A conversation with O'Brien McMahon, host of the acclaimed People Business podcast. We explored themes of self-awareness, lifelong learning, finding your passion, and continually working to become the best version of yourself. O'Brien shared fascinating insights from his own personal growth journey as well as from the wide array of guests he's interviewed on his show. Whether you're an ambitious professional, curious explorer, or someone seeking inspiration, I think you'll get a lot out this episode!
Find O'Brien's book, "How You Become You" here. Follow him on LinkedIn here.
"To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment." – Ralph Waldo Emerson
Show Notes with Timestamps:
Collective Challenge:
Think about how you can communicate better with yourself, to learn more about yourself and where you could make explorative decisions, better conversations, enhance your relationships; just more in depth knowledge of yourself.
One of the things we talked about on the podcast was journaling. So there are journaling apps, some of you may already very good at journaling, very good habits around that. For those of you aren't just take one small step towards this goal and take some of the advice that O'Brien gave about challenging yourself with questions and prompts and different things. Take some dedicated time this week for self reflection. And if it's not through journaling, maybe it's through more intentional conversations with someone close to you or spend some time in your own thoughts. We're very bad at that sometimes with our phones and our feeds and all of the commitments that we have. But if you can challenge yourself to have some progress in this area, I think it will give you greater clarity and appreciation for your unique story and the journey that you're on becoming who you are meant to be.
Music by Music Unlimited from Pixabay
A conversation with O'Brien McMahon, host of the acclaimed People Business podcast. We explored themes of self-awareness, lifelong learning, finding your passion, and continually working to become the best version of yourself. O'Brien shared fascinating insights from his own personal growth journey as well as from the wide array of guests he's interviewed on his show. Whether you're an ambitious professional, curious explorer, or someone seeking inspiration, I think you'll get a lot out this episode!
Find O'Brien's book, "How You Become You" here. Follow him on LinkedIn here.
"To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment." – Ralph Waldo Emerson
Show Notes with Timestamps:
Collective Challenge:
Think about how you can communicate better with yourself, to learn more about yourself and where you could make explorative decisions, better conversations, enhance your relationships; just more in depth knowledge of yourself.
One of the things we talked about on the podcast was journaling. So there are journaling apps, some of you may already very good at journaling, very good habits around that. For those of you aren't just take one small step towards this goal and take some of the advice that O'Brien gave about challenging yourself with questions and prompts and different things. Take some dedicated time this week for self reflection. And if it's not through journaling, maybe it's through more intentional conversations with someone close to you or spend some time in your own thoughts. We're very bad at that sometimes with our phones and our feeds and all of the commitments that we have. But if you can challenge yourself to have some progress in this area, I think it will give you greater clarity and appreciation for your unique story and the journey that you're on becoming who you are meant to be.
Music by Music Unlimited from Pixabay
Welcome to collective energy conversations, your inspiration for personal and professional growth in mid career. I'm Dr. Anna stump Your Guide to inspiring stories from a variety of professionals. A collective energy we believe in the transformative power of connections and shared experiences. Each week we delve into narratives that spark confidence and self awareness. Join us as we elevate our growth through the power of shared stories. Welcome to this inaugural podcast episode under the new title, new brand collective energy conversations. And did I pick an amazing first guest for this new platform? O'Brien McMahon is somebody I was introduced to back in the pandemic, I guess, middle of 2020. And he was just starting his podcast and was just still does make amazing content on LinkedIn always gives you something to think about brings a lot of new perspectives into fruition through his content and podcasts. And then the end of last year wrote a children's book. So I'm just so intrigued by how does he do it all. One thing I'm going to do on this new platform is make sure we start each episode with a quote, to kind of get us in the mindset of what our guest is going to talk about. So today's quote, I'm gonna win all the way back to Ralph Waldo Emerson, to be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment. So let's hear from O'Brien McMahon on how he does that, and I'm excited to have you on, I have followed you for the last couple of years. And feel like I know you because that's the oddity of having a podcast yourself. And being just as probably as voracious about sharing on LinkedIn as I am, is that I get these glimpses into some of your vulnerabilities and some of what you have going on in your thought process. So it's exciting for me to be able to talk to you for multitudes of reasons. But I, welcome to the podcast, and I'm gonna flip the script on you just a little bit. Your children's book came out in December, yes, December 2023. I had a little birthday buddy born on my birthday in 2023. And was excited the minute I saw you put that on LinkedIn, I went and bought him a copy of it, but the title is, how you become you. So I want to ask you sitting here now, how did you become you like, I want to hear your story. I want to hear your journey and how you got where you are. Yeah, well, thank you. Thank you for that. And it is funny to be that exposed. And that out there. And I've actually since starting the podcast almost four years ago now. I've had two interactions with people for the first time where they followed up with me and apologized afterwards, because they realized after the fact that we hadn't met each other, but they had been treating it like they knew me, which for me, is great. Because I like deep conversations. I can go there right away with almost anyone so but most people can't do that. But so if they're, if they're more comfortable with me, they feel like they've known me longer than we can go there right away. So I said no, I thought those are some of the best introductory conversations I've ever had. But they were a little embarrassed after the
O'Brien McMahon:as far as how I became me, I mean, I think to some degree, we all are who we are the whole time. It's just a matter of uncovering what that is. And that's really the message in the children's book that I wrote there's sort of four steps to the lyrical poem that's in the book which you know, the first one is, try as much as you can and then try try some more. The more we see the world the more we explore the world the the better lens we have for who we are and how we feel and how we react. And then next step is figure out what do you love to do? What about that? Do you love What do you enjoy? What lights you up gives you energy? What brings you that spark? The third one is What do you believe? So defining Okay, now I've seen the world I've seen how people live over here I've seen how they live over here I've seen what this looks like on this far corner of the planet and on this local community and what do I believe about this? Do I believe the things that the people around me believe or do I believe something different and really figuring out what it is that you believe on about the world and then use that and go out and do more and just do more of the things that light you up? Have more of your actions aligned with your beliefs and just constantly be cycling through that so yeah, the cycle to go back to number one, right? Like yeah, keep pushing. Go try again. You know, hey, now what do you think you know, do you push yourself further Do you still like this, what about it to you like what else have you learned? What do you believe now, and that is kind of been my MO I just always liked to explore and I'd like to do things I was a jock I got into choir, I was in musical theater for a little bit in like eighth the ninth grade. I like writing I like I taught CrossFit, I have been scuba diving and skydiving and I just I like to do a lot of things. I like to just sample a lot of different different things, different experiences, different ways of life. And once I got to college, that sort of really ramped up and I was able to get out of the community that I had grown up in, which was a great community. But just, that was the only thing I'd ever known. And it was somewhat insular. And so to be able to go to college, spread my wings, try new things. And then when I moved to Chicago, which is not where I'm from, but where I've lived the last 18 or 19 years, that just like it was like injecting steroids into it. I have done just tried to experience a lot over that period of time. And then I've actually been working with a coach for the last few years, which is where that actual framework came from. And there's more to that framework, but and actually put pen to paper and really defined you know, who am I? What are the names, I call myself? What are my principles? What are my beliefs, what are my passions, that kind of thing.
Anna Stumpf:So I take a look at the quality of the podcasts that you put out, and it feels like your full time job, like the prep that you do the variety of speakers that you have. I mean, like we're talking like hostage negotiators to like HR and CEOs, it's there's something in every podcast for everybody. And I think, well, he can't possibly be doing more. And then you're like, you've got a young family that's growing, and you've got an amazing career. So is it that that those four steps and the adult version and having the coach and like doing the things that really just bring you energy? Is that where you get the time and space for all of us? Like how? Or maybe it's what you kind of described as when you were young? That's just the pace and the way that you sample and go through life? Yes, so a couple of different ways to answer that question. I think one, I just enjoy it. And so like I enjoy deep conversations, as I said at the beginning of this, and I've worked with a sales coach through my work at Lockton for the last 14 years, I think, and when I told her I wanted to do a podcast, she her response was, I'm mad at myself for not suggesting this sooner. So I actually had a production degree from college, I did film production and audio production. I've built a very eclectic network, because I'm interested in all these different walks of life. And then I also love having deep conversations with people. And so it just it aligned really well. So I enjoy it. I love listening to podcasts, I love the opportunity to bring on somebody with a different perspective, and just really unpack that perspective.
O'Brien McMahon:I like to write so writing the children's book was a lot of fun finding an illustrator and like learning about that process of how to bring a book to the world. That's really fun. I like sales. And I like thinking about storytelling and how we communicate how we convince somebody that we're the right option to solve their problem. And so that's what I do my day to day work. I love being a father, you know, I love being a husband. And so put a lot of time and thought into that. The the flip side to that is that you can overdo it. And while I often get people who come to me and they're like, oh my god, you do it all this is so great. And you know, much like you did, like there's there's a level of admiration in that, and I appreciate it. I totally respect that. But I would caution people with that too, because there is this element of like hustle culture that's out there, like you always have to do more. And I'm guilty of feeling that I mean, I feel like, if I don't do all the things I want to do, you know, maybe my life's not gonna be worth it or like something not maybe not that extreme. But like, there's this pressure that we always have to be maximizing every minute of every day. And I do succumb to that. And I think that's what drives a lot of the great things I've done, but I have to catch myself and temper that and remind myself to slow down and enjoy the time with my wife and enjoy the time with my kids and really be present with my friends and and schedule time with friends. Right? And so there are both sides of that coin and I don't want to contribute to people who are listening to this feeling like oh my god, I should be doing more. Look at what this person is doing as you're doing more like no, I'm actually in a point of my life right now. Well, I'm just in a point with the projects I've committed to where I'm like, Alright, I get to get through these next five months and then I need to slow down and I am I keep telling my wife like you need to hold me accountable to not take anyone on any more projects for two months after my last big project, which is going to launch this summer goes live. And she's like, Yeah, no, trust me, I'm gonna hold you to that one. So there's both sides to this, right? It's, it's important to enjoy your life. And, and remember that we only get to experience these things once and it is about the relationships and the memories we make. And then also go out and do things you want to do. And you got to, you have to be able to balance both of those at the same time. And it's yeah, it's hard and you get the teeter totter will get a little off balance every once in a while. But I think it's important to remember both of those. Well, I think the one thing if I can make an observation of what you do well, and hearing that you had a multitude of interests in activities, when you were like in your formative years, this doesn't surprise me. But the thing that I appreciate about what you do, is you layer a lot. You layer guests after guests, and you draw through common themes you bring, I'm sure a lot of you talked about bringing your coaching into writing your children's book, and you talk about how that's helped you in your career. And I would imagine, you're a better friend, and father and husband, and salesperson because of all these conversations and like you layer well, like, it's not like you're out, trying to, you know, roll sushi one day and then go to a different direction the next day, like you're bringing a lot of this together and really, in a way that it's observable. I think that's what's so healthy about it. Like that's one thing, you know, like listening to you on the podcast, talk about things that you're working on yourself, or that you've noticed or your relationship like journaling, and just being really cognizant of like, Oh, I'm having some similar experience. Let me draw that in. That layering matters. So much like there, it's where the growth really truly happens. And where you can find all those different applications? Well, it's where it can get really fun, too. I think that it comes from I think, oh, what's an IP start with why Simon Sinek in the book starts with start with why he talks about how you find your why. And I think a lot of people just sit down with a blank page, and they go like, Okay, what, what matters to me. And I've tried to do that before too. And it's just never quite right. Like, you just don't ever get the full gist of it. But I like what he suggests in there, which is if you look backwards, and you look at the things that you've done, and you look at what you love about the different things that you've done, you can find the themes in there. So it's not like I came out of high school and was like, Alright, I'm gonna layer all this stuff. And I had this whole plan. Now I wanted to go in advertising, I didn't want to get an insurance, which is what I've been doing for almost my whole career. Now. I had very different plans for what my life was gonna be like than what it is now. But I just did a bunch of stuff I ran, you know, I was working out and doing normal kind of lifting stuff. Then I started doing these urban athalon, which are like these kind of weird urban triathlons, I did some triathlons, I do ran barefoot for a couple of months to try that I and then I got into CrossFit. And that wound up being a really fun thing. And I was able to coach CrossFit and help people get better. And what I realized was, I like being capable, I like having capable level of fitness so that I can do anything. And I also love sharing that back with people and empowering them to do more than they thought they were able to do. Now those two principles, right, being capable, and helping other people become capable. That's a basic principle that I can translate to anything, right. So I can take my sales job, and I can build my skill set. So I can be able to handle anything that a prospect or client throws at me. And then I can mentor the people who are coming behind me and help them achieve levels of success that they wouldn't get to or wouldn't get to as quickly on their own. And that lights me up. So I can then take those principles, and I can apply it in a lot of different areas. And the more you sort of do that reflection, where you look back and think well, what about that? What about that? Did I really love, oh, I can actually go apply that and a lot of different ways. That's that's where you can then start to layer that stuff. So you do still have to go out and just try a bunch of stuff. And some you're gonna love and some you're not I do a bunch of things that I only ever do once and they fall off. And I have fun stories, but they're not like an integral part of who I am. But then you can then you can sort of sift through the sand and figure out like, what are the basic building blocks here that we're working with, and then you can apply those on a go forward basis. I think having the ability to approach something as being capable, is really what our education I mean core, I have an educators lens. I've been in that space for 18 years, but there's this level of perfectionism that comes from how we are pushing these K through 12 and then college with these linear singular pathways where we're taking the exploration out of it. And I think understanding that just being capable is enough. and being capable gives you enough information and enough experience to go on like, yeah, whether it and knowing that you don't have to commit to something and just stay with it is a life lesson that I'm not sure our younger people are getting. So it makes me excited to know their leaders like you out there that are waiting for them when they hit, hit the workforce, because it's going to be a little bit of a shock for them. But it's funny, you mentioned Simon Sinek. One thing he does on his podcast that I just appreciate so much is he does that little bit of optimism, he asks every guest, like, share with me one of your best childhood memories. And then he asked them something else that they were really proud of recently at work. And he ties those two things together with like, their journey and what they do for their vocation and like how they show up in the world. And it really is like, impactful to think about. Yeah, well, I to that point. I mean, obviously, like writing, we've talked about that a few times, I've written a couple novels for myself as well. One I self published for family and friends, but it's not for sale anywhere and won't be. Hey, that's how calling Hoover got started. I mean, you got to just you got to just now look at her. Yeah. But it was interesting, because I got into this, again with a novel writing several years after college. And then I went back and I realized, whoa, I was writing in college, too. I wrote a bunch of screenplays in college. And then I mentioned that I was working on a book and one of my friends from elementary school said, Oh, that's not surprising. You were always like that. I was like, really? And she said, Oh, yeah, I can remember you writing song lyrics and poems. And I was like, Yeah, I did write, like, I wrote some poems for girlfriends in high school. And, like, I've always been doing that. And I actually, I just turned 40, last month, and my wife, who is an amazing cheerleader, had a bunch of my friends and family pull together videos, and share memories of us over the years. And my dad shared one. And he said, you know, you've always been doing your own thing. You've always explored so much of the world. And he mentioned a couple things I did like in elementary school and middle school in high school. And it was really nice to realize, like, oh, the things that I'm doing now I really have, it really has been me. I've just now in a position from doing all this self reflection, that I really understand who I am and who I've been the whole time. It's and you've been true to yourself. Yeah, a different application. Right? Yeah. Yeah. And there are ways that I've not been true to myself. And I've tried to correct those over the years, right. And I think that's the other benefit of reflecting and journaling and really rinsing who you are and who you want to be is, you can make course corrections. And then you can also unearth, like the richness of whoever you are. Yeah. I would love to hear more. We're flipping back and forth. But how do you go from graduating college and wanting to be an advertising which I'm sure at the time was like the multimedia and like, you know, felt like an exciting space to insurance. It's why it's not exciting and dynamic. It Well, I, here's why we know duck for sure. The way you do it. Fair, clearly, you're still doing it. So you're making it that way. But I just would love to hear what that would look like. So when I was growing up, my dad actually still does owns a small car dealership in Connecticut, shout out to McMahon, Ford, number one main street, Norwalk, Connecticut. And in high school, I worked in the shop and changed tires and did oil changes and that kind of thing. And then in college, he said, Well, why don't you come in once you come inside and learn how to sell. And so for four summers, I sold cars, and he was my boss and sales mentor. And when I got out of college, I wanted to do advertising because I felt like I could really blend the sales experience I had with this creative experience I had and really like understand both and talk to both, which is what account management and advertising is. The advertising world did not see that picture the way that I saw it. And there was I think there was a I don't know if there's a formal hiring freeze, but it was a very bad time to get into advertising. And I needed a job. And so I walked into the local pre owned for our pre owned Mercedes dealer among a few others, and just said, Hey, do you need anybody I've done this before and I have a college degree and they said, Here's your desk. And so I started there, but I knew that wasn't what I wanted. So I just kept taking different sales jobs and I was actually really turned off by b2b sales. I got into b2b sales in two different spots after that, and I ate just really, the culture wasn't great internally and in the industry and I wound up serendipitously running into somebody from Lockton, who has an old family friend, which is an insurance broker where I work now. And everything they said, sounded good, but I was still very skeptical. And but they had a training program, and they were gonna give me, you know, invest a lot in me. And I said, alright, I'll give this one more shot. And lo and behold, everybody in Chicago was saying certain things about locked in and what the company was. And then I went to our headquarters in Kansas City, and they were all saying the same thing. And then people would come in from around the country, and they were all saying the same things. And I was like, Okay, maybe this really is what this what this company is all about. And it's, it's a three and a half billion dollar, family owned business, and really has a great culture. And that I mean, that's the reason I'm still there almost 15 years later. And, to your point, the, you got to make it dynamic, right? It's deductibles, coinsurance it. So just to clarify, too, we have the commercial insurance side, I work on the total reward side. So helping companies with their benefits plans, with their compensation with their retirement plans. And the way I think about it, just like in the podcast that I do, it's all about helping people improve work for people. That's what I do with my corporate job to write it's how do I help companies build better rewards programs, so that they're cost effective, but they're also valuable to their people? And how's that evolving? How do we improve their physical health? How do we improve their mental health? How do we make it easier for them to use the system? How do we communicate that? How do we sell that vision to employees? How do we sell it to employers first to get them to hire us? How do we win? You know, feel that good? That good success of winning new deals and bringing on new clients? And then how do we actually help them? So the principles are kind of the same and thinking creatively telling a story and then solving some people problems? So that's a very long winded answer. But no, it does, in certain ways tie back and in some ways it doesn't. And that's why I still write on the side because I enjoy doing that. And then my work doesn't quite scratch that itch all the way. So I use my free time. And I do that.
Anna Stumpf:Well, and I think that is such a powerful statement, because we talk so much about Find your passion and find your passion, we're probably never gonna find that at work, right? It's why they call it work. Yeah. But if you are in a healthy culture, with a people and product that you believe in, you can find things outside, right, that make you better at your job, help you show up better for your clients, and your team and everybody else. But get you can get those passions and get those like creative juices, all those other things elsewhere, because you're not so drained from being in a role that doesn't empower you or energize you at all. I think that's so important.
O'Brien McMahon:No job is great all the time. Right? I mean, like, look at being a Hollywood actor, right? You're like, Oh, my God, he makes they make so much money, they get all this fame, they get to have fun, they get to learn all these new skills and play pretend for real life, and like, how great would that be, but they're also dealing with a bunch of agents and predatory relationships, who want to take advantage of their fame, they're working really long hours to shoot a movie or a TV show, there's a lot of stress, you know, their sort of view of reality can get skewed a little bit, because it's hard to find somebody to tell you, you know, there's like all sorts of things that come with that, where if you're actually having the experience, you're like, God, I wish I didn't have to deal with XYZ. And every job is going to have that. And so like I heard once, I'm gonna butcher the quote, but it's basically don't envy what somebody has, unless you're willing to go all in on what it took to get there. Right? Like, right, you can envy Tom Brady for winning all the Super Bowls, he won. But unless you want to actually walk that walk and live that lifestyle, commit the way that he committed, like you, you can't take some of it, right and get that result, you have to take all of it. And most people wouldn't when they look at the things they think they aspire to. They wouldn't want that life. Oh, no,
Anna Stumpf:no, I'm I agree. So how's the podcast helped you and how you've been doing it? How long now? Almost four years? That's crazy. You've had I mean, a ton of guests on that are just, I mean, they're similar, but they're very diverse, right? There's just so much unique conversation that you prepare for which again, if that is something that just probably energizes you a lot. But talk about like, what has that given you as an individual? And well, as
O'Brien McMahon:you are learning doing this podcast, the best part about having a podcast is getting to talk to all the people that you interview, right? It's like, you benefit way more than the listeners do, which is a kind of a little secret in the industry. Tell them Yeah, I mean to bring on people that you are interested in. And then to get to ask them whatever you want, in my case for about an hour. I mean, where else do you get to do that to just call up an FBI hostage negotiator and be like, can I ask you a bunch of questions for an hour and just learn all I can learn about you and willing to hear somebody going? Yeah, I'd love
Anna Stumpf:to do that. Because here's what you and I know that the rest of the world hasn't figured out yet is people love to talk about themselves. They love it. And they're like, You want me?
O'Brien McMahon:Yeah, I'm having a great time right now.
Anna Stumpf:I have to tell you like this last season that you just started with the philosophy guru who's like an HR, my son has recently, I've had to just bend and twist in this little 17 year old self. He feels like he should be studying computer science. But he does. He likes the concepts of it. But he knows he doesn't want to work in that space. But he is a voracious consumer of like all things philosophy. So I was like, I'm not sure why you don't major in this. And he says to me, right? This is the role reversal. Well, what kind of job can I get with that? And I'm like, we're not going to focus on jobs, like you go study, like the lightest load, right, the easy thing that you enjoy. So your podcast with that. Shellman came out, and I sent it to him. And I said, like, listen to this, like, this is somebody who has taken their love of philosophy and like, put it to work at the best street cred in my house right now. Because he's like, you're gonna have that guy on your podcast. So I was like, yeah.
O'Brien McMahon:That's great. I love that. It's
Anna Stumpf:so important to just listen and learn and find these things. Like, it's just it's a gift. I agree.
O'Brien McMahon:Yeah. Well, and I mean, we do that to ourselves all the time, where it's like, well, what can I do with this? It's like, who knows? But do it anyway, like, and if you think about philosophy, I mean, there are all kinds of tech companies right now battling with all kinds of philosophical problems and ethical problems, and how are we going to develop AI and self driving cars? And how are we going to teach a self driving car to choose to go left into this obstacle, or right into that, that obstacle, and, you know, they're gonna have to hit something? How do we help them make those decisions, and those are all kinds of philosophical quagmire. So, to have that skill set, you can really apply it in a lot of different ways. And you know what, maybe you couldn't, but if you're somebody who I believe is my belief, if you are somebody who seeks out knowledge, you will find applicable knowledge. For sure, you can apply all of it, I, my, my wife, God bless her, I love my wife. She got into my car one day, and I fired it up. And what came on the radio was this older British gentleman talking about trees. And she just looked at me and she goes, I love you. But there is no effing way. I'm listening to this book. And it was the book was The Secret Life of trees. And it was all about how trees communicate with each other and how forests work and what a web they are. And it was really fascinating. The guy's reading was a little was a little dry. But the content was fascinating. And I just, I haven't done anything with it. There's like no application that I'm ever going to get from that. But it was really interesting. And I really enjoyed it. And there's probably 80%, you know, the 8020 rule, there's 80% of the content out there that I consume. I'll never do anything more than maybe have a interesting conversation about it. But the 20% Like, I've experienced so much that there are very few conversations now where I can't at least offer some resource or insight or something. Back based on the people, I've interviewed the books, I've read the podcasts, I've listened to the jobs, I've worked the communities I've been involved with, like, it's just you just collect all of that stuff, and you will be able to use it somewhere. Well, and
Anna Stumpf:I had a guest on a couple episodes ago, and I was like, What is your advice to people? And he's like, just start, just start. And I think like that, long as you've been doing this, and the experiences that you've had, it makes each episode even more enriching, right, like it makes each episode more relatable. And I'm sure your prep time, you know, is less in some ways because of your experience and bits you're not assuming based on your personality and what I know of you. You're not laser focused on how many downloads you have and are people judging you or you're not you know, that's not the thing that's not the metric that's not what matters and I think that's shows through like an every episode like the the relatability and the way that you have these conversations is just something that is clear that it's important to you. And that's why you show up
O'Brien McMahon:with the eye And thank you very much. I appreciate that. I, when I do the shows I tried, I do try to think about how would this be helpful for people. And if I can get one email back that's like, like, just right now, right? If I get one person who goes, I just showed this to my 17 year old son, and it changed his perspective. Like, I cannot tell you how good that makes me feel right. And like, Oh, my God, you were the only one who listened to that. I'd be like, that was a when I was eight. That was an absolute home run. When and, and that, yes, I want people to listen to it so that more people can have that reaction, or it can help more people. But that's what I want. That's what that's what gives me the juice.
Anna Stumpf:Well, I'm gonna tell you that and the hostage negotiator, and my son thinks I'm talking to a superhero today. So don't think I'm not sharing that. Well, hopefully,
O'Brien McMahon:this won't. won't knock me down a few pegs. And that's what keeps
Anna Stumpf:me humble, right? I live with a teenager. I'm not ever going to be like, cool. So I don't even have to worry about that. I don't even try anymore. It's all good. Well,
O'Brien McMahon:thanks. So humility. You've said humble a few times. That's one of the biggest takeaways that I've had from the show that I've done. From I've, so it's come up with the gentleman, you're talking about Gary Messner hostage negotiator, it's come up with Navy Seals and Green Berets. It's come up with heads of HR CEOs, you know, taking over new organizations, it's come up in so many conversations without me bringing it up. You know, well, what leads to your success? Or what are the traits that make you successful? Or why is this group so impactful? Because they're humble, because they're willing to be humble, they are willing to listen and take feedback and improve and get better not let success go to their head. And, and I've really spent time over the last couple of years, once this, like, click that, or I was like, Jesus, this is coming up all the time, I've spent a lot of time thinking about humility. And I do agree with those people. I mean, they've demonstrated it, and I think it is something that we can all work on. And that's not to say that we shouldn't be confident, right, because like the Navy Seal is a great example, who I had on where he was, that organization is a confident organization, right? They, they go out and I mean, I, I had never talked to somebody, it was like, it was actually a little disruptive for me, it kind of messed me up in the beginning of our episode, we were able to edit it. So you couldn't tell. But I was a little thrown off, because I had never spent time with somebody who just exuded without just in their physical presence, who exuded that much confidence, and he was one of the most humble guests I've had. So I do think the two are compatible. Oh,
Anna Stumpf:that's a brilliant example. I mean, because you have to have the competence to do what they did, rightly, Oh, yeah. been tested, and you know what you could do? But yeah, that doesn't mean you are bragging, or the
O'Brien McMahon:show without confidence that I mean, in that in industry, call that an industry. You know, if you're not confident, you're hesitant, and when you're hesitant you you die, or somebody else dies. But likewise, if you're not humble, and you're not willing to get better than you will make a mistake, and you or somebody else will die. So you have to have both in that in order for you to be successful.
Anna Stumpf:So in the last several, a lot of your episodes, you talk about journaling, and kind of your. And now I'm really curious, because you've
O'Brien McMahon:got up you picked up on that.
Anna Stumpf:Because I too, have a knack for communicating. And I love to tell stories. But when I sit down with a blank journal, and I cannot get into the book, there's I've watched all the like the videos, and I've watched all the like, journal people do all and I'm just like, oh, yeah, I'm curious. If, like your Where did you decided to get started with it? And like, how does it help you? And I also that same question about coaching, because you are this like, confident, capable person who's seemingly has like, I mean, I wouldn't use that has it all figured out thing, right? But you you're very self aware. And you've got to go in? Like, when do you decide you want coaching? And like, how does that help you? So sure, it was a park and I'm sure they're probably somewhat related, right? Maybe? I
O'Brien McMahon:don't know. We'll see. We'll we'll riff a little bit on the journaling one, I totally agree with you. Like I I struggled to know where to start even still, and I've been journaling for a long time. I'm best when I have a prompt for myself. So when I have a question that I want to answer, and sometimes I'll just I can just sit down and I can think like okay, what am I struggling with? Or what do I want to improve or, you know, what am I really enjoying right now or something like that and, and that will surface different questions, you know. But if I don't have a question, I can skip that day of journaling. It's just easy to skip it when I don't have a prompt to sit down and go. And there are books. I mean, I, somebody for my birthday gave me a book of 3000 questions you can ask yourself, I mean, you can go out and find rate questions to ask yourself. And so if you're, if you are struggling, get a 365 day calendar with questions or get, you know, get a book that's a daily reflection book like daily stoic, or the coach that I work with, through becoming built is the company is built to lead the book is called Becoming built to lead. There's, there's a bunch of different ways you can go and approach that. But I find with a prompt, it's always easier. As far as why I decided I wanted coaching, you know, you and I know enough people and I think we know ourselves enough to know that no matter how confident somebody appears, there's always some stuff going on under the surface, we all have insecurities, we all have blind spots. I've hired coaches at a couple different points throughout my life. One I hired just because I felt like I was all over the place, I felt like I was working on a bunch of different things. And I was, I was, I was paddling really fast, but I was paddling in all directions, and I wasn't making any progress. And I just needed somebody to come and be like, here's the swim lane, you know, paddle in that direction. And they weren't going to tell me but they were going to help me figure out which direction I wanted to paddle in. And so they helped me just organize my thoughts and sort of figure out what that direction was. I've worked with therapists in the past to, I think the difference between coaching and therapy for me, again, I'm not a therapist, but I find therapies mostly, like how do we resolve something in the past that's holding you back? And then coaching is how do we get you through the forward looking obstacles faster, so that you can get where you want to go? That's sort of the difference to me, I would agree. Yeah. And both have elements where they're similar around, you know, you got to know who you are. And you got to have a good good sense of self and be be able to work through issues that you have in your head or in congruent ease about who you are what you want that kind of thing. But one to me is more like let's resolve the past versus let's go forward in the future.
Anna Stumpf:And both of those, it's not a one size fits all, like you have to find the person who specializes in what you're in in the moment, right, like you're trying to get through or get past.
O'Brien McMahon:Yeah. And so I have the current coach I work with the reason I chose her is that I've been in this group coaching this leadership development group at work for the last now five years. And I had done a lot of self reflection as a part of that. And I can be a very introspective person, as you could probably tell. And the thing that I've realized was, well, well, I saw in the real world that I was not hitting what I thought was my potential. Like I just in my sales, I was like I'm I'm, if you looked at me from the outside, you'd be like way to go. But like, I just feel like I could do more. I feel like I should be doing more based on how long I've been doing this and what I feel my capability is, but there's something there's some block there that I'm not able to break through. And I've done all this work. And I still can't figure it out. And I said, I kind of came to the realization that because I'm good at doing that self reflection work. I'm also good at hiding my blind spots for myself. Because I can say no, no, I've done all this. I've looked at it all. But I'm not actually going deep in the areas that are most uncomfortable for me. And so I needed somebody that I trusted who could come in, who could go like No, no, no, don't run so fast. Come back here, you just jumped over this hole. Let's let's shine a light in this hole. Let's see what's in here. Let's fill this thing up the way we need to fill it up. And now we're running on more solid ground, you know, now you're not going to trip. So that is what the work that we've been doing for the last six months. And she has been great at doing that for me. And she even had to has to remind herself because I can be really self reflective, we can have these really deep conversations we get going really fast. And her she's told me her mantra for our coaching is slow him down. So she's great. And she's been really helpful in that. And that's what I needed. And other people need different things. And it's to your point, it's all about finding somebody that you can trust and be totally open and honest with because you have to be willing you have to be able to be completely transparent and open in order to actually get the most out of it. And so you need somebody you can trust that you also feel like it's gonna be able to give you the things that you need to get where you want to go.
Anna Stumpf:And sometimes you to your point like you don't have to be in struggle. All right, you don't have to be in some urgent need to bring someone in. Like sometimes that's just like, so important to think about, like, again, you're probably like that duck where the waters look calm, but you're really just paddling really hard. But the meat the surface of insecurities up there that oh, yeah, because you're a human being. So for sure, but as you think about, you know, being self aware enough to say to your wife, like it, this date on the calendar is when we are going to, you know, I mean, that takes a certain next level of self awareness and accountability, and those things that a lot of pain, a lot of screw ups in the past. That's how we learn. That's yeah, that's why life is so upside down. Like, my goal is mistakes. My wife
O'Brien McMahon:and I communicate really well right now, because we didn't communicate very well in the beginning. But we were willing to stick with it, and work it out. And I think I was thinking about that. Recently, on another podcast I was on, we were talking about relationships. And we are better now. Because we were willing to, like, get in the muck and get to a good resolution, and then we would reflect back and say, like, Okay, that didn't feel good for anybody. How do we do that better next time, you know, next time, instead of coming at it this way, if you had just said this, that would have gotten a better reaction. And so then the next time, I'd go, okay, and I bring it up that way, and it has maybe not a great reaction, but a less bad one. And, you know, you can keep getting better from there. So I think, so much of this is just continuing to make little progress on yourself.
Anna Stumpf:So small, we, my husband, I've been married 23 years. And sometimes we will go, oh, gosh, you remember when we were first married, how you said, blah, blah, blah. And then sometimes they'll go, Oh, we're doing that, again, it's just a different look, it looks different. But that has that same back and forth, or that same barrier to communication. So you can't get complacent either, right? You can't think oh are past that. Like, that's not going to be an issue anymore, because those things sneak back up. But yeah,
O'Brien McMahon:there's the other thing too, I feel sort of self righteous when I have these conversations, because I know that I'm pretty reflective. And I know that I just naturally have a lot of interests. And I know that I take on a lot and can do a lot. And again, kind of like I said before, it's easy to feel like, oh, that's what it should be. And it's not like you don't have to be and you probably shouldn't be as self reflective as I am, it can get me in trouble sometimes to you know, our greatest strengths. Left unchecked, become our greatest weaknesses. So, but I think if you just can be a little more self aware, right? If you just pay attention, well, that didn't go well. How could that have gotten better? Right? Just that level of self awareness can have a big impact, right? You don't have to do 1000 different things. But if you challenge yourself to experience a couple of different things every year, you know, several years down the road, you've experienced a lot and you have some really good perspective on yourself. So it's not about again, it's not about going out and just doing everything and maximizing and milking every minute. It's doing it in a way that feels authentic for you. I think that's really important. Well, then not feeling judged by other people who do it more or differently.
Anna Stumpf:And just constantly questioning yourself, like going back to that journal prompt, right? Like, why what, what was I thinking when this happened? Where did I get that thought? And like, what could that have? What other way? Could I have thought about that? Right? Like, that's yeah, two or three pages in a journal. For me, sometimes I'm just a simple interaction with somebody to learn more about myself. And then to kind of go through sometimes where I wish I was better with like, the journaling apps, or I've seen people do it in their notes app where they put tags that were I would love to be able to somebody go back and like make a theme for me, but like, you've been struggling with this for six months, like you need to figure this out. But I think we have so much access to so much information in the world right now. That it can be a little level of fatigue, how much opportunity and stuff is out there. But I'm always gonna lean on this right? It's my number one Clifton strength is communication. So I just feel like talking gets talking to people, having conversations is such a great place to start. But somebody else might think, wow, did he say running barefoot? Like, I want to try that. But the thing I do know is if you are not being true to yourself, and you are not in the right space, you will not have the energy to explore. Like you have to really figure out like why am I not trying new things? Why am I not in new conversations with people? Why am I not finding the space and time for this? Because it is a choice and it is coming from somewhere? Typically, because you're exhausted for something else that you're having to work too hard at maybe but yeah,
O'Brien McMahon:and I think to the comment about your 17 year old son, you know, it's 17 it can feel like it's too late.
Anna Stumpf:Oh, yeah.
O'Brien McMahon:You know, I was talking to my brother One of my two brothers, when he was maybe 28. And he was like, Well, I'm 28. And I was like, yeah, exactly. Like, you do anything you want, you could screw up a couple more times. And you know, you're still fine over the course of your whole life. So it because we're in it now, and we don't know what it's like to live longer. And again, I'm guilty of this too. We all are, right, because we, we feel like we're stuck in whatever the thing is. But we're not, there's so much opportunity out there, which is some, you know, some lifts are big, and they are scary. And they do require big change, but a lot don't. And, you know, I see people work in bad jobs that they don't like, but they feel like they can't get anything better. You can, you can always find a better opportunity. It might not be the next one you find you might get into another bad opportunity. But just keep going until you find the good one. Again, and even that doesn't have to be the perfect one. But you can get too. You can get you can make things better if you continue to take action. Yeah.
Anna Stumpf:And I just talked to some high school students before I got on with you. They were doing like a virtual conference. And they said, Can you come talk about reskilling and I was like to high schools. Geez, I get it. That's like a thing in like the world right now. But I'm not really sure. So
O'Brien McMahon:we're still working on skilling.
Anna Stumpf:Let me think about this. So I did like, oh, yeah, that was like, they just threw down the gauntlet, I had to figure that out. And I actually, like, I'm pretty proud of what I put together, I use Chet GPT a lot, which I kept telling them, but I was to help them understand that like, not all learning you do in life, it's gonna feel like high school, right? Like, you're not always gonna have like the rubric and the standardized test, and the grade and the GPA and somebody telling you what looks good on your application to college, or thank God, I know right? Now, like should be the way you will learn in the future. And we'll definitely need to learn. But I mean, there's going to be such individualization and there's going to be VR, and there's gonna be all these great things, however, where you're going to learn the most about yourself is in conversation and, you know, collaboration with others, and being reflective. And I found this thing from World Economic Forum that the top two, most in demand skills in the next five years in corporate America are creative thinking and analytical thinking, right? And I said, like, you might be sitting here and your algebra class and your history and your English and your music and your PE and thinking like, Why do I want to go to college. That's why I like to be with people that are in growth mode, be with people that are studious, and curious and challenge you and come from a different place than you. And I tell my son that all the time, like your brain isn't even fully formed, go to college and, and grow up, like, take the time. And he's like, to your point, like he's like, I'm ready to like, go live my life, like I'm ready to go out into the world. And I'm sitting there like, huh, I thought that at your age, too. But yeah, it is just so different. When we think about just their journeys, and our journeys, and everybody in between, right? Like, I'm sure you look at your kids. And when you're probably I think another great exercise of writing a children's book, like you did, is having to think, you know, like, what, how do I have to tell this story for them? Because that's the other thing I use as an analogy forever as an educator and talking about people getting ready for the workforce is, how do you tell your story that's not coming from your perspective, like telling you your skill story, your resume story, your experiences, from the perspective of the company who's got a position open, that they need you to fill or problem they need you to solve. And just that you have to have that self awareness and self reflection to be able to like adapt what you're trying to communicate, it's just it's such a skill set.
O'Brien McMahon:Well, I've, I've said this a bunch, you may have heard me say this on my podcast, but I believe that everything's a skill. And if we think about that, that means we can improve at everything and, and that there are more levels to improve at everything. And so you talk about communication, right? Communication has a lot of layers to it. And there you can always get better at communicating, whether it's putting yourself in somebody's shoes and understanding another person, whether it's how we use story or metaphor or analogy, brevity versus length. I mean, there's so many different ways that you can think about communicating different mediums you can use to communicate. And this really hit me when my first son was born. And I had two friends recommend a sleep training book. And I had never really thought about sleep training before but they were like, trust me read the book. And I was like, okay, the same book. Yes, they Good, the same book 12 hour sleep by 12 weeks old.
Anna Stumpf:Yes, I've had that
O'Brien McMahon:one. You read that one? Yep. And we read it. And we followed it. And it worked in both of our boys slept by 10 weeks. And I, you know, granted, they were born a little larger, they were good sleepers, but like, still the methodology worked. And I just was like, Oh, my God, you can train a human being to sleep like this, like we all have to sleep. This is biologically programmed into us. And yet, we just train these little humans to sleep better. Oh, or how
Anna Stumpf:about the, like, toddler sign language? Like, yeah, I trained a less than one year old to tell me when he was hungry. Yeah,
O'Brien McMahon:it's wild. And if you think it is, if you can think if you just think that you have, you don't have to, again, you don't have to train a human head asleep, right? But you can and there's levels to it, right. And so just like anything else, you don't have to teach a human being how to communicate. But if you don't, and you're not thinking about how to be a better communicator, then you're just going to be stuck at whatever sort of innate ability you figured out, and it's probably not going to be a very deep level. So if you think about it like that, it just opens up this world of opportunity to go out and hone whatever skills you want to learn.
Anna Stumpf:Yeah, I agree. Well, obviously, I agree. Because I've spent years as an educator and think, yeah, we're interested, constantly be learning and building those skill sets to your point. So
O'Brien McMahon:as an educator, I'm gonna flip this on you first, as an as an educator in a system that does not build a lot of creative thinking. How do we do it? How do we how do we bring that back to our kids? And how do we challenge either on the family level or on the broader level?
Anna Stumpf:Yeah, I think there's, I'm gonna sound like a boomer right here. But I feel like my husband's an educator to raise like 20 years in seventh grade social studies, and then I have had high school and college level experience. In the best lessons, I think if my if we set my son down and said, like, what have your parents taught you the most? It's the dinner table conversation, and the like, being present, and curious about all the things and not gatekeeping any of your experiences, failures, any of those things, and then just even a surly 17 year old, right, like my son had this amazing kid, two amazing experiences this past summer. One was figuring out you didn't want to do computer science. And that felt like a really heavy realization. But he came home and felt good sharing that was like one of my biggest parenting wins. The second one is he was working at Chipotle. And just would like, go in early and stay late and come home and be like, Mom, I got to wash dishes for like three hours. It was great. Okay, I'm just I don't know where that like my husband are both like so confused. Where is that coming from. And then he has moved on to a different job that he just like, if he I would love to see his timecard because he have he has clocked in on time. Once in the last however many months it would shock me just can't quite get plugged in. And so my insistence, every time we talk about is like, explain to me the differences that you feel when you were going to Chipotle and getting to wash dishes versus walking into Walmart and pulling orders. Right? Like he's a little bit of an introvert. So I'm like, is it the front line piece? Is it this and he finally he was like, I don't even know how to tell you. But like, at the bigger company, I'm just a number. But at Chipotle, there's only like seven of us. And you have to sometimes do the thing nobody else wanted to do and somebody's better. And I'm listening to him thinking, oh, man, this is like something I didn't learn until I was like late 20s.
O'Brien McMahon:Like, we're going into startup world love. And
Anna Stumpf:I'm just like pulling this out of him. And I was like, Honey, like, think of all the applications of what this looks like, right? So he and I have this conversation. My husband comes home, he has a completely different conversation with it and like around something completely different. But I like I went to bed that night. And I thought we're doing good work here. Like we had a kid who came home and like openly shared and thought, which is that's a credit to him. But like the way we showed up, and we're just curious. I think that matters so much. And there's been like he does roll his eyes all the time. Like we don't have to find the lesson and everything mom. I'm always like, Did you see what happened? They're like we'll get in the car of having been at the mall or do you notice what was going on with those two people? I mean, he's just I think now he's coming to grips with like, Oh, you're not just weird. Like you were trying to teach me something. But I do think we have to recognize. I mean, we, in my evolution with education, I've had parents say to me, well, like, you're the you're the educated one, you're the teacher, like, if you can't do this with them, what do you think I can do? Right? Like, you need to handle this, all the way across to like, the most extreme level of, you know, helicopter, lawnmower, snow pot, whatever we're calling him, the parents who tried to just control everything, and like, my son's missing four assignments, what are you going to do about it? I mean, I've run the gamut with all of that. But just letting them lead a lot of that. And just being curious, I think is the best way to do that. And I've looked, I've felt the impact of this as well of like, students missing from the workforce, right, because we went through like a 1015 year period, where we said to high school students, like go into schools, your job, you know, being all these clubs, and organizations and sports and do all these things, it's gonna look good on your application, and they weren't working, they weren't getting those Chipotle experiences, or those other things, and being around different people and just experiencing life and trying to budget their money and, you know, figure out they got taxes, like there wasn't a lot of that going on. And I think we're getting back to some of that. But I think anytime you can put your children in a place to be curious and, and help them understand what that looks like. I mean, I if I had it to do over again, I mean, I used to take a ton of field trips, and everybody always said, I'd me like I want to teach today. But getting those young people out around professionals modeling for them how easy it is to have a conversation and how desperately people in the world want to help them. I just, I mean, I could go on, obviously, for days about how important it is to put them in those places,
O'Brien McMahon:back to the beginning of this conversation, you broaden their experience, you open the world and show them a bunch of different opportunities and change their perspective. And now they can. Now they have that perspective forever. And they can figure out what to do with six cars per day, I broke the tires down, put new tires on the rims, spun them balanced, I'm putting him back on I put on 15 pounds that summer. It was really hot summer, we were working in a hot garage. And that's just like one of the most foundational memories I have. Because I was like, Oh, I can work. Like yeah, it just showed me like, oh, I can do hard things like I can do physical hard things. I can achieve something like I can do this and I can get some respect for it.
Anna Stumpf:Oh, it takes away all of that. Just unknown that I don't even know if it's fear when you're, you know, a teenager. But that familiarity and the competence to know I'm always gonna have something to fall back on because they are scared like, oh, they make a lot of choices from being scared just because of what they consume all day. And the large part.
O'Brien McMahon:We all do, I think I think we don't realize how much our decisions or lack of decisions come from that place of scarcity. That's one of the things that I try to work through with my coach is like, is this coming from a place of scarcity? And if it is, how do I unpack that and come up with the decision I want to make not the fear based one?
Anna Stumpf:Well, my really good friend, Ray Sylvester, who you had on your podcast constantly reminds me your diet is more than what you put your mouth, right? It's what you put in your mouth. And it's what you do. Everything you consume is part of your diet. You got to make sure you got a good healthy, balanced diet. Yeah, I was so true. On that note, I dangerous to ask this because I know it's probably going to be a wide list as well. But like what do you love? What podcasts and books and like where do you? Is it situational? As you prepare for your conversations and things? Are there certain podcasts that you definitely are subscribed to? So I subscribed to
O'Brien McMahon:a couple of the popular ones. I mean, Joe Rogan, Tim Ferriss, armchair expert, Jordan Harbinger, maybe a few others, but those are kind of the ones that I listen to the most probably. And the reason I like them is because they bring on such a diverse set of guests. And again, I like understanding different parts of the world from different people. So I like them, because they're all pretty good interviewers, they're all you know, have very different styles. And so you can have, you can gain a lot of really interesting knowledge, even listening to the same guest on two of those shows, oftentimes there'll be talking about different are complementary things. And so that's kind of where that's what I listened to the most. As far as books go, I kind of have a policy that I just pick one book at a time. And whatever book feels right in that moment is the book that I read. Now I have to read some books for the podcast to prep for guests, but outside of that, you know, I was kind of struggling wasn't sure what I was going to read. And then my wife got me a picture sure that had a quote from the alchemist on it. I said, You know what I just turned 40. The Alchemist is a great book to read it kind of like pivotal moments. So I'm reading it for the third time. And I just picked it up and started reading it again. And I don't know what the next book is that I'm going to read. But whenever I'm done, I'll just sort of figure out like, what's the topic I'm interested in. And I'll go in that direction. And so I keep I use Goodreads to sort of keep track of books, I think are interesting. But just because they're, I think they're interesting doesn't mean I'm gonna be motivated when I finished this book to read that book. And I find that if I read the book, I think I should read right now. It takes forever to finish. But if I just read whatever the book is, that I think is interesting right now. And that could be it'll go young adult fantasy, to a book about trees, to a book about business, to psychology to Agatha Christie to you know, something else. And it's just like, all over the place. One of my friends texted me one day, must have been looking at my Goodreads account, and he goes, I, there's no way I can predict what the next book is that you're going to read. And you
Anna Stumpf:can't either that's kind of fun. Yeah, I think I have friends who just like buying, buy, buy books and collect them. And then they feel the pressure of like their books that are waiting on them to read. And I'm Yeah, kind of the opposite as well.
O'Brien McMahon:Yeah, I think people feel a pressure that they should be reading nonfiction, or they should be reading fiction, or they should be reading highbrow fiction. Well, I don't know, whatever it is. And I just think like, I don't know, you like graphic novels, read graphic novels, if you and I've heard this advice for kids, too. Like, if your kids are reading anything? Let them read it, you know? Yeah. Like, just if they happen to like, weird. Comic books, let them go read the weird comic books, because they're reading and they're engaged in, they're passionate about something. And you know, that's what we want to be cultivating?
Anna Stumpf:Sure. All right. I always like to ask, what kind of advice do you have for people out there as they contemplate life? And I mean, I don't know how you're gonna answer this one, because it could be I should be giving you like, an area to talk about, but it's I'm just gonna throw the big wide net and see what comes out. I
O'Brien McMahon:mean, we'll just we'll circle all the way back to the beginning. And kind of the hopefully, the theme for this conversation, you know, the book that I wrote is called how you become you. And I think, don't worry about who I am. Don't worry about who your parents are, or who they who your parents want you to be like, figure out who you are. And I think if we all figure out what that means, we'll all be a lot happier. And, you know, the world would be a better place. As cheesy as that is. But
Anna Stumpf:it's true in every version of yourself. Right? As the world changes, as you grow, as you add, subtract from your relationships, you have to continue to ask those questions. I'm
O'Brien McMahon:here. Yeah, it's not a process that that stops. No. And
Anna Stumpf:that book, how you become you available on Amazon, and probably most places you buy books are
O'Brien McMahon:anywhere anywhere online that you would buy books. Yep, you can get how you become you. And
Anna Stumpf:the podcast is just people business.
O'Brien McMahon:The podcast is people business, you may have to search people business, O'Brien McMahon. Yeah. But yeah, it's on there. It's a weekly show. We've 160 Something episodes at this point and counting. And if you go to the website, people business podcast.com, you can actually search on there by the three categories that we talked about that we talked to a broad array of guests, but it's really around three themes. It's how do you become a better version of yourself? How do you have better interactions with those around you? And how do you organize and lead people and phenomenal website, you can go through and see little snippets, and you tell what vocation these people have. And it's it's a great place to go shop for your next episode, which is great. You are very active on LinkedIn. For those of you who are like, Where can I learn more about what this guy's up to?
Anna Stumpf:About? Yes, come follow O'Brien McMahon on LinkedIn. You're also on Facebook and Instagram website, O'Brien mcmahon.com. So lots of ways to engage with you and these amazing guests, you keep finding so keep that keep putting that out in the world because it's helping me in my household on an on a regular basis. I appreciate it. Well, that that makes my day that makes it all worth it. So thanks. Good. That's the one thing I can give you for taking your time out to share with us today. Thanks. That's that is the gift for me. So I appreciate it. It's the conclusion of another great episode. And you know what that means? We believe in the power of practical wisdom. That's why at the end of every episode, we propose the collective challenge. This is a small actionable step for you to integrate these lessons learned into your daily life. So this week after listening to O'Brien discuss the importance of self discovery and continual growth, your collective challenge is going to be to think about how you can communicate better with yourself, to learn more about yourself and where you could make explorative decisions, better conversations, enhance your relationships, just more in depth knowledge of yourself. And obviously, one of the things we talked about on the podcast was journaling. So there are journaling apps, some of you may already very good at journaling, very good habits around that. For those of you aren't just take one small step towards this goal and take some of the advice that O'Brien gave about challenging yourself with questions and prompts and different things. Take some dedicated time this week for self reflection. And if it's not through journaling, maybe it's through more intentional conversations with someone close to you or spend some time in your own thoughts. We're very bad at that sometimes with our phones and our feeds and all of the commitments that we have. But if you can challenge yourself to have some progress in this area, I think it will give you greater clarity and appreciation for your unique story and the journey that you're on becoming who you are meant to be. Thank you for joining us on this episode of collective energy conversations. Today's stories and insights are just the beginning of our collective exploration into the vast landscape of personal and professional development. If today's conversation inspired you please share this episode with your friends, family or colleagues who also might find value in our collective wisdom. Your sharing helps us grow and expand our community. We will be back on Friday to share more encounters with the energy coin. If you're not sure what the energy coin is, you can take a listen to those episodes. Or check back at the website at collective energy coach.com forward slash energy coin. And don't forget to subscribe to our podcast for more enriching conversation and transformative stories. We'd love to hear your thoughts and experiences. Connect with us on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram at threads at collective energy coach, and check out our website at WWW dot collective energy coach.com and become part of the collective. Until next time, keep growing, keep connecting and keep sharing your story because every voice matters in the journey of growth. I'm Dr. Anna stump and this has been collective energy conversations where we elevate growth through shared stories