Gentle parenting author L.R. Nost once wrote, when little people are overwhelmed, it's our job to share in our calm, not join in the chaos. Well, how do we actually do that in today's modern world? That's what Helen Boniface from Karma Kids is talking about on today's episode. I'd like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land on which this podcast is recorded. And for us here on the Sunshine Coast, that's the Kabi Kabi and Gubbi Gubbi people. Today I'd particularly like to honour the land on which we work and play, the land, the sea, the air, the sky. We have spent some beautiful days out in nature in the glorious winter sunshine and I really want to honour the elders past, present and emerging, those custodians of the land that have held this space, that have looked after our land for centuries thousands and thousands of years. I'd also like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land on which you are listening to this episode. Welcome to Raising Wildlings, a podcast about parenting, alternative education, stepping into the wilderness, however that looks, with your family.
SPEAKER_00Each week, we'll be interviewing experts that truly inspire us to answer your parenting and education questions. We'll also be sharing stories from some incredible families that took the leap and are taking the road less traveled
SPEAKER_02We're your hosts, Vicky and Nikki from Wildlings Forest School. Pop in your headphones, settle in and join us on this next adventure. Hello. Yes, it's another episode of the Raising Wildlings podcast. And today you're here with me, Vicky Oliver. And before I introduce my guest today, I would like for you to sit with some of these statistics. One in seven primary school students are now experiencing mental health problems. 75% of mental illness has its onset for the age of 24. We're finding 44% of new teachers are leaving teaching within their first five years. And I'll be honest, I'm one of them. And we've also got 45% of Australians experiencing a mental health illness in their lifetime. And yet we're only just starting to see any resources being allocated to addressing our mental health crisis. So today on the podcast, we have invited one half of the amazing Karma Kids duo, Helen Boniface, to help us shift our approach to wellness through the support and maintenance of healthy minds in Australia. Now, the sisters and co-founders of Karma Kids, Helen and Michelle, they share a collective 28 years of teaching experience in the fields of education, yoga and mindfulness. They created Karma Kids to help make simple and effective wellbeing tools accessible to every child and family. And I can't wait for you to hear what Helen has to share with us today. I'm just going to dive straight in. How about you tell us how you came to create Karma Kids?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so myself, I found yoga in my early 20s through anxiety. And I felt, you know, obviously, I just, from that moment, I kind of I feel like it's something that everyone should grow up learning. But way back then, I kind of went over to India, did my first teacher training in India, teaching for about 10 years. And then my sister, who is the co founder of Karma Kids, she's a primary school teacher, and she was a deputy principal in England. She needed some help for some resources at her school where she was deputy principal for a wellbeing week. And she basically asked me to film some breathing exercises and stuff for the school. And they played it in assembly in the UK, like 400 kids and being impacted by mindfulness and breathing. And at that same time, I'd had my twin girls, that was five years ago. And I guess my life was just getting redirected into that place of parenting and children. Fast forward a year on, she actually moved over to Australia. Awesome. So it's kind of the universe threw us together in this, our two passions of her with her, all her teaching experience, me with the yoga and then with my own children and then coming together to birth Karma Kids into the world.
SPEAKER_02That's so amazing because, you know, we follow you, but I was going through all of your, you know, Instagram and What I love about it is so simple, like that it doesn't have to be complicated. So I think I'll rewind a little bit and I want to talk, because we're talking about calming kids down and having some tools, but I guess the challenge that we're facing is that we are searching for these tools is that we're often in a state of stress and that's whether that's ourselves or increasingly children finding themselves in a state of stress, which is distressing as an adult to know that so many children actually need these tools. Like, you know, it's distressing to think that children are not in a more overall state of calm anyway. Yeah. So can you tell us what's happening internally to us when we're in a state of stress?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think the points what you're bringing up is so massive as well, because it speaks to that co-regulation of when you're stressed as adults, like a stressed out adult isn't very beneficial to calm a stressed out child,
SPEAKER_02right?
SPEAKER_01So I guess physiologically, when we're stressed, our heart rate is going faster, our breathing becomes more rapid, you know, all of our, anything that's not essential, basically, like our digestive processes, they're not optimal. So the most important thing we do when that stress response is triggered is to basically calm our breathing so the only physiological proven thing to keep take us out the stress response is actually the breath that's going to be the quickest and easiest way to take us out of stress and of course like as adults we need to model that for our children so if we You know, if our breath becomes really rapid and we become really stressed, it's our responsibility as adults to bring ourselves down so we can model that for the child. There's really no benefit of saying calm down to our children when we're really stressed. But I know as a parent as well how triggering it is when our children are upset. It triggers us. It brings up our stress. We want to make it better for them, but we actually need to calm our own nervous system first to then be able to co-regulate with them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think that's, it's such a, I mean, I often, I'm actually seeing a lot more people now, even as I'm scrolling, there's a few people that are like, just want you to stop and take a deep breath. And it's so interesting to me that it's so simple. Yes. And just having that little anchor to say, just stop and do that now. So that you're not constantly getting to that point where you actually need more than just a little bit of, I mean, breathing's, I mean, that in itself is helping, but, you know, if you can constantly just have those little reminders to take those deep breaths. Yeah. Then we're setting ourselves up to be in a better place if we do find ourselves in a challenging situation or a difficult moment with our children.
SPEAKER_01Which we obviously always will, right? Yeah. Yeah. I think that's the thing with us at Common Kids because we do understand the parenting side, we understand the education side. It needs to be simple. It needs to be quick. It needs to be easy but also effective. Yeah. I love meditation and I love like if I can get 20 minutes of meditation a day, amazing. But for parents, we don't always have that time. It doesn't have to be hard. It doesn't have to be this whole big process. Like, you know, to go to a whole yoga class is amazing, great for the nervous system, but we can reset ourselves with these really simple and easy strategies as well as well. long as we're taught you know taught effectively so that we're going to for example breathe efficiently so
SPEAKER_02breathing
SPEAKER_01efficiently i'm talking about diaphragmatic breathing so extending the belly you know this is going to help to stimulate the vagus nerve and bring a sense of well-being with the breath rather than just just a deep breath we actually want to kids and parents to breathe um efficiently
SPEAKER_02yeah i guess that's the next step as well so what if we're at that moment, we're having a difficult moment with our child or someone else's child, because a lot of us are educators as well. What are some micro actions or questions we can ask ourselves to slow ourselves down before we react? So before we get to that reactive moment, what is something really micro that might help us to steer ourselves into a better direction?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So I think like I use something called the pause button. So some people like to have a physical anchor. So I might touch, like I've got the place between the thumb and the first finger. I'll just myself physically first and then take a breath. So that can, and that can be really good to show children that too. And I talk about it. I say like, I just need to calm down so that I can support you. So I talk to it as well. But really, yeah, creating that pause before the response is really, really pivotal.
SPEAKER_02Because
SPEAKER_01if we respond in that, I mean, stress is a survival response. When we're stressed, the brain doesn't know the difference between being stressed because maybe a child is overwhelmed and then it's triggering us and the child is overwhelmed because they're not maybe getting the right coloured cup. There's no difference in that child stress response of being chased by a tiger. The response is still that old caveman response of we're stressed and it's survival. So I think remembering Remembering that as well, like having that in our minds as parents and educators that this child is in a survival response. And it works with adults too, our partners, you know, maybe work situations, we get a trigger. And when someone's stressed, they're in that survival response. So trying to come to it from a place of empathy.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And understanding. I love that.
SPEAKER_02I think that's really important because I often think that we hold children up to a higher standard than we hold ourselves. 100% agree.
SPEAKER_01It's ridiculous really, isn't it, that we would do that, what we expect from them, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and I catch myself sometimes when I'm deep in it and I'm, you know, frustrated and pouring that all out into my children and then I think like I'm not even doing what I'm expecting them to do to me in this exact moment. So then what kind of strategies do we have to actually implement some mindfulness because we are telling ourselves we're so busy and perhaps we are really busy, And maybe it is people find it really hard to take that 20 minutes to actually do a meditation. Yes. What can we do? What's something really simple that we can implement to start ourselves in a better cycle or a better habit?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, awesome. And do you mean for us as parents or for our children?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well, either, I guess. Start
SPEAKER_01with parents, yeah. Look, something really easy is just to do like a two-minute, either every day or just once a week. Start small, doesn't have to be big, but just a two-minute pause. It could be like I just made a cup of tea, boiling the kettle, and rather than like scrolling on my phone or distracting myself with something else, it's like I'm actually just going to stand while I boil the kettle for two minutes and I'm going to focus on my breathing. Or I'm going to listen to sounds, you know. It could be... I just had a one-on-one with the beautiful child this morning and we did the five senses through the hand. So it's really nice to show the child the hand and you say, what can you see at this moment? What can you feel at this moment? What can you smell at this moment? What can you hear? What can you taste? It just brings us into the present. Like it doesn't have to be this massive, big process of a deep mindfulness experience, but in planting those seeds for our children and for us, the benefit is huge because we start to see that change We start to see, oh, I am more present. I'm noticing what's around me rather than letting my mind take control. Yeah, I
SPEAKER_02think that's so powerful. I just want to tell you a little story. Last week we had a child in the forest and I was only there to pick up my kids and she had a tick and she was really quite distressed. And I watched Lindsay. She must have... gone through some sort of breathing activity with them in the forest that day and I watched her um you know we're all trying to say the things to try and get her to to not be so worked up about us just even looking at it and Lindsay did this beautiful thing where she's you know got her to you know do some breathing tracing her yeah yeah it was like it's one of those moments where I just was it was like time slowed down and I just watched this child go from really, really stressed and really so just didn't know what to do with herself to just, I just cannot explain the immediate calm that I saw in this child from this really simple breathing exercise. And it absolutely, like, I mean, I know how important all of these things are, but to sort of be external and watch it happening was so profound. So do you have examples of things like this where you've seen such a dramatic impact for, you know, children or adults in implementing something so simple like that?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, 100%. I just thought that was such a beautiful gift to witness, isn't it? Yeah. Those little moments that literally it's just, yeah, it's amazing because you just go this is transformational, you know. Yeah, it was. Yeah. Definitely. So we have, I love, we're very community based. So we were in contact with our parents. And so we often hear stuff like, you know, I had a message the other day from a parent that said, I was having a bit of a stressful moment. And, you know, my little boy said, just one thing at a time, mummy. And then the little girl said, take it, maybe take some deep breaths. You know, and so like these kids that we're educating are actually then teaching the parents, reminding the parents. I have like a little girl who was always having trouble sleeping. And so she'd draw the, like a square on her hand, we do box breathing. So breathe in, hold your breath, breathe out, hold your breath. And she'd go to bed every night and she'd draw her little squares. It's like he's taking these tools home. Kids that will give their parents temple massages to help them to relax. And, you know, you hear about them at school that they're, you know, it's mainly the feedback from the parents. I don't always see it. like your experience of seeing it with the child in that experience. I don't always get to, not always lucky enough to witness it firsthand, but often hear parents of ways that they've handled anxiety in school, you know, through a lot of the tactile, the kinesthetic breathing that you just talked about with the five fingers is so good because it is good for that sensory awareness. It's physically anchoring too, right? Not only just breathing, it's also a tactile experience. which the kids, a lot of kids really enjoy.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm sure they do. One of the things that you talk about is that learning and wellbeing can't be separated. Do you want to talk to that a little bit about how important wellbeing is overall?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, sure. And I guess, look, I mean, I think that's come a lot from Michelle's extensive experience in education. Like you guys, you were both teachers as well. So she was for 18 years teaching and I guess she's seen that whole process in the UK of it being very exam driven, very like, you know, the NAP plan came in there before Australia and And they've then kind of gone full circle back to wellbeing being most important. And I think we've really seen that journey here in Australia, you know.
UNKNOWNYeah.
SPEAKER_01in general you know mainstream schooling um and i guess it comes down to the brain and how the brain you know the just the simple the brain in terms of how it works so you you'll obviously be familiar with dan siegel's work um like it's it's neuroscience proves that when the prefrontal cortex is offline we cannot learn we can't take on new information because the limbic brain the emotional brain takes over it takes charge so you know if we are trying to teach children when it's in school, homeschooling, you know, whether it's just trying to share a toy with a sibling, it doesn't even need to be like a big, you know, academic. teaching, but whatever we're doing, if we're trying to impart something and teach a lesson to a child, we can't get through to them when their limbic brain is in charge, just the same as an adult. As you said, you know, we often expect more from our children. It's literally not possible. And I love the phrase when emotions go up, intelligence goes down. So when they, they can't make rational decisions, they can't take on logical thinking. And we need to always connect with a child first. So when it learning and wellbeing. It's really from that premise of like, if you're not connected, if you're not, if your wellbeing is not okay, if your window of tolerance, we can always talk about that, but the window of tolerance is, is in hyper arousal, even hypo arousal, if it's too far up or too far down, we're not in our optimal zone. We, we can't learn.
SPEAKER_02Can you talk about the window of tolerance for me? So for people that haven't heard about it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, sure. So the window of tolerance, again, really good for us to recognize as parents, but also for our children. So you've basically got our optimal zone where we're functioning at our best levels, you know, nervous systems, pretty calm. We can have little peaks and troughs. So, you know, we might be driving to do school run or something. And then we come up a little bit because someone pulls out in front of us and we can still stay in our optimal zone. So there's things that happen, of course, as humans, we're going to go have waves, but, you Hopefully we're staying mainly in our optimal zone if, you know, if we're sleeping well, if we're eating well, if we're exercising, kind of taking all our general well-being to do things. But if we are... maybe overtired maybe overworked for a child maybe hungry maybe not being connected um you know all the all the sort of things that we see in children when their nervous system is starting to get a bit heightened maybe someone's taken something that was theirs like a fight with a sibling or a friend and we start to go up into this what we call hyper arousal so this is the way anxiety presents so um you know that fast breathing i talked about you know the brain's maybe going a little bit offline so when we go up into hyper arousal we're out of our optimal zone and then we've got down below that is our hypo arousal which this also leaks into polyvagal theory probably haven't got quite time to go but basically the hypo arousal it it demonstrates differently for kids. So it actually looks like they're very withdrawn and quiet, which sometimes these kids kind of get missed a little bit because it's, oh, well, that child's shy or that child just doesn't really engage in groups. And it could be that. That totally could be it. But it could also be that their nervous system is actually shutting down. So it's more about disassociation. We've gone out of the hyper arousal and then whatever in the hyper arousal we're trying to get to work isn't working. And so we kind of dive down into that. hypo or dorsal vagal um so I guess long story short it's really important to identify when we're coming up out of our window because if we can start to know like I say to my kids like mummy's a bit cranky today mummy needs to do you know whatever I need to do like mummy just needs to go and sit out on the deck and have a cup of tea for a minute and then I'm gonna be able to play again yeah so it's like realizing what we need to do so it always comes into self-awareness I think for parents particularly when we've got younger kids helping them to recognize but as they get older we can start to say like, how are you going? Are you feeling a bit, you know, you're feeling a bit tired today, something getting to you? Because if we start to identify those markers earlier, we're less likely to have the meltdown. It's before we get into that really hyper arousal or really hypo arousal that we can use the tools that they're going to work. You know, that when a child is so dysregulated, it does get to a stage where, you know, the deep breathing, we need to just connect them back.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's right. And modeling and having that language to give them as well. Like I, when I am around children who have parents who have gone to a lot of effort to talk to their children about their emotions, about what's going on, to make it really clear, give them the right words to go beyond the sad, mad or glad sort of emotional spectrum as well. Those children are able to pull themselves out of or identify at least to go very deep into how they're feeling really quickly, particularly now that my children are getting older and I'm watching the dynamics and what's going on. I don't remember seeing those sorts of things happening when I was a child. Like I don't remember children having that ability to describe how they're feeling or even the permission to feel that all, you know, boxed down and pushed down. And so nobody actually knows how anyone's feeling. Whereas now I'm starting to see such a vulnerability and it's not scary for them. They just talk about it. And to actually watch it play out in front of me is something that's so special and heartwarming and makes me feel really so glad for my, just so glad, so excited for my children that they will have so many better tools because what I'm also seeing is adults unable to do so many of these things. And maybe they can in certain circumstances, but overall so many adults are unable to regulate themselves because we've never been taught the tools and for a myriad of other reasons. So starting young, I just, I can see such a huge and immense benefit for long-term wellbeing as well.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And look, I couldn't agree with you more. I think that the younger we learn this, I mean, if you look at the neuroplasticity of the brain so that, you know, the neurons that fire together, wire together, they say, so the more, the younger we are to create this kind of this changes and synapses in the brain, the more powerful it is, you know, they are They are going to teach us because they, they do, they're like sponges. They take it on and they just, they're imitators, right? Let's give them something to imitate because they, they literally, they do, they copy our good and our bad. Yeah, that's right. You know? And yeah, I, I totally agree with you though. Like it's amazing how, more emotionally aware we are um and as parents like it's if we can it might be it's harder for us to change it is harder yeah but and it's not easy and none of us get it right all the time like none of us get it right all the time um you know I observe myself that's important it's I think so because I think you know we already many of us as parents put so much pressure on ourselves you know be the best we can be for our kids and of course we should do that but I think understanding like compassion for ourselves as well and just learning. If you do mess up, just repairing that straight away. You know, owning your mistakes is just as powerful for our children as, you know, like perfection doesn't actually exist, right?
SPEAKER_02That's right. It's a false sense of something that you're passing on and then it's unachievable for everyone.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and it's just that creates more problems, you know, other problems for the child. So I think just, you know, we're all human, just identifying that, you know, I made a mistake today, you know, this is how I'm going to make it right. That's really good modelling, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I think self-compassion is important. something that we need to talk about a lot more, particularly in the parenting space because we get so many mixed messages about how to do things. And I think that sometimes at the end of the day it can be really simple. So self-compassion, admitting when we're wrong and trying to do the best we can and just do better when we know better. And every time we pick up something new and we go, that sounds like something great, I'm going to implement that because it actually feels right in here, not because... you know, someone's telling me I have to do it is to just keep going and trying and seeing how it works. And, and, and then also going, you know what, I tried something that I thought might be good and it wasn't, and it didn't work out. And I have compassion for myself because all like, you know, the best parents out there are the ones that are just, you know, trying, trying really hard to giving it a go and are aware that They don't know everything. And the way that we were brought up wasn't necessarily perfect and that's okay and we're willing to try something else.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I couldn't agree with you more. I think as well, you know, just recognising as well, like you're, you know, trusting yourself as a parent because every child, every parent's different, every situation's different. It's not a one, you know, a one formula fits everyone. And I think for me as a parent, definitely part of my journey has been trusting that and knowing that what is right for my children, it might be different to other people. Yeah. You do, you kind of go like... They're babies. You know, you're learning all about babies. You're really learning as you go along. With each stage there's something different, isn't there?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and especially like I was thinking in your example, you've got twins. So, you know, that experience is only shared by a handful, you know, a certain percentage of other people. Yeah. And so comparing yourself to a parent of a single child or two children that are a certain age apart can be so damaging to us because...
SPEAKER_01Comparison's the thief of joy, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah,
SPEAKER_01absolutely. It's like we shouldn't compare. We should... be on our own journey, get as much information as we can. Like I think information is power just to have that knowledge to then be able to be discerning and make choices. Yeah,
SPEAKER_02I think so too. And also I love, you know, observing what other people are doing and, you know, Instead of feeling bad because, you know, there's a couple of people that I really admire, they're parenting, and I think, frick, they nail it so often. Like the way they talk to their child, whenever I'm in their presence, they just really do it well. And instead of going, oh, I'm a terrible parent because I don't do that, I go, I'm going to do that. I'm going to pick, I'm going to try and implement that thing that I continually see them doing. I'm going to do that. And that will then help me to feel like I'm, you know, achieving my goal in wanting to have a connected, respectful relationship with my children. rather than framing it as, oh, I should have been doing this this whole time because I didn't, it's hard when you don't see actually someone doing it in front of you.
SPEAKER_01I know, we just use that as a mentor, right? Go, wow, this works. This is something that I can try and achieve and just, and make those little goals. They can be small, can't they? They don't have to change our whole parenting style overnight. It's just, yeah, bringing in little tools that can help finding what works for you.
SPEAKER_02Can I ask you how you practice yoga and meditation with young children? So
SPEAKER_01I do go to yoga classes that the kids don't attend. So if I can, if I look, if I can fit it in, I'll try and get to like a couple of classes a week. It might be sometimes only one. Um, I I've always practiced with the girls. So ever since they were babies, they just, they climb all over me though. There's not great, but they kind of, they opt in and out. So they'll, they'll, um, they'll join in a little bit. They'll use me as a bit of a climbing frame sometimes. They just, yoga has always been a part of their life.
UNKNOWNUh,
SPEAKER_01They're coming to do a group class with me. I'm teaching later on. They'll come and they'll be in that class. That's a children's class. So they'll sit and do the class and be... But at home, it's a little bit different as it is for most of us, right? Our children tend to be a little bit different with us than they are with others. But look, for me, it's just about, it's one of my main values is, you know, particularly the meditation aspect. So the kids just know that that's part of what I do. And then I kind of, they can choose to do that or not. It's not something that I force, because I think you can always go one extreme to the other. If you does the yoga mindfulness, it can make the child adverse to that because it's like, well, that's what mum does. Well, that's what that does. So I try to just make it really open, just like anything. Like, oh, do you want to do yoga? Do you want to do this? And so then it's. That's brilliant.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And I think it's important for people to hear that even, you know, like that was my experience, except for I just couldn't hear it. Like I used to go, I'm going to do some yoga to try and zen out. And then they're climbing all over me. And then I'd like get even more angry. Yes. And so actually surrendering and going into it, going, you know what? children are going to climb all over me and I'm just going to try and get what I can. Or like you say, if that isn't going to work for me, find another way yeah as a class and and and then if neither of those things work then that's okay too ages and stages and and maybe you can find a different practice or a different time
SPEAKER_01and look I think as well like I when I you know when I first uh I guess teaching a lot um I had a lot more space a lot more freedom and I would do like 90 minute practices a day and it was you know I can meditate for as long as I like and and just knowing that you know it does change as a parent I'm Most of us wouldn't change it for the world. We have, you know, it's such. Yeah. But in that the life changes, the practice changes. So maybe it's maybe it's a 10 minute. I'm going to get a little bit kids or I'm going to do it rather than like throw Netflix on or something. I'm going to throw up my mat and just do maybe seven poses. And it's often if you start with that is you often end up doing more anyway. Right. Because it's the same. Yeah. I think that feels good.
SPEAKER_02Can I ask you about your training in India? How do you think that doing the training? in the country of origin has influenced the way you see yoga.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, great question. I feel very, very grateful that I got that opportunity. I'd love to go back there one day with the kids to India, but, I mean, I'm just glad I had that opportunity at the time to really lean into yoga because it is very different in the West. You know, I think for me, it's my teaching always comes back to that traditional Hatha style. However, then I, after coming back from India and then teaching in Australia, I went on to do a lot more training here because I realized there's a lot that, that works for the West that I needed to learn to really succeed as a teacher here. And in terms of the kids stuff, children's yoga is very different again. Um, As you know, with wildlings, kids only learn if they're engaged. So it's very different. But I do always try to come back to the philosophy I think has embedded something really strong for me. So like the philosophy of yoga, the yamas and niyamas, the way that we, what we're teaching, like why we're teaching yoga. Obviously very passionate about the nervous system side of it as well, so the regulation side. And really it's about being a good human, right? Like it doesn't matter if you're doing yoga fancy poses. Like it's not about the asana. Like it's really, for me, it's about the philosophy and the regulation for ourselves so we can find that peace. And if we can show kids that they can access that peace at any time, life's busy. I feel like it's getting... busier and busier. Of course, we all have choice in that, right? We all do have freedom of choice with how kind of far we go down that path. But to be able to give children that empowerment to stop and pause and go,
SPEAKER_02there's
SPEAKER_01a river of peace inside me and I can access that at any time I need to.
SPEAKER_02That's so good. So Karma Kids, tell me how it works. Is it you're doing workshops and going to schools? Paint me a picture of how people can access that. Sure.
SPEAKER_01So, look, I mean, when we started out, it was definitely designed to be going into schools. We found that a really hard pathway with lots of lots. I'm sure you have experience in that and the red tape and everything. So how it's evolved to be is I've been teaching adult. So I've been training adult teachers for the last five years here on the coast. So it was a natural progression to move into kids training. It's training. So we train parents, educators and yoga teachers and allied health professionals to embed the tools. They can go and then teach classes, workshops, or they can just embed it into their programs. And then we also offer classes, workshops. So we're very community-based. So we do like family yoga and kids' classes. But an amazing thing that grew for us out of last year is, well, really it was kind of, I guess, came to life, really birthed this year, is Karma Kids Online. Yeah. Yeah, so this is our online program. Obviously with COVID and how the last couple of years has has um unraveled um it's it has been really important to i guess pivot with what you're doing and and be more have more of an online presence so um we actually received a grant for um to give us some funding to create karma kids online and this is a a program that brings well-being tools like short simple well-being tools into everyday life for families um So it's, you know, yeah, you get access every week there's new content. So you've got like a Mindful Monday, Teaching Tuesday where they'll do yoga, a Wind Down Wednesday with meditations, Thursdays like journaling prompts, and then Friday we have something fun for the family. So there's all these different tools and it's really designed so they can do as much or as little as they want. Cool. It's based on all the habit research. So the habit research basically says that the small change is the big change. And the mistake that many of us make is we'll say like, oh, I'm going to do going to go to yoga like five times a week and like I've got no ability to do that like I'm a busy parent I can't do that you know I'm going to meditate every day for 30 minutes like we are not because at the end of the day you're exhausted you know so it's it's basically going like you've got a tool and you know five days a week a new tool and then you can you can just use one a week if you like you can use yeah you can do one hour a week you can do five minutes a week whatever you want to do but it's just about repetition and starting and making it easy because we're like you know we think
UNKNOWNYeah.
SPEAKER_01It wasn't like this when we were growing up. There is so much more. There's so much information out there, but the information can also then become noise, right? Yes. People can go, well, I love all this. That sounds right. I love this nervous system regulation stuff, but how do I implement it at home because I've got so much to do and
SPEAKER_02I
SPEAKER_01don't want another thing to do? Yeah. So that's kind of where that's all come from and really exciting. The feedback we're getting is that sort of feedback from parents that, you know, we see them doing their meditations at home with their eye pillows on or doing a fun thing together. We get photos and stuff like that, which is just lovely to see. I'm
SPEAKER_02so excited for you guys. It sounds amazing. I'm like, I'm going to go find that and sign up for my own family because I do think that that sounds achievable. It's like just to have something. And I really like that there's variety in that because I've been through those periods of time where I'm like, right, I'm going to get up early. I'm going to meditate for 20 minutes and then I'm going to journal and I'm going to do some yoga or some sort of movement. I'm not even going to do one of those in one day. I know. But if you spread it out over the week, I feel like that's achievable. Absolutely achievable.
SPEAKER_01And you can make it, you can, you can bulk it out. There's always more. There's always like, you know, there's videos, there's resources. So you can like, you can go all in and there's also a weekly. Yeah. So you can be Michelle's the education hat. Right. So she's, she's like, you're going to have it and you can star off what you've done. You can take it off. You organize one. Love
SPEAKER_02me a good tick box.
SPEAKER_01Exactly. Have it on the fridge, tick off what you want. Or you can literally just go, Oh, let's just pull out the computer. Let's see what's on here. Oh, look like, Bumblebee breath. That sounds fun. Let's do that. And let's do this magic star thing. Let's do this today on a Sunday because we've got a bit of time at home. And it's just that whole, you know, when you start something that feels good, once you start, you want to continue it because you notice the benefit.
SPEAKER_02Amazing. I'm going to link all of those things in our show notes for any of our listeners who are interested in finding out more and maybe joining that course, because that sounds like a tool that I think every family should dip into. Absolutely. So thank you so much for chatting. So I'm going to round us out with some rapid fire questions. So to start with, do you want to talk to me about a book that you're either reading at the moment or just like an all-time favourite that our listeners might really want to know about?
SPEAKER_01Okay. Oh, gosh. So many good books. I'm, yeah, I try not to be attached to the material world, but books is something I do have a bit of a problem with. I love books. Anything by Daniel Siegel, anything by him, so Whole Rain Child, all that sort of stuff, Stephen Porges, Bruce Perry, all of the trauma-informed stuff for kids. I just think any kind of, for parents, anything you can read that resonates for you, just, yeah. soak it up. In terms of maybe just like a really nice lighter read, The Alchemist is one of my favourite.
SPEAKER_02Someone else has recommended that
SPEAKER_01to me. Have they? It's not about parenting, but it's just really about the treasures within. And we go on a journey and it's a beautiful, you know, sometimes we just need to be reminded of the simple things too.
SPEAKER_02Brilliant. I love those recommendations and I would second the Daniel Siegel stuff. Definitely been a game changer for me in just having that understanding. 100%. Yeah, knowledge is power. It helps you to make better decisions. It does. All right, where would you go after or what would you do after a rough day or a rough week to reset?
SPEAKER_01Oh, so lucky living on the Sunshine Coast, aren't we? Where wouldn't you go? But for us, we live close to the forest at Kondalilla, so often up there, oh, beautiful, like, you know, as the sun's going down, a nice late afternoon walk, or the ocean's always great for just clearing and resetting as well.
SPEAKER_02See, sometimes I think, you know, well, we're just so lucky we've got the best of both worlds because sometimes it is, sometimes I'm like, I just crave the mountains and I crave the fresh water and then other times I need the sea air. So good. So good. If you could choose one thing that you would change about the education system, what do you think that would be? Oh,
SPEAKER_01gosh.
UNKNOWNYeah.
SPEAKER_01Look, I think changing the environment rather than trying to change the child. So the whole analogy of the flower that if it's not growing, it's not the flower's fault, it's let's change the conditions for the flower. I think seeing the children as individuals, which is hard, it's hard in big classes and I really get that from the education point of view, but just trying to find ways to connect with each child so they can thrive because we all just learn so differently. I
SPEAKER_02think so. And I think that... we're smart and capable humans. We can find a way of catering to everyone. So yeah, I think that so many people are, I think there's, there is change brewing. It's just a lot. It's changed a lot of stuff.
SPEAKER_01Change can be slow. And I think we just all got to keep doing our bit. I think change is slow. It can be overwhelming when we try and change the world. But if we just keep doing our bit, I think those ripples will, Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02Helen, it has just been an absolute delight speaking with you today. I have just have a renewed sense of the importance of all of the things that we talked about today. And I don't know, I know that so many of our listeners will have gained so much. But me personally, I just want to thank you for reminding me of how important these things are and how simple. And that's going to make an impact on my own little family and the children that we surround ourselves with. So thank you so much for that.
SPEAKER_01Oh, that makes me so happy. Thank you so much for having us on. It's been an absolute pleasure.
SPEAKER_02You're most welcome. We will link all of the amazing things for Karma Kids in our show notes and we'll tag in Instagram so you can follow them along and share in all of the golden nuggets that we get watching your feed. So thank you. Thanks guys. Helen has been such an inspiration for me in particular today to continue working on the spectrum of tools that I'm not only just going to be able to use for myself but I'm able to help arm my children. They're going to be able to expand on this toolbox that I'm only now just dipping into as an adult and I'm really personally grateful to have the reminder and motivation today. Now as I wrap up another episode I just wanted to finish up by saying if you're curious about starting a nature play business or a forest school then you'll definitely want to check out our Signet your wild business now your wild business is a business kickstarter program like no other it's specifically designed for teachers forest school leaders outdoor recce's and early years learning educators who are ready to leap into the big wide world of business if you want to take the guesswork out of starting from scratch and more importantly if you want to avoid the three most common mistakes others have made when they started their nature play business then head to www.wildlingsforestschool.com for And check out our exclusive training to get you started on the right path towards your wild business journey. Now, as always, we absolutely love doing this journey with you. So until next week, stay wild.