"Segovia DNA" - Conversation with Beth Segovia @ ChannelAdvisor

Beth Segovia, COO of ChannelAdvisor has a word for you!  While we sat down to talk about burnout in the workplace, Beth and I covered lots of territory - from work-life "balance", to the Great Talent Swap to practical advice on how to tackle workplace burnout.  She's a wife, a mom and fiercely talented leader!  Our conversation was down-to-earth and so inspiring...I can't wait for you to hear her pearls of wisdom. 

Oh...and Beth also offers sage advice at the end of our conversation around self-elimination! Her "Segovia DNA" (a combination of grit, grace and determination) wants you to stay in the game and not let fear pull you away from the possibilities that exist around every corner.  

So Good! 

Transcript

Welcome to the Reinvention Road Trip a coffee shop style podcast that is helping thousands of women dream bigger and level up in business and life. I'm Jes Averhart. Join me as we learn from the baddest women in the game who share their powerful reinvention stories, each one dropping unique gems and takeaways just for you.

Listen, it's time to get inspired, dream louder, and own the keys that will unlock the next best version of you.

All right. We are back with our series on burnout as we go into the summer of 2022. I know this is a little bit of a cold open again, but I mean, heck we're on a series, so everybody knows what we're getting ready to do here. Reinvention reinvention is. It can mean a lot of things to a lot of people, but we know that it is the act or the process by which something has changed so much that it appears entirely new.

And I think that can go both ways, two sides of the coin. Right. So we see that people. Can be bright and shiny and they change and they move and places and spaces that are, that are undefined and they're pushing their limits and they're doing incredible things. And maybe that they never imagined that they would do.

And that reinvention story is amazing. On the other side of that client and what I'm, why the series is so important is that I think that a lot of us have reinvented ourselves in a way that we hadn't anticipated where we're getting exhausted and tired and it's, and we don't recognize ourselves anymore.

And we remember the days when we were refreshed, we remember the days when we had margins. And now we're like, what happened? Where did it go and how do I find it again? And so that's a different side of a reinvention story. And one that we're not talking about as much, because I don't think we know how to solve for it.

And I'm not recommending or suggesting that we are going to solve for the. In this series, but I think as you've heard, what we're trying to do is say one, it's a real thing. You're not alone. Yes. Those feelings are real. And to the way people approach this moment in time, we're all feeling a little bit at capacity.

Is different and it's unique to them and their own lived experience. And so what I'm hoping to do is to bring light to that and shine a new sort of perspective with each and every one of our guests. So today I'm excited because we have  with us Beth Segovia with ChannelAdvisor, she's the COO of that company. And so she has this global reach.

And she's sitting across from me and she's incredibly relatable and just so down to earth yet, she has so much on her plate at all times, and is in his leading in powerful ways. And I had the opportunity to sit down with her a couple of weeks ago and moderate a panel was so impressed with the way that she tells stories and thinks about her work.

And again, I find that the speakers we have on this page, Of the guests that we have on this podcast are straight shooters. That's the other thing that I loved about her is that she kind of cuts through the noise and just says the thing, which is isn't that refreshing don't we love that. So, Beth, thank you so much for joining us and welcome to re-invention Roche.

Thank you, Jes. I'm super pleased to be here and just looking forward to our conversation. Yeah, me too. Well, what I always start with is just like, how do you show up? Who are you? Maybe tell your journey wherever you want to start with that. But as we think about, I just want to set this up a little bit more.

I'm often reminded that when I write. Somebody as the COO of a major global company, people are like, oh, you know, we forget that. That's not where you've always been. And so if you just want to talk a little bit about that journey and let our listeners into who you are as a human, not just your title.

Sure, sure. I'd be happy to. So who do I show up as? So I am obviously the chief operating officer of channel advisor, but I am a white. I am a daughter. I am a sibling. I have five brothers and sisters and I'm a mother. I have two teenage daughters. And, you know, I have worked for 30 years, which is hard to admit.

I'm sure I don't look that old, but you know, I started, I was born in Illinois at one of six of parents who were super supportive, but also demanding. And I was expecting. To perform from when I was very young and it didn't make a difference that I was a girl, I had four brothers, one sister did make a difference that I was a girl.

I was expected to be top of my class, deliver to the best of my ability to go to a great college and just, you know, sort of be all I could be. So I started out that way. So I became an. Which at that time was a little bit unusual as a woman. And I went into supply chain, which was also, I think, a little bit unusual as a woman.

I was sitting in the it industry at that time and I pursued. Uh, a number of different, very traditional engineering roles, you know, so manpower planning, production planning, line design, you know, all kinds of traditional engineering roles. And then I, I decided that I had worked a whole lot and I wasn't having a whole lot of fun.

I needed a little bit of a break. I wanted to get a master's degree. So I went back to school and got another engineering degree, and then I returned to the business, but in a little bit of a different focus area, I went into. Marketing partner management, program management. And that led me into customer engagement and support.

And that's where I found my jam. So I built an organization at IBM that was focused on their largest global customers. And I spent a decade building capability to really service the largest global brands in the world. And it became a passion project for me. So I realized that. If you do the right thing for your customer every single day, like the business just comes, it just happens.

Right? And so we really, we built something that was very powerful and I spent just years at it. I grew during that time through several levels of leadership, eventually becoming the executive that led that organization. And I became a verb at my company, so they would refer to it. We need to go hire somebody with Segovia DNA.

And what that meant was just passion for purpose, customer advocacy. You know, somebody driven to make sure the right thing was done regardless of obstacles. So, you know, it was really amazing during that journey. My heart was broken because the IBM company decided. We sell off the PC division. And I became part of a new company, Lenovo.

And at the time I was crushed just heartbroken, but it turned out to be one of the best things that ever happened to me because Lenovo was a much smaller enterprise, less people. A lot of the people I knew came with me there entered new people into the, into the organization that were the new leaders of the enterprise.

It became an accelerant for my career because I became an executive faster and I had more responsibility, more impact, and it just moved at a faster pace than it turned out to be a wonderful experience for me. From there, I moved into services, which is just an extension of that customer passion. And I wanted to be part of creating value for customers.

So creating solutions and services to improve that client experience. And after 25 years, I realized that I couldn't get to the next level where I was. I made my desires known. I had worked very hard and I'd met all the new requirements. Well, you need this experience where you need that or whatever. And I just never quite got that.

That next promotion. And I really wanted to be the leader of the organization. So I decided that it was time for me to find a new opportunity. So I did, so I changed industries a little bit, still it, but I moved into software and I joined ChannelAdvisor where I led the services organization for about 18 months.

Okay. How long ago was that when you started at channel four and a half years? So I was, I led services for about 18. And then I became the COO. Wow. And so now I am responsible for about 60%, I guess, as a company. So I have all the services, I have human resources, I've all a product management and engineering.

And so it's a very exciting place. It's a much smaller enterprise. So I went from IBM, 400,000, you know, small country to Lenovo, which was 20,000 when we started at 80,000, when I left. To accompany of 900, you know, 170 million in revenue and just a very different place. I went from being one of 200 executives to being one of eight to being the sole decision maker for services, and then, you know, just influential in a different way.

And so that's what I'm doing now. And it just has been a great ride. And so at 30 years I feel like. Honestly, I still am just getting started. You know, there's much more to do. Oh gosh, what did, that's a great narrative. Thank you for that. Yeah. I love your Midwestern girl. First of all, as we share that, right.

We also share sort of the philosophy about doesn't matter. What your gender is, you have potential and you need to live into your potential, whatever that best is for you. I love that you were sort of raised that way. I was also raised that way, pushed in many ways to just go a little bit more, just a little bit more, and you carried that all the way through to today.

I mean that little love, maybe it's a little voice, like just a little. What's your best. What's your potential. Thank you for taking us on that journey. That's awesome. And you kind of talked about some of the twists and turns, like at least the pivots professionally, but is there anything that stands out to you that was just like a major, I don't know, just professionally where you were like, Ooh, how was wasn't ready for that?

And you had to make a decision. I mean, you even told him, I don't, you don't have to tell the story, but you told the story about when you were offered the CLL position. I don't know, this is what I want to do. Right. So I don't know. I don't want to take that. That may not be the story you want to share, but it was one that resonated with me when I met you.

Yeah. I think there's a couple of things. The sale from IBM to Lenovo and becoming part of a new company, sort of not by choice was a pivotal moment for me. It was, it was hard. I, when I say I was heartbroken, that sounds sort of archaic in these times where people maybe don't have the same level of loyalty, but I joined IBM because it was a large enterprise where I could do all kinds of things live in all kinds of places, grow my career and stay there forever.

Right. So, I mean, IBM used to pride themselves on lifetime employment and I was sort of part of that generation. And so that was a big moment. And the transition to something that felt very different. But then having it become freeing and energizing and empowering and an accelerant was unexpected. So I think that was a big goal.

That was a big moment. The moments when we decided to have children and how that impacts. My career were pivotal. I talk about this a lot and sometimes it embarrass has been, but your choice of partner is like a really big deal. And I always say I hit the jackpot because my husband is one of these people that believes we take it on.

And if we don't like it, we put it back. But we never decide not to pick it up because we're afraid of what might happen next. And so I got my first executive opportunity when I was. And nobody knew I was pregnant and my immediate reaction was why can't possibly do this. Now, this is insane. And he has, his immediate reaction was why not?

What are you talking about? And, and so I really was like, what do you mean? Like, we're going to have like a tiny UBIT that needs to be like, you know, kept alive. Like, I can't also run an organization of 300 people. This is crazy. And he was like, let's try. And I took a leave of absence and all that stuff, and they held the job for me and, you know, and I just did it and it sounds so easy now, but, but it is in fact what happened and I'm so grateful.

And, and we'll probably talk about it later. When we talk about advice for people like staying in the game was one of the most important things I did. Right? So I took leaves of absence that took seven months off of each child. Cause I'm an accountant has to be fair. So it took leaves of absence. You know, I spent time with my babies, but then I got right back to work and I tried working.

Part-time not in a leadership role and that was terrible. I just didn't feel whole, I didn't feel human. I felt like a terrible employee. I felt like a terrible mother. Like I felt like the whole thing was terrible. And so I went back to what made me me, which was I had to be an accomplished adult on my own.

And then I had to be somebody's mother that was also successful. So I felt like that was very important. And I think the third one is probably when I chose to. A 25 year career. I mean, even though I was sold, I was sold with all the people I knew. So I really, for 25 years worked alongside this tribe of people and we accomplished so much.

I mean, when I left the company, I remember when the executives said, how can you go? We built the business together. And I was thinking, did we, oh, we did. I think we did, it was like a family. And honestly, the hardest thing to leave was that family. But I got to a point where it wasn't enough for me anymore, and I wasn't feeling refreshed.

And you know, we're going to talk about burnout. I think a little bit more. I had signs of that there. Right. So I was. Not excited to get up and go to work. Meetings were not pleasant. There was too much debate. There wasn't enough collaboration. I didn't feel good about it, you know, anyway, so there was just, yeah, I had changed in that environment and I really wanted to accomplish more.

I wanted to have more of an impact I wanted to, I needed a new experience and so changing to a new role was a very pivotal moment for me. And it kind of happened by accident. So I was ready. I was. Doing the things you do on LinkedIn, when you're starting to think about getting a new job, and I was doing my resume, I was starting to reach out to people and this opportunity just landed in my lap.

Honestly, it was fortune and angels and all those things, but you know, a job showed up and turned out a very close friend of mine was the head of talent. And asked her about the job. And three weeks later and felt like a hundred interviews. I had a job offer and I honestly didn't know what to do. I was like, wait, I'm not sure I bet for that to happen.

So we had family meeting, which is what we do. And I asked my daughters and they actually said, They did me to me, they said, what's the worst that can happen, mom. You always say that if we're unhappy or we don't like what's happening to change our circumstance and what are you afraid of? And the last thing they said was sometimes when you talk about work, you get that face and we just don't think you're very happy.

Oh, wow. And so I said, well, why not? And my husband said, why not? Right. So let's try something new because I had a whole career and I have nothing negative to say about my previous. I mean, my previous employers, I learned at GRU, I had so much great work and impact. It, but it was full and it was time to sort of change the trajectory for my journey.

And that was pivotal because my new role is I've learned so much in this new role in just a short period of time. And that's been an Energizer for me at this point in my career. Wow. That's what a great story. And I've heard it, but just like glimpses of that, that was so cool. He took me right into the living room with your family meeting.

I'm like, yes, that was one of the questions you ask. Oh, your daughters are amazing. All right. Well, that also reminded me that, that moment. And I like to point them out since I love to talk about crucible moments. Talk about it to write about it. I love to think about my own, but that it was a crucible moment for you because you had the choice in that moment to do what you've been doing, or to take a leap, jump off the comfort cliff, right.

And do something radically different. But that you were being pulled to drawn to, which would have led you and did to a better version of yourself. Those moments are so hard. There's some risky, you know, in our mind our mental space is like, yes, no, yes, no. Here's all the reasons why shouldn't that sort of, that, that ring of like, but what if I went in for my, we spend so much time thinking about, you know, what we will lose.

Instead of focusing our energy on the possibilities of what could be. I love that you, that you and I know ChannelAdvisor's grateful for that family meeting. That's such a great experience. And it just, that the thing that resonated the most was when my daughter said, because we do this in our face.

What's the worst thing that could happen right now. We did the whole scenario. What's the worst thing that could happen. ChannelAdvisor could go under, it could be a terrible environment. It could be like, I'd have to leave for some reason, because it just wasn't the right fit. What's the worst thing that can happen.

And I even felt like the worst thing that happened is I could end up backwards, you know, start where I started. You know, I tried to leave with great relationships. And so the worst thing that could happen was not so bad. It wasn't that bad. So why not? So why not? So why not so good. All right. Well, that was beautiful.

I love it. Now that we get a picture of just the vast experience, and then you talked about the customer experience. You also talked about the community that you had with your people, your departments, your organizations, that you've led. So you're a people person you're also customer person. So you're the perfect person to ask this question, but what are you seeing?

Everybody's trying to do an analysis right now on burnout and great resignation and all the words that surround it. We know that the numbers are pretty off the charts right now that folks are tired. And they're burnout. You talked a little bit about that. Is that, are you sensing that, is it at the crisis that we think it is?

You see it in an organization, the people that you lead or even in your peers. So just maybe let's just put a let's start there. Is it real? Is it happening? I think it's real. And I think, gosh, we could talk about this for hours. I think so one of my responsibilities was business continent. During the last couple of years.

So who knew when I joined ChannelAdvisor and then became COO that I would, there would be a pandemic. And then I would be responsible for taking a company of 907 countries and, you know, moving us from the office to work from home and creating a remote first culture. Implementing programs to create stamina and maintain connection with each other when suddenly we didn't see each other every day.

So I think that first year, especially when it's there's fear and there was people were dying and their family members were affected and there were. People who had support systems that now had disappeared. Mothers were at home with their little kids running around and we had to normalize that that was okay.

That we're just going to do our best and get through this time. So I think the pandemic created this environment where. We kind of banded together and we hunkered down and we focused on family. We hung onto our work, right. It was something we knew it was comforting. It was something we could do. And so at that first year, while there was so much fear and there was some isolation, especially for our single folks, it was harder for them.

I think in some ways, many ways like we, the team kind of came together and for our business. Sometimes there are silver linings, right? We work in e-commerce. So our job is to help businesses get their products online and reach more customers. Well, during a pandemic, when nobody could shop at a store, every brand needed a way to reach consumers on that as hard business blew up.

And so we had more work to do. Then we had ever had before and we were working in this whole new way. So we have. This sort of accelerating of workloads. We actually made a lot of investment in this time. So we were on-boarding people. I think we onboard 300 people we'd never met before. You know, we grew our company during this time.

So there was this whole, like banding together. We were very successful and then it kept going. And it kept going, right? I mean, the pandemic is sort of opening up now it's getting a little more normal, but, but the whole way we work has changed. Yes. And I think we're not, it's not settled yet. So within, so what are we seeing?

Yeah, we implemented, so we started opening our offices. We implemented a flexibility policy because what we learned about ourselves and what our employees learned about themselves. Not only could we work from home effectively and be every bit as successful as we had in the past. There were lots of things we all like to know.

I do not like to work out, but I know I need to work out. And when suddenly I don't have to commute, I work out here we go. So there's a beautiful benefit to having that additional flexibility, not having a drive, not having to, you know, we normalized, you know, what was workwear and, you know, we normalized coming to work in athletic gear.

Like we normalize all kinds of things that created, you know, flexibility. So there were things about it. The way we were working that we left and we didn't want to lose that. So we implemented a flexible work policy, but what that meant was, you know, we sort of lost this face to face connection and the relationships with each other, and we lost the boundaries.

Between our work and our home and our lives. And so we found that many people were working more because it was just easy to walk into the other room and send that additional email that I've been thinking about instead of parking it and thinking I'll just do it tomorrow. We found that people were working more, they weren't separating.

This small group of people they were interacting with, but not enough, not that many, not getting out, not traveling, not going to the office, not, you know, just that last at the biology of human connection, I think contributed to it. So we saw people getting tired, people getting burned out and like, so signs of that.

I mean, there's a woman that I work with who is immensely talented. She's driven, amazing transformation work at our company. And there got to a point where she I'd be like, Hey, can we get this done? And she'd be like, yeah. And then nothing would have. And I check in and I'd be like, what's going on? And, and the response I would get would be strange.

It would be, oh yeah, I just, I know I need to get that done. I just have blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I can't get, you know what, and, and, and it's, it was burnout, right? There's been so much for so long that was carried that that much can't be done in the future. Right. So I think that we went from this period where it was positive at connecting and that it became more than we can handle.

And then. I think we haven't hit the stride yet, if you know what I mean, like in terms of the lasting effects of the pandemic and what's going to happen next. And I think that that sort of signs of burnout is leading to, you know, I hate the words, the great resignation, but the great talent swap is what I like that.

You know, people, if you're, if you're onboarded in a company that you've never met anybody and everybody is a zoom tile, What prevents you from swapping that set of zoom tiles for another set of zoom tiles to do some other kind of work, you know, there's less of that connection. So we've certainly seen kind of a return to mobility.

You know, we saw lower attrition rates than we'd ever seen before during the first 18 months of the pandemic. And we've kind of gone back to normal and maybe even a little higher than normal, right. We're seeing people choose to make change now. And I think some of that is. The pandemic added to all the things yes.

And created a level of burnout. That's driving the need to change something. Yeah. So I'm hearing a couple of things. One, I really appreciate the example you gave. Delayed deliverables as was trying to summarize it. How does it show up? I think, I think, you know, I even illustrated it at the beginning about just being fatigued and, you know, we're, we're kind of distracted and we're running at a, this like crazy pace.

The other thing though, is that. And when you run a marathon at the end, you're tired. And what we're saying, you had a really long nap, but a big meal, all the things are refueling, a refilling, right? And so, like, I it's like I'm connecting these dots as we're talking, you know, the pandemic or just the, this new normal, or all of those cliche.

There's no end that there's no 26 point. How many, what is it? My, as my 6.2, there's no twice explained to you that to point to, and you had to keep running. So your example of your team member, who was like, oh yeah, we'll get to that. She's just like, I'm just kind of tired. I know. I feel like when's the next milestone because I know I'm going to have to go even further and even further.

So I'm just going to slow it down a little. I have been talking about speeding everything up, but really the signs of burnout is when we start to slow. Down, we can't perform at the level that we used to. And was that level even fair or normal or sustain or sustainable? I think too, in the, before, you know, world, we had opportunities to recharge and for about 18 months, We couldn't travel the way we used to.

We can take a vacation. We couldn't, for a lot of people, they couldn't go to a restaurant. They didn't feel comfortable. And so that's real, you know, and we're really encouraging people now about time off and, you know, along weekend isn't enough. Like when you're working at the pace, we tend to work now and in the way we work.

It's gotta be a hard recharge. You know, you need that consecutive seven day, you know, full week or more, you know, sort of unplugging to kind of recharge the batteries and people didn't have that outlet, so sure you didn't work, but you're selling your house. There was no going go. I mean, we started renting Airbnb area so we could just go work somewhere else.

So at least we're looking at four different walls. Right. And I did the same thing, you know, just cause I think this time was special because that rate and pace of things. Our ability to step away our ability to connect with people, to make it better, our ability to take a vacation. Like those things were taken away from us at a time when the work changed and our work March with our lives.

It just got to be a lot. Yeah. You know? Yeah. This is good. This is good. I'm unpacking sort of the why, which in a slightly new way for me. So it's helping me to think about the, what sort of the, what to do. So I'm curious on the what on your side. I mean, you've, you admittedly said that last transition you were experiencing a little bit of burnout.

And you also shared that the new role at channel advisor energies, words like energized you and you said change. And so I do think that that's the connection between the great swap channel squash, whatever is that people just need a change. That's kind of perking them up. It's giving them a charge, right?

It doesn't mean that's a fix. It's just a way it's just an option. So I'm curious. Now that you're happy. You, you loving your role. You're thriving. You're, you're doing all the things. Are you feeling a little bit of burnout? And, and if you, if you say, yeah, I get to that point, but what are you doing to sort of like tamp it down?

Like, how do you address. Personally. Yeah. You know, and I think this is it, it becomes on the, you become cognizant of sort of over time. But I think over the last couple of years, because we even felt the need to talk about stamina openly at work, but we all sort of felt something and, and burnout personally for me manifests itself.

And if you, in a few ways, I'm not very patient. But I get super impatient when I'm overextended. So when I start to not ask the probing questions and the coaching questions and my questions start to have a little bite to them, I'm getting less patient. And I can pick up on that pretty quickly when I get, when I'm less reasonable, right.

When it comes to deadlines and are we achieving things? And when I, when I'm giving less grace, I realized that when I get more demanding, I realized that it's because. In my life, I have less control and it gets kind of, that's how it manifests itself. I also get. Just less tolerant of all the things, you know, I have teenage children, they have a lot going on.

Sometimes they do all the right things. Sometimes there's some challenges there and, and my ability to deal with that be supportive, helpful changes based on how overwhelmed I feel and how much I feel like is on my plate. I can tell when I'm not as present, I'm not as helpful. I'm a little less patient, you know, I'm more mean mommy, then, you know, then I know, right.

That it's a little out of balance and, and it's taken me some maturing to figure out how to combat it. So I've learned through the last couple of years that I really need people. And so I would have told you, you know, I need my family that I value time with my family beforehand. But what I now realize is that I need.

Human connection. And so for me, that means, you know, we started to have monthly executive dinners. There were voluntary and it was just a chance for the 10 of us to get together, socialize, connect as humans and just stay connected. We started doing once the off soap and we started doing, we have Monday.

Meetings where we talk about the business. Whenever we started doing that in person, and that really helped, like we still don't work in the office every day, but all being together for a couple of hours has really changed and fed, you know, it fills my bucket, right. So when I meet and see people fills my bucket, so that's one thing and the needing of people to sort of re-energize me extends to.

I have very close girlfriends and I can tell when I need them. Oh, wow. Right. So I can be like, I haven't seen my besties and I need my best days. And so that's what we call each other. So, you know, we at least once a week go for a long walk or meet and have dinner or have drinks or something. And I didn't always do that when my children were young and life is crazy, it would go weeks.

And I wouldn't see that. And now we just sort of know that at this point we need each other and we fill each other's buckets and we help each other solve our problems. And so we prioritize that now, and it might not be every week, but it's at least two times a month. And it feels that helps. I also as mentioned, I hate exercise.

I have learned that if I don't do it. The world gets a little crazier and I think it's all about the things, you know, you're burning, you're, you're creating endorphins, you're burning calories. You're just doing something else that requires your mind to be focused and it's reenergizing. And then the last thing I would say is I've just learned that if I don't take.

Every three to four months, I get crusty. Right. And so we really are purposeful about, it's gotta be at least a five day weekend or a long week away. Like we really have to re-energize I guess the last thing would be, I try to purposely create something that takes me away from work. Okay. Give me an example.

So my daughter's 15 she's in the marching band. She's in the color guard. And so I decided to be the color guard, mom, of course she did. And people are like, well, you're crazy. You're going to executive your, how do you have time for that? And I was like, well, I'm either never going to see her, or I'm going to go to where she is.

Because she's already there and I'm going to participate in that. And if she lets me do that, I'm going to, and it's, it's not that much time. So, and I just carved it out. And so just force myself to be somewhere else for a period of time and do that because otherwise I'd probably feel like. So, you know, create is really getting energized.

So, so that's what I do and it, and it works most of the time. I still get a little crusty, take a vacation. Yeah, no, I get that vacation. It's kind of nice to be like, oh, it's that time? So we need a five day somewhere where we going. Believes. Yeah, that sounds good. Um, I don't care if we're just going down the screen and North Carolina, just somewhere.

I love that. I really, particularly as, I don't hear that often the advice you gave at the. You said, I just want to reiterate, and then my folks are going to be like we heard or just, okay, let's listen. This is my job is to emphasize the points, but I want to emphasize that you said I go, she. You know, that's the way you looked at it.

And I really appreciated that because you said either I don't see her or I'll, I'll find reasons to work late or do the things or prioritize my work, or I can create, create those opportunities and go where she's already going to be. So it's a win-win right. You get to spend that time and create memories, you know, as a mom, it really like hit me.

I love that. I think that's really special. And I know we have one moms who listen, so that's a way to approach it and to really good. And I think a healthy way to think about it too. So thank you. Yeah, thank you. Well, we're going to wrap this thing up. I've enjoyed this. This is really good. So great advice and some really interesting insights on your journey, but also how you look at it.

I want to talk about advice now to our folks. And I always label my listeners. This is probably the wrong thing to do, but ambitious driven, high performing high achieving. It's probably what projecting of my highlight of the beetle, what I hoped I, what I hope to be. Right. But we do have one. On here executives.

We have CEOs of nonprofits, national national MEF executives across the country. Have you listened to this podcast? And we also have early career folks, mid career folks who are looking for that next they're doing what you did, right. They're moving along their professional journey. So what advice would you give them?

This can be on anything. It could be on burnout. It could just be as a woman. It could be whatever. I mean, you have so much lived experience. What are you thinking about and what do you want to leave our folks? There's probably a couple of things, a couple of my habits. So I, I mentor young up and coming women a lot and purposefully because there was not enough of us that make it across the chasm and get to senior leadership levels.

And we know that companies have better results if they have diverse leadership and diverse boards. So we need more women to get across the line. So I think about this a lot. So I think. The first piece of advice I have is you already have a seat at the table, use it. So I have people all the time who say, well, I need permission to speak.

I need permission to act. I need no, you were hired to do a job. It's your responsibility to do a job. You have a seat at the table and use it. Yes, don't be. Don't wait for your boss to give you an opening, no state your kit. You know, like I w I've been told from early in my career that when I walk in a room, my own room and I never understood what that meant, and this is what it means.

It means raise your voice, do your job. Don't wait for an invitation. All right. So that's the biggest thing don't you don't need to be invited. You already have the habit, just use it to write. So that's probably number one. The second thing I think. The intentional about your support system? I have not been able to achieve the things I've been able to achieve personally about myself, right.

And my husband and I, we chose to live away from my family. So I grew up in Illinois. My family is a little bit scattered, but the center is still. So I have no family here locally. And so we created a family right through what we call our village and you don't go through it alone. So first of all, my partner in crime and my husband and my village of family and friends and neighbors.

And even at work, the support system of what are you going to like, there are so many years when we had a little kids who were sick and somebody had to go do and somebody had to step away. And so how do you create the ability for you to not be there for a little while that takes intention, right? I mean, we map out our careers.

I want this job. I want that experience. I want this degree, right? Your support system needs that level of intention. Otherwise you're not going to make it. I mean, and I tell people just don't get ahead of. Like one hour at a time, it's fine. If that's what you need to do today. Right. And looking at next week's calendar.

Like there's no need to get through today and do it next step. That's right. 20th stuff. Don't worry about that strategic plan. Like let's worry about getting through today, set up challenges. So, you know, I think the support system, especially for women, we have so many rules. Yeah, so many people we take care of in addition to ourselves, in addition to our career, that is.

It takes work. So I think that's important. Stay in the game. I love that, but I wrote it down earlier, stay in the game. I have had super talented women who are my friends and peers opt out and they opted out because they were sure they couldn't, they didn't know, they couldn't, they were afraid. They couldn't.

And so they opted out and I took seven months off with each of my kids. You can take three years off with you. You can do whatever. Right. But. You can do everything you choose to do. If you have the right support system in your life to get it done and opting out if that is what you want to do, please do that underwrite.

But don't opt out because you thought you couldn't handle it. Yeah. You know, taken on. And then if you decide that was a bad idea, then opt out. Right. But opt out after, you know, not because you were afraid to try. There's the unknown and self limitation. I think we talked about this a couple of weeks ago, making the decision to limit yourself before you've even before you've tried, because you're afraid that is, I think that's tragic, honestly.

Like I see too many women decide they just can't and they decided that they didn't experience that. And we're losing too many talented women. I think. Because of that. So staying in the game, I just want more of us to get to the end. I think that's it. Maybe the last thing would be. Learn your own signs of burnout.

Um, so there's a little self audit, you know, learn your cause. I had to sell, you asked me these questions and I had to think about that. What are my signs of burnout? And I was, and then I really had to articulate them. And so what are your signs? And then what feels, you know, I don't even know where that quote came from, but what fills your bucket?

Right? What reenergizes you, what refuels you. And then do those things that people always, you know, I think we talk about self care and that's what we mean. Like, and I talk about self care. I think that's indulgent. I don't have time for that, but that's what this, this, what gives you energy? What refuels you figure out what it is, and then try to do it more often than you did.

Guests a little self-reflection goes a long way. I'm a big believer in it. It's very hard to do because we do see it as a luxury and think about ourselves and think about what drought drove us today. If people like, well, write it all down. Like I don't have time to write down my day or what, how I feel about things.

But we do know ourselves. We just haven't maybe can reconnect. We haven't connected with ourselves in this time, this unique time in awhile, or maybe, maybe ever, you know, because we do see it as kind of a luxury to have an audit, but you'll never, if burnout is affecting your family, your friends, your work, your life, your, your energy, then it's gotten to a point where you have no choice.

But to take those few minutes. So it was at that hour, that weekend to do that self reflection. And you said it best staying in the game. What's at stake. Here is the possibilities of the future. What's at stake. Here is your life. What will you do next? And you're making we are, we, I should say, not you, not the collective universal you, but we are making decisions right now out of that depletion.

We're making decisions out of that depletion and you just put a fine point on it, which could mean you take yourself out of the game. And that means you're taking yourself out of an unknown future. That could be amazing. Could be remarkable, could impact the world. Could impact change your family's dynamic because why?

Because we're not taking the moment in time to do that. That could take just a few hours and a little self-correction to pour back into ourselves, to, to give the world our best. It's really incredible. Just the opportunity that we have at this time to, to shift well, and this whole concept of staying in the game, like I think about when I mentored young people know, they worried about.

But I don't know if I can take time off. I'm going to miss the chance at this time. The other, I don't know if I can take, you know, there are so worried about what's going to happen in the next six months or if they're going to get behind or if they're going to, sometimes they can't, the concept just doesn't make any sense to them.

I've been working 30 years and there's no stop. And now, right. There's going to be another 10 or 15. And as long as the brain is still functioning right, then, then my intention is to keep doing something fulfilling. So it's a long game. Yeah. So it doesn't mean you can't take a hike. I mean, you can't have seven months off with each baby.

Doesn't mean you can't change your career and maybe go side, you know, lateral for a little bit before you move forward. Again, like staying in the game can mean a number of things and it can mean reinvention. Right? What you talked about earlier, you know, certainly, maybe not even intentionally that's happened to me several times and.

Just not opting out, I think is the most, the biggest thing I would leave everyone with. I love that. I think that's exactly right. So. On that note. I want to say, I get why your folks said we need more Segovia DNA. I get that now I totally get it. And I appreciate you sort of giving us an insight, a window into what that, what that really means and how that shows up for you on a daily basis.

And I know life is busy. It's got its ups and downs and challenges, and every day is different and new, but the, what you left us today on, on this podcast. Pretty strong. I mean, concrete one observation so that we can reflect on ourselves about what it is. It gives some good tools there, but then also some insights on how we can attack this thing.

Right. Because it's not going away. The pace is changing. We have to adjust and change it for ourselves. And if we lead with nothing else, stay in the game, don't count yourself out. Don't count yourself out. Thank you so much for joining us. Thank you for having me. Yeah. Thanks friends for riding along on today's re-invention road trip.

If you like, what you heard, tell a friend and leave us a review. I know seems like a little thing, but it is so important to see if we're on the right track. You can find the show notes@jesaverhart.com forward slash. And don't forget to join the re-invention road trip by signing up for our newsletter, where I share behind the scene details and nuggets that you won't hear on the show.

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