Athletic Recovery & Performance Podcast

Alfie Mansfield from TRACKSTAA interviews me about the firefly™!

September 03, 2020 Anthony Kjenstad Season 1 Episode 13
Athletic Recovery & Performance Podcast
Alfie Mansfield from TRACKSTAA interviews me about the firefly™!
Chapters
Athletic Recovery & Performance Podcast
Alfie Mansfield from TRACKSTAA interviews me about the firefly™!
Sep 03, 2020 Season 1 Episode 13
Anthony Kjenstad

🎧 Podcast episode #13 The Interviewer becomes the Interviewee!

Trackstaa was the brainchild of Alfie Manthorpe and Rory Leonard. They saw an unmet need in the track and field space and they are aiming to improve the performance and exposure of runners 🏃🏻‍♂️  Alfie came off a recent Injury and was just Introduced to the firefly™ so we connected and he actually Interviewed me for his podcast. 

They have the goal to accelerate the growth of the sport, as well as increase the exposure of athletes, who we know do not get enough attention. 

They are both predominantly 5000m runners, but are invested in any distance/event within the sport.

Trackstaa was originally founded in August 2019, but the actual direction of our “business” was fully decided around April 2020. They are currently starting to produce more original content, as well as sharing other peoples content, on our pages Trackstaa & Trackstaa News. On the original content side of things, They currently produce 2-3 podcasts a week with elite athletes and aim to release at least 1 youtube video a week.

They can be found on Instagram @trackstaa and their website is https://trackstaa.com/performance/

Please find Anthony Kjenstad and firefly™
Email:  [email protected]
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/athleticrecoveryandperformance/notifications/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/fireflyrecovery
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/fireflyrecovery/
Website: https://recoveryfirefly.com/

Show Notes Transcript

🎧 Podcast episode #13 The Interviewer becomes the Interviewee!

Trackstaa was the brainchild of Alfie Manthorpe and Rory Leonard. They saw an unmet need in the track and field space and they are aiming to improve the performance and exposure of runners 🏃🏻‍♂️  Alfie came off a recent Injury and was just Introduced to the firefly™ so we connected and he actually Interviewed me for his podcast. 

They have the goal to accelerate the growth of the sport, as well as increase the exposure of athletes, who we know do not get enough attention. 

They are both predominantly 5000m runners, but are invested in any distance/event within the sport.

Trackstaa was originally founded in August 2019, but the actual direction of our “business” was fully decided around April 2020. They are currently starting to produce more original content, as well as sharing other peoples content, on our pages Trackstaa & Trackstaa News. On the original content side of things, They currently produce 2-3 podcasts a week with elite athletes and aim to release at least 1 youtube video a week.

They can be found on Instagram @trackstaa and their website is https://trackstaa.com/performance/

Please find Anthony Kjenstad and firefly™
Email:  [email protected]
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/athleticrecoveryandperformance/notifications/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/fireflyrecovery
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/fireflyrecovery/
Website: https://recoveryfirefly.com/

Anthony Kjenstad :

Hello, my name is Anthony Jensen and welcome to the athletic recovery and performance podcast. In this podcast, you'll follow my journey of understanding the science behind recovering performance and the technologies that help us get there. I will be interviewing athletes and the behind the scenes professionals that help these athletes reach optimal performance and recovery. Hey, everybody, I've been a little lacks on the podcast for the last two weeks with a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes. And this is an actual podcast where I was the interview II as opposed to the interview or there's a company based out of the UK called track sta tra ck Sta. They are running base content company. And their goal is to improve the performance and exposure of runners and they talk about things around running better training, better equipment, etc. and Firefly became a topic for them. And they actually reached out to me and interviewed me and it was a I thought a pretty insightful conversation. on how the product works, especially for a new user, the one of the founders elfi manthorpe, had actually never used the technology and had reached out to me Got him some samples. And really, this is just a conversation back and forth in how he used the product, what his outcomes were with it on his initial thoughts of it. And I thought, some good feedback from my community. So I hope you enjoy, have a great Labor Day and I'll talk to you next week.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, sure. So, first of all, would you like to introduce yourself and also introduce a fly Fly

Anthony Kjenstad :

Fly? Here? Yeah. My name is Anthony Kjenstad. I am the president of a company called athletic recovery and performance. We are a distribution company based out of Los Angeles, California, and we own the distribution rights to a technology called Firefly. That actually was developed in Europe by a company called first time medical. The technology was in initially in tended as a medical device but has morphed into an over the counter product that has helped athletes with their recovery.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, and obviously, I've had the pleasure of using Firefly for the last few weeks or so. And sort of, I'm sure you can go into science a lot more than me. But basically, if I'm correct, it's basically just some form of is it like electro stimulation? in like a nerve?

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah. So, um, you know, the technology is super simple, but super complex. Um, and it doesn't look and feel like what it competes with, in the minds of many people using it, but at the very basics to not to get too geeky. It's a modified neuromuscular system. NMS device that most nm enemy s devices are focused on specific muscles to increase blood flow articles. technology was actually developed to stimulate the nervous system, which indirectly fires a muscle which doesn't fatigue the muscle, but it actually fires a muscle. And what happens with the Firefly is when you specifically when you when you apply energy to the perinatal nerve, it causes the muscles in the lower extremities to fire. And it actually pushes blood out of the deep veins of your of your calf back to your heart faster. So it actually increases systemic blood flow by stimulating your nervous system.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, and obviously, a lot of people always, especially in the running community, obviously, where we come from, is everyone's always looking for sort of a way to recover because obviously it is a huge part of your training and a huge part of performance and I feel like a lot of people to actually realize that as well. So sort of what I want to ask you is like what sort of the common problems with insufficient recovery what he like noticed over time is only like what stand out

Anthony Kjenstad :

You know, what stands out most to me about recovery is everybody's talking about it, but nobody really has a regimen for recovery. Um, and you know, a lot of the things even the Firefly foam rolling other technologies out there, they're all one percenters, right? The real foundations of recovery are sleeping nutrition, um, which even I think elite level athletes is I've built this company over the last three and a half, four years, even struggle with that alone, right just getting the proper sleep, proper nutrition, but then when you start adding these things on that help accelerate recovery. They're one percenters but I think they're important and and I think all of your your community should really develop a recovery regimen and not one single tools gonna be, you know, the, the silver bullet for for their recovery, but just a focus on it. Everybody's talking about But I can't tell you how many elite athletes that I've spoken to here in the US and Europe where, where it's still they know they should be doing something about it, but they're not necessarily applying anything. So our product in your recovery regimen maximally applied would be good sleep good nutrition, blood flows good. Our science points to increase in blood flow between two and four hours post. I call it loading or running or whatever, you know, in your community to be running it going a long run, depending on how much you loaded yourself that day. And are you loading yourself to get ready for a race excetera our technology throw it on as close to you as you can after the activity and you try to run them for two to four hours depending on the load that day. You take them off, you throw them in your backpack and use them the next time you run again, and and our science points to if you can get those three things right. You should be able to reduce recovery times from 72 hours which is kind of normal, down to about About 28 hours. Um, yeah. So so that's how I think our products maximally use, but there's all, you know, there's all of the things in there that you have to you do well as well. You can't stay out the pub until two in the morning, throw in a firefight, and then think you're gonna recover better, right?

Unknown Speaker :

Well, I have some stories about some people, some athletes who can do that somehow. So maybe they know something I don't but I see this recovering from training, but then it's also recovering from injuries and sort of issues like health issues and stuff like that. How would you say that differs from training, recovery? And also, what should you be doing as well to like, make sure you do, like, stay healthy, like performance aside, staying healthy as a form of like making sure you recover enough to stay healthy as always, so that's kind of the key. key thing here is what would you say like you need to do in order to do that.

Anthony Kjenstad :

You know, it's interesting, so I didn't know anything about recovery four years ago, I still am learning every single day. Um, I think that, you know, there's not there's a lot of discussion of recovery. I don't think there's a lot of research around recovery, and everybody wants the silver bullet after they're injured. Right. But recovery is a lifestyle recovery is something that if you're doing it right, and you and you think about it, right, and you look at some of the literature, you shouldn't, you should be less prone to injury, right? So I think a lot of times, recovery is thought of after the fact and really, it needs to become a part of your lifestyle, and you really need to focus I mean, many people, you know, like here over here, there's a lot of people putting, you know, like, you look at LeBron James, he says, Hey, I put a million dollars into my body, a year focused my focusing myself on mental health and wellness and recovery. And they're not working out as much as they used to right there, folks. Just on on recovering as much as they are on the workout and the grind. And I think in the conversations I've had with athletes that I've got to know them as I'm trying to influence them on my technology and adding it to their, to their regimen, I think what you'll notice about the aging athlete is they start focusing on recovery because they feel so much better. And then they retrospectively think, man, when I was young and invincible, if I would have just focused more on recovery on the front end when I didn't feel I needed it, then maybe my career would have extended or my running career or maybe I would have been less prone to injuries, etc. I guess I would push back to you. I'm not a runner, but I've got to assume as many miles is something you guys are putting in, you're constantly dealing with aches and pains and an injury that you're running through. right um

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, so we get, we get quite a lot of messages as well, on our DMS and it's people are asking about injuries. And it's for me as well, the amount of times I've run with Achilles tendonitis, or the amount of times I've run with a bit of knee pain, like it beat it been syndrome. Everything along those lines, it's because we've run in such a specific sport that all it is, it's just running, like there's no other movements. So it can be very easy to actually get really stiff, because literally all you're doing is running, you're not doing like lateral movements like side to side. So your body sort of is so tuned to doing this. Like it sort of really, whenever you do anything else, like for example, say for example, if someone's not just a runner, like they play football as well. The amount of times I've played football with my friends and afterwards I'm like, I'm supposed to be a fit and healthy individual from running and the the amount of cramps I get the amount of pain I get in my car stiffness and my glutes and everything like that. But yeah, running is very much sort of your running on pain. Like, I'd say probably 50% of runners always have a little licola niggles? I'm not really sure the science terminology of that, but it is very much you're running on, you're running on your like, injury, so to speak, because you'd either don't know the severity of it, or, you know, your body and sort of have just become accustomed to being like Akin, but I guess that is something you can find with a lot of people because they don't actually recover correctly. And also, like, bringing it back to you is Joe, like the athletes you've worked for in the past? Have you noticed that common issues that they've sort of said, Ah, I feel like this is that like, Is there any signs of like, like obvious signs that people aren't recovering correctly? Um, you know,

Anthony Kjenstad :

I it's hard for me to comment on are they recovering correctly at the end of the day, I'm learning just like you guys are about What is proper recovery mean? And again, I think 99% of its proper nutrition and proper sleep. I think with, you know, with an athlete like you guys running, a lot of it's about your form. A lot of it a lot of you know, so then I think when you're really taking it to the next level, it's looking at your form. I think it's cross training a lot. We're all realizing, especially out here in the US, you know, there's this concept of specialization out here, right? Everybody thinks their kid's going to be the next track star, the next basketball player, the next footballer, and, and we're only focused on that sport, right? Because we're afraid Well, our kids not playing that every single day and they're not 100% focused, then they're not going to make that team or they're not going to be the best athlete. But, but when you look, cumulatively back at the really, really good athletes, um, you know, I think I heard a quote from Wayne Gretzky. I mean, he played all sports, right? And I think that's, that's one thing we see here from an issue of just specialization, you're just beating your body over and over doing the exact same thing. So, you know, I don't know that I can specifically say, oh, you're not recovering, right, if you're not using the Firefly, but I will tell you that if you look at all the recovery modalities, because I'm constantly looking at the competition, I'm constantly looking at what is out there that's in this 1%, you know, of helping recover athletes with tools, right? Everything's about blood flow. Um, and our technology just to give you the background was initially developed not as a recovery tool, but to help patients recover from surgery quicker. Um, there's the things they're worried about post surgically, one is blood clotting. And the second is post operative swelling and edema. And the last thing is the wound healing appropriately Our technology on the medical side does help accelerate all of those things, it actually helps reduce blood clots, it actually helps reduce edema dramatically in post surgical patients, and it actually helps the wounds heal faster. And so that same technology is built into the Firefly. So what I tell a lot of my athletes is hey, I can't hand you a paper that says your Achilles tendonitis is going to go away. But we know blood flow is good. We know it's good for our sciences, two to four hours is kind of a maximal effect, you're going to get out of blood flow. But what I think you're going to also get is maybe that Achilles tendonitis goes away in two or three weeks when you're using the firewall for recovery and, and that's a lot of what happens. One of my best runners out here in the US, Galen Rupp had an Achilles tendon repair through and, and when they reached out to me, they were using all sorts of modalities to reduce inflammation as he was getting is training back and, you know, you can throw too many things at something as well and then you don't know what works. Um, so I asked him, I said, Hey, I just want you to use the Firefly for the next three to five days, post running, use it for recovery. But tell me if it's going to help him with this post running swelling, because increasing blood flow to reduce inflammation is what we do. And I can't speak to knowing exactly what gheylens full recovery regimen is, but I know I'm firefights a big part of it and he's found a lot of relief from What did you call them the nickels? The nickels? Yeah, I'm gonna call. So you know, I think, um, you know, I can tell you we work for recovery, we systemically move blood, but we also have a microcirculatory effect. It's going to help with those type of things. Um, sometimes it's going to be quickly and sometimes it's going to be over time but if you're focused on recovering you're using our Technology for that. I think you'll see other benefits from it as well.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, well, I mean, from personal experience, obviously, I used the Firefly when I stupidly decided to try and do a backflip on a trampoline and I fell off the trampoline and hit my shin on some metal and originally actually fought, snaps my leg I thought fractured it I thought broken it. I was really scared and first thing came to my head get jumped a nice buff might not be the best idea. But obviously, luckily for me, I actually, I think the fireflies came like two days later or something like that. Bear in mind. In those two days after my injury, I hadn't really noticed any improvements at all. And I was at work and I got the Firefly had it on me and it must have literally it's obviously some of it is will be mental as well like everything if you're doing some extra. Even if it doesn't work physically, mentally, you're gonna be like it's working great and I Notice that my swelling reduced drastically. Like within first 24 hours, obviously, there's a 24 hour use on them. And I must have, I'd say after 48 hours, I'd gone from being scared. I want to be able to run for months to be ready to start the next day jogging again. And obviously I also went to Monaco last week. And I didn't use the Firefly I didn't traveling it even I should have, I didn't travel in it. I got to that, like went on holiday and come back. And I've noticed that I've actually not seen any reduction swelling in the last week or so since I haven't used a firefly. I'm not sure. I'm sure there's other factors there. But it's, it's just, I find it crazy how this one little thing that you can put around your leg. It's literally no inconvenience at all. You can be sat doing anything with it on your leg. And it seems to have such a great impact. I was just wondering like have you got any sort of stories or, like, case studies, so to speak of, like, situations where they've like, helped athletes in different ways.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, I mean, tons of anecdotal cases. You know, in the US in pro sport, some teams, like the LA Dodgers have completely gone away from using any type of Ice, Compression post injury, and they go right to a firefly. And if you really think about the science and you dig in, what and I'm no scientist by any means, but if you look at the science of you want to increase blood flow to reduce inflammation, you don't want to reduce blood flow to reduce inflammation. So ice is really um, I would say, at least now, and hey, tons of athletes get in nice buckets and there's a ton of other reasons that mentally it worked for him like you said, maybe it's just I'm doing something so I feel better. But if you really look at the site, sense of blood flow. again back to our medical device. We're used every day for reduct swelling of operatively. And the results are dramatic. In lower extremity, Achille surgeries, ACL, total joints, total hip, anything like that. You can't really get eyes on a poster or, you know, surgery because it's covered with bandaging, etc. The nice thing about technology is you slap it on the side of the leg, it increases that microcirculation which, you know, we feel like helps the lymphatic system work better. So it basically cleans out the the lymphatic system and flushes out the edema. We quite honestly 100% don't know why we're so useful in edema, we we we were initially intended to prevent blood clots. We know we do that we know that we in the medical where we prevent spaces because we're driving Blood up the Deep vein in the calf every second, when the vise stimulates you, we know we truly prevent status and that's clinically validated. We also know we're very effective on edema. And we quite honestly 100% don't know why. But it is super useful. So yeah, and you know, in the NBA here, I've had trainers come back and say, Hey, you know, we used to throw everything at it, but the kitchen sink and now we just use a firefly, immediately ankle sprain, strain, anything like that. And literally within 24 hours, the swelling is gone, or it's really down. And a lot of them will tell me two to three days earlier, they'll get their athletes back on the court. Same thing in football, are American football out here. So um, it's interesting product that I've ever worked within the medical world that really nobody knows about. But as simple as it is it has a lot of it does a lot of positive things. And really, it's all around moving blood. We move Blood in that helps healing helps reduction of edema. And it does a lot a lot of good things.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, well, I think even if you take away recovery for a second, the fact that you're increasing blood flow is just by itself is obviously gets get off transports oxygen a lot better. And I've noticed I was wearing it. And a lot of people have been in the same boat as me where if you're working in office, or you're working at home at the minute, you sat down all day, and then you try and do a session, your legs feel really heavy, it's not amazing. Whereas if you have some form of blood flow with everyone should try and stand up and walk every five minutes if I sat down in office anyway, but having some form of blood flow seems to really loosen your legs I want to say but like just make them feel a lot less heavy. I feel that's another benefit. What I find is increasing blood flow in any way. And like for example you could use because because the therapy with the fairer guns or whatever, but yeah, if you're on the way to races on the way to competitions and you find a way To improve blood flow while you're traveling for extended periods of time, then there's going to be performance benefits there as well. Not just recovery.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, absolutely. And that's one of the biggest ways we're used here is a lot of our teams are traveling, you know, East Coast to West Coast. You know, like the Lakers in LA will play if they were playing tonight, they would play, you know, and then if they're playing the Knicks tomorrow, they'll literally jump on a plane immediately post game and fly five hours across country, and then get in a hotel to three in the morning. And, you know, a lot of the teams are using us for travel. You know, at altitude, you're not moving. It's all about blood flow. We give you about 62% of the blood flow that you get from walking. And as you said, the number one way to move blood, walk, get out and move. But if you can't do that, we're a simple solution to dynamically using your body's you know, own systems. To move blood so safe, effective, almost too simple, right? For all the things it does, um, the biggest challenge we have with our athletes is finding the fibular head, the little bone on the leg, which kind of helps us locate the parallel nerve and and attach to the nervous system there so we can increase blood flow, but yeah, there's really no negatives to blood flow, as you know, however you get it there guns are great. hypervolt are great. It's gonna be hard to sit on a plane for five hours and theragun though where you can slap a firefly on and outside of your your foot twitching a little bit. You're the person next to you wondering what the heck's going on. It's a great solution for that. So that's probably, especially with our runners because there's so much international travel when you're hitting the ground after a 12 hour flight. The last thing you want to you know, the biggest thing you get is the swollen legs, the heavy legs, etc. And that really slows down your ability to perform at the level that you want immediately. We get a lot that with any Our national like volleyball players as well where they just want to hit the ground and you know a lot of athletes don't have a budget to go fly to Europe three days early and acclimate to get there you know everything going again I mean a lot of athletes are you know landing and they're performing the next day. So whatever you can do to optimize blood flow and feeling better, you know, on the flight and again, it goes to nutrition right, don't eat the plane food, bring your own food and those type of things but yeah, I think there's some cool technologies not just Firefly that I've seen that are really amazing that are these one percenters that you can focus on?

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, I think a lot of people obviously talk about Norma Tech has been a big one. And you see those like trousers honestly I don't know the science behind them. I just you obviously to see like so there's like tracksuit bottoms at the seams upon where they like can't move anywhere. And that's another thing that I like to notice about the firefighters. You can literally do everything in anything. Whenever you want, and it's it's strange because obviously, so I gave it my girlfriend to try and just as just see if she could feel what it feels like. And she hated it. Like the first thing to like it because it takes like a minute or two to get used to, doesn't it? Yeah, she's like, I'll get it off me. Because she was like, it was on level one as well. You know, the funniest thing. Yeah. So, and but when I put it on now, all I can feel is my leg twitching. I can't feel any. I can't feel obviously the impulses, which is called them. Yeah, I can't feel that anymore. I'm so used to it. It just feels like my legs just twitching away. And at the same time, it just, it's just extremely obviously it is a strange thing to get used to. But when you get used to it, it sort of feels like almost as if your body's supposed to be doing that. Like it's almost like a extended heartbeat, isn't it?

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, so to speak. I mean, it really is. I mean, you know, again, from its medical background, it's very simple. it induces your nervous system to stimulate Muscle firing, which is very similar to walking. And walking is the number one way to move blood. Um, there are people who don't like it straight out the gate. But it takes your body two to three minutes to kind of adapt to it. And then like, as you said, Look, I've been selling the product for four years, I use it all the time. It almost I forget I even have it on now. Um, and you know, it's interesting, you brought up Norma tech, because although we don't look like a normal tech, that's really who we compete with. And I certainly those guys have done a great job of what they're done. And I think their product obviously has great research. Um, but again, it's about blood flow, and where we think we have the advantage over them. Number one is time of use, you want more blood flows better. And you're not going to sit in a corner plugged into a wall hanging on a elevated chair laying back for two, four hours, two to four hours. And you certainly not going to be able to pull that on a commercial flight. Um, and sit in your normal text right, where Firefly, you can slap it On so although great technology and and and has great science behind it we think we have some advantages to time aware and and where you can actually wear them.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, yeah hundred percent is definitely helpful being able to have convenience. Like I said earlier the pharaoh guns no one really wants to hear like a jewel going away at your like on an airplane or whatever. And I'd also just like to quickly touch on obviously your name jobs Galen Rupp and things like that. Are there any athletes if you can obviously speak about them sort of gifts gifts some names like with athletes you've worked with in that specific issues if you can obviously speak about them. And sort of just to give a bit more context for the listeners.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, so my I'm horrible with names number one. And number two, my primary focus when I got this product was selling into college and pro athletic teams because you're selling into one you know, one system one athletic trainer, one physio one sports scientist, and they're kind of Getting it to the whole team. Right? And that was my early focus of developing awareness around why. And I really stayed away from the individual athletes because they're really hard to get down. And, and we were, you know, so that was our initial launch of the product because of COVID because of some, you know, wanting to kind of now take the product to the next level, I've definitely done a reach into the running community. GALEN was one of my first Jordan hasay clink Murphy, I don't know if you know, Clayton, really actually it all started with the Oregon Nike project. And I don't know, I know that products now that that program is now dissipated. But that's where I started. Because of Galen and he saw so much value. It really just trickled to all those athletes. And then it's kind of just opened up to the tons of running communities. You know, the Atlanta track club We're working with the 10 men, elite athletes. I don't know if I mean, there's just a ton of people who would work seeing other people use it. Huge in the triathlete community, it's starting to become as well, Sebastian, I think his name is Kinneil. He's one of the elite athletes, he got, like second place in Kona, those type of athletes are starting to come to us, which is great. And saying, hey, I'd really love to try out the product. And, and so far, we've everything's kind of been word of mouth for us. So it's been amazing. You know, so, and I think the COVID thing slowed us down a little bit because that running community is is everybody's running but nobody's really, you know, performing right now. So I think as we get back to, you know, different races and stuff, we're gonna see a lot more athletes reaching out to us, but those are kind of the top ones that come off the top of my head

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah. You mentioned Tim on elite that everyone's obsessed with them. So they're gonna all the love in that they mentioned them.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Oh, really? You know? Yeah, I've spoke with the head coach Sarah bit. I haven't got a ton of feedback from individual athletes. I know they've liked the technology, but I couldn't tell you who there and who doesn't. And so I certainly don't want to use them to endorse my product, but that's somebody that comes up that I've had a lot of some some decent conversations with.

Unknown Speaker :

It's a great coach as well. Is it Tom Schwartz speaking?

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker :

it goes even easier now being very knowledgeable, obviously. Yep. So that cutting edge on that sort of thing, what knowledge of it in the sport and the science behind the sport, which is obviously, at this day and age is what the main driving factor is, isn't it? Like science testing? Everything's always controlled. Nowadays, and,

Anthony Kjenstad :

yeah, it's funny. You mentioned science, there it is to get you as I almost think or I try to not sell the science of our product. You I don't do a good job of it because people seem to get confused when there's too much science there. You almost want to, I don't want to say dumb it down. But if you can get too geeky on the science, sometimes you lose people but so it's interesting that you said that in science is important probably in your guys's elite community. The quirky sciences good, but I think the general population you can almost give them too much science.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, if if you have to dumb it down to the lowest form of what Firefly does, but also what blood flow does. How would you like sort of constructs that it's as if someone had no clue about blood flow had no clue about Firefly I have no clue about the science of anything. What would you say? are like the key contributors and like the factors What are important to sort of now

Anthony Kjenstad :

i don't know that i can dumb it down for me. I just my brain goes right to you know, but at the very, very, very basics. It's blood flow. Right and we all know that it's movement. Ours is is you know, as You speak to active recovery, we are somewhat in active recovery, you don't necessarily have to be active, you can go back to your daily life, work at your desk for a couple hours through your run and get good blood flow out of it and get recovery set at the very workflow. And then you talk about, there's two ways to deliver blood flow, there's systemic, which is firing it back to your heart faster, and oxygenated, etc. And then you've got this microcirculatory on swelling, and we do both very well. And so I didn't dumb it down very well. I apologize. But, you know, at the core, regardless of whether you use a firefly or a normatec, or theragun, it's nutrition and sleep first and foremost. And if you get those in order, you're 90% there, and then these other things and tools or benefits, um, but I think devices like ours, do help you with the nagging injuries are certainly effective not only on the recovery side but just allowing you to actually go out and run and get through these little idosos and injuries and stuff. So if you're working with a product that does both Um, I think it's a benefit um

Unknown Speaker :

yeah, I noticed that obviously, like you said sleep and nutrition. If you don't sleep and nutrition, there's no point doing anything else really. Like if you're not getting which is eight hours sleep would you say is roughly the benchmark people suggest?

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, that's what I hear all the smart people say, and I certainly, you know, so then it comes down to monitoring and like I have a polar watch I have an aura ring and I'm by no means an elite athlete. I'm a peloton or mountain biker, 51 year old guy who just wants to and also a businessman and I think both sides of recovery are are important not just on being an athlete but being a good entrepreneur, a good employee, like you got to have things dialed in regardless so yeah, I'm I'm eight hours asleep in a minimum. The nutrition thing is probably for all of us it's often on but I tried to really make a focus on it and it makes a difference just in my life, for work and for business and then when you add some of these one percenters on you, I think you can really for me it's been a really good tool to monitor these things because I don't think we realize how little of sleep we get or how unproductive are sleeping. So then you start. I'm always trying to do the best. I'm gaming it always a little bit. So I'm like, I didn't get a lot of deep sleep tonight. Why didn't I Well, maybe I eat too many carbs. You know, too, you know, too late in the night or maybe I had one extra beer or you know those type of things. You can really start monitoring your system and realizing what is affecting Your sleep, and usually is really nutrition. I think we all can understand. You know, you put good stuff in, you're going to get good stuff out of it. So, monitoring for me has helped me. sleep better monitor my nutrition and then when you add some one percenters on I think that's when you're really starting to perform better. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker :

yeah. And sort of speak about performance. And this might have been a tricky question to sort of answer because again, there's there's never any one shoe fits all policy for anyone. Even with recovery. It's different for everyone is safe. You were with an athlete who was either in a hard training block or was in a competition block. What would you How would you optimize a day with Firefly with nutrition with sleep with napping, stretching, what would you say is like the perfect optimizing, like method basically, so like if you're doing something straight after training straight before

Anthony Kjenstad :

I can really alphy only speak to Firefly You know, I'm, I talked to all these performance coaches and everybody's got a different regimen and a style and and like you said everything works differently for athletes, one of the things I like with a couple of the teams that I have is for recovery, they don't tell them what to do, they just need focus on it. So they'll give them these or they'll have a table of recovery devices, right and the normatec will be worth two points and the Firefly will be worth three points and then theragun will be worth one point. And they got to get 10 points each day, right, or five points each day depending on how they load them and whatever they're doing, and they're monitoring and I think that's a good approach because, you know, not, not one product works for everybody. But I think if you find the right things, maybe you assign a value to them. And and then you just make sure you get your five points for the Right whether that's eating better or sleeping more or you know maybe sleeping eight hours is is five points for you but sleeping nine hours is eight points right? And then you just get your point total around recovery nutrition sleep and create goals for yourself. I've seen that approach worked really well and I think I kind of do that for myself when it's you speaking specific to Firefly, um, you know, points to two to four hours post post session and I even have some athletes that will use the Firefly pre run to just get a warm up to get the blood flowing etc. I don't know running enough to be able to hundred percent tell you how to implement it in your you know, getting ready for races and stuff but but flow is good. Um, are sciences two to four hour. I can't imagine not using it as many miles as I see a lot of you putting on I almost feel it's an everyday tool, um, for many athletes in especially in your community?

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, well, from my experience with it, obviously I, I did use it before I use it before and after a session obviously, for different reasons before you've got increase in blood flow, which is obviously get oxygenated blood around the body. And again, I'm not I'm not too scientific with all that, like you said, blood flow is good. That's there for that matter sort of thing. But then also after, after sessions, I found it really helpful to stick on, and it's sort of, again, whether this is indirect science or, but the like, fatigue in my likes, specifically, sort of seems to decrease quite a lot. Like he said, as well, talking about the niggles type of thing. I wouldn't say I've had any noticeable pains or aches or pains over the machine, which obviously was my own fault, like since I've used it and also, since I've sort of, like you said, worked on having more of a structure around record. Because it just it doesn't, it does get neglected. And everyone talks about consistency being the most important thing. Like if you ask any athlete, they're gonna say consistency and hard work, probably the two key factors to success. And to have consistency. You need to have a structured recovery. So you stop injuries, stop nickels, and solve everything along those lines. Really, it just everything revolves around being structured in what you do. And it applies to everything in life as well. Like, I'm sure you know, like business working. If you've got consistency, everything seems to I don't want to use the cliche term keep the ball rolling, because it's very cliche, but that's sort of what he got. It's got to do, isn't it? Yeah, you've always got to make sure you're maintaining and stay on top of things.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, it's a it's a full time game. Right. And it doesn't take long to get off the tracks and and nobody's perfect. For sure. Even a lot of the elite athletes I I talked to, I mean, they they chant they're challenged with that. They're all just human like us. I think one of the things that Clayton Murphy He told me that was interesting is he doesn't have a specific recovery regimen because, you know, if he finds him, he doesn't have a superstitious tool he uses because what if he goes to a race and that tool is not available. So again, I think you have to have a multiple things that make you feel good, and help you with recovery and help you with your nutrition and sleep. And, again, if you can stay on point with those if you don't have access to one as long as you have access to another, I think in many instances, I liked his approach to that I certainly would have loved him to say that Firefly was his only tool, and if he didn't have it, he would be lost. But the reality is, he's not always going to have it available. Maybe he forgot to take them on the trip. Maybe they burnt out, he didn't have enough etc. So I like his approach of I do a lot of different things. I have my go twos but I don't feel like I'm not going to perform well in this race because I didn't do this exact hour. rhythm.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, I think that's a big thing because you don't want to get to a point where you're like, relying on one soul thing to perform, because that can lead to heart problems I can imagine, quite like, I don't think happens so much in running. But I feel like in a lot of sports, you hear things about like certain like football boots or certain shin pads or I don't know, where people can't perform while I'm making excuses like that all the time. So it's definitely important to make sure you've got a variety of things, what sort of help you recover, help you stay fit and sort of, you can't just rely on one finger, I'll still cause a world of pain when for whatever reason you're traveling across the country to compete and you've left it at home or something along those lines. Absolutely. So I obviously we speak spoke there a bit, obviously, about Firefly and like the history but what what do you sort of looking for in the next two or three 510 years? Like in progression? Like what what what do you want to do like leave your mark? Yeah, so

Anthony Kjenstad :

I really enjoy recovery. I really enjoy working with sports scientists and athletes. And so two things for me. Number one, the fireflies a medical device. First and foremost, it's still in its medical kind of packaging, it still looks like a medical product. And it's, it's not super intuitive for the general population. So in the next 12 to 14 months, I'd love to have a reusable technology that was a little more intuitive for the general consumer. Secondarily, I stayed at the front end, I built a distribution company right now fully focused on Firefly. But as I'm gaining awareness with athletes and people like yourself and training rooms, I think there's so many products on the market that have this significant science backing, that have a natural application in the training room and with elite athletes and don't have a platform to get to get to them. And that's my other thing is I want to build the planet. form to truly take medical devices into the training room. So I'm looking at products that help, you know, we can get super geeky and talk about like the circadian rhythm and when you travel, you know, your if your body gets off the circadian rhythm, that's why you have problems with sleep. And there's a lot of things you can do around supplementation nutrition and light blocking that are super interesting. There's a company out there I'm looking at called fly kit. There's just a lot of cool technologies yesterday I was, you know, again, I'm dealing with a lot of training rooms out here and there's a product that was developed in the medical world to to heal wounds faster. It's called active actv. It's a spray. And again, this is gonna sound a little geeky, but they basically figured out that your body uses the hypocaloric molecule to heal something if you have a burn or a cut. Your body sends down the hypercaloric molecule to make your body heal well now that's in a spray form. Um, and it helps athletes with everything from chafing to, to cuts and burns and bruises, really cool little training room product that does, you know, we traditionally get a cut, we throw neosporin on it, that's bad, right? You want to throw natural healing things, but this also helps with like an ocular wash and, you know, sunburns and things like that. So I love geeky technologies like that, that I can give a platform into the training room and with elite athletes because I think everybody's looking for science based products, but they want to figure out how to validate that science and not just believe everything they're told. Um, so sometimes I get involved with these real geeky products and then find myself getting almost too deep in the science. But that's what I'm really interested in is like, how to bring science into the training room and gain awareness. With elite athletes on how to optimize?

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, and for like the geeky, sort of nerdy runners out there, where can they sort of like where would you say on? Is it on your website? Where would you say the best best place to find information about recovery about Firefly and about all these other like geeky things would you say like for everyone is interested in that sort of thing?

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, no, thanks for asking. Um, so it's interesting right now, I'm the US guy for Firefly. So our website is www. Recovery firefly.com. But if you're buying the product in Europe, you actually go to their website, which is www dot Firefly recovery.com. And eventually, it'll all be on one website, which will be my website. I did start a podcast like you. It's called the athletic recovery and performance podcast. I was involved in so many cool conversations with performance coaches and athletes and technology that are Like, I want to take these calls and let everybody hear them. And that's been a good place. And then eventually I will have a website for athletic recovery and performance. We'll put, you know, reviews on these technologies and stuff and not all of them I represent. Um, as far as my distribution company, it's just tools that I think are interesting and maybe people want to do a little more deep dive in and, and and see it so that's currently where you can find all that stuff.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, I think obviously talking about your podcast here. I love listen to it. Like when I'm at work, I just put on the background. I probably listen to an episode like once or twice or maybe even three times to sort of get all the information in. And I listened to Apple Music, but it just, it's sort of, I'm trying I was trying to get the podcast up then to remember exactly it was.

Anthony Kjenstad :

It's been an interesting journey. You know, you're building your own podcasts, you you want people to listen, but you kinda, I built my podcast really for me and just the conversations that I was having, and I thought they were cool. And I thought my little five guys that are my friends that I grew up with, like to hear them, and it's kind of morphed into, um, where people look forward to it now that I see it's got a little bit of a community now so I've enjoyed

Unknown Speaker :

Oh, sorry, my audit is good. Yeah, that's another big thing for me is we start the podcast because we just wanted to speak with athletes and sort of obviously provide something different in the community and sort of share like information because it's there's not as in especially in the running community. Unlike other sports like American football, that normal football i don't know i said normal football, the both normal football, like basketball, like everything else. And there's so much information like if you wanted to find out how to I don't know, shoot a free for over. Yeah, there's gonna be so many videos out there. But if you look up how to like improve, like, I don't know. I'm trying to think of an example. put myself The Spark, I think of something, but anything really related. There's very limited information out there. And a lot of it is sort of very generalized from people who aren't runners. Yep. So we wanted to sort of start this podcast to speak to athletes, coaches, black professionals in the sport who sort of know we're talking about. But then also, what comes with that is you get to learn so much about like different things, like a different experience of athletes different like methods athletes use. I'm not sure if you know, Joe, Joe Rogan, the podcaster.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, of course, everybody knows Joe Rogan, right. Just got your million dollars for his podcast on Spotify. So, you know, I'm yeah, and I've actually met Joe. And actually, if you look on Joe on Instagram, he follows Firefly. He only follows about 800 people he actually follows Firefly.

Unknown Speaker :

That's, that's amazing. So are you somewhat engrained into the UFC world then as well?

Anthony Kjenstad :

A little bit um, I early on. I tried to because Southern California based on a lot of these athletes are based here and, and again, it's a very, very niche community. And they're all independent contractors, and they have all their teams around them. So it's a very hard community to get embraced by but I do have quite a few of their athletes actually, if you go on my Instagram feed, I'm not even great at names, but we've had quite a few posts of many UFC fighters using our technology.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, I can imagine that it's kind of helpful because they obviously get quite a lot of a lot of injuries, sort of just as like tissue damage, injuries and things like that.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, that's where they really need to be like post post training and post fight as much for the, you know, edema reduction as really the recovery and some of the feedback from the athletes has been, you know, I can't move for the next three to five days post fight, but the fireflies really helped accelerate that recovery post fight with just the end. reduction.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, yeah, hundred percent. That's what I've noticed as well. So I've, I've sort of mentioned this already, but you know, like the feeling I get, I use it to travel from. It was like an hour and a half. So obviously it's under the two to four hours what like recommended, but I got the car. I didn't feel like I've been in a car. Mm hmm. It felt like a bit like jog. Yeah. Which ad is found up amazing, because there's no better feeling than Germany do a really easy run or really easy piece of exercise and you get your finish and you just feel amazing. Yeah, because you've obviously looked. And that's what I felt like my legs felt like they were floating. sighs as really pleasantly surprised when that happened. I was like, This is made for recovery. But there's so much more you can sort of use it for

Anthony Kjenstad :

Yeah, that's almost sometimes the kiss of death, right? Because if it's so good for all these things, then it's hard to focus on exactly what so I really try to stay to recovery and then these conversations about itis and inflammation come up and And then a lot of athletes will give me feedback that it helps with that as well. Did you find that park? Yes.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, the one I was referencing at the time was elite youth sports performance? Yeah, yeah, we've done the Mac. Yeah. I just I was listening to that. And I'm pretty sure that's when I was listening to the time. And some of the things I was saying. It's sort of like, it almost is too simple. That what you need to be doing kind of thing, Joe, like you speak about, like, obviously another professional within the sort of the like, health industry. The amount of times they go into places like going to teams or and you basically have to say you're doing this completely wrong. It's It's strange that there's not enough knowledge out there about recovery as a whole, and injuries. everyone cares about training as hard as you can and do everything right to improve. No one cares about maintenance as much. So I just find obviously that podcasts are Also the restroom as well, as obviously touch more about like the youth side of things in that podcast as well. Yeah. But in all the episodes it just it's great to hear some. It's just refreshing hearing about actual professionals speak about things of the night generalized fitness people, like whenever you search like a YouTube video, how to get better at running, obviously, no one's going to search that really, but like, you hear it from like a gym instructor. And it's our great Franks that tells you to do cardio or takes to interval sessions. It's like, great. I'm already doing that. But it's great to actually listen to podcasts and watch YouTube videos as well. where someone who actually I'm going to say, like really knowledgeable within their niche, can speak about it, I find that a lot more valuable to listen to. Yeah,

Anthony Kjenstad :

because like, it's amazing how people are so open to talk and go into the weeds, right? Um, for me when I entered this space, this concept of performance science was really didn't really I mean, understood what it ultimately meant at a very high level. But there were so many people that were in charge of sports science, some came from a physio background, some came from an athletic trainer background, so and they're always want to know how the path of how they got there. And, and the conversations have been interesting. What I probably learned the most is that everybody's talking about recovery, but nobody's really putting a lot of as much effort into it, as they are talking about it. And I think that's what's changing. And I think with the, you know, the push of the companies like Norma tech and hyper ice and Thera gun and all these big companies that are way bigger than me, I think they're really doing a good job of creating a spotlight on the wellness side of being an athlete and I think recovery fits in wellness, right? Um, but it also fits in performance. If you I almost think it's a 5050 now, you should be recovering as hard as you're trying to train. And the athletes that are comfortable with that are gonna see me way more being, in my opinion than the ones that are overtraining.

Unknown Speaker :

It's what people say, like professionals, it's not what they do training wise, what sets them apart. It's what they actually do recovery wise and everything in between the training sessions, which sets them apart from people who aren't professionals, and that's why there's so much better it's because they can do everything like those extra 1%. Like we're talking about, like everything, like add a 1% there by using Firefly, add a 1% thereby, making sure you have got the correct nutrition by having a nutritionist and so on and so forth. Like it's, it's so important to make sure that you like again, maintain but also consider every every aspect of training, because it's not just training, but it's the aspect of every aspect performance. So it's not just training. It's not just recovery. It's meant mentally, mentally as well. It's so many different things. You want to make sure you sort of doing everything in order to actually optimize your performance. A lot of people don't actually realize that until they get told. And then it's like, oh, wait, that makes sense kind of thing.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Well, even one of the podcasts I just did was with Darren treasure. Who's the mental performance coach for Galen Rupp? Yeah, and, and Clayton Murphy actually. And that's the biggest thing that I learned also is, you know, even I have youth athletes in my house that I put in, you know, strength and conditioning and I had them you know, I really focused on making them good athletes not just at their sport, but make sure they get the right Street, the right nutrition, the right cross training, but but one thing I didn't even think about as a father and being in this world is the mental side, right and getting conversation with him. Really In my eyes up to like, how many elite athletes do struggle on the mental side like, like, there's so many elite athletes that just getting that mental side fixed will take them way but you know, it allows them to push through barriers that they don't think they could. And it's a huge part of this recovery equation as well, that has probably even less focus on it, but I think it will have a tremendous focus moving forward. So you're spot on I think recoveries is big bucket. And it's physical. But it's also mental and and I think there's a lot of things now coming at us on the mental side and I don't know that anything specifically defined but mental performance is a is a big thing and and recovery.

Unknown Speaker :

Yeah, percent. And so I've just to obviously finish to finish up the podcast is where Can everyone find you? You've already spoken about your podcast, but where can Everyone listen to you? podcasts, find fireflies in scam. And again, just whacking the Firefly obviousiy. online as well. And if they want to find out more information,

Anthony Kjenstad :

yeah, so only two ways to buy Firefly, either the Europe or the US website, US website is www. Recovery firefly.com. And for the UK site, you flip it over. We do have an Instagram page. It's at Firefly recovery. And then my podcasts predominantly I think people loaded on Apple podcasts, which is the athletic recovery and performance podcast. So and then, you know, on all those platforms, if you just hit email in any of them, it actually goes directly to me. I'm a one man band where I'm accompany. We're three or four people here in the US. You know, representing the Firefly and having a lot of cool international conversations like with you and and kind of just creating awareness but very approachable. Very connected you know, just send me an email. I'm happy to answer any questions about anything we talked.

Unknown Speaker :

Thank you.

Anthony Kjenstad :

Well, guys, I hope you enjoyed the podcast and got some good background on the Firefly and where it came from and maybe some possible outcomes athletes are receiving on it. I'm going to go ahead and link tracks to connections in the notes below. So you guys if you want to follow them and learn a little bit more about what they're doing on the training side, etc. And again, I appreciate your time and thanks for having me in the car with you or wherever you listen to your podcasts, and they've got some good content coming forward and hope you guys continue to listen. Take care