Get ready to challenge your preconceptions as we plunge headfirst into a whirlpool of controversial topics that will make you question what you thought you knew. Together with our insightful guest, Andrew Isker, we'll dissect the damaging fallout of false accusations using Trevor Bauer's case as an example, and expose the sobering reality of how such unfounded claims can erode our faith in justice, and ultimately hurt genuine victims. We'll also shine a light on the distressing impacts of demographic replacement, catalyzed by the current immigration policies, and how this upheaval is sparking factionalism and political discord in our society.
Engage with us as we scrutinize the far-reaching effects of societal and economic shifts on traditional family structures and throw light on the struggles of starting a family in an industrialized economy. Packed with actionable insights, we'll explore creative solutions to these challenges, such as starting a side business or seeking multi-generational help, that can help you thrive in this new normal. We'll also talk about Andrew's new book, The Boniface Option, and what it means for society today.
Finally, join us as we redefine the narrative on Christian nationalism, and assert its importance in building a positive vision for Christianity. We will also assess the disruptive impacts of the Biden administration's immigration and assimilation policies and discuss potential solutions to help us regain social harmony. Be a part of our conversation to reimagine Christianity, reclaim biblical masculinity, and reestablish a more harmonious society.
This episode promises to be a riveting journey that will make you question, challenge and ultimately, redefine your perspectives. So gear up and join us for this rollercoaster ride into the heart of controversy and change.
Talk to Joe Garrisi about managing your wealth.
Sign up for Barbell Logic.
Place your meat order with Salt & Strings.
Start banking with Private Family Banking. You can reach Private Family Banking Partner, Chuck DeLadurantey at chuck@privatefamiliybanking.com, call him directly at 830-339-9472, or download his e-book HERE.
10 Ways to Make Money with Your MAXX-D Trailer.
Get your chicks at IdealPoultry.com.
Get ready to challenge your preconceptions as we plunge headfirst into a whirlpool of controversial topics that will make you question what you thought you knew. Together with our insightful guest, Andrew Isker, we'll dissect the damaging fallout of false accusations using Trevor Bauer's case as an example, and expose the sobering reality of how such unfounded claims can erode our faith in justice, and ultimately hurt genuine victims. We'll also shine a light on the distressing impacts of demographic replacement, catalyzed by the current immigration policies, and how this upheaval is sparking factionalism and political discord in our society.
Engage with us as we scrutinize the far-reaching effects of societal and economic shifts on traditional family structures and throw light on the struggles of starting a family in an industrialized economy. Packed with actionable insights, we'll explore creative solutions to these challenges, such as starting a side business or seeking multi-generational help, that can help you thrive in this new normal. We'll also talk about Andrew's new book, The Boniface Option, and what it means for society today.
Finally, join us as we redefine the narrative on Christian nationalism, and assert its importance in building a positive vision for Christianity. We will also assess the disruptive impacts of the Biden administration's immigration and assimilation policies and discuss potential solutions to help us regain social harmony. Be a part of our conversation to reimagine Christianity, reclaim biblical masculinity, and reestablish a more harmonious society.
This episode promises to be a riveting journey that will make you question, challenge and ultimately, redefine your perspectives. So gear up and join us for this rollercoaster ride into the heart of controversy and change.
Talk to Joe Garrisi about managing your wealth.
Sign up for Barbell Logic.
Place your meat order with Salt & Strings.
Start banking with Private Family Banking. You can reach Private Family Banking Partner, Chuck DeLadurantey at chuck@privatefamiliybanking.com, call him directly at 830-339-9472, or download his e-book HERE.
10 Ways to Make Money with Your MAXX-D Trailer.
Get your chicks at IdealPoultry.com.
This episode of the Hard Men Podcast is brought to you by Salt and Strings Butchery Order your custom beef bundle. Today, it's also brought to you by Private Family Banking, helping Christians take dominion through privatized banking. And finally, today's episode is brought to you by Backwards Planning Financial building, multi-generational wealth with Joe Garrisey. Well, welcome to this episode of the Hard Men Podcast. I'm your host, eric Kahn, and joined by Dick Buckus himself. We've got Mr Andrew Isker, my favorite Minnesota, and Andrew, just you know. First of all, welcome to the show. I know that your Vikings are horrible.
Speaker 2:You know there's battles in the Broncos. Quite frankly, yeah, only a little bit better. I think they have a one win.
Speaker 1:One whole win. We beat the Bears and they were like I think we gave like 300 yards passing to Justin Fields, who was like one of the worst in the league.
Speaker 2:That would be worst.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So to my guy, Andrew Isker, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2:Thank you. Thank you so much for having me, Mr Eric Kahn.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely, andrew, we are going to jump in. I thought we'd start with the sports thing, and the sports thing is. I was fascinated by the story because it's an issue that I talk about a lot women's sin. Maybe we shouldn't believe all women. Just the other day, you remember the story with the Dodgers pitcher, trevor Bauer. Trevor Bauer, yeah, trevor is a piece of filth. He's been vilified in the news media. He's assaulted women. Only one problem Everything comes out after court and discovery and it turns out she lied, she made it up.
Speaker 1:She said she made it up to destroy him and to steal his money. Andrew, obviously this first time in history that we found out a woman lied about something sexual in this manner. I'm sure you were shocked. I'm sure you were shocked.
Speaker 2:I was. I was beside myself. I couldn't contain my disbelief when I discovered what happened.
Speaker 1:I mean it is actually sickening Andrew, when you think about like a Syong award-winning pitcher two years of his career, he'll never get back. Nobody seems to be in line to apologize to him like sorry, we smeared you. People have received to this. By the way, espn and others have slandered the guy.
Speaker 2:Well, and there were reporters that had access to info from her that exonerated him and they still lied. And I mean he is, he could get some defamation money.
Speaker 1:I can't remember the newspaper. It was a big one, it was like the Miami Herald or somebody like this, yeah, yeah, one of the things. Had information. The reporter had the information that he did not in fact choke this lady, that she made it up, but they still published that he choked her.
Speaker 2:It's hard to sue for defamation, but he's probably got a case there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when it's actually in writing and we all have a record of it. So I want to ask you about that, Just as you think about that case. I'm particularly interested whether kind of the me too bent of our culture wakes up and changes at all. I kind of don't think so, but it seems like especially a lot of young people young men are like watching this very closely, Even guys like Sernovich, like they were all over this. They were like this guy's been completely wronged.
Speaker 2:That's the first place I saw. It was when he retweeted it. And so I think to your question here is this going to change? Not the overarching culture and the media or anything like that. They're not going to keep doing these things.
Speaker 2:I mean you see it all over the place. I mean I think back to Kavanaugh right, did anyone suffer any consequences for lying about him? No, there's not going to be any consequences for it. Even Major League Baseball right, they kick him out without any due process or evidence, things like this he just lied about and smeared and his reputation is ruined forever. And yeah, two years. I mean you only have so much time. It's a very short career, you have a short window, yeah, and he's at the very peak of it and he loses it. It's gone. It is so disgusting. So I think I mean the thing is the people see it like people that listen to us and kind of in our world, they see it and what ends up happening? I mean, one of the difficult things is like I think about I have daughters. If something happened to them, you know things can go from one ditch to the other very quickly, and what this does, what false accusations do, is it makes it harder for when something's genuine and real, for people to believe them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you get where nobody actually believes the woman, even if it is true Boy cries wolf enough times and no one believes them.
Speaker 2:And so I mean that's a possibility. I don't think we're anywhere near that. But that's what this kind of stuff does and that's why it's also so heinous is because people who are genuinely victims are less likely to be believed too. I mean it's multifaceted, it's both ways, but it's so disgusting, it's so sick and, yeah, you see these things in our culture again and again, and again, and you just you wonder, and it causes you to wonder, like what am I being lied about to all the time, right? What are they? What are they telling me? That are lies that I? It causes you to just be skeptical, right, because all these things end up being lies. It's hard to live your life so cynically and skeptically, but that's that's the world we're in today, where everything is a lie. So you have to take everything you hear on the TV or in the news with a total grain of salt. Oh yeah, completely.
Speaker 1:It seems like too pastorally. There's a lesson in here. We found this for years, but it's like you have even in David's day under Saul's regime. You have all these men who are disaffected, and a lot of young men in particular. It seems really important for pastors to be picking up on these notes too and saying things like we do actually have to address the fact that women sin, women lie. Eve sinned, you know, Potiphar's wife falsely accused Joseph like. These things aren't new, but what I think in our moment, like if you want to win the young men and they want to rally the troops and and we'll get into this with your book as well, with the Boniface option if you want to build something that is better than trash world, you're going to need the strength of the young men to do that. And so it seems like, if nothing else, being brave pastorally as a leader, whatever capacity you're in, but especially pastors, to say like no, this is, this is really a problem. Young men, some of them, are being destroyed by this type of woman.
Speaker 2:Oh, absolutely. And with women like this, but also, even aside from this stuff, they're being destroyed in every other way as well. They're being actively shut out from the mainstream economy. They're being made lower status just by virtue of being men, and so it's everywhere. There's this thing. Especially young men feel this right. They go to apply for the big corporate job and they don't have enough diversity, credentials to be able to get it. And even if they're, everything is impeccable.
Speaker 2:I tell a story about a young guy that I knew where he was a double major, had a 4.0 in both majors and every extracurricular, every single thing, and he wanted to go to med school. Takes the MCAT, gets a top 90th percentile score or higher, I think, and he goes to apply for all the like five or six med schools and he gets denied by all of them. But there's a gal in his pre-med class who was like a B student and it had an okay MCAT score. She got into like five out of the six that he applied for and it's like, wait a second, why didn't he get into the med school? And then it also makes you think about the doctors you do go see, wait, did you get into the med school on diversity your requirements.
Speaker 1:Or did you?
Speaker 2:get it because you're actually competent and it's like, and it isn't just the medical, it's everything, it's everywhere where it's like no, well, that's like we got too many white guys so we got to bump up the stats a little bit.
Speaker 2:But yeah, I mean sure that guy's I mean you see this with what's his name in, like Fort Worth, the megachurch, x29, pastor Chandler, right, where he's like we got the Anglo eight here and the POC seven. We're going to go with the POC seven and like you just set it out loud you know, it's like usually they don't say it out loud and so you see this and you think that is so, so evil, right, and every young guy sees this stuff and knows that you are a second class citizen in your own country and a despised person just by virtue of who you are and and yeah, so you're going to have just a sea of disaffected young men, like any young guy who is aware of what is going on in the world and what is happening to them specifically. There's going to be anger and angst, like I think you probably saw the the review of my book by Roger Eir.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I want to ask you about well, because it was so good.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was a great review and all you have to say about me is like, yeah, this appears that that Andrew Isker is, you know, his early 30s and he's a young guy. I'm 37. I'm almost 30. That I'm not that young anymore. And he's a young guy and he's angry and the book is all about hate, hate, hate, disgust, filth, trash. He's an angry young man and I'm thinking like, okay, Rod, well, not everybody gets to slurp oysters and hungry all day long While abandoning their family, yeah, yeah, like no.
Speaker 2:The young men should be angry, right, they should be angry about what's happening and what's what's been done to them. And you, yeah, you brought up the situation of Israel during the time of Saul. There are all of these disaffected young men. You know some of them near to well, some of them not such great guys and others who are, and they all rally around David. Right, who is this fugitive? He's this guy who's on the fringes in the cave of Adulam, and they're like that's our guy, right, he's gonna, he's gonna fix things for us, right, that's that's what happens. And and so I see, yeah, like you said, a similar circle set of circumstances where there are, there's a sea of disaffected young men who realize the rotten deal that they've gotten.
Speaker 2:And you know, honestly, I think a reason why the book has has resonated with a lot of people, a lot of angry young men, is because they see it and they feel it, they know it and they, like pastors, don't talk about this stuff Like they're. They're the pastor at their Big Eva church. All he has to say is how they need to man up, right, you just need to man up and work harder. You need to marry. You know Jesus wants the rose. You need to go marry the single mom and like that. That's what God wants you to do.
Speaker 2:Like that's that's all they get told all day long is how defective they are. And never once has it said this world's really messed up, and it's really messed up at your expense, particularly, and I understand what you're going through, I understand what's happening to you and here, here's what you got to do to make it better. Like they don't get any message like that whatsoever and and so what? Yeah, what I try to do in the book is say listen, it's bad, things are bad. You're not imagining it, you're not going crazy, it's as bad as you think it is. Now, here's what you need to do to make it better for you personally and collectively, for all of our people.
Speaker 1:Our sponsor, Private Family Banking Partners, is on a mission to help Christians live out the Dominion mandate by making a stealth-like move away from the mainstream banks and into their own privatized banking system. This innovative system is designed to guarantee uninterrupted compound interest and tax-free growth without exposure to typical stock market risks. To join this growing community that is already building wealth into future generations and converting post-mill talk into post-mill action, contact Private Family Banking Partner Chuck De Lauderante at his email chuck at privatefamilybankingcom Again, that's Chuck at privatefamilybankingcom To set up an appointment and to receive a free copy of Chuck's new book. Protect your Money Now how to Build Multigenerational Wealth Outside of Wall Street and Avoid the Coming Back Banking Meltdown. Go to the link in the show notes for more information.
Speaker 1:Do you desire to be shrewd financially for the sake of your family and future generations? Well, we know that a robust society depends on getting this right Success in building and passing on personal wealth. Let's be mature, responsible leaders with the resources God expects us to turn a profit on To love our children and children's children. Well, Joe Garrisie, with Backwards Planning, Financial integrates, investments, debt insurance, tax strategies and legacy planning in a holistic approach, coaching his clients to act wisely, you can do better than you received. You can affect your family trajectory and maximize your efforts to set up long-term fruitfulness. Joe starts with your values and goals, then provides impactful counsel to help you form and implement your financial plan. Click on the link in the description for Backwards Planning Financial and contact Joe today to get started.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's really helpful in a good place to unpack for young guys that like, hey, there's real problems but there's also a positive strategy that we can lay out as well. So in the book, the Boniface Option, this is a strategy for Christian counteroffensive in a post-Christian nation, Kind of start with. Just why write this book? Obviously young men and problems in society. What motivated you to start writing and putting this together? I?
Speaker 2:mean some of it is, like I said, like nobody's talking about this stuff. I mean I shouldn't say nobody, Like you are and a few others are, but very, I mean, we're just a tiny little small number of people in the, you know, much wider sea of Christian pastors in our country and so very few people are talking about any of this stuff. And so I'm like, well, I need to say it, I need to put into words how I feel about these things and what exactly is wrong, because a lot of people can feel it and they can agree, yes, something's wrong, but they can't really articulate exactly where things are off. Like you see, I mean everybody sees like the drag queen story hour and you know, kids being sexualized in schools and all of that, and the genital mutilation and all of those things. But like, so, like okay, that's bad, that's really wrong. And then it stops there. They're like, how did it get like this? Oh, this is crazy. And they don't ponder for a second. Alright, it didn't just like appear out of nowhere.
Speaker 2:Right, there's a long process to bring us to this point, to create the conditions for this to happen, and, and so it's. It's laying this out. What? How did we get there? How did these things happen?
Speaker 2:What, what went wrong 50, 60, 100 years ago to bring us to this point? And how do we need to think about, you know, all of the supposed progress that has been made throughout the 20th century right to begin to roll these things back, and and the I mean the first step is just admitting no, this isn't good, like the things that happened in our country, in our society, have not been good. They have not been good for for us and for for our people and for our families. And so if you begin to reorient your thinking and other people do too and then you can have a sea change where you can at least have a vanguard of people who are beginning to fight against this stuff, and not just fight against the drag queen story or on all the things that are the most obvious, but all the things that underlie all of that as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and one of the places you start that I found pretty helpful is with the economic emasculation we talked a lot about on our shows with King's Hall and other stuff, that a lot of the problem is actually that the tyranny is being basically applied to everyone through like an HR department and economically people are being crushed. It was that people lost their jobs for not getting the jab. You know is that sort of thing. So I guess, start unpacking. For me, economic emasculation, this is one of the places you start. But why start here? I think a lot of people don't and I think it was wise you did. But just why?
Speaker 2:Because I think that undergirds most of it is what ultimately drives what people do is their pocketbook, right, what you know, why do you live the way you do? I have to in order to make money, right, I have to in order to have a job. I have to live this way in order to survive. And so, right, just peeling that onion back a little bit and asking, well, why do we live in this particular way that we do currently is what's necessary. You know, and I know you guys talk about this.
Speaker 2:It's crazy to me that you can go for really all of human history, everywhere where you have households, right, when you have a household where there's a father and he's the head of his household and he's got his wife and all of his children and he's the one that goes and works. You know, usually he's a farmer or some kind of laborer related to agriculture and that's how he provides for his household. His wife has kids and raises them and takes care of the home. And that was the arrangement, you know, the household economic arrangement for virtually all of human history, until the 20th century, right, and that's only changed very recently, and there's a few reasons for that. I mean one is you have now an industrialized economy where you don't require, you know, brute strength in order to do labor right. You can do work with your brain and you don't need to have big giant muscles to do stuff right. And so then it's like well, we can have women work too. That'll be great. We'll double our economic production if we just add women to the workforce, and then GDP goes way up and we all profit, isn't that so wonderful. And meanwhile the entire household suffers.
Speaker 2:Meanwhile, children grow up without mothers in the traditional sense and they're raised by strangers at daycare and then at, you know, at public school. And that economic activity, which it was right we monetize it now, was produced in the home before, and now it's outsourced to strangers and other people and we've suffered societally because of that. Right. Children are not raised by their mothers at home, and that ruins the society. And as well, birth rates go way, way down. Right, because daycare is expensive. It costs money. And so, right, if and people do the economic calculation well, my wife can make X number of dollars. And if we have, if we have, eight kids and they all have to go to, you know, the younger, four or five of them have to go to daycare. Well, we can't afford that, and so you don't have them.
Speaker 2:Right, that's what's happened in virtually every industrialized country on the planet and regardless of you know what they are, what their you know ethnic makeup or culture or religion, it is like they all are like this, even Iran, and they have, like they have a below replacement level birth rates and it's supposed to be the austere Muslim country that oppresses women and so like that's, that's a big part of it. And so you know, people may be able to ask me like are you saying we shouldn't have an industrial economy, that we should all go be Amish and churn butter all day and things like that? And it's like well, no, but I think you can. You can have the industrial production and retain a traditional society of having households, but it requires. It requires everyone implicitly understanding that that's a priority.
Speaker 2:And that's the difficulty there, right? People don't prioritize those things. They would much rather have a whole bunch of money and to be able to go on vacations and buy expensive things and have a bigger, bigger house. And the problem now that we're running into is, instead of having just extra money and money you're able to put away into savings and retirement and everything else. Now you need that second income just to survive, right? Just to be able to afford a home, right?
Speaker 2:You look at the like, the median house price in the United States is well over $400,000.
Speaker 2:And it's like a single family income is not going to be able to pay for that for most people. Like you're not making 200K, but maybe you and your wife are and you can afford a nice house in the suburbs. Now that's where things are at, where the income level is either stagnant or declining relative to inflation, and it's not like they're going to come up with some solution to stop spending money and printing money. The rubber is meeting the road where this system isn't going to work anymore. And people see this, especially young people. They see this like how am I ever going to be able to afford a home? I'm going to have to make $300,000 a year in order to have a family and have if I want to have, six or seven kids, I need to make that much money. And the boomer will be like well then, go ahead and make it. The Dave Ramsey will just eat rice and beans and it's like no, you can't put your strap your way out of this macroeconomic situation.
Speaker 1:Well, it's crazy too, because I know there was a guy we were talking to recently and this was like in the 80s, so he's an older guy, but he was, I think. He said he was working for UPS in the 80s, just driving a truck, and he said, yeah, in like 1983, he said I bought a house and the house was $30,000 less than my annual salary. And so you put that together and you're like you look at that generational and you're like wait a minute but we had 20% interest rates.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, no. It's like yeah, for like a year, like two years, and then it went back down. You know, yeah, yeah, people have no idea.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're right. It's like you have to recognize, like these economic realities. You have to realize what people are up against. Families have to start strategizing.
Speaker 1:And even there was a time where I was probably more critical this is probably 10 years ago or something but I was like more, dave Ramsey is like well, people need to stop living so lavishly. Well, you know, some of that is obviously true. Obviously, you can always outspend your budget. But then when you are being frugal and you're trying to raise a family and you realize, like you know we're here in Ogden, it's like a average price house would be between five and $650,000 average in the suburbs and you're like, wait a minute like even if you make six figures, you're like that's still like many, many years worth of all of your annual salary. So it's like assuming you don't like have living expenses or something. So yeah, I mean people are going to have this problem.
Speaker 1:And then the other thing that I think is helpful in the second part of the book you talk about you know masculine economics. So this is again, this is what's helpful, recognizing Trash World, now saying like, okay, let's do something about this. I know you guys, like with GAB, you talked a lot about parallel economy. What is the positive vision here for guys in terms of like what do you do about this? I mean some of it is.
Speaker 2:Some of it's, a lot of it is outside of your own hands. Right, you aren't going to be able to change your macroeconomic situation that you're in single handedly, but you have to. You have to, like you said, strategize in the front end, like and recognize the reality where you're. Yeah, if you're 23 years old and you have a girlfriend, you want to get married and think about, all right, here's the vision that I want to have. I want to, I want to work, I want you to stay home with the kids. Here's what housing costs, here's the amount of money I need to make. And then you know, build up from there and recognize that you know you might, you might have to live a life of relative poverty for the first 10 or 15 years of of of your life, which is extremely difficult, like you have to go in with your eyes open and understand that that life for you is very difficult right now and no one is making it easier. No one has any, any, any clear designs to make it any easier. And you, you have to A, recognize that and then, b, build things out from there and and figure that out Like, maybe, maybe it means, like having a having a side business and building, you know, building your own business that you can grow and have the kind of income that you want.
Speaker 2:It might mean, you know, it might mean all sorts of things People are having are being forced to get creative now. It might mean living with your parents for a while until you do get married and just saving up money. It might. It might mean having yeah, having to live in poverty if you want to have a family. It's not the, it's not the option that you know. Anyone wants to hear, but you might have to. My wife, that's what we did, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I haven't even thought about that. My wife and I it was like, I think, for the first seven years of marriage, like we were making like under $25,000 a year, and it's like you can do it. It's not good, it's not pretty, but I also think one of the things looking forward, as we've said, with our kids, is, like we are going to help you. Like this is not a project that can be overcome with, like, if you have multi-generational help and if parents, you know, listen to this, like you should be plotting how to help your kids. Maybe, you know, we even said, like we're going to buy a little more house now so that, like, even if they get married, like there's space where the kids could live. It wouldn't be the best thing in the whole world, you know, admittedly, but it's like you could get your feet underneath you and save some money and and and you know, have at least a good trajectory to start.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, and you see this with like prior generations, where I mean I remember there was the I think he was trolling, but it was like the like Jesse Kelly is tweet rum. I want my kid turns 18, I'm gonna kick him out of the house and have him live on his own. You know, and like I'm done. Now you go do your own thing, go be an RV salesman or whatever, right and and and it's like it was. It was so atrocious, you know, but that's like the mindset that the previous generations have had what's like, well, nobody helped me, nobody helped me and I'm like, well, okay, but how do you end that generational cycle of nobody helping? They should have helped you, that's the thing they should have and they didn't, but you still should help your kids. You should do this instead of instead of thinking, oh, I can't wait to have my nice retirement where I can go play, you know, go, go play pickleball all day, you know it's. It's like, well, maybe you need to stay where you are and and instead of buying a second home, you know you help your, your kid, find them like that Some of it is is trying to do as much intergenerational stuff as possible and that might that like that generation to like they are.
Speaker 2:They are what they are and it's difficult to change their entire mindset. But I mean, some of it, too, is like I have kids and I thought the same thing that you do too. It's like we have to be ready to be able to help them out when they're, when they're older. I mean, some of it is even like man, like I see how much people spend on weddings. They spent like 20k on weddings. It's like you could do this, you, yeah, you could do this for $1000 and just give them that cash to buy a home and they're gonna need it, right, why? Why are you? Why are you? Why are you spending Three grand on a dress that you're gonna wear once? That's insane. Right, that's nuts, yeah, that's. That's, that's banana, that's like okay, but I mean, maybe if you're your millionaires, okay, you can do whatever you want, but, like if you are normal person, don't do that. Don't, that's insane, don't do that.
Speaker 2:So things like that, like you have to, you have to begin to to deal with reality, as it is not how you you wish it would be, and so, yeah, in current year and trash world, starting a family is difficult and I think young people recognize this. But it's not impossible, right, it's not impossible and you could find help. I mean, especially if you, you have a good church where people will help you and recognize the, the place that you're at and Especially in with like careers and business and things like that. Like having a church with a broad network of people, having you know, knowing people that own businesses that you could go work for, that is it. That is incredibly important.
Speaker 2:It isn't finding a nice church is good. Like you know you need, you need to know people and they need to know you and know that like yeah, this young guy might be a good employee and you can, you can have like that's how people get careers is because of who they know it's. It's like the cliche cliche of cliches is you know it's who you know, but it really is. And so Developing networks of people and those networks are growing and building like I, I know you've talked to, you know my friends in Dallas with new founding, like being connected to them. Like those are guys that are building parallel institutions as well. Like they, they want Businesses for you know conservative Christian America and having that network and it's incredibly difficult because of like civil rights laws and things like that, where you can't be like we're only hiring Christian people, like you're not allowed to do that, but you are able to.
Speaker 2:You know, I have your network right that that's, that's allowed. Still, it's not totally illegal yet, and so they they're building things like that, and so I think that's how you counter some of the macro level Problems. Is is getting connected to the right people that are building the right things and it can be done.
Speaker 1:Yeah that's really helpful, andrew. One of the other things I want to ask you about the book is just overall how has it been received? Curious on sales. And then I'm gonna ask you more about Roger are you biggest fan?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, you know it's been received really well. We've sold I think we're over 5000 copies. I haven't asked Torba yet where we're at. I haven't asked him in a while, but I think we're we're. If we haven't crossed that threshold yet, we should be very soon and and that is you know that's doing really well for a book.
Speaker 2:I mean, you're in publishing. You know how few books sell like the average book is like. I think it sells less than 100 and from like an actual publisher. And so you know, rather than than than smaller print groups and even from you know publishing companies like yours or the one I'm with with gab press Right, you're talking like random house, like this average one sells like 100 and so if you sell into the thousands, that's, it's a huge, a huge hit and so, yes, it's done extremely well and I think a lot of the you have the initial marketing and everything, but after that it continues to sell and I think it's because it's actually good. It's always hard because it's like oh, so my or buy my book, buy my book and you're gonna love it and a bunch of people will. But then when they actually read it and they're like no, this is good, this is excellent, like I have, like people are. I see people quoting it all the time and sharing you know ideas from it and you know people will message me and email me and say how much they got out of it, and so like that, those kind of things, the reaction to it is way more meaningful. I think. Then, then, like looking at the sales stats, because it's like anybody you know, if you market something well enough, you could sell, you know ice cream to ask a mo's. But if, if it's actually a quality thing that people are getting something out of right, then you know right, then you know I'm making an impact, I'm doing, I'm doing something that's meaningful. All the work I did on this was worth it because it's it's helping people, it's helping put into words, really, how a lot of people are feeling and so, yeah, the overall the reaction to it has been it's been great.
Speaker 2:I mean I know there are some people that are critical of it. I mean it's funny because I'll have all friends, they'll share it with people and like, yeah, my, you know, my friend read part of it and thought this is nuts, like things are not that bad. Right, your life is good. Right, your life, you, you, you got a good, you know job and and all this kind of stuff. Things are not that bad.
Speaker 2:And it's like how can you, how can you say it's not that bad when you look at the? Like, just even like the sociological statistics, like the number I brought this up before and in other places but like the number of out of wedlock births in America is like 40%. We're nearing one, 100 every two kids is born to a single mom right, that's not good. And it's like, yeah, that does have an effect on you, even if your kids are born to married mom and dad. Like that doesn't affect in your entire society, much less all the other, you know lagging indicators, like children getting their generals cut off, right, that like all of these things like what do you mean? It's not bad, it is bad, are you crazy? And so like that, that always. But a lot of that is like there are so many people that are extremely comfortable in the, in their circumstances, and but the number of people that are extremely comfortable gets smaller and smaller and smaller and smaller, and and so I'm always like, yeah, those people like they'll get it, but it'll probably be too late once I get it, but no, the the reaction though, as overall it's been, it's been really good.
Speaker 2:Like I haven't, you know, I haven't had any haters, other than Rod Rear, because and I think he found the book because of the title, you know, because it's a riff on on his book, but I haven't, you know, like big Eva hasn't attacked me or any or any of like the G3 people. They haven't. They haven't. I hope they do. I would love it if they did, but they haven't. They haven't gone that far yet. You know, I guess I need to sell 10,000 before they deem me worthy to to be attacked. But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, drear man, like that, that whole thing is is is just comical to me. If, if, yeah, if we're laughing about it. But if anyone hasn't read it, you definitely need to read his review of it, because it's like and it was a long review and he was just unhinged about it all, he didn't.
Speaker 1:His was on. It was on American conservative, wasn't it?
Speaker 2:No, no, he doesn't write for them anymore. It was on his sub stack.
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it was. It was like three or four thousand words long and it's only like a 35,000 word book, and so he had longer than the book.
Speaker 1:I was like how long is this gonna go, man?
Speaker 2:But yeah, he, he did not. He didn't get it. He didn't get that. We're living in trash world and I think it's easy for him to not get that things are bad because he has a very comfortable life. You know, he is this international man that that gets to enjoy all sorts of comforts and he doesn't see what life is like for regular ordinary people and or or he does, and he's just repressing it. I think that's probably more likely as well. But, but besides him, there haven't been too many negative reviews. I mean, there's, there are the random one-star ones by people that have never read it, that that call me like a Nazi and a fascist and a homophobic. I don't know. There's a crisis run in the middle yeah, there's.
Speaker 2:I mean there's a Ukraine flag on the cover, so that probably sets off certain people as well, but that that'll happen.
Speaker 1:Well, I was gonna say Looking at the cover, so you guys kind of like covered all the bases here. You've got abortion as a human rights sign. You've got I love Fauci. You've got a bearded dude with purple wig and tube top. You got a Ukraine flag, as you mentioned. I Particularly like the woman with the lonely fans.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thanks we had to be careful with trademark yes infringement there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yes, so you're going after all the idols, which you just love to see it. One of the idols you guys have gone after, I know you and CJ, had a pretty good episode recently that I was listening to on demographic replacement, and so I want to ask you about this. This is kind of one of the, I guess, hot button issues. It's. It's really weird to me because you know you could, you can watch videos of this. You can hear Joe Biden talk about it.
Speaker 1:Bill Clinton talked about it for a long time that you know, white people, if you're white in America, you're being replaced and you should applaud. The world is applauding. This is a good thing. So they just actually come out and say that this is happening. But what's so interesting to me about this is, despite the fact that they're saying, this is what we are aiming at, you watch the border. You watch people flooding into the country. We had Kevin Sorbo on here, mr Hercules, and he was even saying he's like also in Minnesota, by the way, oh yeah, well, that's why it's so cool, that's right. But he was saying you know, it's like five X's. You know, I think there was like a million people during Trump came in through immigration. You know, biden is like five plus million now.
Speaker 2:Whatever that's so low ball number. It might be closer to 10.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, this is like what people are willing to say and it's probably incorrect, you know, yeah, so. So then you think about this and you're like, okay, so clearly happening. You live near Minneapolis, I mean, you've been there obviously. Yeah, I have a few times little Somalia and you go to places like this and you're like, okay, there's something clearly happening. But when you talk about these things, particularly the evangelical establishment is furious, like how could you, andrew, be a conspiracy theorist who believes in demographic replacement?
Speaker 2:Ah, because it's happening like they. It's a clear agenda, right, like they, you see this. Like they talk. There was a video From Joe Biden this week where he's saying like yeah, you know, white people, you're gonna be a minority, but we're gonna still treat you okay, don't worry about it, it's like yeah, you know what, you're gonna be a majority, but it's all right, don't worry, we got worked out for South Africa, it'll be fine, nothing to worry about, and it's like that is, that's nuts man, and and and so like you're, but you're, yeah, you're not allowed to talk about it.
Speaker 2:You know, if you, I think I remember you know Owen Strayen was on one of his unhinged rants about Steven Wolf a few months ago, and this is back when he he followed me at one at one point.
Speaker 1:Don't you get unfollowed.
Speaker 2:I blocked and, yeah, I guess I guess it doesn't like me anymore. What a rabble rouser, you are, I know, and and so yeah it. And he he was talking about like demographic replacement or the great replacement. It's a conspiracy theory and anyone who believes it as a kinest and as a racist and a Nazi, you know I.
Speaker 1:I delete all his tweets and.
Speaker 2:I can't find it because I'm blocked, right, so I I can't find the verbatim. What he said was big along those lines, right, and and like that's the party line that they hold to both the big Eva and the mid Eva. You know, guys, and? And it's like how can you say such things when they brag about it all day long everywhere that this is the design, this is the plan, and not just the United States, but in you know, I focus on you know, with this stuff, with with Europe as well, like France and Germany, uk, this is the act of design for those places as well.
Speaker 2:They want to bring in tens of millions of Africans and Arabs To replace the population, because the population they're not having children, and they're having children for the same reason we talked about all the before and and the priority of the regime is not to have more kids. Like they could make it easy to have kids. They could do it. Like Hungary, your Roger Ears favorite country. They could do what Hungary does and says okay, after you have four kids, a married couple, you don't have to pay taxes anymore.
Speaker 1:No more income tax for life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's like boy. I would love that. That would be great. I've got five kids, right, I would. I would love to, not, I'd love if my total deduction on all of them was a hundred percent. That'd be great. And a lot more people would be like all right, honey, you're, you're, or if you do go to work, you're gonna work from home and take care of all the kids and we're gonna have Ted, right, you know, like that's what you do to boost the, the birth rate. They don't want to do that. They'd say we want to bring in all of these foreign people. And, of course, what that does and this is, you know we discuss this with and Mike Michael Anton article, where he describes just how how bizarre this is historically, that you've you.
Speaker 2:Traditionally, if you had Immigration and this is the way it was in the United States you would prioritize Assimilation, right. You would prioritize bringing in people that become your people right, where they can adopt your language and traditions and and your way of life and make that as seamless as possible. And everyone understood that. All right, who, who, what kind of people is this easier to do with? They're like, well, it's easier for Western Europeans to come to America and do this right, that those are the people who immigrated throughout the 19th century until the late 19th century, and then it was Eastern Europe and Southern Europe and, Like that was the majority, the immigrants of course you had.
Speaker 2:In the West Coast, you had Chinese, but that's what the priority was was assimilation, and in the 20s, in the mid mid 20th century, all of a sudden, assimilation is evil. That's bad. We want to prioritize Everyone retaining their ethnic heritage and actually you know American history and culture. This is really the most racist, evil country on earth, and so you should actually hate it and really Identify yourself as a person from wherever you came from, and never become American, and that's. That's insane right. If you want to have a stable, cohesive, well-ordered society, you want the people to to become like if, if, if. You and I said, alright, we're done with America, we're gonna move to Japan, and for some reason, the Japanese said we want you to live here and be citizens, which they don't, you know what Japanese people are crazy right and.
Speaker 1:I have thought about moving to Hungary? I don't know what I was saying.
Speaker 2:I mean, I really like sushi. You wouldn't be, you know, considered Japanese. For what? Like five to ten generations, until your children intermarried with the people there and, like you, they literally, generation over generation, become more and more Japanese. Like that's, that's how Assimilation was done, right, and you see this with all sorts of other countries, right, you, you become a Person from that country and your, your posterity does, right, that's, that's how assimilation to here, that's, that doesn't happen, right? We, we bring in, and you, antin, you know estimates like a hundred million people in the 20th century, and they're the second half of the 20th century, hundred million immigrants, and all of them are, the Priority is not assimilation but retaining their, their cultural heritage and and having this multicultural society. Well, all that is is a recipe for factionalism and and political disorder. And what do we have now? Right, that's precisely what we have and you have.
Speaker 2:You basically have these, these war, war among these various different ethnic groups, where they don't consider some themselves first and foremost American. They consider themselves POC's or or Hispanic, or whatever, and it, and that's when, like the boomer, the boomer con Will say, well, identity politics is bad, or you should, you should not do it, and it's like that's. That's not how human beings operate, like they're going to retain the identity unless you Forced them to become Americans. Right, that's the only way, and you're not allowed to do that. So what do you? What do you do? And so, yeah, it's, it's crazy, like so. Even the stuff that we talked about like this would get us kicked out of you know, for the last 10 minutes. You know, get us kicked out of every conservative group and every. You know most of evangelicalism. They would think you're some kind of Wignette, you know, crazy, and it's like I'm not.
Speaker 2:I just said, like here's how you can make foreign people become American. I'm laying out the case of how you could have immigration and make it work. That doesn't sound like, you know, white nationalism. It's what America did in the past and we don't do it any longer, and it's it's a recipe for disaster. And so if you bring in, especially, even in an even greater rate, you bring in 50 million foreign people, and they aren't just from Hispanic countries. There are people flooding in from Africa, right, so somehow they get from Africa to South of the US border and that's how they get it, like the millions of people.
Speaker 2:And and yeah, you like you see, you bring up Minnesota, yeah, you see this, when you go to Minneapolis that there are something around a hundred thousand Somalis and and most of them in the fifth congressional district in in Minneapolis, why we have Ilhan Omar and we're always going to have a Somali congress person, you know, indefinitely, as long as this is the case, because they they vote along ethnic lines. Right, maybe the Republicans they tried this, they tried to have a Republican Somali candidate to oppose or they got like 12% of the vote or something Very effective. Yeah, yeah, the Minnesota GOP is is like the GOP everywhere else. But I mean, you see this, but even even in Minnesota, here there was this, this horrific story Earlier this week about a bunch of illegal immigrants that abducted a girl in gang rafter like an 11 year old girl, and it's like this is in Bemidji, minnesota, a town you know, not much bigger than my tiny little town. That's an outstate Minnesota, and this is, I mean you're talking about as far from the southern border as you can get. I mean they're there and not you could walk to Canada from there and and it's like it's, it's everywhere, like this is by design. What they want to be happening in our, in our country is.
Speaker 2:Is this destruction? I look at this stuff man like and I even in my own town, in when I was in seventh grade, I had a classmate in this town is town 9000. I had a classmate when I was 12 years old who was Raped and murdered by an illegal immigrant in this town and it would have been, it would have been huge national news, but it literally happened the same day as Columbine in 1998. You know, this stuff like hits close to home. That's probably why, like I, have some of the views I have now, because, like I, I've seen it.
Speaker 2:I see that this is not good, that not having a secure border is is Reaping destruction of crime. So, like you, when you see Trump come down the escalator and he says you know Mexico is bringing drugs and rapists and murders, and it's like everyone around here was like, yes, finally someone says it, finally, finally, and that's that's why he got all the votes that he got, why he's so popular, because he, he says these things and You're not allowed to say it. I remember the freak out from big Eva when he's saying this always a racist. He's a racist for saying, for saying things that are obviously true it, yeah, it turns me into a bad boy, like I'm not. You know I'm not well thought of by a lot of people, because I will agree with him that, no, this is a problem that has to be stopped, and You're you're not going to get brownie points from the left If you, if you talk about these things in clear, obvious language.
Speaker 1:Red meat is a staple of a healthy protein pack diet, but not all meat is created equal. That's why I buy my meat from salt and strings butchery. Salt and strings is owned and operated by my friends Quinn and Samantha Bible, and the meat they offer is raised, harvested and processed exclusively in southern Illinois. It's cut and packaged by my friends Quinn and Anthony, and not only is it the best meat I've ever had, well, all their meat is sourced from local farms that share our Christian values. So all the strings is now offering a beef and hog box that can be shipped directly to your door. The 15 pound beef box features 100% black angus beef and includes rib eyes, t-bones, sirloin, chakros, fajita meats and ground beef. You can order your beef box today for just $259. They will send it directly to your door. The hog box is $239 and features premium Durrock pork, including eight thick pork chops one of my all-time favorites pork steaks cured in sliced bacon, ground pork, bratwurst and Breakfast sausage links. You can place your order today at salt and strings calm or use the link in the show notes, and also be sure to follow salt and strings on Instagram. Will also include the link in the show notes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's so interesting too, because even evangelical leaders, the thinking on Immigration is so sloppy. Because even when you think about something like the church, you know the Gentiles come into the church through the proclamation of the gospel and evangelism, but there's the requirement of repentance and it's very clear in the New Testament. It's like you have to completely renounce your old way of life. You know you renounce who you were so that with Paul you could say such were some of you. So you don't live like the world anymore, you don't live like the sinful Gentile anymore. So even then it's like there's a whole citizenship, if you will, in coming into the ecclesiastical body which is the church.
Speaker 1:So it's like, put then, when we talk about evangelism and immigration and how they just work so seamlessly together and they're like, yeah, but you're not actually requiring anybody to become anything different than what they already are. And vice versa. If we said, like if you said, would that be good hospitality for me to go to, even if it was hungry? We go to hungry and it's like I refuse to speak your language, I'm not eating your dishes, I'm not participating in your culture, they'd be like, well, I mean there's the door, but let me vote in your elections and let me tell you how to live.
Speaker 2:It's totally backwards and it makes absolutely no sense. And you can't I don't know. For some of the people you can't even begin to describe the problem. They refuse to admit that there's a problem. It doesn't matter how much crime there is, it doesn't matter how much disorder there is, it doesn't matter how much our politics become what they are.
Speaker 2:You see, like the example of like the state of California was, it was the Florida of America. It was what Florida is now for all of America throughout the 20th century. I mean, this is where Richard Nixon came from and Ronald Reagan came from. This is the most conservative state in the country and because of immigration legal immigration, not just illegal they turned it into the worst state in the country, the like leftist hellhole right, where there's just drugs and crime and little trash everywhere Not where CJ lives, but everywhere else and it's so bad and it's like oh no, that doesn't happen, that's not real. It wasn't immigration, it was just they all decided to become leftists one day, like no, that's not what happened. They demographically replaced the population in that state and now it is what it is.
Speaker 2:That is the paradigm for the entire country. That's what they want all of America to be is like California, and unless people are willing to admit things and be called really nasty, horrible, career-ending names, nothing is going to change. It takes people with backbone to stand up and say no, I would like my country to remain what it was when I was born. I would like it to be a nice place to live. I want it to be a safe, peaceful, prosperous country for my family, and that doesn't mean allowing in 100 million third world people. It cannot, it's bad, and so I think there has to be major change within evangelicalism, and I think it's starting to happen, like the younger generation of leaders is beginning to tell the truth about these things and is not cowed by just the leftist slurs that get thrown out.
Speaker 1:Do you think, Andrew, that part of the reason there's such a strong response against something like Christian nationalism is actually because it's catching on with a lot of these young people?
Speaker 2:Yes, it's funny because they're like oh, it's not a real thing, it's going to die off, it's no big deal and it's just like the emergent church. And it's like then why are you so scared of it? Why are you scared of all these young guys listening to people like me? Why are you so afraid? If it's not a big deal, well then you should just stop talking about it. It'll go away anyway. But no, it is. It is a huge deal. And I think you're right. It's because young people see the problems that are confronting them and no one else is telling them the truth about it. No one else is saying anything that makes any sense. And these guys over here are and I'm told they're really scary, but everything they say is actually pretty rational and they're not crazy people, they're normal, they look normal and I'm going to listen to them. That's what they're afraid of. They're afraid because the standard conservative mantras are dying.
Speaker 2:You see, this week, with the speaker of the house fight, all the Republicans thought that we'll just keep doing business as usual and we'll get away with it and nobody's going to care. And you see, the voting base is totally with Matt Gaetz. They're like, oh, we're going to primary him and it's like everyone loves him. How do you think you're going to primary that guy? He's the only person that's holding anybody accountable in Washington DC to keep their promises. And meanwhile, and they see the things happening on the border and just like today, like the Biden administration is like ah, just kidding, we're actually going to build the wall now.
Speaker 1:Isn't that amazing? Isn't that amazing how?
Speaker 2:that happens, yeah, crazy. No, like they're forced to address these things because the people want something done. And you see that with, like the lady, right, the regular people in churches, right. They see the destruction that is happening to their country and then they hear in the pulpit well, we lose down here and you just need to. We just need to preach the gospel more and that'll fix everything.
Speaker 1:We need to allow for a gay marriage and children. Andy Stanley.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, like that's there. So those are your two options. Are like full on apostasy, like Andy Stanley, or just burying your head in the sand and accepting defeat. And so regular people hear that and they're like I don't want either of those. I'm going to go to the people that at least are willing to fight and have clear, compelling reasons for that. You know, you read, you read Stephen Wolff's book, read my book, and it's like this makes a lot of sense and it's rooted in Christian tradition, it's rooted in biblical theology.
Speaker 2:It isn't just something that was made up five minutes ago. This is something that Christians have believed for centuries. And all the thing that's made up five minutes ago is this postwar liberal consensus after World War Two. It's like oh well, we're just an economic zone here in America. Anyone who wants to there's seven, eight billion people on the planet. If you want to be part of our economic zone, you can. If you want, you just got to get on our magic dirt. And now you're an American. Well, people are fed up with that. They don't want that. That's not an answer to the problems that face them, and so they want answers from somebody else, and so that's why it's this huge threat is to them and it's not going away right, because the political circumstances are not changing overnight, like they're not. We're not going to dial things back to, like you know, 2003. That's not happening, they're. People are going to continue to go to where they could find answers.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's absolutely right and I think it's interesting. As you said, politically there's kind of this twofold thing. I think a lot of Christians are realizing that we have basically no thick political theology and the church hasn't had it. This is kind of what I found somewhat comical even as, like Stephen Wolfe is interactive with, like James White, james White's, you know, coming at it like I can't believe you have this really weird position and Stephen's like it's literally existed for thousands of years.
Speaker 1:This is not new at all. I mean you could disagree with it, but really you have the novel position. You have the new position in the last hundred years. So I think that's part of it too is look, from the time you and I were like seminary and then you know pastoring and doing all that sort of stuff, like people were reporting on this then that there was a return to like confessionalism and orthodoxy and people wanted the historic church. They were tired of grandpa and grandma, mama, dad, they were tired of the Boomer big box church that basically sucked and was shallow, and so I think I only think that trend is going to increase as people are saying. No, I want actually I can read political theology from Samuel Rutherford and Lex Racks or somebody else, and I find that it's actually thick and it's robust, and our great grandfathers were not idiots Like the reason we have a great country if we have anything left of one today is because of them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, and the stuff that they wrote, like you said, it's thick, there's something to chew on, there's something, there's a lot there and we believe in democracy and universal suffrage and civil rights and yada, yada. Like no, it's, and all of that is just out of whole cloth. It's like, well, where in? Where in Christian theology or the Bible, do you get that from Right? Where is this coming from? It's like, well, that's just what we believe, because pluralism is good. And like there's no there, there, and people get that. They see there's, there's just nothing to grab hold of, because then you can go back into hundreds and thousands of years of Christian tradition as it related to the church and the state and political power and so forth, and there's so much there and it is so rich.
Speaker 2:And it's the same thing with with with church generally, whereas you know I know you've talked about this before like Aaron Wren's three-world paradigm, you know, positive world, negative world, neutral world, negative world, and like we're so obviously in negative world and the whole paradigm of the big box evangelical church and very shallow theology and non-existent political theology or any idea of how to engage it for Christians to think about politics is now we're confronted with negative world. You have to. That's not an optional thing, that's not just a convenience, like, oh, you're a political theology nerd, that's cool. That's what you say. I like to watch football, you know? Like no, this is a necessity. You have to do it. You have to answer these questions and think about these questions deeply and that's the direction it's going to go. Right, it's going to be full on apostasy, like Andy Stanley, like, oh yeah, if the gay couple and their kids come to church, we want it to be a warm, affirming welcoming place.
Speaker 2:Well, congratulations, congratulations, you're in the ELCA now you know like you're in an apostate world, like that's how you've answered that question. Also not a new position.
Speaker 1:That's no, it's been around for a long time. Andy, You're late to the party.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you've joined, you made it clear where you're going, and so people are not going to go that direction, and so the only direction left is going to the people who have answers to these questions about negative world and what we do from here. Right, that's where they're going to go. I mean, that's you know largely I bring this up in my book is we're in negative world. You need to personally adapt yourself to negative world. You need to live like you're in negative world and begin to make yourself able to fight, and that includes not just being an individual, but having a community, having a brotherhood, having a tribe of men around you that will protect you and build you up, lift you up. Who are your brothers right In real life, not just on the internet, and that is absolutely crucial to have to just stay sane. Right, things are so nuts and you feel like you feel it all day long, and so to have other guys who also see the things you do and you know reinforce the fact that you're not going nuts the world is so important, and then you can begin to build. You can build churches, you can build institutions, you can build businesses, you can build things that will matter and will sustain and only grow stronger when they face opposition. Right, that's part of it is building antifragile things, that the more opposition they face, the stronger they get, like you know, like Roman concrete. That's you know, I think, the way things are going to go. That's the only direction we can go.
Speaker 2:And it's like no, we just we lose down, like that, doesn't that? Nobody wants to hear. That, right, nobody wants to hear. Oh, we're just, we're doomed to lose and Christians have always suffered. And it's like, well, there's like 1500 years of Christendom where they build things and they built glorious things and they're supposed to forget. Well, those are all Roman Catholics, so that doesn't matter. That's really really. They have to say it's like no, that would, that would count. It's like, no, they were actually persecuting the tiny little fragment of Christians that actually existed. That's the only thing they have to say. It's bizarre.
Speaker 1:Or they try to convince us how bad that all actually was right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know the Crusades. Those were terrible and the world was so much worse before the Enlightenment, yeah you know, that's basically all that you have, exactly.
Speaker 2:It's so, it's so incredibly pathetic. And I think people see that like. They see that, no, we can actually draw on the rich tradition of Christendom, we can draw on the successes that the church has had over thousands of years and we can yearn to build things that are that good and even better, right, that kind of vision, Like if you present that vision to people, they say I want that, I want to do that. I mean, maybe it's not going to happen in my lifetime or my kids' lifetime or my grandkids' lifetime, but we're going to build closer and closer to that and that's something worth devoting my life to and not just hanging out here till the rapture comes and we all get. You know, our clothes drop and we float off into space. You know? No, no.
Speaker 1:Well, I think that's what's so huge, especially for the younger generations. You want to win the hearts of the young people, and the left actually does this really well. You have to have a positive moral vision, right. You have to have a positive vision for what the world could be. Elon Musk has even said this. He's like look, if we want to save the future, we need to have kids. And then he's like people need hope. Let's give people a hopeful future about a positive world that we could build together. And so, even if they're wrong, they're still positing some formula for hope and building. And, of course, you know, as we've said at the King's Hall, it's like well, let's think through that christianly. Let's go look at the blueprints of something that was great in the past and maybe we could build something like that as well and christen them and see it reconstructed for our children.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, absolutely, and that's what we have to do. It is capturing that vision. Capturing a vision of what the church can be and what a christian nation can be and what it looks like and it isn't utopian, it isn't as though every problem disappears. It's that we can rebuild the kind of world where there actually were answers to the problems we face, rather than just throwing our hands up and giving up, and so that you can't fight something with nothing. And right now, what the evangelical church has is nothing. We have nothing to fight with and so a compelling vision of christened them with something to build toward the future is what's going to draw people in. It's the only thing right, other than despair. That's all they have to sell. It's despair.
Speaker 2:Things are going to be bad, we lose down here, and that doesn't help anyone. It only makes things way worse. If you're just sitting there and you're thinking well, I better collect guns and ammo and just try to survive the tribulation. No, it's a terrible way to live, and especially young people who have their whole lives ahead of them. They are thinking all right, this crazy world that I'm in, what am I going to do? I want to go, listen to the people that have something to say about how we can make it better, what I can personally do to make life better for me and my family and my whole country.
Speaker 1:I think that's ultimately who wins right, who can cast the vision, who can show themselves as future builders. Well, andrew, it's been phenomenal having you on the podcast. I definitely want to recommend that everybody checks out. If we get some focus here, maybe there we are on the Boniface option.
Speaker 1:You can pick this up, I believe, on Amazon that's where I got my copy and definitely encourage people to read that. They can follow along with your work at Boniface option. We'll include links for that for Twitter and GAB as well, for people to follow along there. But again, andrew, thanks so much for joining us for this conversation. Yeah, thank you so much for having me. Eric, thanks again for listening to this episode of the Hard Men Podcast and special shout out to our Patreon supporters. If you're not yet a Patreon supporter, you can join today for as little as $5 a month, and that definitely helps keep this work going. We are glad to partner with you for content that builds a new Christendom and reclaims biblical masculinity. At the same time, you can check the show notes for the link to become a Patreon supporter of the Hard Men Podcast today. Stay frosty, fight the good fight. Act like men.