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Sherrie's episode on Psalm 23
What happens when the path you were walking suddenly disappears, and you find yourself in a freefall of sorrow and pain? In response to unexpected loss, Sherrie Pilkington, founder of the podcast 'Finding God in Our Pain,' embarked on a journey to discover God's message in her darkness. Sherrie shares her story of loss and subsequent healing, the inspiration behind her podcast, and the experiences of others who've walked a similar path.
Throughout her journey, Sherrie discovered the tenderness with which God shepherds us in our darkest hours, providing comfort, guidance, and peace. Using the metaphor of a shepherd and their sheep, she sheds light on how God gently guides us through the valley of the shadow of death. We examine Psalm 23 with her, reflecting on God's unending faithfulness and His enduring goodness and mercy.
In the midst of our suffering, God's presence serves as a beacon of hope that can transform our lives. Sherrie discusses her ongoing journey as a widow and how the awareness of God's presence has helped her face the future fearlessly. Her experience offers a testament to the healing power of God, rewriting lies and dismantling fears even in our darkest moments. Sherrie's story, filled with wisdom and insight, promises comfort and inspiration to all navigating the choppy waters of loss and pain.
You ARE:
SEEN KNOWN HEARD LOVED VALUED
Subscribe/Follow
Contact Amy
Sherrie's episode on Psalm 23
What happens when the path you were walking suddenly disappears, and you find yourself in a freefall of sorrow and pain? In response to unexpected loss, Sherrie Pilkington, founder of the podcast 'Finding God in Our Pain,' embarked on a journey to discover God's message in her darkness. Sherrie shares her story of loss and subsequent healing, the inspiration behind her podcast, and the experiences of others who've walked a similar path.
Throughout her journey, Sherrie discovered the tenderness with which God shepherds us in our darkest hours, providing comfort, guidance, and peace. Using the metaphor of a shepherd and their sheep, she sheds light on how God gently guides us through the valley of the shadow of death. We examine Psalm 23 with her, reflecting on God's unending faithfulness and His enduring goodness and mercy.
In the midst of our suffering, God's presence serves as a beacon of hope that can transform our lives. Sherrie discusses her ongoing journey as a widow and how the awareness of God's presence has helped her face the future fearlessly. Her experience offers a testament to the healing power of God, rewriting lies and dismantling fears even in our darkest moments. Sherrie's story, filled with wisdom and insight, promises comfort and inspiration to all navigating the choppy waters of loss and pain.
You ARE:
SEEN KNOWN HEARD LOVED VALUED
I knew that God was with me, but after this valley, after him caring for me, tending to me, loving on me, giving me encouragement for the next breath, the next step, the next, you know, a hope and a new tomorrow. That was his presence, and the power of knowing that I was not alone is everything.
Speaker 2:["The Last Song of the Year"]. Hey everybody and welcome back to the Wednesdays with Watson podcast. We are in summer of 2023 and we are in season five. This is our 102nd episode.
Speaker 2:I still can hardly believe that If you are not subscribed to the podcast, I would love it if you do that right now, wherever you are in your app, just hit subscribe or follow so that when we drop a new episode, you can find it. Well, guys, we are on our fourth episode in our Summer in Song series, and I am so excited about this. This is an idea that I stole from my church. Summer is a time when people are traveling, and so series often get messed in churches and on podcasts and things like that, and so we wanted to create a season where you could just listen to any one episode and having not needed to listen to the one prior to it or after it. So today, today, I am bringing back a friend of mine, a fellow podcaster. She has a podcast called Finding God in your Pain. I would love to welcome back my friend all the way from Virginia Beach, virginia, sherry Felkentine. Welcome, sherry. Back to the Wednesdays with Watson Podcast.
Speaker 1:Hey, amy, thank you so much for bringing me back. I love your ministry, I love your message, I love your heart, so to be a part of this is a blessing to me, thank you.
Speaker 2:We'll go right back at you and Sherry, you are a supporter of the podcast and actually are a reason why somebody got a counseling session just last week, as a matter of fact, and so we are so grateful for you. Well, sherry was on the podcast before, and so we're not going to retell her story today. We will. I will let her give you the nickel tour before we start on her favorite song, but I want you to go back and listen to that episode, which I will link in the show notes, because it itself, it by itself, is a rich conversation about why Sherry picked the song that she gave us today, and so we're going to start with her. You know, her nickel tour, if you will, of the genesis of your podcast, sherry, all the things, and then we will dive into your favorite song. So tell us why the Lord is your shepherd my friend.
Speaker 1:I'm just still tickled about the nickel tour. I don't think I've heard that I like that idea.
Speaker 2:Hey, that's a dad McGowan thing actually.
Speaker 1:Okay, I guess so. So the reason that I even have a podcast called Finding God and Our Pain is because that's exactly what I had to do when I unexpectedly lost my husband, whom I'd been together. He and I had been together for a little over 33 years, so in that unexpected loss, I was devastated, just leveled. I had never experienced anything like that before, and so I began to question God. I had a relationship with God, but now everything was thrown up into the air. If you will and you know, a lot of people think how will I ever put it back together? I was thinking how will I ever find the pieces and then try to put them back together? And so engaging the heart of God through this process of my very dark valley is where I learned that God speaks beautiful things in the dark, and you'll hear me say that often now. The reason I decided on a podcast, though, too, as part of the redemption story, because I believe that part of our redemption is that when we turn around and extend our hand to someone else who is going through either what you've been through or similar to that, and so it was because people would come and share their stories with me, and I believe that God did that strategically. If I was struggling with something, for instance, guilt or regret, or the common things that come along with loss, then God would send someone to me, a woman, and she would share her story with me about her situation.
Speaker 1:There was one in particular, a woman who, when I met her, she was my husband.
Speaker 1:She had gone to school with my husband, and so they reconnected, they introduced us you know, spouses together.
Speaker 1:She comes to me and tells me the story of how this husband the man that I know is not her first husband, it's her second husband, and the daughter that I have met is not his daughter that she had been married before and the baby was one week old. Her husband was not well and he had been to the hospital twice before, but they would send him home. So now the baby's one week old, she's sitting up at night with the baby, feeding the baby, and her husband says I'm calling the ambulance, I can't take this anymore, I think I'm dying, and so she's trying to get the baby straight. The ambulance comes, takes the husband so this is his third time that he is in the medical attention medical care professionals and he dies, and he died of meningitis like they missed it, and so this is her story. Like Sherry, this man was in professional medical care three times and they still did not understand what he had. They were. He was diagnosed after, like at the autopsy Autops yeah that they found out that he had that.
Speaker 2:So similar to you, like a lost, just L and O where.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I really I'm sorry, go ahead.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, I don't wanna cut you off.
Speaker 2:Oh well, I was just gonna say that I love where I know you're headed with that and that's, and I've often been heard to say, I wanna be a good steward of my pain because, like you, like in that situation, you can speak into her life, because you actually know what it's like to have lost somebody. So suddenly Now you didn't lose Larry to a medical malpractice situation, but still to me, I think that that is the gospel that is doing, that's doing life with people by just saying I understand.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like that pain in your gut. You know I understand yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you do. I'm sorry that you do.
Speaker 2:Right, and that's a powerful word to say to somebody, right, I'm sorry that you understand, or like, yeah, and but I just think that I think in that situation where somebody comes to you and or that, or the Lord puts that in your purview, you have to do something about that. You have to do something with your pain, right? And so was that. What made you think to start your podcast Was when that situation came on to your purview.
Speaker 1:It definitely had a very strong influence, because what she did for me in that moment was she healed my regrets and my my I don't know guilt about not getting my husband to the hospital because I knew it was gonna be an argument. When he told me he didn't feel good he doesn't ever not feel good I mean sorry, please edit that out, because that wasn't a true statement. He is always healthy. He didn't have a problem with being sick. So when he was sick, I should have known in the moment that something was more serious. But I knew it was gonna be an argument. I did trust him to take care of himself and to know when he should go to the doctors or, in that case, the hospital. But I didn't know it would be a hospital level. I thought it was gonna be, you know, like a doctor. So having her and others share different aspects of the story began to heal my heart. Somebody else said to me Sherry, you're not God.
Speaker 3:How are?
Speaker 1:you to know these things You're not.
Speaker 1:God, and so that was healing to me. So I thought if people have done this for me with their stories, then I can certainly do that through a podcast to help other people deal with various types of loss, because I think I've shared this with you. After going through what I went through, I understand there are many types of deaths. It's not just the death of a loved one, there's many types the death of a marriage, a friendship, a physical ability, finances, a home, a job. It could go on and on Anything that we hold near and dear to our heart. If we're separated from it, that's loss, that's grief, or at least it should be grief, right, because it'll wait for you if you don't.
Speaker 2:Boy, is that a dude? That's a whole podcast in itself. It'll wait for you if you don't. I'm glad you brought that up because so many people are hurting and you don't have to have my story or your story to be able to say, hey, I need some guidance, I need some rest, I need some peace. I need to know that something's going to stick in my life, because it's during those times of loss where you are as many of my listeners know, and you and I talked about right before we came on we lost a giant in my life about. I guess it's been two months ago today, as a matter of fact. And when that happens, when those dark times happen, we've got one of two choices we can either find our shepherd or we can fall off the cliff. And even if we fall off the cliff, he's there.
Speaker 2:But you picked Psalm 23 today and I want to talk with you about that and what the Lord gave you in turn and as it pertains to your grief journey and your journey of helping other people, because you yourself got behind you the microphone on your own podcast and curated an unbelievable episode on Psalm 23. And so I'm going to link that in the show notes, because there's no way we can cover it all, and I'm really interested too to see like the time has gone by since you recorded it before and now, and like what did? What else has the Lord downloaded for you and what will he download for me as you and I talk about it? And so what I'd like to do is, if you don't mind, read Psalm 23 for us and then, and then we will go from there.
Speaker 1:And I will do. The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want he maketh me lie down in green pastures. He leadeth me beside still waters. He restoreth my soul. He leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his namesake, yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for thou art with me, thy rod and thy staff, they comfort me. Thou prepares to table before me in the presence of my enemies. Thou anointest my head with oil. My cup runneth over. Surely, goodness and mercy and I love to say God's goodness and mercy, surely your goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life and I will dwell in the house of the Lord forever, still gives me chills. I don't know, it's such a common verse, but it's so foundational in the walk of faith.
Speaker 2:Just the Lord has just really been working on me, on his faithfulness and this, surely goodness and mercy will follow you. And I think of that song CC Winans is made so famous on the goodness of God, and can't you hear her voice go? Your goodness is running after it's running after, it's running after me. This is just such a comforting song, and so what I'd love to do is, first of all, let's talk about sheep just for a second. One of my favorite subjects are sheep. I just saw Renee Brown and I tried to find it before the interview, but she just talked about when she went to Israel, some things that she learned about sheep.
Speaker 2:But first of all, the funniest thing to me about sheep and why they need a shepherd is because they are the dumbest animals on the planet. Now, there might be some dumber animals, but they're pretty easy to find. There are some dumber animals, but they're pretty. They're not, they're not smart, but they, they want to be with their friends when they're hurt. But when they are hurt, they will just lay down and give up, and that's why we see in the parable and I know it's in Luke's Gospel, where we see Jesus telling the parable about the shepherd. That leaves the 99 to find the one, because the one, when wounded and hurt, will just quit.
Speaker 2:And so it's so fascinating to me when I think of that that way and we think of what happens then in real life, like Renee Brown was saying, in Israel, what happens is they go find the one and God does that for us and he comes and he reaches down into the pits of our despair, like we're getting ready to talk about when you, when God gave you this Psalm for for your pain and your healing with Larry's death, he reaches down for us as the good shepherd, the one that will find us, because we're hurt and we fall down and we don't get up and we don't take care of ourselves and we don't do any of the things that we need to do. And so that first verse the Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want. And the second verse he makes me lie down in the green pastures, he leads me beside the quiet waters, he restores my soul. Tell me what lands for you on those two verses.
Speaker 1:When I think about the way that God does shepherd us, because the shepherd, you know, he's to care for his sheep and they're valuable and they're precious to him. And I love the point that you made that when we are prone to giving up in the midst of deep loss, of deep pain, and God does come to us, and that's exactly what he did for me. He met me in that valley and the beauty of of his presence and that's probably the biggest thing that I took away I knew that God was with me. I'm a believer. The word says God will never leave you. I believe that God will never leave me, but I now know that God will never leave me. And I think I may have shared this with you before, because it's an analogy I like to use. But you know, if somebody says to you, mike Tyson hits hard.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah look at the man he's got lethal hands and he's either punching somebody or maybe biting somebody, I don't know, but either way he's very powerful. But let him hit you and then you know that Mike Tyson hits hard. So that's the difference.
Speaker 1:I knew that God was with me, but after this valley, after him caring for me, tending to me, loving on me, giving me encouragement for the next breath, the next step, the next, you know, a hope in a new tomorrow, that was his presence and the power of knowing that I was not alone is everything. So, really, god's presence is the only thing that I ask for now, in situations, because it's what sustained me, even when I didn't have the answers to my questions. It's what healed me, because he would engage my pain, he would disarm me, or disarm the lies, the fears that I, that I, that attach themselves to you when you're going through that, because Satan attaches themselves to our traumas and then he likes to use them against us. When I think about the first verse of you know, I do not want, I shall not want, god provided for me in a way that for things that I didn't even know I was going to need.
Speaker 1:Yeah didn't know. I didn't know Larry was going to pass, didn't have any clue that I was going to need certain things, but God had already put my relationship in place with people who then delivered on my needs. How amazing is that. And then that green pasture. You know, god gives us these physical descriptions that reveal his spiritual nature, and so that green pasture to me is a safe place, and it was a safe place to struggle well with God.
Speaker 2:Okay, that's a bit of a might drop, just for a second to struggle well with God. So I want us to get the picture in our head. He makes me to lie down in green pastures and then he leaves me beside quiet waters and that looks different for everybody. But he makes us lay down into green pastures like sheep do when they're hurt. And then what a beautiful picture.
Speaker 2:To struggle well, because the way when I close my eyes and I think of struggling well, I think of Exodus 1414. And then we'll fight your battles. For you, you'd be still. Or a verse that we all know, psalm 4610, which most of us have memorized be still and know that I am God. It's also in the Christian Standard Bible. Can be translated stop fighting. So did the restoration of your soul look like that in those green pastures where you stopped fighting? And talk to me a little bit more about that. Struggling well, because we go into verse three where it says he guides us into the house of righteousness for his name's sake. And then you, and then you were walking through the valley, the shadow of death, fearing no evil. Talk to us a little bit about that. So you're struggling well in the, in the green pasture which, when you think about the green pastures and that in that geographical area, very green, very lush, very low right, and so there were nutrients and all the things, but it was dark yeah and there's that for me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for me, that lush green pasture is God's nature and his character. It is something that we have access to, even though I was in a very dark valley, yeah, and so it is something that we have immediate access to at any moment of any time, of any place. We could be in a Jail cell and a dirt floor in a third-world country I think that's the example I used in my audio but so this is a the farthest Conception of comfort, but we can be there and have access to that lush green pasture. We engage the heart of God and we know that his presence, like we Invite and enjoy his presence. But I think it also speaks of the fact that God, in his beauty, interrupts the, the evil of this world. Like we can still have that lush green pasture in the midst of a very dark valley. It's that, yeah.
Speaker 1:Paradox yes, who God is that he interrupts?
Speaker 3:Evil he.
Speaker 1:He is not afraid to go into the pierced, stand in it and walk in it with you and guide you out. And the beauty of that is he knows his way out of that valley. He's been there before. He had his own death on the cross and his father turned his back on him until his wrath was satisfied and so he had. He knows that dark valley and so he can lead us out of there.
Speaker 1:I'm trying to remember now, in this valley of being in God's presence, in his nature, the struggling well with him Meant that I could ask my raw questions. I could take the scripture that I know about him and question him. So I have a framework to question him with. And now I'm saying where were you? Why didn't you care? Where did you even care? Who am I supposed to be now? So all of the deep pain and even deeper questions are happening in the safety of the screen pasture, in the pain and the the rawness of it all. But God never rejected me, he never turned his back on me, he never shamed me. It's as if he absorbed my pain and my questions. And so being able to ask those questions also set me up, because here's another predator that's in that valley, it's Satan hmm, every time that I had one of those painful questions for God, satan wanted me to Define God by my pain.
Speaker 1:He wanted me to take that painful moment and use it to now define all of who God is, to rewrite everything that he had done for me in the past. In the past, rewrite anything of his promises that he had for me in the future. But you need to define God by this moment, because he really let you down. He did not do what he should have done. If he loved you, if he's a good God, if he's a loving God, he don't love you because look what you're going through, look what you're feeling, look what the questions you have. They're real questions, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I want to answer them, as you were struggling. Well, in the valley, my listeners and I want to know, tell me a little bit about that thought thread. When, when Satan was peppering you with those answers or those, those accusations and this is, this, is, this is who your God is he took your husband. You're still in that green valley. You're still struggling. Well, the good Shepherd is right there. Talk to us about that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because it's his presence was allowing me to engage him. I never felt alone, and knowing you're not alone is huge, but the power of being able to ask those questions and be vulnerable and raw with God does set you up for an attack because, as we Mention.
Speaker 1:Satan's attaches himself. So I'm struggling well with God, but I'm giving God the opportunity to answer. He's bringing back songs, he's bringing back scripture. He's bringing back things, examples of my life, stones, if you will, memorial stones of things in my past that he's like this is what I've done, sherry. You're saying this about me, but do you remember this? Do you remember that? Here is my word, here are my promises. You know I'm not gonna let you down, I'm not gonna leave you because this is who I am, despite what you're going through.
Speaker 1:And so one of the reasons that I say that God speaks beautiful things in the dark is because when he would respond to me and I don't hear God's audible voice, I get a download of my spirit. That's the best way I can describe it. And he said something to me one time when I was saying you know, lord, who am I supposed to be now? I'm not a wife, I'm a widow. What does that even mean? And how am I supposed to fill that role? And he said to me spoken to my spirit, sherry, I don't care what this world tries to label you with, attached, you know, to you, tries to define you by you. Keep your eyes on me. I'm writing a much bigger love story with you as the individual I created you to be, you and me. You keep your eyes on me and so that was healing from a heart and the fact that, yeah, life does get hard and it does get painful, but and we are subject to our reality but that does not mean it's the truth, right, and that's really what I discovered is that and I liken it to that plane ride where you're in the clouds and you're in the thunderstorm and the weather's bad, the planes getting shook, you know a jostled, and the pilot is gonna change the location, he's gonna go higher up to get out of the storm and so when you come up through those clouds, the Sun is shining. So our reality is that there's a storm happening, but the truth is the Sun is always shining and in our instance, we can say the s? O? N is always shining.
Speaker 1:Because that's when I took my, what I believed, what I thought was true, and I took it to God and questioned him about it. He showed me, you know, gently and kindly, you know his spirit, he's so kind and he's so gentle. He showed me that they were lies. And, better than that, you know what he did. He peeled away the lies to show me there were fears Attached to my pain. And because here's another thing, and I don't know if this happens for everybody, but when and but, you know my past, you know my childhood, yeah, when Larry passed, all of this stuff that Satan has attached him to now is compounded and thrown on top of this situation abandonment, rejection and all of these things, that it's twisted as a hot tangled mess. But God gently, kindly, generously, untangles fear by fear by fear and tell you're down to the basic part of which is him.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and he does it in. So we're talking about that value, the shadow of death that you were in. Now, listeners, you don't have to like sherry led off with there are many deaths and so I Don't want you guys piece of now of this podcast because you're like I. Well, nobody died, well, a wait for a minute. But we're not necessarily talking about just physical death, that sherry story here today, but the death of a dream, a death of a friendship, the death of a job. You know I, no one got out of Sherry, no one got out of COVID without walking through the valley of the shadow of something. Nobody, nobody, not a person on this planet, got out of it. And so we're talking about that.
Speaker 2:And, as you're talking about it, I'm just envisioning you. I just I love you so much and we get in trouble when we're together. The one time we were together in Nashville, we probably need bail money next time. I'm kidding, just kidding, but I'm envisioning you and that struggle in, whatever it looks like for you A lot of times in these dark places. For me, dark slash light, right, it's a dark like you gotta go through to get through, and I'm just envisioning you in that green, lush valley and I'm visual, I'm a writer, so we know this, and so I can just envision you, sometimes even in the fetal position, and I can envision as God is downloading some of this stuff into your spirit, your muscles just kind of relaxing. And he's the good shepherd and as sheep do when they hurt, they just fall down and hope that somebody comes to help them. And so here you are in the valley of the shadow of death and you, and God is helping you, struggle.
Speaker 2:Well, I think of when you say struggle well, I think of Jacob and the wrestling with the angel, and I will not let go until you bless me. And it sounds like God gave you this unbelievable experience in your grief journey where you were in the valley, the lost sheep, the shepherd having left the 99 to find Sherry Pilkington in this time of your life to demonstrate the truth of Psalm 23. And we will continue. So I think the next person correct me if I'm wrong here that you probably want to talk about, because verse five does say you prepare a table before me in the presence of my enemies, you anoint my head with oil, my cup overflows. Any insight into that verse, or do you want me to read on to verse six. No, we can do that.
Speaker 1:Because what I think of when you say that is that this table prepared in the presence of my enemies. To me, what that meant, what I experienced, was this dismantling that God did of my lies and the beliefs that I had, and so, in my opinion, he's making Satan eat crow, if you will, while Satan's pulling and tugging, because the heart is the trophy here.
Speaker 1:Well, I should say the heart is what the reward is for the struggle between Satan and God my heart. And one sees my heart as a trophy, but the other one sees my heart as a treasure. And so, in this struggle between asking these raw questions and being very real with God and him dismantling it, that was the beauty of this table prepared for me in the presence of my enemy. He gave me life, he gave me his presence, he gave me truth, he rewrote lies, he dismantled fears, and so that was the beauty of that. Also, I felt like the quality of oil that he used and I know that's going to sound strange, but God is so odd, god is so opulent, he is extravagant and the oil that he used to pour over my mind, over my head, it was freedom.
Speaker 1:I mean, that's the best when the truth was introduced into these situations. Because I remember one time I was just peppering the Lord with all these painful questions and finally he said to me he was letting me go on and on and on, but finally he spoke into my spirit and he said kind of in a firm way Sherry, so he got my attention because I was just going on, sherry, some things simply belong to me, and so that just calmed me down at a moment, in the sense that I can just rest in him. I don't have I'm not God, right, I'm not God, I'm not going to figure this out but also what it did for me is he knew me better than I know myself. I wanted my husband back. That's what I was arguing about. I don't care what question.
Speaker 2:That's what this whole thing was about.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's what it was. I wanted my husband back, but I wasn't getting my husband back, and so he could have given me an answer, couldn't he? He could have. He's God. He's got an answer for every question I had. He could have given it to me, but what he knew, was that what I wanted? I could not have. And anything he told me, be it the truth or something to let you know how we tell our children things at certain ages, in order to.
Speaker 1:But I had no authority, no input, no control over any answer he gave me, so all that would have done was give me another target to chase with him, and he was like no more targets, sherry, no more chasing down these paths of unrighteousness, I'm going to just stop here, because you look at me, keep your eyes on me, I'm enough, I'm handling this, I'll take care of it, you rest. And so that was that, that oil, that quality of oil.
Speaker 2:I want to point out really quickly about the oil, because that's also a thing with sheep in the Middle East and it has a particular purpose. And, sherry, you were just telling me what that is. What is the purpose of the oil?
Speaker 1:I believe it is, and somebody can fact check me on this, but I believe it's because of flies or the mites that they get in their ears. There's a protection purpose for that on their head and their ears.
Speaker 2:I think that's how I remember it.
Speaker 2:So I just want to point out something really quickly and again, I'm just getting all these visuals of you in the Green Valley and walking through the valley, the shadow of death, and coming up through, and that's a great analogy of when you're in turbulence on a plane and it's just coming up to that mountaintop where you had this unbelievable experience with God.
Speaker 2:But let's talk about that oil for a second, and the quality of the oil that he used, like the good oil, like if you go back and I want you guys to do that it's going to be the very first link in the show notes. If you go back and listen to Sherry's solo episode on this, I was almost jealous when I hit end because I was like man, she had a Jacob experience with God in the valley of the shadow of death. And when we talk about the oil for protection because if it's protecting from mites or flies or whatever, I know you're correct in that and it's for protection the first thing that came to my mind when you said he used an extremely high quality oil was and man, was that oil Expensive?
Speaker 1:Yes, it was.
Speaker 2:Blood, that's right the bloodbots, the bloodbots presence of the good shepherd in these valleys and these shadows for us, and I just you know, and we're going to close with this last verse in a minute where we talk about how his goodness and mercy follows us. But I think that so many people out there right now and you mentioned that you kind of said these are the questions that Satan peppered. If you have a good God, why, why? Why, why all of this? And I don't know if you've heard Cory Asbury's new song Kind. I am really loving that.
Speaker 2:One of the lyrics is sometimes I wonder if he's still real and if he does, how does he choose who? He does and doesn't heal, and he and, and of course that some of the lyrics are sometimes marriages end, sometimes babies die, bad things happen, and and Cory Asbury goes on to say I've tried, you know, I fought with Jesus, I've declared holy wars, I've kicked down the doors, I've done all the things, but all I ever found him was kind. And the last lyric of the verse is and on that day that I wasn't there, I look up to the cross, on the darkest day of history, and I think that's what kindness cost. That's so good, sherri, was God kind to you when he took Larry.
Speaker 1:That is a good question because I could. My mind is going about three different directions on that, on how to answer that. God has been nothing but kind to me. The goodness and kindness of God is something that sounds very ordinary and plain, but it is extremely extravagantly deep when you start to experience things with him. God, there was kindness in what God did for me when he took Larry, because the truth is that there is every. In every situation of life, there is a beginning and an end. There are seasons to our lives and it's no reflection on us as individuals. When certain things stop and end, it's because it's God's kingdom calendar. So in between Larry's first breath and Larry's last breath, God gave him to me, shared him with me. So when he departed, it was not my responsibility in any way, shape or form for his beginning or his end. That's God's, and so God was kind to me to let me know Larry and to experience him in the way that I did. He was kind to share Larry with me and the children that we have and the life that he created.
Speaker 1:Larry was a very hard worker, and so God was kind to me in that I did not have to look for my husband. There are people who don't know where their loved ones are. I knew where he was. God was kind to me in the sense that I didn't hang on wondering if he was going to come back around. Would he survive, Would he recover, Would he have function? Would he have this? No, he was gone and there was no further question about hanging on and hanging on and hanging on. Was God kind to me? Yes, In so many different ways. The life that I'm living now is still a reflection of my husband's hard work and the way that God provided and set these things up. I have never known anything but the goodness and kindness of God.
Speaker 2:And listen, there's so much power I mean I got tears in my eyes there's so much power in hearing someone who has experienced such a dark night of the soul and most of us have experienced a dark night of the soul but Just like that song with that I just talked about, like he tells the story of all of us. Cory Asbury tells the story of all of us and and he gets to the end and it's like, at the end of it all, my good shepherd Died for me so that when, when, when trouble comes, when loss comes, when you go through your own dark Valley of the shadow of death, when you hopefully choose to struggle, well, that our good shepherd has left the 99 to find us. That's how much he loves us. Can you wrap your head around that? That's how much he loves us.
Speaker 1:I got a glimpse of it, I got a taste of it, but it is difficult to wrap your head around a Think. Even you would say this I don't know if I've ever ever asked you this specific question, but I don't think any of us would really choose the valleys that we walk through. But in that valley we learned things about God that we would not know about his nature and his character and his Extravagant love for us unless we were in that context. And so the beauty, this, this beauty that he gives us, even in the painful parts of this life, I Wouldn't trade for anything really yeah, I heard somebody say the other day and about what you just said, I wouldn't choose it, but I wouldn't change it.
Speaker 2:And for me it's because of what you just said. Is that, and first Corinthians, suffering produces this peculiar sense of glory, and I oftentimes am around people who have not necessarily suffered there's, they, just their, their time hasn't come yet and they don't have this Thing like you have about you this yeah, she's been in the valley, had some experiences with a good shepherd, and so I too would not choose it, but I would not change it. I am so grateful that it pushes me To know that the good shepherd is the only thing that will never leave me, will never forsake me. And Do I understand Evil? No, do I understand why babies die and marriages? And no, do I understand how he decides who he's going to heal and who he's not gonna heal? No, but I know that the good shepherd is sovereign, and I loved on your own podcast Some of the things that you said about this last verse.
Speaker 2:Surely, goodness and mercy will follow me all the days of my life and I will dwell in the house of the Lord forever. I'm single without a husband your widow. It's scary to be single in this world right now. It's scary to be single if you've been married. You guys were married over 30 years. Talk to us about how this first comforts you as as you were coming out of that valley and from struggling. Well, and Just what does that mean to you?
Speaker 1:You know it's not saying that everything is gonna be wonderful and painless for the rest of my days. Experiencing peace doesn't Mean you have no problems, because peace is the presence of God and and again I forget just reiterate that we have access to that at any time of any moment, in any situation, any season and any circumstance. We have access to peace because of who God is, because of his intimacy, because of the blood on the cross broke down that barrier for us To know him and to have access to that. So I feel like when, when we shift our focus from our own problems and on to God, at first and foremost, it shifts our focus. But secondly, now we're we're thinking about you know who he is, what he can do, how he rewrites things, and redemption is guaranteed when we give him our pain. And so, while I am single and it is a still a strange thing to be because, well, I'm a widow am I single?
Speaker 2:and I right. Which box do you check on those forms? Yeah, yes, I'm the same. Am I divorced or am I a widow, because I was divorced but then he died Between them, I right, yeah and so it's just a weird spot to be in.
Speaker 1:But I do know, because of what God did for me in that valley, because I understand that his presence is everything. I do not fear tomorrow. Do I get upset about things sometimes, yes, or I'm worried about my kids, about, for particular, my grandkids. I mean, my gosh, this world is unstable and Violent and evil to a new level that I've never known, and so things like that, yes, get under my skin, but I take it and I turn it toward God and I say this is what my heart is struggling with. Lord, can you comfort me in this? And he always does through his word, through a song, through a friend. It's a beautiful process of relationship with God. And so, even when COVID came around, because of what God did for me in that valley, I was like, well, you know, we're all leaving here on a vehicle, right? If mine's COVID, so be it, like I can't fight it. If it's that it, and if it's not COVID, then he's gonna get me through. And I've had COVID three times and he's gotten me through all three times.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's just something so calming about your presence, like you, like you talk to people as as podcasters, and you know I've, you know I just dropped last Wednesday my hundredth episode and I would say 75, maybe, maybe, let's say 60 of those, thank you. By the way, whoo-hoo, 100 episodes, that was a big deal, but I would say 75 of them were, were were interviews with, with other people, and you can always tell when someone has had a radical Experience with the good shepherd in the places that no one talks about.
Speaker 2:And you're a perfect example of that well, thank you, but I'm talking about you. I have met you one time and I remember seeing you at the thing in Nashville, at the whatever that place. We were Whiskey Joe bar thingy, my Bob and I just remember and then I saw you on the bus and and you just had this presence Exuding off of you, like I'm one of the ones that gets it. Now, I'm not saying you get it all the time, nor am I trying to put a big old bullseye on you, but Suffering produces something in us that, if we let it, we'll do something amazing For the kingdom. And you mentioned the kingdom calendar and I absolutely love that. I'm going to going to steal it because I think that we think that God has to do things on our calendar and by our plans, and when that doesn't happen, we land in these spots. But, but, but.
Speaker 2:People like you, who have been through so much suffering, is the epitome of this verse that I want to read in Romans 12, 12?. Be joyful in hope, patient and affliction, faithful in prayer. And that's you, sherry, and it's because you made the decision to struggle well, in the green pastures and.
Speaker 2:If there's anything I want listeners out there to get is that this is not just a God of sherry and Amy. This is the God of the universe and he is looking for you, lost sheep, and when he finds you, or if he spawned you, like the Lauren dagl song says, look up my child. And I just Encourage anyone out there, under the sound of our voices, to know that you do not have to go through this alone. Sure, I have spent a hundred and two episodes now trying to get the hope of Jesus across on this platform and you know how, what a journey that is. Sometimes three people listen, sometimes, you know, 3000 listen. And During this journey, one thing has become abundantly clear to me, because I tried, in the middle of this journey I tried, let me see if I can create a podcast for people who aren't necessarily looking for God to be. The answer had nothing. Some of the most least listened to episodes I have so much. So, sherry, I believe this with my whole heart that he is our only hope To get through this light, to get through this day. They get through this moment. But I'm writing my dissertation on the crisis of faith and trauma. There's only one answer To help us get through the wiles of the enemy, and that that table that set up the presence of our enemy and our big enemy the insane Do you have?
Speaker 2:I just feel like this has been such a tender time and I hope that listeners out there who have experienced their dark night I hope that if they have, if they're, if they're hanging out up on that mountaintop just because they don't want to go down to the hard, let me tell you, bad things happen on the mountaintop Lightning strikes, you get burnt, scorched, all the things. The nourishment sometimes is in the hard. If that is you today and just encourage you to lean into the hard. And, sherry, one of the things that we focus on on this podcast is counseling. Just did a fundraiser and so we have a little bit of money to to give people. So if that's you out there today, hit that contact Amy button, have a whole process that we use for that. But you got to go to the hard, you got to struggle well, and so, sherry, I always give the mic to you last, my guest last. What would you like to say to our listeners?
Speaker 1:A good shepherd. One of his jobs as a shepherd is to move the sheep down out of the hill country before the weather becomes extreme and they will not survive. And he's willing to go down into that valley with you because it is safer. He has control over every environment that now I'm talking about. God is the good shepherd, and so the intimacy in the valley, the beauty, the friendship that you discover in those dark places there's no price tag to that. I don't understand how any of us can avoid the pain of this life, but to know that you're not alone, to know the extravagance and the beauty of God in the painful places I'm speechless and trying to describe exactly what that means to the heart for endurance, for healing, for redemption.
Speaker 2:And I'm the same like I'm sitting across looking at you thinking how would I answer this question? And it's just like I've mentioned the lyrics of this song before too. Bebo Norman has a song is when your faith is hard to find, you can borrow mine and so borrow ours today, try it, call out to God and see what happens. What do you have to lose, listener, whether you're a Christian who has known him your whole life or you just stumbled around this podcast and wondering what this is all about? Turn around and just say God, if you're there, can you help and watch what happens?
Speaker 2:Not promising it's going to be easy, because I have had my own times and I've even documented it on this podcast when I've hung out in the, in the Green Pastures with God, with Jesus, and I just picture him putting my hand in his and those nails, those scars in his hands, and then he was looking at me saying me too, me too.
Speaker 2:And so, guys, if you do not know Jesus as your personal savior, we would love to introduce you to him. So there will be many ways that you can do that. You'll be able to contact Sherry, you would contact me and I would love to tell you about the star of the story that we call on this podcast. So I said I was going to give you the last word. I'm really going to give you the last word now, because we both kind of landed in this speechless place about how hard it is to explain how, through such depths of pain, you can experience such a relation of the presence of the good shepherd God. So, for real, now you do get the last words to our listeners who are just looking to have the experience that you do.
Speaker 1:One of the beautiful things that I love about God is that when we ask him to heal us, when we invite him into our pain, when we struggle well with him, I discover that he does not put things back like they used to be. He builds new things based on who he is and heaven's value system, and I even talk about this in my podcast episode because it's so important. We get an opportunity to discover who God created us to be before we entered into a world of sin. I mean, he knit us together in our mothers, in each of our mothers' wounds, and put his likeness in us. He gave us his DNA. There are characteristics about us that match him. There's things about us that emulate him, but with sin and this world and the evil of this world and the limitations of the world, we're separated from that until we engage his heart in intimate relationship. And then now I'm on this journey to discover who is it that you created me to be?
Speaker 3:What are my?
Speaker 1:gifts and what are my talents. And I even say you know, if you're still looking for your gifts and your talents, the first place I say look is the place that you feel the most discredited and disqualified. And I know that may sound strange, but the reason I say that is because you better believe that if that's where God has gifted you, Satan has tried to kill it, steal it and destroy it before it ever came to light to you. So God's not afraid to go through the valley with you. Go there, Go there, join him and walk it out. It is not an easy process, it is not painless, but it is beautiful and it is healing and it is freedom, all because of who he is and his truth.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I felt like you were talking to me only there. Yeah, it is, it is not. It is difficult to describe the presence of God period, but particularly in the dark nights. Well, thank you for being here today. Everybody knows how I end my podcast because you matter.
Speaker 2:And so if you're listening to this and you're under the sound of my voice, you know what I'm going to say. We will be back here, though, before I say it, in two weeks with another one of my friends with another one of their favorite songs, and we are just hanging out all summer having conversations about the book of songs, and so I hope that you will come back and hit that like and subscribe button to help the podcast grow, but we leave all podcasts all Wednesdays with Watson podcast, by telling you and proclaiming over you that you are seen, you are known, you are heard, you are loved and you are so, so valued.
Speaker 3:And see you guys in two weeks, and I love you. And when my hope is fading, and when will he still assail me? I will remember how you you never failed me. You have pulled me out from the depths. You have saved me from certain death. You have shown Yourself faithful to me over and over Jesus. So let my life glorify you and teach me to walk beside you. I want to be more like you, so let my life be one marked by you, marked by you, marked by you.