Jennasis Speaks: The Transformative Power of Women's Stories

The Healing Power of Clinical Hypnotherapy - Jennifer with Joni Marra

September 10, 2020 Jennifer Malcolm
Jennasis Speaks: The Transformative Power of Women's Stories
The Healing Power of Clinical Hypnotherapy - Jennifer with Joni Marra
Show Notes Transcript

All of us carry our life experiences with us, good and bad. In some cases, those experiences weigh us down and keep us from realizing our goals. Today, Jennifer Malcolm interviews a clinical hypnotherapist and breath therapist, Joni Marra, who helps her clients confront and shed those experiences that are holding them back.  Joni shares about her practice, her passion for helping others, and how her journey led her to where she is today.

Jennifer Malcolm:

Welcome to the Jennasis Speaks podcast, The Transformative Power of Women's Stories, a platform that empowers women storytelling to promote collective vulnerability, acceptance and healing. I am your host, Jennifer Malcolm, self made entrepreneur, women advocate and life balance expert. Welcome back to Jennasis Speaks: The Transformative Power of Women's Stories where every woman has a story and every story matters. I'm your host, Jennifer Malcolm. And with me today is a longtime friend, colleague, healer Joni Marra. here to share her story today. She's a founder of inward bound a private practice where she treats clients with clinical hypnotherapy and breath therapy. And we're going to jump into her story from her grassroots for profit work that transitioned into her why for what she's doing today. So welcome, Joni.

Joni Marra:

Thank you very much.

Jennifer Malcolm:

It's so good to see your face. I love the power of zoom.

Joni Marra:

Yes, absolutely.

Jennifer Malcolm:

I haven't seen you face to face in probably three to four years. And I in preparation for today, I was trying to think back when you and I first met, and I believe if I remembering correctly, it was around 2011 at common grounds, and I participated in a firewalk out there. And you and Jim, were also there. Yes. And I think I bunch of us went went out afterward and grab beers. And I do believe that was the first time I really hung out with you guys

Joni Marra:

by walking and then bonding over beers. Exactly. I love it. Let's put anyone want. Exactly.

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's a great day. That's a great day. But I just wanted to start with your story of your work and in the public sector and in the for profit arena. And give the audience a little bit of background of who you are and the work that you did. And then transition right into you know, your work that you do today.

Joni Marra:

Yes, thank you. You mentioned the word transition. And that's what I want to weave throughout our discussion. It is trust, transition, saying yes or no and accepting. And for me, you asked for my background, I was a sales rep. I sold industrial products for nine years. And I went to law school at night. After I graduated from law school and took the bar. I then worked at a corporation for 13 years and loved it and probably could have retired from that Corporation, they treated me royally. But it didn't feed me I needed something else. So I left there, and I went to nonprofit, thinking that that would be me. And it didn't. So I trusted myself again, made another transition, left the nonprofit said yes to whatever's next, and I didn't know what was next. And then decided that I wanted to have my own practice. So I went to the Cleveland Clinic and I got certified in clinical hypnotherapy through the wellness Institute. I loved the modality because it teaches us to go in and to heal. I received one more certification and that was in breath therapy. And that was through integrative concepts in Arizona, once again, getting out of our head, getting into the body and healing patterns. So for the last eight years, I have now had inward bound. And I well actually three and a half years of formerly had in warband. Eight years, I have seen clients with either clinical hypnotherapy or breath therapy. So went from sales rep, to law student at night, to the for profit to the nonprofit to my own stuff now. And I love what I do. That's awesome.

Jennifer Malcolm:

So describe to the audience what hypnotherapy is. Because a lot of people may see the bio of this and be like, well, that's just woowoo stuff. And it's soft stuff. And, you know, does that really work? And is it really real? And I think the benefit and the validity that you know, Cleveland Clinic, there's science behind it. There's such deep healing power behind it, but the audience may hear it, like that's a little woowoo. So let's go into what it is and the power and the impact of what can what can occur if you step into that.

Joni Marra:

Sure. Let's take separate first is clinical hypnotherapy. And what we usually think of hypnosis is whenever you are in a Las Vegas room, maybe bad Some dark or dim lights and some alcohol and it's late and someone is up on the stage calls people up, and all of a sudden, asks them to run around the house and act like a chicken. Exactly. Ask them to run around their room and eat an onion and pretending that it's an orange, right? That's actually hypnosis. Okay? My practice is clinical hypnotherapy. The difference is through hypnosis, the person who is facilitating tells you what you do, tells you what you are going to do, tells you what you think tells you what you say, the opposite from my end, but we use hypnosis just to get into a relaxed state. But you Tell me your story, we go deep into the body, and we find out what is your pattern, the pattern serve to as a little girl. But it may not serve you now as an adult, right. And that's the pattern or the wound that we have to heal. The other part of it is breath therapy, that is using the breath to also go into a bit of a trance, to slow the body down, get us out of our head, you've got a lot of body from your neck down, let's get into that subconscious. Exactly. And find out what pattern is in there. You breathe 18,000 times a day. So let's make sure that some of them are mindful. And using these tools to to release what doesn't serve you anymore. Want to bring in What does,

Jennifer Malcolm:

right. And it's interesting because even growing up in western medicine and methodology versus Eastern religion, methodology, Eastern This is normal. This is a normal daily part of really feeling all of it and, and Western is catching up to Eastern methodology. And what the benefit of just breath getting oxygen full breaths into your body, the power and just healing of that alone without, you know, going into let's go deeper into what served you earlier, but just breath alone oxygenating the body because, you know, I know how often I talk fast, I go fast and move fast. And then I'm like going going going I'm like why am I had a breath and it's just allowing myself to be and taking Keeling breaths in to calm to get perspective that I think is becoming more and more norm. But it still can be unknown to a lot of people. So what are some types of situations and I know you have HIPAA laws and privacy which is beautiful. But what are some of the like examples of work that you can do through either breath therapy, hypnotherapy or combination of both?

Joni Marra:

Thank you. And yes, I am under HIPAA and confidentiality what I hear from my clients I take to my gray, a period that we have to have a trusting relationship. Again, the trust trust in yourself trust in the transition. The benefits are just let's just go with some of the breath therapy benefits burns and eliminates toxins from your bloodstream, releases toxins stored in the tissues of the body. boost your immune system, lowers your blood pressure increases circulation, reduces physical stress, reduces emotional stress, enhances libido and both sexes. increases intimacy and relationships increases mental clarity and creativity. Who wouldn't want that?

Jennifer Malcolm:

No exactly, and it's free.

Joni Marra:

It's free if you took my next line.

Jennifer Malcolm:

I didn't know that was your next line. So I didn't mean to steal that from you. But it is it's free. It's just taking the time and being intentional to do that. Wow.

Joni Marra:

So the type of clients the type of healing that we work with, is I not a therapist, but it's really stuff that you would go to a therapist for. And just kind of boil it down inside relationship problems. I don't want to eat carbs. I don't like myself. I was an abuser. I have been abused, either emotionally, physically, sexually. I've been in trauma, and I didn't even recognize that as

Jennifer Malcolm:

powerful because all of us could identify with one of those. Or we can extrapolate it out. I smoke I drink too much. I am a exercise all the time and image issues and I know through some of the groups that I that are in my circle, we talk about things that serve us, that distract us from pain. So whether that's TV, food, alcohol, smoking, exercise, in any of those things, maybe in and of themselves are not harmful. But when you use those as your crutch, or use those because they serve you in some way to avoid, to avoid pain, to withdraw, to get numb, they can serve us to protect us, we're all looking to protect our hearts and our souls. And I think, through breath, and through the work that you do, there's a there's a whole pasture of healing, and beauty, and an ability to walk in higher confidence, deeper freedom and joy, that we that we don't access and we should access.

Unknown:

Well, you need to, I believe you need to go with a dark is to get to the goodies, that's where the gold is, right. And the phrase that I use, which was akin to yours, is I want my clients to be more confident, more courageous, and less compromising, right. And my practice is about three things. One is becoming aware of what's going on out of your head into your into your subconscious, to I teach tools, and three, use your tools, you don't need me he'll and go out with each other. I love it.

Joni Marra:

Really. That's what I did through my transition from sales rep, to law school at night, to nonprofit to from profit to nonprofit, it was that trust was the going inside. It was the willingness to not be compromising anymore. And to say yes, and speak my truth, and say no, and speak my truth, to get out of my comfort zone into my challenge zone. And that's what I teach clients.

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's great. So when you say you go and you take your clients, and often you go to, you know, as a adolescence child, young adult, these things served you, they benefited you, and they may not serve you now as your adult self. Can you can you go a little bit deeper in what that means? Because that may go over some people's head and say I don't I don't know what even that means. Can you go a little bit deeper into explaining that?

Joni Marra:

I believe I can. Here's an example. A mother is walking hand in hand with her small child who's maybe five years old. They're walking, maybe even in a store down the street, toward them, comes one of the mother's friends and says hi. And she reaches down to grab this little girl in hunger free COVID. Exactly. The little girl doesn't know who this person is. There's a towering person with an elevated voice coming toward her. And so she gets afraid. She hides behind her mother's leg. And she starts to cry. The mother is embarrassed, doesn't know what to say and says, Oh, she's shy. Well, here's what happens to the subconscious. That subconscious can take in for the little girl because she doesn't know what shy means. But when you're fearful, run away, start to cry, and don't count on authority taking care of you. So she grows up, when she gets fearful subconscious kicks in. And she it's her flight, she runs away, or she starts to cry. Because the patterns been set. She's in her boss's office. her boss says something to her. She takes it as fear. The boss she didn't mean it. But the girl takes it as an adult goes back to the cubicle instructs to cry. That's the pattern that no longer serves her. It serve turned a moment that had happened. But it no longer serves her. So we go in, through an age regression we get in, we find out where that wound is, and we heal it. And it doesn't even matter what people were they meant it or not. But it's how the body took it in. Not the mind but the body.

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's powerful, because I am sure every woman listening to this now can identify with something as an adult woman going, maybe this is an emotional reaction that I don't know where it came from. But I am either triggered and get defensive. I'm triggered and I withdraw. I'm triggered and I cry. I'm triggered and it started somewhere earlier, where it was reinforced or birthed or that deposit came and your body learns to respond to that type of trigger.

Joni Marra:

Again, you're right, you're activated or you're triggered from trauma, and four things are going to come up guilt, fear, shame, or anger. So when something happens in your trigger, and your triggers are much different than anyone elses That's why you and I can go see a movie, you'll like some parts. And I like other parts. It's, it's what how we were built. So guilt, fear, shame or anger. That's usually how we respond. And if it's not in balance in your body, then what's going to happen is you're going to respond, it's going to be out of balance, and you're not going to understand why. And you're not going to be able to trust anyone, especially yourself. So if you're looking for a transition in life, you need to be able to trust you, because you're the only one you have for the rest of your life.

Jennifer Malcolm:

And that's powerful. Because I know as a woman, caretaker, moms, we help navigate other people's hearts, we help breathe encouragement in life. And, you know, I just dropped off my 17 year off to her freshman year of college yesterday and mixed emotions, pride, such pride. Such some fear of Okay, she's out on her own. And you know, a little bit of worry, joy, sadness, grief, you know, so all these emotions, we're always caretaking others and, and maybe cognizant of our emotions, but how many women and this will be a great question to pull when we when we release this podcast, is how many women really do self care and or identify a trigger? That we feel guilty? Angry? What were the other two? guilt, anger, fear, and shame? And do those service or they are or what do we do with those emotions? And, you know, in full candidacy, you know, the, the emotions that I probably deal with the most are guilt and shame. And some of its from I'm sure, childhood trauma, and fear driven things, that now as an adult, those are my first triggers emotions. Right, that come forth, that are not the appropriate emotion. If my husband, Chad, and I get into an argument, you know, he's not, he's not shaming me. He's not, you know, belittling me, we're just having, you know, a disagreement. And those, those emotions don't serve me as an adult woman.

Joni Marra:

And those emotions in you, I'm what fear in each of us, because if we ever have fear, we're gonna walk across the street and look both ways and smack we're going to get hit. So fear keeps us healthy. I want anger in each of us. Because if we don't have anger, we're not going to stand up for what we believe, and guilt and shame. We want those into Be humble. But we want them in balance with the love with the joy with peace with the harmony, we want to imbalance. And when they're out of balance, we chase them around as if they are our master. Think of a marionette puppet. And the cross bars are the fear. So the fear says Oh, go over here and do this. And we follow along. The anger says come over here and do this. And we follow along. Let's cut those lines to those cross bars, not the life we desire and deserve. Once we cleanse ourselves out.

Jennifer Malcolm:

So if I would come to you and I have come to you for the audience, I have done some work with Joni, and it's powerful and deep and, and healing. But for a typical person, do you go in once and you're done? Is it multiple? Is it I'm going to go in and do some deep work? And then maybe every three months come back? And kind of, you know, keep seeing you? How does it work? And I know you said ultimately you want to cut the ties and have people spread the joy. But what's a typical scenario working with you?

Joni Marra:

It really depends. Okay, usually the first session is a clinical hypnotherapy session. Because we want to go in remember, what am I aware of? It's no longer serving me. So we go in and find that I teach the tools. And then I anticipate that you'll go out and use the tools. I don't see clients unless they do their homework, you've got to do your homework, because this is about healing. I don't see clients very often I need to see them maybe every three or four weeks because they need to go out and do their work. Some clients will come three times some clients will come one time, it really depends on what the issue is. We can say other healing. But a lot of times clients want to go deeper and deeper. And if they want to go deeper, that's cool. I will go deeper with them. But if they come and just come here to learn and not practice, I really can't see the clients anymore, because that's not what this is about. It is a journey like every woman has. And I want her to embrace it. And I want her to trust and use the tools. So after one time she has tools, right? If she wants to come back, that's fine. That's fine. I know that it's all about her, not about me, because now I can be confident and I want her to be confident. That's great can be courageous, she can be courageous and I want us both to not compromise.

Jennifer Malcolm:

And knowing the write up in the preparation for this. You said my practice is not psychotherapy. I am not a therapist. So what does that mean? So you're just a facilitator, like, how would you describe that? Because some people might say, Well, I'm going to go in and I have a counselor, I have a therapist, and it is different. And how would you really differentiate between those two things?

Joni Marra:

I work with the therapists, and they mostly work with talk therapy. So if one of my clients needs to talk therapy, I refer out a lot of times to talk therapists referring to me, I work with the subconscious consider the neck down. That's great. Yeah, well, we work because the body and the muscles have memory, that's where everything is stored. So whenever I have my certifications, they are certifications, they are not licenses, okay. I don't feel comfortable saying that I'm a therapist. But what I do is I work with clinical hypnosis, hypnotherapy, and I also work with breath therapy.

Jennifer Malcolm:

So did does the breath therapy, and the clinical hypnotherapy tend to go hand in hand, or are they? Do they go back and forth? Or they come? Obviously, they're complimentary. But in a practice session with you, are you doing both? Or are you teaching and doing the deep work the first time giving tools such as breath, and then allowing the person to work on those? So how do those two things go hand in hand?

Joni Marra:

Thank you for asking. Usually, we start with clinical hypnotherapy because that's a very deep, but we can start with breath therapy, it really depends on what the client's issue is, what he or she wants to heal, and how far they want to go and how quickly I leave that up to them. I give them the menu, and then we work it out from there. So it's usually clinical hypnotherapy, then maybe a session of breath therapy, to show the how they can compare and contrast that. But sometimes when they're so comfortable with that, they'll go back to clinicals. Because now they want to go deeper, and they want to clean the stuff out of theirs, like I got this baby, let's go for it.

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's great. It's like cleaning out the cobwebs or cleaning out a closet, you know, all of us were purging, you know, the very beginning of COVID. And when you get one area cleaned out, organized, put back together the way it's supposed to be. Yeah, it does encourage you and give you energy and desire and hope to let's move on to the next area where I can he'll clean out the closet, you know, clean out the closet, wipe down the cobwebs, and be a more courageous person as well.

Joni Marra:

And a lot of times people will come once and say, Look, this isn't for me. Okay? A lot of times, within six months to a year, I'll see them again and they'll say I'm ready. That kind of the appetizer, but there's no judgment, there's no expectation, it is what it is. And they're not used to that type of environment. Right. So sometimes that can be a little intimidating.

Jennifer Malcolm:

And and as an I could break my own HIPAA law. So you're not I know you're not saying anything. But when I did my work with you, I only felt love and anyone who would ever work with Joni, you. Even if y u don't work with Johnny, if y u ever meet Joni, you are the e bodiment of love. You are just a ways fully present fully. Just i's like this love bubble. You j st come in you feel safe, you f el warm, welcome. You feel i cluded. And it's just goodness l ke you when you're you spend t me with you, it just goodness e ulates around you and doing t e work that I did with you. It w s a very hard for me to go in a d trust you with, you know, p rt of my story and journey. B t the benefit of I knew I was s fe. And I knew that I was in g od, warm, trusting care. That w uld serve me ultimately, b tter. So I want to honor you i that space as well, because y u're an amazing woman.

Joni Marra:

Thank you.

Jennifer Malcolm:

You're welcome. How did you first start learning about hypnotherapy and the breath therapy? Was it always a part of your journey? Or did you just stumble across it one time and lead? Yeah, that's for me. Um, I

Joni Marra:

I was actually swimming in the pool, someone at the gym and swimming laps, someone said they were going to go to the Cleveland Clinic and be trained, and I could not get it out of my mind. And I just felt called to it. And that's one of those journey feelings that I need to trust. I need to trust the transition need to say yes when it feels right, and then accept. So once I learned that, and I especially like this certification because I had to do my own work as a client to get my certification. And then I did all of my supervisory hours over the Lyndhurst office at the Cleveland Clinic. So I like that because I had to do my stuff clients did their stuff. Then I wanted one more modality. Because if someone doesn't want clinical hypnosis, hypnosis, I want to be able to give them breath therapy, which they can do completely on their own after one session, right?

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's powerful. What would someone coming to you? What expectations should or shouldn't they have Have if they have a session with you.

Joni Marra:

Um, I always have a phone conversation with prospective clients, because I want to make sure that what they expect and what I can deliver, equals, right? They don't need to spend their money or their time, if it's not going to be what they need. So what they would expect is to come into a safe environment where it's confidential, where whatever they want to happen can happen for healing. So if they want to go deep into something, they can go deep. If they just want to discuss, they can discuss, discuss. But the three things again, that I will work on is, what are they aware of in their body that's no longer serving them, I'll help them identify it to is they will leave with tools. And three, I invite them to use their tools. Great.

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's great. Can you give another example, such as the one that you did before about a little girl holding our mom's hand? How that because that's very easy for someone to visualize of, here's an example of, of a childhood experience that can represent as an adult. Can you give another example, and I'm putting you on the spot here? Because I didn't ask you to prep this. But another example of that situation of something that that would have served us as a child to protect us it was the right emotional response or, or that that then takes hold in our body, that in real life as an adult would show up, that does not serve us.

Joni Marra:

Yes, it is a similar one. But this one was the body, the child's body, absolutely shutting down. And this is about sexual abuse. So if there's any triggering out there, anybody that's not comfortable with it. You don't need to listen, it's okay. I honor that. I had someone come to me who was in their 70s. When this person was in boarding school, when he was 10, he was sexually abused by the headmaster. He's now 72. He leads with anger, whatever happens, he leads with anger. Because what happened when he was a little boy, and he was sexually abused in boarding school, he could not say anything, he completely shut down. So he's lived for 60 some years now, with this anger as his first go to. So he recognized the 72 wasn't serving him and he came. And we talked about it. And he was able to go back to be that little boy again, to give that little boy a voice and say, Stop. This isn't right. And a little more to that. So he was able to be the little boy and stop it. release that anger that had been in there all those years. Now is no longer a clue.

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's powerful, no

Joni Marra:

longer a client for good reason,

Jennifer Malcolm:

right? No good reasons. And how powerful and in my heart aches to say that to deal with that type of emotional trigger. 60 some years. Yeah, being cognizant, but open at 72 years old to embrace change. And it's that trust transition that you opened up with trusting you trusting the process, trusting the healing, and being willing to go into a trance, transition state. But the power of the work to identify as a young child, stop, this is not right, use your voice. And there's no shame in in not using your voice as a kid being sexually abused. It's the podcast I recorded last week was on sexual abuse and of a child and, and shame confusion. I don't even know what sex was. I didn't I had never had the birds and bees talk. So all this is new. And, and being reinforced. If you're you'll be good, you know, you're a good girl. If you keep her mouth quiet, you're a good girl. Because you're helping me, you're a good girl. So positive reinforcement that an abuser gave. But thank you for sharing that because when you use the male, but to just for you're never too old to go back and heal. You're never too old to go back and release these emotions that aren't serving you.

Joni Marra:

And now he has anger in him but in a proper balance. And he has shame and guilt at him but a proper balance and that's all we want.

Jennifer Malcolm:

Exactly. So when I did and I'll share a little bit about my when I did a session with you. I do remember being fully, I shouldn't say fully. I do remember the entire thing. So I know that some of it is like Well, whatever. Remember the therapy session? Again, talking about hypnosis and what someone is telling you to do. versus your guide hypnotherapy. That is,

Joni Marra:

I'm sorry, pulling from you,

Jennifer Malcolm:

pulling from you drawing it out of you and guiding you. was my experience typical. Do people typically remember their entire interaction with you? Is there a place where they may not remember all of it? Or is it just vary.

Joni Marra:

with all due respect, I won't speak to yours sharp what I will do is I will just talk about the playing field. Oh, sure. Absolutely. People experiences. Yes, you will remember it is not that you are completely out in asleep. It is not that you are wide awake. It's just a very relaxed state. And you will remember, and chances are you you will release. So a lot of times we're in a trance, and we don't know it. There's one statistic that we're in a trance 90% of the day. Sometimes you drive somewhere and you don't know how you got there, right? That's a trance, the body just takes over the subconscious just takes over. And while I'm talking about statistics, I did want to share one about breath therapy. 70% of the toxins in your body are released through your breath every day. Only 30% of the toxins in your body, every day are released through urination, perspiration, and dedication. So you think about what you do every day. That's only 30% 70% is with the breath. So you get that breath into your belly. And you breathe that out.

Jennifer Malcolm:

Wow. So every so the person will be aware, as I was, it was almost four and and I'm allowed, I'm allowed to share my own experience, right?

Joni Marra:

You didn't share whatever you say word about it. That's

Jennifer Malcolm:

no, that's fair, fair. And so for me, I do remember it was like almost a sleepy state. Very, very warm, comforting, loving environment. I remember responding to I remember a lot of I remember our conversation. And it was almost like that Twilight sleep where you're you still are responding. But you're really relaxed, and you're very open. And that was that was my valuable experience share in that regard. That was my experience. And it's powerful. It's just, it's powerful. I had an opportunity to meet with another woman, I did not do a session with her. But I just happened to cross paths with her a few weeks ago. And she's in similar work. And it was intriguing, because it was it's not about some you changing me. It's about you pulling out. And that was her story too. I was pulling out things that don't serve. But my willing I it's my willingness to also participate.

Joni Marra:

Oh, sure, you have a choice. You can keep all this stuff in, you can heal and move on.

Jennifer Malcolm:

Right. And that was her take is I could do a hypnotherapy with someone who says they want to quit smoking. But if they really don't want to quit smoking, my session isn't going to magically do a magic one and make it go away. So there has to be an activation of the will the soul the spirit to go along the journey with you as well. Right? That's awesome. How do you help? Is there a certain type and it's like you do all sorts of work. But in preparation, there was a question that came up about how do you support people who are going through the death process? And I think that you had some thoughts on that or some experience without again, you share what you're allowed to share or not a lot of share.

Joni Marra:

This is another trust myself and trust in transition. Be open and vulnerable and say yes and no. Sure. I feel called I'm keeping my practice but I feel called to have a slice of it. For the death experience. I've done hospice volunteer work for over 20 years. I'm an attorney, so I do the legal end of it. I don't actively practice. I am now working on a process to have classes to face the fear of death for others if they choose. And it's not so much the Elisabeth Kubler Ross with as the stages of death and dying, that can be part of it. But it's also what best serves you to face the fear of dying. And it's not so much like hospice patients, which Very close with and I get to, I get to watch them and be with them when they take their last breath on this earth. But it might be for some of us that are afraid to fly. And we realize we're not really afraid to fly, we're afraid to die. Not the fear of flying. It's the fear of death. So let's face death, and let's talk about that fear. Do you want to write your own obituary? Do you want to know what a funeral home is? Like? Do you want to do the legal end of it that you need to do your advanced directives? Do you want to lay in a casket? Do you want What do you want? Do you have your advanced directives done? Right? I will tailor a session and this is still in my ear, I feel called I'm trusting myself. Yeah. tailored to whatever best serves this dyeing process. Hearing is the last sentence. Before we die. Let's all know that let's make it public. So when we're with someone, if we choose, when they're dying, let's make sure we talk to them. So that's where I'm going with that. Take that fear away. And whatever your religious belief is, if there is one, let's, let's face that, what happens maybe you just go to ashes to ashes, dust to dust, maybe you take the hand of the Lord, maybe something else happens, I older whatever it is. But when you've got beard, let's face it,

Jennifer Malcolm:

I love That's powerful. Because, again, and I'm just singing praises about who Joni is, you will fully embrace whatever journey anyone is on, honor their journey on where they're at. And help guide them facilitate. Let's work on the things that don't serve you. So I love that you're you brought a little bit of religion into it. Because people may say, Well, does she have a religious belief? Do I have to be of a religious orientation? To do this process with you? Or? Or can I just be, I don't know what happens, or I do believe that I'm going to heaven? Or do you believe in reincarnation? Or do you believe in you know, afterlife? Or I do believe like, I'm just going to be eaten by worms. And that's the end of it.

Joni Marra:

But wouldn't you believe our honor, because it's yours. But for some reason about what is doesn't serve you and you want to get rid of it? Well, good, I'll work with you. I'll be your partner.

Jennifer Malcolm:

And you have such an adventurous spirit. And the other thing that I want to share some stories about Johnny that I was able to share with her so firewalking was one. And we also did a New Year's Day polar jump into Lake Erie. But so I want you to take a few minutes to talk about each of those two experiences, you know, because people are like, okay, walking on fire, that's impossible. And just talk about a little bit of the science and methodology behind that. And then the just the joy of jumping into Lake Erie on January 1.

Joni Marra:

Okay, well, we'll start with what I practice is, as a little girl, I didn't play a lot. As a little girl, I wasn't an adrenaline junkie, well as an adult as soon to be 60. That didn't serve me, right. So I needed to face What didn't serve me. And I wanted to be the adrenaline junkie. So I've jumped out of a plane I have, yes, walked on fire, it is between 11 and 1300 degrees, those coals in my head would say you can't do that. Your head might say you can't do that. But you know, with a proper training, you can face your fear and walk right across those coals. And then the opposite end of the fire was the water. Right? I'm not a big fan of water. But let me face that fear. So let's do it at high noon on January 1. And let's get on the lakes of the shores of Lake Erie, Erie. And let's go right in where the water is cold at 37 degrees with temperature outside is 27 degrees. Yeah, there's a lot of science behind it. But sometimes our worst enemies between our two years out of the head into the body, right. And so then I now trust myself more. And I try new stuff.

Jennifer Malcolm:

It's powerful, because I think was 2011 when I did the firewalk. And I would I mean I was scared like I was petrified. And I knew that I had to see some people do it first and make sure that they got to the other side and they were safe and and when you do it, it is minor matter and it's just trusting that the people facilitating you know are good and wise and keeping best interest in mind. And the same with when we jumped into Lake Erie it was I did 52 things I've never done going into my 14th year for my birthday. And I was like alright, I've never done one and that was the very first January 1 going into my 14th year and you were there and I just jumped in. And I remember, I think your arms were just raised when you came out, you were like glorious. And I was like, Where's my blanket and my hoodie and my jacket and but just just prior proud to do new things. And my husband Chad is he loves adventure. And his story is, you know, if you're going to die with something, let's have something exciting and live, live a legacy. That is, he's not an agenda. Maybe he's an adrenaline junkie. But when we went to Alaska, you know, I'm like, we want to see bears. And he, you know, he's like, wouldn't be awesome if I got mauled by a bear. And that's how I went out. And I was like, That's horrible. And he goes, Yeah, but that's a great story. Versus I sat on my couch watching TV, and I, you know, had a heart attack. And that was my, that was the end of my life. And so it's just perspective and fear how much fear holds us back from experiencing things? And having joy in in uncovering things that we may never have tried before.

Joni Marra:

Exactly.

Jennifer Malcolm:

It's beautiful. It's beautiful. Has your practice been affected through COVID? Are you doing more work? less work? Because people maybe have the gift of time now? And some intentionality? Or How's that? How's your work been impacted throughCOVID?

Joni Marra:

Oh, thank you for asking. Um, I did not see clients face to face. In mid March through I think it was the beginning of June. If I had any existing clients, and they wanted phone or zoom, we would do that. But we did. I did, I did no charges at that point. All we did was we stayed in connection if they needed to, to stay in connection, we would do breathing over the phone. It wasn't fair to have a new client that way, because he or she would not get the experience of what breath therapy is I could never do clinical hypnotherapy over the phone. It's just not. So I start to see clients have been June and I am seeing some new clients now that for some reason, after the pandemic, they are during the 10 panic, they're ready to go deep. They're ready to start purging. And they may have heard about me before, because it's mostly through word of mouth. But they're ready to take that step and trust themselves. So I'm busy and very blessed.

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's good. Now you were the first that I knew that Cleveland Clinic actually, you know, helps train. How long is that training process? Is there a lot of people throughout Northeast Ohio that, you know, have the certifications that you do? Or is it you know, just a small circle that that has had that work with through Cleveland Clinic.

Joni Marra:

It's the wellness institute that we're taught it at the Cleveland Clinic. Mostly, a lot of that, from what I understand a lot of therapists in the area, if they've gone to that training, they added as one more thing that they do. Cleveland Clinic integrative medicine does have sessions. So you can go there and do clinical hypnotherapy or receive clinical hypnotherapy. As for how many are in the area, I'm not real sure, my practice is small. And I like to keep it that way. Because I will not see more than three clients a day, because I want to make sure that that third client gets just as much as the first client, if I'm there I am with you, I am participating. So as to how many clinicians are in the area, I think that would have to be a search to check. If somebody is interested, they can if they want to the Cleveland Clinic behind them, they can go to the Cleveland Clinic and receive it within her office.

Jennifer Malcolm:

So that's interesting, because you said a lot of maybe therapists go in and get that as one spokes in the wheel of all the all the different types of therapy that they do where this is your really folk focus of how to heal, how do you put up your shield or your wall because you're hearing a lot of heart stories, you know, and how how do you protect your heart, your soul, your mind over yourself, you know, a physical doctor, you know, has to take precautions with care, you know, care for patients. But when you're working with trauma triggers, or things that didn't serve us how do you put up that either emotional shield or something to protect yourself as well.

Joni Marra:

Um, I had to learn and I know that every cell of my body, I need to be on my game with my client. So if I take the last client's information in and it starts to affect me, I'm not on for you. So I know that I have done the best that I can for every client. And when they walk over the threshold out of my office, that that is theirs. I keep all of my clients in prayer. They have access to me if they want to me but it does not penetrate Mi does not penetrate my heart mind got none of that. It's beautiful.

Jennifer Malcolm:

Because, and again, maybe that's something that I need to work and grow on. And I always use excuse like, I'm such a compassionate person. I'm a high feeler so on a, you know, an idea, your Myers brigg, I'm a high feeler, I feel everything. And I am an intuitive, I, I pick up emotions, I pick up what's not being said, I pick up energy pretty easily. And I think I would really struggle. And maybe that's why you do the work that you do, and I'm doing the work that I do, but I would really struggle with, with capturing in a therapy session, you know, those trauma issues, without weeping without, like crying alongside you and or them. And that's an honoring piece of who you are. And I think it's important for the audience here. Like, you're you're able to hold that space and really facilitate healing.

Joni Marra:

They need to know that someone has their back. Absolutely. They need to know that they've opened their self up in sacred space, and I've got their back. I'm with them. But I'm not going right there. And I'm not letting their stuff penetrate my body. That's again, I get depleted, or you get depleted or anyone gets depleted, you can't give away what you don't have, right. So let's not deplete ourselves.

Jennifer Malcolm:

No, and that's, that's beautiful, because I think it's essential when you go to the door, you said, You know, I let that drop off. And, and, and able then to continue the beautiful work that you're doing. And, and that allow that and and for me, I would want and this is why I've done my work some work with you is I do need to know that someone has my back. And it's almost like that lifeline of when you're climbing, you know, the side of rappelling or climbing up the side of a mountain. And I need to know that that line is going to be there. And if I slip or I fall or my feet aren't secure, the journey has me and I'm safe. I'm safe. That's great. So do you want to? Well, I want to ask, are there what do you do to fill your tank? So Joni is giving she's on her healing work and journey you've done work. You are an adrenaline junkie. But what do you do to fill your tank? Do you do yoga? Do you read meditate, jump off, like jump out of airplanes to do that,

Joni Marra:

yes, the adrenaline junkie still says days in me. I love to cook. And I love to be I love to be with my husband 35 years next week. And the cooking in the baking and the entertaining that we do at the house. We feed people we have hospitality. That's one of our terrorism's. We're so blessed with. So feeding, cooking. Yes, the adrenaline. I do appreciate my quiet time. But I'm one as the Myers Briggs, as you mentioned, I'm the extroverts I get my energy from being with others, just being in the presence of others. And I don't care if we are walking, I don't care if we're talking, but being with the other. It's a give and take.

Jennifer Malcolm:

How did you respond? it with COVID. And I know that, you know, some as some of the regulations and things kind of started going away, early summer, and then some it's kind of swung back. How are you doing personally with? I'm a high extrovert, I get energized with being around people. I get depleted when I'm stagnant. And you know, housebound without stimulation. How did you do during this time?

Joni Marra:

I had my tough days. There were a couple of days that I thought you know what, let me just get COVID and get it over with now let me go lick the floor at some store. And I'm like, Okay, wait, what are you thinking about? What are you feeling? And so I came in, I used my tool. And my tool was I was just angry about what was going on, the anger was out of balance. So one of the tools that I use is I do a primal scream. And a primal scream is in a safe place. And you feel that you're aware of where the anger is in your body, and you let it out through the screen. That's one of the tools that I teach, you want to do it in your car in your home when no other animals are around. But I use my own tools. I do my own stuff, right. And frankly, I was really angry that I couldn't do anything in life wasn't normal, right? recognize it and do it.

Jennifer Malcolm:

That's powerful. And I know he talked about this on an earlier podcast, but I know that I through through the years, anger tends to be a first response. And so I used to slam doors or cabinet doors. I wanted to make sure that people knew mom wasn't happy. You know, like mom's not happy. No one's gonna be happy. And that has healed healed through the years. But for Christmas, I asked my husband Chad to get me a punching bag. And so what I wanted was something that was safe, healthy, a great positive outlet to move energy. If I'm mad, it's very appropriate for me to go put down, put on my boxing gloves and go, you know, hit this bag and let out the anger let out the frustration versus keeping it a either in my body and ignoring it or be having it come out sideways through slamming doors, etc.

Joni Marra:

So because it's going to come out one way or another. So the idea is to use a tool, like do a hit down tool, something like yours to, but to use a tool to be ahead of the curve and get that anger out. Because if not, you're going to be spewing venom, when you don't mean to, or it's going to stay in and raise your blood pressure come out as eggs and the body is going to get rid of it somehow. Let's be ahead of the curve and get it out.

Jennifer Malcolm:

It's great because my daughter, both my daughters said the same thing. Let me go let's go to a restaurant, I'm gonna lick the counter, literally, I'm gonna lick the counter, I'm going to get it let me fight it and go on out. Like that's not the healthy manner. But the same thing of you know, the things that they missed out on. My daughter missed out on her senior year of high school she missed out on you know, having a real prom she had a beautiful backyard prom. But she missed out on real prom, she missed out on a real graduation, she missed out on all the celebrations that you work for your senior year of high school. And then it was coming to her move to the University of Findlay. And that was you know, getting to the point of is that even going to be viable is that going to be doable and when COVID started threatening that element of her life as a 17 year old, that's when she was really angry. The other stuff she could tell she was frustrated with but she really was either resilient or kept it in stuff that in but when college and and moving on to the next season or life was potentially she was triggered and and I was honoring her journey, like your feelings are healthy, your feelings are normal. And to move them out of your body. In you know frustration, go hit the punching bag, tears, talking through what you're feeling instead of keeping it pent up is really important.

Joni Marra:

Especially as women, we have a cork sometimes in our throat, and we just take it in and take it in and take it in. We don't speak our truth, right. But speaking your truth can be very, very helpful. And I encourage it, I want to make sure that if you're punching a punching bag that you first go into find out what is the emotion, be aware of it, you said it's anger, where is it in my body, and then breathe in and surround it with your breath, and then do your punching because it has to be mindful, because the body will know what to do because you said you were slamming doors are slamming cabinets, the body knows what to do is trying to get something out. But let's help it and let's be very mindful of it. And then we move it out.

Jennifer Malcolm:

So how do you how do you find it in your body so that you've said that phrase a few times on this podcast? Find it in your body? So describe to the audience what that actually means.

Joni Marra:

Sure. You inhale, you get from the neck down. And you find out what is going in your body? What's going on in there. What is it feeling what's going on in the body? That just doesn't feel right. Pay attention, become aware, and it might take you a little bit of time to become aware. But just sit quietly. Eyes closed measure driving, and as you find out what's going on in the body. And then where is it and it's going to be guilt fear, shame or anger. Or sometimes I'll ask clients How big is it watermelon? Great. cantaloupe, what color is it? Is it the surface of the moon? Or is it the surface of a bowling ball? Is it hard? Is it soft? Let's give it substance because it's in their body? It needs to come up. And it's amazing. Practice.

Jennifer Malcolm:

Yeah, because as you ask those questions, I'm sure people instantaneously respond. It's you know, it's orange, it's a size of a melon, it's you know, it's you know, soft, it's whatever, I'm sure your body responds when again you keep I didn't know I wish there was a video on this one, because Johnny keeps going from her neck down and and putting her her hands you know, right below her chin. And really just because we're so in our head and we we navigate bury our head. And our body is telling us so much if we listen to it, and take the time to be open to do to hear it.

Joni Marra:

Well. Even when someone says I have a lump in my throat you're really because you don't speak you have a lump in your throat or I have a back pain like pain in the back stabbed in the back. A lot of times when we are betrayed in life, we do have back problems. So all these little phrases actually mean something.

Jennifer Malcolm:

Why do you think that women have that cork? So give a little bit of thought. Joni's wisdom of because that's very good visual, you know, w have a cork in our throat hat bottles up and we take it we take it we stuff it down, b t why do you think that is?

Joni Marra:

A lot of times The mom will be there. And she realizes that she just has to survive, to get through the day to get through this, to get through that to wear all the different hats. And this is not just about females, but you asked about the female end of it, and I do see a lot more female. So we take it in, we take it in, we take it in, because we believe rather than speaking our truth, it's better to just get through. And that's not really living our life. And it's not teaching others not witnessing to others how to live their life. But we take it in, because we'll deal with it later. Or we don't have time now. Or we have dual careers or career and a mom. And we're trying to do too much. And to do one more thing, rather than take it in is a to do list. So we'll just shove it down. And believe me, it's going to come up at some time. So my goal is for my clients, and I actually show them to put your own oxygen mask on first, we're wearing a heck of a lot of masks right now. Put your own oxygen mask on first. Because again, what I said earlier, you can't give away what you don't have. Right? It's not deplete you, right.

Jennifer Malcolm:

And it's beautiful, because the cadence and the rhythm of the podcasts that are being released and have been recorded and to be released. There's these dramatic pieces of oxygen mask on first self care if you're not if you're not in a good space, the breath and and the whole foundation of the podcast is his voice and encourage and and releasing what's been stuffed down, that we say we don't have time for we hide because of shame. We hide because of fear. We hide because of guilt and those emotions that you were talking about. But the essence of this podcast is that every woman as they hear your story as they hear the power of the work that you do, as they hear, you know, might might testimonial of the work that you've done with me and and will also give some information of how to contact Joni, but the power of r leasing courage and voice in t uth and if I when I see it m deled, and you've been wanting t model that in my life, when I s e it modeled, it gives me c urage, it bolsters it gives me h pe to say my voice does m tter, my truth does matter. My s ory does matter. And even if i's letting it out to heal m self, first getting that o ygen mask on, and getting all t at into my body, the goodness t then be able to go out and g ve it to others, which is the p rpose now is I've been on a h aling journey and I'm not h lding I'm not healed, and I'm c ntinuing to the more I heal, t e more I feel like I need to h al it which you You said that l ke you want to go deeper, like A right, let's, let's get more o this junk out of my body to b in that place of of power a d, and goodness and more over t gifted to other women. It's b autiful. It's absolutely b autiful. So any closing r marks before we go into the l st portion of this array? W're going to the this portion a d then we'll do a closing r marks.

Joni Marra:

It's up to you. I there is one sentence that someone's a question that someone said I think is great. And that's probably another reason why we shut everything down. But if I asked you to name all the people and things you love, how far down on the list would you be? So until we truly love ourselves unconditionally, we're not going to put the oxygen mask on, we're going to keep the core kit. Wow, once we believe that we're worth it. That's the way we live.

Jennifer Malcolm:

I love it. That's powerful. So we did ask Johnny and if you're driving your car listening this podcast, please pull over or hit pause and finish this podcast when you when you're in a safe space. But we did ask that Joni will take a few minutes to just take us i to a little bit of meditation a d breath. And I'm not going to d scribe it. I'm just going to a low her to facilitate it. So J ni, you're on.

Joni Marra:

Okay, thank you.

Jennifer Malcolm:

You're welcome.

Joni Marra:

I'd like for you to sit and just be eyes closed if it feels right. If not have a soft gaze. Inhale, is if you're inhaling from the crown of your head. Take that breath through the entire body and exhale through your mouth. As if you're exhaling through the soles of your feet in your feet have roots deep into Mother Earth. The next breath, breathe in to pull this one through your feet through the body and exhale through the crown of your head into the divine. Whatever you define that as We keep and we release, whatever we choose. When we release, the idea is to reclaim. We were born with everything we need. But life experiences, people, comments, but a lot of toxins in our body and we allow them to stay there. So for the next 45 seconds, you have a choice to release something and reclaim something else. It's what I'd like for you to do is imagine breathing into your heart, your heart has four chambers into that first chamber. Inhale, what you need more of that of love, peace, happiness. And exhale. In this moment, what is not serving you? forgiveness, fear, sadness, feel shame. Go to the second Chamber of your heart. Again, inhale what you need more of in this moment. Exhale, what you don't want anymore, even if it's just a little bit of a third chamber. Again, inhale what you need more. Exhale, what doesn't serve you. And then to the last and fourth chamber, inhale right into your heart, what you need. Exhale, which you don't. But now imagine your heart, filling with that life giving oxygen feeding to every cell in your body through the blood, giving you the love the peace, the happiness, the joy, whatever you chose. fulfilling what you need. Breathe on your own a couple breaths. Once again, a big breath in in through your nose, inhale, when you don't think you can bring in any more, bring in just a little bit more and hold it. When you don't think you can hold it anymore. Hold it two more seconds. And then exhale out of your mouth. When you think you've squeezed all the air out of your lungs, squeeze out a little bit more. Then when it feels right, come back to the room, eyes open. My invitation to you is to put both arms out to your sides is if you're ready to fly. And this is good because it opens up your lungs to get a good breath in there. Get that good breath in. And then have you that inner child who holds all of your wounds enjoys. Thank you.

Jennifer Malcolm:

Thank you, Joni. That was powerful. So we will definitely put all of Joni's contact information how to reach her. And I just am honored to call you my friend. You have You have been such a joy in my life of experiences and healing and laughter and great wine and conversations. And I cannot wait to hang out with you and Jim again. So, thank you so much for your time today. And sending blessings and love.

Joni Marra:

Thank you. Go o something for you toda

Jennifer Malcolm:

I will thank you. So thank you for joining us on this podcast with Joni and we look forward to hearing and connecting with you next week as well. So don't forget that every woman has a story and every story matters and that means you to have a good day. Subscribe to the Jennasis Movement to empower women's voices and reclaim the power over your own narrative.