{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":27.16,"endTime":28.36,"body":"Hey folks,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":27.16,"endTime":28.36,"body":"thanks for tuning in."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":28.36,"endTime":30.880000000000003,"body":"My name is Galen Low with"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":28.36,"endTime":30.880000000000003,"body":"the Digital Project Manager."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":31.21,"endTime":33.79,"body":"We are a community of digital"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":31.21,"endTime":33.79,"body":"professionals on a mission"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":33.79,"endTime":35.95,"body":"to help each other get"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":33.79,"endTime":35.95,"body":"skilled, get confident, and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":35.95,"endTime":38.620000000000005,"body":"get connected so that we can"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":35.95,"endTime":38.620000000000005,"body":"amplify the value of project"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":38.620000000000005,"endTime":40.21,"body":"management in a digital world."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":40.6,"endTime":42.760000000000005,"body":"If you wanna hear more"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":40.6,"endTime":42.760000000000005,"body":"about that, head on over to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":42.760000000000005,"endTime":45.56,"body":"thedigitalprojectmanager.com/membership."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":46.315,"endTime":49.685,"body":"Okay, today we're talking about"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":46.315,"endTime":49.685,"body":"the role of behavioral science"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":49.765,"endTime":52.635000000000005,"body":"in project management, how it"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":49.765,"endTime":52.635000000000005,"body":"impacts our beloved project"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":52.655,"endTime":56.574,"body":"methodologies, and why it could"},{"speaker":"Galen 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could share the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":92.32000000000001,"endTime":94.66,"body":"same origin story you shared"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":92.32000000000001,"endTime":94.66,"body":"with me when we were prepping"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":94.66,"endTime":98.309,"body":"for this, of like, how you got"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":94.66,"endTime":98.309,"body":"into project management, and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":98.309,"endTime":101.179,"body":"then how you got from project"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":98.309,"endTime":101.179,"body":"management into pursuing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":101.179,"endTime":104.649,"body":"your doctorate in behavioral"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":101.179,"endTime":104.649,"body":"science, and then also what"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":104.649,"endTime":106.859,"body":"that formed and how that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":104.649,"endTime":106.859,"body":"formed the 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friend, Dr."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":121.145,"endTime":124.074,"body":"Jodi Wilson, who I had known,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":121.145,"endTime":124.074,"body":"she was a behavioral scientist."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":124.49,"endTime":127.08,"body":"And so I would see all these"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":124.49,"endTime":127.08,"body":"things like, you know, people"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":127.08,"endTime":130.6,"body":"are planning optimistically,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":127.08,"endTime":130.6,"body":"we're always behind schedule,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":130.88,"endTime":132.6,"body":"and I was trying to figure"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":130.88,"endTime":132.6,"body":"it out, and I would ask"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":132.619,"endTime":135.339,"body":"Jodi, I'd be like, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":132.619,"endTime":135.339,"body":"know, what's going on here?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":135.339,"endTime":138.19,"body":"Is this like a human"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":135.339,"endTime":138.19,"body":"behavior thing or something?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":138.32999999999998,"endTime":139.969,"body":"And she would kind of point"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":138.32999999999998,"endTime":139.969,"body":"to her head and say, do"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":139.969,"endTime":140.709,"body":"they have one of these?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":140.709,"endTime":142.41,"body":"You know, referring to,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":140.709,"endTime":142.41,"body":"do you have a brain?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":142.69,"endTime":142.92000000000002,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":142.929,"endTime":145.16,"body":"And I'd say, well, I"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":142.929,"endTime":145.16,"body":"guess they do, you know?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":145.429,"endTime":147.19,"body":"She's like, well, then it's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":145.429,"endTime":147.19,"body":"a behavioral problem, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":148.22899999999998,"endTime":149.649,"body":"So everything's a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":148.22899999999998,"endTime":149.649,"body":"behavioral problem."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":149.94,"endTime":150.59,"body":"For the most part."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":150.84,"endTime":152.47,"body":"But yeah, so she'd"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":150.84,"endTime":152.47,"body":"give me some words."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":152.47,"endTime":154.69,"body":"She'd be like, you know, have"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":152.47,"endTime":154.69,"body":"you heard of cognitive biases?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":154.69,"endTime":156.43,"body":"I was like, I don't know."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":156.69,"endTime":157.739,"body":"And then she'd give me a couple."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":157.739,"endTime":160.26,"body":"I'd go look them up on"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":157.739,"endTime":160.26,"body":"Wikipedia and I'd just do some"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":160.269,"endTime":163.349,"body":"mad searching and find things"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":160.269,"endTime":163.349,"body":"like, oh, the planning fallacy."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":163.349,"endTime":165.429,"body":"That's a cognitive bias"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":163.349,"endTime":165.429,"body":"that explains the tendency"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":165.429,"endTime":166.639,"body":"to underestimate durations."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":166.999,"endTime":167.95,"body":"I'm like, what?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":168.2,"endTime":170.549,"body":"This is all the stuff I"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":168.2,"endTime":170.549,"body":"was looking for, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":170.62,"endTime":172.1,"body":"So I'd dig a little bit deeper."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":172.16,"endTime":174.42,"body":"And so I'd ask her"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":172.16,"endTime":174.42,"body":"more questions."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":174.63,"endTime":176.65,"body":"And I was considering"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":174.63,"endTime":176.65,"body":"a PhD at the time."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":177.005,"endTime":178.815,"body":"And I didn't know which"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":177.005,"endTime":178.815,"body":"direction to go and she's like,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":178.815,"endTime":181.095,"body":"well, have you considered this"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":178.815,"endTime":181.095,"body":"program at the Chicago School"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":181.105,"endTime":182.215,"body":"of Professional Psychology?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":182.505,"endTime":185.595,"body":"And I looked at it and I"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":182.505,"endTime":185.595,"body":"was like, this is it, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":185.755,"endTime":187.335,"body":"This is what I was looking for."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":187.495,"endTime":190.045,"body":"And so essentially my"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":187.495,"endTime":190.045,"body":"dissertation ended up being"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":190.354,"endTime":192.325,"body":"studying the integration"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":190.354,"endTime":192.325,"body":"of behavioral science"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":192.375,"endTime":193.604,"body":"with project management."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":193.625,"endTime":196.675,"body":"So my dissertation is"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":193.625,"endTime":196.675,"body":"titled Toward a Theory of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":196.725,"endTime":198.025,"body":"Behavioral Project Management."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":198.455,"endTime":201.575,"body":"And so, you go a little bit"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":198.455,"endTime":201.575,"body":"further on that, I was on"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":201.575,"endTime":204.205,"body":"a plane ride for our first"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":201.575,"endTime":204.205,"body":"time on a family vacation to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":204.205,"endTime":206.865,"body":"Hawaii, and I was studying"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":204.205,"endTime":206.865,"body":"my behavioral economics"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":206.865,"endTime":208.245,"body":"class, and then it hit me."},{"speaker":"Josh 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already?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":221.984,"endTime":225.135,"body":"And I was like, it was like"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":221.984,"endTime":225.135,"body":"two or three more hours"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":225.135,"endTime":226.995,"body":"before we landed and I'm just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":225.135,"endTime":226.995,"body":"like sitting there without"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":227.005,"endTime":230.014,"body":"internet access thinking, Oh,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":227.005,"endTime":230.014,"body":"like I have to check, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":230.055,"endTime":232.095,"body":"Like, as soon as I"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":230.055,"endTime":232.095,"body":"land, is this a thing?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":232.285,"endTime":234.255,"body":"So it was a nerve"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":232.285,"endTime":234.255,"body":"wracking couple hours."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":234.255,"endTime":234.885,"body":"I landed."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":235.075,"endTime":236.255,"body":"First thing I did was Google it."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":236.474,"endTime":238.545,"body":"There was no behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":236.474,"endTime":238.545,"body":"project management."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":238.575,"endTime":240.014,"body":"And I'm like, face palm."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":240.044,"endTime":241.334,"body":"Are you serious?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":242.01,"endTime":246.75,"body":"So, that essentially led to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":242.01,"endTime":246.75,"body":"my paper, or my dissertation"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":246.75,"endTime":249.66,"body":"for my PhD, Toward a Theory of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":246.75,"endTime":249.66,"body":"Behavioral Project Management,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":249.869,"endTime":252.199,"body":"founding the Institute for"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":249.869,"endTime":252.199,"body":"Neuro \u0026 Behavioral Project"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":252.199,"endTime":254.75,"body":"Management, and then creating"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":252.199,"endTime":254.75,"body":"our certification course,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":254.76,"endTime":255.93,"body":"which is called NeuralPlan."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":256.18,"endTime":257.71000000000004,"body":"So, it just kind of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":256.18,"endTime":257.71000000000004,"body":"all came together."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":257.71000000000004,"endTime":259.769,"body":"Jodi was at the very"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":257.71000000000004,"endTime":259.769,"body":"beginning of that."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":259.879,"endTime":263.46000000000004,"body":"She essentially introduced me"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":259.879,"endTime":263.46000000000004,"body":"to the topic that led to us"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":263.5,"endTime":264.93,"body":"developing this discipline."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":265.43,"endTime":266.91999999999996,"body":"I love that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":265.43,"endTime":266.91999999999996,"body":"story, and I love how, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":266.91999999999996,"endTime":269.829,"body":"know, somehow the best ideas"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":266.91999999999996,"endTime":269.829,"body":"always happen when you're"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":269.829,"endTime":272.299,"body":"dreaming in the shower or on"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":269.829,"endTime":272.299,"body":"an airplane, where you can't"},{"speaker":"Galen 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started my research in 2016."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":287.07899999999995,"endTime":287.639,"body":"Nice, okay."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":287.65,"endTime":290.94899999999996,"body":"Yeah, it's like, it's such"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":287.65,"endTime":290.94899999999996,"body":"interesting timing and framing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":290.94899999999996,"endTime":293.999,"body":"because you know, I think"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":290.94899999999996,"endTime":293.999,"body":"it's around that time, and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":293.999,"endTime":296.90999999999997,"body":"even still now, it's still"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":293.999,"endTime":296.90999999999997,"body":"sort of progressing this sort"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":296.90999999999997,"endTime":300.30999999999995,"body":"of appreciation of the human"},{"speaker":"Galen 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project"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":323.90999999999997,"endTime":325.23,"body":"management around the brain."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":325.45000000000005,"endTime":328.20000000000005,"body":"So, sometimes it just means"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":325.45000000000005,"endTime":328.20000000000005,"body":"your methodologies are"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":328.22,"endTime":329.669,"body":"updated to account for that."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":329.86,"endTime":331.119,"body":"I wonder if"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":329.86,"endTime":331.119,"body":"maybe you could kind of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":331.129,"endTime":334.40999999999997,"body":"give us a few examples of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":331.129,"endTime":334.40999999999997,"body":"like what behavioral project"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":334.40999999999997,"endTime":335.82000000000005,"body":"management entails for you."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":336.03,"endTime":338.96000000000004,"body":"And maybe even just like"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":336.03,"endTime":338.96000000000004,"body":"some places where it's being"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":338.96000000000004,"endTime":341.86,"body":"practiced today, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":338.96000000000004,"endTime":341.86,"body":"with help from the Institute."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":342.13,"endTime":343.73,"body":"It is an"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":342.13,"endTime":343.73,"body":"emerging discipline."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":344.105,"endTime":348.125,"body":"So we've got, I would say in"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":344.105,"endTime":348.125,"body":"terms of practicing, you know,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":348.125,"endTime":351.025,"body":"we've had a few pilot studies"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":348.125,"endTime":351.025,"body":"out there that I've done."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":351.18499999999995,"endTime":354.42499999999995,"body":"A big one was in department of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":351.18499999999995,"endTime":354.42499999999995,"body":"energy where we got about an"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":354.42499999999995,"endTime":357.79499999999996,"body":"80% improvement in planning,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":354.42499999999995,"endTime":357.79499999999996,"body":"reliability, and essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":357.79499999999996,"endTime":359.23400000000004,"body":"meeting milestones more."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":359.67499999999995,"endTime":361.80499999999995,"body":"Of course, we have our"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":359.67499999999995,"endTime":361.80499999999995,"body":"neuro plan practitioners"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":361.80499999999995,"endTime":363.855,"body":"out there who are certified"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":361.80499999999995,"endTime":363.855,"body":"and practicing, and so"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":363.855,"endTime":366.21500000000003,"body":"they're starting to develop"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":363.855,"endTime":366.21500000000003,"body":"their own models as well."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":366.46500000000003,"endTime":368.71000000000004,"body":"But yeah, so, when we think"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":366.46500000000003,"endTime":368.71000000000004,"body":"of project management, we"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":368.79999999999995,"endTime":370.85,"body":"think of, you know, like old"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":368.79999999999995,"endTime":370.85,"body":"school project management"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":370.96000000000004,"endTime":373.20000000000005,"body":"from Waterfall would be like,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":370.96000000000004,"endTime":373.20000000000005,"body":"you know, you have initiating"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":373.20000000000005,"endTime":376.6,"body":"phase, planning, executing,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":373.20000000000005,"endTime":376.6,"body":"monitor, control, close."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":377.05999999999995,"endTime":379.57899999999995,"body":"But from a behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":377.05999999999995,"endTime":379.57899999999995,"body":"standpoint, we look at it"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":379.58000000000004,"endTime":384.289,"body":"from where can you design"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":379.58000000000004,"endTime":384.289,"body":"around the brain, and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":384.289,"endTime":387.539,"body":"so we've got more like"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":384.289,"endTime":387.539,"body":"modalities of behavioral PM."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":387.98900000000003,"endTime":392.23900000000003,"body":"So, right now, from what we see,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":387.98900000000003,"endTime":392.23900000000003,"body":"there are four major ones, which"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":392.299,"endTime":398.125,"body":"are processes, interfaces, such"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":392.299,"endTime":398.125,"body":"as software, metrics and skills."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":398.45500000000004,"endTime":401.235,"body":"And so typically when we think"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":398.45500000000004,"endTime":401.235,"body":"of behavioral science, we would"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":401.235,"endTime":403.725,"body":"think, oh, it's kind of like"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":401.235,"endTime":403.725,"body":"sit on the couch and tell me"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":403.725,"endTime":405.05499999999995,"body":"how you feel type deal, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":405.245,"endTime":407.03499999999997,"body":"Emotional intelligence,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":405.245,"endTime":407.03499999999997,"body":"good communication."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":407.385,"endTime":409.71400000000006,"body":"Yeah, that's all part of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":407.385,"endTime":409.71400000000006,"body":"behavioral science too, but"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":409.71500000000003,"endTime":411.495,"body":"that's like maybe 20% of it."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":411.755,"endTime":414.164,"body":"The other part of that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":411.755,"endTime":414.164,"body":"is you can use behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":414.19500000000005,"endTime":417.794,"body":"science to essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":414.19500000000005,"endTime":417.794,"body":"design your processes."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":418.03499999999997,"endTime":420.605,"body":"So when I say the four"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":418.03499999999997,"endTime":420.605,"body":"modalities of behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":420.605,"endTime":423.985,"body":"PM - processes, interfaces,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":420.605,"endTime":423.985,"body":"metrics, and skills."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":424.53499999999997,"endTime":426.29499999999996,"body":"Typically, when we think"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":424.53499999999997,"endTime":426.29499999999996,"body":"of behavioral science, we"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":426.29499999999996,"endTime":428.145,"body":"only think of it in the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":426.29499999999996,"endTime":428.145,"body":"skills category, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":428.145,"endTime":431.55499999999995,"body":"Like teach me how to be a better"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":428.145,"endTime":431.55499999999995,"body":"leader or teach me how to, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":431.55499999999995,"endTime":434.745,"body":"know, communicate better or"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":431.55499999999995,"endTime":434.745,"body":"de bias myself, for example."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":434.78499999999997,"endTime":435.71400000000006,"body":"Okay, that's great."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":435.775,"endTime":437.265,"body":"That's just the skills portion."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":437.70500000000004,"endTime":438.765,"body":"What about your software?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":439.154,"endTime":442.16499999999996,"body":"You can design your processes"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":439.154,"endTime":442.16499999999996,"body":"and your software that are"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":442.16499999999996,"endTime":445.015,"body":"more centered around human"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":442.16499999999996,"endTime":445.015,"body":"behavior to account for human"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":445.015,"endTime":446.255,"body":"behavior and thinking errors."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":446.275,"endTime":448.485,"body":"For example, you can"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":446.275,"endTime":448.485,"body":"change your metrics."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":448.78499999999997,"endTime":451.245,"body":"You can design your"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":448.78499999999997,"endTime":451.245,"body":"procedures and your processes"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":451.28499999999997,"endTime":452.44500000000005,"body":"to take certain steps."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":453.144,"endTime":453.46400000000006,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":453.46400000000006,"endTime":457.534,"body":"That you would maybe not have"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":453.46400000000006,"endTime":457.534,"body":"had in there otherwise, but"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":457.56399999999996,"endTime":460.18499999999995,"body":"behavioral science has shown you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":457.56399999999996,"endTime":460.18499999999995,"body":"that you need this additional"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":460.18499999999995,"endTime":461.70399999999995,"body":"step to get more reliability."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":462.095,"endTime":464.67499999999995,"body":"So it's a very broad range."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":464.745,"endTime":466.775,"body":"I mean, there's nudging,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":464.745,"endTime":466.775,"body":"there's choice architecture."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":467.32899999999995,"endTime":469.61,"body":"All the things that maybe"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":467.32899999999995,"endTime":469.61,"body":"some people have heard of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":469.629,"endTime":472.509,"body":"before, you can plug that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":469.629,"endTime":472.509,"body":"in, in various modalities."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":473.04999999999995,"endTime":473.41999999999996,"body":"I love that."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":473.41999999999996,"endTime":475.33900000000006,"body":"I'm going to get you to give"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":473.41999999999996,"endTime":475.33900000000006,"body":"some examples in a little bit,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":475.33900000000006,"endTime":477.97,"body":"but what I'm really interested"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":475.33900000000006,"endTime":477.97,"body":"in is that, you know, coming"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":477.97,"endTime":480.24,"body":"into this, I was thinking,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":477.97,"endTime":480.24,"body":"I'm like, okay, is behavioral"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":480.24,"endTime":483.10900000000004,"body":"project management going to, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":480.24,"endTime":483.10900000000004,"body":"know, be this new methodology?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":483.30999999999995,"endTime":486.24,"body":"You know, is it going to try and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":483.30999999999995,"endTime":486.24,"body":"get, you know, in the ring with"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":486.259,"endTime":488.769,"body":"the sort of Waterfall/Agile,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":486.259,"endTime":488.769,"body":"you know, debate?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":489.18499999999995,"endTime":490.275,"body":"Or is it something different?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":490.275,"endTime":491.875,"body":"Is it like a philosophy"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":490.275,"endTime":491.875,"body":"or a framework?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":491.875,"endTime":494.67499999999995,"body":"But like, I love that you use"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":491.875,"endTime":494.67499999999995,"body":"the word design, especially"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":494.67499999999995,"endTime":495.68499999999995,"body":"when you said process design."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":495.68499999999995,"endTime":497.755,"body":"I'm like, Oh yeah, it's like,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":495.68499999999995,"endTime":497.755,"body":"I don't know, in my head, I'm"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":497.755,"endTime":499.145,"body":"thinking it's another layer."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":499.155,"endTime":500.29499999999996,"body":"It's like another step."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":500.29499999999996,"endTime":503.42499999999995,"body":"You could be using whatever"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":500.29499999999996,"endTime":503.42499999999995,"body":"approach, whatever methodology,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":503.72400000000005,"endTime":507.054,"body":"but when it comes down to really"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":503.72400000000005,"endTime":507.054,"body":"detailing how the product's"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":507.05499999999995,"endTime":509.385,"body":"going to go, how these processes"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":507.05499999999995,"endTime":509.385,"body":"are going to go, how we're"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":509.385,"endTime":511.905,"body":"interfacing with software, like"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":509.385,"endTime":511.905,"body":"what that experience is like."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":512.205,"endTime":514.385,"body":"That's when we layer"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":512.205,"endTime":514.385,"body":"in the sort of the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":514.385,"endTime":515.574,"body":"behavioral side of things."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":515.824,"endTime":516.124,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":516.314,"endTime":520.215,"body":"We say behavioral PM isn't"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":516.314,"endTime":520.215,"body":"going to replace Waterfall."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":520.225,"endTime":521.155,"body":"It's not going to replace Agile."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":521.989,"endTime":525.1,"body":"Essentially what it's going"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":521.989,"endTime":525.1,"body":"to do is embed behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":525.1,"endTime":527.2,"body":"science in every methodology."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":527.64,"endTime":529.32,"body":"Because humans, we are humans."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":529.6,"endTime":530.88,"body":"We have human behavior."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":530.88,"endTime":532.74,"body":"We have cognition, thinking."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":533.069,"endTime":536.379,"body":"And so essentially every"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":533.069,"endTime":536.379,"body":"methodology that we use,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":536.54,"endTime":537.67,"body":"there is a human involved."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":538.05,"endTime":540.03,"body":"So essentially a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":538.05,"endTime":540.03,"body":"behavioral PM becomes"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":540.079,"endTime":542.98,"body":"the foundation upon which"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":540.079,"endTime":542.98,"body":"other technical disciplines"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":543.02,"endTime":544.05,"body":"can continue to build."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":544.5,"endTime":547.02,"body":"Because many things that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":544.5,"endTime":547.02,"body":"are common to all humans"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":547.15,"endTime":549.27,"body":"will be common throughout"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":547.15,"endTime":549.27,"body":"all methodologies."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":549.8,"endTime":551.8199999999999,"body":"So Behavioral PM is not one"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":549.8,"endTime":551.8199999999999,"body":"of those things you could"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":551.8199999999999,"endTime":554.6999999999999,"body":"say, Well, okay, now I'm going"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":551.8199999999999,"endTime":554.6999999999999,"body":"to stop using Agile because"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":554.6999999999999,"endTime":555.97,"body":"I've adopted Behavioral PM."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":556.1899999999999,"endTime":559.209,"body":"No, you're actually going to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":556.1899999999999,"endTime":559.209,"body":"use Behavioral PM with all"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":559.2099999999999,"endTime":561.769,"body":"of those methodologies, and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":559.2099999999999,"endTime":561.769,"body":"eventually they will be embedded"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":561.77,"endTime":562.9399999999999,"body":"in all those methodologies."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":562.9789999999999,"endTime":566.0699999999999,"body":"And I'll give you an example,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":562.9789999999999,"endTime":566.0699999999999,"body":"Behavioral Economics, because,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":566.2289999999999,"endTime":568.27,"body":"you know, Behavioral Economics"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":566.2289999999999,"endTime":568.27,"body":"has been around for, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":568.27,"endTime":569.42,"body":"know, a couple of decades."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":569.9649999999999,"endTime":573.105,"body":"And essentially what they did"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":569.9649999999999,"endTime":573.105,"body":"is when they inserted behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":573.105,"endTime":576.515,"body":"science into the technical"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":573.105,"endTime":576.515,"body":"discipline of economics, what"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":576.515,"endTime":580.2149999999999,"body":"they found is that it called"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":576.515,"endTime":580.2149999999999,"body":"into question many traditional"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":580.2239999999999,"endTime":581.115,"body":"theories in economics."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":581.645,"endTime":583.8349999999999,"body":"Because economics essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":581.645,"endTime":583.8349999999999,"body":"just assumed that all"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":583.8349999999999,"endTime":586.3539999999999,"body":"beings were just rational"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":583.8349999999999,"endTime":586.3539999999999,"body":"and, you know, perfect"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":586.3539999999999,"endTime":587.6039999999999,"body":"decision makers, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":587.934,"endTime":590.2339999999999,"body":"So in behavioral economics,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":587.934,"endTime":590.2339999999999,"body":"they call that fictitional"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":590.254,"endTime":593.304,"body":"person homo economicus,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":590.254,"endTime":593.304,"body":"which is essentially means,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":593.394,"endTime":596.294,"body":"you know, it's this person"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":593.394,"endTime":596.294,"body":"that doesn't exist that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":596.294,"endTime":597.3439999999999,"body":"makes perfect decisions."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":597.674,"endTime":600.435,"body":"And so when you insert"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":597.674,"endTime":600.435,"body":"behavioral science into it, what"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":600.435,"endTime":604.384,"body":"you find is that it upends many"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":600.435,"endTime":604.384,"body":"of the traditional technical"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":604.384,"endTime":605.675,"body":"theories that we assumed."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":606.035,"endTime":608.0939999999999,"body":"It'll do the same thing"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":606.035,"endTime":608.0939999999999,"body":"with project management,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":608.295,"endTime":610.805,"body":"and it'll enable us to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":608.295,"endTime":610.805,"body":"essentially kind of clean"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":610.875,"endTime":612.9449999999999,"body":"up some of the complication."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":613.6949999999999,"endTime":615.395,"body":"Behavioral science, you think,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":613.6949999999999,"endTime":615.395,"body":"well, we're going to adopt"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":615.395,"endTime":617.244,"body":"this new discipline, it's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":615.395,"endTime":617.244,"body":"going to make it more complex."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":617.515,"endTime":619.8539999999999,"body":"Actually, as a cognitive"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":617.515,"endTime":619.8539999999999,"body":"scientist, I'm going to tell"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":619.8539999999999,"endTime":622.7239999999999,"body":"you, our idea is actually"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":619.8539999999999,"endTime":622.7239999999999,"body":"to make things more simple"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":623.04,"endTime":625.42,"body":"because that enables the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":623.04,"endTime":625.42,"body":"brain to process better."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":625.77,"endTime":627.22,"body":"In my head, I'm"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":625.77,"endTime":627.22,"body":"thinking, I'm like, okay,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":627.22,"endTime":629.8,"body":"well, throughout all of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":627.22,"endTime":629.8,"body":"this, like, how much is"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":629.8,"endTime":632.68,"body":"actually up to the project"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":629.8,"endTime":632.68,"body":"manager in this scenario?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":632.799,"endTime":634.72,"body":"I think a lot of our listeners"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":632.799,"endTime":634.72,"body":"might be like, okay, well,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":635.009,"endTime":637.61,"body":"I'm not gonna like, start"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":635.009,"endTime":637.61,"body":"from scratch and rewrite"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":637.61,"endTime":640.6999999999999,"body":"every process for every"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":637.61,"endTime":640.6999999999999,"body":"project to account for"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":640.6999999999999,"endTime":642.0989999999999,"body":"human behavior differently."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":642.159,"endTime":644.8199999999999,"body":"Is this something where,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":642.159,"endTime":644.8199999999999,"body":"you know, like, the sort"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":644.8199999999999,"endTime":647.98,"body":"of neural PMs and the folks"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":644.8199999999999,"endTime":647.98,"body":"that you certify and folks"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":647.98,"endTime":650.1,"body":"just practicing this, like,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":647.98,"endTime":650.1,"body":"is that what they're doing?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":650.11,"endTime":651.35,"body":"Are they going, okay,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":650.11,"endTime":651.35,"body":"well, listen, I need to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":651.35,"endTime":654.4599999999999,"body":"redesign a project process"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":651.35,"endTime":654.4599999999999,"body":"with humans in mind."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":654.73,"endTime":657.069,"body":"And I'll use these guiding"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":654.73,"endTime":657.069,"body":"principles, but fundamentally"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":657.069,"endTime":659.16,"body":"it's another sort of stream"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":657.069,"endTime":659.16,"body":"of work that I need to do to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":659.16,"endTime":660.42,"body":"make sure my project goes well."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":660.7389999999999,"endTime":663.619,"body":"Or is it maybe, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":660.7389999999999,"endTime":663.619,"body":"more collaborative or bigger"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":663.619,"endTime":665.9689999999999,"body":"than just the responsibility"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":663.619,"endTime":665.9689999999999,"body":"of the project manager?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":666.3149999999999,"endTime":668.115,"body":"Yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":666.3149999999999,"endTime":668.115,"body":"definitely bigger than the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":668.115,"endTime":669.765,"body":"responsibility of just the PM."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":669.795,"endTime":672.515,"body":"Matter of fact, I think one"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":669.795,"endTime":672.515,"body":"of the biggest places that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":672.515,"endTime":675.685,"body":"we'll probably see the first"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":672.515,"endTime":675.685,"body":"changes will be in the PMO."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":676.8349999999999,"endTime":678.605,"body":"Another name for that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":676.8349999999999,"endTime":678.605,"body":"is what we're calling is"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":678.755,"endTime":680.345,"body":"more of a behavioral PMO."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":680.765,"endTime":684.595,"body":"So it's like the PMO is where"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":680.765,"endTime":684.595,"body":"you would probably start."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":684.655,"endTime":687.055,"body":"It's essentially that's where"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":684.655,"endTime":687.055,"body":"you start to kind of roll out"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":687.055,"endTime":688.7049999999999,"body":"some of those changes, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":688.994,"endTime":692.754,"body":"And sometimes it's completely"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":688.994,"endTime":692.754,"body":"up to the organization itself"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":692.784,"endTime":697.004,"body":"outside of the control of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":692.784,"endTime":697.004,"body":"the PM in terms of designing"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":697.014,"endTime":698.5749999999999,"body":"that cognitive environment."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":698.5849999999999,"endTime":700.8439999999999,"body":"So for example, time"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":698.5849999999999,"endTime":700.8439999999999,"body":"pressure causes us to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":700.884,"endTime":702.304,"body":"think more automatically."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":702.5749999999999,"endTime":705.6039999999999,"body":"We already think"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":702.5749999999999,"endTime":705.6039999999999,"body":"automatically 95% of the day."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":706.055,"endTime":710.355,"body":"And that causes the brain to go"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":706.055,"endTime":710.355,"body":"what behavioral scientists call"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":710.385,"endTime":713.834,"body":"System 1, which is, if you ever"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":710.385,"endTime":713.834,"body":"read the book Thinking Fast and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":713.834,"endTime":715.8149999999999,"body":"Slow, that's that same concept."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":716.165,"endTime":720.645,"body":"So essentially, when we're under"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":716.165,"endTime":720.645,"body":"time pressure, we think faster,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":720.675,"endTime":723.664,"body":"and when we think faster, we're"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":720.675,"endTime":723.664,"body":"not thinking as thoroughly."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":724.174,"endTime":726.9449999999999,"body":"And so what that does is it"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":724.174,"endTime":726.9449999999999,"body":"causes us to use the brain's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":726.9549999999999,"endTime":731.47,"body":"heuristic system, which makes"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":726.9549999999999,"endTime":731.47,"body":"us default certain directions."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":731.48,"endTime":734.1899999999999,"body":"Sometimes those directions"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":731.48,"endTime":734.1899999999999,"body":"are not good, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":734.3299999999999,"endTime":737.8,"body":"For example, we may default"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":734.3299999999999,"endTime":737.8,"body":"to the most obvious answer or"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":737.8,"endTime":741.42,"body":"we default to something that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":737.8,"endTime":741.42,"body":"can quickly come to mind."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":741.89,"endTime":743.48,"body":"So that would be"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":741.89,"endTime":743.48,"body":"more heuristic based."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":743.55,"endTime":747.18,"body":"And when we default to those, we"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":743.55,"endTime":747.18,"body":"actually rely on more cognitive"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":747.1899999999999,"endTime":750.42,"body":"biases to do our decision"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":747.1899999999999,"endTime":750.42,"body":"making and project management."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":750.49,"endTime":752.8199999999999,"body":"So by default, in a sense,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":750.49,"endTime":752.8199999999999,"body":"if you look at project"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":752.8199999999999,"endTime":755.4399999999999,"body":"management and its definition,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":752.8199999999999,"endTime":755.4399999999999,"body":"it's a temporary endeavor to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":755.4399999999999,"endTime":756.62,"body":"deliver a product or service."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":756.89,"endTime":759.56,"body":"Temporary endeavor"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":756.89,"endTime":759.56,"body":"creates time pressure."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":759.68,"endTime":761.449,"body":"Time pressure creates System 1."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":761.47,"endTime":764.039,"body":"System 1 causes potential"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":761.47,"endTime":764.039,"body":"more thinking errors."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":764.29,"endTime":767.13,"body":"And that essentially increases"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":764.29,"endTime":767.13,"body":"your risk and causes schedule"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":767.13,"endTime":768.38,"body":"delays and cost overruns."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":768.86,"endTime":771.68,"body":"So, back to how the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":768.86,"endTime":771.68,"body":"organization can control"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":771.68,"endTime":774.9499999999999,"body":"that, is the organization"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":771.68,"endTime":774.9499999999999,"body":"can control time pressure."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":775.2189999999999,"endTime":777.4889999999999,"body":"The organization can"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":775.2189999999999,"endTime":777.4889999999999,"body":"control cognitive load"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":777.49,"endTime":778.6899999999999,"body":"or psychological safety."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":778.99,"endTime":781.4,"body":"So, it's not just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":778.99,"endTime":781.4,"body":"in the PM's hands."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":781.769,"endTime":782.29,"body":"That's fair."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":782.3,"endTime":785.4789999999999,"body":"No, and I like that in terms"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":782.3,"endTime":785.4789999999999,"body":"of like, the overarching,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":785.53,"endTime":788.0699999999999,"body":"you know, body or centralized"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":785.53,"endTime":788.0699999999999,"body":"project management, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":788.0799999999999,"endTime":790.67,"body":"office or whatever you call"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":788.0799999999999,"endTime":790.67,"body":"it at your organization."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":791.005,"endTime":793.235,"body":"I wonder, maybe you can walk"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":791.005,"endTime":793.235,"body":"through an example, because I"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":793.235,"endTime":796.5649999999999,"body":"like that idea, and I know I've"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":793.235,"endTime":796.5649999999999,"body":"been in projects where, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":796.5649999999999,"endTime":797.885,"body":"know, we kind of recognize that."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":797.885,"endTime":798.885,"body":"We're like, good enough, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":798.885,"endTime":800.5749999999999,"body":"We'll say things like, okay,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":798.885,"endTime":800.5749999999999,"body":"yeah, you know, good enough"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":800.584,"endTime":801.425,"body":"for this, good enough for that."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":801.545,"endTime":804.4549999999999,"body":"We're going, you know, we're"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":801.545,"endTime":804.4549999999999,"body":"using the sort of fast think"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":804.545,"endTime":806.0649999999999,"body":"heuristics view of the world."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":806.074,"endTime":808.855,"body":"We're probably leveraging"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":806.074,"endTime":808.855,"body":"on, you know, unconscious"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":808.855,"endTime":810.2049999999999,"body":"bias, maybe conscious bias."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":810.365,"endTime":811.885,"body":"We're kind of shortcutting"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":810.365,"endTime":811.885,"body":"our way through."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":812.0649999999999,"endTime":814.275,"body":"And then when I like rewind,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":812.0649999999999,"endTime":814.275,"body":"I'm like, I think that's what"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":814.275,"endTime":817.495,"body":"a lot of project managers,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":814.275,"endTime":817.495,"body":"myself included, kind of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":817.625,"endTime":818.865,"body":"think our job is, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":818.885,"endTime":820.995,"body":"Is like, we have time"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":818.885,"endTime":820.995,"body":"pressure and we have to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":820.995,"endTime":821.9649999999999,"body":"manage time pressure."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":822.035,"endTime":824.185,"body":"Time pressure is"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":822.035,"endTime":824.185,"body":"almost a constant."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":824.2149999999999,"endTime":825.295,"body":"It's going to exist."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":825.415,"endTime":829.7339999999999,"body":"And yet, you know, what does a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":825.415,"endTime":829.7339999999999,"body":"world look like where we allow"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":829.735,"endTime":833.665,"body":"our teams to not work under"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":829.735,"endTime":833.665,"body":"this sort of time pressure?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":833.994,"endTime":835.4739999999999,"body":"What does that look like"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":833.994,"endTime":835.4739999999999,"body":"and how does it work?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":835.664,"endTime":837.664,"body":"I think in terms"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":835.664,"endTime":837.664,"body":"of time pressure, what you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":837.664,"endTime":840.794,"body":"have to realize is it's where"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":837.664,"endTime":840.794,"body":"you're using time pressure and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":840.794,"endTime":841.824,"body":"the level of time pressure."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":841.824,"endTime":843.504,"body":"Some time pressure is okay."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":843.9,"endTime":846.53,"body":"Extreme time pressure is"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":843.9,"endTime":846.53,"body":"going to give you more"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":846.93,"endTime":848.4689999999999,"body":"defaulted thinking, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":848.73,"endTime":852.38,"body":"So it's not only how much"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":848.73,"endTime":852.38,"body":"time pressure, but when."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":852.67,"endTime":855.17,"body":"So if you're doing things"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":852.67,"endTime":855.17,"body":"that require a lot of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":855.1899999999999,"endTime":858.52,"body":"predictability, so for example,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":855.1899999999999,"endTime":858.52,"body":"if you're talking anything"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":858.54,"endTime":861.435,"body":"predictive such as creating"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":858.54,"endTime":861.435,"body":"a plan, which is predictive."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":861.785,"endTime":864.095,"body":"If you are doing risk"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":861.785,"endTime":864.095,"body":"identification, that's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":864.115,"endTime":865.175,"body":"predictive, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":865.185,"endTime":867.9549999999999,"body":"If you're doing resource"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":865.185,"endTime":867.9549999999999,"body":"estimation, also predicted."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":868.324,"endTime":869.395,"body":"Those are predictive things."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":869.6139999999999,"endTime":871.555,"body":"Anytime you do anything"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":869.6139999999999,"endTime":871.555,"body":"predictive, you should"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":871.5649999999999,"endTime":874.145,"body":"be reducing time pressure"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":871.5649999999999,"endTime":874.145,"body":"specifically in those areas."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":874.5699999999999,"endTime":876.8299999999999,"body":"If you're just looking at"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":874.5699999999999,"endTime":876.8299999999999,"body":"monitoring, controlling,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":877.14,"endTime":880.4399999999999,"body":"and you're just, you know,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":877.14,"endTime":880.4399999999999,"body":"getting feedback and creating"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":880.4399999999999,"endTime":883.37,"body":"reports, maybe time pressure"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":880.4399999999999,"endTime":883.37,"body":"can be a little higher than"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":883.55,"endTime":885.48,"body":"because it's more redacted"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":883.55,"endTime":885.48,"body":"and it is predictive."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":886.009,"endTime":887.659,"body":"But if you're doing"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":886.009,"endTime":887.659,"body":"anything predictive, time"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":887.66,"endTime":889.629,"body":"pressure should be lower"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":887.66,"endTime":889.629,"body":"than because essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":889.629,"endTime":892.05,"body":"that's when you become more"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":889.629,"endTime":892.05,"body":"defaulted in your thinking."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":892.295,"endTime":894.5749999999999,"body":"I remember and I wish"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":892.295,"endTime":894.5749999999999,"body":"I had this conversation with"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":894.5749999999999,"endTime":898.795,"body":"you like 12 years ago because"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":894.5749999999999,"endTime":898.795,"body":"we, you know, I've worked on a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":898.795,"endTime":901.245,"body":"couple of projects where, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":898.795,"endTime":901.245,"body":"know, there's a lot of technical"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":901.245,"endTime":902.355,"body":"complexity or ambiguity."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":902.355,"endTime":905.245,"body":"We don't really know what the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":902.355,"endTime":905.245,"body":"solution is or, you know, in"},{"speaker":"Galen 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what, what do you mean?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":927.4449999999999,"endTime":930.0939999999999,"body":"Like, can't you just like, don't"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":927.4449999999999,"endTime":930.0939999999999,"body":"you just know how to do this?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":930.4499999999999,"endTime":932.8199999999999,"body":"And I would have loved to have"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":930.4499999999999,"endTime":932.8199999999999,"body":"had that argument up my sleeve"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":932.8199999999999,"endTime":935.74,"body":"to be like, well, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":932.8199999999999,"endTime":935.74,"body":"we can think fast, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":935.74,"endTime":938.26,"body":"and rely on our assumptions"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":935.74,"endTime":938.26,"body":"and produce the wrong thing."},{"speaker":"Galen 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like,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":975.374,"endTime":977.254,"body":"and this is where the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":977.254,"endTime":978.184,"body":"biased thinking comes in."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":978.814,"endTime":981.744,"body":"Yeah, but I think better"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":978.814,"endTime":981.744,"body":"under time pressure, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":982.174,"endTime":982.994,"body":"Sure, okay."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":983.164,"endTime":984.824,"body":"If you want to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":983.164,"endTime":984.824,"body":"believe that, yep."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":985.564,"endTime":988.934,"body":"Or, all I need is a couple good"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":985.564,"endTime":988.934,"body":"cups of coffee and that's going"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":988.934,"endTime":990.2139999999999,"body":"to reduce my cognitive load."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":990.454,"endTime":992.694,"body":"Sorry, that brain doesn't"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":990.454,"endTime":992.694,"body":"work that way, you know?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":992.8539999999999,"endTime":995.794,"body":"And so, if you realize that a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":992.8539999999999,"endTime":995.794,"body":"lot of these things are common"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":995.794,"endTime":998.544,"body":"to all human beings, that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":995.794,"endTime":998.544,"body":"there's neuroscience behind a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":998.544,"endTime":1001.6039999999999,"body":"lot of it as well, then you can"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":998.544,"endTime":1001.6039999999999,"body":"kind of learn to accept that,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1001.6039999999999,"endTime":1005.324,"body":"hey, you know, we all kind of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1001.6039999999999,"endTime":1005.324,"body":"have these same kind of brain"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1005.394,"endTime":1008.124,"body":"functions, and so we all have"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1005.394,"endTime":1008.124,"body":"to account for them, there's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1008.134,"endTime":1009.384,"body":"none of us that are special."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1009.8639999999999,"endTime":1013.064,"body":"What makes us more special"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1009.8639999999999,"endTime":1013.064,"body":"and skilled in that area is"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1013.0939999999999,"endTime":1016.274,"body":"knowing how it affects us so"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1013.0939999999999,"endTime":1016.274,"body":"that we can calibrate that."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1016.4839999999999,"endTime":1018.394,"body":"I just like"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1016.4839999999999,"endTime":1018.394,"body":"the thematic tie as well"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1018.394,"endTime":1020.904,"body":"because, I mean, especially"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1018.394,"endTime":1020.904,"body":"project managers, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1020.904,"endTime":1023.424,"body":"Like, you know, we're talking"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1020.904,"endTime":1023.424,"body":"about, you know, \"old\" school"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1023.444,"endTime":1024.534,"body":"models of project management."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1025.0140000000001,"endTime":1027.354,"body":"And not that long ago, right,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1025.0140000000001,"endTime":1027.354,"body":"a lot of project managers"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1027.354,"endTime":1029.734,"body":"thought their role was to just"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1027.354,"endTime":1029.734,"body":"get it done on time, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1029.7440000000001,"endTime":1032.724,"body":"Like, so, if you can get it"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1029.7440000000001,"endTime":1032.724,"body":"done fast, then that's good."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1032.904,"endTime":1034.714,"body":"And more and more we're"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1032.904,"endTime":1034.714,"body":"realizing that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1034.7740000000001,"endTime":1038.064,"body":"our role is actually to,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1034.7740000000001,"endTime":1038.064,"body":"you know, a) manage a team"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1038.064,"endTime":1040.044,"body":"of humans that probably"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1038.064,"endTime":1040.044,"body":"don't always work together."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1040.104,"endTime":1043.154,"body":"So, I can see how behavioral"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1040.104,"endTime":1043.154,"body":"science could be handy there."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1043.394,"endTime":1045.914,"body":"But also we're responsible"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1043.394,"endTime":1045.914,"body":"for delivering value."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1045.934,"endTime":1048.434,"body":"So thinking fast and getting"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1045.934,"endTime":1048.434,"body":"it done and checking something"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1048.434,"endTime":1050.504,"body":"off of the list doesn't"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1048.434,"endTime":1050.504,"body":"mean good enough anymore."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1050.624,"endTime":1053.024,"body":"Before I could say, yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1050.624,"endTime":1053.024,"body":"got it done on time and I'm"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1053.024,"endTime":1055.014,"body":"a project manager and that's"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1053.024,"endTime":1055.014,"body":"all that really matters."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1055.014,"endTime":1056.844,"body":"It's under budget"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1055.014,"endTime":1056.844,"body":"or is on budget."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1057.024,"endTime":1059.834,"body":"We didn't do anything extra, no"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1057.024,"endTime":1059.834,"body":"gold plating, like it's perfect."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1060.094,"endTime":1061.774,"body":"But if it's the wrong thing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1060.094,"endTime":1061.774,"body":"and we didn't take the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1061.774,"endTime":1064.244,"body":"time to actually create the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1061.774,"endTime":1064.244,"body":"environment for someone to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1064.244,"endTime":1067.819,"body":"come up with a better solution,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1064.244,"endTime":1067.819,"body":"then is that really success?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1068.129,"endTime":1070.649,"body":"And that's what I like"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1068.129,"endTime":1070.649,"body":"about sort of the, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1070.649,"endTime":1073.529,"body":"know, the behavioral"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1070.649,"endTime":1073.529,"body":"science lens to all of this."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1074.049,"endTime":1074.479,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1074.559,"endTime":1077.529,"body":"And, you know, and kind"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1074.559,"endTime":1077.529,"body":"of echoing some of that on"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1077.529,"endTime":1081.359,"body":"another pilot study I did,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1077.529,"endTime":1081.359,"body":"I found about 65% of our"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1081.379,"endTime":1084.399,"body":"schedule delays were actually"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1081.379,"endTime":1084.399,"body":"predictable and preventable."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1084.9189999999999,"endTime":1087.599,"body":"And just to pull the string"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1084.9189999999999,"endTime":1087.599,"body":"on one of those, what I"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1087.609,"endTime":1091.789,"body":"found is in some cases, that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1087.609,"endTime":1091.789,"body":"predictable event that we"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1091.789,"endTime":1095.629,"body":"misforecasted essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1091.789,"endTime":1095.629,"body":"had waste inside of it."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1095.759,"endTime":1101.1789999999999,"body":"So for example, Team A is on"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1095.759,"endTime":1101.1789999999999,"body":"location and doing their thing."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1101.709,"endTime":1104.749,"body":"Team B forecasted that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1101.709,"endTime":1104.749,"body":"next week they're going to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1104.749,"endTime":1106.129,"body":"be at that same location."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1106.579,"endTime":1109.569,"body":"Except they didn't bother to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1106.579,"endTime":1109.569,"body":"pick up the phone to see if"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1109.569,"endTime":1112.539,"body":"Team A was going to be in the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1109.569,"endTime":1112.539,"body":"spot where they needed to be."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1112.969,"endTime":1116.949,"body":"Team B then shows up where Team"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1112.969,"endTime":1116.949,"body":"A is working and can't work."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1117.519,"endTime":1118.4089999999999,"body":"Where's the waste?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1118.459,"endTime":1120.599,"body":"Well, the waste is in now"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1118.459,"endTime":1120.599,"body":"Team B has to redeploy to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1120.979,"endTime":1123.4189999999999,"body":"another project because this"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1120.979,"endTime":1123.4189999999999,"body":"is the one they had planned."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1123.859,"endTime":1127.609,"body":"If they can redeploy to another"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1123.859,"endTime":1127.609,"body":"project, assume it takes them,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1127.949,"endTime":1130.819,"body":"you know, another day before"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1127.949,"endTime":1130.819,"body":"they can start another project."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1131.289,"endTime":1134.899,"body":"Essentially, you've got my"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1131.289,"endTime":1134.899,"body":"particular example, six guys"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1135.199,"endTime":1139.329,"body":"and gals who show up at you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1135.199,"endTime":1139.329,"body":"say a burdened rate of a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1139.329,"endTime":1140.939,"body":"hundred bucks an hour, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1140.959,"endTime":1142.859,"body":"And they're going to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1140.959,"endTime":1142.859,"body":"have an eight hour day."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1143.319,"endTime":1145.289,"body":"Essentially, you just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1143.319,"endTime":1145.289,"body":"wasted, you know, five"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1145.319,"endTime":1149.649,"body":"grand in downtime because"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1145.319,"endTime":1149.649,"body":"you made a bad prediction."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1149.949,"endTime":1152.719,"body":"So planning isn't just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1149.949,"endTime":1152.719,"body":"essentially anything predictive."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1152.959,"endTime":1155.329,"body":"Anytime you're making a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1152.959,"endTime":1155.329,"body":"prediction is planning, whether"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1155.329,"endTime":1157.6589999999999,"body":"you're predicting what you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1155.329,"endTime":1157.6589999999999,"body":"will do tomorrow, predicting"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1157.6589999999999,"endTime":1158.769,"body":"what you do a month from now."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1159.119,"endTime":1163.819,"body":"And there's waste involved"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1159.119,"endTime":1163.819,"body":"with not thinking and using"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1163.829,"endTime":1166.789,"body":"that de biasing technique to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1163.829,"endTime":1166.789,"body":"predict and plan your work."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1167.019,"endTime":1169.069,"body":"Because planning is really"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1167.019,"endTime":1169.069,"body":"predictive coordination, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1169.069,"endTime":1172.144,"body":"We're predictively coordinating"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1169.069,"endTime":1172.144,"body":"where things need to be"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1172.154,"endTime":1173.314,"body":"by a particular time."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1173.774,"endTime":1176.844,"body":"And so good planning and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1173.774,"endTime":1176.844,"body":"good prediction essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1176.844,"endTime":1177.884,"body":"goes back to the brain."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1178.224,"endTime":1181.074,"body":"Because the brain is essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1178.224,"endTime":1181.074,"body":"doing imagination in order"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1181.074,"endTime":1183.5439999999999,"body":"to imagine what we will"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1181.074,"endTime":1183.5439999999999,"body":"do tomorrow, for example."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1183.854,"endTime":1185.944,"body":"Because you're not actually"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1183.854,"endTime":1185.944,"body":"doing it, there's nothing"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1185.984,"endTime":1187.0539999999999,"body":"physical to represent it."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1187.444,"endTime":1189.204,"body":"So it's all mental processing."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1189.5339999999999,"endTime":1193.2939999999999,"body":"Planning is essentially an"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1189.5339999999999,"endTime":1193.2939999999999,"body":"exercise in imagination."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1193.834,"endTime":1197.2839999999999,"body":"And so any weaknesses of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1193.834,"endTime":1197.2839999999999,"body":"the brain essentially become"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1197.2839999999999,"endTime":1198.704,"body":"a weakness in prediction."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1199.069,"endTime":1202.939,"body":"And that causes waste and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1199.069,"endTime":1202.939,"body":"cost overrun, and of course,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1202.949,"endTime":1204.099,"body":"schedule delays and risk."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1204.549,"endTime":1206.249,"body":"So maybe talk to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1204.549,"endTime":1206.249,"body":"me about some of the fixes."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1206.449,"endTime":1208.939,"body":"You had mentioned a couple"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1206.449,"endTime":1208.939,"body":"of things earlier and in"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1208.939,"endTime":1210.209,"body":"our previous conversations."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1210.4289999999999,"endTime":1214.109,"body":"The two that I latched onto were"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1210.4289999999999,"endTime":1214.109,"body":"nudging and I think what you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1214.139,"endTime":1215.949,"body":"called obstacle identification."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1216.339,"endTime":1220.6689999999999,"body":"And I'm wondering if we could"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1216.339,"endTime":1220.6689999999999,"body":"sort of apply this to planning"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1220.6689999999999,"endTime":1223.699,"body":"and time pressure, especially"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1220.6689999999999,"endTime":1223.699,"body":"that scenario of like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1223.699,"endTime":1226.914,"body":"if only we had done X or Y,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1223.699,"endTime":1226.914,"body":"this team wouldn't have just,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1226.914,"endTime":1229.154,"body":"you know, been sitting on their"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1226.914,"endTime":1229.154,"body":"hands all day, and we'd have"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1229.154,"endTime":1230.254,"body":"Scythe Grand in our pocket."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1230.664,"endTime":1232.5439999999999,"body":"So,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1230.664,"endTime":1232.5439999999999,"body":"obstacle identification."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1232.5439999999999,"endTime":1235.584,"body":"So, there's research and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1232.5439999999999,"endTime":1235.584,"body":"planning on the behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1235.584,"endTime":1239.474,"body":"side that shows that when you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1235.584,"endTime":1239.474,"body":"identify obstacles to the task"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1239.834,"endTime":1243.364,"body":"or activity completion prior"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1239.834,"endTime":1243.364,"body":"to, this is the key because"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1243.364,"endTime":1244.464,"body":"of the anchoring effect bias."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1245.039,"endTime":1248.1789999999999,"body":"Prior to making an estimate"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1245.039,"endTime":1248.1789999999999,"body":"of resources or estimate of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1248.209,"endTime":1251.519,"body":"time, then the reliability"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1248.209,"endTime":1251.519,"body":"of your plan goes up."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1251.599,"endTime":1253.479,"body":"In other words, you will"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1251.599,"endTime":1253.479,"body":"deliver more on what"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1253.479,"endTime":1254.399,"body":"you said you would do."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1254.729,"endTime":1257.6589999999999,"body":"So the key there is you're"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1254.729,"endTime":1257.6589999999999,"body":"kind of forcing the brain"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1257.6589999999999,"endTime":1262.144,"body":"to look at what gets in the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1257.6589999999999,"endTime":1262.144,"body":"way of completing this work."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1262.474,"endTime":1265.824,"body":"And the key is doing it prior"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1262.474,"endTime":1265.824,"body":"to actually starting it, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1265.824,"endTime":1268.314,"body":"Because once you start it"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1265.824,"endTime":1268.314,"body":"now, you're gonna run into"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1268.314,"endTime":1270.724,"body":"the obstacles versus, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1268.314,"endTime":1270.724,"body":"know, getting a chance to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1270.834,"endTime":1271.814,"body":"deal with them in advance."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1272.2839999999999,"endTime":1275.014,"body":"But there's little kind"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1272.2839999999999,"endTime":1275.014,"body":"of tricks in behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1275.0439999999999,"endTime":1276.004,"body":"science in some cases."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1276.259,"endTime":1279.059,"body":"Things that are kind of really"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1276.259,"endTime":1279.059,"body":"subtle and they seem mundane,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1279.609,"endTime":1283.1689999999999,"body":"but because we don't use them,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1279.609,"endTime":1283.1689999999999,"body":"we're not as effective, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1283.1689999999999,"endTime":1285.839,"body":"And so this also goes back to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1283.1689999999999,"endTime":1285.839,"body":"the kind of project science"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1285.969,"endTime":1288.949,"body":"evidence based side of project"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1285.969,"endTime":1288.949,"body":"management, which is we're not"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1288.949,"endTime":1292.259,"body":"using a lot of evidence based"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1288.949,"endTime":1292.259,"body":"studies to develop our project"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1292.259,"endTime":1293.329,"body":"management methodologies."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1293.899,"endTime":1296.979,"body":"So if you look at something"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1293.899,"endTime":1296.979,"body":"like obstacle identification,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1297.369,"endTime":1299.279,"body":"essentially what the study"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1297.369,"endTime":1299.279,"body":"found is that you've got"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1299.279,"endTime":1303.4289999999999,"body":"more reliable execution by"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1299.279,"endTime":1303.4289999999999,"body":"identifying obstacles prior"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1303.4289999999999,"endTime":1305.1789999999999,"body":"to estimating anything."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1305.579,"endTime":1307.769,"body":"And it's really kind of common"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1305.579,"endTime":1307.769,"body":"sense when you think about"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1307.769,"endTime":1310.829,"body":"it, except for if we're not"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1307.769,"endTime":1310.829,"body":"doing it, then we're not"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1310.839,"endTime":1312.119,"body":"getting the results, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1312.639,"endTime":1315.569,"body":"And then so you'd"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1312.639,"endTime":1315.569,"body":"mentioned nudging or choice"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1315.569,"endTime":1317.699,"body":"architecture, also very subtle."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1318.1689999999999,"endTime":1322.199,"body":"So, for example, they did a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1318.1689999999999,"endTime":1322.199,"body":"study in, I forget which country"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1322.199,"endTime":1324.359,"body":"it was, but essentially what"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1322.199,"endTime":1324.359,"body":"they were looking at was how"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1324.369,"endTime":1326.329,"body":"do we increase organ donation."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1326.779,"endTime":1332.384,"body":"And what they found is that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1326.779,"endTime":1332.384,"body":"they changed the defaults in"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1332.384,"endTime":1334.504,"body":"terms of when people would,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1332.384,"endTime":1334.504,"body":"you know, sign up to get"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1334.504,"endTime":1337.244,"body":"their license or whatever they"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1334.504,"endTime":1337.244,"body":"would do, they would change"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1337.244,"endTime":1342.004,"body":"the defaults in the program"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1337.244,"endTime":1342.004,"body":"from opting in to opting out."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1342.694,"endTime":1347.614,"body":"So, I have to take an extra"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1342.694,"endTime":1347.614,"body":"step in order to opt out,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1347.934,"endTime":1351.464,"body":"which, that interferes with"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1347.934,"endTime":1351.464,"body":"our human inertia, and we"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1351.464,"endTime":1352.714,"body":"don't like taking extra steps."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1353.7839999999999,"endTime":1357.844,"body":"So we still give them the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1353.7839999999999,"endTime":1357.844,"body":"choice, but it's the defaults"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1357.984,"endTime":1359.104,"body":"that have been switched."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1359.604,"endTime":1361.644,"body":"So essentially what they"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1359.604,"endTime":1361.644,"body":"did is when they switched"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1361.644,"endTime":1364.384,"body":"it from, I have to opt in to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1361.644,"endTime":1364.384,"body":"organ donation to I have to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1364.384,"endTime":1366.004,"body":"opt out of organ donation."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1366.8039999999999,"endTime":1369.644,"body":"The organ donation just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1366.8039999999999,"endTime":1369.644,"body":"went through the roof."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1369.664,"endTime":1371.334,"body":"I mean, it was just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1369.664,"endTime":1371.334,"body":"like crazy increase."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1371.664,"endTime":1373.5539999999999,"body":"And it's like, well, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1371.664,"endTime":1373.5539999999999,"body":"know, you could have left"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1373.5539999999999,"endTime":1377.754,"body":"it at opt in, but spend all"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1373.5539999999999,"endTime":1377.754,"body":"this extra energy marketing,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1377.894,"endTime":1380.704,"body":"begging people to opt in, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1377.894,"endTime":1380.704,"body":"know, blah, blah, blah, blah."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1381.509,"endTime":1384.359,"body":"And all we need to do is just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1381.509,"endTime":1384.359,"body":"make a default switch, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1384.4289999999999,"endTime":1386.119,"body":"And that's just one"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1384.4289999999999,"endTime":1386.119,"body":"example of nudging."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1386.579,"endTime":1388.849,"body":"So if you combine all these"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1386.579,"endTime":1388.849,"body":"different types of behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1388.879,"endTime":1391.9189999999999,"body":"strategies into project"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1388.879,"endTime":1391.9189999999999,"body":"management, what you get"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1391.939,"endTime":1395.059,"body":"is you get defaulted better"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1391.939,"endTime":1395.059,"body":"decision making in the end."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1395.06,"endTime":1397.129,"body":"Let me play it"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1395.06,"endTime":1397.129,"body":"back to you and see if I'm"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1397.1689999999999,"endTime":1399.359,"body":"understanding this correctly,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1397.1689999999999,"endTime":1399.359,"body":"because in some ways, obstacle"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1399.359,"endTime":1403.109,"body":"identification, like I'm"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1399.359,"endTime":1403.109,"body":"thinking of it as similar to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1403.109,"endTime":1404.779,"body":"risk management, I guess, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1404.789,"endTime":1408.079,"body":"Like, we could go wrong, we"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1404.789,"endTime":1408.079,"body":"could go terribly right, I"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1408.079,"endTime":1411.949,"body":"guess, but I think in some"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1408.079,"endTime":1411.949,"body":"ways risk management has a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1411.959,"endTime":1414.4189999999999,"body":"bad rap because, you know, as"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1411.959,"endTime":1414.4189999999999,"body":"soon as you say it, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1414.4289999999999,"endTime":1417.839,"body":"across multiple industries,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1414.4289999999999,"endTime":1417.839,"body":"it's not anyone's favorite"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1417.839,"endTime":1419.249,"body":"thing necessarily, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1419.249,"endTime":1421.059,"body":"Oh, we're going to do"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1419.249,"endTime":1421.059,"body":"risk identification."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1421.059,"endTime":1421.639,"body":"Boring."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1421.649,"endTime":1424.6689999999999,"body":"Like this sounds terrible"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1421.649,"endTime":1424.6689999999999,"body":"and cynical, but you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1424.6689999999999,"endTime":1427.519,"body":"using your sort of nudging"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1424.6689999999999,"endTime":1427.519,"body":"example, it kind of reframing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1427.529,"endTime":1428.859,"body":"a question to make it easier."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1429.1589999999999,"endTime":1431.6789999999999,"body":"You know, I'm thinking about"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1429.1589999999999,"endTime":1431.6789999999999,"body":"things like, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1431.6789999999999,"endTime":1434.609,"body":"question of when do you think"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1431.6789999999999,"endTime":1434.609,"body":"you could get this done by?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1434.6689999999999,"endTime":1436.529,"body":"Which is a common thing to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1434.6689999999999,"endTime":1436.529,"body":"ask when we're planning,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1436.529,"endTime":1437.519,"body":"we're estimating, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1437.519,"endTime":1440.4289999999999,"body":"Which is a very pressurized"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1437.519,"endTime":1440.4289999999999,"body":"question, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1440.479,"endTime":1442.829,"body":"Which is like, when everyone"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1440.479,"endTime":1442.829,"body":"throws up their hands and say,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1442.829,"endTime":1445.819,"body":"you know, estimation is a joke,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1442.829,"endTime":1445.819,"body":"humans suck at planning, yadda"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1445.819,"endTime":1447.899,"body":"yadda yadda, all those things"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1445.819,"endTime":1447.899,"body":"are probably actually true."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1448.049,"endTime":1450.6689999999999,"body":"But you know, versus the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1448.049,"endTime":1450.6689999999999,"body":"question of, I don't know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1450.699,"endTime":1453.469,"body":"like, what might prevent you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1450.699,"endTime":1453.469,"body":"from getting this done, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1453.469,"endTime":1454.979,"body":"know, in the best way possible?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1455.139,"endTime":1456.879,"body":"What has to go right, I"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1455.139,"endTime":1456.879,"body":"guess, in order for this"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1456.9189999999999,"endTime":1459.529,"body":"to give you the best"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1456.9189999999999,"endTime":1459.529,"body":"probability of succeeding"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1459.779,"endTime":1461.109,"body":"at delivering this thing."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1461.494,"endTime":1463.944,"body":"Is that kind of the right idea"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1461.494,"endTime":1463.944,"body":"in terms of, like, a nudge"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1463.944,"endTime":1467.734,"body":"that's framed differently and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1463.944,"endTime":1467.734,"body":"an exercise in, like, obstacle"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1467.754,"endTime":1471.164,"body":"identification so that we can"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1467.754,"endTime":1471.164,"body":"just kind of, you know, unpack"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1471.164,"endTime":1475.934,"body":"differently and maybe just use"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1471.164,"endTime":1475.934,"body":"the parts of our brain that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1476.464,"endTime":1480.274,"body":"are a bit more imaginative and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1476.464,"endTime":1480.274,"body":"creative instead of the, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1480.274,"endTime":1482.254,"body":"know, the fast brain that's"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1480.274,"endTime":1482.254,"body":"just, you know, let's get this"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1482.254,"endTime":1484.774,"body":"estimate done because we need"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1482.254,"endTime":1484.774,"body":"to get out the door and it's"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1484.774,"endTime":1485.884,"body":"going to be terrible anyways."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1486.104,"endTime":1488.564,"body":"So, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1486.104,"endTime":1488.564,"body":"obstacle identification is one"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1488.564,"endTime":1490.654,"body":"of those easy ones, because"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1488.564,"endTime":1490.654,"body":"essentially what you're"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1490.654,"endTime":1492.694,"body":"doing is kind of forcing"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1490.654,"endTime":1492.694,"body":"the brain to look at things"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1492.694,"endTime":1493.704,"body":"from different perspectives."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1494.184,"endTime":1498.364,"body":"But obstacle identification is"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1494.184,"endTime":1498.364,"body":"also different from risk from"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1498.364,"endTime":1499.714,"body":"a human behavior perspective."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1500.354,"endTime":1502.5339999999999,"body":"And so I often get the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1500.354,"endTime":1502.5339999999999,"body":"question, you know, why would"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1502.5339999999999,"endTime":1505.664,"body":"I start identifying obstacles"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1502.5339999999999,"endTime":1505.664,"body":"when I already do risk?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1505.904,"endTime":1507.134,"body":"Well, two reasons."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1507.529,"endTime":1509.749,"body":"But one of the big reasons"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1507.529,"endTime":1509.749,"body":"is that the brain looks"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1509.749,"endTime":1512.019,"body":"at risk different than"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1509.749,"endTime":1512.019,"body":"it looks at obstacles."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1512.609,"endTime":1516.549,"body":"Because risk, in many cases,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1512.609,"endTime":1516.549,"body":"is essentially this bad thing"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1516.559,"endTime":1517.819,"body":"that may or may not occur."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1518.109,"endTime":1520.759,"body":"Obstacles are one of those"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1518.109,"endTime":1520.759,"body":"things I have to overcome and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1520.759,"endTime":1522.1589999999999,"body":"it's something that will occur."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1522.279,"endTime":1523.649,"body":"Obstacles do occur."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1523.859,"endTime":1525.439,"body":"Risks may or may not occur."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1525.789,"endTime":1527.059,"body":"How is that different"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1525.789,"endTime":1527.059,"body":"for the brain?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1527.494,"endTime":1532.344,"body":"Well, to the brain, something"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1527.494,"endTime":1532.344,"body":"bad that may or may not occur,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1532.414,"endTime":1536.274,"body":"I can assign a low probability"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1532.414,"endTime":1536.274,"body":"to or just strike it from"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1536.274,"endTime":1538.744,"body":"the risk register because"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1536.274,"endTime":1538.744,"body":"it's mentally uncomfortable."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1538.964,"endTime":1543.619,"body":"If I say it may or may not"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1538.964,"endTime":1543.619,"body":"occur, my brain to deal with"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1543.649,"endTime":1547.4189999999999,"body":"the cognitive dissonance, as"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1543.649,"endTime":1547.4189999999999,"body":"we call it, may say, eh, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1547.4189999999999,"endTime":1550.249,"body":"know, I just really think"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1547.4189999999999,"endTime":1550.249,"body":"that there's not a high"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1550.259,"endTime":1551.749,"body":"probability of it happening."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1552.259,"endTime":1552.819,"body":"You know why?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1552.869,"endTime":1554.759,"body":"Because I want to reduce"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1552.869,"endTime":1554.759,"body":"the mental discomfort"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1554.759,"endTime":1556.4669999999999,"body":"associated with that risk."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1556.7069999999999,"endTime":1558.639,"body":"And so risk is"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1556.7069999999999,"endTime":1558.639,"body":"essentially giving me"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1558.639,"endTime":1560.1299999999999,"body":"an opt out opportunity."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1560.309,"endTime":1564.149,"body":"An opportunity to say, that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1560.309,"endTime":1564.149,"body":"risk is not that important."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1564.269,"endTime":1565.869,"body":"Low probability or I'm"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1564.269,"endTime":1565.869,"body":"just going to strike it"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1565.869,"endTime":1566.759,"body":"from the risk register."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1567.1589999999999,"endTime":1569.744,"body":"If I ask you to identify"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1567.1589999999999,"endTime":1569.744,"body":"obstacles, those are"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1569.744,"endTime":1570.564,"body":"things that will occur."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1570.594,"endTime":1574.384,"body":"I do have to overcome them,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1570.594,"endTime":1574.384,"body":"and sometimes it can even, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1574.384,"endTime":1576.694,"body":"know, there's a little bit of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1574.384,"endTime":1576.694,"body":"gamification in there as well."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1576.884,"endTime":1579.114,"body":"Obstacle identification,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1576.884,"endTime":1579.114,"body":"it's like, well, you know,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1579.114,"endTime":1581.734,"body":"I have the opportunity to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1579.114,"endTime":1581.734,"body":"essentially solve this problem."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1582.644,"endTime":1585.884,"body":"So, there is a big difference"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1582.644,"endTime":1585.884,"body":"between risk and obstacles."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1585.954,"endTime":1587.594,"body":"You still need to identify risk."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1587.674,"endTime":1588.684,"body":"I'm not saying you shouldn't."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1588.694,"endTime":1590.904,"body":"I'm just saying that identifying"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1588.694,"endTime":1590.904,"body":"obstacles is different."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1591.269,"endTime":1592.719,"body":"Oh, I'm glad you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1591.269,"endTime":1592.719,"body":"clarified that, because, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1592.719,"endTime":1595.209,"body":"know, in my head I was like,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1592.719,"endTime":1595.209,"body":"obstacles, you can kind of walk"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1595.219,"endTime":1598.439,"body":"around, you know, I'm picturing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1595.219,"endTime":1598.439,"body":"this like, obstacle course, one"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1598.439,"endTime":1600.099,"body":"of those ridiculous game shows."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1600.329,"endTime":1602.059,"body":"You know, you're just like,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1600.329,"endTime":1602.059,"body":"I'll just walk around it, but"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1602.069,"endTime":1603.299,"body":"actually, this is the course."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1603.299,"endTime":1605.599,"body":"You have to go through these"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1603.299,"endTime":1605.599,"body":"things, and they're like,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1605.609,"endTime":1607.459,"body":"you know, going through the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1605.609,"endTime":1607.459,"body":"different, various, whatever,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1607.459,"endTime":1610.899,"body":"levels, like it's the process,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1607.459,"endTime":1610.899,"body":"and actually it kind of gives"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1611.269,"endTime":1612.859,"body":"credit to the process, too."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1613.069,"endTime":1615.729,"body":"Not, what's going to go"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1613.069,"endTime":1615.729,"body":"wrong that keeps you from"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1615.729,"endTime":1618.299,"body":"doing, you know, the thing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1615.729,"endTime":1618.299,"body":"that's just your job."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1618.509,"endTime":1620.609,"body":"Versus saying, like, okay, your"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1618.509,"endTime":1620.609,"body":"job is tough, like, tell me"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1620.609,"endTime":1623.6789999999999,"body":"about, like, what obstacles,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1620.609,"endTime":1623.6789999999999,"body":"like, what hard steps do you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1623.6789999999999,"endTime":1626.6589999999999,"body":"need to cross in order to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1623.6789999999999,"endTime":1626.6589999999999,"body":"get this done, so that we can"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1626.699,"endTime":1629.599,"body":"understand better, and actually"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1626.699,"endTime":1629.599,"body":"probably inform the risk"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1629.599,"endTime":1632.444,"body":"management process as well to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1629.599,"endTime":1632.444,"body":"be like, okay, all the ambiguous"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1632.444,"endTime":1634.094,"body":"stuff that we don't know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1632.444,"endTime":1634.094,"body":"yeah, that, those are risks."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1634.464,"endTime":1636.484,"body":"But the stuff that we do"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1634.464,"endTime":1636.484,"body":"know, like, we'll treat them"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1636.484,"endTime":1638.574,"body":"as obstacles because, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1636.484,"endTime":1638.574,"body":"know, the job you're doing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1638.574,"endTime":1642.134,"body":"is difficult, is specialized,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1638.574,"endTime":1642.134,"body":"is, you know, multi step."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1642.464,"endTime":1643.8039999999999,"body":"It's multi faceted."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1643.934,"endTime":1646.524,"body":"It's not, you know, drawing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1643.934,"endTime":1646.524,"body":"a straight line with a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1646.524,"endTime":1647.564,"body":"pencil on a piece of paper."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1647.644,"endTime":1648.854,"body":"There's some complexity to it."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1648.944,"endTime":1650.2839999999999,"body":"And it kind of addresses that."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1650.424,"endTime":1652.984,"body":"And I guess it is like,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1650.424,"endTime":1652.984,"body":"you know, the opt in model."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1653.244,"endTime":1653.504,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1653.774,"endTime":1655.914,"body":"And you can create activities"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1653.774,"endTime":1655.914,"body":"for those obstacles too."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1655.994,"endTime":1657.654,"body":"I mean, if there's a major"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1655.994,"endTime":1657.654,"body":"obstacle, you create an"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1657.654,"endTime":1658.624,"body":"activity to overcome it."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1659.004,"endTime":1660.5339999999999,"body":"You know, so there's options."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1661.5539999999999,"endTime":1661.984,"body":"I like this."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1662.0339999999999,"endTime":1662.344,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1662.394,"endTime":1663.944,"body":"In my framing, in my"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1662.394,"endTime":1663.944,"body":"understanding, it's kind"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1663.944,"endTime":1666.194,"body":"of like, yeah, there's a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1663.944,"endTime":1666.194,"body":"layer of sort of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1666.204,"endTime":1668.424,"body":"process design doesn't give"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1666.204,"endTime":1668.424,"body":"it enough credit, I guess."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1668.7939999999999,"endTime":1671.384,"body":"But to your point, when people"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1668.7939999999999,"endTime":1671.384,"body":"think of behavioral science and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1671.384,"endTime":1674.024,"body":"project management, often they"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1671.384,"endTime":1674.024,"body":"think about, you know, this"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1674.024,"endTime":1677.404,"body":"like, traditionally what people"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1674.024,"endTime":1677.404,"body":"might call \"soft\" skills, sit"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1677.404,"endTime":1680.024,"body":"on the couch, talk about our"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1677.404,"endTime":1680.024,"body":"feelings, but not necessarily,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1680.0439999999999,"endTime":1681.314,"body":"you know, getting the work done."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1681.504,"endTime":1682.964,"body":"But actually, this is different."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1682.964,"endTime":1686.064,"body":"This is actually designing a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1682.964,"endTime":1686.064,"body":"process with the human brain"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1686.064,"endTime":1689.264,"body":"in mind, knowing what the human"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1686.064,"endTime":1689.264,"body":"brain is actually quite bad"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1689.264,"endTime":1693.954,"body":"at and finding ways to hack"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1689.264,"endTime":1693.954,"body":"it for lack of a better word"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1694.084,"endTime":1698.884,"body":"into better planning, better"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1694.084,"endTime":1698.884,"body":"predictability and just overall"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1698.914,"endTime":1701.954,"body":"less cognitive dissonance with"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1698.914,"endTime":1701.954,"body":"the humans that are trying"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1701.954,"endTime":1702.684,"body":"to get the project done."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1702.974,"endTime":1705.254,"body":"You mentioned software and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1702.974,"endTime":1705.254,"body":"like interfacing earlier."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1705.484,"endTime":1707.864,"body":"And just to kind of give that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1705.484,"endTime":1707.864,"body":"some context, I had a guest"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1707.864,"endTime":1709.704,"body":"on the podcast a couple of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1707.864,"endTime":1709.704,"body":"years back, Bentzy Goldman,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1709.854,"endTime":1710.634,"body":"check out that episode."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1710.644,"endTime":1711.014,"body":"Pretty good."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1711.164,"endTime":1712.714,"body":"And it was kind of about that."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1712.714,"endTime":1715.894,"body":"It was nudges around kind of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1712.714,"endTime":1715.894,"body":"like a feedback and giving"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1715.894,"endTime":1717.164,"body":"people an opportunity."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1717.4189999999999,"endTime":1719.259,"body":"I'm framing the question in"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1717.4189999999999,"endTime":1719.259,"body":"a right way that it wasn't"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1719.259,"endTime":1722.969,"body":"necessarily loaded to sort"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1719.259,"endTime":1722.969,"body":"of embed that into the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1722.969,"endTime":1724.219,"body":"software experience, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1724.219,"endTime":1725.969,"body":"You're like managing your"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1724.219,"endTime":1725.969,"body":"project or you're managing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1725.969,"endTime":1728.099,"body":"your work and these things"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1725.969,"endTime":1728.099,"body":"will just kind of like layer in"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1728.099,"endTime":1729.449,"body":"and pop up at the right times."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1729.839,"endTime":1732.329,"body":"In some cases in a way"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1729.839,"endTime":1732.329,"body":"that is more relaxed"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1732.329,"endTime":1734.579,"body":"rather than, you know, very"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1732.329,"endTime":1734.579,"body":"time pressure oriented."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1734.819,"endTime":1738.279,"body":"But like is that something that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1734.819,"endTime":1738.279,"body":"your institute does is looking"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1738.279,"endTime":1741.019,"body":"into in terms of layering"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1738.279,"endTime":1741.019,"body":"onto software so that this"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1741.029,"endTime":1743.7839999999999,"body":"is actually kind of like out"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1741.029,"endTime":1743.7839999999999,"body":"of the box, you know, project"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1743.8039999999999,"endTime":1745.854,"body":"managers might not have to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1743.8039999999999,"endTime":1745.854,"body":"worry about this that much."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1745.854,"endTime":1748.2839999999999,"body":"They might want to understand"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1745.854,"endTime":1748.2839999999999,"body":"it, but they might not have to"},{"speaker":"Galen 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Ramirez","startTime":1760.194,"endTime":1763.614,"body":"behavioral PM and plug that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1763.614,"endTime":1764.834,"body":"into software development?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1765.139,"endTime":1768.239,"body":"Because every step along the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1765.139,"endTime":1768.239,"body":"way, you can change defaults,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1768.629,"endTime":1771.089,"body":"you can add processes,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1768.629,"endTime":1771.089,"body":"like, for example, obstacle"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1771.089,"endTime":1774.299,"body":"identification, combine"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1771.089,"endTime":1774.299,"body":"that with AI and prompts,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1774.689,"endTime":1777.079,"body":"and there's all kinds of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1774.689,"endTime":1777.079,"body":"stuff you can do, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1777.309,"endTime":1781.189,"body":"And so, if you look at just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1777.309,"endTime":1781.189,"body":"the example of the pilot study"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1781.239,"endTime":1785.319,"body":"that I did where we essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1781.239,"endTime":1785.319,"body":"improved planning accuracy and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1785.319,"endTime":1788.439,"body":"the reliability of meeting that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1785.319,"endTime":1788.439,"body":"milestone, you're taking those"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1788.459,"endTime":1790.379,"body":"same steps, and essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1788.459,"endTime":1790.379,"body":"you're just plugging them"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1790.379,"endTime":1793.0539999999999,"body":"into the software versus,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1790.379,"endTime":1793.0539999999999,"body":"you know, the person has to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1793.064,"endTime":1795.424,"body":"be in the meeting, coaching,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1793.064,"endTime":1795.424,"body":"and through that, software"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1795.424,"endTime":1796.934,"body":"essentially becomes the coach."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1797.334,"endTime":1800.714,"body":"And the nice thing about"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1797.334,"endTime":1800.714,"body":"a lot of this is, although"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1801.174,"endTime":1806.084,"body":"awareness of cognitive biases"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1801.174,"endTime":1806.084,"body":"and thinking errors, etc."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1806.364,"endTime":1808.714,"body":"is important, that's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1806.364,"endTime":1808.714,"body":"part of the process."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1808.754,"endTime":1812.664,"body":"Like, if I teach you about"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1808.754,"endTime":1812.664,"body":"optimism bias, you're likely"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1812.664,"endTime":1815.354,"body":"to, you know, try to account"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1812.664,"endTime":1815.354,"body":"for that in many cases."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1815.674,"endTime":1817.764,"body":"Because your brain's just got,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1815.674,"endTime":1817.764,"body":"now that it knows about it."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1817.824,"endTime":1819.104,"body":"So awareness is a good piece."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1819.549,"endTime":1821.599,"body":"And you should always have"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1819.549,"endTime":1821.599,"body":"the awareness piece as well."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1821.849,"endTime":1823.799,"body":"But there's also the other"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1821.849,"endTime":1823.799,"body":"part of it, which is just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1823.809,"endTime":1827.249,"body":"pure design, which is I'm"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1823.809,"endTime":1827.249,"body":"just designing steps into"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1827.249,"endTime":1831.269,"body":"the software or into your"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1827.249,"endTime":1831.269,"body":"procedures, which cause you to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1831.269,"endTime":1832.949,"body":"make better decisions, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1832.979,"endTime":1835.379,"body":"So it's kind of a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1832.979,"endTime":1835.379,"body":"multifaceted approach."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1835.729,"endTime":1838.859,"body":"But the nice thing about the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1835.729,"endTime":1838.859,"body":"one experiment I did is I didn't"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1838.869,"endTime":1840.629,"body":"do any teaching about biases."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1840.939,"endTime":1843.989,"body":"All I did was use"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1840.939,"endTime":1843.989,"body":"behavioral design."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1844.309,"endTime":1848.5439999999999,"body":"And so I still got good results"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1844.309,"endTime":1848.5439999999999,"body":"by essentially designing"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1848.5539999999999,"endTime":1852.324,"body":"better decision making into"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1848.5539999999999,"endTime":1852.324,"body":"the steps without having to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1852.384,"endTime":1855.384,"body":"train them on what cognitive"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1852.384,"endTime":1855.384,"body":"biases were going on."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1855.904,"endTime":1856.234,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1856.624,"endTime":1858.194,"body":"So there's many"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1856.624,"endTime":1858.194,"body":"ways to approach it."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1858.444,"endTime":1859.224,"body":"I love that layering."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1859.234,"endTime":1860.5439999999999,"body":"And I think, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1859.234,"endTime":1860.5439999999999,"body":"probably our listeners"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1860.5439999999999,"endTime":1861.154,"body":"are thinking that too."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1861.154,"endTime":1862.114,"body":"Like, how do I get started?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1862.2839999999999,"endTime":1865.5439999999999,"body":"Yes, probably awareness of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1862.2839999999999,"endTime":1865.5439999999999,"body":"biases and just reading up on"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1865.5439999999999,"endTime":1866.974,"body":"behavioral science overall."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1867.0539999999999,"endTime":1870.0439999999999,"body":"You know, maybe lensing"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1867.0539999999999,"endTime":1870.0439999999999,"body":"behavioral economics through"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1870.0439999999999,"endTime":1872.0439999999999,"body":"a project management lens"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1870.0439999999999,"endTime":1872.0439999999999,"body":"and kind of understanding"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1872.0539999999999,"endTime":1872.5539999999999,"body":"what that means."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1872.5539999999999,"endTime":1875.594,"body":"But I like the idea as well"},{"speaker":"Galen 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curve."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1889.024,"endTime":1890.384,"body":"So obviously"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1889.024,"endTime":1890.384,"body":"you're going to be much"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1890.384,"endTime":1892.694,"body":"better if you have both"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1890.384,"endTime":1892.694,"body":"the awareness component"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1892.704,"endTime":1894.074,"body":"and the design component."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1894.2939999999999,"endTime":1896.154,"body":"But it's not like you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1894.2939999999999,"endTime":1896.154,"body":"have to get started"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1896.164,"endTime":1897.084,"body":"by knowing everything."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1897.314,"endTime":1897.844,"body":"Fair enough."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1898.174,"endTime":1899.8039999999999,"body":"I thought maybe I'd dive"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1898.174,"endTime":1899.8039999999999,"body":"into some tough stuff."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1900.714,"endTime":1901.8039999999999,"body":"Some of the tough questions."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1902.134,"endTime":1903.0539999999999,"body":"Those are the softballs."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1903.084,"endTime":1905.024,"body":"No, I think you gave"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1903.084,"endTime":1905.024,"body":"really good context."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1905.024,"endTime":1906.064,"body":"I think it's really interesting."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1906.064,"endTime":1907.514,"body":"Wait, I think we"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1906.064,"endTime":1907.514,"body":"have a phone call coming in."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1909.464,"endTime":1910.3039999999999,"body":"The"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1909.464,"endTime":1910.3039999999999,"body":"line's breaking up."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1910.5439999999999,"endTime":1912.344,"body":"Toooot!"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1912.924,"endTime":1916.234,"body":"You know, I mentioned earlier"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1912.924,"endTime":1916.234,"body":"just the fact that project"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1916.244,"endTime":1919.654,"body":"managers we've been debating"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1916.244,"endTime":1919.654,"body":"things like Waterfall versus"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1919.654,"endTime":1921.494,"body":"Agile for like over 20 years."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1922.014,"endTime":1924.759,"body":"We're not exactly like, the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1922.014,"endTime":1924.759,"body":"group of people that's like"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1924.779,"endTime":1928.769,"body":"the most open to change, or"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1924.779,"endTime":1928.769,"body":"if we are, it's very hard"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1928.769,"endTime":1930.199,"body":"for us to agree on things."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1930.559,"endTime":1933.779,"body":"I like this idea of behavioral"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1930.559,"endTime":1933.779,"body":"project management, but I'm"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1933.779,"endTime":1937.699,"body":"wondering, like, could it become"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1933.779,"endTime":1937.699,"body":"equally as, like, divisive?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1937.849,"endTime":1941.719,"body":"Like, and if so, what are the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1937.849,"endTime":1941.719,"body":"implications of behavioral"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1941.719,"endTime":1944.249,"body":"project management being,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":1941.719,"endTime":1944.249,"body":"like, adopted and practiced?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1944.879,"endTime":1948.579,"body":"Yeah, so, I don't"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1944.879,"endTime":1948.579,"body":"think that it will become more"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1948.579,"endTime":1952.739,"body":"divisive because essentially,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1948.579,"endTime":1952.739,"body":"what we're doing compared to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1952.849,"endTime":1955.969,"body":"some of the older methodologies,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1952.849,"endTime":1955.969,"body":"which were less evidence based."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1956.399,"endTime":1958.9189999999999,"body":"Although I have to caveat that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1956.399,"endTime":1958.9189999999999,"body":"by saying Agile does have a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1958.9289999999999,"endTime":1962.249,"body":"whole lot more evidence based"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1958.9289999999999,"endTime":1962.249,"body":"stuff and it's a kudos to them."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1962.6789999999999,"endTime":1966.4189999999999,"body":"But I think part of the reason"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1962.6789999999999,"endTime":1966.4189999999999,"body":"why we have these arguments all"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1966.4189999999999,"endTime":1969.4189999999999,"body":"the time, one is time pressure"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1966.4189999999999,"endTime":1969.4189999999999,"body":"causes automatic thinking,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1969.4189999999999,"endTime":1970.489,"body":"which causes more of that."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1970.9289999999999,"endTime":1975.589,"body":"But two is because a lot of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1970.9289999999999,"endTime":1975.589,"body":"methods are evidence based."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1976.3039999999999,"endTime":1979.2939999999999,"body":"So essentially, in many"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1976.3039999999999,"endTime":1979.2939999999999,"body":"cases, we haven't found"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1979.2939999999999,"endTime":1980.174,"body":"what's most effective."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1980.574,"endTime":1982.624,"body":"We're just kind of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1980.574,"endTime":1982.624,"body":"guessing at it sometimes."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1983.164,"endTime":1985.344,"body":"And so when you're guessing"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1983.164,"endTime":1985.344,"body":"at it, then it becomes"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1985.344,"endTime":1987.124,"body":"more a fight of opinions."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1987.844,"endTime":1991.724,"body":"But if you're using things"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1987.844,"endTime":1991.724,"body":"that are kind of more and I"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1991.724,"endTime":1994.744,"body":"say proven very lively because"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1991.724,"endTime":1994.744,"body":"as behavioral scientists,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1994.744,"endTime":1995.904,"body":"we hate using that word."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1996.254,"endTime":1998.134,"body":"But I would say more"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1996.254,"endTime":1998.134,"body":"evidence based, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1998.134,"endTime":2000.5439999999999,"body":"You've got more evidence"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":1998.134,"endTime":2000.5439999999999,"body":"that something worked"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2000.5439999999999,"endTime":2001.504,"body":"because you tested it."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2001.744,"endTime":2006.754,"body":"And so when you bring in more"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2001.744,"endTime":2006.754,"body":"science backed processes,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2007.334,"endTime":2010.724,"body":"there's less room to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2007.334,"endTime":2010.724,"body":"debate if they work, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2011.204,"endTime":2014.974,"body":"And so that I think kind of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2011.204,"endTime":2014.974,"body":"reduces some of the potential in"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2014.974,"endTime":2019.314,"body":"terms of well, you know, which"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2014.974,"endTime":2019.314,"body":"method is better blah blah blah."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2019.314,"endTime":2022.989,"body":"And I'm going to say well, if"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2019.314,"endTime":2022.989,"body":"you use obstacle identification,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2022.989,"endTime":2026.519,"body":"it's going to work in Agile"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2022.989,"endTime":2026.519,"body":"or Waterfall and you're"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2026.519,"endTime":2027.639,"body":"going to find more obstacles."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2027.999,"endTime":2030.0539999999999,"body":"Like, I don't know"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2027.999,"endTime":2030.0539999999999,"body":"what else to tell you."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2030.0539999999999,"endTime":2032.904,"body":"I mean, right, you know,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2030.0539999999999,"endTime":2032.904,"body":"it's simple things like that."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2032.904,"endTime":2034.404,"body":"You know, if you change"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2032.904,"endTime":2034.404,"body":"your defaults, you're"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2034.404,"endTime":2035.564,"body":"going to get results."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2036.024,"endTime":2040.004,"body":"If you do unpacking, which is"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2036.024,"endTime":2040.004,"body":"proven in cognitive science,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2040.384,"endTime":2043.504,"body":"not only beneficial for planning"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2040.384,"endTime":2043.504,"body":"and risk, but also for safety"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2043.714,"endTime":2045.244,"body":"and personal decision making."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2046.154,"endTime":2048.744,"body":"You add in all those kind"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2046.154,"endTime":2048.744,"body":"of components, a lot of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2048.744,"endTime":2050.844,"body":"them are just kind of like,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2048.744,"endTime":2050.844,"body":"yeah, I mean, there's really"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2050.844,"endTime":2051.764,"body":"nothing to argue about there."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2054.424,"endTime":2054.884,"body":"Fair enough."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2054.8940000000002,"endTime":2056.574,"body":"And actually, you know, even"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2054.8940000000002,"endTime":2056.574,"body":"coming back to your story at"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2056.5840000000003,"endTime":2057.744,"body":"the beginning with Jodi, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2057.744,"endTime":2059.974,"body":"It's like a lot of the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2057.744,"endTime":2059.974,"body":"arguments are around the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2059.974,"endTime":2063.3540000000003,"body":"idea that, projects are, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2059.974,"endTime":2063.3540000000003,"body":"know, special snowflakes."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2063.3540000000003,"endTime":2063.994,"body":"They're all unique."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2063.994,"endTime":2066.684,"body":"And actually, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2063.994,"endTime":2066.684,"body":"know, they are, but."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2066.964,"endTime":2068.114,"body":"There's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2066.964,"endTime":2068.114,"body":"a uniqueness bias for"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2068.114,"endTime":2068.8540000000003,"body":"that, too, by the way."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2068.884,"endTime":2069.324,"body":"But go ahead."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2069.3340000000003,"endTime":2070.194,"body":"Ooh, okay."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2071.3540000000003,"endTime":2072.2740000000003,"body":"I want to hear more about that."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2072.3940000000002,"endTime":2074.364,"body":"But I mean, the thing that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2072.3940000000002,"endTime":2074.364,"body":"you said, that Jodi had said"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2074.3740000000003,"endTime":2076.5640000000003,"body":"to you, which is that, well,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2074.3740000000003,"endTime":2076.5640000000003,"body":"the common denominator is"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2076.5640000000003,"endTime":2078.9840000000004,"body":"that these are people with"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2076.5640000000003,"endTime":2078.9840000000004,"body":"brains doing a thing together."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2079.224,"endTime":2081.954,"body":"So, I mean, that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2079.224,"endTime":2081.954,"body":"part is not unique."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2081.994,"endTime":2086.264,"body":"That part is pretty much"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2081.994,"endTime":2086.264,"body":"constant throughout our"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2086.414,"endTime":2089.054,"body":"projects, at least for now,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2086.414,"endTime":2089.054,"body":"until the robots catch up."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2089.3340000000003,"endTime":2091.6940000000004,"body":"Right now we're dealing with"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2089.3340000000003,"endTime":2091.6940000000004,"body":"human brains, human behavior."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2092.0040000000004,"endTime":2094.6940000000004,"body":"Doesn't matter what"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2092.0040000000004,"endTime":2094.6940000000004,"body":"methodology you're using,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2094.844,"endTime":2097.679,"body":"some of the problems you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2094.844,"endTime":2097.679,"body":"run into aren't because"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2097.679,"endTime":2098.9590000000003,"body":"of the methodology at all."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2098.9590000000003,"endTime":2100.4590000000003,"body":"And then we have all"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2098.9590000000003,"endTime":2100.4590000000003,"body":"of these fights over"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2100.4590000000003,"endTime":2102.2690000000002,"body":"anecdotal \"evidence\"."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2102.289,"endTime":2104.8990000000003,"body":"Well, I saw another company"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2102.289,"endTime":2104.8990000000003,"body":"do that and it failed."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2104.8990000000003,"endTime":2105.6090000000004,"body":"It fell on its face."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2105.889,"endTime":2106.6890000000003,"body":"Agile sucks."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2106.7290000000003,"endTime":2107.619,"body":"Like it's not going to work."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2107.6290000000004,"endTime":2108.3990000000003,"body":"Waterfall sucks."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2108.409,"endTime":2109.199,"body":"It doesn't work for us."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2109.3990000000003,"endTime":2109.799,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2109.849,"endTime":2112.1090000000004,"body":"It's like, we might"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2109.849,"endTime":2112.1090000000004,"body":"actually be arguing about"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2112.199,"endTime":2113.489,"body":"the wrong thing, actually."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2113.949,"endTime":2116.139,"body":"We could be agreeing on the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2113.949,"endTime":2116.139,"body":"fact that humans are the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2116.139,"endTime":2118.1090000000004,"body":"ones that we need to kind of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2116.139,"endTime":2118.1090000000004,"body":"account for a little bit more."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2118.389,"endTime":2120.3990000000003,"body":"Yeah, like,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2118.389,"endTime":2120.3990000000003,"body":"yeah, here's a perfect example."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2120.3990000000003,"endTime":2123.6490000000003,"body":"In the federal projects"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2120.3990000000003,"endTime":2123.6490000000003,"body":"environment, what you find"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2123.6490000000003,"endTime":2126.199,"body":"is there's a lot of earned"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2123.6490000000003,"endTime":2126.199,"body":"value compliance measures and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2126.2090000000003,"endTime":2130.369,"body":"earned value compliance has"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2126.2090000000003,"endTime":2130.369,"body":"in it buried a lot of stuff"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2130.369,"endTime":2132.779,"body":"that become counterproductive"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2130.369,"endTime":2132.779,"body":"to good decision making."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2133.029,"endTime":2135.7490000000003,"body":"But why did earned value"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2133.029,"endTime":2135.7490000000003,"body":"compliance become so popular?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2136.539,"endTime":2138.2340000000004,"body":"Or, since then,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2136.539,"endTime":2138.2340000000004,"body":"it's not popular."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2138.5440000000003,"endTime":2141.744,"body":"Why it becomes so used"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2138.5440000000003,"endTime":2141.744,"body":"and regulated and the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2141.744,"endTime":2145.0640000000003,"body":"idea is that, well, I just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2141.744,"endTime":2145.0640000000003,"body":"need to have everything."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2145.114,"endTime":2146.614,"body":"I need to be able to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2145.114,"endTime":2146.614,"body":"see everything and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2146.6240000000003,"endTime":2147.5040000000004,"body":"monitor everything."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2147.5040000000004,"endTime":2149.8140000000003,"body":"And it's like, well,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2147.5040000000004,"endTime":2149.8140000000003,"body":"I understand that, but"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2149.8140000000003,"endTime":2152.6240000000003,"body":"you're going to just such a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2149.8140000000003,"endTime":2152.6240000000003,"body":"level of depth that you're"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2152.6240000000003,"endTime":2153.924,"body":"causing cognitive load."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2153.924,"endTime":2155.264,"body":"You're causing bad planning."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2155.534,"endTime":2157.914,"body":"You're not using visualizations"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2155.534,"endTime":2157.914,"body":"as much, et cetera."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2157.914,"endTime":2158.114,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2158.114,"endTime":2160.074,"body":"And so you find that,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2158.114,"endTime":2160.074,"body":"well, we threw in the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2160.074,"endTime":2162.134,"body":"whole toolbox, hoping"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2160.074,"endTime":2162.134,"body":"that something would work."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2162.574,"endTime":2165.6490000000003,"body":"But what you found out was"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2162.574,"endTime":2165.6490000000003,"body":"that you didn't need a thousand"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2165.6490000000003,"endTime":2166.8390000000004,"body":"tools from the toolbox."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2166.989,"endTime":2168.909,"body":"You needed one three"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2166.989,"endTime":2168.909,"body":"eighths inch socket."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2169.199,"endTime":2169.449,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2169.469,"endTime":2172.3190000000004,"body":"And so the evidence based"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2169.469,"endTime":2172.3190000000004,"body":"stuff essentially points"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2172.3190000000004,"endTime":2174.579,"body":"you to get the right"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2172.3190000000004,"endTime":2174.579,"body":"tool from the right job."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2174.8590000000004,"endTime":2175.3190000000004,"body":"That's fair."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2175.3790000000004,"endTime":2175.6490000000003,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2176.179,"endTime":2178.0890000000004,"body":"So this is the one, because"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2176.179,"endTime":2178.0890000000004,"body":"I'm thinking about, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2178.0890000000004,"endTime":2180.599,"body":"just like, yeah, the culture"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2178.0890000000004,"endTime":2180.599,"body":"of earned value, especially"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2180.599,"endTime":2181.8990000000003,"body":"in like, you know, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2180.599,"endTime":2181.8990000000003,"body":"mentioned government, like"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2181.8990000000003,"endTime":2184.219,"body":"public sector, and it's kind"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2181.8990000000003,"endTime":2184.219,"body":"of like this sort of scrutiny"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2184.219,"endTime":2186.539,"body":"around taxpayer dollars, and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2184.219,"endTime":2186.539,"body":"we want to make sure that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2186.539,"endTime":2187.8190000000004,"body":"no one's gaming the system."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2188.154,"endTime":2191.304,"body":"Which then causes people"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2188.154,"endTime":2191.304,"body":"to game the system, right?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2191.3540000000003,"endTime":2193.3540000000003,"body":"It's like, there's a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2191.3540000000003,"endTime":2193.3540000000003,"body":"human brain for you."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2193.844,"endTime":2195.434,"body":"It's like, okay, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2193.844,"endTime":2195.434,"body":"gave me a set of rules."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2195.4440000000004,"endTime":2196.6040000000003,"body":"Let me see how I can bend them."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2198.954,"endTime":2202.3940000000002,"body":"I mentioned earlier about just"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2198.954,"endTime":2202.3940000000002,"body":"software, but also, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2202.424,"endTime":2206.154,"body":"AI and how generative AI and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2202.424,"endTime":2206.154,"body":"LLMs are kind of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2206.3940000000002,"endTime":2207.5040000000004,"body":"coming into the forefront."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2207.514,"endTime":2209.224,"body":"And we're talking about"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2207.514,"endTime":2209.224,"body":"that a lot, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2209.224,"endTime":2210.284,"body":"in project management."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2210.6040000000003,"endTime":2212.864,"body":"Arguably, there's someone"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2210.6040000000003,"endTime":2212.864,"body":"who might come in and say,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2213.179,"endTime":2216.3990000000003,"body":"Well, listen, like, that's"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2213.179,"endTime":2216.3990000000003,"body":"all fine, Josh, but, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2216.5190000000002,"endTime":2220.0890000000004,"body":"isn't it more important that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2216.5190000000002,"endTime":2220.0890000000004,"body":"we understand technology more"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2220.0890000000004,"endTime":2222.0690000000004,"body":"than we understand some of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2220.0890000000004,"endTime":2222.0690000000004,"body":"this human behavior stuff?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2222.0690000000004,"endTime":2224.3190000000004,"body":"Because, you know,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2222.0690000000004,"endTime":2224.3190000000004,"body":"fundamentally, they're going"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2224.3190000000004,"endTime":2227.039,"body":"to be sort of making the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2224.3190000000004,"endTime":2227.039,"body":"decisions and doing a lot"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2227.039,"endTime":2228.8590000000004,"body":"of these things themselves."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2229.059,"endTime":2231.309,"body":"You know, why should we"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2229.059,"endTime":2231.309,"body":"bother designing these"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2231.3190000000004,"endTime":2233.2490000000003,"body":"processes for the human brain?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2233.2490000000003,"endTime":2234.699,"body":"Like, what would"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2233.2490000000003,"endTime":2234.699,"body":"you say to that?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2235.1440000000002,"endTime":2236.424,"body":"Ooh,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2235.1440000000002,"endTime":2236.424,"body":"that's a deep one."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2236.424,"endTime":2237.704,"body":"I got a lot on that one."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2238.1940000000004,"endTime":2241.3340000000003,"body":"So first of all, as AI"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2238.1940000000004,"endTime":2241.3340000000003,"body":"comes into the picture, AI"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2241.5440000000003,"endTime":2244.5240000000003,"body":"will start handling more of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2241.5440000000003,"endTime":2244.5240000000003,"body":"the mundane tasks, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2244.954,"endTime":2246.474,"body":"What does that leave PMs with?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2246.8740000000003,"endTime":2248.0240000000003,"body":"More decision making."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2248.614,"endTime":2251.4640000000004,"body":"So instead of doing less"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2248.614,"endTime":2251.4640000000004,"body":"decision making because"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2251.4640000000004,"endTime":2253.364,"body":"of AI, they're doing more"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2251.4640000000004,"endTime":2253.364,"body":"decision making, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2253.364,"endTime":2256.2740000000003,"body":"Because now AI is handling"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2253.364,"endTime":2256.2740000000003,"body":"all the mundane tasks."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2256.324,"endTime":2257.424,"body":"What does that leave me with?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2257.7690000000002,"endTime":2261.059,"body":"I don't handle as much of the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2257.7690000000002,"endTime":2261.059,"body":"mundane tasks, so I can't run on"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2261.059,"endTime":2262.7690000000002,"body":"System 1 as much as I used to."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2263.059,"endTime":2265.579,"body":"Now I'm forced to think"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2263.059,"endTime":2265.579,"body":"in System 2, which is more"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2265.579,"endTime":2266.789,"body":"deliberate and thoughtful."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2267.039,"endTime":2267.869,"body":"Which means what?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2268.219,"endTime":2271.989,"body":"I have to have more behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2268.219,"endTime":2271.989,"body":"strategies to essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2271.989,"endTime":2272.9390000000003,"body":"clear my thinking up."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2273.3990000000003,"endTime":2277.789,"body":"So actually, with AI coming into"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2273.3990000000003,"endTime":2277.789,"body":"the picture, we need behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2277.789,"endTime":2280.159,"body":"science more, not less."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2281.0040000000004,"endTime":2284.114,"body":"Also, AI will have to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2281.0040000000004,"endTime":2284.114,"body":"eventually, and some of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2284.114,"endTime":2287.2140000000004,"body":"it's already being done, be"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2284.114,"endTime":2287.2140000000004,"body":"have to be designed around"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2287.224,"endTime":2288.994,"body":"the brain and de biasing."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2289.014,"endTime":2290.4840000000004,"body":"And when I say biasing,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2289.014,"endTime":2290.4840000000004,"body":"I'm not talking"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2290.4840000000004,"endTime":2291.6440000000002,"body":"stereotypes or prejudice."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2291.6440000000002,"endTime":2293.474,"body":"I'm talking about just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2291.6440000000002,"endTime":2293.474,"body":"plain thinking errors"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2293.474,"endTime":2295.434,"body":"like the planning fallacy,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2293.474,"endTime":2295.434,"body":"which is the tendency to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2295.434,"endTime":2297.404,"body":"underestimate durations, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2297.434,"endTime":2300.6040000000003,"body":"So, essentially, with AI coming"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2297.434,"endTime":2300.6040000000003,"body":"to the picture, behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2300.6040000000003,"endTime":2304.5840000000003,"body":"science becomes actually pretty"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2300.6040000000003,"endTime":2304.5840000000003,"body":"much center to everything."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2304.934,"endTime":2308.0840000000003,"body":"Because if AI can handle"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2304.934,"endTime":2308.0840000000003,"body":"some of the mundane project"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2308.114,"endTime":2311.1240000000003,"body":"management tasks, now it's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2308.114,"endTime":2311.1240000000003,"body":"up to us as decision makers"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2311.1240000000003,"endTime":2312.2740000000003,"body":"to use clear thinking."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2312.574,"endTime":2315.344,"body":"The other thing is if you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2312.574,"endTime":2315.344,"body":"look at ChatGPT, for example,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2315.614,"endTime":2318.594,"body":"as a simple example, or any"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2315.614,"endTime":2318.594,"body":"generative AI where you're"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2318.594,"endTime":2323.884,"body":"doing prompting, your prompt and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2318.594,"endTime":2323.884,"body":"how you ask the question will"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2323.884,"endTime":2329.3140000000003,"body":"essentially get better or worse"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2323.884,"endTime":2329.3140000000003,"body":"answers from the generative AI."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2329.7340000000004,"endTime":2334.974,"body":"So if I'm asking generative"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2329.7340000000004,"endTime":2334.974,"body":"AI to unpack my tasks,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2335.474,"endTime":2338.674,"body":"that's the right ask, and I'm"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2335.474,"endTime":2338.674,"body":"going to get better results."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2338.7540000000004,"endTime":2341.8540000000003,"body":"If I ask them to identify"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2338.7540000000004,"endTime":2341.8540000000003,"body":"obstacles, I'm going"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2341.8540000000003,"endTime":2344.1040000000003,"body":"to get better results"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2341.8540000000003,"endTime":2344.1040000000003,"body":"from the AI, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2344.164,"endTime":2347.474,"body":"And also, AI can become a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2344.164,"endTime":2347.474,"body":"coach eventually in the future,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2347.474,"endTime":2350.1040000000003,"body":"where AI is essentially looking"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2347.474,"endTime":2350.1040000000003,"body":"at the rest of our systems"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2350.514,"endTime":2353.844,"body":"or past projects, and it"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2350.514,"endTime":2353.844,"body":"says, what about this, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2354.2340000000004,"endTime":2356.9640000000004,"body":"And so it's pulling up this"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2354.2340000000004,"endTime":2356.9640000000004,"body":"reference class forecast, which"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2356.9640000000004,"endTime":2359.514,"body":"says, well, in the past, you've"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2356.9640000000004,"endTime":2359.514,"body":"benchmarked and done the X"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2359.7740000000003,"endTime":2361.0240000000003,"body":"in a certain amount of time."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2361.094,"endTime":2363.0040000000004,"body":"What say you, human, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2363.364,"endTime":2366.474,"body":"And so in which case now the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2363.364,"endTime":2366.474,"body":"human has to have a better"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2366.474,"endTime":2369.4190000000003,"body":"thinking skills to essentially,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2366.474,"endTime":2369.4190000000003,"body":"for lack of a better word,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2369.4590000000003,"endTime":2372.3390000000004,"body":"converse with the AI and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2369.4590000000003,"endTime":2372.3390000000004,"body":"get better decisions, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2372.3390000000004,"endTime":2373.9190000000003,"body":"Because now they're going"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2372.3390000000004,"endTime":2373.9190000000003,"body":"to be presented with a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2373.9590000000003,"endTime":2377.099,"body":"scenario in which case,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2373.9590000000003,"endTime":2377.099,"body":"once again, they have to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2377.099,"endTime":2378.3190000000004,"body":"make an unbiased decision."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2378.599,"endTime":2380.739,"body":"So if there's cognitive"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2378.599,"endTime":2380.739,"body":"dissonance associated with"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2380.739,"endTime":2384.0690000000004,"body":"that, which is mental discomfort"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2380.739,"endTime":2384.0690000000004,"body":"associated with conflicting"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2384.0690000000004,"endTime":2387.119,"body":"values or beliefs, that's a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2384.0690000000004,"endTime":2387.119,"body":"mentally uncomfortable thing."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2387.119,"endTime":2388.409,"body":"I don't want to talk"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2387.119,"endTime":2388.409,"body":"about it, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2388.409,"endTime":2391.7490000000003,"body":"But AI is bringing you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2388.409,"endTime":2391.7490000000003,"body":"something that you have to face."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2392.2490000000003,"endTime":2393.259,"body":"How are you going"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2392.2490000000003,"endTime":2393.259,"body":"to deal with it?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2393.6690000000003,"endTime":2396.539,"body":"The other thing is that AI"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2393.6690000000003,"endTime":2396.539,"body":"can help in reframing, and so"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2396.539,"endTime":2398.849,"body":"reframing is a big thing in"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2396.539,"endTime":2398.849,"body":"behavioral science because,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2399.199,"endTime":2402.099,"body":"and I tried it in ChatGPT, I"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2399.199,"endTime":2402.099,"body":"said, give me a list of risks"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2402.299,"endTime":2403.6090000000004,"body":"for this associated work."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2403.779,"endTime":2404.9790000000003,"body":"It gave me a list of risks."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2405.3390000000004,"endTime":2407.579,"body":"How did AI give me"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2405.3390000000004,"endTime":2407.579,"body":"the list of risks?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2407.7090000000003,"endTime":2412.3590000000004,"body":"Well, it gave it to me in"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2407.7090000000003,"endTime":2412.3590000000004,"body":"kind of a scary sort of,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2412.449,"endTime":2414.6690000000003,"body":"you know, here's all the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2412.449,"endTime":2414.6690000000003,"body":"things that could go wrong."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2415.009,"endTime":2419.7490000000003,"body":"And I said, Hey ChatGPT, reframe"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2415.009,"endTime":2419.7490000000003,"body":"that entire risk list that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2419.7490000000003,"endTime":2423.2490000000003,"body":"you gave me in a more positive"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2419.7490000000003,"endTime":2423.2490000000003,"body":"light so that my stakeholders"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2423.2490000000003,"endTime":2427.6690000000003,"body":"would be more apt to accept"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2423.2490000000003,"endTime":2427.6690000000003,"body":"them and mitigate them, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2428.0890000000004,"endTime":2431.369,"body":"So essentially I reduced the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2428.0890000000004,"endTime":2431.369,"body":"cognitive dissonance by using"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2431.389,"endTime":2434.9590000000003,"body":"AI so that I could represent"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2431.389,"endTime":2434.9590000000003,"body":"to my stakeholders risk"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2434.969,"endTime":2437.844,"body":"in such a light that they"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2434.969,"endTime":2437.844,"body":"would want to resolve them"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2437.8540000000003,"endTime":2439.1040000000003,"body":"and not run away from them."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2439.3740000000003,"endTime":2440.474,"body":"And so AI did that."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2440.824,"endTime":2445.3940000000002,"body":"So essentially, behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2440.824,"endTime":2445.3940000000002,"body":"science becomes not less used"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2445.434,"endTime":2446.784,"body":"as AI comes to the picture."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2446.7940000000003,"endTime":2450.3740000000003,"body":"It becomes the center of"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2446.7940000000003,"endTime":2450.3740000000003,"body":"everything, essentially."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2450.884,"endTime":2452.8340000000003,"body":"I love that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2450.884,"endTime":2452.8340000000003,"body":"notion of like, you know, a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2452.8340000000003,"endTime":2454.184,"body":"prompt is a nudge, actually."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2454.5240000000003,"endTime":2458.534,"body":"And also, you can prompt an AI"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2454.5240000000003,"endTime":2458.534,"body":"to reframe something so that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2458.574,"endTime":2462.4640000000004,"body":"it's a little less cognitively"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2458.574,"endTime":2462.4640000000004,"body":"dissonant than it was either"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2462.4640000000004,"endTime":2465.614,"body":"in your head or out of the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2462.4640000000004,"endTime":2465.614,"body":"LLM, you know, to begin with."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2466.014,"endTime":2466.664,"body":"Super clever."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2467.094,"endTime":2469.434,"body":"I wish I had added that"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2467.094,"endTime":2469.434,"body":"into my risk management"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2469.4350000000004,"endTime":2470.951,"body":"using AI workshop."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2473.2810000000004,"endTime":2473.661,"body":"Awesome."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2473.8610000000003,"endTime":2475.8210000000004,"body":"Listen, I'll end with a"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2473.8610000000003,"endTime":2475.8210000000004,"body":"question that's a little"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2475.8210000000004,"endTime":2477.8610000000003,"body":"bit more inspirational"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2475.8210000000004,"endTime":2477.8610000000003,"body":"and less of a hardball."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2478.1910000000003,"endTime":2480.201,"body":"Given everything we've been"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2478.1910000000003,"endTime":2480.201,"body":"talking about around, you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2480.201,"endTime":2482.5110000000004,"body":"know, behavioral project"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2480.201,"endTime":2482.5110000000004,"body":"management and its relationship"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2482.521,"endTime":2483.951,"body":"with project methodologies."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2484.4460000000004,"endTime":2487.846,"body":"Like, where is the future of"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2484.4460000000004,"endTime":2487.846,"body":"project methodologies headed?"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2488.106,"endTime":2489.666,"body":"Do you want to make"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2488.106,"endTime":2489.666,"body":"a few predictions?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2489.9260000000004,"endTime":2494.576,"body":"So one, I think"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2489.9260000000004,"endTime":2494.576,"body":"that the absolute methodologies"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2494.576,"endTime":2497.286,"body":"of waterfall, agile, and"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2494.576,"endTime":2497.286,"body":"everything in between, I"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2497.286,"endTime":2500.2960000000003,"body":"think we're already seeing it"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2497.286,"endTime":2500.2960000000003,"body":"becoming more hybrid, right?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2500.606,"endTime":2503.616,"body":"With AI in the picture, it'll"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2500.606,"endTime":2503.616,"body":"start to take over the mundane"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2503.9460000000004,"endTime":2506.4860000000003,"body":"parts of Agile and Waterfall."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2506.8810000000003,"endTime":2510.0710000000004,"body":"And that with behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2506.8810000000003,"endTime":2510.0710000000004,"body":"science and neuroscience come"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2510.0710000000004,"endTime":2513.971,"body":"into the picture, I think"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2510.0710000000004,"endTime":2513.971,"body":"that AI mixed with behavioral"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2513.971,"endTime":2518.481,"body":"science will essentially be"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2513.971,"endTime":2518.481,"body":"center and be key, and the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2518.851,"endTime":2522.751,"body":"methodologies that we use"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2518.851,"endTime":2522.751,"body":"today will essentially, they're"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2522.751,"endTime":2525.731,"body":"not going to go away, but a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2522.751,"endTime":2525.731,"body":"lot of it will be automated."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2526.181,"endTime":2529.021,"body":"And so, as AI comes into"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2526.181,"endTime":2529.021,"body":"the picture, like I said"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2529.021,"endTime":2532.7560000000003,"body":"before, decision making"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2529.021,"endTime":2532.7560000000003,"body":"becomes even more so pushed"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2532.866,"endTime":2537.0660000000003,"body":"to the project manager"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2532.866,"endTime":2537.0660000000003,"body":"because the PM already has a"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2537.0660000000003,"endTime":2538.6360000000004,"body":"lot of automation going on."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2539.076,"endTime":2542.4860000000003,"body":"And so now they have to"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2539.076,"endTime":2542.4860000000003,"body":"use their brain essentially"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2542.496,"endTime":2545.516,"body":"more than maybe what"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2542.496,"endTime":2545.516,"body":"they're used to in the past."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2546.266,"endTime":2550.1360000000004,"body":"I'm hoping that organizations"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2546.266,"endTime":2550.1360000000004,"body":"will also realize that with that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2550.1360000000004,"endTime":2551.5860000000002,"body":"comes higher cognitive load."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2552.0660000000003,"endTime":2555.4860000000003,"body":"And a higher cognitive load"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2552.0660000000003,"endTime":2555.4860000000003,"body":"is associated also with System"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2555.4860000000003,"endTime":2557.4260000000004,"body":"1 and heuristics and biases."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2557.9660000000003,"endTime":2562.616,"body":"So I think the future will"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2557.9660000000003,"endTime":2562.616,"body":"be really cool in project"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2562.616,"endTime":2565.4860000000003,"body":"management, because in 10"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2562.616,"endTime":2565.4860000000003,"body":"years, I hope to see it, maybe"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2565.4860000000003,"endTime":2569.476,"body":"even five years, I hope to see"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2565.4860000000003,"endTime":2569.476,"body":"much of our project management"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2569.476,"endTime":2572.206,"body":"software designed around humans."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2572.846,"endTime":2578.6310000000003,"body":"And that a lot of government"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2572.846,"endTime":2578.6310000000003,"body":"policy, a lot of procedures,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2578.7110000000002,"endTime":2582.411,"body":"PMOs essentially become more"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2578.7110000000002,"endTime":2582.411,"body":"centered around human thinking."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2582.681,"endTime":2587.061,"body":"Because if we realize anything"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2582.681,"endTime":2587.061,"body":"above everything, projects"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2587.141,"endTime":2588.851,"body":"are by humans for humans."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2589.661,"endTime":2593.101,"body":"And so if we center our"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2589.661,"endTime":2593.101,"body":"thinking around, hey, it's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2593.101,"endTime":2595.701,"body":"also the humans we're creating"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2593.101,"endTime":2595.701,"body":"this for, but it's also the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2595.701,"endTime":2596.9210000000003,"body":"humans who are managing it."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2597.3210000000004,"endTime":2602.371,"body":"And there are ways to solve, you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2597.3210000000004,"endTime":2602.371,"body":"know, the 50% of projects that"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2602.4010000000003,"endTime":2606.2110000000002,"body":"go awry and go over budget and,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2602.4010000000003,"endTime":2606.2110000000002,"body":"you know, get behind schedule."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2606.8410000000003,"endTime":2609.4410000000003,"body":"I like that model"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2606.8410000000003,"endTime":2609.4410000000003,"body":"of where, you know, in the"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2609.4410000000003,"endTime":2612.291,"body":"solar system model, actually"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2609.4410000000003,"endTime":2612.291,"body":"the behavioral science side"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2612.291,"endTime":2614.991,"body":"of things is the sun, and"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2612.291,"endTime":2614.991,"body":"our methodologies can orbit"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2615.001,"endTime":2616.431,"body":"around that, and that's okay."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2616.5110000000004,"endTime":2618.851,"body":"Sometimes you need a gas giant,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2616.5110000000004,"endTime":2618.851,"body":"sometimes you need a terrestrial"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2618.851,"endTime":2620.831,"body":"planet, you know, it's all good."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2621.1560000000004,"endTime":2622.7960000000003,"body":"But at the center"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2621.1560000000004,"endTime":2622.7960000000003,"body":"of it is the humans."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2623.2560000000003,"endTime":2625.846,"body":"And that's what will"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2623.2560000000003,"endTime":2625.846,"body":"influence it going ahead."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2626.166,"endTime":2627.8360000000002,"body":"And realize"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2626.166,"endTime":2627.8360000000002,"body":"our brain is not just"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2627.8360000000002,"endTime":2629.3860000000004,"body":"a feeling machine, it's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2627.8360000000002,"endTime":2629.3860000000004,"body":"a thinking machine."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2630.7560000000003,"endTime":2632.666,"body":"I'm using that as"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2630.7560000000003,"endTime":2632.666,"body":"a poll quote for this episode."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2633.2760000000003,"endTime":2634.116,"body":"Do that, yeah."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2635.146,"endTime":2637.106,"body":"Josh, thanks so much"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2635.146,"endTime":2637.106,"body":"for hanging out with me today."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2637.2560000000003,"endTime":2639.4460000000004,"body":"This has been a lot of fun,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2637.2560000000003,"endTime":2639.4460000000004,"body":"I found it really insightful."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2639.6960000000004,"endTime":2641.326,"body":"If folks want to learn"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2639.6960000000004,"endTime":2641.326,"body":"more about what you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2641.326,"endTime":2643.1560000000004,"body":"do in the Institute,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2641.326,"endTime":2643.1560000000004,"body":"like, where can they go?"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2643.471,"endTime":2646.701,"body":"So, if you"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2643.471,"endTime":2646.701,"body":"go to behavioralpm.com,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2646.9410000000003,"endTime":2648.5310000000004,"body":"that's our institute page."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2648.7110000000002,"endTime":2651.371,"body":"You can also click on the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2648.7110000000002,"endTime":2651.371,"body":"membership tab and become"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2651.371,"endTime":2653.201,"body":"a member for free up there."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2653.291,"endTime":2656.351,"body":"And then we also have our"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2653.291,"endTime":2656.351,"body":"certification, which is the"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2656.351,"endTime":2658.871,"body":"NeuralPlan NPPQ certification."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2659.2810000000004,"endTime":2663.911,"body":"So if you go to neural-plan.com,"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2659.2810000000004,"endTime":2663.911,"body":"it's also there."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2663.9210000000003,"endTime":2666.021,"body":"By the way, you can get"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2663.9210000000003,"endTime":2666.021,"body":"certified on a monthly"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2666.0310000000004,"endTime":2669.311,"body":"payment plan, by the way, if"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2666.0310000000004,"endTime":2669.311,"body":"you're in Canada or the U.S."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2669.681,"endTime":2671.581,"body":"Obviously subject"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2669.681,"endTime":2671.581,"body":"to eligibility."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2671.731,"endTime":2673.251,"body":"So that makes it a little"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2671.731,"endTime":2673.251,"body":"bit more convenient."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2673.721,"endTime":2676.241,"body":"So by the way, neural"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2673.721,"endTime":2676.241,"body":"is spelled NEURAL."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2677.6910000000003,"endTime":2679.701,"body":"So it's neural-plan.com."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2680.041,"endTime":2681.641,"body":"So that's our"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2680.041,"endTime":2681.641,"body":"certification as well."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2682.041,"endTime":2682.4610000000002,"body":"Very cool."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2682.501,"endTime":2684.501,"body":"I'm going to include all those"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2682.501,"endTime":2684.501,"body":"links in the show notes as well."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2684.661,"endTime":2685.1310000000003,"body":"Thanks again."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2685.1310000000003,"endTime":2685.6310000000003,"body":"This has been great."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2686.061,"endTime":2687.811,"body":"Yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2686.061,"endTime":2687.811,"body":"been my pleasure, for sure."},{"speaker":"Josh Ramirez","startTime":2687.8210000000004,"endTime":2689.221,"body":"I appreciate the invitation."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2690.201,"endTime":2691.521,"body":"Alright"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2690.201,"endTime":2691.521,"body":"folks, there you have it."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2691.681,"endTime":2693.971,"body":"As always, if you'd like to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2691.681,"endTime":2693.971,"body":"join the conversation with"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2693.971,"endTime":2696.331,"body":"over a thousand like minded"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2693.971,"endTime":2696.331,"body":"project management champions,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2696.541,"endTime":2697.621,"body":"come and join our collective."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2697.811,"endTime":2701.3410000000003,"body":"Head on over to"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2697.811,"endTime":2701.3410000000003,"body":"thedigitalprojectmanager.com/membership"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2701.411,"endTime":2702.021,"body":"to learn more."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2702.0310000000004,"endTime":2704.471,"body":"And if you like what you"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2702.0310000000004,"endTime":2704.471,"body":"heard today, please subscribe"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2704.481,"endTime":2707.826,"body":"and stay in touch on"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2704.481,"endTime":2707.826,"body":"thedigitalprojectmanager.com."},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2708.1910000000003,"endTime":2710.1310000000003,"body":"Until next time,"},{"speaker":"Galen Low","startTime":2708.1910000000003,"endTime":2710.1310000000003,"body":"thanks for listening."}]}