Second Serve Tennis

Winning Doubles with Singals & Staying Positive (Part 2)

• Second Serve with Carolyn Roach & Erin Conigliaro • Episode 277

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We are back with McKenzie and Rachel to discuss receiving strategy and more!

The secret to doubles success isn't just technical skill—it's communication. Discover how signals, strategy, and knowing when to poach can transform your game. Sometimes the non-hitting partner is the most impactful player on court! 

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Carolyn:

Hi, this is Carolyn. I'm here with Erin and this is part two of our episode with Rachel and McKenzie to discuss double strategy. In part one they told us what they normally do when they serve the ball. So if you missed that, we hope you go back and check it out. But here's part two. So if you missed that, we hope you go back and check it out. But here's part two. I know you guys have talked a lot about serving and signals and strategy. Do you guys do anything when you receive the?

Rachel:

Absolutely, absolutely. And particularly Kenzie on deuce will say I'm going down the line here and I know, okay, I'm going to back up, I'm going to back up to the tee, I'm going to be ready for that volley to come right at me with their backhand. Yeah, we'll go, I'll go. Okay, watch your tee, cause if she gets a racket on it it's going to be your backhand, it's going to drop short. No-transcript. One is Rachel is an incredible lobber. Are you going to tell your secret play? We do, we say secret play and then Rachel Go ahead.

Rachel:

When I'm on deuce I love to lob the net player because then the deuce player on the opposite side has to run across the baseline and hit a running backhand. So Ken's knows she's come to the middle of the court, taken over the middle and she's ready to crack it with her forehand, and it works 95% of the time. Yeah, so we'll go secret play and that's our secret play. Now I have to change the name. Well, we did so. We'll our secret play. So now I have to change the name. Well, we did so. Longer secret play and then we'll go return of safe poach. Sometimes we'll go. I'll go, okay, poach on my return.

Erin:

And.

McKenzie:

I'll send a really wide I'll try at least. I mean this is all you know, hypothetical A wide return and then Rachel will go across and hit a nice put away poach. And I think the the biggest thing on that is as rec players at our level we protect the alleys way too much Like make them 100%.

McKenzie:

Yes, Make them hit that low percentage shot. Yeah, Take up the middle. Yeah, we say that a lot because we love to go down the middle and we'll say, let's take the middle away and make them hit, hit, hit the alley, and then if they hit it, great, great shot. And if they hit it three times, then we go, okay, we got to cover that. But until they can do that, like regularly, we just we are more worried about the percentage of covering that middle and being able to to to shorten the points Absolutely getting that long and Jane did say this the longer you let that point go, it becomes anybody's point, Because you're out of position, you scrambled and suddenly it's just who's going to make that error first. And we don't like, I don't like that feeling of not controlling the point.

Erin:

Yeah, gigi Fernandez told us that too. She said people cover their alley way too much. She said give it to them and then if they burn you exactly what you guys said if they burn you two or three times, then make, then, then change your plan. But I think that's really smart.

Erin:

Carolyn unfortunately had a partner a couple of years ago that kept saying watch your alley, watch your alley, cause she didn't want her to. You know, when you just like I've asked her, she's wearing pink today. I know our listeners can't see it, but when we used to practice a lot of singles against each other, I would be like, please don't wear red, or please don't wear pink, cause she moves so much that I focus, you know, I mean I'm a, you know, low level four O's, so I'm watching the, the, the movement of her, instead of doing all the things that I'm supposed to be doing. So I think you guys are smart. That's a great strategy to have. I think you know, like you know Mackenzie, if you're going to hit wide and you can tell Rachel to go and if she gets burned, then she gets burned. Yeah.

Rachel:

Not a big deal. Well, to your point, erin, that's one thing that I have told a pro that I loved is he taught a whole clinic on how to be impactful as the non-hitting player. And so exactly what you're saying is because at our level we are, we're watching that person up at the net and just moving or covering their favorite shot, like a lot of times I'll go I know that this girl loves, she loves that down the line, so I might stand there because I know that that's her favorite return, and then you take that favorite shot away. But just like and, carolyn, that's something that you did so well in that match was you were so impactful when you weren't the hitting player, and I think that that's something that we don't see enough of at our level as well.

Carolyn:

Yeah, have you guys played with other people where they say no, I don't want to do signals? Because, I definitely. I'm a person where I want a plan, I want signals. I don't care if I don't execute the plan, but I just want a plan. But I've played with a lot of people that I think it messes up their chi or their flow if we try to do that, so I never want to push it. How has that experience been for you with other people?

Rachel:

Recently I had a match with wonderful she's a great player and she just said I said why don't we try using some, some basic signals? She's got a phenomenal serve and she goes. No, that's too much for me to think about, I just can't. I can't think about all that. Yes, and for me it actually. I struggled with that, just not knowing where this big serve was going to go. I think once you kind of get used to it and, like I said, you always got to track the ball but once you're used to kind of knowing where it's going to be, it's a level of comfort that you know. If you play with consistent partner and I love to play with Ken's there's a level of comfort there and also in terms of what balls to leave. So when I'm up at the net I know, okay, this is a ball for me not to take, even though I said I was going to poach on this ball. It's Kenzie's forehand, she's going to come in and crack that, so maybe, yeah, right into the net.

Erin:

It's going somewhere, so maybe, yeah, right into the net. It's going somewhere.

Rachel:

So it's about knowing what balls to go for and also which ones to leave. Well, and I do agree, Like it is like again, just it keeps us kind of playing together. So when you are playing with someone new, when we don't get a chance to play together for whatever reason and we say, okay, hey, like where are you going to go on this serve, and that person kind of shuts you down. For me personally, it makes me feel like go inside myself and I don't feel like I can swing free or communicate with them and I don't play. My best, and that's something that I'm trying to work on is to be able to play with people who don't really want to talk, and so far it has not gone well. It is a work in progress.

Carolyn:

That's right, but it is true, you need to practice this, and so, like this year, I played with all different doubles partners, so we never really had a time to practice, and it was more my schedule than anyone's where I just never could practice and only showed up for USTA matches, which, by the way, is not a good strategy. Do not only play in USTA matches when you come back to tennis, but I think it's true, like you go, you can practice. Do you take lessons together, working on this? We do yes, yes.

Rachel:

In fact, we had a great lesson yesterday. We showed up it's normally my singles lesson, but then Rach has been joining me and then our pro had her partner for their upcoming match like a four or five match today, and they're like well, you just practiced with us and during that we ran through some signals and some points and that's another just great time to practice, just trying it, trying a strategy. And again Rachel says maybe we miss our serve, maybe we're going up the tee, but I mean, who knows where that baby's going, goes out wide, but she still knows to track it down. And so I think running those plays really over and over again is something that we've been working on for a long time. Yes, oh, absolutely.

Carolyn:

You mentioned that you have teaching pros where you play at your club and you've gone to the camp with Jane that we mentioned earlier. Have you gone anywhere else, like any other camps, where you've been taught this, Because you guys really do have a strategy. I mean, I haven't played anyone else this season. Have you Erin, where they're doing signals and poaching? Do you play? A lot of people that do that, Erin.

Erin:

I don't play a lot of people that do it, but we do teach it at our club that Mackenzie's part of too now. So yeah, I mean, and not at all levels, but we should be doing it even more so than we do now. But I mean you guys are doing it consistently because you're consistent partners, but we all need to do it a little more, for sure.

Rachel:

Yeah. But yeah, I think if you do travel for clinics or take them outside of our club, does teach it, aaron, I agree, but most don't. And but when you travel, it does seem like the more resort clubs do focus on that, because they're not going to fix your forehand in a weekend but they can give you a couple of positioning cues or a couple of strategic points that you'll take with you forever. That could win you that tie break or maybe the two sets. You didn't even go to a tie break and that little kind of intangible or like 5% edge I do think is huge. So if people are listening that haven't done a trip with their team or even, like you know, their their eight group, that they that they play with regularly, like I, would encourage them to do a travel clinic to a resort because they are going to focus more on that type of thing versus your home club. That maybe is really trying to fix your technique.

Erin:

Okay, I want to move on to, I'm sure, since you guys have played enough, maybe have a crazy situation together, but our listeners love to hear people's craziest situation on the court. Mackenzie, do you want to start with that one?

Rachel:

crazy. It was just one of the first big things we've done together, which was play the elite eight two years ago at RRC. And Rachel wasn't a member I had just joined, so nobody knew us and you know, it's such a great community there and everyone's friendly and they all know each other and we were like definitely the outsiders and we came in and we played against two really great opponents and lost the first set horribly, Like it was one of our worst sets ever.

Erin:

Did we get a?

Rachel:

game and, honestly, rachel made. You can't see her face, but she made this face the whole time in the first set. And I put Vahmi over to be like, come on, we got this. And she'd be like just not really responding. Yes, it was like not responsive and I'd be like not really responding yes, it was like not responsive and I'd be like are you okay?

Rachel:

so anyway, we lost the first set and then we were down one four in the second set and I looked over at her and this is like, really we only started playing.

Rachel:

Maybe we played a few matches together at this point, right, yeah, this is our first tournament yeah, right, so I go and I look straight in the eye and I was like they don't win another game? And she was like another game, yep, I basically just brought out a very competitive side of me and, um, she was like okay, okay, so we actually win, um, two games in a row. We switch over to the other side, yep, so it's 3743, and I felt like I was gonna. I looked at her, I go, I think I'm gonna be sick, like I was so anxious. And she was like her and I go.

Erin:

I think I'm going to be sick, Like I was so anxious.

Rachel:

And she was like we got this, we got all the time in the world and I was like, okay, I didn't really say anything. And then they won their game. And then it was like we were down four or five or something and Rachel's like we got this. I am not worried.

Erin:

I was like you should be worried because if we lose?

Rachel:

I didn't even know, I didn't even know that there was one point, no clue. We thought this then what happened and then we came all the way back and we won that set and in the tie break we just I think I said not another point in the tie break I think we were done the tie break and that's when I walked into the crew.

Rachel:

But I won the whole thing Like it's beneficial for one partner to kind of and Ken's and I do this. I don't know why we have. We've asked ourselves this so many times why can't we both be dialed in at the same time? It's like one of us is out on left field and the other one's super dialed in, and so we can carry each other. We kind of help each other through that and then we flip it's in the other way.

Rachel:

Rachel's been saying recently. It's like the yin and the yang and it's like, yes, it's unfortunate we can't seem to usually dial in at the same time, but also we never both fall apart at the same time, I would say. And so it's like I know that if I'm having a moment, rachel is just going to turn up that level and like refocus me and vice versa.

Rachel:

And it happened just on Tuesday, it's, I mean it's happened so many times just this season, and we keep saying Rachel keeps going, it's like this yin and yang and it's like really interesting that we don't fall apart both at the same time. So yes, unfortunately we never seem to like play our best at the same time, but we also never let the other person just completely go away and one of us is always pretty calm. Sometimes I'll go. I just I'm sorry, I just took a nap for two games and but you'll keep us in for like just enough that then we can still kind of start playing both really well and come back and win.

Erin:

That's usually what happens.

Rachel:

One of us takes a nap for two games and I think that happens when we get nervous and we say we got to bring back the fun.

Rachel:

Like one of us will say, we got to bring back the fun, like we'll get tight, we stop talking, we stop with the plays, we get nervous and then we have to remind each other we're out here having fun. I mean just to be a member guest. The other day was a really tight match in that final, the final match, and I went back to the baseline and we just like sang a silly little song.

Carolyn:

She sang this ridiculous song. I sang just the two of us.

Erin:

If anybody wants to look that up.

Rachel:

She did this all day. She was going just the two of us and she's like snapping her fingers and it totally released the tension and we won every game after that. Yes, bing bang boom. Yes, yeah, bing bang boom.

Erin:

Yes, yeah.

Rachel:

It was a good reset. That was a fun moment. I needed that.

Carolyn:

Thanks again to Mackenzie and Rachel for coming on the podcast. We have one more episode where they discuss their most memorable moments, a few annoying situations that have happened to them on the court, and even a trick McKenzie does during a tie break. That can help you relax and I think it works. We hope you check out our website, which is SecondServePodcastcom. Thanks so much for listening and hope to see you on the court soon. Outro Music.