Shooting the Breeze with John Livia and Lee Priest

Special guests Paul Barnett and Armon Adibi, How are bodybuilders getting so big so easily?

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#johnlivia #leepriest #seriousandsillinessbodybuilding #paulbarnett #armonadibi

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:30

Yo, what's up, big call? I'm just in time. Yeah, thank you very much, man. I appreciate it. So uh Lee is in Germany. Oh, for FIBO. So he is six hours ahead of us. So it's three thirty in the morning over there. So uh that's not conducive to doing this. I said, okay, don't worry about it. Um I've heard FIBO's great. I've heard it. Did you see the lineup before we get to the topic? Did you see the lineup? It's pathetic, man. No, it really is. It's the I'll I'll I'll send it to you because it Rx Muscle just put out the lineup and it is. I'll actually just bring it up because people need to see this shit. I mean, I couldn't believe I'm like, what let's see. Where is it? Trying to find it. Yeah, I think I'm pretty sure RX muscle just put it up. And there is like basically nothing.

SPEAKER_01 1:32

How many and Dave goes to like every show?

SPEAKER_02 1:36

Well, Dave is going through a divorce. Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah, he's going through a divorce, so now where is it? I know. Let me try, let me try to look for it.

SPEAKER_01 1:47

Whoa, who oh every show I every show I go to, I see him. Yeah, he's I've never actually I've never actually talked to him. I need to talk about it. Really?

SPEAKER_02 1:59

I actually invited him to come on, um, but he had his kids tonight. So let me see. Who is your favorite? I can't see where the I can't I I don't know where the fuck I I found. I thought it was RX Muslim. But it's pathetic. The only name is fucking Sas Harate.

SPEAKER_01 2:19

I had heard something about Andrew Jack, but I guess he's not doing it. No, it doesn't look that way.

SPEAKER_02 2:26

Let's see. Because I put uh I made I put a message. I actually said, what kind of shit lineup is this? Because there's no nobody in this lineup.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

I don't see anything on Dave's site.

SPEAKER_02 2:46

Uh let's see if I could find another one. Let's see. Uh Ferdinando. He's another guy that's Fernando Royal. Yeah, whatever. I don't know. I can't see it. But uh who's your favorite? I don't see it. It doesn't say on their website. Yeah, it doesn't say, but it doesn't matter. It it's it's pathetic. It's it's absolutely pathetic. I should have fucking saved it, and I was like, so I don't understand what's going on.

SPEAKER_01 3:21

Like well, they don't pay anybody. That's part of it. Yeah, I mean I mean it's so expensive right now, like like with inflation and everything, man, like doing prep and travel. Like, look, if like think about it, man. Like, if I if I'm going over there to do that show, I'm probably dropping 20 grand. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and then you don't make shit when you go over there. So I mean it's like, why do it?

SPEAKER_02 3:47

I know, but but it it sucks for the fans, you know.

SPEAKER_01 3:52

Well, you know what the what the deal is, and you know I mean leak and trunk and all this, but these promoters, if they want guys to do their shows, they need to pay for them to get there.

SPEAKER_02 4:01

Yeah, I think that there should be some kind of obligation if you're an IFB pro, you know, to do a certain amount of shows every year. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 4:12

Well, there was a there was a talk about requiring guys to do one show, but at the same time, I mean, like, you know, if I'm paying for it out of my pocket, man, like a lot of these guys don't have a ton of money to burn, man. I mean, even doing I mean, even doing like Masters Nationals, man, by the time when I did that, I paid for a coach and my food and you know my gear, travel, everything to get up there. I probably dropped 10 grand to do that show.

SPEAKER_02 4:40

Yeah, I have one good friend who's an IFBB pro and he did one show. Uh, he did he did a Legion and he told me he spent twelve thousand dollars and he he he broke the top ten, but now I think he came in ninth, and that was it. And it's like, yeah, I get it, man. It's fucking expensive.

SPEAKER_01 4:57

But at the same time, something's gotta give because well, they need uh the pro they man, there's some stuff that needs to change. I like I I don't know if you saw what was it, the San Diego Pro last week with the lighting in the backdrop were absolutely terrible. Everybody looked orange.

SPEAKER_02 5:16

Yeah, it was pretty bad.

SPEAKER_01 5:17

It was bad. Like they the the I like you know, and I'm not trying to be critical. I I love bodybuilding and I want it to be better, I want the sport to be better. I want it to and it seems to be growing right now, but they they I mean the NFL came to the realization at some point, but the IFP, and I'm not comparing the IFB to the NFL, but they need to have like some standards when it comes to lighting and show promotion.

SPEAKER_02 5:42

Oh, 100%. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 5:43

They need they need to, I'd say at the bare minimum, if you want good competitors to show up for your show, cover their fucking travel costs.

SPEAKER_02 5:51

At the very least.

SPEAKER_01 5:53

Yeah. At the very least. Put them up in a hotel, pay for their airplane flight flight to get to wherever they're going.

SPEAKER_02 6:08

I know you get they get the card, right? You get the the yearly payment for the card, right? Here's Aman. Amon, what's up, man? What's up, man?

SPEAKER_01 6:20

Can you hear? Oh, you can't hear us. Yeah, get the speakers going. What's up, dude?

SPEAKER_00 6:29

How y'all doing?

SPEAKER_01 6:30

Good. You guys know each other, right? Paul, you know, uh I've never met Arman.

SPEAKER_00 6:33

I feel like I know him because I listen to your just from just from uh Instagram, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:38

Yeah, I listen to your stuff all the time. So it's yeah, first, thank you guys for uh I appreciate you guys coming on.

SPEAKER_02 6:47

Uh Lee is in um uh Germany, so he's six hours ahead, so it's 3 30 in the morning. Uh I just want to plug this before we get to uh the topic that me and Paul were talking about. I want to plug this um in the link in my description. There's the link for Jason Owens's uh supplement company, iPrave Sups. He's back home, he's out of the hospital, but um, he's not out of the woods.

SPEAKER_00 7:10

Uh what happened with Jason?

SPEAKER_02 7:12

Well, I um he's I got septic.

SPEAKER_00 7:15

I almost died like uh six months ago.

unknown 7:19

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 7:20

Now what's wrong with Jason? Yeah, I was septic. Remember, they had a couple of things. Oh, yes, that's right.

SPEAKER_02 7:24

You lost all you lost a weight, a whole bunch of weight. Yes, that's right.

SPEAKER_00 7:27

I didn't know that, man. That's 40, 40, 50 pounds. I lost like 50 pounds.

SPEAKER_02 7:31

That's right, that's right. All right, we're gonna have a Jason. Well, Jason had some had two back surgeries, and um uh his first surgery was uh a shit show. His doctor really, really put a hurting on him. Apparently, the doctor put the wrong size uh uh bone into his vertebrae, it was too big and it just made everything worse. Uh then he had to have it redone again, but then he's having some issues besides that, uh, which he doesn't really want me to say publicly because it's serious, but he is home and he is getting treatment. So please, if you guys are listening to this, you know me and Jay are good friends. Me and Jay have been friends for a very long time. He has a really good supplement company. Just go and and show your support, you know, go buy something. The discount code is in there, SNS10. It's you get 10% off. He has really good uh products. Um I'll just tell you this it's it's serious. Okay, I'll just say that. Um, he promised, he made me promise not to say anything until he's ready, but it is uh serious. He also has three broken ribs, he also has like hairline fractures broken in his in um his vertebrae. So he's you know, it's gonna be a long, a long uh struggle.

SPEAKER_00 8:55

But he did he get an accident or was this like uh back surgery he needed to have?

SPEAKER_02 9:00

He had back surgery, had a second back surgery, and then something there was a then there's more to the story, but he really doesn't want me to say because it is very serious. So um, I'll just say please show support and go, go just go buy anything, you know. Like I said, you get 10%. He's got great products, it's not like you're buying shit. I mean, the guy has fantastic products. Um, and he'll I think he might be back on Anabolic Academy, not this week. Uh, the following week I'll be on vacation, so he might be back in two weeks, but we'll we'll see. Um, he was supposed to start uh judging NPC shows. That's on a whole on hold because he can't show up right now. But anyway, um, yeah, I'm on. I forgot, I totally forgot. You were you were how did that happen when you became septic and lost all that weight in the hospital six months ago?

SPEAKER_00 9:49

Man, I don't know, man. Uh so like it happened to Victor Martinez, right? And it happened to Rod Ronnie, Ronnie too. Um, and then some people were like, Oh, it's probably from the stem cells you did, because we all did stem cells, right? But uh, but um, I don't know, man. I think it it is, and then I I'm in the garage and stuff. I get cut up sometimes when I'm doing stuff in the garage. But I had a bunch of peptides at home, you know, because companies just send you free peptides, like, hey, try these peptides out. No, you do, not me.

SPEAKER_02 10:20

I get dick and bowls, that's what I get.

SPEAKER_00 10:24

Yeah. So I think I maybe from some peptides I took because the an infectious disease doctor was just like it could dude, it could be something as simple as just like your normal injection, even if you don't use alcohol. Like, you know, how many bodybuilders use alcohol every single time they do an injection? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:43

It's usually shower, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:46

Right, I said that too, uh, bro. And and people were like, That's crazy. How do you not use alcohol? I'm like, dude, I I started uh I think cycling when I was like 20. I was like, I never I think I used maybe the first few times, then when you do the shops all the time, you get out of the shower, you're clean. It's not like you're coming home dirty and like dirt all the time.

SPEAKER_02 11:03

Exactly what I do right after the shower. You're right, you're 100% right.

SPEAKER_00 11:06

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:07

So um but you feel better, you're back to normal, you put the you put some weight back on.

SPEAKER_00 11:12

Yeah, I dro I I I dropped from 275 to 228. Holy shit, and then uh yeah, and then um I had a pick line in for three and a half months.

SPEAKER_01 11:25

Um was it a abscess from a shot?

SPEAKER_00 11:29

No, no, no, they don't know what it was. So it started as uh infection in my lungs, and then it um uh a blood infection, and then it turned septic, and so my elbow started swelling, my knee started swelling, and then my and I'm like and my spine started hurting, and I'm like, okay, when my knee starts swelling, I'm like, maybe I bumped it, maybe my wife's like, no, something's going on. So I go to the ER. They run their tests, they're like, Oh, you gotta go to the ICU. I'm like, oh, okay. And so they had a cut up with my knee, so do snee surgery because it like uh when you go septic, it just attacks joints and organs, it just goes wherever. And so um it was like a bag of milk that had to come out of my knee. So they sliced it and they go in there and they clean out all your ligaments and tendons. And basically he said, like, hey, you know, your knee's gonna be like uh accelerated like 10 years of uh abuse in the gym. So you're probably gonna need a knee replacement 10 years earlier than you probably would if you need one eventually. So just kind of I know, and then luckily the spine, um uh you know, you don't want to get your spine cut open. Obviously, that's awful, right? The because that's what they had to do to to Victor Martinez, but um, so I had to do the pick line where they you know put the antibiotics in every single night. I did that for like three and a half months, and then I was on oral antibiotics for like three months, and then um yeah, so I finally just got back in the gym like several weeks ago, but I've just been going like once or twice a week, just doing like little baby stuff.

SPEAKER_02 13:05

Yeah, yeah. Did you were you able to put any weight back on?

SPEAKER_00 13:08

Yeah, yeah. My weight's like at 255 right now, but I'm just eating a couple meals a day. I'm not eating like I eat like three meals a day, probably. All right, good, cool. You're lucky you didn't die, man. I know people people's yeah, substance is uh it's serious business, man.

SPEAKER_02 13:23

Sounds like you caught it early, so that's good.

SPEAKER_01 13:26

Um I had this weird ass shit last year where I banged my finger in the gym and I end up getting this flesh-eating bacteria in my finger, man. I yeah, man, I almost lost my finger. But there's like shit all over the gym, man. You never know, man.

SPEAKER_02 13:42

You know what's funny, Paul, is I work in the sewer, I'm a sewer worker, I'm underground in shit all the time. I'm probably so fucking immune to that stuff because I things like that. Like, I I'll get like kidney stones. Last year I had uh pancreatitis, um, but I never get anything like that, like bacteria. I'm probably so fucking immune to it because I've been doing I've been at my job for 15 years, so you know, probably dude.

SPEAKER_00 14:06

The gym's so gross, like Paul said. Like, I've I've picked up stuff at the gym too. My friends have got like I remember uh one of the gyms, you know, when they have like a tear in something, and like that that foam, all the sweat, and just nasty stuff just gets into it, and you're like putting your neck on that, and so yeah, the gym's a nasty place.

SPEAKER_02 14:23

Yeah, you know how many people start cleaning up right before I go on there, and I go, dude, do you know what I do for a living? Don't don't worry about it. It's fine, really. But oh man, I want I want your opinion because we were talking before you got on. Did you see the list, the competitor list for the FIBO open? I mean, it is no, no, I didn't look at it.

SPEAKER_00 14:42

I I didn't check it out yet, bro.

SPEAKER_02 14:44

It the only name on there that I recognize is Sas Harati. That's it, and it's only like like seven or eight guys. I mean, it is pathetic. So we were talking about what what can they do? I know we were saying how expensive it is to compete, but what can we do to get these guys to compete? Because it's ridiculous, dude. You have all these shows, nobody's jumping in, like you had the Arnold USA, and then you had Detroit, nobody does Detroit, and then everybody jumps in Arnold UK. Um and then and then nobody's doing FIBO. It's and then there was there was that one show where they did they only had classic and and physique, and only there was only one guy that won that was in the physique. This was uh several weeks ago. I mean, it's pretty it's pretty big. We were talking about maybe you know, figuring out if the if the IFB could pay for their travel expenses or something, because nobody's talking about they're not gonna do that. But uh I know that even if they like even if they like if you're an IFB pro and like maybe they should have something like this. If you have an I if you're an IFB pro and um and you decide that you're gonna compete and you register to compete for this year or whatever the case may be, maybe they should set up like some kind of fund where they take some money out of your account every week, you know, almost like a 401k kind of deal, and put it into a separate account for travel and expenses to help you compete. It's coming out of your pocket, but at least they're they're trying to like um budget it for you, right? So it doesn't cost them anything, but it helps you budget it. Maybe something like that. I don't I don't know because it's just too expensive, man.

SPEAKER_00 16:29

And it's like you know, the sponsors aren't sending people over there, right? So if you if you don't have a uh a decent sponsor that's like, yeah, we want to send you over there because this makes sense for us, be uh, because all these sponsors over the years they get smart and they're like, Man, is this really benefiting us? Sending this guy paying you know five grand for him to travel and do all this, come out to whatever is he. What's it benefiting our you know, supplement company or cloth clothing company or wherever it may be? Yeah, and they get they get smart and they stop doing it, and and it sucks because they these guys work really hard, and and to get over there, it you're spending your own money. And let's say you get a check for whatever it may be, you're still in the negative, usually, you know.

SPEAKER_01 17:11

Yeah, that's what I was saying too. I mean, like, think about it. Like, if you wanted to go do this this show in Germany, I mean, what is it? What is a fucking plane ticket to Germany cost right now?

SPEAKER_02 17:21

A thousand dollars.

SPEAKER_01 17:22

Oh, more than that, man. More than that, man. My big ass is not flying coach to Germany. I mean, I mean 280 pounds flying coach, man. I ain't happening.

SPEAKER_02 17:32

You're a hundred percent right. I didn't even think of that. Yeah, you're right.

SPEAKER_00 17:34

Like like when I went to last out of the country, I went to Turkey, they paid for it, but it was uh like round trip was like 3,500 for our business.

SPEAKER_02 17:43

But you're right, only the top elite guys are getting you know sponsored, big sponsors, you know. And the um the other guys aren't getting it, you know. You if Nick wanted to do it, or if Andrew Jacked or if Brandon wanted to do it, yeah, pick up the chat. But everybody underneath that, the second tier guys, they're not getting any, they're getting nothing, you know. Um, so I I don't know what the answer is, to be honest with you, but something has to be done because no, yeah, nobody's going to these shows. Like, if I'm if I'm in Germany or if I'm in Europe and I'm looking forward to going to a bodybuilding competition and I see that nobody's competing, I'm like, well, it I'm why why would I go? Why am I going?

SPEAKER_01 18:21

Why am I buying these promoters? If they're they're putting on an expo and they want people to show for their expo, they need to pay for guys to be there. Yeah, it's just simple as that, man. Yeah, it's very it's you know, and you gotta put yourself in their shoes if other people put on any other kind of convention or something and don't pay for people's travel. I mean, you don't put on like like if you put on a comic book convention, you wouldn't expect the guys that that write the comic books to pay for their own travel to come.

SPEAKER_02 18:52

Yeah, right, right, yeah, come to your thing, man.

SPEAKER_01 18:55

So FIBO's a big expo, too, right? Is it? I've never been there.

SPEAKER_00 18:59

I'm assuming I've never been, but I've never been, but people love it. They what they go there, it says you know, it's awesome to go to, but it's sad, man. I I feel I feel for these guys because you know it's hard and they deserve you know to travel and do some cool stuff like that, and yeah, you know, the sponsors aren't doing it, so it sucks, man. So they you they gotta resort to doing other things like selling you know gear and you know, doing stuff they can get in trouble with, and it's just sucks because I know a lot of guys here like it, you know, destination Dallas is like 15 minutes from my house. I don't go there much anymore, but you got a lot of the gasp guys there, and um there people are moving to Dallas just to just to be there, and I'm like, and I try to tell them like, hey man, you might want to rethink your move. Like, it's not like this like magical thing, you come train a destination, everybody's buddy, buddy. It's not like that, and um you know, they think you're they're gonna make all this money, like, well, I got promised this much, and they said they're gonna increase it. Like, well, you know, and they a lot of them end up just moving back to where they came from, moving back to where they came from because they don't have friends, family here, and it gets a little lonely. And um, it's it's it is what it is, man. You know, uh we all love to see that.

SPEAKER_02 20:11

If you are a bodybuilder or trying to be an aspiring bodybuilder, and um you are not in the top five, top ten in the world, um, you have to work, you have to get a fucking job. And and and that's exactly I went to a seminar in New Jersey. Um, oh yeah, by the way, Paul, it must be big because Lee is is there and he was sponsored. I think I I think uh Young LA is sponsoring it to be there, so it must be a pretty big uh expo. Anyway, I went to a seminar in uh New Jersey. Phil Heath was there, Jason Arnes, Arkeem Williams, Lee Priest, uh Sean Ray. I mean, you go down the list, they were all there. It was in Apollo Apolland Gym in September. So I went because it was like you know, half hour from me. So I go, and one young kid who wanted to be a bodybuilder asked, you know, how to make money in bodybuilding. And you know, nobody was honest with him. Like Phil was telling him, you know, how to make money, but but but Phil could do anything and make money. Phil could put his name on anything, he can go any. They probably they probably paid him 10 grand just to be there. You know, he's an exception, he's an extreme exception to the rule, guys like Ronnie, Jay, Phil, the the you know, Mr. Olympias. The you can't you can't say to yourself, Oh, I'm gonna make that kind of money in bodybuilding. I mean, my answer would be get yourself a skill and learn how to make money before you decide that you want to be a bodybuilder. Because how many, how many guys really make it as a bodybuilder? I mean, what are the percentages less than one percent has to be of men and women that really make a living as bodybuilders?

SPEAKER_01 21:54

It's lower than that, it's probably one in a thousand or more one in several thousand.

SPEAKER_02 21:58

It's definitely less than one. percent of people that have competed that can make a living in bodybuilding at just as bodybuilders, right? And and these these young kids um they're being deceived by social media by bodybuilders saying I and it it's great to have a passion but you need to be realistic and some of these some some of these kids need to have somebody tell them look you know you need a skill in order to make a living you know um and and there are a ton of trades that are literally in a deficit of finding skilled laborers. I mean and they're paying and they pay a lot of money and nobody is going into these fucking trades.

SPEAKER_00 22:43

And the truth of the matter is you're working from seven to three or um six thirty two thirty depend depending on the trade and they're paying that you get paid over a hundred grand a year plus and we're talking I think the stat is every five tradesmen that retire only two take their place I mean there is a huge market for electricians plumbers um uh heavy machine operators my cousin is a crane operator on the docks in Newark he makes over$200,000 a year you know and none of these young kids they all they just they're being deceived by social media well John they think they're too good i i talked to a lot of them they think they're too good they think uh you know it's beneath them and i'm like that's honest work i'm i'm like you're gonna waste your life like waiting around for some and I get you know what Phil Heath is if he's trying to tell these guys he don't want to crush their dreams and all that but to be realistic you know even if you are great you get an injury you're done the money's gone it you know you quit people forget about you within you know six months you know no matter what level you're at you know think of Phil Heath all that he's done anyways and how many how many people talk about Phil Heath even as great as he was that often and he gives his flowers enough flowers as he's as he should so um a lot of these kids they don't want to work though that's the problem they want to play video games bodybuild hang out chill and they look at the social media and all the fake stuff on there and that's the problem so I think well then they're gonna be then then they're destined to you know they're destined the majority of them are gonna be destined to you know be failures and that's the gods honest truth you know I was gonna say how many bodybuilders you know they can want to go work on a construction site all day long you gotta motherfuckers are getting stoned at play video games you gotta do what you gotta do though you know what I mean like my friend my friend uh Luke who is a pro bodybuilder um he works for the TA working on the um railroads in um in uh in Jersey city and new york city and so on and so forth me i mean I look I know I'm I'm no pro bodybuilder but I'm a sewer worker I I make well over a hundred thousand a yeah and plus I do the podcast which I'm you know I'm in the black finally so I'm making some money there you gotta you gotta work you got to hustle it's not gonna just come to you like it's great to have a passion and a dream but you have to be realistic about that passion and dream and you know and you know what once you get married and you have kids your passion and dream turns into taking care of your fucking wife and your kids and you got to do what you got to do to do that and that's more fulfilling than anything else but anyway I went off on a tangent sorry sorry yeah I mean when I have my what I have my kiddos my my I was like I don't care about my my uh view of bodybuilding like shifted dramatically I was like I don't like this is crazy I'm spending my money on my kids taking my family that's it but look you gotta look I I've been in love with bodybuilding since I'm 15 years old I've I've I've competed a bunch of times you gotta be realistic there's a reason why I have a microphone and a podcast because I'm not a good bodybuilder that's why then you become a critic when you're a shit fucking athlete that's what happens you know so you know so I I could talk about it and I could critique it because I wasn't a very good bodybuilder that's the what it comes down to but um all right it just seems like the the the main topic I wanted to get to is it's unbelievable how many bodybuilders on our offseason are breaking 300 pounds.

SPEAKER_02 26:29

They're all over 300 pounds it's unreal do you do you remember when we were all younger getting to 300 pounds was like insane there was maybe a handful of guys Dorian Dave Palumbo there were only a handful of guys that now these I mean Regan Grimes is I think 310 or 315 Samson forget it. Samson's 350 Jordan uh 360 is he yeah I think it is Jordan um little guy uh yeah really Jordan is I forgot his name he's 320 Jordan Hutchinson no no not not um uh what's his name hold on no uh he's it far he's foreign I think he's Spanish oh the the yeah the Perel oh Joe Perel Perales I think is his name and then yes yes and then even the Russian guy um I mean these guys are just fucking uh insane uh let's see uh where is he uh as I know I uh pulled it up let me just look up what's saying what's well a lot of them don't even they don't even need to get to that it's just it's just a number like man I'm 300 pounds like do they need to get that big not really I mean it's it's insane though it really is they are these guys are just I mean do they need to get that big these guys the open bodybuilders that are that are that are doing well are fucking monsters man these guys are big yeah that's right that's what that's what his name is yes I'm sorry Joe Palacios oh yeah he's another guy he oh yeah he's over 300 pounds but there is a another guy I think he's Spanish Peraldo Joan that's it that's it yeah he he's another guy then there is a Russian guy and these guys like you know obviously andrew jack that goes without saying but it just seems like they're crack cracking 300 like like it's normal now like it's like if it's unreal and it's not even cracking 300 it's well over 300 it's like 320 310 three thirds holy shit I mean what's the what's the reason we got into doing this man we wanted to be the biggest motherfucker in the gym that's right you know I mean that's everybody wants to see the freaks man yeah that's it I mean um uh but what is it what is it so different about now to the early 2000s that these guys are just breaking barriers cheap access to growth hormone you think that's what you think that's what it is really insulin IGF one everybody's cracked the formula I mean I mean you you remember um man back in the early 2000s uh growth hormone was not cheap i mean even the shit generic stuff and half the time it was fake anyway yeah uh joan predellus is 322 pounds now he's just a kid in his 20s he's a young kid there's I understand if you're like over six or six one or something like that like right but you know under that and then also the guys they don't you know used to they would go off like Ronnie Branch Johnny all those guys remember them personally growing up they would they would go off their gear about three months um they don't go off anymore so uh that's a reason too i mean they're constantly pushing gasoline pedal which i don't think is a good idea but hey you know it is what it is they want to get to that but they're also but oman they were also over 300 pounds and relatively lean yeah the growth hormone yeah they're relatively lean like um what was that one the russian dude was said he was uh what was it he said he was taking 100 units of growth hormone something fucking he tried it he tried it for a week but then he moved it back down to 30 30 out of me amateur numbers what is that russian dude's name if if any anybody in the chat knows who I'm talking about always forget it uh there's Smae and then what's the other dude Save's just a I forget oh yeah here it is uh Russian guy's doing yeah 2030 the Russian guy uh doing on uh if anybody knows his name because I'll look him up because he's another free I think he's 340 or something like that.

SPEAKER_00 30:48

I saw a video I saw a video of him yeah sergei donilov that's right I'm sorry I saw I think it was him I saw somebody post or he posted a video of him eating like like a pound of turkey breast and like a whole box of of of noodles post work he had like some some rigatoni post workout and he was just hammering it man I mean it's just using a salad spoon to eat it with yeah I'm sure with all that insulin yeah he's just uh here he is look at this uh let me see uh I'll just share it uh share what is the is big is bigger always better I mean I think a lot of guys they run their shape a lot if they took a little more time I think they would look a little bit better taking their time yeah you might be right but I'm a fan of the freaks man and I always were was a fan of the freaks look at that dude it's rich that's making Larry is he's still lean you know what is Larry like 270 yeah yeah yeah yeah it makes Larry look like a child that's fucking insane dude yeah you know this is but it he's a freak but like compare him to other freaks like you know we like us growing up like let's say NASA or Ronnie it's not the same it's not the same look you know it's he's big it's freaky no it's like like but look compare it to like a Marcus rule or something Marcus rule looks significantly better than that I I think in my opinion yeah it's not uh high well that's the problem you know man around when you blow up on insulin and GH it's just that puffy look you don't get that hard dense look right and how old is he probably like 27 or something like that right he's in his 20s let me see if I can find this guy here we go I don't know it's so impressive though it really is very impressive yeah yeah I saw his his joint I mean this kid is just a fucking he he's got a nice shape yeah this kid's gotta be good I mean he's 340 no no no he's 322 I mean that's he's just freaky Samson forget it sam Samson I I I don't know how he's he doesn't stop growing he's gotta have a myostatin deficiency I I you know I I think uh you you brought it up with once before and I'm like you know what I I'm starting to believe it because I've talked to people that that know him closely and they say he doesn't take a whole lot yeah he he's just and uh another guy he just gets and he's still lead he still is I just got the six pack give me a break you know I I still you know after the deaths we had you know like rodent and cedric and all them I don't want to see any more of these guys go man it's that's the thing yeah call me selfish I'm a fan of the freaks I like seeing the fucking I like I do too I do too that's it's impressive I'm a fan of the fucking freaks I've always you know I I remember I mean I remember going to uh it was Pump and Iron Gym in Staten Island and these guys they would basically just they would be in there and it was this little hole in the wall gym and they were there to get big and strong and that was it and I would fucking I loved going there.

SPEAKER_01 34:11

I was like in college or I was in you know out of college whatever I went to a community school and I would just go there and train and I wasn't a third of the size of these guys you know I mean the owner his name was I forgot his Paul something I forgot his last name Paul Wagner and he was 250 and that was like holy shit 250 that was like unbelievable back then you know and uh I was always a fan of the freaks and still I'm to this day I you know it is what it is but it's just like they seem to always be breaking new ground um Bruno says Andre Smaev Smave yeah Smae yeah that dude I'll look him up let's see you know it's not just it's not just uh bodybuilders man but you know you don't hear about it it just gets swept under the rug but big dudes don't live long i i remember seeing some stats on nfl linemen like the uh the nfl linemen they live like fucking 20 years less than an average person does really oh yeah yeah nfl players in general don't live long time really yeah there are not too many 80 year olds uh 300 pound people walking around no just period oh shit that guy is massive yeah i forgot about this guy but he's not really a competitive bodybuilder right he's not wrestler i think more like a social media uh i think he's an arm wrestler is he really he might be right he is fucking massive though you want to see something crazy look up that guy's hands oh no right his hand oh you know what you might be right let me see you gotta get a certain age though and and just be like man you know it's uh at a certain age you gotta bring it down the heart just can't take it oh absolutely even dude last year was the first year I had high blood pressure and I'm what 200 pounds you know what I mean and I had to go on i i'm on blood pressure medication and i'm only 200 pounds you know i'm five eight 200 i'm like you know i can only imagine these guys at a certain level they have to get to a point where it's like yeah you're gonna have to you know it's too much stress on your kidneys too much stress on your on your heart and it's inevitable you know it's it's inevitable Paul you know you know um yeah quentin beastwood is another one yeah you're right uh quentin beastwood is another guy is fucking monster you know more what age do you get to a point where generally you got to start like saying okay it's time for me to start pulling back because of blood pressure because of kidney stress because of heart stress because these guys seem to be like you know Brandon is 43 he's still Andrew Jack's 41 I think the big thing is if you manage your blood pressure and your lipids um you can extend your lifespan and bodybuilding if you're and from what I understand Brandon runs very moderate amounts of stuff too like I don't think he runs any crazy doses I uh Justin Harris is my coach and he coaches Brandon as well and from what I understand is that Brent Brandon is very conservative with what he does.

SPEAKER_00 37:23

He comes off too like yeah he comes off yeah he comes off too yeah brand brandon's very conservative with what he does he takes long periods of time I think it's exposure I think it's you know you know this man back back in the early 2000s anybody was anybody checking their fucking blood pressure yeah yeah yeah yeah that's a good point yeah right I started I started just because I had a a decent doctor at 21 and he was like dude your blood pressure's a little high you might want to you know try I remember uh I was taking epigen though epo because uh uh someone had it at the gym and we didn't even know what what it did that much so we were just taking it and I'm oh man my doctor was like yeah my doctor's like dude you're about you're gonna die if you keep taking this my your blood like 65 yeah they actually prescribe me epigen so like um they wrote me a script I had a doctor they used to just write scripts and it was uh they the the CVS pharmacy since I got a uh prescription for epigen before from a doctor it was for ACG but they wrote it for epigen instead and it said take one ml daily one ml that's a bottle daily of epigen so and then they they figured out they made that mistake and that's dude that was like epigen was going for like I think like 400 bottle 300 at that time so I had like like almost ten thousand dollars of epigen CBS just gave me because my insurance accidentally covered it because it was ACG and they called and they said hey like we were prescribed you the wrong medication keep it I said I said no because you prescribed this and it says one ML a day and I said I would die if I took this so I'm keeping it and they're just like okay so people who don't know explain what effigy is it's it uh increases your blood cells like it's like kind of like uh yeah right right right yeah it's uh but it's not I don't I don't suggest it for bodybuilding even though no definitely I have to get another thing that's another thing I have to give blood every three months now yeah the uh it's what all the uh cyclists were using cyclists but Ronnie was using it uh you know Chad had Ronnie using it back in the day I remember Ronnie using why would why would they have Ronnie use I mean because from what I understand anabolics increase your red blood cell count anyway doesn't it it makes you super vascular yeah it makes you more vascular yeah you want I mean it's gonna increase blood volume so you're gonna have you're gonna be looking like a Texas roadmap walking around your blood's like I mean I you may you had to have been tired when you were that when it was that high right like you I felt I felt horrible I had bad headaches but I was like not on much anabolics at all and I was taking that and I was like super vascular and pumped all the time but um I felt like my head was going to explode yeah I don't if if I take a crazy drug if I take something and it makes me feel like shit especially in the gym um to me it's not worth it because that's my happy time being in the gym working out getting that workout in and feeling good is my that's my happy time.

SPEAKER_02 40:23

So I was um using Redatrootide uh and I went through one bottle I was doing like uh one uh what was it one milligram every seven days and it made me feel horrible I would be completely and totally exhausted in the gym winded I couldn't finish a workout it was fucking terrible and and and then I got constipated it made me you know and I'm like okay the the I don't I really have a problem burning fat so I'm coming off this it doesn't it doesn't anything that makes me feel shitty isn't worth it for me I don't care what the outcome is because when I go to the gym that is my time that is my time I forget about everything I love training I love working out it it puts me you know in a euphoric state so I do not want to mess with that happy time and um so like the effigy or the red atruthide but then I talk to guys that take insane amount of red at true tide and they're like nah I don't no it doesn't bother me so I I guess everybody reacts differently to it people feel great on it really because because for me I would be I was exhausted not exhausted but winded really fast really really fast and I constipated couldn't shit even using fucking fibolize and I was like all right now it doesn't doesn't you know um IGF one I used when I was competing back you know 15 years ago another one it made me feel like made me feel like I was almost had a flu all the time really yeah it made me feel like I was I had flu like symptoms all the time and I'm like okay I'm not gonna use this because it's just made me feel like crap. So what's the point?

SPEAKER_00 42:07

Like if you can't get a good workout in then what's the point of using this fucking drug you know that's that's I was I I was I was kind of like that with anadrol like every time I take anadroll I would just use 50 milligrams a day I would yeah get so full because I'd I'd have I could get lean very easily too but I just didn't feel good at all I kill my appetite I'd just be nauseous and that was another one that's like you look good and nice and full on it but I just felt like junk all the time.

SPEAKER_01 42:32

Talib Priest what's up I'm epigeny's point in day when you don't like any real bunch of product have a good day go back to sleep you and not I know what time it is over there.

SPEAKER_02 42:49

Honey put a few of my buddies on epigen too though like when he was prepping a moat too honey did he really yeah I can't believe he's watching this it's 3 30 in the morning in fucking Germany it's it's almost four o'clock in the morning in Germany he's probably still on Australian time.

SPEAKER_01 43:03

Yeah right right right yeah I just sent you uh in the private chat I sent you a link to that that Russian's hands I want you to see how big this fucking dude's hands are oh here it is oh Jesus Christ yeah actually that's so funny this is what happens when you take a hundred units of gh that's insane let me pop that up on the screen yeah let me see if I could do that that's fucking insane there we go it was it's like a big dumb kid like oh I'll just try it 100 for a week just to see kind of how it was I mean it's just it's just retarded I don't know yeah you know I I was always conservative with this with the with the stuff too to be honest with you um because I look if there was if I was able to um really think that I had a future bodybuilding then maybe I would have pushed the envelope

SPEAKER_02 44:00

But when I when when I like was were doing local shows and I couldn't win an overall, you know, I was like, what's the fucking point? I was already in my 30s. I wasn't I couldn't win an overall at an NPC show. And I'm like, all right, I'm I'm just you gotta look in the mirror sometimes and go, yeah, I'm not pushing the envelope. And I remember going to see, I remember I told the story. I went to go see Oscar Arden because I was thinking about doing a uh Masters Nationals because I would win the Masters overall. Once I got over 35, I wouldn't win the Masters overall. And then I went to see another uh uh trainer, and they were all like, Yeah, you should you know try jumping on insulin. And I can see you're very conservative with the stuff, and I'm like, what's the point? What to break the top five at the Masters Nationals and fucking spend all this money and push the envelope with the drugs? I'm like, it was just not the last show I did online, I was 181 pounds.

SPEAKER_00 44:54

Well, I mean, it's an expensive hobby. So if you love it, I I mean, I tell guys if you love it and you want to be that big and it makes you happy, uh, go for it. But if you're miserable doing it, like a lot of these guys, they're miserable doing it. I'm like, why do this if you're unhappy? Like, there's you know, life can be so much happier like spending your money on other things. But if you truly love it, like I loved bodybuilding when I was younger, and I uh I enjoyed it, so I enjoyed the suffering, the diet, the everything about it. So if you if it makes you happy, do it. But it even if you're not gonna you know make money from it or whatever, if you can afford it, it's an expensive hobby, go for it. But yeah, I think a lot of these guys just don't enjoy it.

SPEAKER_01 45:32

Um that idiot, I just love competing, man. I do, yeah. I'm too old to be doing it, and I still fucking do it.

SPEAKER_02 45:39

Yeah, but like Amon says, if it if my attitude is, you know, listen, Vinny Galante is still fucking doing it. The guy is in his 50s. Vinny's Vinny's amazing. Yeah, Vinny's still doing his 50s. My attitude is if it's not taking away from your family, if it's not taken away from your kids, if it's not taken away from your lifestyle, um, and you want to compete because you just love uh you know competitive bodybuilding, go right ahead. My problem is when you see these young kids and then they drag their life goes into their 30s and 40s, and they're still chasing the dream. And they're and you know they haven't had children, they haven't had family, they haven't been able to make any money, they haven't bought a house, that they're still chasing this dream, and it becomes a fucking paradoxical treadmill where you're just on this just on a going nowhere fast.

SPEAKER_01 46:36

That's we you know pretty quickly if you you know you've coached people, Armand, you know, pretty quickly if guys have genetics to do something with it.

SPEAKER_00 46:44

I mean, yeah, I mean even when I was competing, like I got I had a I had a I was uh forced to because injuries had a done double shoulder surgery, but I mean I uh you have to kind of get out of it for a little bit sometimes to look at like, man, what have I been doing? And I'm like, I'm so much happier just like not having to eat every two hours, not having to do this. So um some people have to like kind of take a step back and look at like what they're really doing, but you get stuck in this, like it's like an addiction, like anything else. Like this, it's like a I don't know, sickness, but this addiction where it's like our constant, I'm never happy. I mean, who's ever happy with their physique? I don't know one person that looks in the mirror and like, yeah, I'm actually happy with my physique. You're never happy, you always can be bigger, your arms can be bigger, your legs, you know, you're never happy, and it's like absolutely you're chasing something you're never gonna be like really fulfilled with. I don't know, Paul. If you feel that way, do you ever look in the mirror and you're like, Man, I'm completely happy with how I look. It's like I don't think that happens. We all we all have body dysmorphia, man. It's why we do that.

SPEAKER_01 47:44

You know, we're all we're all crazy. I remember being in college, I was a skinny, uh you know, as a basketball boy. I was just a super skinny guy, man. I remember being 170 pounds in college, and I'm like, if I just ever make it to 200, and we'll be happy.

SPEAKER_03 47:59

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:01

Right. And then you know, then 200 came and I was like, all right, 220, then 240, then 260, then 280. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely. Yeah, no, at one point I was 300, it wasn't pretty, but yeah, it's it's a lot, man.

SPEAKER_02 48:16

I mean, it's you know, like I said, I genetically, if I if I when I competed, if they had classic physique, I probably would have done much better in classic. I probably could have got a because I have more of a classic physique. Um uh probably probably but would have been able to get a pro card of classic, but even still, you know, um within what go stand next to Mike Sommerfeld. Yeah, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 48:43

Like I don't know, it's it's like our mindset. If you love it, man, it's then that's what matters. I like for me, like I I never even care. I know it sounds cliche and stupid. I I don't even care how I place. I just it's like me, it's like I'm the same way, man. I just like the suffering, I like the diet, I like the process, yeah, I like the science, um, I like the friends, I like the camaraderie. I don't even give a fuck how I place, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I I just you know, I I fuck I go to shows all the time, you know. I probably go to 15, 20 shows a year just to be around it. I just like being around it.

SPEAKER_02 49:19

Oh yeah, it's like um remember in Rocky II? I say this all the time. Um remember the movie Rocky? Yeah, remember in movie, uh remember in the movie Rocky II where he goes to see Mickey and he's got the dog with him, and uh he says, you know, maybe I could work at the at the at the gym. And Mickey says to Rocky, you know, why would you want to do that? You're like royalty, you know. And he goes, I just have to be around it. I don't know if you guys remember that scene, but it was the same way because after I was done competing in bodybuilding, I would work backstage as an expediter for the NPC, and sometimes I wouldn't get paid, most of the time I didn't get paid. I just wanted to be around it and just fucking be there. And then once I started this podcast, it really fulfilled the void, you know. It's a love that I'll always have, but I had to be realistic within myself. And um, I knew I just didn't have what it took to turn pro as a bodybuilder. Um and I just had to be realistic. I just my whole thing is like I said, you know, I don't want to repeat myself, but if you are chasing something that's gonna put you in uh it's gonna put you in a situation where you're gonna be broke, homeless, uh uh uh addicted to something that's never gonna happen, then you really have to do some soul searching and rethink it. And this is a lot of people I know like that, man. There's a lot of people I know in the bodybuilding world, men and women, women too, you know.

SPEAKER_00 50:52

I mean, when I was competing, uh coming up too, like we, you know, I grew up in Arlington, so I was seeing Ronnie all the time, and a lot of the guys surrounding Ronnie, his friends and stuff, they would miss car payments to child support to pay for their bodybuilding. And I'm like, that's a problem when that yeah, when you're doing that, when you're you know doing that, if you can uh if you have the money to afford what you need and everything and do it that and it makes you happy, that's great. But if you're as if it's affecting your life and others or loved ones around you, then yeah, maybe you need to rethink kind of what you do.

SPEAKER_02 51:20

And a lot of women they skip having families, you know. Uh, you know, whether it's whether it's from the drugs or whether it's the decision to chase this uh this dream, they they skip having families, they you know, and they don't they don't have kids, and you can't tell me that that's it doesn't bother them, especially when you get to a you know your 30s, your your early to mid-30s. Um, it's gotta be significant. You know, they might not admit it, but oh yeah, it is definitely significant, you know. And I like seeing I just joined a new YouTube channel, and it's this uh it's it's a bodybuilding channel, it's more fitness, and it's it's a family. It's uh husband, wife, and two kids, and the whole the whole thing is their fitness, all of them. They have they have a whole home gym, and the kids are uh going to you know uh karate and they go into baseball and their uh husband and wife work out together, and to me that's fantastic. That's how it should be, right? You you kind of you're everybody's on the same page and it's complete fulfillment, but you know, I had I had uh one girl uh friend that um turn pro and she had this little uh hole in the wall apartment, and she couldn't afford that. And I remember we stopped talking because she asked me uh for money. This was like 10 years ago, and and I was like, I can't give you any any money, and uh you know, she would allude to it, she wouldn't ask directly, she would she would allude to the fact that you know every time we spoke, I don't have any money, and I wish I had somebody could help. And then finally I was just like, like, I can't, I don't know what you're telling me this for. I'm not, I can't give you any any money. And then of course she got defensive, and then we stopped talking, right?

SPEAKER_00 53:00

Um, you'll see you'll see a lot of the kitty girls. I I do, um uh, and a lot of times they're with a lot older guys, so they can afford to compete and stuff like that too. And you know, um a lot of a lot of the girls are getting pretty, I mean, the guys are one thing, a lot of the girls are getting you know pretty wrapped up, and and then while I was judging too for a while. I saw, I mean, girls would literally come up to judges and us and ask us, like, hey, what can I do to kind of do better? Alluding to certain things. So I'm like, man, you're will, you're like, you're willing to do that for like a plastic trophy, like you know, sell yourself. It's really you know, not okay. A lot of things I saw.

SPEAKER_02 53:39

So a lot of the bodybuilding girls do that because that's a fetish, so they throw themselves on OnlyFans and on the dark web. And I've interviewed plenty of on my other channel where they do, you know, they do fetish stuff, you know. Um Amber De Luca, and I mean, you go you go down the line, and this is what the what they would do, you know. King has a great story. I don't know who the girl is that he's friends with when he used to do cardio with. He has that great story, and he she would come with a bag of cash with her that she would do this crazy fetish bodybuilding fetish, you know, the firemen's carry and the arm wrestling and the choking the guys out and the kicking the guys in the balls, and this is what they would do, you know.

SPEAKER_00 54:16

I had a bigger girl I prepped for like uh four years, and she did that, and she owned her own webcam site and all that. And I used to go to her and stand outside the hotel when she would do her things, like the um you know, the scissors, uh, cut getting them in the scissors and crushing them and all that, and she would pay me like a good amount just to make sure she was safe. I would stand outside. But listen, I mean, it's uh the girls, they get into some weird stuff too, and it's you know, it's what it is. If yeah, like if make them happy and they're okay with that, uh, but you know, it's it's there's so much negativity uh towards bodybuilding. I I'd like to shine you know some more like uh positivity on it because you know uh outsiders looking in on bodybuilding, it's a really weird, weird industry.

SPEAKER_02 55:02

A lot uh yeah, I'm glad you brought that up because there's one thing that I wanted to say that a lot of people aren't talking about, um, as far as the positive stuff. Brandon Curry's not getting enough credit. He he he just came off that amazing second place next to Andrew Jacked. He looked amazing. Guys, 43 years old, he's a former Olympia, multiple honor classic champion, and all anybody could talk about was fucking uh Martin Fitzbord. And it's like, dude, we're we're missing, we're missing the boat here. You you're you're you're missing a guy that has literally checked all the boxes for a legend at this point, and nobody's talking about it.

SPEAKER_01 55:43

Brandon, yeah. Brandon Brandon's a family man too.

SPEAKER_02 55:46

Yeah, you're you're literally he's checking all the boxes for a legend in the sport, he's checking all the boxes for uh respect, for uh family, um, somebody that you want to look up to, and nobody's talking about him, and it's it's pathetic, it really is. Um, it's it's there is more negativity about Martin Fitzwater and the meltdown he had, and um, you know, uh uh you know Patrick uh Moore that he had a uh uh a tear, what was an Achilles tear five years ago?

SPEAKER_00 56:21

And it's like what the how long ago without tear? I was like, five years ago.

SPEAKER_02 56:27

What are we talking about here, guys? I mean what you know, Mond Fitzwater fine, you know, showed up at uh Arnold UK and it's like hey, showed up, you look like shit. What the fuck? Are we what are we what are we applauding here? That he just showed up. The worst, the absolute worst was Hassan Mustafa. He he was the absolute worst. I mean, I don't even like if you get an invite to the Arnold and you show up looking the way he showed up, it's like, dude, like really go away. Just just you you disrespected yourself, the sport, just go away. Brandon gets no fucking credit, and this guy literally has basically he could retire tomorrow and he's in the conversation for one of the best that ever lived.

SPEAKER_00 57:07

I think you know, an age factor too, and uh, you know, they start pushing certain guys away at an age. It happened to one of my uh buddies at the pro. Um, and he got a certain age, still great, and uh his placing started dropping too, just because they like to push the younger guys, they see okay, they have a longer career, they can more sponsors after them. It's just it it's like that, and it it I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 57:30

Um, but he's he's making it undeniable because that's second place that second place. Um uh that second placing for uh next to Andrew Jack was phenomenal.

SPEAKER_00 57:41

I love Brandon's physique, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:42

Yeah, I thought Brandon, I was there at the Arnold. That's about 15 rows back from the stage. I thought Brandon should have been third place in in you Ohio or UK at Ohio, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 57:54

Well, he was overlooked at Ohio 100, and then in the U when he did it at UK, they made sure to give him a better look, and he he showed up better at the UK than he did in Ohio. That's that's a profession. That is a conflict.

SPEAKER_01 58:07

Did you hear what happened to him on at the UK? Well, he lost his luggage or something like that, right? Yeah, all these had all his food and everything packed there, all his stuff, and lost his luggage, and he still kept it together.

SPEAKER_02 58:19

And he still fucking came and saying, and he still didn't whine and bitch and moan, and he still came in second next to an excellent Andrew Jack. The guy more people need to start talking about Brandon Curry because the kid, the guy is just phenomenal.

SPEAKER_00 58:32

We had him on the other day, and he I knew how he felt because he's he's been in it so long, and I'm like, how'd you feel when all that happened? He's like, Of course, I was stressed a little, but he's been in this game so long, and when you've been doing it so long, he's just like calm, it is what it is. I'm gonna get my food, I'm eating the hotel food. I he was eating like steak and rice every couple hours, anyways. I didn't it there, so he just he's calm, cool, collective. And Brandon's not only a great competitor, great physique, he's been consistent, he has you know, has he's uh like a perfect example as uh how bodybuilder should act too. Um exactly he's not getting not getting in trouble and drama and all this different mess. You know, he's he's a great ambassador. I love Brandon all around, so and 100%.

SPEAKER_02 59:15

And the fact that especially when I when when did he win? Uh 2020 or 2021? I forgot when he won 2019, right?

SPEAKER_01 59:24

Before COVID, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 59:25

Yeah, it was 19, sorry. When he had that ability to go to co Kuwait and just put it all on the line and it worked. I mean and you're talking about a situation where he couldn't be with his family, couldn't be with his wife, it was nothing but eat, sleep, and train in Kuwait, and he did it and came back to be Mr. Olympia. The guy is a consummate professional, respectable athlete that everybody should be looking up to. And all we talk about is fucking Martin and fucking you know Larry Wheels and fucking I mean I can tell you from social media, man, people love drama. Oh yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:14

That's what it boils down to.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:17

Brandon's kind of boring.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:19

Yeah, but you know what? He's got this amazing career, and uh uh that's what it that's what it takes to be good. Look, if if Martin or who's the other guy, uh Mike Sommerfeld keep going the way they're going in the direction they're going, they're not gonna have long careers.

unknown 1:00:39

Right?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:39

If Mike Sommerfeld continues to lose or miss weight, if he continues to miss uh a deadline, if Martin continues to have meltdowns, if he continues to not show up in shape, uh yeah, for that short period of time, we're gonna be talking about it, but he's not gonna have a long, extensive career. Guys like Andrew Jack, Brandon Curry, Samson Dowder, Nick Walker, those are the guys that are gonna be around for a long time and making dents in the fucking bodybuilding universe. It's the way it is, man.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:08

Even when Martin lived here in Dallas, you know, I trained with him for about three years or so weeks, and it you know, he had this outburst. This was like probably three years ago or so, and he was not right then. He was he, you know, um I won't get into it, but I helped him out with some stuff, and he just he's odd. He does some, he does weird stuff that's not cool, and yeah, uh normal people just wouldn't do. So it's not it's it's a behavior problem. It's not just that he went ahead and did this. Is this a pattern with him of doing stuff that's like not okay, not cool? Uh he needs he's mentally not all that, you know, not all there. He needs to get that together before I think trying to pursue competitive stuff, or he's gonna find himself in some, you know, some maybe other kind of trouble.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:56

Yeah, um, he's younger. You remind me of a little bit, and you're old enough to remember him. You guys are you remember Craig Titus back in the day?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:04

Oh, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:05

Yeah, they were calling him Craig Titus 2.0 at one point.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:09

Some people were they he's young enough to get the what I'll give both of those guys, Summerfeld and Martin, is they're young enough to get their shit together. Yeah, you know, they're young enough to realize okay, I really, I really gotta fucking get my shit because both of those guys, Summerfeld and Fitzwater, could have long, tremendous money-making careers if they get their shit together. Both of them. Martin Fitzwater could be in contention for an Olympia win for an Armor Classic win if he has his shit together. There's no question about it. The talent is there, you know. Um, same thing with Summerfeld, you know. Obviously. Obviously, when he comes in shape, he wins. That goes without saying. Uh, but you you gotta you gotta get your head on straight, you know. Uh, and I know at the beginning when you're young and you uh the fame comes and money comes quick, it's difficult. You know, we've seen plenty of athletes, NFL and NBA, you know, guys that just can't handle it. I uh, you know, we I get it, but uh uh it gets to the point where you need either somebody in your corner to tell you, hey, look, man, you got to get your shit together, otherwise, uh this uh this train's gonna uh you're not gonna be on the train for very long, or you have to realize it yourself, or you have to internalize your own values and realize okay, uh, you know, where the way I'm behaving is not going to end up well, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:25

But fuck, I don't know if I would have handled it well in my 20s.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:29

Dude, no way.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:30

I probably would have fucked it all up, dude.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:33

I totally would have been fucking overdosed with two hookers in the back of a Corvette smashed up somewhere.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:38

A hundred especially now with social media, you can't hide anything.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:44

There's no you can't say to your butt, you can't say to your buddy, don't say anything to anybody. Somebody got it on a video, somebody saw it.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:51

Yeah. You know how many times I uh you know how many times I remember we went me and um a few guys, we went to this uh after we went to a club, we went to a strip club, and the strip club was owned by everybody knew the strip club was owned by by by gangsters. You know, this is in Staten Island in the late 90s, everybody, everybody knew it. And uh my friend was getting drunk and loud and belligerent, and it was getting late, and uh we left and he was there by himself. And the next day he's got a fucking knot, and he goes, and then we were and we were like, yo, what happened to you? And he's like, Oh, uh, yeah, I fell, and I hit, I hit, I hit my oven when I was like, Yeah, I'm sure you fell. I'm sure that's what happened. You know, today you you you know, you could say, you know, today today you have to live with the phone and some monster knocking you out because you get because you were loud and stupid. Like, oh yeah, I think it takes a while.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:42

I mean, I remember when I was young and I first started, I was like uh won all four of my first shows, and at like 21, I got a dymatized contract that was pretty sweet, and I like you know, just you did I did a lot of dumb shit, and I'm like, I I left that contract for muscle tech, which made no sense because I was the only guy with dynatized, and you just do a lot of dumb stuff you really don't think through, of course. But then you know, reach a certain age, and hopefully these guys Martin, I think he's like 30, 31, so he should be, but I think he just recently blew up and started making the money in the past, I think, you know, several years. So yeah, then once that settles down, hopefully, you know, he gets his stuff together and realizes like, hey, I want to do this long term, I have to act a certain way, I have to behave a certain way.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:25

So yeah, that's why I I don't know if you guys saw it, but that's why I really tore into Phil Heath um when he applauded Martin Fitzwater for coming in fourth at the Arnold UK. And I'm like, what are we applauding? The fact that he showed up and he didn't have a meltdown and he looked like crap. I mean, is that what is that what you we expect from bodybuilders now just to show up? You know, um, same thing with Patrick. That's why, you know, when he's like, Oh, if you know, yeah, he had this tear, and I go, the tear was five years ago, it's not 1970. He people could come back from a fucking Achilles tear, you know. Um he was fine.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:59

I talked to him. At the heart of Texas, I think a year after he had the tear, and he was already doing well after that. It was just him getting his stuff together like in his personal life, pretty much. He was fine.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:12

Turbo Laz 1. Thank you very much, man. For uh the donation. I appreciate that. Ever hear of anyone getting a high CNS stim, BP increase high energy on GH? Current stack 300 megs, five milligram reta, two. I use of uh start started when I took GH. Uh, what do you think, Paul? Um, but actually multi use are good at this.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:33

It's it's the REDA. The Retta, the glucagon agonism in the Retta is causes your pulse to increase. It's it stimulates uh metabolism and CNS. It's not the GH. 100%.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:47

Okay, well, they have it. I'm glad he uh I'm glad Paul is on, and I'm glad Alman is on because I would have never been able to answer that question. So the answer is it is the Retta. So what would you suggest, uh Paul? Um try dropping the Rita and see if it goes away. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Five milligrams is a lot, man. I mean, I was only on one and I did not like my reaction to it, but um I I came off the reta because it made my pulse too high.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:12

I couldn't, I couldn't, it was it was too much.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:15

I'm not a huge fan of it. I know a lot of people love it. I'm not a huge fan of it for for people. I I think you know, especially once you start getting close to the show and you're pushing the carbs trying to dial in, it slows everything down. I I don't know. I'm not I'm just maybe a little old school, but I'm not a huge fan of it.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:29

But everybody Yeah, I don't think um I'm gonna start a contest prep here in a few weeks. I don't think I'm gonna run it run it. Yeah, um I I've I've been 50-50 with it with some of my prep clients. Yeah, for the guys that really have a hard time losing weight, right? Like the guys that really struggle, the GLP ones have been um fantastic for them. But I I the guys that tend to stay leaner. I don't know if you've seen this or not, Armand, but it seems like it flattens them out. Like I have a hard time filling guys out. They get like one of the things I've noticed, like, is you can't eat and you're bloated, which is not a good combination.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:09

Exactly. Um, and that's what that's what was happening. That's exactly what was happening to me because it does slow down your digestion process. Am I right?

SPEAKER_01 1:08:16

Yeah, yeah, it lowers gastric emptying. It depends. I mean, a lot of it is depends on the person, but yeah, and I remember that's exactly what happened.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:25

I remember I felt bloated, but uh my my you know, I wasn't I had to remind myself to eat, and I was only using it for like six weeks, and then um I was like, nah, what's what's the what's the fucking point here?

SPEAKER_00 1:08:37

I could I think it's I think it's becoming a staple, and yeah, and people don't a lot of people don't need it, but it's just it's so popular, it's becoming a staple is in a lot of people's preps or whatever. And a lot of times, you know, like Paul said, some people might need it if they can't control eating and stuff like that, but it's not for everybody, and not everybody needs it, and you know, maybe some people it does help, um, but it's just become like everybody thinks they need to take it. Oh my gosh, Red is this, it's a goat, it's a lifesaver, it's this, and so I think it just gets praised too much.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:06

So yeah, I good, Paul. I'm sorry. I was gonna say my approach with dieting and getting people lean. Um, this has always been the way I've kind of handled it. I want to use the least amount of fat burning agents that I can possibly get away with and get people lean. The least amount of cardio, the most amount of food, least amount of fat burners that I can get away with. Some people need more, some people need less, but like I like the whole kitchen sink approach. I just have never been a fan. I I think ultimately you end up looking worse. Yeah, I agree.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:39

Yeah, and you gotta figure out and you gotta figure it out. Unfortunately, you gotta be like a a test bunny, you gotta figure out what works for you, what doesn't, what to pull out, what not to, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:48

This is all but there's some people that just can't control their appetite, man. You get some of these people that are just have no control whatsoever. Um, there's some people that do have metabolic dysfunction, and it does seem to address and fix some of that those issues. But I just look at it as a tool in the toolbox, man. If you need a screwdriver, use a screwdriver. If you need a hammer, use a hammer, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:10:10

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:11

It's it's it's a tool in the toolbox. Uh pull it out when you need it. It it's you know, we still, you know, it's like last year was the first year that I I ever really had anybody use GLP1s on prep, and it was about 50-50. And I think I'm leaning more away from them this year on prep. I do like them in some instances, like these, I get some of these guys that are in for fat loss and just can't control themselves or they're metabolically dysfunction. Um, I'm on it because I'm a I'm a diabetic, I'm prescribed it. Um you know, it's had many health benefits for me. You know, I'm on a low dose uh trisepatite munjar, I'll prescribe, but my uh you know, lipids, everything have have improved well on it. Um so yeah, you know, it's just it just depends on the person, you know, it's case by case.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:00

Yeah, absolutely. Um that was the one thing that uh was difficult when you know I was competing. It was figuring out what to use and what not to use. And then you would go to different coaches, and different coaches would tell you, no, try this and use this, and you you kind of by the time I got to my 30s, I knew my body, and it's like I I I know what is going to work and what's not, you know. Um you know, uh and there were certain things I just stayed away from that I just didn't want to use, and there were certain things that uh was I knew it was worthless, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:41

I remember we all go through our phase where we're gonna try everything.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:46

Oh yeah. I remember I had one I had one coach that wanted me to use use anadroll throughout my whole uh prep, and I was like, uh that's not gonna do anything for me, man. It's it's that's that's worthless, you know. And I knew that Tyrannaball was a better a better uh oral for me than than uh uh than anadroll. So that's that's what I would use. But you know, you kind of have to go back and forth um and understand you have to figure out what works for you and what doesn't work for you. Yeah, of course. I I to be honest with you, I was never one of those guys that would like use everything. First of all, because it was very expensive. Secondly, I was was very conservative with it. Remember the first bodybuilding show I ever used? I used uh Primobolin, Winstrel. I think that was it. I think I was 23, and all I used was Primaboland or Winstrel. We're talking back in 1999.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:38

Yeah, well, I mean, that's back then, that's all we had, right? I remember, I remember you just took whatever you the guy at the gym could get you. Yeah, right, right, right, right. I'm like, all right, you got DECA, you got some win straw, that's why I'm running my country. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:51

Whatever's available, whatever's available. Yeah, yeah, exactly. That's how we be like, hey, yeah, we got like, hey, you have a see of winstraw, I'll trade you see a pro if I need this, you know, this, or you know, see of this for this when you're in close to the it's so funny you said that because I remember I was like 23 and there was this girl that I wanted to hang out with, and I traded a vi I traded an amp of sus for Viagra. My friend had Viagra. And uh and I was 23 question is good, you won that trade. I don't know, I think I I did. I was 23 and the girl was 18, uh you know, and that was that was it. But that's fun. All right, gentlemen, listen, I'm gonna let you guys go. Uh, always Aman and Paul. Much respect. Thank you guys very much for showing up. I really appreciate it. Um, yeah, man.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:45

Thanks for having me on.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:46

Of course, and we'll be in touch. Uh uh, great having you guys on. Your wealth of knowledge. Thank you for coming on, guys. All right, everybody have a good day. Later, Paul. All right, see you.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:55

Have a good day, guys.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:57

Later.