Passion, Purpose and Sustainable Travel with Melissa DaSilva

In this first episode of Soul of Travel, Season 5: Women's Wisdom + Mindful Travel, Christine hosts a soulful conversation with Melissa DaSilva, President, TTC Tour Brands North America, The Travel Corporation.

Melissa DaSilva is the president of the TTC Tour Brands North America and has an industry career spanning over 30 years. Travel is both a personal passion and a professional pursuit. An avid and lifelong traveler Melissa has been to more than fifty countries and has lived in both the US and the UK. Her contagious enthusiasm comes from a deeply held belief she shares with The Travel Corporation; travel helps broaden perspectives through the connectivity of shared experiences of adventure, exploration, learning and laughter showing how we are all more alike than different.

Christine and Melissa discuss:

• Inherent Passion and Impactful Purpose, and how these areas of focus create a foundation for travel with a positive impact
• Challenges some businesses may face quantifying and measuring impact and TTC's Sustainability Strategy
• Different ways to put sustainable strategy into action
• Using your seat at the table to create the most impact possible

Thank you to TTC Tour Brands and The Travel Corporation for joining us as our first founding sponsors and helping Soul of Travel Podcast to tell the stories of women creating a positive impact in travel!

Join Christine now for this soulful conversation with Melissa DaSilva.

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Credits. Christine Winebrenner Irick (Host, creator, editor). Melissa DaSilva (Guest). Original music by Clark Adams. Editing, production, and content writing by Carly Oduardo.

Transcript

Christine: Welcome to the Soul of Travel podcast. I'm Christine Weiner Irik, the founder of Lotus Sojourns, a book lover, Yogi mom of three girls and your guide On this journey. We are here to discover why women who are seasoned travelers, industry professionals, and global community leaders fall in love with the people and places of this planet. Join me to explore how travel has inspired our guests to change the world. We seek to understand the driving force, unending curiosity and wanderlust that can best be described as the soul of Travel. Soul of Travel Podcast is a proud member of the Journey, woman Family, where we work to create powerful forums for women to share their wisdom and inspire meaningful change in travel. In each soulful conversation, you'll hear compelling travel stories alongside tales of what it takes to bring our creative vision to life as we're living life with purpose, chasing dreams and building businesses to make the world a better place. But the real treasure here is the story of the journey as we reflect on who we were, who we are, and who we're becoming. We are travelers, thought leaders and heart-centered change makers, and this is the soul of travel.

Here we are back together and kicking off Season five. I'm so excited to bring you another season of soulful Conversations with Women creating a positive change in tourism. Our first guest is Melissa De Silva, president of the TTC Tour Brands for North America with an industry career spanning over 30 years, travel is both a personal passion and professional pursuit. An avid and lifelong traveler, Melissa has been to more than 50 countries and has lived in both the US and the uk. Her contagious enthusiasm comes from a deeply held belief she shares with the Travel Corporation. Travel helps broaden perspectives through the connectivity of shared experiences of adventure, exploration, learning, and laughter, showing how we are all more alike than different. In our conversation, Melissa and I talk about bringing passion and purpose in as the foundation for impactful travel, the privilege and responsibility associated with travel, and how we can design travel experiences that place equal importance on the visitor and the visited. We also talk about the challenges faced when quantifying and measuring impact and TTCs sustainability strategy and what she thinks is one of the most important things leaders can do with their seat at the table. Thank you again to Melissa Trafalgar and the TTC tour brands for helping to bring this season to life. Join me now for my soulful conversation with Melissa DeSilva.

Before we begin this episode, I want to take just a moment to share some big news and talk about the new supporter of the podcast. Those of you who have been enjoying these soulful conversations for the past few years may not know that I have almost entirely self-funded this program. I am so happy to announce we have a new founding sponsor. Before I share who they are, I want to share why I'm excited to work with them. They are dedicated to sustainability and making a positive measurable impact. Their collective mission as a family of brands is to make travel matter. They have implemented a five-year sustainability strategy and blend this with philanthropic efforts to ensure they do in fact make travel matter. Before we get too far, I want to let you know who will be joining me to support this meaningful forum for women to share their wisdom and inspire meaningful change in travel.

So give me a little drum roll in your car or on your walk wherever you are listening right now. And without further ado, I'm delighted to share that the Travel Corporation and their amazing family of tour brands, including Trafalgar Insight, vacations, cost Saver, Brendan Vacations, luxury Golden Contiki is joining us for season five as a founding sponsor. This will allow me to continue to bring diverse voices to this podcast and to this stage in tourism to share years of wisdom and expertise. And I'll begin by interviewing Melissa de Silva, north America President of the Travel Corporation Tour Brands. If you'd love to learn more about Trafalgar or any of the other award-winning tour brands that can help you travel in the most incredible ways possible to amazing destinations so that you can experience life-changing moments that will remain with you forever. Be sure to visit trafalgar.com/soul. That's trafalgar.com/s UL. I also really encourage you to explore the work being done at Tread Wright Foundation, the Travel Corporation, not-for-profit organization By visiting www.treadwright.org, I'll be sharing more about Trafalgar and the impactful work they are doing this season. But for now, let's officially kick off season five and begin our soulful conversation.

Welcome to Soul of Travel podcast. I am Christine Wine Runner Irik, and I'm your host and I'm so excited to be kicking off season five of the podcast. It hardly seems that that can be true. It has gone by so quickly, and I guess they say that you always have time always passes when you're having so much fun. So I'm really excited to be here today and to be joined by our first guest of the season. I'd love to welcome Melissa de Silva, who is the president of the TTC Tour Brands. So welcome to the podcast, Melissa.

Melissa: Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited about this.

Christine: Thank you. And it's really special to have you here helping me kick off this podcast because you have joined us as a founding sponsor for the podcast. So I also just want to extend a huge amount of thanks and gratitude for stepping up to support me in my mission to elevate the voices of women in travel and to help to tell these stories and create a space for the voices of women in our industry. So thank you for being a part of that as well,

Melissa: And thank you for doing that. We we're so honored to be a part of it.

Christine: Thank you. Well, to begin the conversation, I'd just actually love to turn it over to you and give you the opportunity to introduce yourself. Tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do in travel right now.

Melissa: Yeah, of course. So I run all of the tour brands at the Travel Corporation, which may not mean anything to people because it's not something that we usually talk about the Travel Corporation that is our parent company. But the brands that I run that you or your listeners might know about would be brands like Trafalgar Insight, vacation Cost Saver, Brendan Vacations, luxury Gold, and of course our youth brand, which is Tiki. So it's all of the guided vacation brands that fall under that umbrella. I run them for North America, so all of our guests that are traveling from either Canada or the US and I have a team of people making sure that we're spreading the word about how amazing guided vacations are and making sure that all of the guests understand what it is that they're going to get when they come on trip. Anyway, it's a job that I love. It's a dream job.

Christine: Great. Thank you so much for telling us that. And I would love to hear from you how you got started in the tourism industry and what really led you into this path of having your dream job.

Melissa: Yeah, it's a funny, strange turn of events. So I grew up in a really tiny small town in northern California and my family didn't really have a ton of money and so we didn't do a lot of, well, we did a lot of travel by car, but we didn't do any international travel. And my mother had traveled quite a bit when she was young, so she was a child of the fifties and traveled in the sixties and had these fabulous stories to tell about when she lived in Europe for three months and things like that. So I had grown up just fantasizing about travel. So knowing I didn't have a lot of money, I thought I'm going to get a job that pays me to travel, but I didn't have a lot of experience. I didn't know what kind of job that might be. The only thing that I knew was what I saw on tv, which was journalists.

So I got this idea in my head that I would be a journalist and I would get paid to go all over the world. So I went to university and that's what I was studying. And while I was there, I had a girlfriend who was traveling all the time and I was like, how are you doing this? How are you taking weekend trips to Hawaii? And she said, oh, I work at the local travel agency. So I said, I need to get a job there. So I started working at the on-campus travel agency to pay my way through school and we didn't make commission, but we could earn free travel. So that's what I did. I sold my little heart out and I earned my very first trip out of the country. So I earned an airline ticket with American and I also earned a tiki tour.

So if you remember, that's one of the brands I actually run. So it's kind of full circle moment, but I did a 30 day European panorama trip throughout Europe and that was what I got. My passport was to go on Tiki and I came back from that trip really just changed. I knew that travel was something that was in my blood. I always knew I had wanted to travel, but now I knew that there was more than just one way to do that. And I still went ahead my senior year and I got an internship at MGM and I hated it. And I remember I quit and I picked up more hours at the travel agency. And then when I graduated I got a job at a different travel agency and that's where I was for 18 years before finally coming here to the Travel Corporation. So I've been in travel now for over 30 years, started out as a seasonal travel agent and now I am very excited, like I said, have the best job in the world.

Christine: Yeah, thank you for sharing that. I love how travel, and this is such a common theme for so many of the guests, how travel just finds us and there's so many of us who had this just strong desire to travel and explore even though it wasn't a part of our childhood. And similar to you, I grew up in a really small town and it's like I could just constantly hear the rest of the world beckoning me to just come be a part of it. And I didn't even know what that meant. I just knew it was something that eventually I would need to figure out how to do. And I ended up taking a travel training course kind of during college as a whim and loved it. And then what I really found out about it was that I actually didn't really want to be a travel agent.

That was a lot of the things that we were doing. But there were speakers that came in and they were talking about conservation and they were talking about being explorers and educational travel and trips that were really focused on these immersive experiences. And I was just mesmerized. I'm like, whatever that is, I want to be out there doing that. And then much like many of us in travel who want to travel, I ended up working for an expedition cruise company and sending people to do all of these things that I wished I was doing, but I learned so much about what I thought travel could be in a way that I didn't ever expect in the media and television and movies, we see this one version of travel and I think that's what we kind of set off to seek because it's what we're seeing over and over again.

And through those experiences working with the expedition cruise company and just these moments I had learning about what travel really could mean outside of just taking a vacation is kind of where I've always gone in tourism. And so I think that's a really great place to start. That's one of the things that I know I connected with your group on as well is talking about what you call the ips, which are the inherent passion and impactful purpose. I hope that I got that right, and I would love to learn how these create a foundation for travel and how those help your brands to create a positive impact.

Melissa: So our ips are really our internal values. So they are our people, our passion and our purpose. And so they really work both internally and externally. Starting at the core is our people. And I do believe that we couldn't do anything that we do if we didn't have an amazing team behind the scenes in front of the scenes. I mean, there's thousands of people across the globe that are making all of this happen. And so it's really important to us to invest in them, in their development, make sure that they're empowered, that they're motivated, that they're speaking up, that they're contributing to the success of the business and the guest experience. So really that is at the foundation. Our purpose is just for everything that we do. And this is not just about giving back while we're traveling. So this is about making sure that everything that we do, we're doing with purpose.

So it's giving back in our local communities, it's making sure that everything we do is as sustainable as possible. It's making sure that we are bringing our guests into destinations in a way that is having a positive impact on the places and the people that we visit. And so that is very much, again, just at the core of everything. And then our passion really just comes back to the fact that pretty much everybody that works at the Travel Corporation and all of my brands has that same passion that you and I do for travel, not just to be the travelers ourselves, but we do take a lot of joy in knowing that every day when we come to work, we get to help bring people's travel dreams to reality. And I think that it brings us all together. It makes us all feel really good about what it is that we do. And I think that that then goes back to the people part. And when you feel good about what you're doing, you're going to feel much more satisfied and engaged and it just comes full circle. So really those are the three things that are the foundation for everything that we do both internally and externally.

Christine: Yeah, I think that's something so unique about the travel space is the way that people love their jobs, really love their jobs and how committed they are to having other people have those experiences that they love. I always rack my mind to think of another industry that kind of has that same privilege and that same sort of atmosphere. And I don't think I've seen it anywhere else, but it feels so magical. It just feels like an extension of play and creativity and it is work, but it's also just such a great community to be a part of. So like you said, the people that are here, I mean you go to conferences as I do, we got to meet last February at an event. It always just feels like the most exciting place to be and I enjoy it so much and I know that so many of us that are in this industry as a career really appreciate what that sense of community means.

You also talked about sustainability not just in the context of travel, which is important, but within the whole brand and in all of the actions that you're created. And there's one thing on your website that really resonated with me. And so I wanted to just read it because it's actually something that I say a lot on the podcast. It's something that I talk about with my daughters. We just got done traveling for three and a half months together, and it was definitely something we talked about a lot, but it says on your website, travel is a privilege. But with that privilege comes a responsibility to ensure we have a positive impact on the places we go, the people we meet and the wildlife we enjoy. For us, travel is of equal importance for the visitor and the visited. And for me, that has really been at the heart of my career.

And when I first witnessed travel, I noticed the balance for me felt off and I really didn't sense an equitable exchange. And then I started to study sustainable tourism and work in the industry. And this became something that I really wanted to seek out in my work. And then that last line of really it being of equal importance for the visitor and the visited is one that just is the most important to me. And it's the thing I notice myself witnessing when I travel the most and I observe myself as a traveler there, and then I observe the industry there in that space and then that person's life in their home in tourism. And so it becomes this huge puzzle that I'm kind of constantly examining. But I would really love for you to share any experiences you may have had personally kind of witnessing that harmony or disharmony in tourism. And then talk a little bit about how you really worked to achieve that at TTC.

Melissa: Yeah, I think for me, coming to the realization that this was an incredibly important cross-section was not just one thing. I think first and foremost, I became really enamored in travel because of the impact that it had on us socially. I do fundamentally believe that when you travel outside of your own bubble, when you experience other cultures, that it has a positive and profound impact on you. And I do think that it helps us understand that different is not a bad thing. It helps us have more compassion, more empathy. And let's face it, I think in today's world that is lacking. And I don't think just in the us I think there's a lot of places that you can point to and say, you need to understand that your way is not always the best way. And so that was why I really felt drawn, I think in the first place to working in travel.

And I spent 20 years working in youth travel specifically. I was like, if I can get 'em out early, then we're going to make the most positive impact. But the more and more time I spent in the industry, I started to see a lot of what you saw. I saw the impact of globalization in the sense that it doesn't matter where you go in the world, a big city is going to pretty much have a similar looking high street. So whether you're in London or Budapest or Rio, it's going to be h and m and Zara and Swarovski and Gucci, whatever it happens to be. And that to me was kind of devastating because you start to lose everything that made that particular place special, the local artisans and the local food, and there's a Starbucks or a Burger King on every corner. And I think to me, that is a

Kind of tragic, and so what we want to make sure that we do is try to minimize that loss of culture, I guess you could say. And so we want to make sure that we're providing our guests those real authentic experiences, but doing so in a way that isn't going to take away from the people that we visit but be beneficial to them. So a couple of things that we want to do is make sure that we are working with local businesses, local guides, people that are going to ensure that the money stays within the destination, but who are doing so in a, that is true to their heritage and it's not commercialized. A good example of this I guess is we work with a Christina Herron Foundation in Svia, and I think anybody who goes to Spain is wanting to see a flamenco show.

But you could go to one of the big flamenco dances that are put on purely really for money. They're very western, well, I guess they're western, but they're very geared toward the tourist and not necessarily towards preserving the culture of flamenco, which includes not just dance, but the music and the, but the Christina Hern Foundation was set up for exactly that. She thought that there was a need to preserve the actual culture of the flamenco downs. And so she set up a school and the way that we first became introduced to them was through Tread Wright, which is our nonprofit organization. And we were originally funding scholarships for them, but the more we worked with them, we realized that we needed to help them become a self-funding organization so that they could sustain themselves whether they were getting individual donations or not. So we worked with them to create a program where their students could actually be the ones doing the flamenco demonstrations.

They would then teach some of our guests how to do the dance themselves. And it became this beautiful symbiotic relationship, which has happened with many of the partnerships that we've created, whereby not only are we preserving that culture in a way that is really true, but we're also benefiting that local business economy tradition by creating this relationship that helps them survive and thrive, not just survive, thrive on their own. So we get the best of both worlds in that sense. And that's what I mean by good for the visitor and the visited. When I visit wherever I am in the world and I meet with our partners, they're just so appreciative of that relationship. It is sometimes two and three generations that we've been working with some of these businesses. And for them it means that they've been able to really invest in their dreams.

I've got a million different examples. I was in Greece in March and I was visiting with a gentleman who runs an olive of oil farm there. And it was the very first be my guest experience that Trafalgar had ever had in Greece, but it was also their very first foray into working in tourism and the tiny little olive farm outside of nap. And they had never done anything like that before. They literally set up picnic tables, they welcomed our guests. It was this beautiful experience. But through that he's been able to build out this beautiful business. He's put in the sustainable olive presses. They actually run, he takes the feeds from the olives. This is very cool. He grinds them down and then that's what they use as fuel to run the press, to make the olive oil, which they now have won multiple awards.

They do soaps, they do oil themselves, they do cooking demonstrations. It's really phenomenal to watch these things and they're just so appreciative for this relationship that we have been able to forge with them. And that is really what we're talking about. So it's about making sure that we're not just bringing guests into a place for four hours where they go get an ice cream cone and they're not really contributing to the local economy. How can we bring them in? How can we give them those deeper richer experiences? How can we take them past the gateway cities so that the people around can also benefit from tourism and it can be a force for good.

Christine: Yeah, thank you so much for sharing all those experiences. And I think, again, just from my own personal experiences, and I hadn't really been able to articulate it how you did, but just the idea of the way the major cities all feel so similar, even if you're somewhere where you have maybe envisioned like Paris where it's going to have this standout feel like it has standout moments, but for me, it had so much of it felt similar to other places I had been, and I really couldn't find the language for what that felt like, but that was what I was witnessing. And then I took a train ride an hour outside of the city and visited a farm and stayed with a family whose family had been there for four generations. And we went and learned about the bees that they have and all the different types of honey.

And for me, that's how I'm going to actually remember France is through that experience. And I do think that travelers, again, kind of going back where we started, they have this illusion of what tourism and travel should look and feel like, but that sometimes leaves them feeling like they didn't have the experience they really wanted. And when they step outside of those places and can become more immersed in a destination, they walk away feeling so much richer for that connection and that experience. And like you said, that really shifts then how people show up as travelers in the future and what they're looking for or how they engage with another destination once they've had that kind of experience. I really do think that changes who they want to be as a traveler because it does feel so much more balanced and rich and welcoming. And I think pure, really, to me, it just feels so much more equitable and feels like it has some integrity to it, and it doesn't make me feel that feeling I can sometimes feel in those other moments of travel.

Melissa: I think that's really well stated and I definitely have felt the same. So it's nice to be on the side where we're able to very consciously try to make a big difference in the way that people experience the destination.

Christine: Well, I know that so many businesses, obviously in the past few years, especially since the pandemic have been asking the question of what does it mean to be more sustainable and to have a positive impact? And one of the things they come up against pretty quickly, especially many of my colleagues that have smaller businesses, but at a greater scale when you're looking at mini brands like you are, is quantifying and measuring impact. And I know that's something you've been really dedicated to and I would love for you to talk a little bit about ttts sustainability strategy. Wow, that's a great word that I can't say right now. Strategy, measurable goals that you've set and what you've focused on and what you have achieved so far because it's been quite an accomplishment.

Melissa: Thanks. I mean, it has been something, we've been on this journey for about 15 years. I looked back and our brands originally founded treadright, which is our nonprofit organization, about 2008. And they really have helped guide us in terms of the things that we should be focused on, whether it come to internally within our business or externally on our trips. And in 2020 we announced our five-year strategy, which we call How we Tread. And that was really about putting down on paper exactly what we wanted to achieve and each of our goals in that five-year strategy rolled up to one of the UN global sustainability development goals. So we chose 11 of them that we felt that we could really make an impact on. And so that's what we're committed to. And then each year what we do is we actually publish a report that goes into great detail.

It takes us about six months to actually finish each report so it's not a small task. And we go through and we actually say, how are we doing against each of those goals? And each of them have got clear targets that we have to achieve. They're not wooly, they're very much based in science-based targets. And so we're very proud of the progress that we've made. But to your point, it's not easy. It is a big undertaking, but I do think it's critical and important that we do. So with the utmost transparency, I don't think just saying that you have a strategy anymore is good enough. I don't think just saying that, oh, we've whatever reduced X or we put this much money into the economy is good enough. Excuse me. So again, I just don't think it's good enough anymore for brands to just say that they're doing it.

There's been too many brands out there who have been caught in let's say, stretching the truth or whatever it may be. And it really gives a bad reputation to many of us in the industry because they're greenwashing. And so our goal is to be as transparent as possible. We want to make sure that we're sharing that with anybody who wants access to it. So if you were to go onto our website to ttc.com, you can see that we have a link directly through if you click on our purpose to the plan and you can see all of the progress that's been made. It goes brand by brand, it goes goal by goal. So it is really important to us that happens every year. Some of the plan, some of the ideas that we had in the plan that we had laid out, we've already changed.

And what I mean by that is, for example, one of our goals was to become carbon neutral. And it was very clear even 12 months into that wasn't good enough anymore. So we pivoted, we changed, and we're now on a path to become completely net zero by 2050. And so to date, we've made really good progress. So for example, we set up a carbon fund, which is an industry first, and that fund is going to actually help us as we invest in the things that we need to do to get to our commitment of being net zero. So whether that's things like renewable energy in our offices or biofuel for our coaches, that's what it's going to help us do. So I think that that's a really good example of how people should not be afraid of just hitting their goal, but being willing and able to pivot, not about winning, it's about doing the best and always continuously improving upon where you are.

Another one of our goals, I know you'd asked about progress, was to include what we call a make travel matter experience on at least 50% of our trips. So make travel matter experiences kind of like I was telling you about the Christina Herron Foundation. It's where we are including these experiences which either give back to the community or the environment or the wildlife, and we include them on the trip so that our guests have an opportunity to experience them themselves. And we know a few things. We know that our guests want to do well, they want to travel more sustainably, but typically speaking, unfortunately, they don't want it to cost anymore and they don't want it to be an inconvenience. So by us building them into the trip, they're able to have these experiences, they go away with these aha moments, they feel really good about the trip that they've just taken, and we've done something good in the places that we visit.

So our goal was to have it on 50% of our itineraries. And I mentioned before that people is the most important value that we have because without great people, we can't accomplish anything. Well, they didn't think that was good enough. So our teams on the ground said, Hey, 50% we can kill that. And within two years we now have it on a hundred percent of our trips with Trafalgar Insight, luxury, gold and Brendan, and it's on at least available as optionals on all of our cost saver trips. And with Tiki, they've also got it on all of our trips. So it's a really good example of how we can take a target and smash it and other ones we're just going to have to continue to work towards.

Christine: Yeah, thank you for sharing. I think I've been in the sustainability focus in tourism industry for almost 20 years, and so seeing how the conversation has evolved around just what that means, who can do it, who it's for, how it can really implemented has evolved so much. And just as you were talking initially even, I remember having early conversations about being really passionate about what could sustainability be in tourism? And it often led to this conversation around a unique way to market a destination. And really early on I kept thinking, oh my gosh, this is going to get us into such a mess, which it has in some places because in fact, many people did pick up on the fact that that was something that was very appealing to what was then a niche audience. But I do think now it's not a niche audience.

I think it's most travelers are at least aware of the term, and many travelers, like you said, are seeking that out. They're actively seeking out sustainability and whether they're willing to put that as a values decision-making and know that they maybe would pay more or choose a different destination simply because of their values or whether they want it provided to them, and then they see the value and they carry that forward. I do think we're at such a different stage in the game. And then also the transparency that you mentioned, I think it can be very intimidating. I feel like these goals are so different than any other business goals. I mean aren't business goals, they are goals on how we are going to be able to create a positive world that we're going to continue to live in. And so for many of us, that's obviously quite daunting.

And so that transparency helps other businesses to see what they can shoot for and inspire them, show them strategies to be able to achieve it. And so I think it's really important, and unlike many parts of our business that we tend to try to keep private and secret, I think this is something that's so important to be out there because it doesn't matter if only you do it the best if no one else figures out how to do it. And I do think that that is something that we're seeing across the board, especially in the last three years as people in our industry really coming together to figure out how we can tackle this as an industry and not as individuals. But I do think it's really important to have brands leading and really sharing their experiences. So I appreciate so much all that you have done and shared already to help others make that same progress.

Melissa: Yeah, thank you. And I could not agree with you more. Like I said, this is not something we want to win at. It's something that we want everybody to win at. And so I think if people are looking for tools out there, there are so many different, whether they be organizations or federations or associations that are giving tools out to their members, that I would seek those out. So whether it's their travel agents through asta or the Family Travel Association, or if they're tour operators through U-S-T-O-A or just linking up with somebody like Tourism Cares, there's so many tools that are out there that I would really encourage people to just go seek them out that it doesn't matter that they haven't started yet, it's just important that they do start.

Christine: Yeah, I agree. One of the things that you and I have talked about when it comes to creating change and one kind of seemingly easy way to really create change and travel is to encourage people to travel outside of peak season, which will both get us away from some of those experiences I've already talked about in terms of things being crowded and congested and feeling as though you're a part of a consumer process and not a traveling process. And I really witnessed that this summer. I ended up having to travel in Europe during some of the height of the season because of other obligations I had. And it really detracted from the experience for me. And I know sometimes when you tell people they're going to travel in a shoulder season or off peak season, they automatically think they're going to be missing something because something is happening in that peak season. That's why you're supposed to be there. But I really think that so much more is gained. So I would really love to talk to you about that decision that you have made in your business regarding peak travel seasons and then again how you're putting that in action.

Melissa: I think in the depths of the pandemic, we all vowed to do better. We all were like, you know what? Overt tourism was the thing everybody was talking about, right? When the world shut down, how are we going to avoid it? And so we thought, okay, this is our chance to reset. And I'm super sad to say that as an industry, and you witnessed it this summer, that just didn't happen when the world clammed to open back up, everybody wanted to go back to their favorite destinations and they all seemed to want to go sometime between July and August or July and September. And it's just been heartbreaking actually to see some of the pictures that have come out and to hear from the locals on the ground, whether it be Barcelona or Amsterdam, who just don't want people visiting if they're going to have that kind of impact on their cities.

And so what we have decided to do is we have committed that in 2024, we will not be adding any additional capacity into Europe in summer. We don't want to continue to exacerbate that problem at all. And so the majority of our efforts throughout the remainder of the year are going to be to, well, this year and next year are going to be to get people to see the benefits of traveling to some of these destinations in not those peak months like you're saying, I don't even want to call it the off season because it somehow then has a connotation that it's not still fabulous. I mentioned I was in Greece in March, there was nobody at the Acropolis, I was practically by myself with my family when we visited the Oracle Adelphi. And the shop owners were just so happy to have us in and they would even give us little trinkets as we were leaving because they just hadn't even seen anybody all day.

And that's what it means to have a sustainable business is to make sure that you can have income all year long. And if you only have people coming into your shop for three months of the year, that is not good for the economy in that destination. So it's imperative that we do a better job of spreading out the guests that are visiting a destination throughout the entire year. So that is going to be key in all of our messaging. It's going to be key in all of our offers. You will see that there will be no discounts off of peak season because we don't want to be driving further demand into those destination and it'll be key in the messages that we have with most of our trade partners. So yeah, that's what we're going to be doing. I think it's the right decision. It's not the most profitable decision, but it's the right thing to do. And to your point, I think people don't really understand that someplace like Ireland as an example, nobody goes to Ireland for the weather. They don't need to be there in the middle of summer, just as likely to rain as it is in February. So why not go when it's not going to be crowded and you're going to have an unobstructed view of the Cliffs more, or you're going to have the Book of Kels all be yourself in the long room. So I don't know, that's our goal.

Christine: I mean, when you really are wanting to sell people the magic of travel, that is where it lives. Because I've had those moments too where I've been hiking in Peru for days and never seen another traveler, never. And going and seeing these ruins and these sites, and they're as if they exist only for me. And you get the childhood Indiana Jones vibes, and it really brings back for me the magic of travel, which quickly dissipates when I'm standing in a line to get into some other attraction. And I see the value of that, and I totally understand people wanting to see these things that they've heard about their whole lives. But like you said, if get to go to Greece in March and witness it without anybody else, the impact that it's going to have on you is going to be so much more. And then also just to reiterate on the communities where you're traveling.

And that was something another conversation I was having with my daughters because we started to edge into the season where there were less travelers coming because school was back in session and we noticed we were in places by ourselves more, and the conversations and interactions we started having were so different and they were like, what just happened? Why is it so different now? And not everybody has the ability to travel during that time, I understand that. But I do really think that we're going to begin to shift the story about what travel means to all year round and really emphasizing what it means to destinations both in increasing the impact during the less traveled and visited months and decreasing the impact during the most traveled months. Because I think this experience I just had is probably going to even be a further catalyst to what I want to create in travel because I just felt so many moments of a little bit of heartbreak, and I haven't had time to process it yet, but I just think it's going to be so important.

So I love that you're really starting that conversation with your travelers and getting people to be thinking about it in a different way. I also wanted to talk to you a little bit about it. You mentioned at the beginning of your conversation bringing travelers into the group travel setting and allowing travelers to have these first experiences maybe overseas with a group. A lot of times we end up talking about women's travel and solo travel here on the podcast, and I really love to speak to the power of group travel for people that maybe haven't traveled by themselves or haven't traveled internationally and what the value of that is. So I wanted to talk to you a little bit about that.

Melissa: So my first trip, like I mentioned, was as a solo female traveler on a group tour. And it probably was the best thing I could have done because I didn't have to worry about the logistics. I didn't need to worry about, I don't want to say safety or security, you still have to watch out for yourself. But I was with people even though I was on my own. So I knew that there was almost that safety net. And I think that that's one of the beauties of going on a tour is that even if you want to break off and be on your own and do some exploring that you can always come back to the group at any time. And I also think that there is also an element of, even though we're traveling by ourselves, there is still something very powerful about that shared experience.

And I think sometimes experiencing something with other people has that much more of an impact on us, whether that be, I don't know, you mentioned Peru, whether it's the first time you maybe see the Sun Gate or whatever it happens to be having a toast at Oktoberfest. I do think that there is something very special about the social element of it, but you still want to travel by yourself. And so being on a group tour allows you that opportunity. We see lots of solo women traveling with us. We more and more I would say in the last few years are just seeing women who either they don't have a partner that they want to travel with or their girlfriends just aren't down to go to the same destination at the same time. Maybe they can't get the same days off, or maybe they have a partner, but they've each decided they want to take separate vacations this year because that is definitely a trend that we're seeing as well. And so again, it just takes a little bit of the fear out of it by going with other people and it gives them that built-in opportunity to have travel buddies.

Christine: And I think even as solo travelers, I have found that you end up finding a group of people that you end up doing some traveling with anyway. So there's this kind of belief that you're going to just be out there really on your own, but you do crave community. And so this gives you the best of both worlds. So I love recommending people that are curious about traveling by themselves to start there because it does give them that freedom and that flexibility at the same time. Well, we're almost to the end, but there's two more things I really quickly wanted to touch on with you. You've mentioned treadright Foundation a couple of times, and I just really quickly wanted you to share a little bit more about what it is and maybe one or two of the projects that it is supporting right now.

Melissa: So treadright is our nonprofit organization. They are, as I mentioned, our guiding light. They help us to determine what projects we should be investing in. They help us come up with our criteria on our make travel matter experiences in terms of whether or not they meet the sustainability development goals. They're just absolutely key and critical in us achieving our goals for setting them and then achieving them. And again, that's both internally and externally. So internally, again, they're going to be making sure that we're making the right decisions when it comes to our renewable energy, whether it's we're eliminating single use plastic out of our offices, reducing food waste in our hotels and our cruise ships. But some of the projects that they fund externally would be something like Project Vesta, which we just formed a partnership or a donation with them this year. So Vesta is a very cool project.

They use this very unique sand. They've created it and they re-sand coastal ecosystems, and the sand actually pulls the O two out of the air at an exponential rate, even more so than trees or plants. And so it's a really cool thing that they've created. You fund them, they create the sand, and then they go and they re-sand coastlines with this sand that takes the O two out of the air. So it's absolutely very cool, and I don't understand all the signs behind it, but they do. Another example of a project that we support is Rainbow Railroad. So Rainbow Railroad is based out of the US and Canada, and they are actually an organization that has been set up to help displace L-G-B-T-Q-I-A from around the world to get them someplace safe. So I mean, I know it's kind of hard to believe, but there's still more than 70 countries around the world where they criminalize, whether it be homosexuality or sexual orientation, and it is absolutely terrifying. The links that they will go to, they'll be denied basic human rights, they're attacked, they're brutalized, and so Rainbow Railroad helps get them to a country that they will be able to live safely. So those are just a couple of the different types of projects that they would support. These are not necessarily projects that we would include on any of our trips, but that they're equally important when it comes to supporting the environment or the communities.

Christine: Yeah, I think for me, especially, I have a background in sociology, and when I kind of landed in tourism and responsible tourism, it was this space where I understood how all of these things could intersect because travel happens everywhere, and when you want to create a positive impact, you're looking at social issues everywhere around the world. And so I think it's such a unique industry again, where you can take something that's important to you and put that forward in who you are as a traveler. And even as you were just speaking and you were mentioning the sustainable development goals, that's one of the things I've started including in my onboarding form with my guests, is having them talk about what goals their businesses support. Because I do want travelers to then be able to maybe set their own travel values. And that's such a great place to look if you don't know, maybe what your values are is just to look at the sustainable development goals and see what resonates with you, and then find brands that are creating trips that support those things.

Because again, sustainability, it can become overwhelming, but there's such a way that you can make it yours and really make it mean something to you, and you can really feel like you're creating an impact when you're traveling. So listeners, if you aren't familiar, it's so easy to find a list of those goals, and so many more businesses are also being transparent about that being a part of their mission and what they're to create. So I would encourage you to do that. The last thing that I wanted to talk to you about is really turn it back to you again and talk to you some more about things that you're passionate about in the industry. I know that leadership is something important to you, obviously that is important in your role as a leader in the industry, what is something that you like to model or encourage for other leaders to really either grow to their potential or to take advantage of who they are as leaders in the industry?

Melissa: So our leadership team is primarily female. I think the last time we measured it was about 73%. And I really strive to create an environment where they're empowered that they question everything, that there's a lot of robust dialogue and collaboration. I feel like that's how you come up with the best result. And so I always tell anybody who's on my team leader or not, that if they are given a seat at the table that they need to use their voice. I think it's really important for people to not be bystanders that they're there for a reason, that we've hired them because they are smart, that they know the field in which they've been hired, and that they're not just there to sort of listen to those of us that are in leadership positions. We hire smart, amazing people so that we can be better, our organization can be better. Like I mentioned very early on, there's thousands of people who make all of our wonderful trips happen. I don't do them alone, so don't let me make all the decisions. So I tell them, use your voice. If you have a seat, use it. And they do once they've been given the permission, they do. And so I hope they take that with them wherever they go out into the world, because I think that's really important that they raise their hand and say what they're thinking.

Christine: I think that's incredible. And looking back at my early positions when I was in my early twenties, I feel like that wasn't a dynamic that was created at all. And I know there was a mini times that I would've wished that I could have been a part of the conversation because I did feel like I had something valuable to add, but there was just something that said, you are actually not at the table to be heard. You're just here as, I don't know exactly what, but it was really frustrating, and I do think that has shifted so much. And so I really appreciate that that is what you are working to create, because I do think we go through all this effort to find incredible employees and bring them into the office and bring them into our workspace, and then to tell them that they actually aren't at a level where their voice is valued seems counterintuitive to the whole process. So I think that's so incredible. And to teach people, especially starting out in their careers early, that they can speak up and be heard and continue to grow is only going to make them stronger leaders in the future, like you said, wherever they might be.

Melissa: I agree. And I think if they end up in an organization where that's not valued, they will soon be on to find an organization that does value them. So I think it's probably the most important lesson that I can impart.

Christine: Yeah. Well, Melissa, thank you so much for being here. Also, thank you so much for helping me to kick off this season. I am really excited that this is where we're starting. I think we're setting the bar high for some really great conversations that I can't wait to share. Before we end our call, I have just a few rapid fire questions that I always wrap the conversations with, so we'll jump over to those. The first is, what are you reading right now?

Melissa: I just finished a book called, and then there was, or wait, and then there was one, I can't remember. I just finished it in the last couple of days. But it's a really great murder mystery about a woman living on a cliff in Maine.

Christine: As I asked you that, I was just thinking, I almost always reading a business book, a spirituality book and some other book, and I actually have really jumped onto the summer binge reading this summer, and so I'm like, oh gosh, I'm reading some really crazy odd books and books that were left in VRBO and things like that, things that I wouldn't have read, but it's been really enjoyable. I actually really got back into loving reading and not it feeling like an assignment or a job. So thank you for sharing. What is always in your suitcase when you travel

Melissa: A charger? So I've got a charger that holds multiple different wires because I never seem to have enough places to plug things in. So yeah, my charger

Christine: To sojourn, which is a word that's really important to me, is to travel somewhere as if you lived there for a short while. Where is a place that you would love to sojourn?

Melissa: I would love to sojourn, probably Costa Rica. I visited there, but it's a place that I would love to just settle down for at least six or 12 months and really just soak it all up. There's so much there between the volcanoes and the rainforest and the beaches and the hot springs, and it's a country that really embodies sustainable living, not just travel as well. So I would love to soer in there for a while.

Christine: Yeah. What is something you eat that immediately connects you to a place that you have been?

Melissa: Ooh, probably hin from Brazil. So there's these little fried, I don't know masa that have meat in the middle or cheese in the middle. And my husband's from Brazil. And so whenever we would go to visit his family, we would always have Osh and I tried to make him at home and I fail miserably. So

Christine: I feel like that is what happens most often when I try to recreate my favorite travel foods. Who was a person that inspired or encouraged you to set out and explore the world?

Melissa: Oh, my mother. She always told her travel stories, and she was my biggest cheerleader while I was traveling, and her only request was that I always posted on Facebook so she could see where I was in the world and make sure I was alive. But yeah, she encouraged me to go everywhere all the time by myself with friends. It didn't matter. Just get out and explore the world.

Christine: If you could take an adventure with one person, fictional or real, alive or past, who would it be?

Melissa: Ooh, that's hard. Maybe. You know what? I am so inspired by Brene Brown. I would love to do something with her. I couldn't say one of my daughters, you had told me I could only pick one and I can't pick one daughter. So I would say Brene Brown then,

Christine: Oh yeah, I aspire to have some sort of travel and leadership experience with her. So maybe the universe will pick up on that insight here. The last one is The Soul of Travel is really a place for recognizing and honoring women in the industry. So I'd love for you to share one woman who you admire and would like to recognize here in this space.

Melissa: I would like to recognize, oh, there's so many amazing women in travel. Actually, I would like to recognize a woman who, she works in an art organization. I don't think she's very well known, but her name is Lucille Siv and she is the head of our Africa division, and she is a phenomenal trailblazer. And the reason that I choose Lucille was she was the first woman executive within TTC. So she really paved the way for myself and all of the women that are now within our organization. I mentioned 73% in leadership positions. If it had not been for Lucille and the amazing leader and businesswoman that she is, I don't know that we would be here doing what we are today. And she's just a fabulous example to all of us. To use your voice and to be kind and to be empathetic. You don't have to be a horrible person to be successful in business. And so I picked Lucille,

Christine: Oh, thank you. And I love what you shared about her. That really speaks to what I'm trying to do here at the podcast. And I love hearing that part of her story and how she really created that path forward for you. So thank you. And again, thank you so much for being here. I appreciate this and I look forward to all that we're going to share together over the coming season with your founding sponsorship as well. And I really appreciate what that's going to allow for us to do together.

Melissa: Thank you so much.

Christine: Thank you.

Thank you for listening to Soul of Travel, presented by Journey Woman. I hope you enjoyed the journey. If you loved this conversation, I encourage you to subscribe and rate the podcast. Please share episodes that inspire you with others because this is how we extend the impact of this show. Learn more about each of my guests by reading our episode blogs, which are more than your average show notes. I think you'll love the connection. Find our episode blogs at www.souloftravelpodcast.com. I'm so proud of the way these conversations are bringing together people from around the world. If this sounds like your community, welcome, I'm so happy you are here. I am all about community and would love to connect. You can find me on Facebook at Soul of Travel podcast or follow me on Instagram, either at she Sojourns or at Soul of Travel podcast. Stay up to date by joining the Soul of Travel podcast mailing list. You'll also want to explore the Journey Woman community and its resources for women travelers over 50. I'd also like to share a quick thank you to my podcast producer and content magician, Carly Eduardo, CEO of Conte. I look forward to getting to know you and hopefully hear your story.