Serious and Silliness Bodybuilding
John Livia presents the most informative and fun bodybuilding podcast ever. Covering bodybuilding contests, drama, gossip, and bodybuilding training, nutrition and supplementation.
Serious and Silliness Bodybuilding
Muscle Talk! with special guests Aaron Clark and Eric Wood
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John Livia is joined by special guests, Aaron Clark and Eric Wood as they discuss Derek Lunsford, the Olympia, IFBB Pro Cards and more in an all-new episode.
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All right, muscle talk. We got me, John Olivia, Eric Wood, and Aaron Clark. What's up, fellas? I sent you guys the list of the shows that are the rest of the shows for 2026. And I've noticed there's a lot of guys that still haven't really competed yet, you know? And I'm like, what, you know, like uh there's a lot of guys that are waiting until the last minute to to qualify. You know, we we still haven't seen Regan Grimes, we still haven't seen Brett Wilkins, we still haven't seen Joan Prudell's or whatever his name is, uh, right? Uh, we still haven't seen uh Kennedy, Colossus Ken, even though we know he's doing Tampa, but that's but what do you what do you guys think? Like these are all guys that have a really good shot of winning a show and making it to the Olympia. Do you think it was a smart idea to for the for them to wait for the last minute? Because the cutoff is the end of August. That's it. After that, every other show is you qualified for 2027.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I don't know why they wouldn't go earlier, like you know, even like May and uh early June, they had all that stretcher show, New York Pro, Pittsburgh, you know, all that it was Tonyo that was just winning all those.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean Tony, Bonak, right? They were like throwing themselves in whatever they can. I mean, even um Sasarati, he's a uh guy, you know. Um, I don't know. What do you think, Aaron? Because these are these are the young, these are the young guys that people want to see that I mentioned the Regan Grimes, Brett Wilkins, Colossus uh Ken, um, Joan Prudell's. Um, there's that Russian dude. I know he did, I know he won a show last year and qualified for the leak for the Olympia, but he's only doing the Olympia this year. Sergei.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, maybe there's a I don't know. Obviously, I'm just shooting from the hip, but like maybe there's a strategy. Maybe they think maybe if I wait, some of the the harder competition will have already gone through and qualified. Maybe I got a better shot at winning. I don't know.
SPEAKER_01I I don't I don't know either. Or you know, it just knows. Good, Eric. What do you think?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, it seems like uh it seems like some of some of the bigger names are coming up, you know, like Nick and uh uh Nick's another one, right?
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00You know, Nick will qualify probably at at Tampa, and then what do they have? Texas after that, I think.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, well, you got you got okay. See, we got Tampa, and then you got a couple of shows that don't have open, then you got Texas, then you got the uh a show in Austria, the Austrian Oak, um Europa Pro. Oh no, once the no, once Austrian Oak's the last one. After that, you have the Gold's Gym Classic, but I don't know if that I don't think that has no that's that's here in Raleigh. Do they have open there?
SPEAKER_03No, they don't have open there.
SPEAKER_01So then after August 29th, once you get into September, there's nothing that's it. You know, the Olympia is September 25th. That leaves these guys not much time to qualify. I mean, I know you got the China Pro coming up, right? So you got the China Pro coming up, and I think James Holling's head is doing that, which I think is a smart move on his behalf, and then you also have uh Tobani that's supposed to be doing that, but fucking good luck getting a visa. I you know, I'll I'll believe it when I see it. You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_00I I you know even the shows, the shows here. After I did Toronto, there was no other shows in the States until Tampa.
SPEAKER_01Oh, really?
SPEAKER_00You had to leave the country, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Oh, that's right, that's right.
SPEAKER_00Am I wrong? I think there was no shows after they usually have Chicago, but they have Chicago didn't have open, right?
SPEAKER_01Chicago is is is this weekend coming, but there's no open. There's 212 and there's classic.
SPEAKER_02That's really interesting.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Well, you know what I heard, I think it gets very expensive for these promoters.
SPEAKER_02Sure, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, a lot of times they have to put on NPC shows to make up for, you know, either the day before or the day of to make up for the money they have to spend. Um, because the uh the sanction fees to run a show is very expensive. Um and they have to be in they have to be in, but they have to be paid like three or six months before the show. It's not like okay, you know, or which was one of the problems leading to the prize money.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, if you remember last year, the uh the guy who did the Masters Olympia in Japan didn't pay anybody for months.
SPEAKER_02Okay, I remember that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and uh Dorian, who we used to I we still keep in touch, we're still good friends, uh, used to be on the show all the time. He I think he didn't get paid for like three months after that or something like that. And he won. You know, and and it came and it didn't come from that promoter, it came from who's the guy who won't the Olympia? Jake Wood. Came from Jake Wood, he was the one that laid out the money, and you know, I don't know how he worked it out with the promoter, but yeah, so it becomes very expensive for these uh for these guys to put on an open show. I'm not so I think you're seeing that's why you see a lot of classic only 212, uh, you know, the girls, you the girl of bikini ones, you know, uh that kind of shit, you know, because they want to make money. But getting back to the original point, I just you know, it just really think like especially a guy like Kennedy, Colossus Ken, right? He did the New York Pro this year and he didn't do well. He had the size, clearly has the size, clearly has the shape, but he he didn't have his conditioning down. And now he waits months and months and months, and he's doing Tampa, and now he's got to go up against Nick, and he's got to go up against uh Joe, and he's got to go up against James Hollingshead. Yeah, I would have thought if you're a young bodybuilder, and Aaron, you you could you could answer this question first. If you're a young bodybuilder, don't you think it takes a couple of shows before you figure out because he has a lot of added size since last year and the year before, doesn't it take a few shows before you figure out what actually needs to be done before you get into that fucking grainy hard look that like Eric pulled off this year to really be in the run?
SPEAKER_03Well, I will say that that's kind of out of my wheelhouse, really. I I I stayed within five to ten pounds of the same weight. Ah, you know what I mean. So for me, I felt like the first show I did was my best look sometimes. And if I continued to diet, usually the next look I had was like uh I some people said it was better. I liked the first look better, you know, that I did. Um, but you you have a point for sure. Like if you if you add 15, 20 pounds, I don't know how much weight exactly he's added, but if you add that much mass to your body, yeah, maybe so. Maybe it is gonna take a few shots. Um I don't know. I mean, maybe they're just trying to do it all in one, like you know, get ready for the show and then just continue into the Olympia. But like you said, the likelihood of there being an Olympia for them is at this point slim to none.
SPEAKER_01Yes, or is it Eric, or is it what the old school guys are saying? The old good old school guys are saying these young guys just don't have the fucking grit.
SPEAKER_00I don't I don't know. I mean you're still you're still talking, you know.
SPEAKER_01I mean, you hear it all the time. I mean, Lee said lee, Jason Arnes, all the older guys I have on, you hear it all the time, and then that that conditioning is like not a joke.
SPEAKER_00It was it hurt to like walk at some time the last like week or two, and just no energy, but you just gotta like you can't really think about it. Yeah, but that that's not like it was hard getting to that. I think that's probably the hardest thing about bodybuilding, you know, eating a lot of food in the off season and all that can be difficult, but it's just something about prepping and getting to that like single digit body fat where you just you know it gets really tough.
SPEAKER_01I get all I get all of yourself, yeah.
SPEAKER_03You're not really present, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you is I like no emotion, it was just like it was just a robot. I was just going doing the same thing every day.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Is it uh have you did I've heard of bodybuilders actually having physical pain? Like their body fat is so low. If they sat down, their butt hurt or the bottoms of their feet hurt. Have you heard of that?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I I'm not I haven't heard of that, no.
SPEAKER_01Go ahead, Aaron.
SPEAKER_03There were times where I it hurt to walk um barefoot. Uh yeah, I had a couple, uh maybe like one or two preps. And I don't know if I was more conditioned then, but it was just like I remember one time where when I would walk on the wooden floor, I would be like, fuck, that hurt. Like if it just felt like bone, you know. Yeah, so I would wear slippers around the house. But I don't know, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you can you're a well, you know, you're a pro athlete, you kind of have to just you know deal with it.
SPEAKER_00I never used oh, sorry.
SPEAKER_01Good, good.
SPEAKER_00I'm saying like this reta and all that stuff. I I didn't use any of that. It's people say it makes it easier, but I'm like, it's you know, Acino never told me to use it, so I'm not gonna I'm just gonna listen to what he says.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. Listen to your coach. Uh uh, yeah, that's actually a really good topic. Let's get into that. I tried Retta True Tide. Um and it was the only peptide I can with the aside of GH, obviously, with the exception of GH. Red A, uh I did not like it. Now, obviously, it did kill my hunger, it killed my appetite. It got to the point where I had to force myself to eat, right? Um so it takes no discipline if if that's number one. Okay. Um, number two, it didn't, it really the side effects. I mean, I would be gassed out at the gym quick and to the point where like one or two sets in, one or two sets into my working sets, and I was gassed out, like to the point where I was like, what the fuck? And then I would Google it, side effects of Reditr and sure as shit, you know, there it is, fatigue and whatnot, whatnot. And my attitude is like, if I'm taking something that is not enabling me to train to my fullest potential in the gym, then what's the point? You know, I could see if you're extremely overweight and you're borderline diabetic or diabetic or you have high cholesterol or you have heart disease and you you know and you just don't have what it takes. I get it. The retitruti, the trzippitai, the you know, all the other ones, whatever. But for a bodybuilder, I I I don't know if it's if it's necessary. What do you think, Aaron?
SPEAKER_03Well, I think well, let me ask you this. When when you're just feeling super drained, would you blame that completely on the drug itself, or would you say like maybe it was because of the diet, or was it no?
SPEAKER_01It was definitely the drug because once I'm not yeah, because I haven't low carb since I I haven't low carb since I've competed. Yeah, you know, I don't low carb. Fuck that.
SPEAKER_03I I I've never used reditrutide. Um and I wouldn't. I mean I could think of one time, you know, in a prep I did for 212 where I was eating like 1300 calories a day, right? And it would have been nice then because I couldn't, I couldn't, I was losing my mind, right?
SPEAKER_02Right, right.
SPEAKER_03Um but uh on a normal day, like to stay lean, I I always kind of have to force myself to eat.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_03Now it's not a problem that I have of like can't stop eating, right? Like it, I don't, it's not it's not a drug that's for me, right? Yeah, no, I know other people who like if it's there, they can't not eat it, right? Yeah, yeah. Or after a show, the rebound. Oh, yeah, that's where I could see it being useful for for some. Now, in a perfect world, we wouldn't need it, right? But I think some people like they've been dieting so strict and then it's over, and they just can't. It's like they have the opposite eating disorder, right? Yeah, so like, yeah, I can keep that at bay, but still, even for that, you only need a little bit of it. Uh, I've heard people so much of it.
SPEAKER_01Um, but I might have been dosing it wrong because I was literally getting gas gassed out and not feeling good. And I'm like, how many milligrams were you taking? It was supposed to be, I think it was one that was a week or something like that. Yeah, to me, it's like to me, it's just I'm at the I'm 50. So, like uh, we've talked about this before. At 50 years old, I do uh test and GH and like literally I'm good. Like, I I'm not looking to get on stage, and I was never I never I always had a good build, but I never had the physique of being a competitive uh elite bodybuilder. So you you gotta kind of know what you are too at at some point and come to the realization. Before we actually continue, I want to take one break and actually uh show you guys the sponsor. I I don't know who you're with, Aaron, but this is Nutrafit, and this is these are their product lines, and they have actually really good shit. And I'm gonna show you the the Lee Priest pre-workout because they are they have established a all Lee Priest line, and it is called the fuck is it called?
SPEAKER_03It's the crucifix or crucifix.
SPEAKER_01That's it. Sorry, crucifix. Where is it?
SPEAKER_03I remember it from last time, yeah. And it is like that name, it stood out to me.
SPEAKER_01It's very yeah, I know really. It is it is basically uh, I don't know if you want to work out and then like build an addition on your house afterwards. I mean, then then I would take it. Okay, yeah, if if if if that's the case, there it is, and there's leap priest giving you the finger. The good part is uh they don't just have a crucifix, they have crowba, which is another pre-workout that I prefer because it is a moderate pre-workout. And if you use the discount code priest, uh then you get 20% off. If you buy crucifix and then buy another NutriFit product and use the discount code Priest, you get 30% off. So we'll just keep it at that. Go from there. Just wanted to show you guys that one. And then, of course, there is vintage muscle, which is a uh pro hormone. You put it under your tongue uh for people that are afraid of injections and clinics. Yeah, it's a liquid, it is a pro hormone, it is liquid. This one is epitest, and this one is 19 dandro. They have a bunch of them, so you go to vintage desmuscle.com. I'm not gonna lie to you, it's not the best tasting stuff in the world, it is pretty gross, but but it does work, you know. It does work. All right, next. Okay, so yeah, so you hear a lot of the older guys. I mean, I I'm kind of sick and tired of the older guys bitching and complaining about the new guys, but what happened? I feel like every time Dorian Yates is on an interview, he's just shitting on the new guys, you know. It's just he's just you know, and it's gotta be discouraging because these are the guys that you've looked up to. You're the only guy who really doesn't do it is uh is Ronnie Coleman. He I think he did it once on a podcast where he said that any of the top ten guys during my era would be Mr. Olympia now, but he doesn't ponder on it, you know, he doesn't dwell on it. Dorian seems to dwell on it.
SPEAKER_03I feel like Ronnie, it's more like when they ask him. Yeah, like do you think they could have reached him? He's like, no, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01But he's but here's the thing, he's right, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course, yeah. He's right, Dorian. As far as I'm concerned, is like the Muhammad Ali or the the the the the you know the Mariana Rivera, you know, the the the Tom Brady of bodybuilding. There's just one in a million, he's just never one in a billion. It's just never gonna be another one like him. But uh, I mean, you know, you listen to Dorian when he's on an interview talking about that these guys don't compete, they don't have crit, uh, they do movements that don't mean anything, like upright rows, um uh uh or uh wide lat pull downs he thinks that are a waste of time, and and it's just constant negativity from you know guys like Dorian and even Sean Ray, but Sean Ray, everything that comes out of Sean Ray's mouth is is negative. I don't know. Can you guys take a personal opinion that you guys were the younger guys coming up and you were looking up to these guys?
SPEAKER_00No, I I don't. I I think like just like any sport, you know, they're gonna say Michael Jordan was better than Kobe or LeBron.
SPEAKER_01Right, right, right, right.
SPEAKER_00Anything.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. What do you think, Aaron?
SPEAKER_03I think that anything, uh let's take any sport, let's take music, let's take anytime things evolve, like the past generation talks shit about the new ones. Always so it's just it's just how it is, and I think that part of it, and this isn't to talk shit about the the grades of the past either. Like, I have a lot of respect for them, but I think that there's also once you are past your prime, and I mean I can lump myself in there too. We can, that's fine. Like, uh you're trying to stay relevant too, right?
SPEAKER_01Uh yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03And I'm not saying that's all it is, but it's something to say, right? Yeah, and it's it's your way of providing value to a conversation, and there's maybe a little bit of truth in some of the things, right? Yeah, but it's not like everybody on stage now is a fucking pussy, and it's like they were all these fucking Viking warriors back, you know, 50 years ago.
SPEAKER_01You can't get to the top of the game. Uh no, man. I don't care what era you can't get to the top of the game unless you're putting in that fucking hard ass work. Yeah, right. I I yeah, I I don't care what era it is, like uh I I have this people don't like this opinion of me, but I always say when Jay Cutler was Mr. Olympia, you know, he was in between the Ronnie fate Ronnie era and the Phil era. And in between that era, it was a little weaker than those two eras. You know, the best guys you had were like Victor Martinez, Dexter Jackson, Branch Warren. You know, the flexes were gone, and Kevin Lavron was gone, and Sean Ray was gone, and Ronnie Colmer was gone, and you know, and then Kai was coming up, Phil was coming up, Dennis Wolfe was coming up, but they weren't relevant yet. And I always say that Jay Cutler, um, I don't put him in my top five because of that era that he was in, top five of Olympians. Um but there's no there's no way in the world you're gonna tell me he didn't fucking bust his ass to get to where he was. This it's just impossible to get to that point, no matter what era you're in.
SPEAKER_03I I think, and of course, I don't know. I think I think Jay worked harder and smarter than a lot of the other people. Um he's gifted enough, right? And I think that's where I have so much respect for him as a person and a bodybuilder. Like, he's not Phil Heath, he's not Ronnie Coleman, but he was right up there with him. Oh, yeah, oh yeah, and that's because of his work ethic, and because you know he didn't destroy his body either, right? Or his health, like right, and I I look at him and and I look up to that a lot because I think some of the guys that are so gifted, like, and I'm not saying they do work really hard, but they don't have to just like you're saying someone's talking shit about like oh wide grip lap pull downs or shit, and only do if you're really gifted, it doesn't fucking matter what kind of laptop. Yeah, it's the truth. You're gonna grow. Train hard, you train hard, and it's gonna, you know, it's gonna go well, right? Yeah, so like I don't know, it's yeah.
SPEAKER_01No, yeah, it's the God's honest truth. It really is. It's uh, but a lot of people get pissed when I have that opinion. But I'm not saying that you know Jay Cutler wasn't a great. Bodybuilder wasn't one of the greatest bodybuilders, wasn't a great Olympian. I'm just saying that during his time it was a downtime, but you always have those peaks and valleys. Do you know what I mean? Like, you know, after after Arnold's time, after he uh retired, you know, you had you had a you had a dip until like Lee Ainey came along. You know, would you have Frank Zane, who was a good bodybuilder, but he was like 170 pounds or whatever the hell he was, you know. Um, you had a Mike Mencer that got pissed off because he believed the whole thing was rigged and he probably was right and he just threw the towel in. Um Lou Ferrigno left to go do the and then you had guys like uh uh who was the guy that's always on with uh Rx Muscle doing the wrap up who became Mr. Olympia. Uh I think uh they called him the Lebanese lion. What's his name? Help me out.
SPEAKER_00Oh is he from New York or somewhere up there?
SPEAKER_01No, he's from Lebanon. He's uh Samir Samir Samir Banu became Mr. Olympia, and I'm not saying he wasn't a good, like I said, you know, but during that time, it was just a weak time until Lee Haney, until Lee Haney came around, and he had Lee Haney, Rich Gasparry, and Lee Labrata, and all these guys, you know, so it's always a fucking cycle. And in in in modern times, you you know, if you go to you know 2019, 2020, 2021, that was kind of a a weaker time until the new guy started coming up, you know, when Brandon Curry became Mr. Olympia. I'm not saying that he wasn't a great bodybuilder. Of course, every all know Brandon Curry was a great bodybuilder, but that was before Derek Lunsford, that was before Samson Dowder, that was before uh, you know, Hottie Chopin. And you know, you had Ham Bonak, you had Rami, who was like a coin toss, you didn't know what Ramie were gonna get. Um, so there's always an ups and downs. And I think that it that's like that in any in any sport, but to say that they that they uh don't work hard, that's just that's just not the case. That's just that's just not the case. You know, you know the guys that are talented that don't work hard because they always get to a certain level and they never get better. That's it. Yeah, yeah, they just they they rely on their genetics. I think the best example was Lionel Becky. Lion, remember him, the French guy? Yeah, yeah. Lionel Becky had an amazing physique, and and as a fan, you would look at him and you would go, Jesus Christ, if this guy put 10 more effort into it, he could be fucking an Arnold Classic champion. And you would you would get pissed because you're like, I can't, why is he missing the mark? He's amazing. And then he just, you know, um, I've heard from sources that he'd never listened to his coaches, and the last couple of shows he showed up to, he he really looked like crap. It was really bad, you know. Then he had a I think he had a recon, a rest record in France. It was just, you know, just a shit show. But you kind of always see the guys. One of the guys that I always got a little aggravated with, um in this in that same perspective was um who was the who was the fireman?
SPEAKER_00Ku Klo. What's his name? Are you talking about Steve? Ku Klo?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, Kuklo to me would always look like the same bodybuilder every time he came. I would I I he would you would never see him put added size on, you would never see him make extreme changes, but you saw the talent, you were like, This guy's really fucking good, man. This guy could be an honor classic champion. This guy, and then the next season would come and it would kind of be the same Kuklo. You know, what do you guys think? You guys have a different opinion. Go ahead.
unknownGo ahead.
SPEAKER_01Actually, that was your generation, Aaron. Good.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it was. Yes. Uh, he was actually. I remember uh when I did the USA's, he came up to me and he's like, You did it, man. You won't like he was like, I was like, really? He was like, Yeah, man. Um, and uh I don't know. I think that it's just like I think bodybuilding is a lot like growth spurts in high school, right? It's like some people burst on the scene and people are like, Oh my god, they're gonna be Mr. Olympia, but that's they don't really get much better than that, right? Just like some kid is like 6'2 in eighth grade, and then he might grow another inch, but that's all he got, right? Like it's like it that's why I don't always like when people like, oh, there's potential, like you don't know, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, right, right, right.
SPEAKER_03Of course, there's some people like a Phil Heath, where you just look at them and you're like, he could just add five more pounds, and he's unstoppable, right?
SPEAKER_01It's over, yeah, right.
SPEAKER_03Right, but for a lot of people, I think that there was a lot of work for them to get to where they turned pro, and then after that, like their physique doesn't really get that much better.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. You think it's get get Eric.
SPEAKER_00What was Steve? Steve was like what 275? Oh, he's a big boy, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01He was tall too, though, right?
SPEAKER_03He wasn't a short guy, like for bodybuilding, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean five ten, something like that. Yeah, right, something like that, yeah. Um, maybe I'm just coming from a pan fan, because I'm a fan first, right? Um uh so I might be coming from a fan's perspective, and from a fan's perspective, when you when you have a a favorite, you know, you want to see them, you know, continue. Like when I first uh interviewed Samson Dowda, it was it was during COVID, and it was right after he did that show in Hong Kong, and he got locked in his fucking hotel room. You remember that? Oh, yeah, he got they wouldn't let him out of his hotel room because of COVID. It was like the only show that was available. It was him and like one other guy, uh, he wound up losing, whatever. And I had him on afterwards, and I remember seeing his physique and going, Wow, if this guy fucking this guy could really be great, he could be. I remember thinking at the time, you could he could be at least be an all the classic champion, right? And then then he went on to prove it. And and I I guess there's a lot of variables that come into play that you don't realize. But as a fan, that's kind of what you want to see. You kind of look at a guy, like you said, and you need to go, oh, this guy's this guy's got it. This guy's got what it takes. You know, we want to see him go as as far as as he could with uh with all that hard work and genetics. But here's another question I got for you, Eric. Uh if next year you compete, right? And you win, like, let's say you win one or two shows, which very well may happen, and then you go on and you do the Olympia, and then all of a sudden, like hostile wants to fucking sponsor you, and you gotta go on Fuad's channel. Does that mean you're never gonna come on my channel anymore? You're gonna be like, fuck you, John. I'm I'm the champ now. Fuck you, dude.
SPEAKER_00No, honestly, like I don't know. I reached out to Fuad like a few years after the New York Pro. Yeah, but they said they weren't taking anyone else on, but I don't know. I kind of like just doing bodybuilding, no sponsorships, just doing it myself, you know.
SPEAKER_01It doesn't tie you down to anything, yeah. Because Samson, I had to interview Samson two or three times, and then once he became Mr. Olympia, like that was it. I never got a response from my emails anymore anymore. Like the son of a bitch.
SPEAKER_00I didn't know you interviewed him back in 2020.
SPEAKER_01What's up?
SPEAKER_00I didn't know you interviewed him back then.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, well, what I had I had one channel back then, and it was like a multiple, it was like a multi-channel. And then when I I once I realized what how how YouTube works, I split it up into two separate channels and I dedicated one to just bodybuilding. And then the other one just became more of an interview show about strange people. Um, so I have this uh this guy coming on the other channel, be interviewing him tomorrow night. Uh, so he's on the other channel, his name is Jimmy Easy, and um he was a uh Mafia associate killer, like killer killer, from what I understand. I had to his I saw an interview of him, right, Aaron? This is I know we're going off topic, but I saw an interview of him. It was on Vlad TV. Vlad TV is one of the biggest fucking yeah, the rappers and stuff, yeah. Yeah, it was my he's one of the biggest podcast YouTube channels in the world, and he always has these these criminals, these ex-criminals, these ex-tough guys on, always. So he has Jimmy Easy on, and I'm watching the interview, and I'm like, Really? Like that many people? Like that, it's that like you were that so then I literally had to like talk to and I I texted other guys I've had on my channel, and they had a verifier for me. They're like, Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's he was a lunatic. So I'm like, oh, okay. So apparently this guy uh killed seven people. Yeah, yeah. So he'll be coming on uh yeah, he'll be coming on tomorrow night on the Elder Channel. If anybody's interested, it'll be airing Friday at 7 p.m. But anyway, all right. So back to bodybuilding. Okay, so what are we thinking? Does Derek have the shot to repeat this year? Or is Derek have his hands full with Andrew being better and Samson obviously going to be better? What do you think?
SPEAKER_00I feel like as a complete like front to back side shots, I still feel like Derek will beat Andrew. You know, the back double, all the from the you know, the glutes and hamstrings and just Derek's back double. I don't think anyone's touching that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's an incredible shot. That's an incredible shot.
SPEAKER_00And I don't know, I feel like he's gonna keep getting better. I mean, he's like what 33, I think.
SPEAKER_01He's a young dude, yeah. He's a young dude. Yeah, and you see a lot of hate coming from the uh from the bodybuilding fans with Derek for some reason. Um especially for with his front bicep pose.
SPEAKER_03Um, people don't like his biceps, but we're always telling saying oil, and I don't know. I've never really looked at him and thought oil.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, there's so many videos of people being like, he should like I don't know, it's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_01There was there's one uh there's one video and one picture when he was an amateur, and you could clearly see he put something in his thighs. I mean it look you could clearly see it. I did a a video on it. Um, I think it was PMMA though, it wasn't um like synthol. Uh but since then it's very it's uh it's very hard to kind of see if he is using oil. I I I don't know if he is or not. And my whole attitude is like you could use growth, you could use retitrutide, you could use T3, you could use Clan, you could use anabolics, but when it comes to sight injections, that's that's the line.
SPEAKER_02I you know, I don't that I don't fucking to me, but whatever.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think Samson has a really good shot of reclaiming it. I mean, the guy clearly understood what he did wrong last year, and he he was at a point where he's 350 pounds, like with abs, yeah, not a stone a blown out stomach. Um the other next question is Hottie is clearly on uh what's his name's protocol? Yeah, you can clearly see he's on Milosa's protocol. Yeah, he's he's bigger, he looks like he's bigger than ever. Have you seen him, Aaron?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I saw that I saw the video. I always take everything I see on Instagram with a couple grains of salt nowadays.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Um, do you think that's gonna serve him well? Because I never thought he needed more size, Hottie.
SPEAKER_02Uh I think that and I'm saying this as a short man, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, join the club, dude.
SPEAKER_03Um, the guy's Hottie, Derek, right?
SPEAKER_01We're around that five, six height, I would say. Yeah, something like that. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03So, like, how much more size can they carry and it actually look good, right? I don't know. Like, when I look at Derek, I don't know how much better he can get. I hope I'm wrong. Like, I'd love to see him get better, but like he's got so much muscle on his frame. Yeah, right. I don't know. Like, when you see him, especially off season, you're like, I don't really know how much more muscle he could add, especially to his back, his chest, his arm. Like, he's pretty somebody like Samson, somebody like Andrew Jack, like their ceiling is higher. Like, when I see them, I don't say like that's they're done. Like, that's the most they can add, right? Right, they can so there's always that element of like maybe they'll show up and they'll look, they'll have taken it, maybe not, right? Right, but there's always that element. I think Hottie, like you talked about Derek's back double bye, right? Like, I think that he he loses that shot to Derek. Um, and it's not it's not a bad shot, but I from what I remember last time I saw Hottie, I feel like you know he was peeled, and his abdominals and his some of his front shots are incredible. Yeah, um, his hamstrings aren't bad, but they're not all like whoa, right? Like right. Um, I don't know, man. It depends on where that size is, what what he holds coming in.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's right, it's rough for Hottie because I look at Hottie and I go, I don't think he can get much better. Do you know what I mean? Like he comes, he's so massive and he comes in fucking peeled and he's full. And it's like, how much I credit him from for trying to get better and trying new methods like with Milo's. Okay, I I fully credit him. You could see that he wants it. The hunger is there, the gumption is there, clearly, right? Clearly, yeah. With Derek, I don't see him being able to put on much more science, but I could see him getting tighter and harder, you know. Um see. I I I think I don't know. Eric, do you like the idea of the last few years of the Olympia where we didn't know who was gonna win? That it was a toss-up with the top five guys, top three, four, five guys. Yeah, anyone should win. Or did you like it when you had one dominant guy?
SPEAKER_00I liked I liked watching it the most when Phil kept winning.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Or him and Kai were going back and forth.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And they almost duped it out on stage. Yeah, that was great. Yeah. What do you think, Aaron? Do you like it like it is now, or do you like having a dominant champion?
SPEAKER_03I mean, both? Like everyone. Right? It's cool. Like, yeah. There's only there's only so many of those.
SPEAKER_01Right, right, right.
SPEAKER_03But it's at the same time, it's like, yeah, you won for the sixth time, right? Like it's you already know what's gonna happen. Yeah, bodybuilding already has a tendency to become that way. Like people being like, oh, wait, look, watch what's gonna happen, they're gonna choose him again. Like, right, like it's almost predetermined. So I think um it takes some of the excitement away. Um but yeah, everybody likes to see somebody like a Ronnie Coleman or uh right, like so. I don't know, you can't really say what's better, but it is cool, it makes it uh more interesting, yeah, when it could go uh you know many different ways, right?
SPEAKER_01And you got a lot of new blood, like you got a lot of new blood that is really good, like Tonyo and and Joe Palacios, and a lot of these guys are coming up and they're no fucking joke, man. They really aren't like they can clearly break the top five if they if something goes wrong, even Nick, you know, Nick Walker still has the ability to break the top five. You know, if if people slip and Nick is on, he could get in, he could sneak in there and win. Um, what do you think of Martin? I think Martin, if he has his head on straight, can be a champion. I don't think he could, I don't think he could be a Mr. Olympia champion this year, but I think he has the potential to be an Arnold Classic winner and Mr. Olympia champion. But it's all in his head, it's all his mentality. The guy, I think his worst enemy is his fucking his head, his head is his worst enemy, you know. Like he really made a fool of himself this year. He really did. It was pitiful. And then he had a chance to redeem himself, and then he came looking worse than he did. Like he looked like he didn't even try, you know, and and that's the kind of that's the kind of bodybuilder that as a fan, you get angry. You go, dude, you have all the fucking talent and skill in the world. You have ever you're you're a god-given, you are destined to be a champion bodybuilder. Why can't you keep your head on straight? You know, and you get angry as a fan. Like there was no reason for him to react the way he did at the Arnold Classic this year, or with with Nick and when they got second. Yeah, there was no reason for that. And then the rumors about him shoving Nick in the back, and then the rumors about him starting rumors about Derek's uh dehydration during the Olympia. Um it's just then he, you know, he was arrested several years ago. It's it's I I hate I hate that with a passion because any one of us, like I think uh Aaron, I think I told you this before. The reason why I'm on this on this microphone and I have this YouTube channel, because I always wanted to be a champion bodybuilder, right? I just genetically didn't have it, just didn't. That was it. And a critic is one of two people a retired athlete or uh an athlete who can't make it. And I'm the latter, and I look at these guys, I mean, I yeah, I'm the ladder. I look at these guys and I go, Jesus Christ, you're everything I've ever wanted, and you're throwing it away. So I think it's do or die for Martin, to be honest with you.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, but I did that, you know.
SPEAKER_01Are you in a different scenario though?
SPEAKER_03Well, sure, but I think that people would say that, like, why are you doing all these drugs and doing like right? Like they because they would look at that and be like, Man, I would do anything to be like, what are you doing? Yeah, like and it it it never looks the same, right, from the from when you're in the audience. Um, but I think that self-sabotage is really real. Oh, yeah, it's very, very real. And I'm not saying that's what it is. I mean, man, I I tell you what, I've met so many people through bodybuilding that are are insane, you know, like their heads put on sideways, like just the temper and like an emotional. I will say some of the most I have met some of the most emotional men I have ever met, right? And you meet them, you're like, oh, this big tough guy. It's like, no, like they're just a big crybaby who's juiced up.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's like it's like it's like their it's like their muscles are armor, right? It really is, and what's inside is just really sensitive.
SPEAKER_03It's like a it's like a scary, yeah, uh actually, but yeah, I've met many people like that, and uh you know, yeah, and um and I I've no you're 100% right.
SPEAKER_01The majority of bodybuilders, like I don't want to say the majority of my whatever.
SPEAKER_03I mean, I'll throw out I'll throw out 50-50.
SPEAKER_01I don't know. I don't know the majority of bodybuilders, but they do seem to like let's take Eric as an example. Eric is getting married, he has a daughter, he works and he's he's becoming a champion bodybuilder, and he is responsible and has his head on his shoulders. It's not too many bodybuilders like that. There really isn't, you know, which is the reason why I respect Eric Wood so much, which it's the God's honest truth. Um, it's it's very difficult for these people to have balance. Um, all right. Well, the this past weekend I was on Paul Barnett's uh podcast, and they were really nice people. I was out of my element. All these people were really deep into the science of bodybuilding. But there was one gentleman on that was in his 50s, and he's still chasing a pro card.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01You know, like and I didn't say anything too much. I told him good luck at the he's because he's doing the the the he's doing the uh Masters Nationals this week coming up. I think it's tomorrow, actually. And uh I just told him good luck, and you know, listen, as a person, you could do whatever you want. But if you're still chasing a pro card after 45, after 40, 45, 60, you're clearly not a balanced human being. Sometimes it's time to reevaluate yourself. It's like well, and the reason why I say that, Aaron, is because we all know that bodybuilding is a very selfish sport. Everything falls to the wayside. You have to ice, if you do it right, you're isolating yourself from everything. Family, friends, parties, food, everything. And to continue to do that as you get older, to me, there has to be a certain there has to be a certain part of you as you get older that it's time to kind of give back. You know? And it's time to, okay, spend some time with family. Spend some time with grandchildren. If you don't have family or grandchildren, maybe coaching and helping people. At the gym I go to, there is a there are personal trainers that um uh train there's a they train autistic kids, you know, and just give back something instead of constantly being the center of your life. I I just don't find fulfillment in that.
SPEAKER_03Well, what about you how much of their life before that was given to this? I don't yeah, I don't know that I guess because I know some guys in their 50s who still want to turn pro, and they're wonderful people, and they've already set their life up, right? They already own businesses, and I know them, they're very generous. Like, I I just have another friend who wanted to start a business, and the guy gave them something more than 50 grand, I don't know how much, but like, right, like start this business, right? Like, so like they're giving back, but he already set himself up. It's very different. Like when I was chasing a pro card, I didn't have shit to my you were a young man, yeah. So I was totally self-consumed because I was Eric too, he was a very young man, yeah. But you have a family, right? And uh, right you could say that, yeah. You could say that, you could say that.
SPEAKER_01I don't have kids, I'm married, and you know, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03I mean, I didn't, I'm just saying, like, I was floundering, right? So, like, I was not giving back, right? So I think it depends on it depends on the person. I I see the point you're making, but I think that uh it's very individualistic. People get into this sport at different times and seasons in their life, and um I don't know, it it it wears a little bit different on everybody, right? Like, but I I know the point you're making of like when it's you know, maybe some people just want to get the card just because just for just for fucking fun, man. You know, they just like hey, it's what I want to do. Like, I don't really drink, I don't do this, like who knows? But I I get it because to me, like I even now I'm 38, and like I don't really want to push it like I did when I was 23, you know.
SPEAKER_01So but you so you're not competing anymore, but you educate people, right? Like you have your Instagram following and you you educate people, and that's what I mean by by giving back. You know, you don't you could stay in the sport and revel be relevant in the sport and and and not have it everything revolving around you. I just you know, maybe it may I went through a period of time. All right, so here's my train of thought, okay? I don't think I'm a good person. I do, I think I'm a piece of shit. And I got to a certain age where I was like, I can't stay a fucking piece of shit forever. I I have to start giving back. I am not the center of the universe. And I don't get me wrong, there are times where I slip and I fall back into that, but then I have to realize, okay, I have responsibilities, I am not the center of my universe anymore. There's other people that depend on me, like my wife, my mother, you know, the people at my job, so on and so forth. And I've when I did put myself first, everything else was ruined. Relationships, family, everything else was ruined. And I and I had to take a strong hard look, and I'm not just talking about bodybuilding, I'm you know, there were other elements too, right? But I had to take a strong hard look at myself and reevaluate myself and say, if I continue on this path, I'm gonna be alone, I am going to be uh uh not fulfilled as a person, and I I I need to start giving back and taking responsibility and making people around me like the fact that they could depend on me because that's what a man is when people can come to you during times of crisis and depend on you, yeah, not go, sorry, I can't make it. I I I gotta meal prep. I gotta chop up broccoli. I'm 55 years old, I gotta chop up broccoli, and I just I can't wrap my head around it anymore, you know. I know, I know, I know.
SPEAKER_03No, I it's valid. I think that anytime being around this has really taught me too that um there's a lot of people in bodybuilding that's they're extreme, yeah, and don't know how to compartmentalize aspects of their life, they can't even talk about other topics, right? And so it's unbelievable. I'm not saying that you when you when you prepare for a show, those last 12 weeks, we'll say 16 weeks, right? We'll even say 20. Those last 20 weeks, like, yeah, you're not gonna be at your best for the rest of the world.
SPEAKER_01Well, that's five months out of the year, if you realize that. It's five 20 weeks is five months.
SPEAKER_03For a while, it is, but I'm saying, like, if if you you know, if you've been doing this a while, you shouldn't be completely decapacitated for 20 weeks, right? Which is well, let's say 12, right? Right. Like I've met people that they are able to, you know, for every you know, up to the last part, they're able to have some semblance of balance. And I've also met people who can't, right? Right, right, right. And so like they have to there's a fork in the road, like you're saying. Like, I have to decide, I'm either going to like put everything on the altar to this thing, like every, like my whether that's the people I love, you know, the other things I love, whatever it is, and I'm gonna burn it for this, right? Or right, or I quit. So, not quit, but you know what I mean. Like, you're not gonna compete and so I don't know, it it's it's subjective, man, but it it is a valid point, and I think that uh it takes some awareness to to be conscious of that. I I think everyone should be aware of the effect you know that it has on their life, and uh it's pros and cons, man.
SPEAKER_01Right, right, right, yeah, yeah. Eric, give me a last opinion and I'll let you guys go because I'm already talking about it.
SPEAKER_00If you can't talk about anything else except bodybuilding, just get hyper-focused, and then you know, the day of the show comes, you got all this anxiety. It's I think it's good to have balance with other shit.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_01But you said we when when we we first came on, you said you don't have all your eggs in one basket. Remember that? What did you mean by that?
SPEAKER_00Like I worked in my business up until three days out from the show, two days out.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_00Every day.
SPEAKER_01What kind of what kind of business is that?
SPEAKER_00Pressure washing.
SPEAKER_01Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_00All right, nice, nice, yeah. You know, like McDonald's and a bunch of businesses.
SPEAKER_01Oh, that's great. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. Exactly. It's um it becomes I've noticed that a lot of people too, they trade one addiction in for the next. I've noticed a lot of people in the industry were either, and I've noticed a lot with the girls too, right? The girls especially, they were had these wild lifestyles, multiple men, drugs, alcohol, and then they kind of find bodybuilding, and and it's obviously a good thing, uh, because I'm kind of trying to flip the script a little bit, right? Uh, you know, because I wasn't talking bad about it for a second. But the other side is that there are people that find bodybuilding and it actually pulls them out of uh a terrible lifestyle, right? Uh and I oh, you were like that, yeah. And I've I've seen I especially seen that with with women, especially with women. I've seen that a lot, and they just go from you know one extreme to the next. And believe me, if I had to choose, you know, if I had a daughter who was, you know, uh, and I had to choose between my daughter being a bodybuilder or of uh or a drug addict, obviously I'm gonna choose bodybuilding.
SPEAKER_03That's kind of both, though, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I yeah, you're actually right. Yeah. But um, what do you uh okay? What were you gonna say, Aaron? And you were uh you you were in that position.
SPEAKER_03Well, yeah, I mean, I I struggled with drugs and eating disorders and all that, right? So like I think that it's it's an extreme, has a lot of aspects of almost like a cult, right? Like, when do you eat? What are you allowed to do, right? We we train at this time, right? And then we show our work at this time, right? Right, yeah, like you don't it it takes away, it gives you a reason, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it gives you a purpose instruction.
SPEAKER_03They can't find a reason to not do whatever they do, right? Their thing is however they want to destroy themselves, right? It's like it's too strong, they need a bigger why, and so yeah, bodybuilding can be a why, also because you're basically naked, like everything that you've done is shown, right? So it's like uh yeah, you have to be um you have to live in a in congruence with that goal, right?
SPEAKER_01Because yeah, no, absolutely, it's uh it's it's a strange world, but it's kind of an addicting fun world, you know. It really is. All right, gentlemen, I'm gonna let you go. Thank you very much for coming on. Uh muscle talk. As we get closer and closer to the Olympia, now if you guys want, it's up to you. The only show that I do like a live feed during uh is the Olympia. Uh so if you guys want to hop on, but we're talking, you don't have to stay on for the whole thing because it's hours. If you guys during the Olympia want to hop on, well, unless you guys are gonna be there, if you're gonna be there, that's obviously I get it. But even if you're like Lee comes on if it's if he's in when he's in his hotel room and you want to come on and like uh commentate and talk about uh the Olympia while it's going on, you know. Uh believe me, I'm gonna send out messages to all you guys. Um, that's usually the uh a fun part, but you don't have to stay for the whole thing because it's fucking two nights of who wants to watch the wellness girls? It's like Jesus Christ, you know. But um classes, yeah. But it's uh it's it's usually pretty fun. It gets lots of views, and um you can come and go as you want, like you can, you know, you don't have to stay, but I'll definitely reach out. Uh, and that's it, gentlemen. Thank you very much for coming on, fellas. Yeah, thanks for having us. All right, guys. I'll talk to you soon.
SPEAKER_02All right, later, you guys.