Lasernut and Lasertown explained with guest, Cody Waggoner

No doubt you’ve already got the t-shirt….everyone I know has a Lasernut or Lasertown t-shirt – our next guest is famous for giving them away.  Please welcome Cody Waggoner to the show.  Cody brings his history of rockcrawling, the formation of Laserut and the building of Lasertown to the show this week, together with his plans for the future and an opportunity for you – the listener.

2:11 – Ugh, who’s dad didn’t do this??

7:27 – Applying for your last, best job at 18

11:48 – Where’s the road?

25:30 – The origin story for Lasernut

36:33 – the future of rockcrawling – who’s your driver?

42:36 – There’s no private property on the lakebed?  Or is there?

51:40 – an offer you shouldn’t refuse….

If you’re in the market for anything lasercut – from one part to 1,000,000 parts – contact Cody at Lasernut https://lasernut.com/

We want to thank our sponsors Maxxis Tires and 4Low Magazine.

www.maxxis.com

www.4lowmagazine.com 

Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.

Transcript

Big Rich Klein:   0:01
Welcome to the Big Rich show. This podcast will focus on conversations with friends and acquaintances within the four-wheel drive industry. Many of the people that I will be interviewing, you may know the name, you may know some of the history, but let's get in depth with these people and find out what truly makes them a four-wheel drive enthusiast. So now is the time to sit back, grab a cold one and enjoy our conversation. 

Big Rich Klein

Whether you're crawling the red rocks of Moab or hauling your toys to the trail. Maxxis has the tires you can trust for performance and durability. Four wheels or two Maxxis tires are the choice of champions because they know that whether for work, or play, for fun, or competition. Maxxis tires deliver. Choose Maxxis. Tread victoriously. 

Why should you read 4Low Magazine? Because 4Low Magazine is about your lifestyle. The four-wheel drive adventure lifestyle that we all enjoy, rock crawling, trail riding, event coverage, vehicle builds and do-it-yourself tech, all in a beautifully presented package. You won't find 4Low on the newsstand rack, so subscribe today and have it delivered to you. Welcome to the Big Rich show. Today's guest is none other than Cody Waggoner. So tell us about yourself, Cody. Where'd you grow up?
 
 Cody Waggoner:   1:28
I was born in Whittier, California, which is Orange County, Southern California. Whittier’s Aaout 15 miles from Disneyland. Have you ever been to Disneyland? Let's pretty much site by Disneyland. I I was born there. Let's see, we were lived in Ah, Yorba Linda. Yorba Linda is up right off the 91 Freeway and ah, small community. And I lived there til I was 15, from three to 15. I have a brother, Brian. He's 3.5 years younger than me. So it's just my brother and I pretty much back in the day. You know, uh, my dad would always work his ass off, you know, He started his company in 84. So that was when I was about eight years old and I never saw my dad. The only time I could actually see my dad was if I went to work, he would drag me to work on the weekends, and I cleaned the restrooms and washed the trucks and cars and vacuum and that's where I got my work ethic. My, my dad dragging me into work and working. I hated it. I would. I remember. On Saturday morning he would go in my room at 6:30 in the morning and he’d see if I'm awake and I would be awake, but I pretend I was asleep, so hopefully he would just go off to work. But, uh, back to that so grew up, had a great childhood, you know, we lived on a cul de sac. And I remember playing the kids and hide and go seek. It was a cool it was It was a lot different than it is today. But it was really cool being on the play with everyone. And, you know, Mom, Mom Oh, it's dinner time should come in. You have dinner as a family. That was really huge. We're a tight knit family and ah, my dad. He would always do things like, we used to have. Ah, an ATC’s, we had the three-wheel, ATC’s, we’d go out to Glamis, go to the washes, and then we went to the high desert and every that's where I kind of got into Wow, there's a desert out there. There's open land and you gotta put a helmet on and and go make some dust as they call it. And I really enjoyed that. And then we also went to the river and did a lot of a lot of boating. And then my dad got into ocean boating. We start going over to Catalina Island, which is right off the coast of Southern California, and did scuba diving and all that stuff. But when I was 15 my dad and mom being that they love the ocean and they had a boat down in the harbor. They bought a house down at the beach in San Clemente, so at 15 I moved down there went to  San Clemente high school pretty much turned into a surf bum. I my hair grew out in the middle of my back. I didn't have a job I actually used to wash cars was one of my first jobs, and I was going to own my own car washing mobile detail service  work when I want, don't need that much money. Just need enough for a surfboard and some surf wax and wet suit and go to the beach and surf. It didn't cost me anything. And I It was great exercise. And it was a pretty cool lifestyle. Until I met Lindsay. Our girls came in to the situation. or came into the picture, and, uh, you needed money, right? To be able to go out with the with the girlfriends. I met Lindsay in history class, I don't know what year I think I was a sophomore or junior. She sat right behind me, and I used to come in from surfing cause I had surf class back then and she used to comb my hair, surf in the morning down at San Clemente pier and then, uh, go off to school. Yeah, go to school. And that's where we met. And I've been with her ever since. You know, it's been a really, really, really good always, you know, highs and lows and good times and bad times. But we really make great a great partnership. Strive to, you know, keep the relationship going, and we love each other. And we have a family and all that. So back, to San Clemente. I hope I don't go all over the place. I'm sure I will.  I was a surf bum. Then I got a truck. I got a 1988 Toyota pickup truck. Well, you need gas, right? So now I need to make some money. And I didn't really want to work for my dad, cause that was like, I've been doing that my whole life. So I went down to Price Club, which is now Costco. And I applied and I got a job in the maintenance department, so I would clean the restrooms. I would empty the trash

Big Rich Klein:   5:47
All the things you did for your dad.

Cody Waggoner:   5:49
Yeah. All the things I did for my dad. I was really good at cleaning. I’m still good at cleaning. I love cleaning. So they had one of those, ah, machines that you push and it cleans the floor to make the floor's all nice and clean. Because that was another thing at my dad's shop, we would sweep. We’d put down this, this Clean Sweep down, and you would sweep the shop every time where it was. He was really meticulous about where the tools go. I always have a clean shop. Know what you got If you don't? If you haven't used something for six months. Throw it away. We're not one of, you know, where a lot of people they'll just hoard onto everything which works also, but it's always I've always been taught. If you don't use it, get rid of it. You know? So, um so back to Costco. And then Lindsay started working there and she worked in the bakery, and then I got promoted up to the meat department. So she was We were in the back of Price Club where she worked in the bakery, and I work in the meat department, and and, uh, you know, we have some fun. We’ll leave it at that. But to get that job, obviously, I had to cut my hair and, you know, look presentable and started working. And then I learned really quick about unions, which I knew nothing about. So, um, I I left Price Club and I was gonna do go back to the car washing and run my own company. But, you know, some days it would rain and there's all these variables on making money. So at 18, I think I was 18. After I graduated, I went and applied for a job in my dad's shop, Industrial Process Equipment. IPE and started at the bottom, you know, started. You know, he said he's like, Cody, you aren't going to get anything. You're gonna work your ass off from the bottom. And if you want to go to the top, you can or don't you know? So I was I did the shipping and receiving, driving around, cleaning vehicles, started at the bottom and worked my way up. And then one day he’s all, you know, you might want to learn how to do drafting. I’m like, what do you mean, you got Jay, he does drafting. Jay still works for us. The well, you know, it might be another step on moving up. OK, so I went to school to learn how to do CAD drafting. I hate school. My attention span just does not work with school. So I got behind the computer and learned it myself on how to make lines on a drawing and that turned into doing system layouts. Powder coat layouts in buildings. So I go to the customers, get all the dimensions, and lay the equipment into the facility and then that snowballed into doing, um, doing making the proposals. And then that snowballed into pretty much going out with my dad and selling the jobs for equipment. So I did that for a long time. Worked, you know, 12 hour days, six days a week? Pretty consistently, Um, never got paid a lot of money. It was mainly the way he always looked at it, as if you want to make money, you need to work hard and work long hours to make the money. Um And that that's another thing with with my dad is I learned about being consistent and not not overspending and always saving money and putting it in the bank. Don't ever live beyond our means. So, um, from there let's see. I moved out when I was 18. Also, Lindsay, um, she lived on the bluff and she had some money to be able to move out. So she moved out and we bought, She bought. She leased this 596 square foot apartment. It was $596, it was a dollar a square foot. So we moved up into the Whispering Winds in San Clemente and I was out of my own. My mom pretty much gave me the ultimatum that if you don't go to school because she wanted me to go to college, you need to pay. I'm like, Well, why? Why the hell would I paid you when I can move out and pay someone else and live on my own and do whatever I want. So I said, Okay, well, I'm out of here. I guess when I was 18 a lot of things happened, I moved out, And that's when my buddy Mike Edwards, who passed away last year, he, uh, he’s all, Cody, you really need to buy a jeep. Why would I buy a jeep? He's Ah. Well, it's a lot of fun. We go out to the desert, we go off roading, and I’m like, Okay, so for whatever reason, he was really good at selling, convincing you to do things that you shouldn't do

Big Rich Klein:   10:29
putting that dream in your head.

Cody Waggoner:   10:31
Yeah, I’m like Okay, Well, I’ll buy a Jeep, So I found a 1971 CJ five jeep. It was 4500 bucks, so I sold my, I’ll call my reliable Toyota truck, sold it to be able to afford this Jeep, because I had no money. I mean, I mean, I was 18 I had no money and, uh, I bought this 1971 CJ5 Jeep and went out to Truck Haven Ocotilla Wells. There is this run called Terra Del Sol, TDS. It's still going on. It's a It's a pretty famous event. We went in these notches and up these hills and I fell in love. I was like, Man, this is the coolest thing. It's so much fun. I mean, because I hate going home and just sitting on the couch and doing nothing, I love going, either go surfing or go, go, go boating or, or, go Jeeping So, um, we went out there and did that. It's like, man, this is pretty cool. I need to get I need upgrade, Right? So I I put I went and found a company called Tri County Gear Jason Bunch in Pomona and he's all Yeah, well, you could put a low gear. It's You know, your you could put an SM  420 transmission in and give you a brand new low so you can go real slow and you gotta put a locker a Detroit locker in the rear. So we did that, and I went to larger tires, and I spent enough money at Tri County Gear that they invited me on this customer appreciation run in 1994. So I went out there to the Hammers where the customer appreciation run was, never heard of the Hammers. And I'm like, Man, this is kind of cool. Well, what do we do? Well, we're gonna go up that canyon over there. I'm like, Holy crap. Really? Well, where is the road? He's like, Well, that's the road. Like, Oh, okay, so my Jeep’s gonna go up with that in mind you. I had this meticulous little yellow 1971 had no scratches. It was beautiful. I mean, it was my baby. He walked me up Sledgehammer the entire the entire trail, teaching me how to rock crawl, how to keep, cuz I had a posi-traction in the front and no power steering at the time. So I had to learn to keep the wheels on the ground cuz once you lift the wheel in the air, Obviously it spins with the posi. So that's where I really learned how to drive the little Jeep and my little Jeep was 83 had an 83 inch wheelbase. So all the other Jeeps were like 12 inches or longer. So they had the the ability to climb the ledges where mine. I had to be pretty strategic on how to get up the ledges, or up the waterfalls and stuff. So after that, I really was like, Man, this is way cool. And then a month later, a couple months later, ah, a picture was in Four Wheel Drive and Sports Utility magazine is one of the is one of those magazines. I have it on the wall. I was like, Man, I'm famous. I'm in the magazine. So that was the years where competition started coming up with the I think ARCA and UROC and all those, uh, pro rock all those competitions and there in the late nineties. And, um, one year Jason Bunch was competing and he was really one of the best in his little yellow YJ I think it is. And he dragged me down to Las Cruces, New Mexico, and these guys ran a whole different way than I would run, why I’m saying that is they would get to the event like at midnight the night before, still working on their shit, and they wouldn't sleep and they wouldn't eat. And I was like, What are you guys doing? When are you going to sleep? We aren’t going to sleep, let’s drink some beer, like Okay. Cool. Then they convinced me to push a spare tire up the canyon at Los Cruces in case they needed a spare tire. I'm like, this is for the birds. This is This is shit. I just don't work this way. So anyways, I did that. I realized I wasn't really a pit crew type person to go along, at least not with the that team. And then in 2001 they had a modified stock class, and that was in Los Cruces also. So, I’m like, man, let's give it a shot. So we took the little yellow Jeep down there, and we did really well, my dad spotted me, I think, on the first course. Yeah, he kicked a cone. And that's where the whole yelling match, cuz my dad and I, we just, you know, he’s a red. He's a He's a red type personality and I’m a red type personality we would butt heads, it was pretty comical. It was, I remember.  Kind of like with Randall and I. So maybe it's all me. Um, yeah, we did it that for until 2006 and we would slowly modify the jeep. We’d take, we’d get as much ground clearance. And I was losing events because I didn't have an atlas. And everyone is doing Jeff Mello front. Burn here and front, burn there and dig this. I'm like, God damn it. We lost again by a couple points because I couldn't burn around. So we put an atlas in it with cutting breaks. We moved up the transmission and the engine. So we have more clearance and we won, we won a lot of events and a lot of championships just doing our thing. I mean, the little I knew the little yellow Jeep could only do so much, So we just did our thing. If we had to stack rocks, we’d stack rocks, we were very strategic on. Well, let's let them a lot of guys. Most guys have the mentality go big or go home. I've never had that mentality. I mean I enjoy technical rock crawling and having a good time and not destroying my stuff. That's one thing that's been really cool since coming back to rock crawling the last few years at WE Rock is you, don't, you don't, go and roll me. You can go roll over and destroy your stuff and pretty much it’s technical courses. You know, A lot of people say, Oh, it's not tough enough. It's not hard enough, But honestly, I think it's great, I love love when the competition's down to a point or back up or a cone and you go home with a rig that you're not gonna have to work on pretty much, which is another benefit. So

Big Rich Klein:   16:41
that is, that is, by design.

Cody Waggoner:   16:43
Yeah,because we used to, years ago, you know, there would be guys half the field would be broken. Car killer courses Yep, then people would stopp coming. So So I love the technical stuff. So back to 2000. So, yeah, had the little yellpw Jeep from 2001 to 2006 and then in 2006 I really wanted to step it up, so I contacted Mitch Guthrie. He had the first Campbell Enterprise Moon buggy and, ah, Mitch was kind of done and rock crawling. I wouldn't say it was dead, but it wasn't like it was. You know, not a lot of people decided Go to go to do the go fast stuff because the go fast stuff was kind of hidden. You know, everyone wants to be a go fast desert racer, right? That's what kind of, you know, until they realize the money it costs to do that,

Big Rich Klein:   17:32
well, that and the way I look at it, is that rock crawling to be successful, there's a skill level that you have to have to obtain, and there's a lot of strategy in it. And if you it's a lot different than trail wheeling because you're forced into driving the course designers line, and that didn't matter if, who was designing the courses. You know, you had to do what the course designer wanted, couldn't just go around stuff. Go fast, no matter how fast you're going. Even if you're the slowest guy out there, you're still going as fast as you can to your ability, and it's fun. There's absolutely no doubt about it. But yes, you're right. The best thing I ever heard from anybody was Campbell. Nick, he goes, You know, the nice thing about rock crawling is I can take my car from one event to the next. And all I have to do to prep is open it up and and top off the fuels and check the air pressure in the tires because, you know, with racing every single event, it's $10,000 per race per car. Especially now that they've all gone IFS.

Cody Waggoner:   18:36
Yeah. So I contacted Mitch Guthrie and I bought his moon buggy the first Shannon Campbell built Ah, moon buggy. Um, ever built. I think it was right after Tiny was built, which Nelson built and who kind of revolutionised the whole rock crawling industry. And then we went and we rock crawled from 2006 to 2009, won a lot of championships, won a lot of events, that was that was really cool. I had a few different spotters. My dad was getting a little up there in age, so I had Jack Graf of CTM racing spot, and Mike Berard. He's a He's a really good rock crawler. And a few others I have a hard time remember names, but yeah, it was good, cause you're only as good as your spotter. Actually, you got You got to really understand what they're seeing and how to see it. And it's a team effort. Unless you’re Justin Keilman. Then you don't really need a spotter. You can just go to the event and do well.

 Big Rich Klein:   19:31
Well, you know, You've done a good thing by getting Randall behind the wheel. Because I really think that a spotter needs to understand the capabilities of the vehicle. They have got to know when they can rear dig, when to, you know what exactly the car is going to do to put you on the right line And you Then you have to have that trust in your spotter that he's not gonna he or she is not gonna put you Ah, in a position where you're gonna, you know, throw it off a 30 foot cliff.

Cody Waggoner:   19:59
Absolutely. Absolutely. And having your spotter drive, they see what you see. They see what you're going through and understanding that that has really really helped us out a lot on putting him in the driver's seat. And, you know, he loved the drive. If he could drive every event he would. So it's just another as a payback to on their commitments and everything that he's done with his time and going to the events and everything. So and another part of it is for me. I have been driving for almost 20 years, so I mean, it's kind of cool. Seeing it from another side of it. Our understanding, what it takes to do to be a spotter, because there's there's good spotters and there's bad spotters and, uh, a lot of work

Big Rich Klein:   20:47
exactly. And it's it's nice if you have a spotter that can can read the lines. I'm always amazed, you know, as a course designer, I spent a lot of time. Everybody thinks I just throw cones out there, and it's that's not that's not the idea. I'm sure there are people that design courses that do that just say, Oh, here's a hard spot and put cones there. I like to throw the cones up so sometimes it's it's difficult to get to the cones. Sometimes it's difficult to get through the cones or once you get through the cones, then it's like, Oh, okay, great. Now how do I get the next angle to get to the next set of cones? You know, there's a lot that goes into it. There's very I don't want to say there's very few, but, you know, there's times where I was set up a course, and I go, Okay, if they do this one particular thing, they're gonna get this this bonus or they're going to get this line better to skip the next bonus because it will screw up to get to the next gate. Whatever. And then I see guys go just plowing into that into things and not doing it the way that I've designed it in my head, how it's gonna work. Have I ever driven anything like that? What I've put up No. You know, I've never driven a buggy like yours or anybody else's, and I particularly don't want to drive my courses. But having done it for so many years and watching the vehicles, you know, I know what your vehicle is going to do and how it's gonna react differently. Then one of Jesse's, even though they're very similar just because of the way the different tires handle on the way. The portals are the engine, the torque, all that kind of things. Everybody's vehicle works differently and then, you know, but the spotters and the drivers are different, too.

Cody Waggoner:   22:30
It's such a mind of mine, you know, minds. I say I say the F word. But it’s such a mind f word cause it like, Let's last event. I went to first course. We saw a couple guys go and they hit this one particular cone. I'm like, OK, well, Randall, we're gonna need to take that cone then, I don't see anyone getting through it. So we took the cone, went back through into that, and then the next day I asked to run that course. I mean, it's dead. The events over. It's a sure go up there and walked right through the frickin course. So it's It's all in here on a lot of things that your mind just screws with you sometimes, like Oh, look, if it can't be done, but then you come to find out, it's it's it can be done absolutely. And then there was another course the same thing. I was like, Oh, if you just do this because if you just tweak it a little bit with, you know, a little here and a little there it it makes a huge difference. You know, a lot of people have a hard time with the time. Which teams are definitely getting better because they used to be. I mean, if you if you 40 a course, which means you time out or you hit too many cones, you're done. There's no way you'll ever win that event because all you have to do is get through mainly all the courses, Jacob Reeves is a good example of that. He is very consistent. He's We've gone out to Johnson Valley multiple times, and I've been helping him teaching him the things I know this last event, I believe he got third or fourth, third place. Third place, you know, with small tires, full chassis. What did he do? He finished all the courses. I mean, that is that's only that. Not that that's all you have to do. But you're gonna be in the top if you stay consistent and get through all the courses and use your head. You know, don't don't bite off more than you can chew.

Big Rich Klein:   24:15
Yeah, pick and choose which which bonuses to go for and which ones to look at and say, you know, I might be able to do it, but that might is where it's gonna cost you the 40 you either in a rollover or time.

Cody Waggoner:   24:28
Yeah. So 2006 to 2009 I had the moon buggy and then 2009 and we had a lot of sponsors. So if anyone's watching this wondering, Well, how did you get the sponsors? It's just like anything in life. You go after them, you be, you be persistent and consistent. You know, one thing I've learned in life is being persistent. If you want something, you're going to get, you know, And we got a lot of sponsors. One of our main sponsors was Detroit Locker. They liked our team, our whole thing. Lindsay, my wife show me theirs back. They should have pom poms in her hair and she don't have a bright shirt on and all that. And we had a dog Willy who passed away years ago. And, you know, They really liked our team. And we were the Detroit locker team, which was really cool for a number of years. And Lindsay actually would do all the marketing for Team Waggoner Racing. That was our name. And she did a really good job where I was actually are actually making money. I mean, we would get a lot of tires and get some money. It was It was a good thing. I mean, people say all you can't make money racing. Well, there's a few years that it was really good. Okay, So 2009 came Lasernut started, which is my our company. Lasernutt. We do laser cutting. We started out in 2007 which is part of my dad's company. So because I worked for my dad and my dad on the way to Rock Crawl said, Hey, Cody, I think we're gonna buy a laser. What do you mean, a laser? What? What are we to do with a laser? Well, you cut metal out with them like Okay, cool. Look. So we bought this used laser. We put it into our 32,000 square foot facility, which had no work. I mean, it was empty building and we spent a year learning how to run it. Well, a couple of the guys, Brad and James spent a year learning how to run it. Then we sat in our board meeting in 2007 and said, OK, we got the laser up and running who’s gonna get work for it,everyone looked looked at each other, like not me, not me.

Big Rich Klein:   26:23
I'm not a salesman..

Cody Waggoner:   26:23
I guess I will. I'm sitting here doing nothing, so I'll go out and get work for it. So I made up a little postcard, literally drove from company to company in the local area, handing postcards out, saying, Hey, we do laser cutting? You know you got anything for us and one postcard got to Summit Industries. I don't know if they're around anymore, which is Jardine Performance, Doug Thorley Headers. There are one of our first large customers, and there was a lot of flanges, so we started cutting out flanges. Well, this little 1500 watt laser had a hard time cutting 3/8 thick flanges. We actually had a weed water weeder spraying water onto the material while the laser head is cutting to keep the material. Cool. So we get a cool good, good flange. So I went to my dad in 2008 and I said, Dad, well, I'm cutting out a lot of flanges, and I'm having a hell of a time. Cutting them out. We need to get a new laser. We're slowly building company. The first year we did $200,000 sales in the second we did $600,000 sales. I mean, we're doubling every year than we did 1.2 million in sales. And, you know, now we're doing a lot more, but it's, ah, it just slow. It was a slow growth deal, a lot off road parts, started contacting my sponsors. One of the postcards got to Fabtech Motorsports. They make a suspension parts and shocks and stuff. And they got that postcard in the mail cause I got all the SIC codes of companies and I mass mail them out to all those companies. Then they get this stupid little postcard, and go “oh wow, they, do laser cutting” and they call us and we build a relationship and start doing cutting for them. So they turn into one of our largest customers for years doing the suspension parts and brackets, and it snowballed into laser cutting. And then they Hey, Can you do some bending? And I'm like, Well, I gotta brake, I can bend up that part. Well, I thought I knew how to bend. We didn't know how to bend. So we spent some time learning how to bend accurately and consistently where we determined that we needed a more accurate brake to bend the parts. So we started doing laser cutting, bending, and then they go, Hey, can you guys do some welding like, Yeah, we know how to weld, we’ve got a welder. We didn't know how to weld. Not not the So we learned out of weld.

Big Rich Klein:   28:46
Fake it until you make it

Cody Waggoner:   28:48
right. So we bought welders. And now we have, actually, we have six press brakes. We'll go on the list are beginning. We have five lasers were one that we are try the largest laser cutting facility in Southern California. So we do. We have five lasers, six press brakes, three robotic welders, a bunch of manual welders we do aluminum welding and steel welding.

Big Rich Klein:   29:12
How many employees do you have now?

Cody Waggoner:   29:15
Right now we have that. You know, with this whole thing going on where I think we're at about 60 employees. Luckily, we're we are an essential related business. Come to find out, all are off. All our customers are auto repair facilities. That's what they're under. So they're allowed to stay open during this this deal. And so now we're allowed to stay open to fund them. Lot of military contracts, place apartments and all that, which are also essential also, so, fortunately, we are able to keep the doors open as long as, Obviously, the work comes in which so far it has been. But yeah, it's been fun. And then the Lasernut has been has been cool because I'm able to like, cut off road parts, which was my hobby for all those years. So my customers are My friends are my family type thing, which is really cool. It's been it's been it's been a really a dream, a dream, the whole thing to be able to do what I love off roading and be able to tie it in with customers and working, and it's just you know how they say, Do what you love. It's turned into that which has been really, really cool. I focused on Lasernut, getting more customers and building up the brand base.. And I sold my mon buggy um, Shannon Cambell moon buggy and bought a, uh, a twisted custom. Four seater. And what started going the hammers again? Because when I was competing, I never would go recreation wheeling, went recreation wheeling for four years. And then I went to the King of the Hammers for the first time. First time in 2013 because I never would go because I knew I'd get the bug. Went to the hammers like Man, I could do this that year Randy Slawson won.. So I'm like, Hey, Dad, I think we have to do this. Oh yeah, let's do it So we called Randy Slawson. We had him build two identical Bombers I raced in 2014. Got top 20, 2015 got a top 10. And that's when I said, Man, I'm never gonna beat Randy Slawson And And this this bomber so had a relationship with Armada Engineering laser cutting their parts, and I'm like they're very innovative and cutting edge. So we designed the Ultra4 that I have now. And in 2016 car shouldn’t have even been there,. It showed up to the lake bed. I mean, it wasn't tested. We had some issues. Got to the third lap and the harness, burned up, 2017, I probably got the years all screwed up. We've gotta a top 10, I think I got eighth place. And then the last couple years, we had some DNF’s. And then this last year, we have Cameron Steele, a trophy truck driver, Commentator guy, drive it. He did really well. He was actually leading the race 28 miles from the finish in first place, which it was huge. And we had another failure, which we've never had a failure of this part. So we will make it stronger and better and be ready for 2021 but back to rock crawling. So that was That's to go fast part of it. And, ah, I got back into rock crawling, going 2016 somewhere right around there. I bought Brent, Bradshaw's moon buggy, which I've always liked. He just wanted way too much money for it. And then he finally came down, like, three or four years later, and I bought it, so I drove up to work and pick that up and started competing. And just like my little yellow CJ five, I couldn't beat anyone cause I didn't have rear steer. I’d get second and third, and we did really well, you know, not having rear steer. But couldn’t, couldn’t win. So what do you do contacted Jesse Haines We We were starting up, build a relationship over the years and had him build his first moon buggy he's ever built. And he built that and I was started winning doing quite well. And now the moon buggy. I mean, there's a lot of people buying this moon buggy. Why? I don't know. But I mean, people just buying it to recreation wheel and competes, and it's a really cool buggy, portals and all the stuff. So when I got back into the rock crawling, that was about the time we had Lacey and Lacey, my youngest daughter. She knew nothing about rock crawling, cause I we weren't really doing it, So I really wanted to have a legacy and in and show her what we were doing, you know, I don't know. I just want to get back into it, too, because I, you know, don't do it for 20 years. There's not a lot of people that can say they've not saying but to do it for 20 some years is a long, actually, 25 years. So, yeah, where we are now is I do the rock crawling competitions. What was doing on before this? This whole deal and also the go fast, which I've gone out of the driver's seat and we have Cameron Steele driving the car. Who is doing a really good job. We aren’t gonna do any go fast this year. It’ll  be king of the Hammers coming up in 2021. I really wanted to focus on rock crawling. I wanted to do the East Coast events this year of 2020 and the West Coast and win the championship, which that's still

Big Rich Klein:   34:28
They’re all still gonna happen.

Cody Waggoner:   34:30
Yeah. Good. Okay,

Big Rich Klein:   34:31
we're just All we're doing is postponing until they clear us. And for those of you that they're hearing this sometime down the road, you know where you're sitting here in this ah shelter in place. I'm in Texas. Cody is in Southern California and ah, we're now I don't know. What? What is it? The beginning At very end of March April 1st is tomorrow. So we're hoping that all this stuff blows through. We're hoping all of our all of our people on everybody else and their families and their friends all stay safe in this. And if they do get it that they they recover quickly. Looks like Jesse Haine's is doing that recovering, his kids just, you know, didn't catch it. Well, they caught it, but they didn't get it badly. And Sara has been healthy the whole time, so that's good to hear. And we hope everybody else could do that. We're not gonna cancel any events. We're gonna We're gonna continue to do him Unless this thing drags on past beginning in July. Then we may have to look it at dropping an event or two just because we won't be able to have enough free weekends to get them all done. But we're even ready to, push the national finals in to October if we have to, or later into September to fit everything in. Remember up until we started going Naozumi’s events, we never Our events were always finals were always in October and we moved him into September so that we could facilitate working with Naozumi in Japan And that that's what we've continued to do. I like the way the season rolls out that way. But no, we will we have to do because of this, we're gonna keep that going to keep the sport alive. All right. So, uh, Cody, you mentioned about getting your kids involved. And I know that this year you just had a kid's buggy. Built a 75 80% copy of what would be a twisted customs car by Ryan Busa. Can you share with us? What? You're your ideas on behind that was?

Cody Waggoner:   36:33
Yes. So I saw on social Media. Ryan was had a had a splitting image of his twisted custom buggy, and it was like 30% smaller. And I saw his kid driving and like, Man, that's pretty cool. So typical fashion. I reached out to him and said, Hey, do you Are you selling those? He’s loke, no, I'm like, Well, if I bought one from ya, would would you sell one to me, he's all sure he built one for us. It was, I guess, the that simple. So Oh, and then also I got to go down the Texas to Mason, Texas. Yeah, we went down there and I picked it up. I really thought my older daughter would would be get a kick of it. She's actually driven it a few times, but she's just not into it, which I respect is fine. But I'm really hoping my 4.5 year old Lacy, who's just the whole nother breed pretty crazy, full tilt, until she falls over, and goes to sleep. So I think she's I'm hoping she's gonna be my driver. I can only hope I'm not gonna push him or pressure them to do anything. She seems to me we have this razor. I'm out of laser Town. She puts her helmet on. She can barely see over the roll bar. And she just goes, I mean, she’ll go drive that thing for an hour, two hours and and really enjoys it. So I'm really hoping that she'll be my driver, To, not my driver, but I'll be able to get her into the sport and possibly spotter and, you know, making a making a part of who she is. I think that's my goal. That the only thing that Dad can hope for right is to have one of your kids wanted to something like that. You have done all these years?

Big Rich Klein:   38:14
Absolutely. And that Ryan, it has built some really nice looking rigs with yours and and his son. We did it at a an article in 4Low magazine about the two rigs out there at Katemcy, when I first saw it and then when I heard that you were having him build one, it was, uh I thought that was off the hook. And I hope Lacey does enjoy it enough to where she gets involved in it. You know, we have opened up in WE Rock the kids buggy class. We have two different classes for those kids. And right now we only have one East Coast and one West Coast driver, both five and six years old. So we're looking forward to that. But with the two classes, you know, we have a five to nine year old class for 5 to 8, and then a 9 to 11 year old class. We're really hoping that that's gonna help the sport flourish over the next decade or so and get more kids involved because we know, you know, families you know they want. They want to do what their kids want to do to. And the kids want to do what the parents do quite often. So in a wheeling has been really good for my family. You know, I just wanna bring that out to everybody else and hope Lacy gets involved with it, like you said and becomes a driver. So the competitions will be there. And if she wants to do it, I hope you guys do.
Cody Waggoner:   39:32
Yeah, I would have to get a bigger trailer now. Help the economy, right? Yeah. Well, yeah, right. Yeah, it's pretty cool. You know, I've mentioned Jacob Reeves earlier in the in the conversation a young kid wants to learn, wants to do the best. I mean that that's a inspiration in itself. I mean, he's got a full sized buggy, smaller tires, doesn't have portals, and he's out there with his dad, Dad spotting and and his mom and they live it, eat it and breathe it. And it's just so cool seeing that. And then, like, for example, Jewell, um, out of Farmington. I believe, New Mexico. I let her drive my my moon buggy at the last competition, and it was just It's just amazing. You know, when someone drives a piece of machinery like that, it's never driven it that it is just the smile on the face. You know, I had one kid or one adult come up to me that I let drive the moon buggy a few months ago. They're like, That's the coolest thing I've ever done in my entire life. That's like top of the list that was just like, Wow, that was It was cool a share and give you let people enjoy the experience because way I always looked at it. You know, most people, you know, look up to the drivers or looked up to the spotters, and not in just this sport, but NASCAR or or Monster jam or whatever. Motor sports or trophy truck drivers. Whatever sport there is, but no one ever just to understand, no one ever gets to drive. So when you give someone the opportunity to go for a ride in the Ultra4  race car or let him drive, drive the moon buggy, something that is not like anything else in off road and actually feel, you know, feel the tire, go above your yourself and doing an incline feeling like the buggy is gonna roll over backwards because you're already inclined. You know, I always call it sitting in a recliner in a couch. You know, that's what I always feel like I'm sitting on already inclined, and then you go up. You know what, a 45 degree and you’re looking up at the Stars. It's cool to be able to share that, and I really enjoy sharing that. And if anyone's listening, you know, honestly hit meat, not honestly, but hit me up. In any event, after an event typically would get done between two. And three in the afternoon. I don't have anything else to do. So hit me up. I'll let you drive the moon buggy.

Big Rich Klein:   41:52
So where are things going at you guys still expanding with Lasernut and, uh, how’s Lasertown doing? Um, that's one thing I want to touch on his lasertown. I want to thank you for giving the rock crawlers a home in Johnson Valley during KOH. Okay, it's it's great when I when I come by Laser Town, and I see all the rock crawlers. They're camped out on your property. It's just like being at one of the events except there. Everybody's doing trail rides and hanging out, and it's it's awesome that that you make that available. And then, you know, everybody gets to camp together instead of being spread out all across the lake bed. And you know, the Thunderdome, you might want to call it

Cody Waggoner:   42:36
think. Yeah, right. So it's a Lasertown. It's just a piece of private property that I own out out in Johnson Valley. I guess I can go through the story. So a few years ago, for four years ago, an acquaintance of mine said, Hey, do you want to buy a piece of property? Out inJohnson Valley. I'm like Where? Oh, it's right by the lakebed. I'm like there's no private property out by the lake bed and he's Oh, yeah, yeah, there's 10 acres and I found it in a land auction and the guy didn't pay his property tax and we could bid on it. Well, what's a starting bid? Its 3200 bucks. So he had two other partners. So the total of four partners in his an $800 question. So I’m like, Well, I don't know where he's talking about this private property, because there's not I I didn't know that was private property. And he he I said it. Sure. So we make the bid 3200. No one else bid on it. We got the property. 10 acres for 3200 bucks. The four of four of us went out there in the middle of the desert where LaserTown is like, Okay, well, we need to get a surveyor out here and put the four corners and Well, what do you mean, a surveyor? Oh, the guy comes out with his his satellite thing, and he’ll put a corner here in a corner here. The corner in the corner. You know, it's 660 by 660, I go. OK, cool. I'm learning all I love learning things. So I Okay, let's do that. So he comes Any goes out there and he puts the four corners in, and then we all stood Look at each other, like what we do next. Well, uh, we can get ah, some heavy equipment out here and we could start moving all the brush out of the way like, Okay, so, uh, the one guy got this heavy equipment are are caterpillars. Earthmover, whatever it is, I think a d five or something plenty like you started moving the trees and not trees, the bushes. And they were like, Well, we're gonna put a fence or a gate around it like, yeah, that's cost too much money. Let's let let's make up. Let's make a berm. Let's make a sand berm. So he started moving everything out. We started putting a berm around the property. And when we do with all that, all the ground, especially with the creosote those those bushes because there's those are mounds, so you have to flatten it out. It got real sandy kind of like a Glamis. I mean, it was just a pure sandpit. So we brought a water truck in and made a wagon wheel and had King of the hammers there in this one little wagon wheel that we hardened up the ground and, uh, it kind of just went from there. So I first I brought one container out and I wanted to put it with. So the wind wouldn’t blow in my RV And I also could put all my wood and my chairs and all the crap that you bring out to the desert and bring back the desert. That was like the worst thing is loading and unloading every time you go to the desert. So I got the container and we put stuff in there. We have that for, I don't know, a year or so And then one year for King of the Hammers we put up the big tents. I had 6 or 8 guys come out for a day. Carpets, sandbags, the whole. The whole thing was heaters. All the stuff sat down at the fire two hours later. Well, the wind came up, the tents just just boom gone like OK, I guess we're not gonna have tents this year cause I'm not gonna spend any more money put in the tents back. So then I like Well, we'll get to more containers and make a U shape. We can build a canopy. I mean, that's what Lasernut we know. We can build the trusses and do the sheet metal. We know how to weld, So we made a canopy 14 foot high. So it's a 40 foot by 40 foot, 1600 square foot canopy area that's permanent. And the first thing one of the things we worried about is the wind. While what the wind comes up, it blows it out because it gets really windy out there, as everyone knows and knock on wood, we’ve. It's been up, never had an issue with that, and then that snowball into Ah, well, then, I had to buy two partners out. You know, they people change no, have kids and everything. So they were kind of done with the desert. So I bought them out and then my other partner about a year. So after that, I we had some issues, and I bought him out. So I I own Lasertown. I own it 100%. I'll tell you one thing about partners. If you don't have to have a partner, it's not worth having a partner, because people the reason why I say that is it might be all great in the beginning. Oh, we're gonna do this. I want to do that. But But then wives get involved and family gets involved in people's priorities. change, so, you know, it sounds all great, but just just just from experience I had it's best not to have a partner. So we put out a well, and so we have sustainable water and ah, we go out. We've, you know, kind of math it out. And, like, man, we go out about a month and 1/2 a year. And the worst thing about Johnson for me, going to Johnson Valley is from my house, it's about 2.5 hours away. And if you want to go for the day or say you want to go for the weekend to get the RV and get everything loaded up to go out for 48 to 72 hours and then come back? It was so much work just doing that. So I'm like, Well, what if we built a house out there? Well, we can't build a normal house. We'll need a built, you know, we can't do a manual. A manufactured home because of the issues are out there with break ins and stuff. So I kept seeing all these container homes. I'm like, man, what about a container home? You know, it's secure and I guess we can probably do it ourselves. So we bought a few containers. My original idea was to do five containers on the first floor than five containers on a second floor because I thought it be really cool. It's amazing. A Johnson Valley. If you get up off the ground about 10 to 15 feet, the view you have of the whole area. Well, we decided that doing that with stairs. I am getting older, and I have stairs in my house now, and I've always wanted a one story. So we decided to do 10 containers across 3200 square feet, which is a big container, most container homes are small. We learned a lot. I've never built a home before, let alone a container home. Um, I we got a crew of guys and and just made a home, and we built most of it at a Lasernut behind our shop. We have two acres behind our shop, and then we ship the containers out all 10 of them out there, and we put beams down and leveled it all out and then push the containers in the place and then finished out the did all the rest of the finish work out there and Ah, it turned out pretty bitchin’ I mean, we've had some All we should have done, that we could have done this. But all in all for my family, we're gonna I think we're gonna go out there this weekend to be able to go out there, open it up, be safe, be comfortable and have everything there, hot water as much as you want Power TV, I mean, has there it's, it's actually it's bigger than the home I live in. I mean, it's it's it's nice having some extra room. So not everyone's walking around on top of each other, and then you go right out the door and it just.  I say, it’s dreams come true because it's a dream I had and it came true to see my daughter, you know, in my other daughter go out and hang out at the pond or go over to the hammock area and the other one running around on her razor is just It's just cool because most people that go to Johnson I shouldn't say most people, a lot of people that go to Johnson Valley It's a boy's trip, right? It's It's the boys going to Johnson Valley. Uh, let loose. I've never been that boy that I like my, I Like my family there. I like, you know, they, like, think I really enjoy being around my family and and then this whole adventure we're having right now with hope, you know, thing-amado going on. It's you got to really enjoy your family or all hell is gonna break loose. You know

Big Rich Klein:   50:36
how many divorces are gonna happen,

Cody Waggoner:   50:38
right? But yeah, it's been fun. We really don't have any bond. Another 10 another time. So I have actually total 30 acres out there. I don't know. Maybe someday there'll be other things that happened. I mean, I sometimes vision like, Well, what? There's so many people that goes that Johnson Valley Now, maybe you could do an RV park, or I mean, just something be kind of cool it and collect money. You know, every day from a guy who wants to camp there for 100 bucks a night, 50 bucks a night. I don't know. Maybe that's another thing, but I think we'll see what happens with that.

Big Rich Klein:   51:14
Cool. Well, Cody. Um, thank you so much for joining me and talking about your life. Everything you have going on and what you've done in the past. Appreciate that. We wish you the best of luck in the future. I know we'll get through this will all start wheeling here real soon again altogether. And I look forward to that.

Cody Waggoner:   51:35
Yeah, absolutely. I I appreciate everything you've done all these years, Rich. You know, you stuck with it and never gave up. And you know, you you do your own thing, which I respect that also. But if anyone ever wants to know what it is that you're like to drive the moon buggy, you're going Ultra4 You just have to ask. Um, same with if you need anything from Lasernut laser. Not were a job shop. We do anything from one part to a 1,000,000 parts. We laser cut, we bend, we weld counter seeing tap pem nut san. We may complete product lines, for example. Bumpers You probably above for you seeing go down the road we made. We don't We don't sell anything ourselves. We make him for customers and then they sell it to the end user. We we make a lot of cool stuff, and I'm really stoked to be part of the community and be able to do what I love. It's been it's been It's been a fun ride, I'm excited to see what the next 20 years bring brings.

Big Rich Klein:   52:34
I'm I'm looking forward to it, Cody. Thank you very much. Say hello to your family for me and we'll see you out. Hopefully here. Real soon at a rockcrawl

Cody Waggoner:   52:44
sounds good. Have fun. Thanks.

Big Rich Klein:   52:46
Thank you. If you enjoy these podcasts, please give us a rating. Share some feedback with us via Facebook or Instagram and share our link among your friends who might be like minded. Well, that brings this episode to an end. Hope you enjoyed it. We'll catch you next week with Conversations of Big Rich. Thank you very much.