Rest as Resistance: Challenging the Cult of Productivity for Mental Health

Welcome to episode 38 of "Trusting the Universe and Sh*t"! In this episode, we dive deep into the intersection of social pressures and personal desires, exploring how societal norms can impact our decision-making processes.

Stace and Ané discuss their unique perspectives on navigating social belief systems and desires that often clash with external expectations. We share personal anecdotes, like the pressure to resist getting seconds at dinner due to social stigma around overindulgence.

The conversation touches on the concept of the "Almond Mum" and how cultural backgrounds shape our attitudes towards food and social interactions. We emphasize the importance of self-trust in making decisions that align with our true desires, whether in personal life or business.

We reflect on the significance of rest as a productive activity, challenging the notion that constant productivity is the only path to success. We share insights on setting boundaries, honouring personal needs, and carving out our unique path in a world driven by societal expectations.

Listeners are encouraged to embrace their desires unapologetically, trust their instincts, and cultivate self-trust as a muscle that strengthens over time. The episode concludes with a reminder that small decisions aligned with inner truth contribute to building resilience against societal pressures and lead to greater authenticity in life and business.

You can find Ané and Stacey on Instagram at:
Ané - @ane.mgmnt
✦ https://www.instagram.com/mgmnt__/
https://msha.ke/anemgmnt

Stacey - @barefootbranding
✦ instagram.com/barefootbranding
🌐 barefootbranding.academy
https://barefootbranding.academy/eyes-above-waitlist/

Visit us here: 🌐 trustingtheuniverseandshit.com
Email us: 📩 hello@trustingtheuniverseandshit.com

Intro music by Tyler Dixon from @tones.on.toast - tonesontoast.com

Transcript

Stacey: 0:04

Am I capable. Do I want to do this? Do I have the desire for it? Do I have the capacity for it? And yes, you can actually say no to something. If you really don't feel like you really want to do it.

Ané: 0:17

It's really important to, be discerned about what you want in your business and what feels good. And I do believe that at the first couple of years of business, it is a trial and error,

Stacey: 0:47

hello, and welcome to episode 38 of trusting in the universe and ship. We're happy to have you here. I'm here with the Ané. Of

Ané: 0:54

Hello guys, hello, and yes, welcome to another episode.

Stacey: 0:59

Ooh. So today we're going to be talking about social pressures, social belief systems, and our desires and our desires that push up against. These social beliefs and social norms and. Yeah, what can we do about it? What can we do about our desires when they, they are very present for us, but we feel very much like we're being pushed. In another direction by external things like external social belief systems.

Ané: 1:32

I love that, I love that you said pushed because it kind of does feel like it like sometimes because of course as Stace and I usually do we kind of figure out what we're going to talk about like a couple minutes before we press record but it was just so perfect because even though she had a social like I guess Thing that happened. I, on the other hand, have been feeling it very internally, but like everything, we are all influenced always. So it probably does come from a social pressure and yeah. We wanna dive deep into it and just yeah. Share a little bit of our, I guess, unique mindset and perspective on it.

Stacey: 2:16

Yeah, beautiful. Okay, so I'm going to give a little example. Like a practical example. So, you know, when you're at a dinner and you want to go up for seconds and you're really hesitating because you feel judged or you feel like I really, I can't go up and have seconds, like I'm such a pig. I don't want to go and go up there and have seconds because on the weekend I was at a dinner with my friends and. Were there. And I go out for seconds, like at some point, and then one of my other friends, he comes up next to me and he's like, we're like ninjas. We're like ninjas getting seconds. Like when no one was really noticing. And I was like, that's so funny that he really had to feel like he was a ninja in order to get seconds. And that we had so much food, it was insane. The amount of food. So it wasn't like, oh, there's only one thing left. It was please eat more because this is ridiculous. And I feel like that's so interesting that desire that we have, like, we really hungry, right? We want to eat more. We want. A little bit more, they so much, but. We turn it down because socially it's, you're gluttonous your, you really, this, this is a sin to overeat or to overindulge and to overindulge is really frowned upon. And. I don't know in, in which cultures. Exactly, but definitely in the west, it's very frowned upon to, to go and eat more because growing up it wasn't like that for me. Because growing up, you know, we had, it was Chinese. And it wasn't, it wasn't like we had to, it was like eat more, eat more, eat more like my Popo was always like the quote was fatten up your babies. So it was, it was eat more, eat more moist as much as you could. So she was really fading people as much as she could, but I find in the west it's so different. It's Oh, no, you better not want to eat seconds. That's really uncouth. You really shouldn't want to be doing that.

Ané: 4:15

Absolutely. And it's so interesting when it's not until you get, like, you zoom out that you realise how much that's actually embedded in the culture, like, in our society. Like, gosh. Yeah, actually, it's so funny that you mention this because I was talking to a friend the other day and we were talking about the almond mum. Like, what? If you ever grew up with an

Stacey: 4:34

Yeah.

Ané: 4:35

yeah,

Stacey: 4:36

Yeah.

Ané: 4:36

and Almond Mum is, if no one knows, which I didn't know until she had explained to me, was essentially a mum that is very particular, is very concerned about what you eat as a child, right, or what, what the whole family unit is eating, and will kind of a little bit project, you know, ooh, are you really going to eat that, or maybe you shouldn't eat this, or blah, blah, blah, and whether or not, like, they're aware of it or not, that's just, you know, You know, in the day, in the culture that we live now, that the almond mums are particularly there. Especially, I feel like, I don't know why, but I just feel like private, private school kids would have almond mums. And yeah, they're just very, very, like concerned about what you are eating. And it's so funny that you're saying that you literally had the polar opposite. Experience and then it would be such a, it would be such a contrast then coming into this world and being like, Oh, well, why is everyone all of a sudden concerned where like it would have in my culture been seen as like disrespectful, not eating, you know, or whatever. So that's so, that's so interesting. So yeah.

Stacey: 5:42

Yeah, exactly. It's like. Why aren't you eating more? That feels, yeah. It's like people have poured all the effort and energy into this food and you're like, no, no, no. Like, and you know, people will put the tiniest little bit on their plate, you know? And they're like, no, I couldn't. I couldn't have any more. And I find that so funny, like, yeah, you know, I understand people get full and stuff, but it's not that it's, you can tell there's like a social. Demure ruinous going on. It's like a, no, I'm not going to overindulge I think it's interesting that culturally. Yeah, as I grew up, it was really, you know, we had Friday night dinners, Friday night dinners was to bring everybody around and my Por por would cook food for everybody. And it was. I eat more you more and more, you know? Feeding was our love language. You know how there's the love languages, there's gifts. There's acts of service. In our family, it was. Feed people. And, you know, to this day, it's still like that in my family, my auntie will give me, he had his$50 go by and all the Tupperware containers to bring tonight. Even though we have a full cupboard of Tupperware containers, we need more Tupperware containers. And at the end, there's like this symphony, there's this orchestra procession where all the food gets packed up into containers for individual servings of things, and people take them home and we write the names on the top and it's this whole thing. Whereas I find in the west is different. It's like, Like whoever hosts keeps all the food. Because that's what a friend of mine was saying. Like the host keeps all the food and I was like, that's so interesting because. Yeah, for me, it was just so different. There was just this, it was like, it happened like clockwork. You know, all the women go into the kitchen. As soon as all the food was done, all it all. It would be just this beautiful symphony. Everything would be packed up. Everybody would get their take away that have their name on it. And then at the end of the night, they'd go home with like four containers of whatever. All the little different things that they wanted to take. And yeah, I feel like there's these. Social pressures that butt up against our desires. So even if we may really deeply want something or you really wanted to go and get more food. We really want something. Those social pressures can be. So much stronger. And can hold us back from what we really want. So I think this can really be applied in a business sense and just in life, probably in general of, I really want something. I really, truly desire it, but I really feel like I can't do it or have it. And this could be applied to so many things like. Going out to an event really, truly desiring to want to go. And then feeling like, ah, like the social pressure of how I should talk, how I should be, like what I should be wearing, will Trump the desire for you to make those connections with people. So it can be really difficult. Because we have these two conflicting. Freshest on us. And yeah, it can, it can, I think it can affect us in many different ways.

Ané: 8:51

yeah, well it's funny how you mentioned that as well like with the whatever side it is, like whether you are really desiring to go to an event or you're really desiring to stay home, but you've got the pressure of everyone saying, where are you? You're going to come out, all the things like I definitely sometimes have experienced that. And it's so hard to like, stay in your ground and be like, I actually know that there is no social battery left within me to go out and enjoy this time away. And it's like, same thing if you really desired an event or Even a workshop or something you really just desire to do something else and you're just like, what are, you know, what is this person going to think? Or like, how am I going to act? Or like, you just, and I, and I actually, as I'm speaking and as we're speaking about how to dissolve this pressure, I just think it comes down to self trust, like building unapologetically self trust within yourself of like, no, I intuitively know right now that this is not what my soul needs right now. And it's, I think that's the most beautiful thing that we can step into. And it even, this even applies for like business, right? Like how many times would you do something that's like not the ordinary strategy way or like sell something that or whatever it may be. And you just have to build that trust within your business that it can hold it, or, you know, it's leading you to a better Result, you know, in the long run. But yeah, it's hard. It's hard to be full of pressure with everyone else around you,

Stacey: 10:25

Yeah. And I know what you mean about the social battery too, because it's like, okay. I really cannot go out to this event tonight, but I was invited, I said I was going to go and I have to go. That pressure of, I can't let this person down and my friend, I really need to go, but I really don't feel like I'm up to it. And. I think we know when you're talking about having self trust. I think that's, it's a muscle that's going to need to be developed. So every time you stick within your integrity and you stick within what you know is true for you in that moment and is. Where your energy lies and being honest with yourself, I feel like every time you do it, and every time you. You stick to those boundaries or. You stick to what it is that you said for yourself, or you wanted. Then that muscle will grow a little bit. And then the next time you do it, the muscle will grow a little bit. I was even talking to friend. We were talking about how, you know, if somebody came to us and asked us to be a bridesmaid. What would we say? And I was like, I don't have my answer prepared for that because I don't want to do that again. Personally. Because it's a lot of work, right. Socially. It's like, oh my goodness. On. Ask you that. How can you say no? And you think, how can I say no, but actually you can say no. You just need to really sit with yourself and say, Am I capable. Do I want to do this? Do I have the desire for it? Do I have the capacity for it? And yes, you can actually say no to something. If you really don't feel like you really want to do it.

Ané: 12:02

Mm, absolutely. And I just wanna like. regroup this back to like even the scenario of like have getting seconds or thirds or fourths like sometimes i just find that if you can make peace with the fact that like you're hungry and you want to eat more and there's tons of food like i just think i don't know how how you will you try to do it but i will just be like yeah i'm getting thirds like i will kind of just not mock myself but i will kind of just like make fun of because that shows more like confidence than trying to like, you know, not rock the boat, quote unquote, but and I just think it's the same thing. Like, if you have trust that like, I don't really care what others think, then absolutely go have that third piece of cake. And, you know, I make it well known that I have a sweet tooth. So if that cake's not, if that cake's done, you know, I can't

Stacey: 13:00

Yeah.

Ané: 13:02

Absolutely.

Stacey: 13:03

I did notice there was a slight more desire for the cake that I had brought then for the other, other main meals. So I feel like people lost their demure nest a little bit with when it came to the cake. And yeah, like we, I hear for you guys. Or, you know, not guys, sorry. Trying not to gender, gender that we are here for you. If you're listening to have that third piece of cake. If you truly desire it and listen within yourself about. Where it is that you aren't trusting yourself? Where is it that you're saying to yourself? I have to sneak this because when we deny ourselves our desires, I feel like that's when it leads to those times where we have to we'll, we will guiltily eat it and we'll go into a shame spiral after, and then we. We'll think the next day like, oh my God, I ate so much cake. Like, I feel so bad, but when we go into a mode of I'm going to confidently have this, I know I want it. And then the next day. I'm going to forgive myself for it. If I felt guilty, I'm going to forgive myself. And tomorrow's a new day tomorrow. I can go back to my regular eating schedule and ate well and, you know, treat myself well. So it's not this. This, you know, don't allow the guilt and the shame to control you in that situation. I'm going to go down this big. Spiral path and. If I'm going to go do it, then, then have those feelings that are attached to it as well.

Ané: 14:38

Absolutely, absolutely. Like, even the moment I decided I'm not going to go to that event or whatever, I just, I was in conviction. I was like, you know what, that is my choice and I'm going to get projections or I'm going to get people being like looking weird or asking or whatever. And it's like, If you can just stay your ground, it does become like the muscle. It does come easy and easier if you can stay on your ground to be like, yes, I'm going to get thirds or fourth or got to eat my fifth piece of cake. Then. Fine. Like then that, that, like you said, that shame spiral doesn't start. And I think that's beautiful. And I also generally believe that when you do that, you're helping someone else also accept themselves, you know, like fully wholeheartedly make them accept themselves. And that's like beautiful. That's the best part. That's the reason we are such social, like, creatures. So, yeah, I love that we're having this conversation. And, and even the fact with, like, business, like, if, if there is a way or strategy or whatever that is really working for you, who cares how it's, you know, You know, how it's wrong or different, like, own it. And in fact, that's awesome. That means that you're like a trailblazer and you can probably show other people how to do that. Like, that's the superpower of it. So yeah, I just think it's really important that people just accept that. Yeah,

Stacey: 16:02

kind of acquaintance that I follow that she says that she. So many of her most successful offerings. Where ones that she made up herself. These were things like voice coaching without having, you know, a zoom call you know, There was another podcast that I was listening to where this multimillion dollar business owner, she has a$9 offer. That's it. So it's a$9 membership. And it was for copywriting. And the copywriting, she sends out copywriting templates every month by email. That's it. She has a multimillion dollar. Like actually, I'm not sure if it was multimillion dollar. Let me just think for a second. I think it was, she was earning a couple of hundred thousand dollars a year. But she may, she may have accrued in the millions now, but just from a$9 offer. So don't say to yourself, I have to have a big ticket offer. I have to have X, I have to have X in order to be successful. You actually don't. You can have potentially a$9 membership be really successful. You can have a one high ticket offer and be successful. You can have the whole range. But it's really about testing out what works for you and the, also the w what works for your lifestyle. Like sometimes people will set up physical businesses that require you to physically be there and then realize later on, actually, I really wanted location independence, and now I don't have it.'cause that's what I thought that I was supposed to create.

Ané: 17:31

Yeah, I love that. I love that. Absolutely. It's really important to yeah, be discerned about what you want in your business and what feels good. And I do believe that like at the first couple of years of business, like it is a trial and error and it is like a, what feels good, what doesn't, because like I said before, we are, we do get influenced and sometimes we do go and think this is the way, and then it ends up burning you out or you people please or whatever the case may be, but it's. It's just, that's just indicating for you that that wasn't an alignment and it's time to pivot and build that self trust within.

Stacey: 18:07

Yeah, exactly. I was going to say, bringing that back to the self-trust of this is really the way that I want my business in life to look. And I'm not going to follow the blueprint that some meet somebody like a mentor or a course that I took told me I have to do

Ané: 18:21

mm

Stacey: 18:22

You don't have to do it that way. You can carve out your own way of doing it. If you really feel like this, isn't working for the way that I want to leave. Like, I don't want to have to. Do one-on-one calls on this day, on this morning, you don't have to, you can shift them. You can. Move things around the way that you want to want to work. Like if you don't want to work on Mondays,

Ané: 18:45

hmm,

Stacey: 18:45

You don't have to. I know that, you know, we need to do what we need to do in order to pay our bills and get. Everything, you know, keep the lights on. But if that's your goal to eventually have that you can just have that on your vision board. Like, I want to get to a point where I don't work on Mondays.

Ané: 19:03

hmm,

Stacey: 19:04

Well, I don't work on Friday afternoons. Whatever that is for you. You can have that as one of your goals and keep yourself. Like moving towards that and eventually know that, okay, I'm doing this for now, but eventually. I may not have to anymore.

Ané: 19:19

I love that. And actually it just ties in so well with the identity episode that we did not long ago, because if you guys, yeah, we'll link it below because it's a really good one about whether or not you should shift the habit or shift your identity to really embody what, who you. Trying to be or, you know, what your results are, where your goals are. So that kind of is a really good way of kind of expressing what we're talking about here. And just to like, also give you guys a bit of a, you know, understanding, like lately I have put so much internal pressure. Like for instance, I, yeah, shoot, like I've got a lot of days where it's a lot of client work. And so when I do have days where it's like business, like my, my own business stuff, it's like, I try to get as much done as possible. But sometimes I desire to go to the sauna on a random Monday at 3 PM, you know, or sometimes I really desire to go. for a long walk in nature. And even though logically it's like, and hey, your to do list is crazy. You shouldn't be doing that. I just know intuitively it's gonna benefit me in the long run because I could be in the verge of burnout or I could be in the verge of really being a sucky client or whatever. And, That's the last thing that you want. You got to take care of yourself. And so even though, yes, I do feel this pressure, I've built enough self trust within to be like, no, this is what your soul, your intuition is screaming at you. And every time I've done that and I've just like own it, there's been so much synchronicities and things just randomly start to, you know, fall in place. So if you're someone that is feeling the pressure within, take some time to just rest and rejuvenate, because that's probably. You know, a, a way of your body communicating to you like, Hey, you're doing a lot. Like, just take a minute. Just take a minute.

Stacey: 21:13

Yeah, I've noticed this trend on tech, talk of people talking about how they don't want to do anything at all. So they don't want to go out, see friends. They don't want to do they work. They don't want to go to the gym. They don't want to. Cook themselves food. They just, they, they just feel completely flatlined. And I saw a few people persists. And for me, I really feel like this is burnout. This is burnout inaction of. I just cannot do anything anymore. And people saying it's not depression. They're like, I'm medicated. I have this IVR therapist, blah, blah, blah. And it's not depression. It's just that I can't do anymore. And I really feel like that is just you sitting in the burnout space of, I just, I have nothing more to give and. You know, Our culture often tells us we need to be productive. We need to do more. But we never told rest is productive. But it is rest. Is your cells resting, replenishing, creating space for you? To go and have energy. It's cultivating the energy for you for the next day, for the next week. And I've definitely been in burnout before. And I was in burnout once for two months. I couldn't do anything, nothing. I was, it was kind of scary because I thought, how long is this going to last? I can't do anything. And it was just that constant pushing, pushing, pushing I was working. Every day. I like also having that belief that I need to work nine to five. And that persisted for me for such a long time of, I need to be working the nine to five when everybody else is at work. Do I actually know. Am I faster if I work sometimes in a short period and cause I know that. When I was in an only, ever really had one office job, but I know for a year. But I know that when I was in that job, People would fluff around all

Ané: 23:06

All day?

Stacey: 23:07

I saw them all. And that's why I quit because I thought this is stupid. I want to get my work done efficiently and quickly, and then I'm done. But in office jobs, I noticed, I noticed that. Of. People fluffing around, like I had a coworker, she would get there at 8:00 AM and fluff around for two hours. And I was like, why do you get here so early? And I would get there later. And then work till later, because at one I was trying to miss all of the peak hour traffic. But also I would just focus, get my work done and then I'd go home. She would just gas bag and talk. Shade about a weekend and how drunk she got and all this stuff. And. I was like, this is so stupid.

Ané: 23:47

Yeah, I know. There's, it's so interesting, but it's funny that you mentioned about like the burnout cycle and I just think that that's just people that are autopilot. Like they are just on autopilot doing the same thing over and over again. And sometimes we have to be really careful with like when we're on autopilot while doing too much because that's where I think you start to prolong a burnout cycle. And that's also where, so for instance, like. Even though I'm not at burnout, I'm like, if my body is yearning to go to the sauna or to go chill for a minute and go for a walk or whatever, start a veggie patch or whatever, it is literally telling me to please take it slow because you are on the verge to burnout and like you, like many of us, have 2, months of just could not do anything. So yeah, really take care of yourself and build that trust within to be like, no, this is, this is productive. Rest is productive. And this is helping me actually achieve more in a short amount of time rather than fluffing around and being an autopilot. So yeah, take, take off the social pressure. You guys, like, it's just, you know, Just know that it's, we know that this society is really not, it's crashing and burning slowly, so we really have to start doing things differently, and it starts with you, it really does, so.

Stacey: 25:14

Yeah. Yeah. And you reminded me weirdly. I was watching Dr. Strange on the weekend. And he goes in Dr. Strange before he becomes Dr. Strange, and he's, his hands have been all mangled by an accident and he was a surgeon and he goes in and he says, He goes to the great. You know, master teacher of magic and he's like, please teach me, teach me how, how did you do that? Teach me. And she was like, how did you learn how to become a surgeon? And he's like years of training, she goes exactly. And that's exactly how you learn to trust yourself and learn to lean into. This, it's just going to take training, training yourself. Every tiny little decision you make that is in alignment with your soul's desires is a little a win for you in training yourself. Okay. I did. At that time, I said no to that client. I didn't just give in and say, yes, I'll give you a discount. Every time you make a small decision like that. It builds your. Like boundary bar a build your boundary muscle. I feel.

Ané: 26:22

Absolutely. Yeah, it's such a such a good way of putting it. It does take time. You know, especially if you are working for yourself, you do have to build that trust and trust. Yeah, like faith within the business, but also trust that you are doing the right thing. Good, you know, you are doing what is necessary for you. So Yeah, I really hope that you guys enjoy this episode Let us know what you what pressure you're feeling lately. We have a website that you can contact us now. So yeah Yeah,

Stacey: 26:59

something from you to see that you. Real people are listening to this and it's not just us gas, bagging, you know? To each other, which is fun, but you know, we like to know you exist as well. So please leave us a review on apple. Podcasts. And yeah. Check us hello@trustingtheuniverseandshit.com. We would love to hear from you. And we'll see you next time.

Ané: 27:20

guys next time bye