The Bible Provocateur
The Bible Provocateur
Kingdom Economics: Laborer's in the Vineyard (PART 3 of 5)
"Why do you stand here all day idle?" This profound question from Christ's parable of the workers in the vineyard serves as our exploration's cornerstone as we unpack its challenging message about salvation, divine fairness, and spiritual passivity.
The vineyard owner's encounter with those waiting until the eleventh hour reveals something distinctive about both their spiritual condition and God's relentless pursuit. These final workers' response—"because no man hired us"—mirrors a mindset many share today: waiting for explicit invitation rather than actively seeking God's kingdom. Are we similarly standing idle in life's marketplace, expecting others to make the first move in our spiritual journey?
Through passionate discussion, we trace four distinct groups of laborers entering God's vineyard at different times. The first group, potentially representing ancient Israel, negotiated a specific wage with an entitled mindset. Later groups simply trusted the owner to give "whatever is right"—a profound contrast in approaching relationship with God. Yet remarkably, all receive identical payment, challenging our human notions of spiritual merit.
This equal distribution of reward—the penny representing salvation—confronts our tendency to measure spiritual worth by longevity or effort rather than grace. When the early workers complain about fairness, the owner's powerful response affirms God's sovereignty: "Is it not lawful for me to do what I wish with my own things? Or is your eye evil because I am good?"
What makes this teaching so relevant is how it dismantles spiritual pride and transactional approaches to God. The duration of our salvation journey doesn't determine divine reward. A five-year believer might produce more spiritual fruit than someone who's walked with Christ for decades. God's economy operates on grace, not human metrics of deservingness.
Join us in wrestling with these challenging truths. What are you waiting for? The vineyard awaits, and the reward—full salvation through Christ—remains the same for all who respond to His call, regardless of when they answer.
God, doubt, and proof walk into a podcast... it goes better than you’d expect!
Listen on: Apple Podcasts Spotify
Eleventh hour. He went out and found others standing idle, like you said, big Gravy, and he said unto them why do you stand here? Why do you stand here all day Idle? Now let me ask you a question what do you think? What do you think Christ is trying to teach us there when he tells these guys at the eleventh hour, why do you stand here all day idle? Anybody can go. What is Christ? What does he want us to learn from this parable? I don't believe that the word of God wastes words.
Speaker 2:I don't want to misapply what I'm about to say, but you tell me if it fits. If you think it fits, I'm thinking of Proverbs. Okay, when I remember when I first started reading Proverbs and wisdom first thing got my attention. Wisdom was introduced in the feminine gender. The second thing I noticed it says wisdom was everywhere, available to everyone. But what got me was when the people who rejected that. Wisdom got into big trouble. Wisdom, sit back and was laughing at them. That floored me, buddy. That knocked me out of my seat.
Speaker 3:Kind of reminds me of some relationships.
Speaker 2:These people are in trouble and he's laughing at them. I had to go back and read and get the understanding that, like our children, we try to teach our children right from wrong and they go out and say they're going to do what they want to do. Then, when they get in trouble, who do they call? Unfortunately, we answer sometimes when we shouldn't, but wisdom says you can call on me when you want to but I ain't coming. I ain't coming.
Speaker 1:You know, I'll say, I'm going to be honest with you on this one, brothers, I'm going to be honest with you on this one. When he says, when Christ says in this parable, when he asked those guys that came in at the 11th hour because this is the last group that comes in, this is the very last group, and he says to them why do you stand here all day idle? And I've got to be honest with you, I don't have an answer for that. I really don't. You know, I looked at it and I just I don't have an answer for that. I really don't. I looked at it and I just don't have an answer.
Speaker 1:I really don't Because he's at the 11th hour, which is one hour left in the day. He asked them first about why. You know, why do they stand there all day idle? And I know, like one brother says in the in the comments, they're sinners. Yeah, see that part, I know. I know that. I know they represent sinners, because I think all of these groups represent sinners. But when he says why stand you here all day idle, I honestly don't have an answer to that.
Speaker 2:I got a question for you, man. Okay, who are they?
Speaker 1:I believe these are believers that he approaches before he returns. I don't know, I don't know, I know they're sinners. I know it's talking about people who will potentially, because I do believe that in the parable they end up being believers because they work for one hour.
Speaker 2:But you wouldn't say that they were the Gentile.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I would say they're all. See, I believe this. I believe that the first group is speaking specifically about the Jews, the first group, the ones who got paid the penny right. They had the negotiation that we talked about, but I think that everybody else, after the fact, is a combination of jew and gentile but don't?
Speaker 2:don't you remember the part where for paul was reminding the gentiles what they were in fact inheriting and he told them you had no part at all in the commonwealth of israel. You had no hope, you didn't have God in this world? It was like you were just standing there. You know what I mean. You had no expectation to receive what you're about to be bestowed upon you.
Speaker 1:I know that the idol part has a lot to do with a lack of direction, has a lot to do with a lack of here's what I look at Direction.
Speaker 1:No, I look at it this way and, like I said, I can't be dogmatic about it, but I feel that there's two things. He says you stand here all day and you stand here idle, and now it is the 11th hour. It's almost as if he's asking them why haven't you made any movement? Why haven't you, why haven't you made any progress? You saw what other people were, you know, came into the vineyard. Why are you standing idle Like why?
Speaker 3:Hey, I hate to throw a wrench in the whole works thing, but you know how James says that faith without works is dead.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:I wonder if those are people called to work and didn't. And that's, you know, works doesn't save us, obviously, but do you think maybe that's the reason why the idol is there?
Speaker 1:No, Well, the idols were there because they were definitely lazy, they definitely didn't make any inroads into coming into connection with this guy, with the householder which we know is the Lord. But I know they ended up being saved because in verse 7, they say to him because nobody hired us, Nobody hired us. And then he said to them well, nobody hired us, you know, nobody hired us. And then he said to them well, go into the vineyard, but whatsoever is right, you shall receive. And that's what he said. And see, the first group and the last group were the extremes. The two middle groups was all the same, but this last group is different in this regard, because they stand there all day idle. They're there all day. It's the last hour of the day and they say this to him and he asked them the question. And then they say the reason why we're idle is because no man hired us. So you know what it's like to me.
Speaker 1:It's like those people who are always saying you guys probably heard Christians say, or not Christians, but people who haven't come to faith. They'll say something like to the effect of well, you know, God is not speaking to me, he hasn't showed me anything. You know I'm not. You know, I don't know. You know, and if God wants me to, if God wants to save me, he can come to me, or I want to hear him or come to him. In this case, he goes to them.
Speaker 1:I've heard that. I've heard a lot of people say that They'll ask you things like you say God talks to you. How is he doing that? Because it hasn't happened to me and if he wants me, he knows where to find me. This kind of thing. I've heard many people like this.
Speaker 1:Now, I don't know that that's specifically what Christ is talking about here, know that that's specifically what Christ is talking about here, but I don't think it's not outside the realm of possibility for it to be part of it. Whatever it is, Because he definitely has an exchange with them that is different than everybody else. It's a different exchange. It's like he's inquiring you've been here all day, why? Why have you been here all day? And they say and I think the answer is key to understanding when they say their response, which is because no man has hired us, Nobody hired us. So I think somewhere in there is where the answer is and honestly, I don't know. I genuinely don't know, and you know, I don't know, I genuinely don't know, and the fact that I don't is inspiring me to look more into this because yeah, yeah, I mean that's that's cool, like going into it, you know, you're you're you know, you don't know the answer to it.
Speaker 3:You're going to, we're going to dig, we're going to, you know, search the Holy Spirit, we're going to dig, we're going to search the Holy Spirit, we're going to pray about it. Yeah, that's cool, man, I dig it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm looking through this one because that's kind of. You know how it is. Look, the Word of God is a well that never ends. And I read this thing I don't know how many times, I don't know how many hundreds of times, and it's one of the kind of things you look at it and you go man. I just never really focused on that and I really don't have a wholly competent answer for it that I can stand behind. So I'm not going to be one of the kind of people that likes to just make stuff up as I go.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm getting ready to make something up. That's cool. Just make stuff up as I go. Well, I'm getting ready to make something up. I've read in the Old Testament on several times where God alludes to provisions for Gentiles. So, but, and all through the New Testament he's telling the apostles you're going to save the world.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:But in their mind, in Jewish thinking, they would have only saved the Jews. Yeah, so maybe nobody hired them because the Jews were the one doing the hiring and they weren't going to hire no Gentiles. Right, that's just.
Speaker 1:It's something else here, because in verse 7, when he says because they say because no man hired us, it's like these are the kind of people that are always waiting for the first move on somebody else's part. You know they're waiting for somebody else to for the first move on somebody else's side part. You know they're waiting for somebody else to make the first move. It's sort of like you know. It's sort of like us being men, right, what would it be like if you know? What would it be like if we went about our whole lives thinking that only that women should always make the first move on us. That would be kind of a weird situation. We probably still we probably all be celibate for the rest of our lives.
Speaker 2:I don't get you Right Like we're an idol is what gets you, yeah, yeah. I get it, I get it.
Speaker 1:But then yeah, but I.
Speaker 3:I started to. But I think big gravy is onto something man Like, when you look at Leviticus and Deuteronomy and it talks about like hiring. You know, like the, the Israelites looked at the indentured servant period of seven years, right they were. That's all about taking care of your own. Taking care of your own. Maybe that idleness is like nobody hired us yet, Kind of thing is like hey, hey, I wasn't invited in the fold, you know. And like a four, like the foreign servant.
Speaker 3:I believe in the year of jubilee that they freed everybody, you know yeah but um, yeah, but you know, so like that's why I look at it's like hey, I've been here, nobody's hired me, because that's how it used to be. That would fit your narrative on the Israelite thing. It'd be like bringing it full circle.
Speaker 2:Would it also fit the narrow John 10, 16?
Speaker 1:Which says what about the sheep?
Speaker 2:Jesus is addressing the Pharisees.
Speaker 1:Yes, In 10, 16, he says I believe that Other sheep I have which are not of this fold and exist. Yeah, In 1016, he says an other sheep, yeah, I believe that other sheep I have which are not of this fold, and them I must also bring in and they will hear my voice and there will be one flock and one shepherd. Yeah, I think that is. But, like you said, it is that idol part of it, it's like. But the answer that they give when he asks them why are you here idle all day, it's like he he's expecting them to have an answer for why they didn't do what apparently other people did, but he said earlier that the other ones, they were standing idle too right they were standing idle too, and the only one, the only ones who didn't that's not mentioned, is the first group.
Speaker 1:So Esco you there, brother or sister?
Speaker 4:Yeah, how you doing. Good, it's an interesting conversation. I was just watching the whole thing. I think it's because, you know, many come but few are chosen. Right, you know what I mean. Maybe they don't think they're chosen. That could be it. Maybe they don't think they're chosen, that could be it. Yeah, that could be it, because if I was standing here idle, you know, watching a party or something, are you going to invite me in? Or I'm kind of like waiting, you know, are you going to give me an invitation?
Speaker 1:You know what I got to say? Something, esco. I'm going to tell you why I like what you just said, because what it made me think about is that these groups seem to be representative of a type of a hero.
Speaker 4:And not a doer.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, because they were all. It is clear that the last three groups, they were all in the marketplace standing idle. He specified they were standing idle.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Except for the first group. I do think that somehow there's a different disposition, a different demeanor that each group sort of has. But this last group, this last group, he calls out and he and he, and he says he asked the question. He goes like cause he didn't ask anybody else, that he just asked this last group. Why are you standing here all day? I don't, they all were.
Speaker 4:Maybe they, maybe they don't think they're worthy.
Speaker 3:That could be true, that could be true.
Speaker 4:I mean, if I was at your house and you didn't ask me to come in, I might think you don't like me, or maybe there's some kind of something against me that you don't want to invite me in your house.
Speaker 1:I mean, you know, I think I think you might be on to something there, I think you might be on to something there. But this, this gets really good because in verse eight, this gets really good because in verse 8, the vineyard, it says so. When evening came, the Lord of the vineyard said to his steward call the laborers and give them their hire, beginning with the last to the first. Now, here's a good one, here's a good question for you. The Lord of the vineyard said to his steward to call the laborers and to give them their pay. Who is the steward in this parable?
Speaker 1:that's a good question yeah, what do you say esco?
Speaker 4:I don't know. I think the last or first and the first or last.
Speaker 1:No, but I mean this, I mean, I mean this, I mean this steward. So the householder, the guy who owns the house, that's the Lord. We know that's the Lord. I think, it's the Holy Spirit. Ok, what do you say, Big Gravy? I'd go with Jesus. I think it's Jesus too, I think. I think he's the steward. The steward should be the Holy Spirit?
Speaker 4:no, I think he's the steward. The steward should be the Holy Spirit. No, Because he's the one who stewarded us?
Speaker 1:I think that the steward, if you look at the Lord of the vineyard being the father we always see in a lot of these parables where the father is sending his son because when the father is trying to get or is communicating to his people to do this or act this way or behave or respond to him this way, they don't. And then a lot of these parables say okay, now, since you didn't respect me or honor me, I'm going to send my son because him you're going to honor.
Speaker 4:Yeah, get a dictionary. Look up the word steward.
Speaker 1:Well, the steward is like well in the parable. It's like an employee, employee, okay. It's like it's an imperable, it's like one who works for him.
Speaker 4:It has to be jesus, has to be jesus, yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:So I I agree with that too, but I also don't believe that the holy spirit is out of it. But I'm just saying, when we talk about the parables, we gotta you know it's a parable, so it is, it's there's no meaning yeah, you know. So he tells him, he tells the steward To call the laborers. Now we also know that the father Gave to Christ those who were his people. He gave them to him, they were his gift, they were his inheritance, so that means that the laborers belong to him.
Speaker 4:You know, well, if you think about it this way, israel was chosen by God. They rejected God and didn't do what he said. So he went to the Gentiles and he made the Jewish people jealous, right, you know, right, and so kind of put that in the whole context of this parable, you could probably see exactly what's going on Right.
Speaker 1:It's an interesting thing. There's a lot of people here. I'm sorry. You could probably see exactly what's going on Right. It's an interesting thing. Go ahead, todd, I'm sorry.
Speaker 3:I just had a question. So at the end of the day there were no laborers. That didn't work.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 3:There wasn't Right. I mean to me, there was nobody left behind.
Speaker 4:There was nobody left behind. I think that's grace. I think that's the grace you've been saved. But here's the thing.
Speaker 1:Here's the thing All of them, all of them. All four groups of people. Well, not all four groups, the last three groups. It specifically says they were standing idle in the marketplace, right.
Speaker 2:In the marketplace.
Speaker 1:Right In the marketplace and I think that shows us that it is not the whole world but those who are in the marketplace In the parable marketplace is a definite place where those people are purchased In Christ, in Christ.
Speaker 3:Yes, by the blood of Christ.
Speaker 1:Do you agree with that, Todd? Yeah, I agree. What do you think, Big Randy?
Speaker 2:They are purchased in terms of employment.
Speaker 1:Right, but he goes the householder. He always goes to the marketplace.
Speaker 4:I think those are the people who aren't doing the marketplace. Yeah, I think those are people who aren't doing the works of God. There's like there's some Christians who just are continually happy just by being saved and they don't think that they have to do anything to bring others into a fold. You know, they're just content with being saved.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Well see, I believe. Let me, let me ask you. I'll go one by one and ask you guys do you believe that out of these four groups, do you believe that all four groups represent saved people, or do some not? What do you think? I think all saved. What do you think, Todd?
Speaker 3:I think they all eventually are saved. You know, I go back to that original thing where it's like, you know, it's basically like the person who's in prison and accepts Jesus at the very end, you know, and people that accept it early. I think they're all believers.
Speaker 1:Right, what do you think, big Raven?
Speaker 2:I might have a few issues with that first group, but yeah, I believe, I believe, yeah.
Speaker 3:Most have an issue with that last group.
Speaker 4:Well, we know Israel is going to be saved in the end, so well, yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, put it this way, I believe that you, I believe with you guys, I believe that in this, in this parable, these represents this group. These four groups represent four classes of believers. Yeah, definitely, I believe and and I think that I think that their earliest group, if we're saying that they represent ancient Israel, the nation of Israel, that physical nation of Israel, these people have a sort of an affiliation.
Speaker 2:Entitlement.
Speaker 1:Huh, entitlement, yeah, there's sort of an entitlement thing, not not not entirely that vibe, but yeah, I think it's. It's a lot like that which makes it harder for them. Um, because they've had such like, like when you like, when you like. When you read the familiar passages in the bible where it said, where paul says to the jew first and then to the gentile, you know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 3:I know what you're talking about. I was thinking that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I think that's what's happening here. I think, in this particular parable, I believe that because he's talking about the kingdom of God, the kingdom of you know, the kingdom of heaven so these people all belong to that kingdom. Is that what it says?
Speaker 4:in the beginning of that verse.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it does.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's what it's talking about. To save people, then yep, yeah, so.
Speaker 1:I believe here that this is a parable that really is addressing four types of believers. Now, when you go to the parable of the soils, you're talking about out of four different types of hearts to receive the gospel. Only one of those four groups was true believers, the one where the seed landed in good ground right, absolutely. The other three weren't.
Speaker 2:I kind of I got a little disagreement with that. Go ahead, let me hear it. I think the group, before you get to the good ground, I think that last group came in and because of the misfocus of their embracing of God, they became occupied or consumed with the cares of the world and choked out You're talking about in this parable. No, no, the one you were talking about, the different kind of heart.
Speaker 1:The parable of the seed. The parable of the seed, yes, the sower and the seed and the heart sower. So what do you believe about that group? You believe all four of them. Where? Is that reading at Let me see I have to go to Matthew 13. Let me see you have to go to.
Speaker 2:Matthew 13. The parable of the sower. Maybe I can show you what I'm talking about.
Speaker 3:Okay, where is that last one, where it falls on different types of soil?
Speaker 2:Yeah, stone Between the cracks, verse 7, I think it is. Some fell on stony places where they did not have much earth and they immediately sprang up because they had no death of earth. But when the sun was up. They were scorched because they had no roof. That's not the group I'm talking about. Some fell among thorns and the thorns sprang up and choked them out. Okay so in another gospel it says it in a different way.
Speaker 1:No, it's the same. They give four different types of hearts.
Speaker 2:Where is this at in another gospel?
Speaker 1:I don't know. I have to go back and look at it.
Speaker 2:We'll come back to that. I'm sure the wording is different.
Speaker 1:I guarantee you I'll challenge you on that one. Let's get through this one. We'll look at that one on a different tip. So where was I On verse? So where was I on a verse?
Speaker 1:Oh, so the steward, the householder, sent the steward in to pay everybody and he tells them. He tells them to call the laborers and to give them their hire, beginning from the last to the first. So he tells them to start with the last group and then go down to the first group. And then it says in verse nine and when they came that were hired about the 11th hour, they came in at the very the ones that he said why are you standing here idle? He gives them a penny. And when they received it, I mean, he gives them a penny to the last group.
Speaker 1:So the last group, they came at the 11th hour and in verse 10 it says but when the first came, they supposed that they should have received more and likewise they received. Every man received a penny. So the first group they agreed to take a penny and the last group just agreed to take whatever the good man of the house was going to give them and the other guys in between. So the only group that had a complaint was the first group, and their idea is this is basically what they're saying. How can you, god, how can you give them all of what you promised us when we've been with you all this time, we have been your people all this time? These guys come in at the last minute and you give them the same reward you gave us that was how you did it.
Speaker 4:God shows no partiality. Partiality, thank you. Right, he's not a partial God, he's a fair God, and we don't see him as that being fair, but that's fair.
Speaker 1:Right. So let me ask you a question, because this is what I was getting at when I first started this whole thing, because one thing I hear a lot in a lot of, in a lot of modern Christian conversations is this idea of fairness and equity in salvation, and I don't know where to get that from, and this parable is a good one to indicate the problem that people have. What were you going to say, todd?
Speaker 3:Yeah, but doesn't Jesus say that they'll be called lesser in the kingdom of heaven Sorry my throat, but he's preparing a room for us and that unless you are greater than the Pharisees, you won't go into heaven. To me, jesus at that time is talking about there are different degrees, like your room is different.
Speaker 3:Like your room, my room might be different. Like Enoch walked with God, right, you know Abraham walked with God. You know I forgot where it was in when Jesus was talking about it. But he says basically like you know, if, if anybody tries to teach you to not follow this law, they'll be lesser in the kingdom of heaven, Right, so there's a. There seems to be lesser, at least out of all that. Am I wrong?
Speaker 1:Well, I don't, I don't, I don't know if you're wrong, I think. I think. I think that there's a couple of ways of looking at this, and it could be a combination of both ways, and that, and that meaning that, means this it could have a lot to do with the people. So, basically, what we know is this what we know is that the reward that the believer is to get.
Speaker 1:Every believer is the same. Yes, salvation, Salvation is the same. You know, christ said that in his Father's house there are many mansions. There are many mansions. Now he doesn't describe size and dimensions. People will get into all that stuff, but salvation is given to all. Now you can be a Christian for five years before you die. Somebody can be a Christian for 90 years and they die. But the person that who lived for five years as a Christian, there's a strong possibility in many cases that they could have produced more fruit in their five years than the person that lived as a Christian for 80 years or 50 years.
Speaker 1:You know what I'm saying. That's powerful. So it is hard to understand. Like, when you think about it. When you think about it, I don't know how old Paul was when he died. I don't know how old David was. Well, I do know how old David was. It talks about it in the Bible, but what I'm saying is. What I'm saying is how long we've been Christians has nothing to do with the output or the produce. You know there is. But the scriptures that we teach us in the verse, that in the passage that Big Gravy was talking about that, when the seed of God lands in a good heart. That heart will produce some 30-fold, some 60-fold, some 100-fold, but it is not tied to the duration of your salvation.
Speaker 4:Especially if you look at it through the eyes of God and how he sees time. Right, because it's a thousand years is one day, right Now. We think God is slowing, punishing us. We only live 70, 80 years time. Right, because it's a thousand years is one day, right Now. We think God is slowing, punishing us. We only live 70, 80 years, right? Right, that's not even a blink of an eye If we sin today and don't get punished for 20 years. I mean, it's like a blink of an eye to him.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:So I think that in here, when it comes to what hour that these groups came into the vineyard to work, I think that it's talking about two things Us as individuals, number one, and then the whole creation as a collective, when people came with faith. But the point of the matter is that the vineyard, you know the vineyard is open and we are allowed to go into it. And there are certain people, like in the last group, where he comes to them and says what are you waiting for? What are you waiting for Christ? Are you waiting for Christ, would tell a lot of us what are you?
Speaker 1:waiting for? What are you waiting for? I have this. I have a wage that I'm willing to pay. There's a reward that I'm willing to give, an inheritance that I'm willing to give.
Speaker 1:And he asks us all why do you stand here, idle in this marketplace? And you know, ensure the parable can break down in a lot of different ways, but we know that the gospel calls those out to people, and those who belong to him will come to him and will come to him in faith. Who belong to him will come to him in faith. He sent his steward to come pay the guys that are in the vineyard, to give them the fruit Right. And it's interesting because he goes on to say and you guys can stop me if you want to at any point here. So the guys that murmured and complained because the other guys got the same wage, they go to him and they say well, listen, we agreed to a penny, but you gave the guys who only worked one hour the same thing you gave us. We worked 12 hours and you gave them the same thing you gave us.
Speaker 1:This is where this part I want to point out. There's a different aspect to this whole thing when we talk about Christ. But I'm going to bring this up last because I really want to get you guys' opinion on this. This part I want to get to in a minute. So then he goes on. After they murmured and complained to the householder that how can you make them equal to us? How can that happen? How can you do that we borne the burden of the heat of the day? And you gave us a penny and you gave them the same thing. And this is what he says. I love this. This is what he says. This is what he says.