Conversations with Big Rich

All-American badass, JT Taylor, on Episode 92

January 06, 2022 Guest JT Taylor Season 2 Episode 92
Conversations with Big Rich
All-American badass, JT Taylor, on Episode 92
Show Notes Transcript

All-American Badass, JT Taylor, on Episode 92.  JT is currently the race director for American Offroad Endurance working with Mid-America Outdoors, but that’s just the latest feather in his cap. Former race director at Ultra4, racer extraordinaire in all forms of go-fast, especially Baja. JT has seen and done more than most.  Listen in for a few chuckles, a lot of history, and more info about What's Next. 

2:45 – the grease went outta my knees

9:21 – the e-brake came in handy when you passed a state trooper

12:39 – There’s a lot of Alphas in our sport

17:22 – they hooked me by showing me a video at the recruiter’s office – sign me up!

21:04 – I was cheating. Everybody was cheating

41:54 – racing the Elf

59:13 – setting up KOH…it’s like a deployment

1:16:51 – Mid America Outdoors and what comes with that!

1:32:10 – my goal is to break 200 miles an hour

1:35:23 – Mooneyham beat my record

We want to thank our sponsors Maxxis Tires and 4Low Magazine. 

Be sure to listen on your favorite podcast app.

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[00:00:01.150] - Speaker 1

Welcome to The Big Rich Show. This podcast will focus on conversations with friends and acquaintances within the fourwheel drive industry. Many of the people that I will be interviewing you may know the name. You may know some of the history, but let's get in depth with these people and find out what truly makes them a four wheel drive enthusiast. So now is the time to sit back. Grab a cold one and enjoy our conversation.


[00:00:29.430] - Speaker 2

Whether you're crawling the red rock of Moab or hauling your toys to the trail, Maxxis has the tires you can trust for performance and durability four wheels or two. Maxxis tires are the choice of Champions because they know that whether for work or play, for fun or competition, Maxxis Tires Deliver. Choose Maxxis Tread Victoriously.


[00:00:55.990] - Speaker 3

Why should you read 4low magazine? Because 4low Magazine is about your lifestyle, the four wheel drive adventure lifestyle that we all enjoy - rock crawling, trail riding, event coverage, vehicle builds, and do it yourself tech, all in a beautifully presented package. You won't find 4low on the newsstand rack. So subscribe today and have it delivered to you.


[00:01:20.470] - Big Rich Klein

On today's episode of Conversations with Big Rich. We have none other than the American badass JT Taylor. Anybody I know, it always kind of drives me nuts when people call him that, but JT is really a good dude. Anybody that's not met him, you'll find that he's got a heart of gold even though he comes across kind of gruff and he's got a long history and off road and other various motor sports. Anything with a motor, basically. So we'll get into that.


[00:01:51.760] - Big Rich Klein

And JT, I want to say thank you so much for coming on board and glad we were finally able to make this happen.


[00:01:59.470] - JT Taylor

Yeah. No, I really appreciate it, Rich. It's an honor to be on here and chat with you about the stuff that we both love.


[00:02:07.240] - Big Rich Klein

Correct. So let's get started right off with where were you born and raised?


[00:02:13.990] - JT Taylor

I was born in Bradenton, Florida, raised there for a while and then ended up finishing up growing up in Myaaka, Florida. So in between Bradenton and Washula, graduated from Hardy County High. There in Wasula, Florida.


[00:02:29.690] - Big Rich Klein

Okay, let's talk about those early years. I know your dad was a pilot. How early did you get into flying?


[00:02:38.290] - JT Taylor

Oh, man, I can remember flying with my pops. Man. I was four or five.


[00:02:44.590] - Big Rich Klein



[00:02:45.670] - JT Taylor

And I can remember standing up behind one of the front seats, hanging on to the back of the front seat, him flying and hitting a little dip. And I went down to the floor on my butt, and my mom was laughing at me, asking me what happened. I said the grease went out of my knees.


[00:03:05.390] - Big Rich Klein

That's funny. So any instances like we had one, I can't remember who it was right now that they went flying with their dad. It may have been Jack Bettio and the dad went inverted, rolled over and flew upside down, and he fell out of the plane.


[00:03:29.150] - JT Taylor

What? Yeah.


[00:03:30.150] - Big Rich Klein

And didn't get hurt.


[00:03:32.690] - JT Taylor

Good Lord, no, dad. He like to fly low and slow.


[00:03:37.700] - Big Rich Klein



[00:03:38.220] - JT Taylor

And most of the time, we never even had the doors on the plane. So it was kind of riding around on a Jeep, but just the sightseeing and low and slow. And he never really did anything too crazy. He'd like to buzz the neighbors, buzz my uncle's aunt's house, my grandma's house, and let them know we were around. But that was about it. He was a good pilot.


[00:04:00.680] - Big Rich Klein

So I've been out to the property in Myaaka, and it's pretty rural Florida. There's not a whole lot of Hills, except for Ant Hills.


[00:04:13.970] - JT Taylor



[00:04:15.950] - Big Rich Klein

What was it like growing up out there in that rural situation? That was the family home, correct?


[00:04:22.730] - JT Taylor

Yeah. It was awesome. It was a lot of hard work. I mean, we raise cows and we raise oranges. So anybody that knows farming, it's not easy. And you're always subject to the weather, and we're always scared of a freeze because that kills your oranges, and then you don't have a crop, then you don't make any money, right? But it was awesome. I mean, riding around, driving on dirt roads, learning how to slide around corners. And I don't know how many 22 shells I shot when I was a kid, but it was a lot.


[00:04:57.780] - JT Taylor

So we were always hunting and riding and shooting and just being country kids and chasing each other around Orange Groves on motorcycles, throwing green oranges at each other, knocking each other off motorcycles. It's a wonder we live through it.


[00:05:16.200] - Big Rich Klein

So what was the first vehicle you got to drive or ride, man?


[00:05:25.050] - JT Taylor

I don't know. It's probably an old 9N tractor when I was like, six.


[00:05:31.830] - Big Rich Klein

That's awesome.


[00:05:36.070] - JT Taylor

But, yeah, there was a big red three Wheeler that I had that I didn't have. It was my dad's. It was our work rig, but I beat that poor thing like it owed me money.


[00:05:50.350] - Big Rich Klein

So the school that you probably went to, you had to get bused to it because I don't remember there being passing any schools nearby that you could have walked to.


[00:06:02.230] - JT Taylor

Well, it was funny because we live right on the edge of Hardy County. We actually live in Manatee County.


[00:06:07.270] - Big Rich Klein



[00:06:07.650] - JT Taylor

But dad wanted me to go to watchula to school. They had a better AG program, the FFA program. There was good. And it was more of a rural school. And so my cousin Regina and I would drive over, pick her up. We would drive to the county line, park the car. And this was before I even had a license. It was 14-15 and parked it in one of the neighbor's yards and then catch the bus because the bus would come to the county line.


[00:06:42.160] - Big Rich Klein



[00:06:42.630] - JT Taylor

And then it was over an hour bus ride to school.


[00:06:49.570] - Big Rich Klein

So you were future farmers of America.


[00:06:53.950] - JT Taylor

Yeah. High school. I was the parliamentarian for two years, and then my senior year, I was the President.


[00:06:59.470] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And did you just do cattle, or did you start with sheep or pigs or anything else? Rabbits?


[00:07:06.360] - JT Taylor

No, I did a steer when I was in 4H when I was way younger. But then when I was in FFA, I didn't really do any of the show stuff. It was just helping run the club and do the parliamentary procedure competitions and and stuff things like that.


[00:07:27.680] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And did you play any sports while you were in high school, or was it too much work around the farm and Ranch to do?


[00:07:37.210] - JT Taylor

No. I never really got into playing sports. I mean, I did a little three Wheeler racing, but that was about it as far as doing sports. But I always went to the game, went to the football games and supported the teams and all that, but just never really got into being a part of the sports thing.


[00:07:57.770] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And what was the first vehicle that you owned Besides, or were given so that you could drive around? What was it?


[00:08:14.570] - JT Taylor

What year was that thing? It was a 79 Dotson 510.


[00:08:22.270] - Big Rich Klein

Little hatchback, 510. Okay. Cool.


[00:08:25.370] - JT Taylor

Yeah. I wish I had it now you know what those things are worth?


[00:08:27.660] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, yeah. Love the 510s, especially the little four door coupes.


[00:08:32.630] - JT Taylor

Yeah, this one's a little two door hatchback, and it jumped really good. Landed bad.


[00:08:41.690] - Big Rich Klein

I had a 210 my parents had, and I took it to College when my.


[00:08:46.360] - JT Taylor

Oh, no, you're right. It was a 210. It was a two door.


[00:08:51.270] - Big Rich Klein

Yes, those things for a small motor. I ran from the cops four times in that thing in the San Francisco Bay Area, once from the highway patrol and three times from police and they couldn't catch me.


[00:09:06.910] - JT Taylor

That is funny.


[00:09:08.210] - Big Rich Klein

You could lay that thing out in the corner on those little 155. 8013 tires or 1213s, I think.


[00:09:15.660] - JT Taylor



[00:09:15.880] - Big Rich Klein

They would slide the corners. Rear wheel drive.


[00:09:21.770] - JT Taylor

Oh, yeah. Now I did find that the ebrake comes in handy when you go past the state trooper and you see him stop and flip and you go lights out. You can dip off into a neighbor's driveway by using the parking brake so your brake lights don't come on. So he just goes right on by you.


[00:09:38.820] - Big Rich Klein

That works. That's awesome. So you did some three wheel racing locally there in that in Manatee County?


[00:09:52.650] - JT Taylor

Yeah, there in Hardy County, and it was nothing to speak of, really, just for fun.


[00:09:59.640] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And FFA in high school, and then you went after high school. Is that when you went into the military right away, or did you work for a while or what happened?


[00:10:11.740] - JT Taylor

No. I actually joined the army on the delayed entry program in 11th grade, so I was already signed up. So when I graduated, I was out for a month and 28 days when I was on a plane headed to Fort Bliss in El Paso for basic training.


[00:10:27.150] - Big Rich Klein

Wow. Okay. Cool.


[00:10:29.480] - JT Taylor

And I landed in Fort Bliss. I'm looking out the window of the plane. I'd never seen desert before, and I'm like, what did I do?


[00:10:39.250] - Big Rich Klein

So let's talk about that time. What was it like as a young man and jumping out into the real world?


[00:10:49.690] - JT Taylor

It was fun. Basic training was brutal. It was hard, but it was still fun. It was a challenge. I liked the leadership roles because in basic training and AIT, they move you around, they put you in a leadership position for a while, and then they fire you and they put somebody else in there. And it's just how it works. But I didn't like getting fired. I didn't like not being in the leadership position because I enjoyed it. And it was a challenge. And it was fun. But once I understood that that was how it worked.


[00:11:24.920] - JT Taylor

Then I was okay. But at first I was pissed.


[00:11:28.390] - Big Rich Klein

I can understand that my leadership stuff started with scouting as a patrol leader, then senior patrol leader, all that kind of stuff. And I never went into the military. But every job I ever had, I wasn't satisfied with just being one of the shop guys or just being whatever it was always, how can I move up? How can I move up? And that must have been the same for you. Then if you started off in FFA being the President and Pau that you had that knack.


[00:12:10.510] - JT Taylor

Yeah. No, I never put two and two together on that. But yeah, I think you're right.


[00:12:14.290] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And I see that same thing with you to this day. I think that comes early for most people. You're either a leader or follower. And I know that a lot of us that are in the racing one way or another were more leaders than followers.


[00:12:39.430] - JT Taylor

Yeah. There's a lot of Alphas in our sport.


[00:12:44.430] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. We'll get into that being race director here in a little while.


[00:12:48.850] - JT Taylor

Yeah. I agree that all that the leadership stuff from early all the way through the military is I kind of laughed about a lot of the stuff that we had to do in the army and the leadership training that I had to go through didn't really see how much it meant while I was doing it. But once I went back to the unit after one of the training events, you could put it to work, put the stuff that you learned to work. But then when I got out and moving into the racing world, it's really paid off.


[00:13:28.850] - Big Rich Klein

Right. And how many years did you spend in the military? 21 years, 21 years. And was any of that, like, in Guard, or was it just active duty?


[00:13:39.220] - JT Taylor

No, it was all active duty.


[00:13:41.220] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And let's talk about some of those 21 years after Fort Bliss. Where did you end up?


[00:13:49.550] - JT Taylor

I was lucky enough to have a good recruiter. And he got me the Europe option. So I got a sign on bonus, and I got to go to Europe. So I went straight from AIT. So I did basic training and AIT right there in Fort Bliss in the air defense artillery. And then I went to Spain. Allen Airbase in Germany, which is down by Trier and Luxembourg. It's in the corner, down in the Mosul region. So great wine region, beautiful scenery, great people, just a really good experience.


[00:14:25.660] - JT Taylor

I spent four years there and then came to Fort Carson in Colorado Springs. Got super lucky because several of my friends from Germany came to Fort Carson, and I got to come here. So I already had a friend base here. So that made things easier.


[00:14:47.350] - Big Rich Klein

Is that difficult for a lot of people that are in the military? Is if you're changing locations, if you're more than your basic four year guy and you're moving around a lot, is it difficult going from spot to spot and being a new guy, do you think?


[00:15:07.370] - JT Taylor

Yeah, it used to man. They were moving people, like every 18 months. And it was their policy back then, and nobody understood it. But they were trying to keep things to where you keep changing up, changing command and changing up people and training in different areas, different personalities. But you couldn't build a cohesive unit very well. It was hard. So then they slowed down on that, which I was lucky to be in when they started slowing down on that because I was supposed to be in Germany for two years.


[00:15:45.810] - JT Taylor

I signed up for an extension because they were hurting for people. So I got at State three. Well, then I re enlisted because I had orders to go to Fort Riley. Kansas didn't really want to do that. No offense to Kansas. But I didn't want to go to Fort Riley. And so I re upped for another year. And then I got to choose my station. And so I chose Fort Carson.


[00:16:13.130] - Big Rich Klein

And what made you pick Fort Carson?


[00:16:17.210] - JT Taylor

I just heard a lot of really good things about it. I had spent time out in Colorado going to Gunnison when I was a kid. And so I liked Colorado. I liked the whole the mountains and just everything about it. And the training Arca. Fort Carson is good. They got the other one down at Penny Canyon. That's a good training area. So, yeah, the unit had a fourth idea at the time, had a good reputation. And I had friends that had left from Germany and came to Colorado.


[00:16:48.670] - JT Taylor

So that helped.





[00:16:51.340] - Big Rich Klein

And what were the type of duties that you performed? You said something about artillery.


[00:17:01.170] - JT Taylor

I was in the air defense artillery. I started out on the Vulcan weapon system, so it's a six barrel, 20 millimeter Gatlin gun that fires 3000 rounds a minute and basically just throw up a wall of lead at a plane or helicopter and get it to run into it.


[00:17:20.910] - Big Rich Klein

That's cool.


[00:17:22.830] - JT Taylor

Oh, man. They hooked me. They showed me that video at the recruiter's office, and it was in Panama, and it was a towelk in a trailer model, like cutting a building in half. And I'm, like, done. Sign me up. I want that the daily stuff at Fort Carson. It's maintenance and motor pool and training. And then you get ramped up. You'd go like to NTC out the National Training Center out in Barstow, California.


[00:17:53.780] - Big Rich Klein



[00:17:54.580] - JT Taylor

And do war games exercises and continued training. It was all about training and maintenance and leadership training. And that's no matter where you are or what you do, it's always the same in the army, at least. Right.


[00:18:15.520] - Big Rich Klein

Prepare for that day.


[00:18:17.190] - JT Taylor

Exactly. Let's see. That was 19. Damn. When was that? It was 90 to 94. I was here. And then I went to Korea for a year. And that was interesting. Korea's, man. It's hot as the surface of the sun in the summer and then cold like Siberia in the winter.





[00:18:52.940] - JT Taylor

Yeah, it is. It's humid. So it'll cut you. It's so cold and so hot. But I traveled all over me and my buddy Steve favorite. We learned the train system, and we'd get on the train and we'd go to Seoul and we'd go down to Pusan and we'd go up to DMZ and go to Freedom Village, see all that stuff. So we traveled a lot. I mean, I did the same in Germany. We went all over every weekend. We were going somewhere, but did the same thing in Korea.


[00:19:27.150] - JT Taylor

Couldn't have cars. So we rode buses and rode the trains and all that, but got to see a lot of cool history and a lot of cool stuff.


[00:19:37.160] - Big Rich Klein

So was that a military rule? You couldn't own a car over there?


[00:19:41.270] - JT Taylor

Yeah. I never understood why. But now in Korea, it's a hardship tour. So they won't pay for your family to come with you. And you can't have a car, at least up where we were. A lot of it was because the bases are so small. Okay, that if every soldier had a car, you wouldn't be able to move, right? Yeah.


[00:20:02.280] - Big Rich Klein

That makes sense.


[00:20:04.070] - JT Taylor

So I volunteered to go to Korea so I could get my station of choice follow on. And I chose Fort Carson. So I got to come back to Fort Carson, then spent a couple more years here, then went to Korea again. Same kind of deal. They were hurting for people over there, volunteered to go and got to pick my follow on.


[00:20:22.770] - Big Rich Klein

So I chose Fort Carson nice.


[00:20:25.690] - JT Taylor

And then Iraq came about. So deployed to Iraq with third armor calf and then back to Carson and retired no six.


[00:20:44.920] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And when did you start the racing?


[00:20:55.750] - JT Taylor

I built old Blue because I raced in Germany. I raised Third Circle track in a Volkswagen.


[00:21:02.550] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. In a Volkswagen.


[00:21:04.810] - JT Taylor

Yeah. We have a quarter mile, medium bank clay Oval there on spangola airbase right on the backside of the airbase. So I built a little bug, cut it down and made it low and low slung. And I raised the 1600 stock class, which wasn't stock. I was cheating. Everybody was cheating. Well, yeah, but raised 1600 stock class for a couple of years. And then I built a super modified car with a five cylinder, fuel injected, turbo charged Audi mounted mid engine and a little single seat kind of a sprint car looking thing.





[00:21:46.510] - JT Taylor

There was a death trap. It was fast. So I raced there. And then when I got back to the States, there's a track just south of me here that I looked at it's like a five eight asphalt.





[00:22:04.680] - JT Taylor

And I went down there and was looking at buying a car. But the people at the time down there were, I mean, just not friendly, not good. It was just real clicky. And it looked like nobody was having fun racing circle jerks. Yeah, man, it was not good that turned me off to that. And then some friends of mine were into wheeling, and I'd always been playing around off road and never really got into rock crawling. But I just got here, and I the first one was a little 83 Toyota pickup, and I had big tires on it.


[00:22:51.140] - JT Taylor

They were 33s and wheeled that thing all over the place here in Colorado, because, man, there's some amazing wheeling here in Colorado, right. And then moved up from there. I built a Land Cruiser and then went crazy with it and made it like, super nice show car, badass rig. And then I built that black 85 Toyota that you've seen, right? Old black Sunshine. That was a good truck.


[00:23:24.700] - Big Rich Klein

And you sold that, didn't you?


[00:23:26.420] - JT Taylor

I did again. I sold it and bought it back. Then I sold it again. Wow. It's up in Montana doing off road recovery work.


[00:23:37.580] - Big Rich Klein



[00:23:38.970] - JT Taylor

And the guy loves it. So at least I don't have to see it running around town because that would hurt my feelers.


[00:23:48.600] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. No doubt if I would have known that I've had vehicles in my life that I really wish I had not gotten rid of now. But of course, I needed to get rid of them at the time because I needed the money or whatever the situation was. It was never like, I'm tired of this. Get rid of it. It was always like, okay, I got to move up to something else or whatever. And I really wish I had some of those vehicles back. Do you have that case as well?


[00:24:23.140] - Big Rich Klein

I know that you bought the Toyota back and you sold it. Now, is there anything else?


[00:24:29.950] - JT Taylor

I sold my Land Cruiser to Dan Smith, one of my best friends from high school down in Florida, and he had it for a while. And then I got it back. And then I sold it again. I kind of wish I kept that one because it was cool. It was a really good looking rig, and it was fun. It was tomb Port injected small block Chevy with a Muncie 465 Dana 300 Tera low, three to one, nine inch rear Detroit. I stretch the wheelbase, chopped the windshield frame down three and a half inches, because for some reason, they thought that every American was six foot six with a cowboy hat on.


[00:25:11.520] - JT Taylor

So they made their mind cruises really tall. So I chopped it down. But it was a goodlooking rig, and it was a lot of fun. And yeah, I kind of wish I still had that one.


[00:25:22.790] - Big Rich Klein

That's understandable the FJ 40, right?


[00:25:26.030] - JT Taylor

Yes, sir.


[00:25:26.770] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And you built old Blues sometime after the military?


[00:25:36.350] - JT Taylor

No. I came back from Iraq in four.


[00:25:39.300] - Big Rich Klein



[00:25:40.310] - JT Taylor

And that's when the Avalanche Ranch was going on. And I went over there with my buddy Dave Jones and Crash, you remember Harrison Bean Crash?


[00:25:51.510] - Big Rich Klein



[00:25:52.610] - JT Taylor

I went over there with him, and Dave rode with him on a couple of courses. And then I rode with him on Aliens and the other one that was like a snake. I can't remember the name of it, but I was hooked, absolutely hooked. And so I told Crash that I wanted to build one of his chassis. So we spent it was about three months straight and built Old Blue, and it was the first buggy I've ever built and crashed. And Dave and caught a bunch of other friends.


[00:26:33.860] - JT Taylor

Everybody pitched in and we finished it, rolled it out of the shop onto the trailer, went to Moab and raced it at the first Xray race there. That time it snowed.


[00:26:47.390] - Big Rich Klein



[00:26:48.470] - JT Taylor

And my total driving time in the car was from the shop to the trailer.


[00:26:54.420] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. I think a lot of guys do that nowadays. Still.


[00:27:00.530] - JT Taylor

Yeah. You know how much time it takes to get ready for a race all the time. You have?


[00:27:06.560] - Big Rich Klein

Yes. Every waking moment.


[00:27:08.930] - JT Taylor



[00:27:09.670] - Big Rich Klein

And plus more.


[00:27:11.870] - JT Taylor

But yeah, I still got it. It was a good car. And we did a lot of first with that car.


[00:27:18.590] - Big Rich Klein

So Avalanche Ranch. That was Steve or Moore from Avalanche Engineering. And that was that very far South West Colorado, just outside of Durango. Yeah. I did a rock crawl there back in the day. And then that's how we got involved with it. And then he had all sorts of problems with the county or the state. Or I forget what it was.


[00:27:50.020] - JT Taylor

It was County, county people that didn't like him, right?


[00:27:54.890] - Big Rich Klein

That's a shame, because it was a nice place.


[00:27:57.300] - JT Taylor

Yeah. You got to love politics.


[00:27:58.870] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. So I was at that first XRA event as well that they put on Rich and I with We Rock had done the rock crawl the week before on Saturday, and we started to get snow there on I think it was like Sunday or Monday, Tuesday. And then it snowed off and on all week long, if I remember. Right. But we helped the Weavers out with that first event after doing our rock crawl there.


[00:28:39.530] - JT Taylor

I don't even remember that, man. That's awesome.


[00:28:41.560] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. Because one of our recommendations at that first XRA was to build four courses, like an A one and two and a B, one and two, so that if they had a breakdown or a rollover or delay, they could move the cars over to the B courses so that they could keep the flow going.


[00:29:07.150] - JT Taylor



[00:29:07.970] - Big Rich Klein

And then afterwards, I told them you can't do a lunch break because you're going to lose your crowd and they continue to do lunch breaks. But one of these days, I'll get Weaver on here and we'll talk to him about all that.


[00:29:21.710] - JT Taylor

I talked to him not long ago.


[00:29:23.380] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, yeah. How was that?


[00:29:25.200] - JT Taylor

It was awesome. It was great to catch up with him. He and Jody are still doing good. And it was very cool to catch up with him.


[00:29:31.270] - Big Rich Klein

And are they down in Alabama or are they in Tennessee?


[00:29:35.870] - JT Taylor



[00:29:36.560] - Big Rich Klein

Tennessee. Okay. So, XRA, let's talk about your time there.


[00:29:45.650] - JT Taylor

That was so much fun. It was so cool because you could really hang it out because your trailer is not far away, right? It was all short runs, and just there was all the sprint. There was no strategy to it. You just had to go. Weaver was diabolical. He would come up with some courses that would kick your butt.


[00:30:15.450] - Big Rich Klein

What was your favorite place to race with XRA?


[00:30:20.610] - JT Taylor

I love Moab, but I think I'm going to have to go with Ram. Those jumps at Ram were just terrifyingly fun.


[00:30:28.830] - Big Rich Klein

True. I can remember. I think it was the first race there. There was some guys hesitated on the second part of that double.


[00:30:42.370] - JT Taylor



[00:30:43.200] - Big Rich Klein

Or off the first double across the gap. That wasn't a good idea.


[00:30:50.290] - JT Taylor

Yes. No. You have to stay on it. Of course. Matt Thompson and I one time we jumped at the first one landed, and normally you lift and then roll back into it to hit that triple. Well, I didn't lift. We hit that triple, and we were in low Earth orbit. We were in the air long enough that we talked about it, so we were high and it landed, and I had to jam the throttle to get it to pull out. But then jam the brakes because then we hit that wall.


[00:31:28.670] - JT Taylor

That was after that and bounced off of it and off we went again. So I almost screwed that up because, man, I way over jump that one.


[00:31:38.810] - Big Rich Klein

And Besides, Ram, what were some of the locations that you raced at?


[00:31:44.510] - JT Taylor

We did a couple of different locations there in Cortez. That was pretty fun. The Rock Corey, right there by town was a blast jumping off that big ledge because we were all talking about it. It's like, man, that's crazy. Nobody's going to do that. And I don't remember who the first one to jump off it was, but it might have been changed hitting. But then after that, everybody jumped it. And it was cool because you jump off this six or eight foot burnt ledge and land on the down ramp.


[00:32:13.910] - JT Taylor

And so it hurt. But it didn't hurt like it looked like it was going to hurt, right? Of course. We're all running small coilovers and air shocks at the time. So the suspension technology weren't running all the good stuff yet.


[00:32:32.990] - Big Rich Klein

So did you run mostly west or that mountain area that they competed in, or did you go east at all?


[00:32:42.350] - JT Taylor

Mark Munson and Rob DuBrock and I loaded up that one time and went back for the very first East Coast Xray there at Paragon.


[00:32:51.240] - Big Rich Klein



[00:32:52.430] - JT Taylor

And got the race there. Hi, there was guys there. John Boring was there. Eric Miller was there this 17 year old kid, and this beat up little TJ, the gold one. Yeah, he was beating that thing like it owed him money. That was the first time I got to meet him. Then we got to do some wheeling around the park after the event. And that place was amazing. It's a shame that you can't wheel there anymore, right?


[00:33:23.590] - Big Rich Klein

I agree. 100%.


[00:33:26.150] - JT Taylor

Yeah, we did this one drop off. This guy named Mikey was spotted me off this one drop off that man. It was big. It had an undercut, and he just kind of fell off of it. And Munson, he was not happy when we dropped off that thing. He was looking for something to hang on to.


[00:33:47.810] - Big Rich Klein

So a story. The first time rogee and I went out there, we helped set up the first event that they did out there that Kyle Knoffs did, and it was an error event. Excuse me. New rock. It was a new rock event, and we're driving around looking at the place. And then we started setting courses, and Bob had flown out. I had driven the XJ out with both his dad and my dad, which was absolutely a hilarious trip because we looked at other locations on the way there.


[00:34:23.830] - Big Rich Klein

Well, we get out there and we're wheeling around and we're driving Kyle's Jeep, and it only had a B pillar hoop, no full cage and rogue's. I mean, he's wheeling it like it was his commando. And at one point, he goes, well, without a front cage, put a rope on the back and hold me as I drop off of this. And it was some big Boulder, and we got all done for the day and kind of knew where we were going to set up courses and stuff and walk through with Big Kyle and little Kyle on how we set courses and what the process was and the mindset and little Kyle goes.


[00:35:10.000] - Big Rich Klein

So what do you think of our rocks, Bob? In typical Bob fashion? Go, oh, your rocks are great, but I don't know why you guys always drive around them because there was no trails off. We rock. It was, like, right along the edges of them. And it was a typical roguism.


[00:35:33.290] - JT Taylor

You might say I've never known rogue to speak his mind.


[00:35:45.430] - Big Rich Klein

I've got to get him on the interview one of these times. If I can ply him with enough adult barley pops first to loosen him up.


[00:35:55.940] - JT Taylor

Yeah. I think you have to loosen him up a little bit first.


[00:36:00.730] - Big Rich Klein

So during the XRA years, is that when you got into desert racing, or was it Hill climbing stuff first?


[00:36:13.310] - JT Taylor

I think it was desert race first because Jason Burger and Andrew Burger raced with us, and they had that badass buggy that Jason is a wheel man. He could drive.


[00:36:27.270] - Big Rich Klein



[00:36:28.100] - JT Taylor

And we met racing, and so we used to always have our time slips from our races. And it's like, what do you do? You show me yours first. What do you do? And we'd always give each other shit. And it was a lot of fun racing against those guys. And he knew I had retired in October. And so he calls me early November and goes, hey, man, what are you doing here in a couple weeks? I was like, Well, Funnily enough. My schedule is pretty free right now, right?


[00:37:07.360] - JT Taylor

And he said, you want to go to Mexico? I'm like, sure. What for? He goes to Baha 1000. I was like, yeah, what's going to cost? He goes, no, we're going to get paid. I'm like, okay, what are we going to do? He's like, we're chasing a class one for the bottom $1,000. Sign me up. So the way it works is Jason Berger is good friends with Jeff Rock, who was one of the key people on Speed Technologies team out of Reno. And they were campaigning a class one car with John Harris.


[00:37:42.290] - JT Taylor

And I can't remember who the other driver was, but, yeah, we went down there, and that was my first foray into desert racing, and that hooked me pretty hard, man. I love me some Baja.


[00:38:00.030] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. Baja is kind of a mystical spot. Really?


[00:38:05.190] - JT Taylor



[00:38:05.690] - Big Rich Klein

And it doesn't matter if you're there for racing or just touring. It's like being in the Old West rules. Typically, the rules are there, but it's not kind of the same.


[00:38:19.290] - JT Taylor

Yeah. People ask me about it, and the best way I can explain it is it's fun and scary and awesome and dangerous, and the food is amazing. The people are amazing. The scenery is crazy. It changes so much from the Joshua trees to the Bough trees to the beaches to the Cactus is going right down to the salt water, and it is still kind of wild west. It's sketchy and you can get hurt and you can get dead if you're not careful, right? But especially with the racing stuff, it's as close as I've found to combat to get your adrenaline up.


[00:39:08.390] - Big Rich Klein

Oh, wow. Okay. And you were crewing for Speed Technologies for John Harris, correct.


[00:39:17.550] - JT Taylor

Yes. I went from volunteer guy, tire changer guy to the crew chief in a year.


[00:39:24.450] - Big Rich Klein



[00:39:26.250] - JT Taylor

And then 2008 was the first year that it was my plan. It was my logistics, my plan, everything for the thousand. And we want it in class one with John Herder and Joe Whining and Chuck Dempsey and Ray. So we heard or took it out front early and was just running away, had a couple of good fights in there, but Her kept the lead, handed it off to Dempsey, and Dempsey brought it home, and we want it. That's a pretty big deal. I'm sure you've seen there's that poster in my bathroom in the shop, right.


[00:40:13.970] - JT Taylor

That's signed by Herder and Hara and Joe and Dempsey and all those guys for winning that 2008. But I was pretty proud of that of my first big crew chief gig. And we pulled off a win.


[00:40:34.470] - Big Rich Klein

That's pretty awesome. So who else have you raced with down there Besides Speed Technologies?


[00:40:45.370] - JT Taylor

Steve Appleton, Apple Racing. Yeah. I missed that guy. He was a really good dude. Corey Keys are Shannon Campbell, Mike Palmer, Pat Sims. The past several years, I've been racing with Pat Sims, Terry Madden, and I this year ran the first 433 miles in that spectrophy truck, the 211 of Pat Sims. And we did okay. We finished 13th, but we got Pat another Milestone award. So two years in a row, milestone Award. The Wilson boys out of Boulder City prepped the car, and Jeff Wilson, their dad is the crew chief, and they do a hell of a job.


[00:41:35.910] - JT Taylor

And then there's Pat. He's a walking, talking cartoon character.


[00:41:49.210] - Big Rich Klein

No. You bought the Elf class, correct.


[00:41:54.100] - JT Taylor

Yeah, I did. So. Yeah, I raced the Nora Mexican 1000, the first one in 2010 with the dirt sports team. It was Jim and Kurt and Marty Fioka and myself. So I co drove and mechanic. And then those three guys swapped out driving. We had a rollover incident with the Elf, and it got squished, and Jim was pretty upset about it, but it's racing. It happens. But then he parked it for a while and didn't do anything with it. So I finally talked him out of it, and I bought it from him, and we fixed it and then went and raced Nora with it for two years and had a blast.


[00:42:40.160] - JT Taylor

That thing was such fun to drive. And then I ended up selling it to Greg from Rugged.


[00:42:48.260] - Big Rich Klein



[00:42:49.260] - JT Taylor

And he redid it beautifully. I mean, it is showroom, and it's sitting in their showroom at the new Rugged shop.


[00:42:57.490] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. I wondered what happened to it.


[00:43:00.330] - JT Taylor

Yes. She's got a happy, healthy home. So it's pretty cool when I see videos that Greg does at the Rugged shop, and I see it in the background. It makes me smile.


[00:43:10.430] - Big Rich Klein

Because when that car was built, it was supposed to be class eleven but it didn't fit the score. Class eleven rules. Quite, I guess.


[00:43:24.530] - JT Taylor

No, it didn't. I don't know what other disconnect was on that, but it's funny because we were at Horsepower Ranch with Speed Tech, and then that car showed up. Mike and Jody Weaver were with it, and it showed up and it wouldn't run. So me and Burger went over there and were looking at it, and I knew Volkswagen from racing them. So they had stuck the distributor 180 out. So I had turned it over. I heard that. So I said, stop. I pulled the trigger, lined it up, restabbed it.


[00:43:54.190] - JT Taylor

And it got it fired up. And Mike and Jody comes walking over Mike's, like, how the hell did you do that? He's like, people have been trying to get that thing started for two days. I'm like, well, the distributor was $180, so, yeah, I got to see that car back then, but, yeah, they ended up having to run it in Sportsman, and Jason Sheer was supposed to get in the car. So he rode with us down to the road going into Bay of La, was hanging out with us, and we had an issue in a silt bed and got a shock broken.


[00:44:26.930] - JT Taylor

We got run into. And then, of course, they helped it make it him. So none of us got to see either race car down there.


[00:44:35.430] - Big Rich Klein

That's the story of Baja. Yeah, absolutely.


[00:44:40.110] - JT Taylor

But, yeah, it's just crazy how early with being around Cheer and burger and being around that car, and then it just comes full circle and then end up owning the car. It's crazy. It's all this weird and incestuous little world that we live in.


[00:45:02.670] - Big Rich Klein

I agree. And that's the nature of off road. It's like with businesses in off road, and it doesn't seem to matter what. But you go to Sima one year and you collect a bunch of business cards. And the next year, you go see those same people and they have a new business card. But they're still an off road. They're just with a different company. Nobody ever leaves. Very few people ever leave off road. They just kind of, like, migrate to another spot.


[00:45:39.730] - JT Taylor

That's true.


[00:45:41.650] - Big Rich Klein

Changing business cards.


[00:45:44.290] - JT Taylor

Yes, I know that. Well.


[00:45:48.910] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, you do, don't you? So then when did the relationship with Torch mate and Bill get started?


[00:46:02.770] - JT Taylor

Shoot. I forgot about that race with Torch mate with Bill Coons and Greg Jones and Mark Leverett and Brad Lovell, Jake Povey, Nick Sosha.


[00:46:18.850] - Big Rich Klein

And that was the class seven.


[00:46:21.670] - JT Taylor

It was a class seven truck that V six would cut a hole in you with that residence that it had.


[00:46:34.610] - Big Rich Klein



[00:46:35.060] - JT Taylor

When was that? I don't even remember the year, man, but, yeah, we raised that seven truck a couple of times. Marty Fioka ICO drove with him that one year in that truck. And then I remember that we were in between Mike's over behind Simpsons. You know, when that little Oak robe that's in there.


[00:46:59.040] - Big Rich Klein



[00:47:00.150] - JT Taylor

And it was cool. So I opened my visor and a Bee flew in and stung me right in the face. And I was like, wow. And Marty's, like, what happened? It's like a B got me and he's freaking out. Are you allergic? Are you okay? What do we do? I'm like, shut up and drive, Marty. I'm good. Go. But, yeah, that was a great time. Bill is a really, really great American.





[00:47:35.360] - JT Taylor

Agreed. Greg Jones, man, he's crazy, but such a good dude, man, if you want something tested, let him drive it because, man, he was hard on equipment. But, yeah, that led into me working for Torch mate and being their sponsorship manager. So, like, all the packets would come into me and I would review them and figure out who we were going to sponsor and who was a good fit for a marketing partner and who wasn't. And that was fun. It was a different kind of gig, but it was fun.


[00:48:20.230] - JT Taylor

And then we built the TTB car. It was a Jesse Haines design with Nick Socia in there and and Mark Leverett and Mike, just a lot of effort. A lot of people getting in on that car, and it was different doing a twin traction, being front end. A lot of people thought it wouldn't work, and the whole build was on pirate and just amazing work, the welding that those guys can do. I mean, it just blows my mind. And then the design because, you know how Jesse's brain works.


[00:49:05.930] - JT Taylor

It'll hurt your head, like looking at the steering that they came up with on this car. It'll hurt your head, right?


[00:49:14.040] - Big Rich Klein

But it worked.


[00:49:15.350] - JT Taylor

Yeah. There was no bump steer through the whole thing. It just would get down in the rough stuff, man. It worked good. Well, you know, I got that car back, but then I sold it. I sold it to Bill. He owns it now, right.


[00:49:33.930] - Big Rich Klein

And I think he's campaigning it again this last year.


[00:49:37.940] - JT Taylor

He is. He and Jake Coby are racing it, and they've done pretty good. They podiumed a couple of times. He had an he put it upside down, and I was the first one to him, and he's like, I'm happy and not happy to see you.


[00:50:00.550] - Big Rich Klein

That's what I always tell people when we were doing the dirt riot racing is that you didn't want to see me or Josh when Josh was still working with us while the race was going on. Because that means there was a problem.


[00:50:16.510] - JT Taylor

Exactly. Yeah. You're either crashed or in trouble.


[00:50:20.320] - Big Rich Klein

Yes. So what was the favorite car you ever got to drive? Maybe not even in a race situation.


[00:50:33.110] - JT Taylor

I think the fastest. Well, I know the fastest one I ever drove was a rough turbo 911 in Germany on the auto bond at 155 miles an hour on the auto on.


[00:50:46.590] - Big Rich Klein

And that's a legal unlimited speed limit, isn't it?


[00:50:52.110] - JT Taylor

The section that we were on. Yeah, it was unlimited. So. Yeah, that was pretty amazing because you slowed down and you think you're crawling. It's like you feel like you can get out and walk and you look down and you're doing 80. Yeah. When you get above 120, things happen really fast.


[00:51:12.150] - Big Rich Klein

True. Very true.


[00:51:13.800] - JT Taylor

But that was probably the coolest go fast car I've ever gotten to drive off road race car. I'm going to have to go the TTB, man, that thing, that is a great car. I'm really happy to bills got it. And he's campaigning it because with being the race director and running all those races, I just couldn't give that thing the love that it needed and campaign. It the way it needed to be run, right? It was sitting a lot and it was a shame to let that piece of art sit.


[00:51:52.060] - JT Taylor

So I'm glad it's back out there.


[00:51:53.860] - Big Rich Klein

Now, how did that one compare with, like, Burkett's car? That's also the TTB.


[00:52:02.410] - JT Taylor

I've never gotten a mess with Per Kett's car. It's a good car. He's done okay with it. I've never really looked at it that close.


[00:52:16.260] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. Yeah, I know. He raced with us a number of times and won at least one race with it at Canyons outside of Fredericksburg, Texas. But that's the one time that Wyatt Pemberton showed up with the Unicorn to race as well.


[00:52:36.650] - JT Taylor

Oh, really?


[00:52:37.380] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. And I think the unicorn was a little bit too big for that course. Maybe. But it was quite a battle out there. But I've never been the engineering nerd. I just make sure the cars are safe. My tech is always like, okay, belts are attached. They're not afraid. Seats are anchored in properly. Two fire extinguishers. I go through the list that way. It's a safety item. I don't worry about class until somebody's cheating in the class, and it's brought to my attention. But we were a little bit more regional and allow a little bit more.


[00:53:25.050] - Big Rich Klein

But how did things come about? From you going from racer to being staff and race director with Dave at Ultrafour.


[00:53:41.470] - JT Taylor

So we had just finished the Mexican 1000 and we were down in Cabo and I was having dinner with Dave and he says, hey, man, can I talk to you for a minute? And so we step away from the table and he tells me he's got throat cancer and so I freak out and he goes, no, it's going to be okay, man. We'll be alright. And we're going to work through this. He said, but I want you to be the race director while I'm out. I said, yes, of course.


[00:54:20.450] - JT Taylor

And he's like, what's it going to cost me? I'm like, just pay for my travel. I said, we'll just do it that way. I got this. So that's how we did it. And he already had an amazing team in place. And so it was pretty easy and fun. We had a blast doing it. It was Shannon Welch, Ron Stobaugh. Simon Sainz, Texas, Jesus, Roxy. And then Goodby was coming and doing the timing. And then Shon. Shon Wilson?


[00:54:53.410] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. What an amazing guy.


[00:54:55.350] - JT Taylor

Oh, God, I miss Shon so much. Such a good dude.


[00:54:58.080] - Big Rich Klein

I agree.


[00:54:59.550] - JT Taylor

But we had a blast and it went well. And then Dave got healed up and came back and he called me. He was like, So are you having fun doing this? Yeah, it's pretty fun. Like, do you want to do it more or are you tired of doing it? I said, Well, just ask me. He goes, alright, fine. He said, you want to do this? He said, I'll pay you. I said, sure, let's do it. So I was there for seven years, right.


[00:55:36.390] - Big Rich Klein

That's when you met Shon Wilson, right? Yes, sir. When you became the race director.


[00:55:42.630] - JT Taylor



[00:55:44.490] - Big Rich Klein

I met Shon. He was part of the club in Cedar City, the four wheel drive club when I was living there. And him and Dean Bullock and Buzzy Bronzema and a bunch of guys.


[00:55:56.850] - JT Taylor

Good dudes.


[00:55:57.990] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. Awesome guys. And like you said, yes, Shon is definitely one that's missed. And most people didn't even know he was around because he was so quiet and just did whatever needed to be done.


[00:56:12.630] - JT Taylor

Just getting shit done is what S did.


[00:56:15.220] - Big Rich Klein

Yes. To the point that it really took a toll on him too.


[00:56:22.050] - JT Taylor

Oh, I know. It would suck watching him fight through that fibromyalgia and fight through the pain, you know, building Hammers or even at a regional race. It hurt watching it. And he was so not so much stubborn but just self reliant that he didn't want to put it on anybody else and didn't want to be a burden to anybody.


[00:56:46.060] - Big Rich Klein



[00:56:47.430] - JT Taylor

But yeah, he is definitely missed.


[00:56:51.210] - Big Rich Klein

So let's talk about those times at Ultra Four and becoming the race director. What was that first race like? Because was it Koh was the first race you did?


[00:57:03.990] - JT Taylor

No. Because David already done the stampede. He had asked me, and then it was going to the Stampede. So that's when he announced he went and did the race because I already had a prior commitment because I was still crew chief for Brad Level in short court, and I couldn't leave Brad hanging. So I told David I got to go do this. I can't leave Brad out. And so he went and did that race and then announced that I was going to be the race director. So the first one I did was Badlands there at Kyle's place.





[00:57:40.590] - JT Taylor

And it was different. I mean, being on the front side of the driver's meeting instead of being talked to, it was intimidating. But at the time, all the guys and girls that were racing were my friends. And so it was pretty easy. And we set up a good course and we had fun qualifying and we went around Narnia because screw that place. I hated that section, but yeah, it was good. And we had our struggles with the timing and scoring for years, just fighting through that. But goodbye always did a great job with it.


[00:58:31.740] - JT Taylor

Yeah, it was just a good team. It really wasn't even like it was anybody in charge. It was just everybody kind of got stuff done.


[00:58:40.430] - Big Rich Klein

It's one of the things I think Dave has done a really good job with is always surrounded himself with people that were solid and could take care of business.


[00:58:52.790] - JT Taylor

Yeah, I agree.


[00:58:54.310] - Big Rich Klein

Well, you there for seven years. What was it like setting up King of the Hammers and dealing with everything that had to be dealt with out there?


[00:59:13.350] - JT Taylor

It's like a deployment because, I mean, face of the Lake back. Looks like Canada are. Yeah, it's like a deployment without getting shot at it's a lot. There's so many moving pieces to that that it's hard to wrap your head around and being out there for five or six weeks living in the desert, it gets tiring, you get worn out. But again, the people that were in place, everybody just did their part. I mean, we got Travis and his team doing all the tech stuff and laying electrical grid and putting in Internet, and Tony Caulkins comes out from Arkansas and Lindsey Fischer from Colorado and Clint, and I mean, they just bust their butt doing all that techy stuff.


[01:00:15.010] - JT Taylor

And so that's something I never had to mess with because it's not my Lane. My Lane is the Racecourse stuff and marking and GPS and all that. Dave would lay out the course because he always had it in his head a year out. And then I'd go out and run it and GPS it and do some tweaks here and there, but then always looking for new stuff to keep adding to, like, idle issues and her problem and hell to pay. And just adding some of that stuff just changed up to make it fun but difficult.


[01:00:56.440] - JT Taylor

I mean, hell to paint, no joke, and neither of issues. I mean, they're hard, but, yeah, it's crazy, the amount of moving pieces that's there, and it takes a month to build it and five days to tear it down and we would leave and it would be cleaner than when we got there. We were all pretty proud of that, spent a lot of time and money to hire people and to clean it ourselves. And the racers did always do a good job. There was some of them, like the poo barrel incident.


[01:01:33.740] - Big Rich Klein

I was going to bring that up.


[01:01:35.950] - JT Taylor

Yeah, the Poo Barrel incident, that was special. I don't need to do that again, but I didn't have to call out the team that did it, and I still won't because it was an accident. It was a miscommunication, and it wasn't intentional. And I did some call outs on social media for people leaving trash in their pit areas. And one of them was Dwayne Garrison. I called him like, Dwayne. I know you didn't leave this. He goes, hell, no, I got pictures. I'll send them to you right now.


[01:02:11.980] - JT Taylor

I clean my so somebody had put taking their trash and put it in Dwayne's tent. Yeah, so they're shady.


[01:02:20.170] - Big Rich Klein

But if there would have been empty Mickeylobultras, then you knew it was Dwayne Garretson's trash.


[01:02:28.390] - JT Taylor

Yeah, but, yeah, he was adamant. He's like, no, sir. And I said, I didn't think so. I knew you wouldn't do that to me. But once I did that a couple of times, it got way better. The racers did an amazing job the past several years of taking their trash with them, and we helped facilitate it better by having dumpsters more available. It was a hand in hand thing, but it all made the staff's life a lot easier.


[01:03:04.070] - Big Rich Klein

So the adding in during that time, the expansion of the UTVs, because the UTV thing went up and down a couple of years there. I did the first UTV race there, and Jeff and Dave didn't want no part of it until they saw that we had 20 some rigs show up with only, like, two weeks worth of notice. And then they decided to do it. And then it kind of didn't go anywhere because it was kind of like an afterthought, of course, for what they were wanting to do or used to doing.


[01:03:49.650] - Big Rich Klein

And then it made a comeback. What was it like looking at a course and having to judge the terrain, figure it out so that you could put all those classes of vehicles across basically the same terrain.


[01:04:13.490] - JT Taylor

It was a challenge. I mean, it always is because you don't want to throw the stock guys in on something that's just going to cause a bottleneck and break all their cars, because that's not fun. That's not racing. You want to be challenged, but you don't want to plug up the works and not have them racing. And it used to be that way with UTVs. Not anymore, man. Those UTVs are as capable as a 4400 car.


[01:04:41.690] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, technology has really pushed forward with them.


[01:04:45.030] - JT Taylor

Yeah, they're not golf carts anymore. They will go places that they probably shouldn't be. But, yeah, the technology has definitely caught up because they are legit race cars.


[01:05:00.890] - Big Rich Klein

So what was it like then? Adding in the T ones or the trophy trucks?


[01:05:07.970] - JT Taylor

That was pretty fun. The challenge of building a course for them that would flow was pretty fun. Dave and I had a good time doing that. And having those guys the big names come out and race a race that we were putting on was an honor. To be honest, I'm a huge fan of all the offroad racers, period, but from going way back from being a kid, Ivan Stewart was one of my heroes and to have that caliber of the driver bring the desert trucks out and race out there, it was pretty cool.


[01:06:06.710] - JT Taylor

I didn't want it to take away from our drivers. And I think the way it was done, it didn't because I definitely didn't want to take away from our guys and girls that have busted their butt to get to where they are. But I don't know, I hope everybody enjoyed it. And I think it went pretty well. And like I said, it was a challenge to build the course, but it was fun. And then I got some good compliments on the backside from several of those trophy truck drivers saying that it was a good course, it was technical.


[01:06:46.370] - JT Taylor

It flowed well. It was marked well. So that was a huge compliment.


[01:06:53.130] - Big Rich Klein

And then working with Jimmy Lewis on the King of the Moto, the amount of people that would come in and out on that first weekend for the motor race and stuff, talk about that.


[01:07:15.490] - JT Taylor

Those guys are insane. You couldn't pay me to do that stuff on a Moto. Ain't no way. And Jimmy Lewis is evil. He has a black heart because the stuff he makes those guys do is evil. But Jimmy is such an amazing person. He's just cool as a cucumber man. I love working with that guy.


[01:07:42.610] - Big Rich Klein

His abilities on a motorcycle are absolutely phenomenal. Oh, it's crazy because he wrote all that stuff. He just didn't walk it or go. Okay, we're going to go up this. He actually would ride that all that stuff anyway.


[01:07:57.550] - JT Taylor

Yeah, I told him I said you probably should go get a cat scan because I think you got something wrong in your head. But no, the Moto. I basically was just helping Jimmy. You know, I didn't lay the course out or any of that. But when it came to it was our crew would go assist with the starts and setting up banners and arches and stuff like that and make sure that we had spectators back. So just helping Jimmy and his crew manage that part of it.


[01:08:31.380] - JT Taylor

So it was pretty fun. Crazy man. Yeah. Like you said, you couldn't pay me to do that.


[01:08:41.950] - Big Rich Klein

So in Hamilton, was that a juggling act with getting the regular Ultra four teams in there inside the gate for the most part, and then bringing in the Utvers and then the Moto guys and then the desert racers and trying to get everybody in the same footprint as people went in and out.


[01:09:16.640] - JT Taylor

Yeah, absolutely. It was a juggling act. And our crew that was on that just did an amazing job. Honestly, I don't know how they did it, but Simon, when he was doing the assignments and stuff, he did a really good job. And then Rusty would be out there doing the parking and running people around and getting people where they need to be and just busting his butt. Yeah, the in and out of all of that is pretty amazing that it actually works.


[01:09:53.870] - Big Rich Klein

Let's talk about Europe and going over there with Dave and getting the European guys started with Ultra four.


[01:10:07.310] - JT Taylor

So I came in after they had already got it started some, but, yeah, I went over there and would go help with the races. You know, Chris Bowler is the race director over there, and he does a really good job of setting up courses and marking them. And Richard Crosslin is overall of the whole thing. But their crew over there, Dave Robson, drew skins, poultry Magda. They have such a really good crew that has such a love for it that it was a lot of fun to go and help run the race because they didn't need us to be there.


[01:10:58.740] - JT Taylor

They completely can run that autonomously. But it was a lot of fun. Hey, to go to Europe and travel and see things and get to go back and see my friends over there. But it was just a joy to go help them. And it was awesome going to races, because when you got people from Malta and Portugal and Italy and Spain and England and Wales, just all in Germany all together into this one group racing. And it's just a blast. And I think the one thing that we did help do is we kind of got them to be together because at first going there, it's like this group was set up over there and they wouldn't socialize with that group because they're from a different country because of how the Hammers is and the culture here and how everybody helps everybody and us talking about it and them seeing it.


[01:12:08.930] - JT Taylor

It started happening in Europe, and that was pretty cool to see.


[01:12:14.690] - Big Rich Klein

Absolutely one of the things that we tried to do with Dirt Riot and what I tried to explain to Dave the first time, and Dave and I will have this conversation when I do an interview with him. He wasn't all GungHo about me starting Dirt Riot, and I tried to explain to him that we weren't competition. We had helped to help grow what he was doing. And at first he couldn't fathom that idea. But it was basically I told him I said, my goal is to take these guys that are regional racers or guys that want to race.


[01:12:56.390] - Big Rich Klein

And I started Dirt Riot right after the Weavers dropped XRA, right. Because I was like, okay, you got all these short course cars basically is what they are short duration cars, and those cars are not ready just to go turn around and go race at Koh, right. So it's like, let's create something that's in between. I didn't want to do just a trophy dash, like XRA was. I wanted to do something that was repetitious so that drivers would learn what it was like to drive fast for a long period of time.


[01:13:39.710] - Big Rich Klein

Kind of like a training school.





[01:13:42.960] - Big Rich Klein

And so I remember the first conversation I had with Derek West is he was like, man, I want to do point to point races I want it to be 2 hours long and go. I don't want to do over the same terrain over and over and over. And I said, Well, think about it. That's how you're going to get better. And he's like, what do you mean? And I explained, you hit that corner, you see, it seven, eight, nine times. You're going to figure out how to get through it faster.


[01:14:10.220] - Big Rich Klein

And then once you do a bunch of tracks that way, the next time you go to a race course, you're going to see something. You're going to go. Okay. I know what to do now. And it might be on your first lap. And it also taught guys, too, how to work together because we built what we called the dirt, right? Family. Those racers, when they were ready to move up to Ultrafour and go to Koh. My idea was so that they'd be successful instead of going out there going 2 miles or 20 miles and then having to load it back up on the trailer and never show back up because they'd spent their wad.


[01:14:53.530] - Big Rich Klein

They didn't have fun, you know, whatever, right. And I think we were successful at that in creating that family type atmosphere. When people showed up, the Texas guys knew the California guys. The guys in the south knew the Colorado and New Mexico guys so that it became a family where people could. If they had a problem, they could share pit crews, they could share resources.


[01:15:24.540] - JT Taylor

Yeah, exactly.


[01:15:27.270] - Big Rich Klein

And that was our goal. And I think it worked.


[01:15:30.870] - JT Taylor

You did? I think you guys did a good job. I was at several of them, and it's it was always a good feel.


[01:15:41.790] - Big Rich Klein

Plus, I didn't let anybody get away with a bunch of shit. Anyway, that's always been my personality. These are the rules. That's it. It doesn't matter who you are. You're going to play by the same rules.


[01:15:57.930] - JT Taylor

Yup. No, I agree. Everybody has to be treated the same.


[01:16:00.860] - Big Rich Klein

Right. Let's see. You're gone through Ultra four. Of course, this last year decided to call quits and do something else. When you did that, I got in touch with you. And I said, okay, what do you got planned and you were going to do some airboat racing?


[01:16:22.050] - JT Taylor

Yes. Still working on that.


[01:16:24.180] - Big Rich Klein

Still working on that. You've been helping Doug Jackson with his stole events, the short take off and landing.


[01:16:32.580] - JT Taylor

Yeah. That's been a lot of fun. I want to continue helping him with that when I can, because I really enjoyed that. That was cool. And then you guys coming out, Shelley helping or doing the scoring was amazing. She's so good at that.


[01:16:47.790] - Big Rich Klein

And now you've got something else you're doing? Yeah.


[01:16:51.850] - JT Taylor

I got hired by Mid American Outdoors and Jay, Oklahoma. It's a good size park and probably one of the nicest parks I've ever been to as far as amenities. I mean, the bath houses and the individual shower rooms, and they got two different car washes there to wash the rigs and the main store and restaurant upfront. And then it's got a great short course and it's got great writing. We're moving pretty quickly on a lot of stuff. There's a new series that we're starting. First race is going to be at the end of February at Jay, Oklahoma.


[01:17:41.930] - JT Taylor

It's called the Nine one eight race. So it's a 91.8 miles race. I've already built course for it. It's going to be a really fun 9.8 miles lap and then do ten laps, and we're going to race Moto's, ATVs, UTVs and then a full complement of big cars. So stock all the way up through unlimited.


[01:18:06.000] - Big Rich Klein

Okay. And I saw that it has a guaranteed purse.


[01:18:13.610] - JT Taylor

It does. The entry fees are good and affordable, and then the payouts are really good. I'm thinking about building a car and going back to racing to pay off. I'm just kidding. I can't race my own race, but, yeah, it's going to be a lot of fun. We're going to travel around. We got different locations that we're going to hit, and we're going to put on some good fun places.


[01:18:47.100] - Big Rich Klein

So they won't all be at Jay at Mid America, then?


[01:18:51.360] - JT Taylor

No, sir. The schedule is just about finalized. I'm waiting on two phone calls.


[01:18:56.440] - Big Rich Klein



[01:18:56.710] - JT Taylor

From park owners, landowners, and then the schedule will be out very shortly.


[01:19:04.350] - Big Rich Klein

Can you tell me, like, the regional area that those races will be in Midwest East.


[01:19:13.480] - JT Taylor

And we've got one in Utah?


[01:19:16.660] - Big Rich Klein

Okay, cool.


[01:19:20.550] - JT Taylor

So, yeah, it's going to be good. It's a OE. It's American offroad endurance.


[01:19:32.710] - Big Rich Klein

How many events is the series six race series? Six race series. And you're looking for anybody to do scoring? Shelley told me to make sure I mentioned that. Now I know our schedule is probably not going to line up for this year, but with what we've got going on, maybe in the future, we can work together if you need us.


[01:20:01.270] - JT Taylor

No, we need to talk about that, because anytime I could have Shelley help me do scoring, I am going to sign up for that. That's a no brainer.


[01:20:09.570] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah. I don't know how she pulls it off.


[01:20:11.640] - JT Taylor

I don't either. It hurts my head.


[01:20:16.810] - Big Rich Klein

Yeah, I'm looking forward to that. I've noticed some of the Facebook posts about it and some of the comments not a lot of blowback.


[01:20:28.630] - JT Taylor

But it's always going to be. Yeah, but we don't want to go any negative on this. We want people to have a set of rules that I'm working on and a schedule that if they want to go race Ultra for we want them to do that, but then we want them to come race with us because it's good for the industry. It's good for the racers. It's good for the sponsors. Competition is healthy. And we are going to do this correctly. And I'm not going to badmouth Ultra four.


[01:21:06.590] - JT Taylor

I mean, it's my family. I'm not going to bad mouth. I'm not going to bad mouth, Dave, right?


[01:21:10.490] - Big Rich Klein

No, not at all.


[01:21:12.850] - JT Taylor

I don't need to go down that road. We went a different direction, and we're still friends. I wish him the best. I wish Ultra four the best. I hope Hammers goes off without a hitch. And with the competing series, we can just keep growing this thing, make it better.


[01:21:40.050] - Big Rich Klein

Right. And that's what happened in the early days of rock crawling. I mean, at one time there was like, seven promoters.


[01:21:47.850] - JT Taylor



[01:21:48.640] - Big Rich Klein

And then I think what it being a downfall of that was that the one promoter tried to absorb everybody else to control absolutely every facet of it. And I wouldn't buy into that, right. For one thing, it didn't make financial sense for me to do that with them. So I just kept doing my own thing. And here we are, 21 years later, getting ready to start another season, and the other organization could have kept going, I think, had they not overspent or over, maybe some of the backers weren't in it for the right reason.


[01:22:42.410] - Big Rich Klein

They weren't in it for the love of the sport. Maybe they were in it for a financial gain, which was never my base. My base was just because I love the drivers. I love the sport, and it has to make sense financially, because you can't lose money putting on races, of course, or at least not consistently.


[01:23:04.560] - JT Taylor

Yeah, you're going to have it. When you're starting out, you're going to lose money, but then you do it right. Then it's going to come back around, correct. But no, I agree. That was one of the reasons it was really hard for me to leave Ultra because I freaking love doing races and laying out courses and talking to the drivers and just seeing the smiles on the faces of people, even when they if they break. There was a guy at Tennessee this last year, and he broke in a UTV and he was a new racer.


[01:23:47.740] - JT Taylor

It was his second race, and I went out there to him and got him pulled off the course. And he's like, thanks, man. I'm like, no problem. That's what I do. I want to make sure you're safe. He goes, no, he's like, thanks for doing all this. He's like, I love this. So thank you. And he was all smiles and he broke. And that's the thing. That's the stuff that just makes me love doing it, right.


[01:24:13.200] - Big Rich Klein

And that is for me. What I believe my legacy is, it doesn't matter the accolades I get from people in public, ever, no matter what happens in the future. As I start to step out of the role that I've played for 21 years, I'm not looking for recognition or Fame or fortune or any of that kind of stuff. I've learned not to do that, but it's the people that we've been able to put together and the relationships that they've built because of what the events that we put on and then also the technology and the businesses that have grown from doing it.


[01:25:05.790] - Big Rich Klein

That's my legacy. I feel. And I'm hoping that Dave and yourself and anybody else that is on the non racer side understands that as well.


[01:25:18.770] - JT Taylor

Yeah. No, I definitely do. And the families that I'm working with now, Jason, Robinette, Gayle, Robinette, and then all of their extended family there at Mid America, they have that glance in their eye about racing, and I love it. And they understand that. And I think it's going to be really good. I think it's going to be awesome for the racers.


[01:25:53.890] - Big Rich Klein

That's cool. And they have the wherewithal it appears to make sure that it's going to be a class act. Hiring you to facilitate that, of course, is a huge step, but also the way they have. I've not been to their park, but I've heard a lot about it, and everybody raves about it, like you were doing about the infrastructure and the layout, and they're not afraid to put some money and effort into building. No, not at all quality. No.


[01:26:30.170] - JT Taylor

And that's what we're going to do on this series. The races aren't just going to be races. They're going to be events. So we're going to have live music and we're going to have hospitality and it's going to be good. I think it's going to be a lot of fun.


[01:26:48.970] - Big Rich Klein

And so Besides, the American offroad endurance, what else is in the future for JT?


[01:27:02.410] - JT Taylor

Well, you talked a little bit about the airboat thing. I am going to still pursue that American airboat racing. It's going to be the first time anybody's ever done it is endurance racing with airboats, and we're going to try to do it, or we are going to do it on the Red River in between Oklahoma and Texas, and we're looking at about 150 miles race.


[01:27:27.800] - Big Rich Klein



[01:27:33.130] - JT Taylor

That one, I think, is going to be a blast.


[01:27:38.350] - Big Rich Klein

That's interesting. Yeah. Whatever we can do to help you on that one, I like to experience all sorts of different things.


[01:27:50.030] - JT Taylor

Yeah, I know. Besides freezing our butts off, you and Shelley had a good time when we went airboat and down there like.


[01:27:55.300] - Big Rich Klein

Assuming, oh, I loved it. I wanted to buy an airboat. I was looking. And then we left there, came to Port A, was hanging out with Josh Jackson, and then with Rick and BB White, we wintered or did a Christmas vacation last year here and Covet extended our season. We didn't get started as soon. So Shelley was like, okay, what are we going to do now? We didn't want to leave the area. So I said, Well, you know, we were looking at condos, that kind of thing.


[01:28:32.260] - Big Rich Klein

And I said we could live on a boat. And she goes, yeah, we could. Three weeks later, we were moving on to a boat.


[01:28:40.430] - JT Taylor

I love it.


[01:28:41.350] - Big Rich Klein

Now. I got a big enough boat. It ain't an airboat, but I can live on it.


[01:28:45.650] - JT Taylor

That's all right. You can go riding on my boat anytime.


[01:28:48.110] - Big Rich Klein

All right.


[01:28:48.880] - JT Taylor

Here in Colorado, we're finishing up a motor swap on it. I blew up that LS two that he wrote it, and we're putting in over 600 horse LS three and doing the injection and doing the fuel system and putting lights on it and changing a bunch of stuff. So looking forward to getting that thing done. We fired it the other day. James Scofield helped me with the tune, and we fired it up. And I'm hoping to put it in the water in the next couple of days and go finish the tune up and then do some heat cycles on it, make sure everything's good.


[01:29:23.250] - JT Taylor

And then it will be time to take it down and pre run. That the Red River run.


[01:29:28.370] - Big Rich Klein

Well, cool. If you do that before the beginning of February, let me know.


[01:29:34.850] - JT Taylor



[01:29:35.440] - Big Rich Klein

We'll see if we can come out and meet you guys out there or something.


[01:29:40.250] - JT Taylor

Right on. I'll keep sending you airboats for sale, though.


[01:29:43.550] - Big Rich Klein

You know what? Actually, Shelley said I can't buy any more boats. Now, this is our starter boat because I realized without diesels and like a fresh water maker and an ice machine and to repower and do the things I'd really want to do with this, it's going to cost me. I might as well just buy a boat that's already got those. So this will be our starter boat. We'll sell this, we'll move into another boat, but we want to do the Great Loop.


[01:30:12.530] - JT Taylor

Oh, cool.


[01:30:13.510] - Big Rich Klein

And go from here, down around the Keys, up the Eastern Seaboard, through the Erie Canal, into the Great Lakes, and then down the river systems back to Louisiana.


[01:30:24.230] - JT Taylor

Yeah, you can sign me up for a leg or two of that. I'll come cast a line.


[01:30:28.960] - Big Rich Klein

Awesome. Sounds great. So what else Besides the river racing? You got anything? Is there a bucket list thing you haven't gotten to? I mean, we could probably talk for about 6 hours if we got into all the stories with you and Dave in Europe. Did you make the China trips?


[01:30:50.580] - JT Taylor

I did. I made one of them. It was so much fun.


[01:30:55.610] - Big Rich Klein

I mean, there's so much that we could talk about. We may have to do another one if I can nail you down again. It only took us, like, six months to make this one happen.


[01:31:03.550] - JT Taylor

I know. I apologize.


[01:31:04.910] - Big Rich Klein

No, you don't need to apologize. You're a busy man.


[01:31:08.450] - JT Taylor

The one bucket list thing that I am working on. I've already raised Pikes Peak three times, but I'm going back. I want to go back on the mountain. And since it's all paved now, nothing of my four wheel drive stuff will work anymore. It will. But it's not as fun, right? I'm building a 67 Coronet RT into a Hill climb race car, but it's going to be a street legal race car. So full tube chassis, a Hellcat Demon 840 horse supercharged crate motor with a six speed manual tremoch.


[01:31:49.770] - JT Taylor

It should be a handful in what year?


[01:31:53.040] - Big Rich Klein

Body 67. So are you going to acid dip it and get it a little lighter?


[01:31:58.830] - JT Taylor

No, actually, I want to kind of keep it heavy because I'm going to also do Silver State. Wow. And Big Bend and Sandhills Rally.


[01:32:08.940] - Big Rich Klein

Wow. Cool.


[01:32:10.310] - JT Taylor

My goal is to break 200 miles an hour.


[01:32:13.050] - Big Rich Klein

Whoa, yeah, I know.


[01:32:17.910] - JT Taylor

For some reason, I got it in my head. I want to be in the 200 Milehour Club.


[01:32:23.710] - Big Rich Klein

That's awesome. That's a great goal.


[01:32:27.730] - JT Taylor

It should be fun. And I've got a line at Skip Barber. So when I get the car done, I'm going to actually go to school and learn how to drive on the asphalt again, because it's been a really long time. When I was in Germany, I raced it nobrook Rink Auckenheim Rink and at Spa in Belgium. But that's been a long time ago. So I got to get tuned back up and learn how to drive two wheel drive, big horsepower on the asphalt. So I think it'll be a lot of fun.


[01:33:01.030] - Big Rich Klein

Do you think drifting would help in some of that?


[01:33:06.410] - JT Taylor

I don't know. I talked to Von about that several months ago, and he's like, I don't think that what I do is where you need to look. He said, I think you need more. I said, but your car control is amazing. And I said, Right. And he goes, yeah, he said, but when you're racing, he said, you don't want it stepping out. He's like, you want to be able to control it. And when it does step out, then you have to have that car control to gather it back up.


[01:33:34.570] - JT Taylor

I said, okay, that makes sense. And he even told me that a Skip Barber or then even going to O'Neill's or dirt fish would help that because you're racing on the dirt. Well, because we're also planning on putting some of those new Hoosiers that look like the Pike Speak specials right underneath the back of this car and go race lands in. So that's a dirt Hill climb.





[01:34:00.950] - JT Taylor

And it's my favorite road. It is so much fun. But that was the first time anybody took a rock buggy and went hilt time racing with it was myself and Jack went over to race lands in Val, actually talked me into it. And I was just kind of funny. She's like, you should bring your car over here and race. And I'm like, yeah, whatever. But then I got to think about it. And then I got some pike speed specials and lowered it down and strapped it down and went over and ran it and did pretty Dang good.


[01:34:37.020] - JT Taylor

And it was super blast. It's so much fun. And then I think we had 19 multiple cars that showed up at one time. Right? That was a lot of fun because Moody Ham was there, and Levi and Brian, Shirley and Kevin was there with Big Ugly Lauren was there. Jesse was there. We had a bunch of heavy hitters show up for that race, and we had a blast, and we got to the top on the last run, and I'd lost brakes, like, halfway up, but still stayed on it.


[01:35:23.320] - JT Taylor

But it bothered me. I thought I'd lost some time, so I got to the top, and Mooneyham was up there. He's on his radio to the guys down at the bottom, and I didn't have anybody down the bottom. It was just me and Matt Thompson, and he kind of looks over me. Goes, hey, Taylor. Yeah. What's up? He said, what was your record on this Hill? And I'm like, and I couldn't find out what the times were until I got back down, and I had won.


[01:35:52.050] - JT Taylor

I've won the run and broke my own record. But Mooningham, man, he had me sweat, and I thought he got me.


[01:36:00.870] - Big Rich Klein

Well, didn't he beat your old time? But you ended up winning, beating that time. And your old time.


[01:36:08.540] - JT Taylor

Yeah, he did. Now he stepped it up, he got me. But then that last run, Matt and I, like I said, we lost breaks, but we hung it all out because we knew we had to. And, yeah, we beat the fastest time. We beat Mooneyham and all the other guys and set a new record.


[01:36:25.220] - Big Rich Klein

That's awesome. That's so cool.


[01:36:27.810] - JT Taylor

It was a good time. But, yeah, buddy hadn't got me, man. He had me sweating.


[01:36:32.550] - Big Rich Klein

Sweet, sweet. Well, cool. I don't know. Except for individual stories on stuff. I think that we've touched pretty much everything in your across your spectrum.


[01:36:46.230] - JT Taylor

Yeah, I've had a good time. And I appreciate you having me on and look forward to hearing it out there and see how it does.


[01:36:57.550] - Big Rich Klein

Have you ever thought about coming out and trying to fit through the cones?


[01:37:03.090] - JT Taylor

You know, I did. I did some rock crawling. I did. That the sports and the rough thing with Bob Hazel back 28th.


[01:37:11.050] - Big Rich Klein

All right.


[01:37:11.840] - JT Taylor

And then I did a little bit of the stuff with Ranch early on.


[01:37:15.970] - Big Rich Klein

All right.


[01:37:17.310] - JT Taylor

In my Toyota. But then when it got to where it was courses that were just buggy courses and I was going to destroy my truck. That's when I backed out and then started doing the go fast stuff. I enjoyed it. The technical side of that and the courses that you guys built it's hard and challenging. It made you think so? I don't know.


[01:37:41.220] - Big Rich Klein

I might be talking to coming back out and do some comb dodging awesome need to get you and Lovell out there.


[01:37:50.610] - JT Taylor

That would be fun.


[01:37:52.410] - Big Rich Klein

Brad was an amazing driver.


[01:37:55.350] - JT Taylor

Still, is that dude good people? He and his brother and the whole family just good people. And, yeah, amazing driver.


[01:38:09.450] - Big Rich Klein

Well, JT, I want to say thank you. So much for coming out and being available on this Friday morning and finally getting this interview done. We'll have to do it again. One of these days that we're sitting there either in Florida or in Colorado Springs with you and do a live interview and do it over again with more story based. But I want to say thank you so much for being the friend that you've been over the years. I will throw in one thing. Camo and I were coming across Mexico from Mikes, from the East Coast to the West Coast when we spent the night at Mikes, and we were on Camo time just having a good time and not being in a hurry or anything.


[01:39:04.380] - Big Rich Klein

And we get to El Coyote. And all of a sudden, I hear somebody yelling for me, and I'm like, who the hell knows that? I'm out here. Then I turn around and there you are.


[01:39:17.070] - JT Taylor

I know that was so funny, because I'm like, we're in deep middle of nowhere.


[01:39:23.730] - Big Rich Klein



[01:39:24.760] - JT Taylor

Because El Coyote is not on the beaten path. You got to want to get there.


[01:39:29.640] - Big Rich Klein



[01:39:30.480] - JT Taylor

And I see a dude get out of the truck to open the gate with a we rock hoodie on. And I'm like, Holy crap. That's rich.


[01:39:43.330] - Big Rich Klein

It's always amazing. The people I come across in Mexico that I don't think about that would be there. That was you that time.


[01:39:54.850] - JT Taylor

That's a great story.


[01:39:57.130] - Big Rich Klein

So, anyway, thank you so much for coming on board and being the friend that you've always been. And I can only wish you all the success that you ever wish for as you move forward in life.


[01:40:11.350] - JT Taylor

Well, thank you, brother. I really appreciate it. And as always, Mikasa Sukasa awesome.


[01:40:16.870] - Big Rich Klein

All right, buddy. We'll talk to you later.


[01:40:19.240] - JT Taylor

All right. Thanks, Babe.


[01:40:20.260] - Big Rich Klein



[01:40:20.610] - JT Taylor



[01:40:22.090] - Speaker 3

If you enjoy these podcasts, please give us a rating. Share some feedback with us via Facebook or Instagram and share our link among your friends who might be like minded. Well, that brings this episode to an end. Hope you enjoyed it. We'll catch you next week with conversations with Big Rich. Thank you very much. Bye.