 minutes that you guys get to be happy about what we do on the court.
Erol Senel:
Or if you're a lifelong Browns fan, sad about what you do on a field. That makes total sense, and I didn't completely think of it that way, but now that you're saying it like that, it's the same thing with actors too, actors and actresses. Once you get out of that realm where we're used to that, and it's really about having empathy and realizing that everyone is multi-dimensional.
Erol Senel:
And one of the things that I wanted to do is kind of go down some of those experiences with you. You have so much to say on some topics because of your lived experience. And you've been very active in the discourse, over the past year or so, and I'm sure far beyond that, but that's as long as I've been aware of you at this juncture. So, not too long ago, you had a couple posts about tokenism on your social media, on your Instagram stories, and I was just kind of reading through it and trying to understand a little bit more about that. But I'm really curious, what are your feelings about tokenism? And what are some of the negatives that you feel because of the behaviors associated with tokenism?
Edniesha Curry:
Wow, I'm afraid that there will be no action. I'm afraid that this is support now, marketing campaigns, t-shirts, whatever you might want to name. That support, that's changed. No, that's putting a spotlight on something, just like going out and marching and protesting, it's putting a spotlight on it, but it's not actually creating change. That's my main worry that, what's the transition after it? What's the action steps after? Those are more important, to me, than anything. I want to see the action steps. Show me what your Executive Board looks like, let me see your hiring, let me see the changes that you made after you said, "Okay, we have a problem, and we do need to fix this, and we are a part of this problem." What did you actually change? Or, did you just do that because it was a fad, it was a trend, and you didn't want to be left out.
Edniesha Curry:
That's what I'm looking at, what I'm very aware of, in these next six months to a year, seeing where the change actually happened with action. How these uncomfortable conversations that we're having now sparked actual decision-making. Change is decision-making, change is not saying, "Okay, we have a lot of hate. We have a lot of issues, and we need to fix what's going on in the world." Okay. What actions? Change is action. It's policies, it's things that create a new system at every level. So for me, that's what I'm afraid of, that sometimes the tokenism gets lost in the actual reason for why things need to be changed.
Erol Senel:
Yeah. So tokenism at its core, it's basically doing something to indicate that you are making a change without actually doing something substantial to do it. So, I mean, in the example that I think we're kind of concerned, we do see a rash of hirings, but if you invite all these communities in and you don't provide the structure and framework for them to excel once they're inside to ascend to those higher levels, I think that's where tokenism is really such a big negative is that it's so surface level that it's not true to intent. And one of the things, I was talking to you about this before we started today, is that we see some changes being made within sports. You see some of the opportunities within pro football, where you're starting to see some women ascending to higher positions in the front office or on coaching staffs, but correct me if I'm wrong, in this type of situation is the fear that those opportunities are open, but then there's not a true path up from there?
Edniesha Curry:
I think that it always starts from the top, and that's why it's so important to create a culture in each organization that invites different communities in. Because in business, in life, people hire who they're comfortable with, people hire who look like them, majority of the time, their comfort level. So if you're only around certain people in certain communities, then that's your only pool. For whatever reason, your mindset is not going to go to anybody else. It's just not. So you're always going to go to your comfort zone and your pool, and that's why it's so important to create these diverse communities. Because when you're creating diverse, diverse communities and a diverse culture of communities, now you're having diverse conversations and diverse ideas. There's different input. When you have different input, you have different ways to think about things in life and think about decision-making.
Edniesha Curry:
That's why I love the fact that I've lived in so many different countries and worked around the world because I have so much input from so many cultures and religions and people of all types of backgrounds. It has helped me become a better person because I'm not locked in on one way. And you can look at majority of these cultures and communities and look at the top, and it's like, okay, being diverse is not having 15 white male, one Black woman, two White women, and another person of color, that's not diverse. And you see a lot of that. So think of the conversations at the top, because the majority of the diversity, which people are not understanding, the majority of the diversity in a lot of these communities and cultures and organizations is at the bottom. And we both know the bottom is not making the decisions.
Erol Senel:
So I'd like to kind of just build off of that a little bit more, if that's okay. So, I feel like athletes are way ahead of the trend when it comes to social change, just because we're used to training together and playing together and we value each other, and the fact that we have this comradery. But at the same time, when you look at professional sports, and high level college sports, from an organizational standpoint, on the surface, they're pretty behind the times when it comes to leadership roles like coaches and player personnel and front office stuff. And I'm kind of curious, what actually needs to change in the practices involved there, to see a true shift in diversity of thought and personnel so that we can move all this forward?
Edniesha Curry:
It's constant conversations like this, it's applying pressure. It's educating those organizations about the talent pool. Like I said, people are so used to just hiring just who they know, or what is presented to them, that they miss out on opportunities. It's just like with me being a woman coach in men's basketball, I know a ton of women that coach boys basketball, men's basketball, coach abroad. So anytime I get in a conversation and an opportunity to tell someone about these wonderful women, I do, just to educate them. There's a missing educational piece when it comes to the hiring process, when it comes to diversity. For me, diversity is, again, about different conversations and different ideas. If you don't have an equal balance of different people in the room, you're going to have the same conversations, you're going to have the same comfort level. And the questions that we always have to ask is, why does that diversity stop when it's no longer entertainment?
Edniesha Curry:
Because it does, it stops. It just completely stops. Like you say, coaching, front office, personnel, you name it, it just stops. And again, it's the educational piece. You have to get people in these rooms and say, "Hey, there's other women out there. There are other people of color. I know a bunch of Black people that are great at analytics. Here's this pool of people." But if you don't have these people in the room that can have these diverse conversations and speak for other people that don't look like them, it's hard. I mean, if you have a 60 year old white man that's been in corporate America all his life, how many people has he worked with, or been in rooms, that don't look like him?
Erol Senel:
Yeah.
Edniesha Curry:
It's very powerful.
Erol Senel:
It is. And to some extent, they look back and they're like, "Well, we've been profitable. We've done this. We've been okay up to this point. Why do I have to make a change?"
Edniesha Curry:
Their success has been that. So it leaves a group of communities out because in their mind, I'm successful, I've been successful doing it this way. I don't want to change because I don't want to, no one doesn't want to be successful. No one. [crosstalk 00:23:18] doesn't go out and say, "Hey, I want to be a failure." So, we have to shake them up, and I feel like our generation, this generation, has a different mindset when it comes to having hard conversations, the young athletes. And that's why it's so cool that we have social media, and our athletes are speaking out, our athletes are creating committees and groups on campus, and they're applying pressure to people that have kind of got in a comfort zone. And they're like, "Okay, we have to change this. This is different. You're going to have to have different conversations."
Edniesha Curry:
And I think that just makes us better. I think it makes every organization better. It makes us better as people, and it goes back to, a lot of people don't know how to deal with people because they don't deal with people. And that's why sports is so ahead and it's so different. Like me, just think of playing 10 years abroad, living in 15 different countries, how many different people have I had to deal with and work with and grow with to be successful, to be where I am now? That's a lot of different people. That's diversity. And we have to get over the fear that certain communities mean that we're not successful.
Erol Senel:
So you just shared a lot. I love what we just got into in that space, and it really does come down to creating more opportunities to have different people at the table, because if you've ever sat around a table with interesting people, it's not because everyone says the same thing. That's boring as fuck.
Edniesha Curry:
Oh my God, Jesus Christ. Yes. You go to the meeting, those are those meetings with the means, okay, you go to the meeting, you're like, "You could have emailed me this." That's why.
Erol Senel:
Right. So if we create the right type of table, life's just going to be far more richer, but at the same time, no one likes to be uncomfortable either. We like familiarity because we know what to expect in certain ways, and we get to put our guard down a little bit, and we don't have to have all of our energy going towards this. So I'm curious, so from a coaching standpoint, I was wondering if I could challenge you to give us just a little bit of a pep talk, motivating us towards embracing this change, because this is going to lead to so much good and so much new opportunity that it's going to just breed new success, if we embrace this too. So I was wondering if you can do that for us to kind of close things out.
Edniesha Curry:
Life is about change. Life is about learning. You cannot learn and you cannot grow being still, being in the same room with the same voices and the same minds. We tell our athletes all the time, "You have to get out of your comfort zone." America has to get out of their comfort zone, right now, in order for us to grow forward, be better towards each other, and be a better country for everyone.
Erol Senel:
Amen. Thank you so much, coach. This is, oh, I called you coach.
Edniesha Curry:
Everyone calls me coach. I go to the doctor, I go to the grocery store, "Hey, coach." I'm like, "Hey."
Erol Senel:
But thank you, thank you so much. This was great.
Edniesha Curry:
You're welcome.
Erol Senel:
And that's all we have for this episode of Success Shorts. Hopefully you found today's topic useful, and remember, have fun, stay curious, and keep it short.