Join Nikita for a conversation with 3rd Decade Alumni, Kyle Mittan, on a discussion around his history with budgeting (or lack thereof) and how he became the diligent budgeter that he is today. We hope if you've been procrastinating on using a budget that this episode inspires you to get started.
Some resources if you're interested in YNAB include:
YNAB also offers a great selection of written guides, organized by topic, that anyone can use for free regardless of their subscription status.
Join Nikita for a conversation with 3rd Decade Alumni, Kyle Mittan, on a discussion around his history with budgeting (or lack thereof) and how he became the diligent budgeter that he is today. We hope if you've been procrastinating on using a budget that this episode inspires you to get started.
Some resources if you're interested in YNAB include:
YNAB also offers a great selection of written guides, organized by topic, that anyone can use for free regardless of their subscription status.
Hey , 3rd Decade community, I'm your host Nikita Wolff, and today I'm joined by Kyle Mittan. Kyle's a writer who works in public relations at the University of Arizona. He's a proud 3rd Decade alumnus who completed the two year program in fall of 2022. In this discussion, Kyle shares a little about his own history around budgeting and how he found a system that works for him. Thanks for joining us today, Kyle. Appreciate you spending your time on the podcast sharing a little bit about your history.
Kyle:Yeah, thanks for having me. Happy to be here!
Nikita:I would love if you started this off today maybe by sharing a little bit about your financial background, a little bit about the path that brought you to where you are today .
Kyle:Yeah, definitely. So my financial background was kind of a little bit all over the place. I was really grateful to find third decade. I got a referral from a coworker and friend who'd been through it and had really great things to say, and I needed desperately the guidance that I got in the class and in the mentoring sessions afterward. So yeah, I didn't have a lot of experience or, or I was, I was really lost in a lot of ways. And, and third decade really helped, helped me shore that up from, you know, really basic things to budgeting, like we're talking about today, but then also big, big picture things like investing and taxes and, and mortgages and things like that. So, yeah.
Nikita:So I mean, prior to your time with third decade , how did you used to do things?
Kyle:Um, in terms of budgeting you mean? I did no budgeting before third decade. My brief experience with budgeting before the program was with like a day or two that I tried Mint, which is an app that I'm not sure if it's still around, but it is back in like high school. I tried to use Mint for a little while and I , I mean, it was, it was just a few days. Um, and I, you know, didn't have real strong income at that point, so there wasn't really a lot to budget to begin with. Um, and it was just really overwhelming. I just sort of tried to dive in and, and there was, there was too much to keep track of and, and not enough, like really money for me to, to try budgeting. So , um, really that was the extent of it . And then after that it was like, if I wanted this new jacket, I would quickly check my checking account balance and go, oh, cool, there's money there today, let's buy the jacket, or whatever. Which of course is not budgeting, that's just spending so <laugh> . Um ,
Nikita:That's like, do I have the money? Sure. Does that mean exactly the next expense is gonna be covered? I don't know. <laugh> . Right,
Kyle:Right. Oh, I have money. Okay, I'll buy this. So, yeah. Um, yeah, I
Nikita:Think a lot of people do that.
Kyle:Yeah, for sure. Did not work all that well. Um, so,
Nikita:So then how did you, like, what was your first experience with the budget like then? Because now you're like budgeting master, like what did your first experience end up shaking out to be ?
Kyle:So I went through third decade in the fall of 2020. And I had my discovery meeting in September of 2020. And I need to shout out Jennifer Edwards, who was my mentor. I think she's awesome.
Nikita:Just,
Kyle:Yeah, just, I just think super highly of her. Um, and all of the advice that she's passed along has served me well for, you know, going on almost three years now. So , um, but she, you know, in, in that discovery meeting in, you know, mid to late September of 2020, she said, you know, the first thing you really have to do is establish a budget. Um, it's really foundational , and then everything else will follow. And so , um, I think it was the second weekend of that following October. I, it's kind of a weird story, but I had, I kind of got a , a covid infection scare, and that was back during the times that testing was not super available. So I was isolating for a , a weekend and it turned out I didn't have it. But anyway , um, I had nothing to do for like a weekend, and I had just gotten all this great advice from Jennifer and I said, okay, well, I'm stuck here for, for at least a few days. I'll, you know, set up a budget. I think I opened a savings account. I did all this stuff that she recommended that I do, and the budget was really the big thing. Um, I opened an account with an app called and a website software called "You Need a Budget" , I think it's more commonly known by its acronym, which is pronounced " YNAB". And , I just started using it. They have a three month free trial , at least back when I used it. It was a three month free trial, and I started using it and I actually used the app to budget for the, the one year subscription. They, they subscribed your your subscription Yeah. Runs, runs annually. And so I just used those three months to actually use the app to budget it and got it all set up. I, I spent that that first day just watching a ton of videos online about how to use it, why a's , um, a little interesting. It was the first app that showed up on, on Jennifer's list of, of reviews. I think she's, she, she has this, at least what she shared with me was this list of reviews of different apps. And I think her approach to it was entirely agnostic. She was just sort of, here are the, the apps that people use and know of. Here's what I think of 'em . Um, but Winab just so happened to be the first one. And I think the only cons to it were really that it's, it's a zero base budgeting system, which is slightly different , um, in that from, from a lot of systems in that it's, you know, you don't, you don't forecast your budget. You only budget the money that you have. And so every paycheck money comes in and you win a's whole thing is assign every dollar a job. And so you, you know, you allocate , you go down your budget and through all your categories and, and you know, put, put however much money you need for, for each line rather than trying to forecast out , like I'm going to have this much money on this day and so forth. Um, and so zero-based budgeting, from my understanding, comes with a bit of a learning curve for folks who are used to forecasting. That was really the only con that I, that I saw in Jennifer's review. And so I said, well, I don't have any experience with any kind of budgeting, so I think I'll be fine. That
Nikita:Almost worked out in your favor. You didn't have any like, habits to undo.
Kyle:Yes, exactly. Yeah, precisely. And so , um, so yeah, that first day it was, it was like October 10th, 2020. And ever since that day, I've been using y n pretty religiously. I log all of my purchases manually and budget every single paycheck. You know, I get paid biweekly and, and I budget every, every paycheck every two weeks. Um, and it's like, I look forward to paydays now, not only because I'm getting money, but it's, I'm also have become like a budgeting nerd. And it's fun to, it's fun to budget on on those days. So yeah, it's, it's been, it's been a really interesting, and I never thought that I would be a , a quote unquote budgeting expert. Um, and I, I don't think, I still kind of don't think I am. I think it's always a learning process. yeah. But that's the beauty of budgeting as you just kind of, you know , um, get started and adjust as needed. How do
Nikita:You build into your schedule, the manual entry of that? I know it can sometimes be daunting if people go like a week and a half before they enter in their expenses. Do you have like a daily habit or something like that?
Kyle:Oh, man, that's, that's a fantastic question. So I tried, one thing I tried to do that might work for, for folks who, who need this sort of advice, but , um, I <laugh> I did not , keep up with it . I had a reminder set on my phone , um, toward the end of the day in the evening when I'm just hanging out, not doing anything to go through it the day and, and go through my, you know, my bank statement or, you know, just my online banking and log the expenses that I, that I made that day. Um, for whatever reason, that didn't always stick. And so I just, I find myself sometimes doing what you described, like a week and a half going back and, and logging 'em . But for whatever reason, I've always been able, for the most part to keep up with that. Um, and, and to reconcile. I, it , it , it becomes tedious , every once in a while the longer you wait, of course. But , I don't know . I've been able to, to keep up with it.
Nikita:I find that for myself, I, I don't use a budget, I just use a spreadsheet, but a weekly, like Saturday evening, I have a reminder in my phone that's like, you should track your expenses. And if I go longer than that, yeah, I'm definitely struggling to like remember what it was that I bought on Amazon or at Target or whatever. So it's harder to itemize.
Kyle:Weekly's probably a good idea. Um , Daley was, was maybe too much to, to keep up with, but you've got me thinking now, weekly's probably the move
Nikita:Totally depends on the person I know. Um, yeah, Daley , if, if it's easy to build into your schedule, like I have a , a friend of mine who does it right when they get to work , um, because they have a few minutes before they like get really started with their day and stuff and it takes five minutes. And that way it's, that's a good ideas, like always these tiny chunks and it's just kind of built into the routine. So I think everyone's just a little different. But yeah, daily, weekly, whatever you can accommodate. It's just tough to wait longer probably.
Kyle:Yeah, absolutely.
Nikita:So if you, when starting the program hadn't yet been budgeting, I'm, I'm curious how you felt about that financial profile exercise that you had to complete in preparation for your discovery meeting.
Kyle:Oh, God. Uh, it was a soul crusher. Um, I, like, I , I'm not gonna lie, it was, it was tough , um, because yeah, you're talking about an entire year of expenses, like just, just logging 'em into a spreadsheet. And I should say, you know, I'm a writer, I work with words , um, and working with numbers, I just like, I know it's kind of cliche, but I, it's just not my thing. It's not my idea of a good time. So that was, that was , um, that was not the funnest thing I've, I've ever done, but I tell you what, it was super important, laid the foundation and as much as in as much as the budget is a foundation for the rest of your financial life, the financial profile is the best foundation you can have for starting a budget because you, you know, obviously it makes you go back and, and look at how your money got spent and, and then if your , you know, if , if your situation works out like mine did, then your, your third decade mentor can help you understand like, and annualize all those expenses. So like, you know, whether your , your utilities were different every month, you can at least kind of looking at 'em in a more annual kind of through a more annual lens helps you figure out an average for each month that you can start to save for. And that's the whole thing with, with setting up a budget, one of the hardest parts is figuring out, well, how much, how much should each goal, like what, what's the benchmark I should set for each of these categories? The financial profile will do that for you if you don't have a budget set up yet, that, you know, that's definitely the first step. So , um, so yeah, it was, it was really tedious and not my favorite thing in the world, but I only had to do it the one time. And one piece of advice that I got from another third decade, or that I thought was awesome is, you know, you have like a , a few days at least to get the financial profile set up. And so what I did was I just tackled one or two months, you know, in the evening, just really split it up, don't try to do it all in one sitting. Um, and that worked really well for me. But you know, the important thing is once you have it, and then once you set up, if you're using a , you know, a system like YAB or even any, you know, any other kind of budgeting system, once you do that year and then start using a budget, you don't really have to go through anything like that again, because the budget in doing the budget, you're doing just that all the time now. Yeah.
Nikita:For better or worse, it gives you a true starting point. A lot of people, yes . I think probably the most commonly mis um, mis budgeted category is related to food. People think yes . That they spend a lot less eating out than what they actually do. So, oh, yes. Oftentimes it's, it's kind of the , hard look in the mirror, I guess. And like if you are overspending in certain categories, you're not even realizing it . Like yeah , it's painful to find that out, but it's also like the only way of being able to go forward and address potential, like spending deficit issues.
Kyle:For sure. For sure. I have to agree with you completely on, on food expenses. I mean, they were just astronomical <laugh> when I, when I got started. But anyway, yeah, the financial profile, like I said, it's , um, it's tough at the beginning, but once you do it, it's um , total eyeopener. So
Nikita:Yep . That's oftentimes people's favorite and least favorite part of the program. So Yep . We're sorry, but we're gonna keep on doing it. <laugh>
Kyle:<laugh> .
Nikita:So is there anything else that you, you know, wanna touch on that you think would be helpful for those that are listening to this episode?
Kyle:Yeah , um, I'll say like, starting a budget was, to me really daunting. You know, I had the weird experience in high school that didn't pan out, and for years I was just like, I, you know, it's not gonna work. Like, I don't know, you know, I , I know I knew that I needed to do something, but I just needed the right guidance. And so third decade provided that, and I am so glad that I got back on track. What I would say to folks who are maybe in a similar situation, like not really sure where to start and, you know, perhaps it seems overwhelming , um, is to just try literally anything at first, because a system of some sort is better than, than no system at all, whether it's pen and paper or an app like YNAB or anything else that's out there. Um, and sort of similar to that, whatever system you have, it really doesn't need to be perfect. Like, you can start and if you blow your budget the first month that you've started, that's like, okay, you've still learned a few things you've learned where you need to make adjustments, you learned perhaps where you are overspending or maybe you're under budgeting and, and you can kind of, you know, kind of tweak it from there. One thing that has always sort of held me back in, in a lot of different regards, but is the fact that I'm just kind of a perfectionist about things. And I think it was Jennifer who said, you know, you, that's, that's okay. But like for, for your budget, you know, just go easy on yourself and do the best you can for the first few months and things will eventually click and become more habitual and you'll, you know, just kind of subconsciously start to understand where you need to be on, on spending on certain things and, and this and that. And so that's, that's how it worked for me and that's what I would say to anyone who is, is kind of starting out and not really sure where to start, start literally anywhere, do anything that, that seems like it would be helpful. Um, don't try to do a bunch of heavy lifting all at once because budgeting kind of unfolds and evolves over time.
Nikita:That's a great way of putting it. There's a quote that came to mind when you were sharing that. Um , I think it goes, don't let perfection be the enemy of progress.
Kyle:Yeah, exactly.
Nikita:So I'm kind of curious, now that you are budgeting, is there anything you feel like that has like, opened up for you? Like has it changed your philosophy on money, your anxiety around money or anything like that? Like how does this impact you on the day-to-day now?
Kyle:So I'm not nearly as anxious as I used to be about, about money. Um, and go , going back to ano again, something Jennifer told me, I think in her notes, she said, you know, keep in mind the budget is not the thing that tells you you have no money. It's the thing that prioritizes how you, you know, should save and, and , and allocate and spend your money. Um, and that's always stuck with me because that is like, that was always my mindset was, God, I don't want to log into my online banking right now cuz I'll, you know, I'll <laugh> I'll like have to look at how like low my, my account is just because , especially in college and things like that , um mm-hmm <affirmative> and that, that philosophy got really ingrained and it got to the point where I was just anxious about, about even knowing <laugh> how little money I had or whatever. Um, the budget has completely changed that I now look at my money always with sort of a sense of empowerment. Like I know that's maybe sounds a little weird, but no, no matter what my situation looks like, I know that I have a system that is like tried and true at this point that I can refer to, to help me make decisions that will serve me in the best possible way. That's ultimately what a budget is. I think the president said this recently , because of the federal budgeting that's going on right now, but like a , a budget is a reflection of your values and yeah , that's, I think that's really true for me. Like that's, that's how it's worked out for me. So I just kind of refer back to it when I need to, to make tough decisions and it always seems to nudge me in the right direction, but I don't feel, I don't feel anxious there , there are difficult decisions every once in a while depending on, on the situation or whatever, but I now know that the system I have works and that's really empowering in a lot of ways.
Nikita:I kinda wanna ask , um, outta left field question because it's always fun to hear people's different answers, but love it. Speaking of value-based spending, what are, you know, one or two categories that to you are worth spending lavishly in?
Kyle:Oh gosh, that's a great question. I love that. Um, I would say , um, uh, this is, this sounds a little silly maybe, but , uh, the, the budget category for my dog
Nikita:Sound silly at all.
Kyle:Okay, good, good. My dog Arlo , I love to, to spend on him as, as much as I can.And then honestly like this sounds again maybe like pretentious or weird, but watching, watching the savings, the emergency savings category grow has been really, I don't know , I like win a's sort of graphics and visuals for , for that sort of thing are really, really effective. And so watching that, watching that grow, I mean , so I'm not, that's not lavish spending, but um, that's, that's one area that the more I build up that that budget line, it's just incredibly satisfying to watch that. Um, so, but that, and then I would say, you know, gifts in general , um, it's, it's great to, to be able to finally, you know, have a system that helps me allocate money for gifts and, and therefore spend , uh, on, on gifts a little bit more effectively. If that makes sense. Um, totally. So, yep . And
Nikita:It , it like allows joy to kind of be part of the spending experience as well in those categories.
Kyle:So yes, absolutely.
Nikita:There is no shame in whatever your answers were. That's why I ask it is everyone's essential expenses or , you know, value-based expenses are different and yeah, kind of want to illustrate for our listeners that, you know, it's okay to wanna spend lavishly on your dog <laugh>.
Kyle:Yeah, totally . It
Nikita:Can all be part of the plan and yeah,
Kyle:And it's interesting how those, those values sort of maybe I guess, change over, over the time, over time when you, when you budget cuz you realize like it really helps you realize what's more important to you getting all these coffees right now, or would it be better to sock away some of that cash for , um, you know, for Christmas or that that upcoming like birthday for a friend or something like that. Yeah. Um, everything
Nikita:Has a trade-off
Kyle:For sure. That's the, that's the magic of budgeting. So.
Nikita:Well I would love if you would maybe send me some of your favorite YAB resources, cuz I know that is a platform that has definitely got a learning curve up front . It's a heavy lift, but then it's an amazing platform once you've got that going. So if you wanna send those to me, I'll link those in the show nuts for our listeners. But thanks so much again for, for sharing a little bit about how budgeting has improved your life and maybe where to get started for someone who's been avoiding it a little bit.
Kyle:Absolutely. Thanks so much for having me. I appreciate it .