The Bible Provocateur
The Bible Provocateur
LIVE DISCUSSION: Abraham Believed God (Part 3 of 5)
What does it truly mean that Abraham's faith was "accounted to him for righteousness"? This powerful exploration of faith, salvation, and divine justice challenges common misconceptions about God's character with unflinching biblical clarity.
The conversation begins with a provocative statement: "There will be no one in hell that God loves." Far from heretical, this statement opens the door to understanding the completeness of God's nature—His justice as well as His mercy, His wrath alongside His love. Through Scripture, we discover that God's love and wrath cannot coexist eternally for the same soul.
Abraham serves as our prototype of saving faith. His belief wasn't mere intellectual assent but a deep trust that aligned him with God's will. Today, believers follow this same pattern, becoming Abraham's true children not through bloodline but through shared faith.
The discussion tackles difficult questions about divine discipline, challenging the notion that God's favor exists in comfort. Instead, participants reveal how God's chastisement demonstrates His care for His children. One speaker poignantly shares how their mother's strict discipline, though painful at the time, protected them from destructive paths—a small reflection of God's higher purpose in our suffering.
Perhaps most illuminating is the examination of 2 Peter 3:9, often misinterpreted as suggesting universal salvation. When read in context, this passage actually reassures believers that God's seeming "delay" in Christ's return ensures all His people will come to repentance. This divine patience guarantees the complete ingathering of God's chosen family.
Whether you're wrestling with questions about predestination, suffering, or the nature of saving faith, this episode offers biblical clarity that transcends denominational labels. God's sovereignty isn't just a theological concept—it's the bedrock assurance that His purposes will prevail and His promises will be fulfilled.
but his chastening didn't work. You may have a problem raising your own children. Christians, you might have a problem raising your own children. I certainly had my share of not being able to raise my children the way I wish I could have. But let me assure you of one thing that is not a problem that the Lord God has. So rest assured, there will be. Let me make sure I say this clearly there will be no one in hell that God loves. Now everybody, go run to your pastors and your friends and whatever, and tell them how much of a heretic I am, and then come back and let's open up the scriptures and see what it says.
Speaker 2:Heretic whenever Romans 5, 8 says but God commanded his love toward us in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. So much more than being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from the wrath through him.
Speaker 1:Abraham's belief that was accounted to him for righteousness. It means that he trusted that there is nothing that is going to get in the way of God's will, and so what he needed to do, like all of us did, is to align ourselves with God's will, and if we find ourselves seeking his will and believing that his will will justify us, we believe that that is what he will absolutely do justify us, that we will be reconciled to him. And abraham believe that. I believe that. Do you believe that? Um, angie, go angie and Banana Pancakes, and then Jeffrey.
Speaker 4:Well, brother, I just wanted to Support what Meg was saying. You know, the thing is when I think it was a couple of hours ago when it was like all I wanted to do Was know who God was, who Christ was, his characters attributes, who he is. But people who go around saying, oh well, god wouldn't do that, god wouldn't do that, hang on a second. What are you being saved from? You're not being saved from Satan that's pretty much what they're thinking, because you're being saved from God's wrath. He's saving you from his own self, which is pulling us into himself. So that's when we become. When they become, we do, too, become narcissistic towards God. And I mean I just go, you know, hang on a second.
Speaker 4:I really love what Meg said because that's just. You know, she had the biblical aspect, but I always have, you know, I can't always go into scripture and just point all that out, but I can speak truth because it's written in my heart. But that's the thing. If you know God and his character, he's going to discipline us. If you're not his children, then what kind of father is he? When you scream, I'm a father.
Speaker 1:Right Amen sister.
Speaker 5:Banana pancakes. Go ahead, your turn. All right, okay, so I might struggle a little bit toward this question, but as I was sitting here looking at verse six, you know righteousness comes by faith, only networks. So can I get a little bit of help, kind of understanding the scenario where, like, like God nearly unalived Moses Because I know it's because of the circumcision, god nearly unalived Moses Because I know it was because of the circumcision? So is it just like grace operates differently, like judgment is not nearly as quick?
Speaker 1:Are you talking about Abraham or Moses? Tell me about Abraham or Moses.
Speaker 3:I'm talking about both of them.
Speaker 5:In verse 6. Yeah, I was just sitting here staring at verse 6.
Speaker 6:I'm like okay, so righteousness came by faith.
Speaker 5:Right, so the works come. Okay, so we have faith. And then Abraham expressed his faith with that sign of the covenant, the circumcision. And so then in Exodus is it? We have Moses almost being unalive because he had not submitted to the circumcision. So it's like works works were kind of handled differently in the old Testament.
Speaker 1:Works Well, well works. Here's the thing.
Speaker 5:When it comes to I didn't understand. I didn't explain that well.
Speaker 6:That's okay.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean we'll, you know, hopefully we can. We can address a little bit. First of all, we know that man, we know that Moses was a just man. He was the just man and but I will say this, there's not one believer whether it be Abraham or Moses, jacob or you or I we are always subject to God's threatenings, and his threatenings are often used by him as a tool for chastisement, which we're just talking about. So there was no possible way, in any scenario, that Moses was ever not in God's favor and there was no scenario where God was ever going to destroy him or cast him into outer dark. That's never been the play there.
Speaker 1:But I think that I think that and I'm open to have a variety of opinions or additions to this situation where God uses his threats very often to hedge us in, to keep us safe, it's a tool that he uses to chastise us. Sometimes the guilt that we feel we're having that he has taken away, but we feel we may be having, is used as a means to keep us on the right path, and so it's kind of weird in a way. But when you think about it, if you look down all of our lives, I know, if I look at my life, I can see how God has used circumstances, even currently, circumstances that have a tendency to cause you to go in a certain direction, because he sees far ahead in the distance where we're going, if he doesn't take us in a different way, and I hope that makes sense. If somebody wants to add to that answer of his questions, feel free to add to that.
Speaker 5:Just real quick. Actually, what you said very much clicked a lot into place and I'm going to put a note on my Bible next to that. It was discipline, it was chastising because I got a visual of Psalm 32, where it says For day and night, your hand of discipline is on me. So I see that.
Speaker 1:Absolutely Listen. When I was a kid when I was a kid I'll make this real short my mother and my father was gone when I was around five or six years old five or six, so I don't know much about living with him my mother did not play and where we grew up, she couldn't afford to play if she valued her children. And there were four of us and I was the oldest when my father left and I was five. So when I say she didn't play, discipline was not something that we lacked and my mother was scary, it's just the truth. My mother was scary. It's just the truth.
Speaker 1:And not me or any of my siblings regret today. Neither one of us regret it. But we know one thing. We all know one thing that when the wrath, her wrath, unleashed on us because of disobedience to her, it didn't feel good, it hurt and it made us tremble. It didn't feel good, it hurt and it made us tremble, but none of us ended up in jail, none of us ended up in gangs, none of us ended up strung out on the street. None of us. You know what I'm saying is this is the way God works, but on a much higher level than we understand, but he uses his divine providence to bring us to a place that eventually brings us to him. Remember, no matter what you're going through, he's working out the pathway to get you home to him. Ask Angie, ask Candy, ask anybody who's going through hardship. Ask.
Speaker 6:Brother Jeffrey and Joni Ask them.
Speaker 1:Then you will understand. And that's why we're told that we need to smart, in other words, to bear up under the rod of God. Bear up under it the whole world is always talking about. God's favor exists in the comforts that he provides. No, it doesn't. If you want to know where his favor really exists, it's in carrying you through these tribulations and trials. And this is why I hate this doctrine of this pre-tribulation rapture nonsense, because it teaches people to become complacent. It tells them that they're supposed to avoid tribulation, to avoid persecution and affliction. No, we were made let me say that again, made to go through it.
Speaker 1:Man we were made to do it.
Speaker 4:Because you know what those trials and those tests, some of it is not even anything other than the testing of the genuineness of your faith. So you can go and rejoice in all the things that he does, no matter where we see it bad. The world sees it bad. The humanistic point see it bad. The world sees it bad. The humanistic point of view sees it bad. But it's actually good if you're seeing it from God's point of view. You're not seeing it from God's point of view. I can tell you this is what we're talking about. Yeah, this is what we're talking about.
Speaker 6:And everyone can see it in a bad way, and some people can see it in a bad way and some people can see it that way and Candy can relate too.
Speaker 4:I mean, it's just the things that you go through. When it says counting all joy, I can see where Paul was shackled up and writing some of these books that we are actually learning from right here. He had to count all joy in it in order to write this, because when he was writing all these things to us, he was doing it in an act of love, and so he was had to count on joy in it in order to write this, because when he was writing all these things to us, he was doing it in an act of love and so sharing all this stuff. So what I'm saying is I can relate to all that and just saying, you know it's, I don't see it as a punishment, I see it. He's making me grow, he's preparing me for something he's preparing me to go and be him, yep.
Speaker 1:Make it in the jeopardy.
Speaker 7:All right, I had a light bulb moment, all right. So you were talking about there won't be people in heaven, I mean in hell that God loves, and I thought about it for a moment. I was like you know what. So I got some scripture. I want, I want to this. This is it's pretty deep, but listen to what John 3, 36 says. It says whoever believes in the son has eternal life. Whoever does not the son, whoever does not obey the son, shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him. Okay, so if God's wrath remains, then his love does not. His love and wrath are not co-eternal for the same soul, neither he, even he either loves you or he doesn't, and we see it with Jacob and Esau. Now, there will be no one in hell who got who's who's who whom God loves in a redemptive, saving or covenantal sense.
Speaker 1:Those in hell are under the just eternal wrath.
Speaker 7:They're not there's. There's no sense. Now this is my light bulb, so we see that god will get his glory from the unbeliever as well as the believer. It makes me laugh. So hell glorifies God's justice Absolutely, and heaven glorifies his grace.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. And God made, took one lump. He made vessels of honor and vessels of dishonor. And so there are those who are Chosen to be redeemed by grace, through faith in Jesus Christ, and there are those who are chosen by God to be Excluded from that Because, as you said, he is glorifying his justice In one and he's glorifying His mercy in the other. This whole thing, this is what man doesn't understand. It ain't about man, it ain't about me or you.
Speaker 1:It's about him, it's about him. It's always been about him, not him and us just him.
Speaker 7:And we see, we see all over scripture. I guess you could call it judicial rejection, because we see it all, we see it all over it says, it says even in John, like 1239, 40,. It says therefore, they could not believe he has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, believe he has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts. So it's, it's, it's judicial, it's, it's it's justice, it's who god is. But when he, when we go on to see it, says god gave them up, god gave them up to dishonorable passions, god gave them over to a debased mind. God reject, rejected. It is him in his justice.
Speaker 7:But see, so many people don't again, don't want to see the totality of God and knowing him and knowing his attributes and understanding where the fear of the Lord comes from. The fear of the Lord is what? The beginning of knowledge, of wisdom. Okay, and if we don't take the lord god as a whole and explore all the different facets of him, then as believers we get stuck in this place of oh, god is god, is just love, he's a hippie wearing a headband.
Speaker 7:This is not the case, it's just not once we read scripture and explore it, it's not.
Speaker 1:No, it's not Jeffrey. Then God's word and then Candy.
Speaker 6:Jonathan, I just want to add we've been talking about hell here just a little bit and talking about how God's love will not reside upon those who are cast to hell, which I completely agree with. But let's take that a step further, jonathan. I've read some studies on this that when it's all said and done, when everything has been played out, god and us, who are with him eternally, will have no more knowledge or remembrance of those who were cast into hell. Because what would it be like if you had a close relative or a friend or someone who never received Christ? You're going to sit up there for eternity lamenting about them? No, you're not. They're not. When god closes that door, that's it. There will be no remembrance of them again.
Speaker 7:That's part of the hell of hell brother jeffrey, we see that in scripture, though in, in, in revelation, when judgment happens. But what happens? It says, and then he will wipe the tears from their eyes Absolutely, because only he can do this. It makes me sad, but that is going to happen. Yeah, it is. And that wiping we will remember no more.
Speaker 1:Exactly, but here's the thing.
Speaker 3:But the thing I'm looking forward to it.
Speaker 1:But the thing is, we need to look at how to translate that into our vocations here on earth today, because there are a lot of Christians who talk about.
Speaker 1:They don't want to be weeping over their lost mother or father and make sure that you've done all that you can within your power, by the grace of god, to impact the lives of all these souls so they might come. So they might come. This is why, christ, this is why unbelievers don't understand why we do it. They, they, they don't understand that that when, when these men and women and children get turned into hell, when they get turned into for defying, defying God and telling us to shut up, to leave them alone, not to bother them with this gospel every day, this will be a refrain in their ears in eternity. They will long for it to have a fraction of a second of a gospel message that could redeem, even though they know they can never redeem them. They will long. They will long for the word of God. They will long for something that they cannot obtain. Even there, they will still maintain their reprobate. Place Right, they won't change, they can't place Right, they won't change, they can't change.
Speaker 6:Yeah, they can't change. You're right. But Jonathan, I'll also add too, they will be in total agreement with the fact they are there.
Speaker 3:They know why they're there.
Speaker 6:Going back to the rich man and Lazarus. Okay, right, the rich man in hell. He understood why he was there, you know. He knew that there wasn't an accounting error somewhere, that this is what he had earned, this is what his reward was. He understood it. He hated it. He wanted that split second in time that you just talked about, which he knew he was never going to get, but you you, you just said you said something very interesting when you said you mentioned accounting error.
Speaker 1:And we're talking about Abraham, that his faith was accounted to him for righteousness. If God wanted to redeem everyone and didn't or couldn't or wouldn't, then there was a serious accounting error on his part, you see. So what we need to understand is that there is no scenario when it comes to the salvation of those who are saved and the damnation of those who remain in their condemnation. There is no aspect of God's will that was not accomplished. That's what all mankind needs to understand. God does whatsoever he wills.
Speaker 1:Now some guy wrote in comments is this Calvinism or Christianity? Call it what you want, my friend Brian, call it what you want, because we've had a conversation all night and nobody said one word about Calvinism. Because we've had a conversation all night and nobody said one word about Calvinism. We're talking about the word of God and God is sovereign, and if you disagree with that, then I don't know what your, what your Christianity looks like. So I get sick and tired of this silly thing that people try to bring up, to try to to try to undermine the truth. The truth is the truth, no matter who said it, no matter who taught it. The truth is the truth, and so we will obey it and we will follow it, and we will believe it until our last dying day.
Speaker 3:God's word and then candy and Candy. I was going to kind of agree with what the economy guy up there was saying too. As well. As you know, he created and formed us all. He had a purpose that would will for us to believe in the son, be resurrected as he was, share in the father's inheritance, the whole thing. He knew us beforehand and, as he was saying, he created us for that joy, this suffering that we have on earth is the trials and the tribulations. It's all a test, kind of like Job, and we've known, like he said, he's known us from the foundation of the form. He knew us. That's what he created, for us to give him glory.
Speaker 3:Those that lost faith that's what the devil did. He lost faith. He sought the Godhead. That's why he fell. And those that lose their faith with him they say, oh, like you're saying, there is no God. They start questioning God and becoming proud. Yeah, they ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, and they're under the curse that was promised to them, the curse of death, because they question God's purpose and don't give him the glory, because it's always been about him.
Speaker 7:It's never been about mankind.
Speaker 3:It's always been about his will. And I was going to say that's the reason he said when he was talking about brothers and sisters, and we're not going to be sad for those people because they're not our brothers and sisters, not in spirit, they never were. Those brothers and sisters are the ones that wants the will of our father being done, which goes back to 640. Those who know before the foundation of the planet, who have seen that resurrection, that glory, just as Abraham did, and us being the descendants, trying to tie it all back into what you're getting at. We are all descendants and have seen that and sharing that faith and our brothers and sisters in that. Amen to that I'll shut up and be done.
Speaker 1:Amen brother, amen, brother, don't shut up and be done. Amen, brother, amen, brother, don't shut up. Come back later, come back in a minute, because I love what you just said, because we haven't gotten to verse seven yet. But. But it says here in verse six again, even as abraham believed god and it was accounted to him for righteousness. And then he says verse seven.
Speaker 1:Paul says know ye, therefore, that they which are of faith the same are the children of Abraham. Notice what he says. They which are of faith, they Not all, only those who are of faith. These are the same ones who are of faith are white, black, yellow, red, purple, blue, all nations, all tongues, all creeds, people from all those groups that came to Christ in faith, and what Paul says here is that they are not his children. They have no affiliation with him whatsoever, unless it is by blood alone, which cannot save you, because we, as I said earlier, abraham is that prototype of faith. He is the model for what a true believing, saved by grace through faith saint, is. We who believe like him, are justified by faith and we, being justified by faith, are his seed, because he is in Christ as we are in Christ and Christ is in us. This is easy for the Christian. This is easy for the Christian. This is easy for the Christian. This is serious talk. This is what gets people saved, not winning arguments, not following certain people. It is by faith that we believe. Notice something A brother of mine asked me earlier today to comment on 2 Peter 3.9.
Speaker 1:And I was going to do it in a separate post, responding to him directly. And I'm going to do it still because I love this brother. He always listens and he asked me how do I explain 2 Peter 3.9? And 2 Peter 3.9,? You guys have all heard it before, because this is the verse that those of the Armenian not Armenian Armenian persuasion this is what they believe they believe. This verse supports the idea that man has a free will to believe and to be saved. That is all up to them.
Speaker 1:Verse 9, 2 Peter 3, the Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness, but is longsuffering to usward, not willing that any of us, not willing that any should perish, but that all come to repentance. So the idea here that people, that there are Christians who believe that this verse is saying that God is not willing that any should perish, in other words that God doesn't want people to perish. It is true and it is not true, depending on how you understand the context. Here's what it says. Here's what it says, so you know how to deal with these people, these monsters who butcher the truth. First of all, in verse 8, 2 Peter 3, verse 8, peter says this and I believe this is a worthy deviation from the text that I was going to, but it will fit together and I'll show you how.
Speaker 1:In a second, peter says but beloved, now he just got through talking about mockers and scoffers in the last days and people who perished because of the wickedness during the days of the flood, and they were ungodly men, perdicious men, right. So in verse eight, he says this what Peter says, but, beloved, he makes a transition. He was talking about the scoffers and the markers and the wicked men who perished, and now he makes a transition in verse eight. And now he's addressing believers, not scoffers, not markers, not wicked men who resisted and and rebelled against the truth. Resisted and rebelled against the truth. He says but, beloved, don't you be ignorant of this one thing. Don't be ignorant of this. In other words, know this. In other words, don't not know this that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
Speaker 1:Those words are not used or intended to be calculators for you to determine when Christ is going to come back or not. It has nothing to do with that. He is talking about be patient, because the perspective from God is different than our perspective in human flesh. Time doesn't matter to God. We factor time into everything. So he's saying endurance is the order of the day, patience is the order of the day. Don't think, because these scoffers keep asking you. Well, you keep telling me that the Lord is going to come. You keep telling me this is the last days, but where is the promise of his coming? This is what is happening here. This is what Paul Peter is dealing with People saying this. These wicked people are going to Christians going like, yeah, you think your Lord is so great. Well, he's telling you he's going to come back. Well, it's already been 2000 years.
Speaker 8:Where it's already been 2,000 years.
Speaker 1:Where is he? He's not coming because he's not God. He's not true, it's not real. So he says Peter says beloved listen to me, I'm using modern day terms. Peter's saying Christians, folks, y'all, listen to me, please know this and don't be ignorant of this. One day is what the Lord is a thousand years, and a thousand years is one day. Now listen to verse nine, because he's Paul.
Speaker 1:Peter is giving Christians words of comfort. In verse nine he says the Lord Is not slack. He's continuing this theme of not being ignorant. Don't be ignorant of this. The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness, but God is long-suffering To who? To usward. Who are the usward? The beloved? He's talking to in verse eight Believers, you and me. The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness. And then it says but he is long suffering to usward, why? Because he is not willing that any of us should perish, but that all should come to repentance. In other words, the Lord delays his coming. From our perspective is how it's perceived. So he uses this talk, this language, but from his perspective it's a day. From our perspective it might as well be a thousand years. But he says but notice what he says here, because he's saying what not to be ignorant of, what Christians should not be ignorant of. And he goes in verse nine do not be ignorant of this. Number one one day with the Lord is as a thousand years, and vice versa. Number two the Lord is not slack concerning his promise. So don't think that he's slack concerning his promise because he hasn't returned yet. And then he says that some men do count slackness. But he says but God is long suffering to usward Look at the verse.
Speaker 1:To usward, not all mankind, to believers, the beloved. In verse verse 8, and it says that god is not willing that any of us should perish. That's the reason why he's taken so long, because if he came sooner then those who are belong, who belong to him, will not have, will not be redeemed. But he's saying that because he is taking his time. The time that he's taking, from the way we see it, is the insurance and the assurance that all of us should not perish but that all of us come to repentance. He is taking his time to bring in, like Banana says, the full harvest. This verse is not an evangelistic, world, evangelistic passage. This verse is talking about God's people, telling them not to lose hope, not to lose courage, that it may seem like he's being slack, that it may seem like he's being slack, but he's not. The reason why it seems like that is because he is not willing that any of us should perish, but that all should come to repentance. That's what he's waiting for to bring in the entire flock. This is, and superbly, you're next. So this is what.
Speaker 1:When you go back to Galatians 6, when you go back to Galatians 6, let me get there. And it says that Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness. What Peter said in second period three nine is what Paul, abraham and all the saints of God had faith in. They knew that God was not slack concerning his promise and he was not willing that any of them should perish, but that all of them and all of us and all of those who come after us should come to repentance. That's what 2 Peter, 3, 9 is about. It has nothing to do about rejecting God or choosing to accept him. It has nothing to do with that at all.
Speaker 1:The whole context is about Abraham's family, christ's family, the sons of God, the true saints. That's what 2 Peter, 3, 3 verse 9 is talking about. So when it says that God is not willing that any should perish, that's what Abraham and David and Moses and everybody believed. We know what his will is and so we believe that. And so we believe that If this Peter, if second Peter, three nine, was what the worldly people believe, these unbelieving Christians, if what they say is true, then there is no substance, there's no guarantee that God is going to accomplish. We would believe, like them, that God is slack concerning his promises. But when it says that God is not slack concerning his promises, he is saying you can be assured that none of my people will perish. Why? Because I am not willing that any should perish, but that every single one of my people will come to repentance. That's what 2 Peter, 3 means. I looked up us word Hold on one second.
Speaker 7:Let me go to superbly.
Speaker 1:And then you Meg, you next Superbly.
Speaker 8:Go ahead, brother. So my question is is that in verse 9, when it says not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance, you're saying that Peter is speaking to believers here. Yes, Look at verse 8. Look at verse eight. So if that's the case, if he is speaking to believers here, why would he say but that all should reach repentance? Because they all will, Because to be a believer you'd have to repent, right, right, okay, so if you have repented, you've changed your mind from unbelief to belief, then why would Peter be telling believers that God would that he wants you to reach repentance.
Speaker 1:You have your Bible with you. Yeah, look at verse 4. Look at verse three and four. You read them. Read them for us all.
Speaker 8:Knowing this first of all, that scoffers will come in the last days of scoffing following their own sinful desires, they will say where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the beginning of creation.
Speaker 1:OK, now stop there for a second. So what is he saying so far? What's the stage Peter's setting up right now? What is he saying? What is he dealing with?
Speaker 8:Well, he's telling him that people are scoffing at him. And what are they scoffing? Because it is taking so long or it hasn't happened. They're saying, well, where's this promise of him coming?
Speaker 1:All right, perfect. Okay, hold that there Now. Read verse 5 now.
Speaker 8:For they deliberately overlooked this fact that the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and through water, by the word of God.
Speaker 1:And then verse 6, whereby the world that then was being overflowed with water, but the heavens and the earth. And in verse 6, now remember how long was Noah building that ark 150 years, about 120 years plus.
Speaker 8:Right, you're right.
Speaker 3:Something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're right, so 100 years.
Speaker 8:And what was going on when he was doing that? Well, they were scoffing and not believing.
Speaker 1:They were scoffing and not believing. So the issue was that what he's doing is ridiculous and it was 120 years and there was no evidence in their mind that anything was going to happen, especially for somebody building an ark up in the mountains. Now Noah's building his ark up in the mountain. He's preaching for 120 years while he builds this thing 120 plus years building this thing.