Previewing CIPA Congress 2026

In this special preview episode, Gwilym Roberts is joined by Alexandra Collingwood-Pierce and Greg Corcoran to look ahead to CIPA Congress 2026. Together, they explore the key issues shaping this year’s programme, from sustainable IP and AI to regulation, commercialisation and the changing global landscape of innovation. They also discuss what attendees can expect from the Manchester programme and why this year’s Congress is about more than CPD. It is a chance to explore the future of the patent profession and the issues that will shape it. 

Transcript

Welcome And Lee’s Nose Update

SPEAKER_04 0:00

This is exciting. It's podcast time. But unfortunately, our normal host isn't with us. Lee, we miss you as ever. And I hope your operation's gone okay on your nose. We'll fill you in on that in a little bit in more detail soon because everyone needs to know about Lee's nose. But I'm very excited that I have an alternative host, Alexandra Collingwood-Pierce. Alexandra, if you're too good, then leave that at the job. So that's your your decision to make.

SPEAKER_01 0:32

Lee Davis and Willem Roberts are the two IPs in a pod, and you are listening to a podcast on intellectual property brought to you by the Chartered Institute of Pattern Attorney.

SPEAKER_04 0:51

Welcome. How are you?

SPEAKER_00 0:53

I'm very well, thank you, Grillem. I don't think we need to risk leaping out of a job. Um but I'm very happy to be here.

SPEAKER_04 1:02

Good. Yeah, so the reference to Lee's nose, he's having his nose done. I think he's having it removed and replaced with a brass one, like Tycho Brahe, uh, a Danish astronomer you'll all be aware of, who um lived off a small island uh off the coast of Denmark and was the king's astronomer around the time of Copernicus, and his nose chopped off in a jewel, which is not what's happened to Lee. Lee has not been in the jewel. Um he did have a nose job. He's had a nose job. Indeed, I mean, we've all seen the pictures. It was fun. No, Lee, hope you're okay. Alexandra, how are you? How's your summer?

SPEAKER_00 1:33

Doing very good, thank you. I'm desperate for some rain. Um, but you know, I think everyone is. But I'm actually quite used to the heat now, so who needs to go on holiday?

SPEAKER_04 1:43

Are you an air conditioner person or a fan person?

SPEAKER_00 1:47

I'm neither. Oh, hello. I just sit in it until I have acclimatised.

SPEAKER_04 1:54

You're in a cool place, you're not in the greenhouse or something.

SPEAKER_00 1:56

I mean, you're not you're not looking for I'm in my windowless office. So I mean that does help.

SPEAKER_04 2:02

Okay, okay, okay. Sounds quite tough to me.

What CIPA Congress Really Is

SPEAKER_04 2:05

Um, and it's exciting why you're on as well, because of course we're coming up to um the next Speaker Congress, and I think you've been running the show for a little while. So do you want to give us a little bit of background about yourself, first of all? Because of course we've worked together. It's very nice to see an alumnus of Gilbertness Road on on the podcast. Um, but also a little bit about your background and then a little bit about your history with uh the Congress.

SPEAKER_00 2:26

Yeah, so I've been I guess in the profession quite a long time now. I still think I'm new, but you know, I'm newer than Gwillem, but not that new. Um and I've been on the Congress Committee about 10 years, probably, nine years. Um for those who don't know, Congress is CEPA's annual conference. And it's quite an interesting conference because CEPA has the dedicated life sciences conference and the dedicated computer technology conference. And then Congress is the kind of general one. So when we're looking at putting it together, we're always thinking about what's relevant to everyone in the profession rather than kind of technology-specific factors. So we often don't talk about SPCs, for example. Um historically, Congress has been a kind of pure CPD, and I think that's what people tend to think of when they think of Congress. You know, when we had to do 16 hours of CPD, Congress gave you eight hours. And when we put the program together, we were very conscious that we had to meet that CPD requirement. Um, but as kind of Congress has evolved and the CPD requirements have evolved, it's become a bit, it's become a lot broader. It's not just about CPD. And we're really trying to have kind of broader conversations about policy and factors affecting the IP profession and things that we think people need to know. We don't really have answers a lot of the time, but I think we try to have really interesting questions and conversations and spark ideas and bring people together for networking and discussion and meeting with peers. And I think this has really been helped by moving Congress around. Historically, Congress was always in London. And then we had a couple of virtual years, and people came virtually who said they never would have attended Congress in London. And that kind of prompted an initial idea to sort of refresh Congress. We had two virtual years and then it was cancelled because of the Queen's funeral. And we decided it just needed a bit of a refresh, a rebrand. And we decided to move it outside London, and that was really supported by Daniel Chu, who was president for the first one that we moved outside of London. We had it in Cambridge. Um, and he's been a really big supporter of that, as of all the kind of following presidents. So, yeah, we've been in Cambridge, Edinburgh, Bristol, this year in Manchester. We're gonna talk a bit about Manchester later. Um, and next year we'll be back in London and then we'll start our tour again.

SPEAKER_04 4:54

No, it's a good history. I think I said when we were warming up that I actually I think I went to the first Congress because we saw another Kilburn Australia's alumnus, Tibble Gold, in his presidential time, was very involved in getting it going. I think I might have popped along to the first one when we were still trying to work out exactly what it was. As you say, it's evolved a lot and there's a real clarity around that. Um there's a big team obviously involved in putting it together, and we're gonna have just guests dropping in and out. Um but we've got one here who's been very very well behaved so far, but our old friend Greg, Greg Corcrane. Nice to see you, Greg. Do you want to give us a little bit of your backstory in the profession and then a little bit about your involvement with Congress as well? Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:31

Well, hello everyone. Um I um I've been in the profession in IP since before the century began, really, um, but then became a patent attorney um uh in the early 2000s uh in private practice before moving in-house LASML in the Netherlands, where I've been since 2007. And um I got involved since left, but I've now got involved um or got attended uh congress as a way of keeping in touch uh with the um the UK profession. In those days, um we weren't so connected as we are now. I mean we had the internet, we had email, but we didn't have mobile telephones. Um and a telephone call uh to the UK was more uh it was a bigger thing than it is today. Um so I I went uh along to a couple of uh uh congresses and I started to ask question or two every time. It didn't go every year, but then um it was around 2010, I think, when Mike Duess at the end of Congress said, Um, would you help like to help organize um the event every year? And um I I I thought about it and thought, well, why not? And I haven't looked back since. Well, um 2010 is 16 years, so it's an incredibly long amount of time. Um and I have thought about leaving, um, but then um my role in the committee um kind of became redefined, and the remote uh participation became easier. And uh last year when Alexandra um uh stepped out due to uh maternity leave, um she invited me in and I had a go last year, which um was uh uh quite uh um it was um a good experience.

SPEAKER_04 7:48

So in terms of um in terms of the actual Congress, and we're gonna talk a little bit about this year's one in a moment, but probably we should give it a little poke.

Manchester Details And Networking Plans

SPEAKER_04 8:00

Let's let's give it let's let's sell this Congress to people. When is it? And why should why should the plug? Poke.

SPEAKER_02 8:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 8:08

Give it a poke and then let's give it a plug. Um when is it? It's in Manchester. Why should people be going? Let's just plug this. Let's plug this. Let's plug this.

SPEAKER_00 8:17

I think we've been informed it's actually in Salford. Um it's on well, it's over, it's kind of over two days, but the main the main congress on Tuesday, the 15th of September, at the Lowry Hotel. We say in Manchester, but I believe it's in Salford. So the Manchester region. Um the day before we have a kind of pre-event networking drinks reception that is free to attend, it's open to everyone, um, paralegals, administrators, trainees, partners, clients, anyone. Um so that will be hosted at the People's History Museum. Um and we'll have a little talk from the EDR committee in IP Inclusive, but primarily it's about networking, having some drinks, I think a little bit of canopies, um, kind of getting in the mood and enjoying the city. And then following Congress, we also have the annual dinner um which is in the same hotel, so the Lowry. And that's again open to everyone, you don't have to come to Congress to come to the dinner. If you want to just come for a nice three-course meal, chat with some patent attorneys, and we'd love to have you.

SPEAKER_04 9:32

Perfect evening.

SPEAKER_00 9:33

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 9:35

Okay, so that's that's the logistics. Okay, what we networking obviously is really important. As you say, that's become a focus of it, has become topics relevant to the IP profession. Um, should we delve a bit more into what's happening at this one in particular?

Sustainable IP As The Big Theme

SPEAKER_00 9:50

Yeah, so we kind of have a broad theme every year. This year, our theme is sustainable IP, sustainability in IP. We're basically looking at broadly how we as a profession remain sustainable. So, you know, as patent attorneys, we're obviously all scientists, we're very aware of things like changing climate. I mean, this year we've had floods, droughts, fires in the UK. And I think that does raise questions about what business as usual might look in the future. Um one of our key, our keynotes is going to be asking some of these questions and talking about whether kind of we as a society need to reframe what we mean by success and growth, um, as well as discussing some of the factors that actually led her to leave the patent profession and kind of look elsewhere for her job. Um that'll be Rihanna Turner. She was formerly of the Carbon Trust and she's currently moving on. But yeah, she has some really interesting thoughts on kind of ethical tensions and and competing competing your own your own ethics with kind of perhaps what's last of you for working with clients or or kind of participating in perhaps the business environment that you don't necessarily agree with anymore. And I think that's that's something that we kind of want to touch on, because those are questions we need to be asking. You know, for those of us who are still patent attorneys, there are also much shorter-term questions about how we build a resilient and sustainable business practice.

AI Pressure And Business Resilience

SPEAKER_00 11:26

Um, we have a couple of sessions looking at this from different angles. So the first session looking at a range of factors such as the rise of AI tools within the profession and by our clients and being asked to use AI by our clients. We've got increasing global deglobalization and changing markets and a change in client base, which affects fees and internal practices. You know, personally, I felt this shift quite keenly because I came back from a Senti leave having been gone nine months, and it felt like a completely different world that I'd come back to. So, what what do we think the profession is going to look like, you know, in the next nine months and then nine months after that? And like these changes are happening so rapidly, we really need to be having these conversations now about how we adopt and adapt and just keep keep the profession and our businesses kind of resilient for the future. Um and kind of a flip side of that is regulation. So we also have a second session looking at the intersection of EPI and Ipreg and Legal Services Board and the kind of effects of regulation and how they interact and conflict and how firms of different sizes are putting these regulations into effect and how it's affecting their business practices and kind of the burdens that's placing on us. So that those are our kind of I guess maybe like existential existential crisis questions.

SPEAKER_04 12:52

Um you got you mentioned you get flood and droughts in it, which is quite scary. I wasn't expecting I wasn't actually expecting that, but yeah, okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:00

Um yeah, sustainability is, I mean, it's so much more than kind of green environmental, you know, we're we're really looking at kind of the future of the profession and how we navigate the changing world. Um something else that we, you know, when you talk about when talking about sustainability of IP and innovation is commercialization and generating long-term commercial value from your innovations. Fundamentally, that's what we as a patent attorney are trying to achieve, you know, is commercially relevant patterns which enable our clients to leverage that IP to grow and scale their business or or use it in whatever way they choose to do. Um we have a session with Freddie Gumeni from Manchester, University of Manchester Innovation Factory, and David Ewing from BAE is talking about some kind of um projects they've got about kind of commercialising technology for alternative uses. Um, and that's chaired by Claudia, who's the chair of the CEPA commercialisation committee. Um we've also got someone from ARM, Darrell Bradley will be speaking on that panel. I think that's everyone.

unknown 14:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 14:15

So it's a really interesting comment. You've got tech transfer, you've got um industry speakers as well, you've got an ex-attore um who's been at the Carbon Trust. So a good range of different perspectives. You've got private practice people speaking?

SPEAKER_00 14:28

Yeah, so you, I mean, there's always the private practice people daily quite often love to speak. Um but you know, we do try really hard to to get in-house perspectives because you know that's important to hear from.

UPC Long-Arm Risks For Clients

SPEAKER_00 14:44

Um, other big questions facing the IP profession at the moment, it's UPC and long-arm jurisdiction. So there is a kind of dedicated UPC conference that's epo run. Um, we're focusing on long-arm jurisdiction. We have an excellent panel for this. I've got David Kapos, he's the former USP TA Director, Judge Vandenbrock from the UPC Court of Appeal, Mr. Justice Mead from the High Court, and Dr. Hubertus Stadt from the Munich District Court. And they're going to be looking at the kind of decisions that have come out and how they're being applied in different jurisdictions, um, and what those decisions really mean for our clients, what they mean for your litigation strategy, what they mean for your choice of domicile and corporate headquarters, and things that you know we kind of need to be aware of on a day-to-day basis when we're kind of advising clients, even if we're not actively kind of involved in UPC work, as it were. Um, I think it's really important that we all stay up to date on these things. Um, and that's chaired by Darren Smythe from the CPUPC committee. So, yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. I think that's gonna be an excellent panel.

SPEAKER_03 15:52

It's um if I may interrupt, that's just a session quite unlike we've had before, um, considering the participation um with the David Kapos's um activities in the US uh with regard to European behaviour with long-arm jurisdiction. And uh also uh Dr. Schacht uh being uh on one of the panels in the Chairman Regional Division um uh involved with the BMW or NADA case, where uh one of the parties tried to assert a US patent, um which proved interesting.

SPEAKER_04 16:32

That's it's he's a huge problem. I mean, Catholics obviously, as you say, X G S P T O directs X IBM. I've interviewed him, I think he may have been on the podcast, I've interviewed him somewhere anyway, and he's met at least two presidents, which is quite cool. So when you meet him, then your seven degrees of connection really kicks off, just so you know. And of course, Richard Mead's just gone to the Court of Appeal, so we have a you know, we have a really influential and important judge, and then from from the European jurisdictions as well. I was just thinking about the, I mean, there's an obvious networking element always. There's some good educational stuff there. I think future-looking stuff, the sustainability of the business and sustainability of the profession against the changing world, as it

Students, Rates, And Better Networking

SPEAKER_04 17:10

were. It feels to me like it might be uh of interest to a younger subsection of the profession than sometimes comes along. I don't know if that's deliberate or is that right.

SPEAKER_00 17:26

I think I don't know if it's deliberate, I think, but I agree it is. Um we do have a student rate this year. We are we I mean, we always try to encourage students to come and younger members of the profession to get involved, to get involved with the Congress committee, to get involved by coming to Congress. Um it's really great. We do see kind of some similar familiar faces over and over. Um but yeah, we we'd love to get new people in. So if you're a student and you want to come, email cpd at CEPA and ask about the student rate. Um I mean, I guess we want everyone, we want the people who are the decision makers, but we also want the future decision makers. And I think I guess we want everyone in the fans to be having these conversations because these conversations affect the people coming up through the profession. They affect how many people fans are hiring, whether we're hiring, and that ultimately affects you know young people and employment rates. And I think these are really important conversations to be having with everyone.

SPEAKER_03 18:32

Okay, going back to Going back to participation in the committee, um, that's how Alexandra and I got involved in this uh committee was being the youngest member of the committee when each of us joined.

SPEAKER_00 18:47

In fact, there's also Mike Joas who made me join. I think he's responsible for almost everyone on the committee. Um so thanks.

SPEAKER_04 18:57

I mean that there's a sustainable sustainability element there, of course. So you need to keep cycling through, and you've got to get these different perspectives. I've always felt this is really important. Um in any any business tends to be run by the older generation just because you've been there longer and you've been around the block or whatever. But unless you get into voices of what's coming next, you just start missing tricks. I think you're absolutely right at the moment. And you picked up, I mean, I've been reading a couple of things. There's been an EPO's put out an early consultation um uh outcome about its kind of futures for the next five years, about what different people think, and AI tech convergence and geopolitics consistently come out at the top of that. So you're quite right. We live in a slightly unfortunate age of catastrophization. I think every ear has got its problems, and it's all amplified and echo chambered at the moment. But I think that, yeah, I think the the younger attorneys want to be coming along, A, to think about it, but B, maybe start to feel that we have a little bit more control over things. Not maybe not drought and flood, sorry guys. Um, but not immediately. We can all stop getting takeaways, I reckon that'll help. Um, but going forward, um, I can see how that that input and that slight sense of control might actually cheer people up a little bit. So yeah, I can I can exhort. I'm gonna go back to a KNS section and say let's maybe look at students going to this. I think it's it's don't forget, it's also these things are fun too. I think that's the other thing that people forget about networking. They're great, I mean pattern are great fun. You're quite right, Alexander.

SPEAKER_00 20:26

They are great fun. I think also, you know, it's a hard skill to learn, you know, being in a room full of people you don't know and and networking. Um so the sooner you start doing it, the better you become. Um so yeah, I mean, I'd really encourage everyone to, you know, if you don't want to if you don't want to come to the full congress or you can't get your phone to pay for you to come to the full congress, come to the networking event, practice some networking for free, um, see what's going on in the Manchester IP community.

SPEAKER_03 20:55

And I I wouldn't say it's practicing networking is networking, whatever stage you do it in your career. You just build up experience.

SPEAKER_04 21:04

Also calling it practicing networking. Really hang out, chat to people. Same thing really. Yeah, yeah. Just a bit like LinkedIn, a bit more eyeballs, side thing. That sounds awful. That's what I mean.

Training Juniors In An AI Workflow

SPEAKER_04 21:18

Um I was actually gonna go out to something you said earlier, which is just quite an interesting throwaway comment. Um that you went away on Matt Lee. Congratulations. Um uh how's the little one?

SPEAKER_00 21:29

Yeah, just relentless, but fun. Yeah, good.

SPEAKER_04 21:33

Um you came back, and even in the reasonably relatively short period of a Mat Leave, things have changed massively. Oh, can you expand on that? That's really interesting because I think I haven't had that break and then come back recently.

SPEAKER_00 21:44

Yeah, I think I I guess I feel the kind of A and I use very heavily, you know, quite keenly. Um, you know, it was it's not that we weren't aware of these tools, and you know, in fact, while I was off on Mat Leaf, the whole Greg's whole congress that he organized was focused. on AI. So I mean it was definitely coming, I think. I think it's just been there's been big directors from clients about using AI or using tools. There's been kind of corresponding pressures on fees, corresponding pressures on time. And I think my biggest concern, I guess, that I'm seeing is is how that inf I guess this comeback to what we're talking about with the younger people is the impact of that on trainees. You know, we talk a lot about AI tools as a tool for experts and a tool to be guided by an expert who can judge the output. But how do trainees learn the skills to judge the output if they don't get the time to do the work and the time to be wrong? And you know if if clients are asking that AI is used, are we pushing that down? Should we be pushing that down? Personally I think perhaps not, but you know, other people might view it differently. You know, I kind of want my trainees to do it the hard way and because they need to learn. But then you know are we asking them to kind of underperform on their billing if they're being asked to do it the hard way but the fees reflect the use of AI. So yeah that was just kind of a comeback to a whole different way of working. And I've I've got used to it. I mean I've I'm a pro at drafting with AI now. And it's a different skill. So you know we're developing new skills and it is a different way of working. But I think sometimes does it take the fun out of it? And you know if we're doing this for intellectual curiosity and intellectual enjoyment do we still get that with this new way of working?

SPEAKER_04 23:48

So those are just kind of my thoughts I think this will be coming up this year I guess at the Congress but Greg out of interest because I mean it's it's a rolling topic it just doesn't go away I'm yeah again I've I've I've hosted panels on AI as well. What were the conclusions last year and are they already out of date?

SPEAKER_03 24:17

It's a very good question. Because there wasn't one conclusion last year it was more of a reflection of what the conversations the conversations that are going on or were going on at that time and as I see it the conversation has moved on but the some of the issues are more relevant and um some of the challenges where it gets tight are more significant. There is on the other one hand AI adoption um and then on the other hand um the regulation coming out of the EU which um is something which I think people need to pay attention to but we didn't discuss last year um which actually raises in my view the um and I'm speaking on my own behalf and my own account um it raises the bar for accountability in that handing over things uh to AI is not passing the button it's actually increasing the need for you to um review everything which then creates attention which is even bigger and even more fundamental which is why I think we have this session as which Alexandra referred to earlier about the future of the profession.

SPEAKER_04 25:43

It is yeah I mean we've had separate we're going to whole podcast on AI now don't worry but it is it is something that we're looking at I think every firm's thinking that point about you know where does it hit but also as you said Alexandra how we're going to maintain training quality and make sure that we work out how everything fits together um we'll be revisiting that one the other one worries me I think I forget the exact term you use now um Alexandra it's something like disharmonisation or disunification so globe globally we're seeing the beginning of fragmentation as well for harmonization. What's the theme going to be there do you think?

SPEAKER_03 26:17

Oh I don't know Greg, you can state shape here can you well it's I think it depends on who they get talking. I mean from my own background coming from ASML um it's in some time that it's been a um a question of deglobalization and fragmentation um the and therefore I'm thinking that the way it's going to be uh handled uh in JP session uh is going to be still going to be part of it but it it it's the way the markets operate um and uh it occurs in different ways. I I'm talking about um uh importation uh or export bans um but um I think where what an angle that JP may come up well which is relevant for JP session is AI sovereignty um which could be uh one way of looking at it um and uh in the way that uh Congress is developed some of these details are actually shaped um uh close the time of Congress there's only so much I can actually say at the current time um but it is an issue they're talking about.

SPEAKER_04 27:37

But it all comes back to this I mean there's a sustainability topic and I'm hopefully people listening thinking oh gosh I do need to I do need to come along to this there's stuff to worry about. And I think Alexandra you say we're not necessarily going to solve everything but we start the conversation going and I think that group awareness of where the key points are is going to help you everyone will go back hopefully to their businesses and say right we need to be thinking about these extra things. All good the UK profession remains a very resilient one but partly it's because we are we do face up to this stuff rather than hoping it'll go away.

Sustainable Tech And Emotional Perception

SPEAKER_00 28:08

Yeah I think that's it. It's about having the conversations um and kind of we also have a couple sessions that are a bit more focused on on I guess AI and and also the intersection with sustainable technology. So we have a session on sort of growing and and funding and scaling sustainable technology, looking at some of the factors that help or hinder some of the investment options available, things like Wiper Green, just kind of offer a licensing route and obviously the role of AI in the technology itself and the technology being being supported by AI, I think there's this sort of tension between AI being potentially this incredibly unsustainable technology in terms of energy consumption and water use, but at the same time being incredibly transformative and it's being applied to all these new areas of innovation and doing incredible things like speeding up drug discovery and dosage regime discovery and helping get products to patients quicker. And I guess we're kind of going to talk about do the trade-off in RD time and resources balance the cost of AI it's being used? Are we using AI in the right way? Could we use it better? And also how can sustainable technologies kind of support that use of AI on the flip side you know can we power it in a more sustainable way? And I think yeah this kind of I don't want to say pervasive, but I guess it is pervasive, this filtering of AI into all these different technology areas means that life sciences and biotech and chemistry pattern attorneys are now something faced with inventions that essentially are computer inventions. And that's something that potentially they have no skills in in drafting and in in kind of meeting the requirements at the EPA for kind of plausibility of your AI and your model and your data and your training. So we're also going to look at the emotional perception case that's our Mark Taxfield and Pav Petrovic are going to talk about emotional perception there was a hearing last week on emotional perception AI and there was another hearing I think came out last week kind of applying the intermediate step. So although we don't have official guidance in the manual patent practice yet, that is coming the situation is developing and I think there's quite a lot to say now about how it's being applied in practice, the things that we can do in our practice day to day and that's relevant to the broad profession you know it's not just the computer technology issue anymore how we draft computer implemented inventions is relevant for all patent attorneys.

SPEAKER_03 30:51

So when you talk about the existential problems in the morning the um what you've just explained is rather than just computer inventions and the capability of them being a reserve for computer technology specialists it's uh for everyone and at the same time everyone even though you say there's guidance the guidance that's been issued are only specific to one specific case and therefore it's of note but not of uh relevance uh for practice as such um and with the absence of of of of uh clear guidance from the UK Patent Office simply because they need to have go to the method of developing their practice um and the practice note that was issued on the 14th of July and the um it's that everyone in the profession is facing an accidental uh issue um uh with uh uh how this practice is going to develop i mean the clear signs and how we can expect it will develop uh but we're not there yet quick question uh do we need a podcast in on emotional perception oh i think probably yes in due course you let me know when yeah uh jump of the line i think you could have several ones on emotional perception one you could have now because so much has happened now and no we're not gonna have a podcast now Greg we're gonna talk about it at Congress yeah yes indeed I don't mean now I mean the next couple of months um or or you wait until everything's settled but as you probably gathered from the conversation that Alexandra and I just had is when when will that be? Um because it could be um the way that this is developed from the uh is it and Andrea Brimelo's reference as presidents of the EPO uh in around 2008 or 2010 um or it was 2008 and then published in 2010 and it's only now we get a decision uh by the UK Supreme Court which clears all of that up um and we it could be years before we actually have clear practice.

SPEAKER_04 33:17

Even so very topical as you say even if you don't have the final answers and yeah everything about this Congress sounds very much on the on the moment which is important.

Manchester’s Innovation Ecosystem Moment

SPEAKER_04 33:26

One other highly topical element of it and this is what we in the business call a segue is of course that it's happening in Manchester which is um having a major political rebirth at the moment as we all know uh and I think that's really closely linked in as well. I I tantalizingly mentioned another guest at the beginning but it looks like Suzanne can't Suzanne Oliver honorary secretary in waiting amongst many other things and an old friend of the podcast um as well as a champion of northern technical powerhouse um thinking can't make it um by the look of it although she might pop in in which case we'll just welcome her in but Greg I know you've been talking to her about this near there's there's a real relevance to having it in Manchester right now isn't there absolutely um I think it all stems from Andy Burnham's um bid for the Labour leadership on the 29th of June which is significant for us um uh his speech was in the same venue we're having our reception on the 14th of September the People's History Museum which is where he launched his first bid some years ago and uh in his speech he had about just under two minutes talking about innovation policy um where he said that he would seek to drive growth using innovation policy in Manchester and also Cambridge as a blueprint for adaptation to different regions dependent on their different strengths and I summarised what he actually said.

SPEAKER_03 34:56

Well okay what he's done in Cambridge he's going to be doing all over the country but then when talking with Suzanne there was a quite a lot more in that short bit that he said on innovation um which was couched him with a broader uh reindustrialization uh objective um uh in that uh he referred to Cambridge for a specific reason. Cambridge and uh Manchester have a uh a partnership agreement and the organizations focusing on innovation and stimulating innovation mirror each other to the extent that the uh the Cambridge Tech Week which I think in innovation is quite a big thing um there's branch events which are uh which according to Suzanne occur in Manchester and um therefore this is something which is uh exists and it's not a random reference to Cambridge just to being two different things it's referring to an existing uh functioning active relationship then um in discussion this is actually started to point out the uh the uh Manchester Sheffield um corridor um which doing some research includes including a very big tunnel um like they have in Norway uh between uh Manchester and Sheffield um but which I thought she's not referring to a tunnel she's referring to something else um and it's actually uh something at the Don Valley reinvigoration or something which is something which is done with Manchester support and um I also found that Manchester mayors like getting like getting together and there are all sorts of various projects and uh plans and policy which they have uh individually or combined which all support each other and uh of course um other cities don't quite have the strength of innovation they didn't have people like Ernest Radford developing nuclear physics uh uh 120 years ago like Manchester and Cambridge did um but they have more practical industries uh and technologies in their location so they all have their own strengths so it seems that talking with the chat with Suzanne was very helpful at least for me in my interpretation of what Andy Burnham was saying is that um this is not just aimless policy it it has actual substance and is actually based on um a tried and tested plan with existing policies and approaches so we haven't seen anything yet I mean he's only been in government for for um uh as prime minister uh for weeks some of it which being on holiday um but it's um it is probably something to watch and um suzanne uh as I mentioned is is is a is an active community a member of this innovation ecosystem um she actually emphasised the point that in her view looking outwards from Manchester this is uh quite a significant policy development is timely um and I mean Manchester has always been echoing around as a really important city in the UK um I'm I'm talking Hacienda I'm talking Oasis I'm talking Alex Ferguson and the golden generation and Man United all these things so it's only right that it comes comes around again um but this time the nice tech side that really fits in um any final plugs for the Congress come come come essential students all that kind of thing well I suppose the one thing I just should finish off the Manchester spiel of course we do have we do have people uh from the local uh community um in this innovation community in in the Congress like Freddie Guameri sorry I didn't get his name right and also the the speaker from ARM because ARM is one of the companies like AstraZeneca uh which is present in both Cambridge and uh Manchester which supports this innovation economy so uh my plug based on that would be if you want to find out more come along and take part in the conversation.

SPEAKER_00 39:32

Yeah and if you want to hear from Suzanne who cannot be here come to Congress and talk to Suzanne. Yeah I think you know Manchester's a really well the Manchester region really exciting place to be um I guess when we picked Manchester uh it didn't have this kind of relevance but it's been really exciting to to build on that over the last few months and and kind of you know as things have progressed with Andy Burnham and the kind of situations become really fluid um I think we've really kind of dug into that innovation ecosystem and I'm trying to draw on that and share that with delegates and kind of give everyone a window into into what the region is doing and how that can be relevant for everyone now.

Tunnel Question And Final Send-Off

SPEAKER_04 40:23

Thank you. Any last thoughts or should we because we're gonna do we're gonna do Lee's wind up question I'm afraid I'm not gonna I'm not letting you get away with that and Alexandra you're in the most difficult position when we get to it. Yeah topics all done yeah come to Congress hear about all of this from the actual speakers not from me paraphrasing it no it's it genuinely sounds um fascinating um and um I'm now regret I'm not going and I'm sure what's so there you go so you've you've got one so I'm gonna go and plug it back in the office so that I hope that it will have the same impact. As you know we listen to the podcast we always end up with end up with a question I've never understood why uh it's the least thing and I never quite understand what generates the questions all I know is that I get asked it first as co-host but Alexandra today you're co-host so I'm gonna ask you the question so you're gonna find out what it's like being meet a completely random question um and you have to answer it and here it is um Greg talked about building a tunnel from Manchester to Sheffield if you could build a tunnel where would you build it to oh where would I build a tunnel?

SPEAKER_00 41:33

Welcome to my life I mean I think I I think I built another tunnel from North London to South London that just like cuts out the whole centre of it. Not you know not these tunnels that just go across the river. I think you want a full tunnel um because you know South London is eight miles away from me and it takes an hour to get there.

SPEAKER_04 42:02

Oh you still you still live in South London?

SPEAKER_00 42:04

I live in North London but my my mother lives in South London. We're obviously there quite a lot more now than we have.

SPEAKER_04 42:12

Not sure the politics the politics of building a large infrastructure project under London right now I don't think very well at all. You can picture it in Congress and see how it goes.

SPEAKER_00 42:24

But I mean I think tunnels are great I think actually I think I mean more importantly I think we should maybe get on with this like tunnel around Stonehenge or under Stone near Stonehenge get rid of that A303 traffic that would be good.

SPEAKER_04 42:40

Agreed tunnels tunnels are great quotes that's the quote in the podcast thank you. Greg you've had time to think where would you build a tunnel?

SPEAKER_03 42:52

Given the context it would be all to Magister from from from London. I think that's what everyone needs. A flood of people coming up to Congress. Going to appreciate number 10 in the north and where the new centre is I mean Congress we we're only just just just having see have a look up there and uh bring um uh a chance to to for bring CEPA to the IP community of the north brilliant good answer Alexandra you now have to ask me this is all part of the protocol oh where would you build a tunnel?

SPEAKER_04 43:25

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 43:26

Willem if you had to build a tunnel where would you build a tunnel?

SPEAKER_04 43:29

Oh just from the house of the pub. Great the family favourite uh the the little with a little um well the a train like an Austin Powers that went really fast as well oh like the tiny little post train yeah some of that one yeah yeah just just big enough a small family that that would be my answer thank you so much everyone thank you um for for for for all of your inputs um uh alexandra have you enjoyed being co-hosts and should we should we bin Lee and carry on as I think it's been quite enjoyed it thank you Philip and honesty there good chemistry excellent okay I'll I'll tell Lee he's had a good run um you shouldn't don't get ill next time hang on to your nose mate um thank you so much Alexandra for that Greg as a very great to see you and thanks so much yeah I know you when you got here you weren't expecting to speak but I'm really glad you did you're great so uh and the the Congress as well um no no well that I'm really excited to hear about the Congress that's great um as uh Lee always says just before we finish off if you enjoyed this episode please subscribe share it with a colleague and leave us a review thanks for listening to two IPs in the podcast