Episode 120 with Roger Lovell shares the future of racing with the Lovell family

Roger Lovell, of Colorado Springs’ Lovell Racing, on the impact of racing on his family. Part of the duo of Roger and Brad, Roger has had some incredible experiences that are worth hearing about. Be sure to listen in and find out what’s in store for the future of this family. 

5:34 – stupid, little competitions

9:39 – the thing about engineering is it teaches you a different way to think

15:03 – that’s some of the joy of being young

19:01 – the highlight of my racing career 

27:23 – the Bronco is something that would compete with Jeep, but not replicate the Jeep

42:42 – it’s everything about a dirt road…

46:06 – we can recognize each other just by the driving style, or by the breathing

52:06 – “you’re not as bad as she said you were”

55:50 – what racing has done for me is really make me value family and value the relationships that I have

We want to thank our sponsors Maxxis Tires and 4Low Magazine.

www.maxxis.com

www.4lowmagazine.com 

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Transcript

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[00:00:06.370] - Big Rich Klein

Welcome to conversations with Big Rich. This is an interview style podcast. Those interviews are all involved in the offroad industry. Being involved, like all of my guests are, is a lifestyle, not just a job. I talk to competitive teams, racers, rock crawlers, business owners, employees, media and private park owners, men and women who have found their way into this exciting and addictive lifestyle. We discuss their personal history, struggles, successes, and reboots. We dive into what drives them to stay active and offroad. We all hope to shed some light on how to find a path into this world we live and love and call offroad.

[00:00:53.790] - Roger Lovell

Whether you're crawling the red rocks of Moab or hauling your toys to the trail, Maxxis has the tires you can trust for performance and durability. Four wheels or two? Maxxis tires are the choice of champions because they know that whether for work or play, for fun or competition, Maxxis tires deliver, choose Maxxis, tread victoriously.

[00:01:20.290] - Big Rich Klein

Have you seen 4low magazine yet? 4low magazine is a high quality, well written, four wheel drive focused magazine for the enthusiast market. If you still love the idea of a printed magazine, something to save and read at any time, 4Low is the magazine for you. 4Low cannot be found in stores, but you can have it delivered to your home or place of business. Visit 4lowmagazine.com to order your subscription today.

[00:01:47.170] - Big Rich Klein

On today's episode of Conversations with big Rich, we have Roger Lovell. You probably all know who Roger is, and if you don't, get your head out of the sand. That's Brad's older brother and part of Lovell racing, the guys that had some great news in the last week or two, and it's going to be really good to see you guys down in Vegas. I'm assuming you're going to come down to the induction dinner for ORMHOF, is that correct?

[00:02:14.010] - Roger Lovell

Wouldn't miss it.

[00:02:15.080] - Big Rich Klein

All right. So, Roger, thank you for coming on board and telling your side of the story.

[00:02:20.240] - Roger Lovell

Well, thanks, Rich, I appreciate the time.

[00:02:22.990] - Big Rich Klein

Let's start off some of the people that will hear this have not listened to your brother's podcast. So where were you born and raised?

[00:02:32.470] - Roger Lovell

I was born and raised in Colorado Springs, Colorado. Born in the same hospital as Brad and actually same hospital as my wife as well.

[00:02:40.830] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, wow.

[00:02:41.450] - Roger Lovell

Never left here.

[00:02:42.810] - Big Rich Klein

Never left. You left the hospital, of course.

[00:02:45.470] - Roger Lovell

Left the hospital, yeah.

[00:02:47.490] - Big Rich Klein

So what was it like growing up in Colorado Springs as a kid?

[00:02:53.050] - Roger Lovell

Well, it's changed an awful lot since I was a kid and it's grown an awful lot. Brad and I both went to the University of Wyoming college as engineers, and that's when I kind of at that point in my life, I really wanted to stay in Wyoming because I like people and I like the slower pace, but ended up where there's work and back in Colorado Springs. So it's been a lot of fun and I don't plan to go anywhere.

[00:03:17.480] - Big Rich Klein

Excellent. That's interesting. I have no desire to go back to my hometown, but that's the San Francisco bay area, too, so it's all overgrown.

[00:03:28.720] - Roger Lovell

Well, you got to leave to have that experience.

[00:03:32.250] - Big Rich Klein

Yes.

[00:03:32.730] - Roger Lovell

I guess I never really did that.

[00:03:34.930] - Big Rich Klein

Let's talk about those early days. And school and all that kind of stuff, the things that you did as a family. Because one of the things I'm really impressed. With Brad's story. And your story. And having met your families. Is that it is such a family. I mean, it seems like you guys are almost, like, joined at the hip at times, but I see nothing wrong with that. And it's great that you're able to do that. Let's talk about that.

[00:04:05.740] - Roger Lovell

Yeah. It is really neat. I got to give credit to our mom and dad. They raised us to respect family. And know how important family was. And that's something that Brad and I both carried on in our lives. But going all the way back, I was born born in colorado springs. And it was December. There was a nasty blizzard, and to get home from the hospital, I had to ride in the back seat of my dad's. I believe it was a 68 bronco at the time. So my true experience of four wheel drive. Started shortly after I was born. And coming home with blizzard. Growing up was a lot of fun. We started doing some camping and whatnot as a family. And every time we go camping, of course, my dad always had a Bronco. And brad and I would always try and convince him. To go do some of the hardest trails up in the colorado mountains. And as a dad now, I'm starting to understand it a little bit better. I prefer just to sit around the campfire and drink beer, but we were always pushing him to go out and do that stuff.

[00:05:10.280] - Roger Lovell

And it wasn't long before I got my first car, which was the wonderful bronco two. And, in fact, I still have it, but I've been working on it for 30 years. Because I just keep modifying it. And making it better and whatnot. Now it's a full blown close to a race car.

[00:05:33.150] 

Wow.

[00:05:34.140] - Roger Lovell

But we started doing that. I got my license first, and Brad got his license. But the interesting thing about Brad. Is when he got his license, he got an 88 ranger. And he didn't want anything to do with his truck. Or anything like that. He was just into flying model airplanes. I kind of went to him, like, do you realize how lucky you are? You've got this cool vehicle. You got to do some stuff with it. So we started going up camping. And then got involved. Our cousin mark had a jeep, and he's our older cousin. And we'd all go up camping. And we always shoot to find the hardest trails, most difficult trails we could do trails with a destination in Colorado, and we started going to Moab, and as brothers would have it, we start competing with each other a little bit, stupid little competitions, and then we ended up at supercrawl as spectators, and that just really lit the fire for Brad and I. And before the event was even over, we figured out that that was something that we wanted to do. That was 2002, I think. Maybe it was 2001, I can't remember, but it was in Farmington.

[00:06:50.490] - Roger Lovell

So on the way out of town, we bought a Dana 60 for the front of Brad's ranger. And we went home, and we started modifying it right away to turn his ranger into a rock crawler and go rock crawling. That ranger was the first ranger that we built, and every once in a while, it pops up for sale. And we had so many competitions and so much success with that thing that it's crazy that it was something that we just built in a little two car garage with a welder and a grinder, but it still pops up for sale, and the people who've had it have kept it in great shape. And you love seeing something like that, right?

[00:07:34.250] - Big Rich Klein

I think Jonas Burnett has that car now.

[00:07:37.210] - Roger Lovell

You're right. Yeah.

[00:07:39.770] - Big Rich Klein

And he restored it because when he got it, it was pretty beat on.

[00:07:44.810] - Roger Lovell

Well, I'm glad I didn't see those pictures.

[00:07:46.930] - Big Rich Klein

Right. But he's done a great job restoring it and bringing it back and competing in it, and it's still competitive. It's amazing that something that was built that long ago, you guys did a good job with that. So when you guys were younger and out camping and stuff like that, that's when you were younger kids, you weren't driving yet. But did you start with ATVs or motorcycles or just bicycles or what was the beginning?

[00:08:23.370] - Roger Lovell

Brad and I both did some mountain biking, but neither of us I guess it wasn't until after we got our licenses, we both had some dirt bikes. I had an ATV at one point in there, but mom wasn't too hot on ATVs and motorcycles, so I guess we kind of skip that phase of our lives and just went straight for four wheels and a V8 and then.

[00:08:48.500] - Big Rich Klein

Going to exploring some more of the schooling. If you guys both went to Wyoming for and that's in Laramie, correct?

[00:08:59.640] - Roger Lovell

Yes.

[00:09:00.200] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. By the way, I love that town. If I was going to live in a town in the mountains, that would be one of the places I might live. Except Wyoming. Wyoming is an Indian word for always windy.

[00:09:15.750] - Roger Lovell

That's very correct. Very windy and very cold in the winters.

[00:09:20.230] - Big Rich Klein

Yes, it is. But it's a beautiful town, and it just seems right. I mean, all the old buildings and everything. But what was school like if you guys I would imagine you guys were both pretty good if you went up there for engineering, that you had to have some good grades and stuff.

[00:09:39.450] - Roger Lovell

Yeah. I struggled a little bit my first year in college. My math scores, believe it or not, my math scores wouldn't where they should be. So it took me a little longer to get into the engineering program, and of course, I had some fun, maybe a little bit too much, like we all do. Yes. But I knew that I wanted to do something with engineering outside of the off road side of the world. I love construction, and I'm always building something, working with wood, doing that kind of thing. So building stuff has always fascinated me, and that's what a lot of my jobs were when I was in high school and whatnot framing and doing that kind of thing. So I wanted to be in engineering, and I don't really know I've never really found out why Brad kind of wanted to do engineering, but he's got a really good mind for it. I graduated from college, and I went on to get my license, and he just never really did. But it doesn't really matter, because he takes everything we both do. The thing about an engineering degree is it teaches you a different way to think, and it teaches you how to analyze pieces.

[00:10:54.580] - Roger Lovell

And in working with our sons, it's been really easy to explain how something works and then see them grasp the same concept. So whether you use it or not, you use it every day.

[00:11:09.850] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Yours was structural engineering?

[00:11:16.530] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, structural engineering.

[00:11:19.030] - Big Rich Klein

Because I know there's a million it seems like there's a million different engineering facets or whatever you want to call it.

[00:11:26.730] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, there are. And I figured I'd choose the one with the highest liability and the lowest pay. It made great sense at the time.

[00:11:39.810] - Big Rich Klein

And I know now that you're do you work for the county or the city?

[00:11:46.530] - Roger Lovell

I'm the building official for the building department. Not really the city, not really the county, but building officials probably the largest building department in Colorado. Okay, so that keeps me busy, right?

[00:12:01.090] - Big Rich Klein

I'd imagine so. Then let's talk about still in the school. Were there did you play sports at all, or was it more what did you do for extracurricular activities, you might say, besides the classroom stuff?

[00:12:18.410] - Roger Lovell

Rich, have you seen me run?

[00:12:20.320] - Big Rich Klein

No.

[00:12:22.170] - Roger Lovell

You see me run a little bit during competition.

[00:12:25.350] - Big Rich Klein

Well, that's that fear factor. I know that.

[00:12:27.720] - Roger Lovell

And that's only when I have to.

[00:12:29.100] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, flight. What I call fear flight. Yes.

[00:12:32.310] - Roger Lovell

No, I didn't play any sports in high school or in college. I don't really know why. I was kind of focused on my own thing, and I think the big part for me was and I can see it in my son, too, and I guess that's the best way to reflect on it. He comes home from school, and the first thing he does is he goes out to the shop. He starts working on his bronco. Well, that's what I was doing when I was that age, too. I get home from school, do my homework, and I'm out trying to figure out a way to put bigger tires on my Bronco or something like that. And quite frankly, in college, I think I just have to study more than most people. But I spent all my spare time studying and doing what I could there and then on weekends, obviously having plenty of fun that you shouldn't have.

[00:13:27.750] - Big Rich Klein

Right. I know all too well about that. I went to college, a private liberal arts college down in Santa Barbara. And even though it wasn't part of the UC system or anything like that, we spent a lot of time at UC Santa Barbara.

[00:13:44.850] - Roger Lovell

Yes. You touched on Laramie. In the winter it's really cold and it's really windy. There's not too much else to do other than drink beer. But I did have actually, it's kind of funny. I did have my dirt bike up there and it was a street legal dirt bike and my Bronco died on me and I was living off campus and the only way I could get back and forth to school was on my dirt bike in the winter. And I tell you, riding a dirt bike in twelve inches of snow or on snowpack roads, that's an experience that everybody should have. But a lot of the times on the weekend I just jump on my bike and head up towards Vedauwoo or go out and find some trails. That was obviously quite a while ago when it was a lot easier to access public lands and get out there and just do stuff.

[00:14:39.530] - Big Rich Klein

Right.

[00:14:40.490] - Roger Lovell

Some of my best memories what's that?

[00:14:42.890] - Big Rich Klein

I said we just did the Vedauwoo.

[00:14:46.290] - Roger Lovell

Yeah. That's a cool area.

[00:14:47.920] - Big Rich Klein

It really is. I'd like to put tire tracks on it, but I don't think they'd appreciate that.

[00:14:52.970] - Roger Lovell

Yes, they might not, but it's beautiful though.

[00:14:57.160] - Big Rich Klein

Yes. So anyway, you were able to access a lot of the public lands back then.

[00:15:03.240] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, I'd get out, find a way, just follow roads and I didn't have a cell phone. Not being smart. You don't have a cell phone? You just go out and ride all by yourself. And looking back, I don't think I even told anybody where I was going, but I didn't know where I was going either. And that's just some of the joy of being young and going out and doing those things and exploring and seeing where you end up and then trying to remember how to get back home. But great times. And I think looking back on some of that, that's what really kind of fostered my desire to stay continued and off road and it continues to evolve.

[00:15:48.690] - Big Rich Klein

Right. So are you racing or anything like that now? Occasionally. You said your car, your Bronco too, is pretty much a race car now. Are you racing it?

[00:16:05.460] - Roger Lovell

No, I'm not going to race that that's kind of a free runner type of thing. You remember Nick Sosha?

[00:16:14.060] - Big Rich Klein

Yes.

[00:16:14.960] - Roger Lovell

Who got hurt at a Rock Carlin event. And there was a raffle on Pirates, and we were right there at the event. My wife was there, and we were around it when it happened. So we jumped on the raffle, and I think I don't remember how much money we threw in, but we threw some money into the raffle, and one of the grand prizes was chassis. Well, actually, that was the grand prize. Well, she won it and she's not really the offroad type of person. Somehow I convinced her to let me have it and build that. And the trade off would be if I could build that, I would paint my Bronco pink. Well, my Broncos still hasn't been painted.

[00:17:02.680] 

Okay.

[00:17:02.990] - Roger Lovell

And it's not going to be painted, I'll tell you that. So I built that, and that kind of changed what I wanted to do with my Bronco. End of that car was when I raced it on Pike's Peak in 2011, and I had a really bad crash on Pikes Peak, and so that was the end of that car. So that changed the evolution of the Bronco again because we were having kids and we wanted four seats, and then my wife decided that she wanted a Jeep. So that changed the evolution of the Bronco again because we didn't need four seats. We had four seats.

[00:17:39.870] - Big Rich Klein

Right.

[00:17:40.340] - Roger Lovell

So it just keeps changing.

[00:17:44.170] - Big Rich Klein

Did you buy a pink Jeep?

[00:17:47.170] - Roger Lovell

No, it was a maroon colored Wrangler.

[00:17:50.010] - Big Rich Klein

Okay.

[00:17:52.870] - Roger Lovell

She wanted a convertible, but she wanted to be able to drive it in the winter. Well, at the time, that's the only option. Right.

[00:18:01.390] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. But she got what she wanted in the long run. Just not pink.

[00:18:06.030] - Roger Lovell

Just not pink. Okay.

[00:18:08.770] - Big Rich Klein

Because I know from experience that what they want in the long run somehow.

[00:18:14.970] - Roger Lovell

Has to work out somehow. But it works out the same way for us. Rich.

[00:18:19.720] - Big Rich Klein

Yes.

[00:18:20.070] - Roger Lovell

I'll always figure out a way to get what I want to put some more effort into it.

[00:18:24.720] - Big Rich Klein

Correct. Yeah. One of the things that Shelley brought to our relationship is, I guess, the self control. When I say, oh, man, I need to do this, she'll go, well, you can do that if you can find more sponsor money.

[00:18:42.260] - Roger Lovell

Right.

[00:18:42.600] - Big Rich Klein

Something like that. And I was like, okay, yeah, I.

[00:18:45.960] - Roger Lovell

Guess I got to do that first.

[00:18:47.570] - Big Rich Klein

Exactly. Where in the the old days, it was just like, okay, well, we'll figure it out later. Let's get what we need. So then where is the drive now with off road for you?

[00:19:01.690] - Roger Lovell

I think the drive for me, and it's changed in a couple of ways. I used to really get a kick out of being in the left seat and driving and or co driving. I think what I really enjoy now is the codriving piece of it, especially with I have a son who just well, actually, Brad and I both have sons. He has two. I have one. And all three of them got their license, their driver's license yesterday. So it's been a lot of fun kind of working with them and teaching them some stuff. And this year at the Mint 400, we entered a UTV, and the boys all have they've all raced before. They haven't driven in a race before. We race the Baja 502 times with them as co drivers, and Brad and I just figured, well, why not? Let's put them in the right seat or the left seat and see how they do. So I co drove the Mint 400 for all three boys, and I got to tell you, that was probably one of the highlights of my racing career, just to be there with those young minds that can do things that you had no idea.

[00:20:15.490] - Roger Lovell

I don't even know where they learned it or how they learned it, how they learned to pass, how they learned to run and dust. It was incredible. So that's kind of what I'm enjoying a little bit more right now. And work gets difficult. It's hard for me to get to every race and make all the events, but being involved with Ford in the new bronco program has been a highlight of my career as well.

[00:20:41.950] - Big Rich Klein

Right. How did that all play out?

[00:20:45.370] - Roger Lovell

Well, it's impossible to even count right now how many broncos that we own between our two families, but it's plenty of broncos. Some would say we have a bronco problem, and I think we probably do. But Brad and I've always loved broncos, and when there was starting to be some rumblings about Ford maybe reintroducing the Bronco, brad told me, he said, I got to be involved in that program. And he was dead serious, and he made some contacts. He talked to a couple of people, and he got involved in it, and he's been working on that program for about four years. And early on, he had this wild idea, I want to bring the Bronco back. I want to be part of that, and then I want to race them. And Ford listen. They listen so much to his input and to that of the entire offroad community, and that was really cool. BFGoodrich does a lot of that with their tires, too, with the development of tires. And it was the same type of thing that Ford did. So that kind of one thing leads to another, and then we're talking about figuring out a way to build a couple of 4600 to race in the stock class.

[00:22:11.410] - Big Rich Klein

And you guys did that this last koh, is that correct?

[00:22:15.880] - Roger Lovell

Yes, we debuted the first one, the first 4600 race bronco that we have. We debuted that last year, and then we raised it for the first time out at king of the hammers. This year, we took second place in the stock class and raced it a couple more times this year. It's phenomenal. It's so much fun to drive.

[00:22:41.350] - Big Rich Klein

And that's the framed vehicle, not that built off of the uni body. Bronco Sport, right?

[00:22:49.700] - Roger Lovell

Right. Nothing to do with a bronco sport. It's a true two door, Bronco body on frame, independent front suspension, solid axle, rear. And it was kind of our first other than UTV, it was our first venture into the ISS world. Well, I guess we have the spectrum, too, but two wheel drive and four wheel drive, two different worlds when it comes to independent suspension. And it's incredible what that thing will do in the desert. And eat up whoops. But then when you get it in the rocks, too, it's a short wheel base. It's on thirty five s. And quite honestly, I'd venture to say there's probably some places we can go on that thing that we would struggle with in our Ranger that we've competed with for 14 years, I think.

[00:23:41.750] - Big Rich Klein

Wow, that's surprising to hear. I always thought that the independent suspension, you have to drive them a lot different than a straight axle. Do you think that's correct?

[00:23:59.170] - Roger Lovell

Maybe a little bit in the rocks, but once you I don't know that you have to drive it any differently. I think maybe if you took a solid axle car and put independent on it, you would have to drive it differently, but you drive every vehicle differently. And I think that that's just part of the adjustment with learning the new vehicles. You're not smashing a diff where you're regularly smashing the diff, so you can take some different lines that you normally wouldn't do. The Broncos is a little bit narrower than our Rangers, so we have to take different lines.

[00:24:35.950] - Big Rich Klein

True. Okay. Because watching, like, the Ifs cars in the 4400 class, at least, it appears to me that they're really not crawling, but they're like shoving the front end through the rocks.

[00:24:54.550] - Roger Lovell

They may be a little bit harder to crawl at slow, technical speeds. If I was doing something slow and technical, like a WE rock event, I don't think that independent front suspension would be the way to go. So there is probably a bit of a trade off in the rocks versus the desert. But the difference that it makes in the desert just eclipses what you lose in the rocks. And I think that as we continue to evolve technology and shock tuning, and some of the lifestyle of stuff Fox is doing, that we can really get that suspension dialed in for a lot better performance on the rocks. But it's already great. A lot of it comes down to driver, too, and the driver just really being confident in the truck and knowing how it works and where it's going to get traction and where it's not.

[00:25:48.600] - Big Rich Klein

Right. So one of the things that I thought that everybody bagged on the release of the Bronco, especially Jeep owners and Toyota owners.

[00:25:59.960] - Roger Lovell

Oh, yeah.

[00:26:01.690] - Big Rich Klein

But they were comparing the Jeeps to the S, to the sport, the unibody. And it was like, come on, people. That's like one of the patriots or something. Jeep patriot or little renegade or something like that. And then when they finally came out with the body on frame, the full size Bronco or the two door Bronco, four door Bronco, they kind of carried over. Well, people were still trying to compare it as if it was an S, one of the sports.

[00:26:39.770] - Roger Lovell

Right.

[00:26:40.850] - Big Rich Klein

I don't think that was fair.

[00:26:43.550] - Roger Lovell

Well, I think if you look back on everything that happened, Ford, they introduced the sport right before Covid hit, and they actually delayed the release of the Bronco. When Covid hit, I think they were supposed to release it at the Detroit auto show, and that got canceled or postponed. So the release of the Bronco was postponed, and then everybody thinks, well, the Bronco sport is the Bronco. So I think it was just a matter of not good timing all around.

[00:27:18.830] - Big Rich Klein

I get that. Yeah, I figured the same thing.

[00:27:23.330] - Roger Lovell

But it is a different vehicle. The Bronco isn't. What Ford wanted to do was build something that would compete with Jeep but not replicate the Jeep, something that drives a little bit better, have some better on road manners, and and can still do a whole lot of stuff offroad and do it better than the Jeep. In my experience of driving a Jeep, and jeeps are incredibly capable. I love the rubicon that we had, but I would trade it hands down for a bronco.

[00:27:56.870] - Big Rich Klein

Okay, well, I'm a Ford fan in the fact that the raptor. I have a gen one, and I tell everybody it's my forever truck. I will have until somebody wrecks it runs into me and totals it, and then God help them if that ever happens.

[00:28:20.030] - Roger Lovell

I've got a gen one as well, and it sits in the garage most of the time. And unfortunately, due to some unforeseen circumstances, my wife is driving it right now while we get her car fixed. But it's like watching your kid leave. That's my baby.

[00:28:37.560] - Big Rich Klein

I drive mine so much, I bought it from Josh Jackson, the Springs. That black one. He had the Tuxedo black, and it had 50,000 miles on it. And I bought it just under three years ago. It sat for probably about four months now of the three years that I've owned it, and it now has 190,000 miles on it.

[00:29:03.000] - Roger Lovell

Does it really? Wow.

[00:29:04.400] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah.

[00:29:04.760] - Roger Lovell

Wow.

[00:29:05.490] - Big Rich Klein

And it's not easy miles.

[00:29:08.270] - Roger Lovell

No, they never are. They never are.

[00:29:11.520] - Big Rich Klein

Not with us.

[00:29:13.070] - Roger Lovell

No truck is going to live a hard life. Yes.

[00:29:17.070] - Big Rich Klein

But it's okay. It's built for that. The thing has just been so solid. It's just amazed me when I hear when I read on the boards and everything about people having problems, I'm like, man, I don't know what they've done to theirs. So they have these problems or what was done before they owned them or whatever, but there's been, like, what I would call zero problems in this besides maintenance items.

[00:29:46.530] - Roger Lovell

Oh, yeah, you got to do the maintenance and anything is going to have problems. There's always going to be something, right? And I'm about as diehard a Ford guy as we get. I don't own anything other than anything other than Fords.

[00:30:03.730] - Big Rich Klein

I've never been vehicle specific. I've just always driven what was available or what I liked that particular moment. But like I said, this Raptor is going to be the forever Truck.

[00:30:17.930] - Roger Lovell

They can keep the you're hanging on that.

[00:30:20.100] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, they can keep the Gen two. They can keep the gen three. When I need to replace the 62, I'll figure out something that'll be faster.

[00:30:34.370] - Roger Lovell

That Raptor R, maybe. I kind of like the looks of that one.

[00:30:41.210] - Big Rich Klein

The lines are too harsh. They need to go back to that smoother lines. Like in the gen one. For me, the lines are just too harsh. They're softer than the Gen Two, but not enough.

[00:30:52.730] - Roger Lovell

I'd agree with that. But something about 700 HP that I like, too.

[00:30:57.390] - Big Rich Klein

Well, I'm thinking a Godzilla Motor 73 might just do the trick.

[00:31:06.810] - Roger Lovell

That would be a good replacement for the 62. Right.

[00:31:10.030] - Big Rich Klein

So then with working with the Bronco team, how did the input work? Did you guys test them out at each level or make recommendations beforehand?

[00:31:26.950] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, Brad was involved in almost all of that in the early on prototype testing and some of that. And with any vehicle like that, it evolves from different stages. And he can tell you all the stages. I wasn't too involved in a whole lot of that. I'd ask him questions and he couldn't even tell me. He had to sign a nondisclosure agreement. He wouldn't even tell his brother. But he was involved in the preproduction or the prototype to the preproduction and then into the durability testing. And in fact, this week, he's out in Johnson Valley doing more work with Ford on the Bronco and doing more Durability testing. So they continue even though it's in production now, they're continuing on on the next steps. And that's where the Bronco Raptor came from. Okay, what else can we do? And it's interesting how the input works, and that's kind of what you're asking, the input they'll ask for. You got a whole slew of engineers out there from every different facet drive line to suspension to every piece of the vehicle, and they all want specific feedback. And they got data all over the truck. And you're really just a test dummy in that case.

[00:32:48.440] - Roger Lovell

But they do want to hear what you think about it and how it performed in this case. In that case. And they'll take it back and do some tweaking here and tweaking there, and then go out and run it again. And in the Durability testing, they literally say, go break it. Go find the limit. That's pretty interesting, too, when you're. Challenged to go out and break something instead of challenged not to go out and break something.

[00:33:17.580] - Big Rich Klein

Like in a race situation, you want to say you have to finish.

[00:33:21.490] - Roger Lovell

I'm okay going across the finish line on three wheels.

[00:33:26.770] - Big Rich Klein

So then where do you think things are going to lead with the kids?

[00:33:37.850] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, it's a great question. I have a daughter, too, and you look at the differences between them, between all of the kids. And what I don't want to do is send them down a predetermined path. I want them to all be able to choose what they want to do. My daughter, she'll go to college. She wants to either be a baker or a marine biologist, kind of a wild range, but that's what she's got set now. Parker, my son, I don't even college might not be for him. It might not. If he doesn't want to go to college, he doesn't have to. But he wants to go build and work on trucks and build race trucks. He was on this year at Pikes peak. He was on the Reese millenn team working with a Porsche. And he's helped me out up there. I've been crew chiefing for another team up there for about five years, and he's been involved every year in that. He's working for my neighbor on his race car. And he can tig weld and fabricate just go ahead and say better than I can. So he's got a great mind for it.

[00:34:56.260] - Roger Lovell

And as far as where Brad's kids are heading, it's difficult to say, but they both have that same mindset of fabrication and hard work, good work ethic.

[00:35:08.910] - Big Rich Klein

Right.

[00:35:13.070] - Roger Lovell

I think there'll be some manner of motorsports involvement in the future.

[00:35:17.040] - Big Rich Klein

Great. Okay. Like to see a family tradition hang on there.

[00:35:21.420] - Roger Lovell

Yeah. Lovell racing Isn't going to die. No, we're not going to let that happen.

[00:35:26.140] - Big Rich Klein

Cool. Excellent. And what about personally for you? Your what are aspirations? What are the things that you want to see happen?

[00:35:40.090] - Roger Lovell

The racing is fun, and it's a great experience. I think part of maybe what I'm looking at right now is some of the been there, done that, and what's next. I remember years ago, Ron Stobaugh, we were doing really well in rock crawling, and he was kind of our first sponsor, and we're doing great in rock crawling. And I approached him the following year for some support, and he said, no, it's time for you guys to do something different. And forced us out of our comfort zone. And that's what got us into some of the XRRA and some of the desert stuff, as well as rock crawling. So reflecting back on that, I think that's some of what I need to do a little bit now, and that might be a little bit more of the expedition stuff. And I'm really concerned, as is Brad, about land use, about the future of our public lands and being able to access them and use them responsibly.

[00:36:44.450] - Big Rich Klein

Well, that's good to hear, because that's a big push that I don't know if I want to get back into the actual land use fight, but to make others aware that maybe have more energy to do that is a good role for me.

[00:37:06.110] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, I don't have much desire to get involved in the political side of it, that's for sure. But the education side of it and living in Colorado, even just going out and using it, I don't get out enough, so I need to do more of that.

[00:37:21.590] - Big Rich Klein

That's our next step with us is to do exploration runs, discovery runs, you might say. All these states have these have trails. There's like the Tat, the Trans American trail, and then there's the north south routes that do the same thing border to border. And those are the kind of things that I want to start doing and inviting people along that want to experience the same thing exactly as we pull away from the competitive side of it.

[00:37:52.190] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, I think that's probably somewhere where I'd like to go, and we're doing just a little boys trip next week where all three of our boys take their broncos, and Brad and I'll take ours and just go do some trails around Colorado and just see what we find.

[00:38:09.650] - Big Rich Klein

That's really cool. And did you do the trip from Colorado Springs to Moab?

[00:38:15.830] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, we've done that. I can't remember how many years we did that. Three or four times. And that's just such a fun thing to do. And you can drive you can drive down the interstate and miss everything in the world. You're not even going through the most beautiful parts of Colorado. But when you can slow down and take the long way back and just enjoy the scenery, you just see things and you experience things that you'll never see again. Right.

[00:38:45.220] - Big Rich Klein

I asked Brad for a download of what you guys the trip that we featured in the magazine, because I think that was just phenomenal to do things like that. That's the kind of stuff that I really want to do. I want to slow down. I see too much from the interstate.

[00:39:01.340] - Roger Lovell

Yes, exactly. So, yeah, that's more of what I'd like to do.

[00:39:10.530] - Big Rich Klein

When you've gone to Baja, have you had the time to enjoy it down there as well?

[00:39:20.530] - Roger Lovell

To a degree, yes. Rich, but not like I'd like to. I've done NORRA a number of times, and every time with NORRA, I get on a plane in Cabo and fly home. And so I missed the whole experience of coming back up. But the first year that we raised NORRA down there, we had some mechanical issues with the bronco. It turns out we could have fixed them, but we didn't know at the time we had some mechanical issues. About halfway down, we figured, well, let's just continue on down to Cabo. And it was just stopping on beaches here and there, and it was just such a great time. And seeing the beauty of Baja and really experiencing it for what it is, and NORRA is a great way to do that, but when you can slow down even more, Baja, it's untouched.

[00:40:10.930] - Big Rich Klein

It's still the Wild West.

[00:40:13.210] - Roger Lovell

Absolutely.

[00:40:14.040] - Big Rich Klein

And the people, for the most part, the people really appreciate us Americanos going down there and enjoying their country. As long as we're not assholes.

[00:40:27.080] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, exactly. Earlier this year, I guess it was in June, took a family trip up to Alaska, and we did 1300 miles in an RV and just experiencing Alaska for the first time. Man, that's the Wild West, too, in a big way.

[00:40:47.360] - Big Rich Klein

Yes.

[00:40:47.790] - Roger Lovell

So I got to get back up there. I venture to say if I discovered Alaska when I was a lot younger, but that could be where I would have ended up.

[00:40:58.090] - Big Rich Klein

Well, it's pretty similar to Colorado.

[00:41:02.050] - Roger Lovell

It is. It's probably just it's not as hot there as it is right now, that's for sure.

[00:41:06.060] - Big Rich Klein

Yes. We're suffering at almost 100 degrees here in the Western slope of the Sierra in Placerville as well.

[00:41:16.030] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, it's a hot one here. I can't be in the house today because we had the floors refinished, so I'm out hanging out in the garage with the dogs and the swamp cooler.

[00:41:28.090] - Big Rich Klein

Well, swamp coolers at least worked there. They don't work in Texas now. Humidity is already too high.

[00:41:34.770] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, it works out all right here.

[00:41:37.570] - Big Rich Klein

So let's talk about Brad and actually, I think the family's induction into Ormhof because Ormhof is something and this is the Off Road Motor Sports Hall of Fame is really dear to my heart. I think it's an organization that every enthusiast needs to get involved with, and it's as easy as being a member at $25 a year. But I think that's my other goal is, besides doing social things, is to really push the Motorsports Hall of Fame, because it's not just about racers or drivers. It's about business people. It's about advocates, it's about pioneers, it's about media. It's everything that we cherish. And off road, whether it's four wheel drive, motorcycle, ATVs, UTVs, young and old, it recognizes all of that.

[00:42:42.340] - Roger Lovell

It's everything about a dirt road. And then that's what I love about it. And it doesn't just celebrate the people who've been successful in off road. It celebrates what off road is and why it's important and why we need to continue to recreate and keep the things that we have.

[00:43:09.950] - Big Rich Klein

And Brad got voted in on the first year that an application was put in.

[00:43:17.930] - Roger Lovell

This was actually his third year.

[00:43:19.520] - Big Rich Klein

Third year, okay. Yeah. I wasn't sure how that went with him. I'm not sure with Lance either, but I know a lot of them rarely get in on the first time.

[00:43:35.030] - Roger Lovell

Well, you just got to keep trying. And even if, you know it's a long shot, you got to try. It's kind of like a race. You might have qualified last, you might have crashed in qualifying. Who knows? But you still got to go out there and push hard and try and win and make it successful, and sometimes the racing god shined down on you. And I was just elated the fact that Brad was nominated or that he was inducted and that he made it. I couldn't be more proud of him. He lives offroad. The thing about Brad is he lives offroad not just racing, but offroad every day. It's what he lives and breathes, and he doesn't know anything else. Literally, I don't think he knows anything else.

[00:44:24.570] - Big Rich Klein

Right. He's totally immersed.

[00:44:27.410] - Roger Lovell

Yeah. He was trying to build a shop, and he asked me some of the simplest questions. It's like, yeah, you're really into this off road thing because you forgot everything you learned in engineering school.

[00:44:46.610] - Big Rich Klein

So, what was his engineering background? Or what's his engineering background? That was he structural, as well.

[00:44:55.490] - Roger Lovell

You figured that out? Yes. Kind of like two peas from a pod, right?

[00:45:00.710] - Big Rich Klein

I figured as much. Maybe.

[00:45:04.550] - Roger Lovell

You stole my notebooks or something. I don't know.

[00:45:09.870] - Big Rich Klein

So, then, did he always ask did he ask, okay, where's the cool places to hang out? Or did he come up and visit and get the experience?

[00:45:19.090] - Roger Lovell

Those I think he came up and visited and figured that out pretty quick. But it's neat because going back to college, not only were we there for a couple of years together, we also have a lot of the same friends and the same network out of college. So it's been great.

[00:45:43.810] - Big Rich Klein

It really amazes me how close you two guys are as brothers. I know that there can be a lot of competition, and you can build a lot of animosity in almost every group of brothers that I know, they get along, but not like you guys do.

[00:46:06.140] - Roger Lovell

Well, it's not all sunshine and roses. There are times where we have disagreements and see things differently, and eventually he'll come around and realize that I was right. But it's one of the things we just kind of always been doing the same thing together and goes back to the rock crawling days where all of a sudden, we are high tech. And we weren't yelling at each other. We had radios, and I could hear him as a spotter when he's getting ready for a big climb. I could hear him breathing hard, and knowing him, I knew what that meant. You can tell him, calm down, relax a little bit. And same thing in any one of the race vehicles that we have. We can recognize each other just by the driving style or by the breathing or by a movie, your hand or something, you know, that he's getting stressed or nervous. You don't usually have to tell Brad, push harder. But there are times where you can tell him, let's go. Let's move.

[00:47:16.970] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Interesting. And did he ever spot for you.

[00:47:24.410] - Roger Lovell

We tried it once or twice, did not work so well, at least in competition, because he always wants to be the driver, although he is when we'll go out and do recreational four wheeling. Yeah, he's the number one spotter that I'd want to have, and we've done plenty of that. But in competition, he's better behind the wheel.

[00:47:48.370] - Big Rich Klein

So you're saying you're actually a better spotter?

[00:47:51.240] - Roger Lovell

Well, I'll be honest, Rich, I would say I probably am a better spotter than he is, but he's probably a better driver than I am, too.

[00:47:59.930] - Big Rich Klein

Okay, fair enough.

[00:48:02.360] - Roger Lovell

Yeah.

[00:48:03.000] - Big Rich Klein

I've always said that the three parts of the team, the spotter was the most important. And the reason I said that is because you have to know what the capability of the vehicles, but you also need to know the fears or the tendencies that the driver has, what they like to do and not do.

[00:48:23.950] - Roger Lovell

Yeah. Whether it's a side hill or a big climb or downhill, the limitations of.

[00:48:30.010] - Big Rich Klein

The driver or the capabilities of the vehicle.

[00:48:32.580] - Roger Lovell

Yes, exactly. 100%.

[00:48:36.890] - Big Rich Klein

So as the racing world goes and continues for Brad, you're more into the camping and the scenic wheeling, is that correct?

[00:48:48.740] - Roger Lovell

Well, that's what I really enjoy the most. It doesn't by any way mean that I'm going to step back from the racing side and any chance I get, I'm going to get in the race truck, whether it's left seat or right seat, because it's just one of those things that once it gets in your blood, you can't get rid of it. And it's like a drug, especially when things are going like they should be going. But what I really enjoy, especially about desert racing, is the adversity that you face out there. If you can finish a race without getting out of the truck. Once doesn't happen very often, but it's king of hammers when, as the co driver this year with the 4600, the amount of winching that we had to do and be prepared to do so it's the physical and mental side of that that really I really enjoy that. I'm not letting that go either.

[00:49:50.750] - Big Rich Klein

Good.

[00:49:51.340] - Roger Lovell

I just want to do more outside and off road and less stuff in the office.

[00:49:56.990] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Because the office is a have to.

[00:50:01.610] - Roger Lovell

The office is a half, too, and.

[00:50:04.440] - Big Rich Klein

The off road is a want to.

[00:50:07.790] - Roger Lovell

Yes, exactly.

[00:50:09.560] - Big Rich Klein

Sometimes the have to win over the what to, but ultimately the want to.

[00:50:15.590] - Roger Lovell

Is where we end up, and that's where I want to end up as I get closer to retirement.

[00:50:23.990] - Big Rich Klein

So do your daughter and your wife enjoy the off road or outdoors as well?

[00:50:30.080] - Roger Lovell

They love the outdoors, the Alaska trip, they absolutely love that. They're not much on the dust and dirt part of it. Right. But they do like to get out there and go camping as much as we can.

[00:50:44.990] - Big Rich Klein

That helps when you can do it as an entire family. I got lucky shelley had really no experience being offroad or out.

[00:50:58.830] - Roger Lovell

She doesn't mind getting dirty.

[00:51:00.400] - Big Rich Klein

No, she doesn't. And that's awesome. I found that out the first trip we took to Mexico and to Baja, and took her cross the goat trail from Mike's Rancho over to El Coyote.

[00:51:17.190] - Roger Lovell

Okay.

[00:51:17.740] - Big Rich Klein

And put her on the outside of that cliff road right on the edge, and just to see how she would go. And we get to the top, and she goes, well, did I pass the test?

[00:51:31.020] - Roger Lovell

Oh, nice.

[00:51:32.100] - Big Rich Klein

What test?

[00:51:33.810] - Roger Lovell

I don't know what you're talking about.

[00:51:35.480] - Big Rich Klein

Yes. She knew it right away, but she did. It was good.

[00:51:41.730] - Roger Lovell

You guys are great together.

[00:51:44.310] - Big Rich Klein

Explain your relationship. You guys went to school together, born in the same hospital?

[00:51:50.610] - Roger Lovell

Yes. At the time, there were only gosh, I think there were two, maybe three hospitals in town, so there wasn't a whole lot to choose from.

[00:52:00.210] - Big Rich Klein

And how did you meet your wife? I don't think you guys met in the hospital, right?

[00:52:06.270] - Roger Lovell

No, I didn't meet in the hospital. My wife and we went to school together. We didn't go to the same elementary school, but we went to the same junior high. And she will tell you that she didn't know who I was, but of course she did. I knew who she was, and we graduated from college. I was, at the time, dating her best friend for a couple of years, not fell apart, and we ended up getting together. So I remember saying, you're not as bad as she said you were. But the key word there is as bad. I got lucky. I got real lucky.

[00:52:51.620] - Big Rich Klein

That's awesome. I'm happy for you for that. That's for sure. So then, man, let's see. Have we missed anything that you want to talk about?

[00:53:05.140] - Roger Lovell

Do you want to talk about some.

[00:53:06.300] - Big Rich Klein

Of your experiences at competitions with your brother or driving your own or, like, the wreck on Pike's Peak?

[00:53:16.210] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, that was an interesting one, and that one really struck me personally. I've had so many memorable races and events in my career, but that one will always stick out because Pike's Peak was part dirt, part asphalt in 2011, so it makes it very difficult for that. Of course, I'm racing a four wheel drive, 35 shortcourse tires, and I've had a couple of issues in practice, and I was down about 40 HP as I was popping the alternator. But I had the course down, and I knew the course really well. And come race day, I had more horsepower. But in all the practice I've done, I didn't account for one thing, and that was spectators on the course, spectators lined on the sides of the course. So I lost my turning points and I lost my breaking points, and quite frankly, I got lost. And at the time, Pike's Peak was the first sanctioning body that I'd ever raced in that required a head and neck restraint. If they had not required a head and neck restraint. I'm convinced that I would have broken my neck on my back, and things could be drastically different today.

[00:54:37.390] - Roger Lovell

I took a really bad role. I didn't go off the road, but I tumbled it about 60 miles an hour down the road, and safety crew picked me up. I knew the safety guy, and he looks at me because he knows my insurance isn't going to cover a trip to the hospital and says, are you okay? I said yes, I am. He said, are you sure you're okay? I'm fine. So I got in the back of the safety truck, and I got out of the start line, and they'd already red flagged the race. And the first car lined up on the start line was brad. And brad sees me come down on the back of the safety truck. He knew they'd stop the race. And I look over the side, and there's my wife and my son standing there, and she had tears in her eyes. And it even brings tears to my eyes right now, thinking about how emotional that time was. But it just really makes you value everything that you have and how delicate life is and how important everyone is around us. And that was probably the most memorable racing experience that I've ever had.

[00:55:50.600] - Roger Lovell

But besides that, being down in nora, racing to 68 bronco that you built in your garage, that your dad used to have a 68, and you're sitting there driving down the beach, there's wild horses running on one side and waves crashing on the other, and you're spending that time with your brother, you can't buy those type of things. We lost our dad about 20 years ago, and we lost our mom last year, so it's hard to lose family. So what racing has done for me is really make me value family and value the relationships that I have. And the best friends that I have are people that I've met, people that you see one or two times a year, but you see them, and it's just great to hang out with them and have a beer.

[00:56:47.250] - Big Rich Klein

Right? Very well said. So then in rock crawling, you guys were pretty successful all the way across the board with different organizations, but who did you feel was your biggest competition and who you always had to watch out for?

[00:57:12.210] - Roger Lovell

Oh, wow. That's a great question. Rock crawling with Joachim and brian, they were kind of always the ones that we had to watch out for. They were always on top of their game and could pull lines off that we just look at and go, oh, my gosh, how did you even see that line? They were the ones that we were kind of always watching. Of course, there's always a handful of others, but Joachim, brian, they were forced to be reckoned with.

[00:57:50.090] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, they were a good team, that's for sure.

[00:57:53.820] - Roger Lovell

Yeah. And the fun thing about rock crawling is you can have a team like that. That is just absolutely phenomenal. And one little thing can go wrong. Just the tiniest little thing goes wrong, whether it's a twitch in the steering wheel or something like that. And all of a sudden you went from being in second place to first place or vice versa. That's one of the things about the rock crawling competitions that were always so fun. You just on the edge of your seat the whole time.

[00:58:27.410] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. I talked to Walker Evans one time and I said, okay, what's the difference? Feeling wise? Offroad racing and rock crawling? And he goes, well, rich in off road racing, you're sitting in line waiting for the green flag and you start getting nervous when you're about two cars away from the green flag and you got your adrenaline pumping for maybe the first five or ten minutes of the race course. And then after that, you just settle in until Dudu hits the fan and then you get another rush of adrenaline.

[00:59:13.530] - Roger Lovell

Yes.

[00:59:14.470] - Big Rich Klein

And he goes rock crawling. The adrenaline is there all day long. It's just in ten minutes spurts.

[00:59:22.850] - Roger Lovell

And learning to control it is hard.

[00:59:27.110] - Big Rich Klein

Right. And sticking to your game plan.

[00:59:30.050] - Roger Lovell

Yes, exactly. And knowing when to adapt your game plan. Okay, that line didn't work. Do we try it again or do we try and alter the line?

[00:59:45.470] - Big Rich Klein

Right, I see that a lot. Yeah, I see too many people. People follow the leader.

[00:59:52.370] - Roger Lovell

Yeah. And it's not about follow the leader.

[00:59:54.960] - Big Rich Klein

No, because everybody's car is different anyhow. I mean, even if everybody's driving a Jesse Haynes car, they're still going to be differences.

[01:00:04.310] - Roger Lovell

You're still going to follow it. Yeah, exactly.

[01:00:11.190] - Big Rich Klein

So then racing Baja with your brother, like you said in the Nora events, did you ever get a chance to do the 1000 with the BC cars?

[01:00:26.320] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, I've done the thousand in the BC cars, I think probably about six times.

[01:00:31.250] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, nice.

[01:00:32.790] - Roger Lovell

And that was probably what really got us probably going down to Baja and more interested in desert racing because we knew a lot about what we were doing, but we didn't know everything. And you get involved with some, like, minds that have some tips and tricks here and there. And it wasn't long before Brad and I figured, well, we could do this with our own program. We haven't taken on the $1,000 under our own program just because of the magnitude of the event and the number of people it takes and, quite frankly, dollars.

[01:01:13.430] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. Logistics and money.

[01:01:15.850] - Roger Lovell

Absolutely. Yeah.

[01:01:20.890] - Big Rich Klein

I know JT Taylor is pretty busy right now, but he used to work with your group, correct, on the short course.

[01:01:29.200] - Roger Lovell

Yeah, JT worked with us on the short course program for a number of years and he was a really good asset to have as a spotter. The thing about JT is he's not going to miss any words. You know what you're going to get if you were too slow up there, he's going to tell you it was really good working with him and we've been around JT a long time and know him well even prior to that, so it was a natural fit and it's fun to see him continue to further his career too, with everything off road.

[01:02:07.530] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, JT is a good guy. He's a good friend to have too. And like you said, as a friend, he's a straight shooter as well.

[01:02:15.790] - Roger Lovell

He is. And even when he's your friend, he will pull that knife on you and hold it at your neck just to make sure you know he's there.

[01:02:26.390] - Big Rich Klein

It's a nice way of putting it. Yeah. Well, Roger, is there anything else that we haven't hit on that you would like to discuss?

[01:02:35.570] - Roger Lovell

Well, I don't think I have anything else rich. I just like to thank you for your time and the opportunity and the recognition and wish you the best of success as well.

[01:02:46.140] - Big Rich Klein

Well, I appreciate that and wholeheartedly congratulations to the entire level plan for getting into the hall of Fame even though Brad's name is going to be the one on that page. It really is a group cause.

[01:03:05.870] - Roger Lovell

Well, it is, and I guess the way that I see it is just like anything else, it takes a team to make it happen, but you have to have a leader and Brad's that leader that made it happen and he's the driving factor behind all of it. So I have great respect for him as well as I'm incredibly proud and I don't know where he got it from, but he got it and he's good at it.

[01:03:36.160] - Big Rich Klein

Excellent. Well, I look forward Shelley and I look forward to seeing you guys and hanging out down there for the Omaha induction dinner and I'd like to encourage everybody to become an Armhof member. You can go on to the off road Motorsports Hall of Fame page and join and you get voting rights on the not voting rights on those that get actually inducted in. But there's a number of things that other things that you can be involved with and I really would appreciate it if everybody joined that. And Roger, thank you for competing with us over the years and being such a solid guy and having such a solid family and I'd like to say a friendship too. I know I've called you a couple of times when we were trying to get races going on down in Colorado Springs and you were really able to help out a lot and I really appreciate you stepping up and doing that.

[01:04:39.670] - Roger Lovell

Well, I'm only ever a phone call away, Rich, so don't ever hesitate.

[01:04:43.190] - Big Rich Klein

All right, I appreciate it and thank you for your time this day.

[01:04:47.380] - Roger Lovell

All right, buddy, we'll talk soon.

[01:04:48.920] - Big Rich Klein

Okay, thank you.

[01:04:50.020] - Roger Lovell

All right, bye bye.

[01:04:51.570] - Big Rich Klein

Well, that's another episode of Conversations with Big Rich. I'd like to thank you all for listening. If you could do us a favor and leave us a review on any podcast service that you happen to be listening on. Or send us an email or text message or Facebook message. And let me know any ideas that you have or if there's anybody that you have that you think would be a great guest. Please forward the contact information to me so that we can try to get them on. And always remember, live life to the fullest. Enjoying life is a must. Follow your dreams and live life with all the gusto you can't. Thank you.