The Bible Provocateur
The Bible Provocateur
LIVE DISCUSSION: Rich Man, Beggar, And Forever (Part 1 of 2)
Ever wonder what the very first moments after death actually reveal about a life? We walk through Jesus’ account of the rich man and Lazarus in Luke 16 and slow down at every decisive turn: the sumptuous ease of a man who had everything, the sores of a beggar who had nothing, and the great reversal that follows when both pass beyond the veil. This isn’t abstract theology. It’s a clear, unsettling glimpse into the afterlife before the final resurrection, where souls see, know, remember, and speak—and where mercy received in life becomes comfort, while mercy refused becomes regret.
We explore how Jesus frames the contrast: purple and fine linen on one side, crumbs and dogs on the other. Lazarus is carried by angels to Abraham’s bosom, a picture of covenant comfort and nearness to God’s promise. The rich man awakens in Hades, fully conscious, asking for relief but not repentance, trying to send orders across a chasm that will not budge. That detail matters. Suffering doesn’t automatically soften us; it exposes us. The posture we cultivate now—the way we treat neighbors at our gate, the way we hold wealth, the way we respond to God—continues on the far side of death.
Along the way, we address common misconceptions about Sheol and Hades, the nature of the intermediate state, and why Jesus’ story can’t be brushed off as a simple parable. Expect a candid look at recognition without bodies, memory’s moral weight, and the urgency of seeking mercy before it’s too late. If you’ve wondered how eternity should shape everyday choices—how to live, give, and hope with clear eyes—this conversation will meet you at the gate and point you home.
If this resonates, follow the show, share it with a friend who’s wrestling with big questions, and leave a review to help others find these conversations. What part challenged you most?
BE PROVOKED AND BE PERSUADED!
So you know, I'm gonna get right into it because and people can just come in or not come in or do whatever they want to do. But I'm gonna talk about uh yeah. You know, I oh what yeah, what you did there was pretty cool. I gotta get somebody to kind of show me how to do things like this. Like I don't even know how to put stuff in the background. I know there's a green screen feature and all that kind of stuff where I can put verses that I'm talking about behind me or whatever. So I I spend more time trying to put content up there rather than focus on some of these um these little tricks. But I'm I'm gonna get get into it. I'm gonna take time one day on a vacation or something to figure out how to do some of these things because I like it. And I come from the tech world, so um it won't be hard to grasp. I just gotta spend time to do it. But that being said, I'm gonna deal with Luke chapter 16. I'm gonna be talking about or gleaning a few things from the rich man and Lazarus. Jesus talks about the rich man and Lazarus in Luke chapter 16. And, you know, people have a lot of different notions and ideas about that passage, but overall, we tend to make the Bible so much more complicated than it really is. You know, uh people make the Bible so complicated. And I'm not saying that it's all easy, I'm not saying that it's all um simple. There are some very complex ideas in the word of God, uh, but for the most part, we make things very complicated because the Bible, the word of God has a tendency to um alienate the carnal mind. And the carnal mind doesn't want to embrace things that are spiritual because men want what men want. And basically, like Burger King, they want to have it their way, they want to have it their way. So uh in Luke 16, you have Christ starts off giving a parable of the unjust steward. And then he gives a law, then he talks about the law of the prophets and the kingdom, the governing the law governing the king governing, excuse me, governing the kingdom. But then he goes to this topic of the rich man and Lazarus, and he's not talking about a parable. He seems to be talking about a real situation. Usually in his parables, he tells us when it's a parable. And then he provides an interpretation for the parable in private with his disciples. But in Luke 16, starting at verse 19 through verse 31, he's not just giving us a parable. He's not giving us a parable, he's giving us an actual narrative. Now, what is the purpose of this narrative? The purpose of this narrative that Christ is giving us in Luke 16 about the rich man and Lazarus is to give us a glimpse into the afterlife prior to the resurrection of all men. We're getting a glimpse. It's almost like going up to a foggy window and sort of trying to clear up a space so you can kind of see through, but it's dark and you can't really see that clearly. And this is what Christ is doing, he's giving us a glimpse into the afterlife. So, Jesus says there was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen, and he fared sumptuously every day. In other words, he was wealthy, he dressed well, he ate well, he lived well. We know a lot of people like this, or we we've seen the lifestyles of people like this, where they indulge more often than not to excesses. And they have become, the rich have become aspirational models for what everyone else wants to be. Rich and powerful, and having planes and cars and fancy clothes and jewelry and access into events that only the elite get access to. So many people want to just be rich, and he wants to have all these uh all the regalia of a wealthy person and a powerful person. Well, this rich man is one such man. He's a rich man. He fared sumptuously every day, he wore the finest clothes. And then by contrast, in verse 20, our Lord says, But there was also a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, and who laid at his gate. Lazarus was a beggar who was full of sores, and he laid at the gate of the rich man. He laid at the gate of the rich man, desiring, verse 21, to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table. Moreover, the dogs came and licked his sores. So you got this picture. You have this contrast of this rich man having everything, and this poor beggar that lays at his gate hoping to gather scraps left behind by this rich man. And the picture that Christ paints of the beggar is a pathetic picture. A pathetic picture. He has sores, and evidently he's content with feeding from with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table. But then verse 22 is where it gets interesting, and sores, by the way, is S-O-R-E-S. Sores. Wounds, as it were. So verse 22, it gets to be a little interesting. Because in verse 22, Jesus says, so it was that the beggar, Lazarus, he died. And when he died, the angels carried him to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. That's right, Michael. So the beggar died, and the rich man died. Down to Shoal, down to Hades. That's right. But notice that the beggar who died was carried away by angels to Abraham's bosoms. Now think of this for a second. He died. Now, if you were living nearby him and you or you knew who he was, you would know that he died. But something else was happening, happened when he died. It says that the beggar died, but he was carried to by angels to Abraham's bosom. His body died. But his body wasn't carried anywhere. We know that when we see people die all the time. The rich man also died, and it just says he was buried. That was it. And they both died right around the same time. That's correct. They all died right around, they both died right around the same time. Now, verse 23. This gets good, everybody. For those of you who love the word of God, this gets good. As all the word of God is. I say that about every page of scripture, but so whatever we're talking about in the Bible at any given time is very good. Now, both of them died. The rich, the the Lazarus, the poor man, was carried away by angels to Abraham's bosom, wherever that is. But it says that the rich man also died and was buried. But, verse 23, and being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes, and he saw Abraham afar off in the distance, and Lazarus was in his bosom. So here's interesting. Here's what's interesting. Excuse me. They both die. One gets carried to Abraham's bosom by angels. Lazarus the beggar has angelic escorts. Take him to Abraham's bosom. But notice what it says about the rich man. He being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and he saw Abraham afar off. And he saw Lazarus in Abraham's bosom. Now, two things that I want to bring up. A couple of things I want to bring up, actually. When we die, when we die, we are immediately brought into the presence of our Lord. And if we're not a believer, we are immediately in torment in Hades. Or Sol, whichever one you want to call it, whichever version of the Bible you're reading. Now, a lot of people would like to argue and say that Sheol or Hades is just simply the grave. That is just the grave. But it's not. It is not. If it were, how could Jesus say that the rich man was in torment in Hades? Now keep in mind, he said the rich man was in torment, and this is, and the resurrection hasn't even taken place yet. The resurrection hasn't taken place yet. So one thing that we know now is that one, when you die, based on what your life was when you were alive, you end up in torments or you end up in Abraham's bosom. Jesus' words, not mine. If you die, an impenitent sinner, you die now before Christ comes back. You go immediately into Hades, where you are tormented. Again, not my words, the Lord's words. If you are a believer in the Lord Jesus, when you die, you will be carried away by angels immediately into Abraham's bosom. You will go to the place where all believers go when they die. Now it says that verse twenty three, that the rich man being in torments in Hades, it says that he lifted up his eyes. He lifted up his eyes, and he saw Abraham afar off, and he also saw Lazarus the beggar in Abraham's bosom. So even without the body, even without the body, even though we are immaterial, in the intermediate state, meaning we don't have a physical body, somehow we are able to be seen and to see. How? I don't know. But it's the same way angels see. Angels see and hear. They don't have senses, but they see and hear, and they have strength, and they move about swiftly. Same with Lazarus and the rich man, or at least the rich man for sure, because he lifted up his eyes in torment, and he was able to see Abraham, and he was able to see Lazarus. He saw them. And it was a far distance. But whatever the reason, however, is done, departed souls can see other departed souls. Departed souls that go down into torments can see the departed souls that have gone into Abraham's bosom, and vice versa. There is a way in which they can see each other. Don't ask me how. I don't know. No one knows. We just know that it is so. We just know that it is so. Then it says in verse 24. The rich man then cried out and said, Father, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am tormented in this flame. Now, listen to this. Hear me out, believers. I know there's a lot of you on here that are sort of quiet, but hear me out here. The rich man calls out to Abraham, and he says, Father Abraham, have mercy on me. And then he says something really interesting. He says, Abraham, send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue because I am tormented in this flame. So now we see that the rich man can actually talk to Abraham. I'm in Luke 16. Luke chapter 16. Now I'm at verse 24. So the rich man says, Abraham, he says, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his tongue or tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue because I'm in flames. So now we see that he is able to communicate to Abraham. He's able to communicate. But before that, we notice that he also recognizes Abraham. He recognizes who he is. Now, no doubt he's never seen Abraham, but somehow he now knows. Somehow he now knows that that is Abraham. And he recognizes him with respect. Father Abraham, have mercy on me. See, now he's asking for mercy. Now that he's in flames, in torment, now he's asking for mercy. All these people that come on here and start ridiculing and mocking God, calling it fairy tales, calling it lies, calling it something that men use just to enslave the minds of men. Instead of asking for God to show them mercy, they want to ridicule God's people and mock God's people. But Christians, let me tell you something. The day is going to come when these people are going to shed the tenement that they live in. Their bodies. They are going to be removed from the ghetto of their bodies. Spiritual ghetto. And they are going to beg for mercy after the fact. They mock God and they say, Where is the promise of his coming? For things continue as they always have been. Jesus isn't coming. It's a fairy tale. Jesus didn't resurrect. There's not going to be any resurrection. It's a fairy tale. You guys are crazy if you believe all that Bible talk. You are nuts. I don't need mercy. I don't need salvation. I have science to lead me the way. It is not enough for them to just not believe. But they have to put down and be critical over the ones who do. Instead of mercy, they want to charge you with being foolish and wasting your time. But let me tell you something. The day is going to come, like they did for this rich man, where they're going to die. That tabernacle that they live in right now is going to go into the ground. And they are going to lift up their eyes in Hades, being in torments, seeking the mercy that they refuse to ask for themselves, and they're going and the mercy that they refuse to extend to others. It's coming and it's coming quickly. It's coming quickly. So when I see these people, they don't distract me. Sometimes I get a little my feathers ruffled. But I always know who I believe and that he will come for me and that he will make do on his promise. He will not embarrass us for having the hope that we have in him. He will make do. And all those people who laughed at you and who mocked you and who and who speak against the word of God and against our Lord and Savior, they are going to wake up in torment begging for mercy. Begging for mercy that they will never get. You are going to die. And if you do not know the Lord Jesus Christ, you are going to wake up in hell begging for mercy. You may want to call that fantasy. You may want to say that hell is here on earth. You can make up whatever you want to make up that's going to make living your life in your body of sin palatable. But believe this one thing. Your soul is going to be removed violently from your body. You're going to be cast into Hades to be tormented. And that, my friend, will just be the beginning. That will just be the beginning. And you will be seeking God's mercy. But your nature won't change. Your essential nature won't change. See, you will want ease from your current circumstances. But you will want ease because you are used to having ease. This rich man, notice, he doesn't change. He never changed. He still has the attitude of a rich man who is living on earth. How do I know? Well, look at the passage. He says, Father Abraham, have mercy on me. And he says, send Lazarus to dip his finger in water to cool my tongue. Now notice, he asked Abraham to have mercy on him. He's still selfish. He's not asking for mercy for others. He's only seeking mercy for himself. He's seeking only his own comfort because he's used to that. Wealthy people, generally, more often than not, 99.99% of them, are selfish human beings. They are selfish human beings and they rationalize their wickedness. But they tell you, if you just pull up your bootstraps, you too can be like me. We all know that's not how it is. But he's telling, he's he's asking Abraham to have mercy on me. He doesn't have the demeanor of someone who is broken. He doesn't have the demeanor of someone who is repenting. He's telling Abraham to have mercy on him, but he hasn't asked for forgiveness. He hasn't asked, how can he get out of this torment? He's asking, how can I be comforted while I'm in this torment? Think about this for a second. Look at what he's asking. This man opens his eyes after dying, being in torment in Hades, in a flame of some sort, some supernatural flame that he's in. And he doesn't ask for anything significant. He asks for mercy for himself. Not forgiveness. Not can I have a second chance at life? Not can I talk to the Savior? No. He asks for mercy. And he doesn't even ask. He just basically says, Abraham, have mercy on me. He still thinks he's calling shots. Sorry, once again, my phone is people keep trying to call, and I forgot to put it on um mute or whatever. So forgive me for that. Now the rich man decides to give Abraham a directive. Imagine B. In hell, giving out directives to Abraham. What do I mean? Well, look at verse 24. He says to Abraham, Um, can you send Lazarus to me? Have him dip his finger in cold water, and then come back and cool my tongue. Now he's giving Abraham directives, orders.