Second Serve Tennis
Second Serve Podcast is the only tennis podcast created exclusively for adult recreational players by everyday tennis players. We are passionate about the game and our episodes are geared towards adults playing a sport in the later years of life (hence, the name “Second Serve”). This podcast discusses everything related to rec tennis. Topics include the following: advice for beginners; funny and crazy situations that happen on the court; the rules of adult tennis; and how it feels being an adult and getting your feelings hurt when you are not played in an important match. We know how it feels!
Second Serve Tennis
Rec Tennis Stories, Laughter, and Spilling the Tennis Tea!
Welcome to a candid, laughter-filled exploration of tennis partnership dynamics with our guests Rachel and McKenzie, who pull back the curtain on their successful doubles relationship.
Ready to laugh, learn, and maybe pick up a few unconventional tennis tips along the way? Listen now and join the conversation about what makes doubles partnerships work on and off the court.
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Hi, this is Carolyn and I'm here with Erin, and this is part three of our conversation with Mackenzie and Rachel. In parts one and two, they gave us their double strategy that is effective, and in this episode, we just hear stories and laugh. So here it is. Do you have anything else? That's your most memorable moment on the court?
Speaker 2:I'm going to tell the story about our match, are you? I was going to say our hat's falling off, but okay, it's about signals. This is specifically about signals. It is kind of tie-in. So our match earlier this week we were playing two great opponents First, try level match of the season.
Speaker 2:Our first try level match. They were good players and we knew we needed to win our court. You know, try level is interesting. I love it because you get to play with all your friends, but the pressure's on to win your court every week and we're over there doing our signals and one of our opponents just lost it.
Speaker 3:We'd already won the first set.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we won the first set and I we're on serve as my serve and Ken's came to the baseline just for a few seconds, um, to remind me, serve your backhand and go up the T. I'm going to go literally that's what it was and our opponent lost it and she goes. Do you need to talk? Do you need to talk? Do you need to have a play before everything? And I knew she was frustrated because they lost the first set and we were both serving Well, our serves. You know it was effective. It was a great service day and she just couldn't stop, she couldn't let it go. She was very upset and you were serving two, three, yeah, and I just that's when I kind of wanted to say is that situation Like we're all out, we're all rec players?
Speaker 1:We did say that Rachel goes.
Speaker 2:I thought we were having a lovely match, cause we actually were like we were having a. You've played us and you, aaron, you and I played together Like we had a lovely match up until that point. And she said that Rachel's like I thought we were having a lovely match, you know, and the lady goes. Well, we were, and now we're not. Yeah, and they were like, okay, well, that's fine and honestly, it just refocused me. It was one of those moments that actually I probably could have started taking a nap for like two, two games. I probably would have. Like I kind of felt the focus go and at that point it was over. Rachel and I were like, okay, like let's dial game on. Yeah, the last thing you want to do is don't make mckinsey mad. Don't say that. Don't say that.
Speaker 2:That's, that's a pro tip for anybody who's about to say that you make me mad and I get a pit in my stomach and I'm like yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, that's such a good response to have. Is that because I do the exact same thing? If somebody yells or is upset on the other side, I get like, oh no, they're upset. But I think I should do what you guys did and Mackenzie did, which is okay. If you're upset, I'm gonna be even more focused.
Speaker 3:And let me just throw this rule out there, because we love rules. A friend of mine had this happen to her recently. The rule is that you go to the server's pace. You guys weren't doing that when they were serving. Exactly, you were doing it when you were serving and she did say.
Speaker 2:she was like I'm going to go look this up. And we were like, okay, that's fine, Like go ahead. And then I said, ironically, I'm like right now, because, like at this point, now you're delayed, Like your whole point was that this is taking too long and now you're going to like sit down for five minutes and look it up. But that's fine.
Speaker 1:And we weren't, we weren't doing it on returns yeah, you get 25 seconds between points too. It says in the rules that as well, and so it's like well, I've played you guys, you guys go quickly. It's I hate when people people are frustrated and then they want to take it out on their opponents for something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, sometimes I one of our pros at CCC. She's always like don't compliment your opponent, cause we both are. We tend to be pretty complimentary and you know they'll hit like a a good serve Maybe it isn't the best serve and we're like great shot, great shot. Or like you know you got it, girl. And they're like stop doing that, like you don't need to like pump up your, build them up. And it's very hard for us Both of us still do that and we try to like not do that as much as possible.
Speaker 3:I disagree with your pro. Only because they are pros, they played whole lives We've picked it up. Like you, Mackenzie, I did not start playing until I was 40 years old. I'm not going to change my personality. I'm happy to be out on a court. I'm happy to be healthy enough to be out there playing. If I'm going to say good shot to my opponent, that's just me.
Speaker 1:I'm just going to say it. I'm going to stop saying it. I'm going to stop saying it. See, that's advice that I got. I'm going to try. You're going to get bumped up. You're going to stop telling people how great they are.
Speaker 2:That's it. Well, we don't see the stop. I'm going to see if it helps me win.
Speaker 1:I'm going to see if that helps me.
Speaker 2:We can't stop it. We keep going. I mean, rachel is so sweet, she'll be up at the net. And and Ken's like, let's maybe not encourage her. Let's dial it down just a smidge.
Speaker 3:Right, right, that's so funny. Have you done any other tennis traveling together, not necessarily like tournaments or clinics, but how about other stuff?
Speaker 2:Well, we go to the US Open every year and that's so fun.
Speaker 3:Whoop whoop. I know y'all do too.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, it is so fun, that's our favorite. Yeah, yes, yes, it is so fun, that's our, that's our favorite. Yeah, if you get to go to a tournament like that, don't forget to watch the doubles. I feel like so many people go and go to the big stadium and they're watching those singles matches and kins and I actually bypassed whose match who was playing?
Speaker 2:it was a huge singles match and we satper Rood was playing and then it was Hadaj Maya and she was playing against, I think, makova or something. We didn't even go in to watch, we sat and we watched the women's doubles, taylor Townsend, and we sat on the first row. Nobody was in there and we sat behind them and we watched how they moved. We actually got to hear them talk. We could have high-fived them. Yes, hear them talk. I wanted to.
Speaker 3:I'm sure they wouldn't have minded.
Speaker 2:We're actually bad luck.
Speaker 3:Oh, it's Mackenzie and Rachel.
Speaker 2:But it was so great to sit there and watch women's doubles up close and see how they communicate with each other and they crack the ball. I mean, when our husbands weren't around. We would just like get on the phone at eight 30 and go hey, what are we watching? And it would be some random you know tournament like the Mexico or like whatever tournament. I'd be like, hey, okay, turn on Siegmund. And you know, rachel, go okay. Okay, pause it.
Speaker 2:Just like we would have our cup of tea and go on the phone and watch these points and talk about what they're doing and no, like we are nowhere near that level. Obviously, we will never, ever hit the ball like these ladies, but like some of the strategy still resonates and it still applies and it's still super relevant in our matches and we'll even say it, we'll go hey, remember that time that they you know those people lined up both back and they went I or whatever. And we'll go, let's just try it and it just keeps it so fun. I mean, that's the biggest thing.
Speaker 3:I like watching doubles on TV and watching their signals, and I, as a viewer, know what they're going to do.
Speaker 2:So I'm like oh.
Speaker 3:I've done that signal before yes, exactly, exactly.
Speaker 1:And you guys are really nice and really fun to play against. I will say as somebody that's played against you as an opponent. I mean, we went into a match tie break and I think Kenzie double faulted the first serve Like she served first and it was a double fault and instead of being like upset, she walked over and she said something like I should have just given you guys that point. I don't know why we wasted time.
Speaker 2:You know, it was something so funny, like sometimes people do say like we loved watching you, because we really are ridiculous out there. I mean, at the member gas, we ended up being on stadium court. Okay, it was so windy. Did y'all play in that? Were you all there?
Speaker 3:Yeah, you were there. You were there, she was beside us.
Speaker 2:Right, it was crazy windy and there was one point that I I will say I will going to hustle for that ball. So I was sprinting forward. My visor flies off, it's so windy. I get the ball. The point keeps going. It was like a very, a very good point. I hear Rachel coming up behind me. She hits another ball whatever, we ended up winning the point and I turn around and her hat's on the ground, my visor's on the ground, so both of our headwear fell off in the middle of the point and there was like 10 people up there just watching and cracking up because I'm sure we didn't like absolutely Hats off. We just left it all on the court, as they say.
Speaker 1:Oh that's fantastic.
Speaker 3:I love that.
Speaker 2:Can you tell me about your earlobe trick? You get nervous, no, okay.
Speaker 3:When Kenz gets nervous, like in a tie break, she'll pull her earlobes down. She's like we won't put this on unless we can't tension it's a real thing.
Speaker 2:It is a body connection, y'all, in that match, in that elite eight match. I look back there in the tiebreak and she's got both of her hands on her ear and she's just yanking her earlobes. I'm like, okay, here we go.
Speaker 1:It is a real thing, though. If you're tense, you pull your earlobes down and it releases it and makes you less tense. I mean, that's what my therapist said. I'm going to do it.
Speaker 2:I'm going to do it. I'm going to use that. Yes, I mean, I haven't ever Googled it, I haven't fact-checked her, but I trust her with a lot of things, so I feel like I had to just go with that one. But, yes, you, will you make it sound like I do it all the time, like I have like a tick or something? But, like you may see me at the baseline tugging, especially if I'm serving.
Speaker 3:Carolyn's always looking for winning strategies.
Speaker 1:Yeah, or tips.
Speaker 2:I mean, I'm not complimenting my opponents, I'm going to be pulling my earlobe, we do that, we just were told not to, but we actually really do continue to compliment people and try to lift them up, like especially it's so hard if someone's having a bad day out there, and like they're hitting a couple double faults, like Rachel and I both would be like you got this girl, like we just can't help it.
Speaker 1:So, okay, I'll still compliment then, but I'm going to definitely do the earlobe thing. I've never heard that I'm going to do that.
Speaker 2:How about don't do this, though, in a match that barely caught the tape? This guy's crazy just got on the back of the line there that I'm like, yeah, okay, they want you to know that they are the most fair line call fair.
Speaker 3:That's when you know did we talk about I feel like I just had this conversation. That's when you know that they're really not calling the ball, that they're waiting to call out your ball on a big point that actually caught the tape and you'll go gosh, but she was so fair, it must have really been.
Speaker 2:Oh, and you're like, okay, yeah, there was one match in particular that drove Rachel absolutely insane.
Speaker 3:I can't imagine you being upset at all.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can't imagine you guys being upset just because you're so friendly and nice out there and having such a good time If I get upset.
Speaker 2:Ken's dials it back. Yeah, we really do have an NNA Like. I got real mad about that the other day when the lady got was upset with Rachel for taking extra time during the point. It actually really did bother me and I I could not even actually be nice at that point. I was not ugly, but I was not any. I was no, I was not ugly, but I was not. I was done.
Speaker 3:I really was like this is it, I'm over it. And it didn't bother Rachel as much as it bothered me, and usually she's the one that gets annoyed about stuff. She looks at me and she goes.
Speaker 2:Why is this not bothering you?
Speaker 1:It bothered me it shouldn't bother you, she goes.
Speaker 2:Why is this not bothering you right now? And I'm like God. I didn't because we couldn't both be upset out there.
Speaker 3:Exactly Right, that's true.
Speaker 2:And we do tend to know that. So, like the double bounce, oh my God, the double bounce. What happened with the double bounce? Like in a tie, another tie break, and I do say like we give people a lot of grace in the double bounce Absolutely, because sometimes you think you, you think you got it right and you really feel like you scooped it up and you have to call it on yourself.
Speaker 2:It's your call at the end of the day and we're going to tie break on hard court. I personally think it's easier to call a double bounce on yourself on clay, but I got to a ball. I know I got there. Also, I will say Rachel is like the most honest person in the world and like a hundred percent would have called it on herself no questions asked and I mean, and they wanted to argue about it. They felt like she was a double balance and Rachel was like I got that ball. They came to the net and they it was a big thing. It was a long discussion and I was like you know what, fine, take the point. And I could not move past it. That's the other thing I want to encourage rec players like don't give a point away. I feel like we do that all the time and then it throws us off.
Speaker 2:You're going to throw yourself off. In fact, we played a match. It was a great, it was a four-a-match a great four-a-match the other day at North Hills and the people were awesome. You know, it was just a very athletic, good match. It wasn't like a whole lot of chatting or anything like that, but this one woman had a great serve. I returned it and she just caught my return and we were like what happened?
Speaker 3:She caught it in her hand.
Speaker 2:She goes oh, I thought you said out, and we were like nobody said out, and so someone was watching and said, oh, I think it was the court behind you, and her partner goes oh, okay, so second serve.
Speaker 2:And I was like I'm so sorry, but no, like that's our point, and I think we ended up winning the game pretty quickly after that and and I felt horrible and I walked over to her after and I was like I really wanted to give you that point, I wanted to give you that chance again to give a second serve. You know, like I want you to know that I wanted to, but I also know that I shouldn't have done that, because in the past I have done that and then if I lose that point, I get really upset with myself and then we would have ended up losing the game. And I have my partner to think about and like cause I really wanted to give it to her, I wanted to go. Just go again, girl, it's fine, you know, but it it wasn't fine. So we've we have learned to like just stick to the rules and don't go overboard to, because it ends up hurting us. It ends up hurting our, our like mental state.
Speaker 1:And we lose a couple of games.
Speaker 3:Oh, we've lost matches, yeah, because we've been like, I'm sure, and we've talked about this a lot the problem is, if you're the rule enforcer and we know the rule we're not experts, but because of doing this for so many years now, we've learned a lot about rules. We've talked about rules that are weird things, we want to change all kinds of stuff, but it's. The problem is is that when we stick to the rules, if somebody else doesn't want to follow the rule because they're trying to be you know just, oh, it's just rec tennis, whatever then you, as the rule enforcer, look like the jerk. But the rules are there for a reason. That's happened so many times and I will tell you in that situation specifically, I can absolutely remember several times that I have played tennis over the last 13 years that I thought I heard an out call too and I either stopped playing or didn't hit a ball or whatever.
Speaker 3:But I immediately, because I'm also a real follower and I like to also be the real implementer or make sure other people. I feel like it's an injustice when people don't follow rules, and so because I'm such a rule follower, I expect that people will do that too, and they don't. They don't like to follow rules when it doesn't work for them, right? And I have said that's your point, like I'm giving up that point because I made the mistake. But let me tell you how many times that doesn't happen on the flip side A hundred percent yes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's frustrating. And it's frustrating as a captain. You know again like I've had to forfeit courts because we've made a mistake either on a time, or a player's been late or you know, whatever it is, and I'm like that's why there's a rule book. But, man, when it happens to the other team, no.
Speaker 3:Oh, it's just rec tennis. We're just here to have fun, Aren't we just here to play a match? It's like, yeah, on time, we're here to play a match on time and on this date that we're here to play a match on time and on this date that we're. You know that sort of thing. So it's, it's frustrating, but you know, I mean, I know you guys well enough to know I'm. 90% of our matches are all pretty friendly, but those 10% stick out.
Speaker 2:They do, they do and it's unfortunate, and I mean that's that's one thing that we it does kind of bother us when people get really upset out there. You know, and we kind of we want to, like Rachel and I's tendency is to kind of like, try to mitigate that however we can. But, but also Ken's and I, we say this all the time we learn more from those situations, from either a conflict on the court or from a loss, than we do from easy, pleasant matches. Right, you learn more about you as a player, um, we improve more when we lose because we can reflect on that match and say, okay, what did we not do?
Speaker 3:What did we not strive for?
Speaker 2:I like the matches that we win actually Well yeah, me too. I like to have life back on those. Look, there's nobody who has a harder time letting a loss go than me?
Speaker 3:That's true.
Speaker 2:Despite what she says, she's like it's so fun and she gets in the car and she calls, but she's like I can't let it go.
Speaker 3:It's like three hours later wake up in the middle of the night and not be able to go back to sleep.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've been there, like in the middle of the match. I'll go why I'll take a ball I've got no business Because I know it'll haunt me. But you do learn more from your losses, that's true.
Speaker 1:That's true, Carolyn. Have you learned a lot this season? I'm getting a PhD this season. Oh my gosh, I don't know, but watch out. Next year that's right 2026.
Speaker 2:You just keep hitting that appeal button, don't even sweat it.
Speaker 1:I am, I am Just wait. Well, I'm going to have to go this season.
Speaker 2:Really, this was a freshman season for me at 4-0.
Speaker 3:I mean Just getting bumped, yeah, yeah. Did your phone stop ringing after you got bumped to 4-0? They're like oh, like. You know you went from the best 3, five. Everybody wanted you to like. What is my phone working?
Speaker 1:Try level. You guys are on try level but like oh, not try level anymore, sorry, yeah, yeah, combo.
Speaker 2:It's really going to be a struggle.
Speaker 3:Combo is going to be great.
Speaker 2:We have two combo teams. I mean it's going to be great, I can't wait, it's going to be epic.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but yeah, it's going to be epic. Yeah, but it's true, though your phone stops for a couple years when you're at the top echelon of your rating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, people still want me.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, girl, Uh-huh. Yeah, mackenzie's still a commodity, she's a hot ticket.
Speaker 1:I got like five more months left on this call.
Speaker 3:Rachel's a liability.
Speaker 2:I am a major liability. People know that.
Speaker 3:But together you guys are a good doubles team, so I'm sure everybody does want you on their teams together.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they don't want to play with us, they only want us together. We really annoy everybody we really do At our club, yeah.
Speaker 3:We've had to go outside clubs. We're tennis nomads.
Speaker 1:now we just play everywhere for a couple of seasons, and then people are like okay, we really appreciate Mackenzie and Rachel coming on the podcast and I've realized I'm one of those people that have said previously oh that just hit the line. So I'm going to make sure to stop doing that, because now I realize that that annoys some people, so I'm going to stop. I'm learning a lot from this podcast. Thanks so much for listening and hope to see you on the court soon.