Salt Cell Problems? Here’s What’s REALLY Going On

Your saltwater pool can look perfect on the surface while the sanitizer quietly drops to zero, and when that happens most people blame the salt level. I go straight to the real weak link: the salt chlorine generator cell. After 35 years in the pool industry, I’ve seen the same failure patterns repeat, from undersized cells that can’t keep up in summer to perfectly sized systems that still lose the fight because the pump isn’t running long enough.

We unpack why salt cells are expensive (titanium plates coated with ruthenium or iridium), why “bigger cell = longer life” isn’t as guaranteed as it used to be, and why I still prefer a higher gallon-rated cell for practical chlorine production headroom. 

From there, it’s the stuff that actually trips up saltwater pool maintenance: cyanuric acid targets (including why many pros like about 80 ppm CYA for salt pools), phosphates and algae burning through chlorine, calcium scale blocking conductivity, and the cleaning mistakes that strip coatings and shorten cell life. We also cover cell lifespan (often about 10,000 hours), how to check remaining life, why a dying cell can throw false low-salt readings, and why adding more salt can create an even bigger problem. 

• why I still like an oversized salt cell for production headroom
• chlorine output benchmarks for common Pentair IC and Hayward T-Cell models
• how pump runtime and output percentage control real-world chlorine production
• why algae, cloudiness, phosphates, and low CYA can overwhelm a salt system
• why many pros target about 80 ppm cyanuric acid for saltwater pools
• calcium buildup on plates and how it blocks conductivity
• Hayward AquaRite 90-day inspect cell reminder and how it can mislead
• safe salt cell cleaning and how too much muriatic acid ruins coatings
• typical salt cell lifespan in hours and what that means in years
• signs a cell is dying including false low salt readings
• why adding salt does not fix a dying cell and can oversalt the pool
• white flake blowback vs mushy flakes and what to try for each
• coo

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Transcript

Welcome And Quick Focus

SPEAKER_00 1:02

Welcome to the Fool Game Podcast Show. In this episode, I'm going to talk to you about problems you may have with your salt miter generator, salt cell specifically. These are issues that develop with the cell, and this could be a cell that's going bad or a cell that's dead or a cell that has another kind of issue, and I'll go over some of the common issues with these salt cells. Are you a pool service pro looking to take your business to the next level? Join the pool guy coaching program. Get expert advice, business tips, exclusive content, and get direct support from me. I'm a 35-year veteran in the industry. Whether you're starting out or scaling up, I've got the tools to help you succeed. Learn more at swimmingpoollearning.com. The first thing you need to know about the saltwater cell is that it's made out of precious metals that are mined, and these are pretty expensive metals. The actual metal that's primarily used is titanium, and these are coated with either ruthenium or iridium. And both of these, of course, are pretty expensive. You can bet that the price of the salt cell has a built-in cost factor because of the ruthutum or the iridium coating that's on the titanium. So these aren't cheap to replace, and that's why it's important to keep them operational for as long as possible. Now I have always suggested to get a salt cell that's for a larger body of water than the actual pool that you have. So for example, if you had a 20,000 gallon pool, I would always suggest getting an you know a Penter IC40, which is for 40,000 gallon pool, or something similar to that. So you're actually going to have a very large cell based on the amount of water that's in your pool or oversized salt cell. But I got a lot of pushback from one of my group members that said, I do this and then the cell doesn't last as long as it's supposed to, and then I pay more money, my customer pays more money for a larger cell for the pool, and it just breaks down because they don't make them the way they used to. And so not only does he waste money on a larger cell or size cell for the amount of water, but the cell doesn't last that long anyway, so he's not getting the benefits of the larger cell. Now I still think you would want to get a higher gallon rated cell because it makes it easier to boost production when you need more chlorine in the pool. But the argument that it's going to last longer because you're running it less at a lower percentage, I guess it doesn't really hold a lot of weight anymore since the manufacturing of these things isn't as robust as things used to be. I mean, if you have a washer and dryer from the 90s compared to today, those lasted a lot longer than the washer and dryer of today. Same thing with a pool motor. If you're an old school guy like me that started in the early 90s, actually I started in 1988, but in the early 90s, you had all these pumps that just lasted forever. You know, the Purex pumps, the Duraglass, and the motors seem to just last pretty much for eternity on these things. Now, of course, the motors burn out within three or four years. If you're lucky, you get longer. With the variable speed pumps, of course, they last a lot longer. This goes to say that I don't think the salt cell production or the manufacturing has improved every year. It may have been the same or even has gotten a little worse. There's been a lot of defects in salt cells lately, with you know different things that have happened with manufacturers. So again, I'm gonna say it may not pay to get a larger cell to run it at a lower output to extend the life of it, but it may be worth it just to have an oversized cell so that if you need to increase production, you can do that very easily. If you had a 20,000 gallon pool and you had an IC20 on there, which is rated for 20,000 gallons, it would be hard to boost that production because you don't have any kind of margin. I wanted to get that out of the way because I didn't change my philosophy. I still think you should get a larger cell than your pool. Like, for instance, I have a Jandy TrueClear 33,000 gallon cell on my 15,000 gallon pool, and I'm perfectly content with it. If it even if it lasts just three or four years, like the size cell that I would normally get for the pool, but I can boost output really easily with the larger cell. And this, of course, leads into the first issue you have with your salt system, is that maybe the whole problem is that you have an undersized salt cell for the size of the body of water that you're trying to produce the chlorine for. And I'll give you an example of the production the production based on different cell sizes and how much chlorine it generates or can produce in 24 hours, running at of course the full speed of the pump, 3450 rpm, for a 24-hour period. I'll start with the penter cells and get an idea that if you had an IC15 or an iClore 15, that would produce about 0.60 pounds of chlorine a day. And that's rated for a 15,000 gallon pool, by the way. So that's about half a pound of chlorine a day. If you go up to the IC20, it's coming in at 0.90 pounds, which is just shy of a pound of chlorine. The IC40 is at 1.4 pounds of chlorine per day, running 24 hours a day, I should say, at full speed. And the IC60 is producing two pounds of chlorine a day. So based on that, you can get an idea of the cell size. For instance, the the Hayward uh TC3, the T cell 3 is for a 15,000 gallon pullant. Again, that's at 0.5 pounds a day. The T T cell 9 is at 0.98 pounds, the T cell 15, which is the most common T cell for the Hayward aquarite systems, that produces 1.45 pounds of chlorine per day. So you want to make sure you have the right size salt cell for your pool so that if you do need the extra production, which sometimes happens in the summertime, or if there's other factors in your pool in your area that would cause you to have to have more chlorine being produced, you need to have the cell that is capable of doing that. And you wouldn't want to run your pool 24-7 to get that production out. So you would want to have the larger cell to get more chlorine when you need it. And this is one problem I find with a lot of builds where they put an undersized salt cell in, and you have to upgrade that eventually. Now, the of course, the larger the cell, the more plates it has, the more metal that's in there, and the more expensive that's gonna be. So there is a tipping point to where you can go too big. Like for instance, I wouldn't get an IC60 for a 20,000 gallon pool that's just too big and the cell is too expensive in that regard. But the first problem is to make sure that the cell is big enough for the output for the pool. The second thing you're gonna run into is if you do have the right size salt cell, which a lot of people do have the right size salt cell, you have to run the pool long enough for it to produce that amount of chlorine. So if we go back to these numbers that I just read to you, I'll just pick up the hay words since I have it here in front of me. The T cell 15 is rated for 40,000 gallons and makes 1.45 pounds of chlorine a day. If you had a 20,000 gallon pool and you ran that pool four hours a day, I don't think you're gonna be able to produce enough chlorine in that 20,000 gallon pool with a four-hour runtime for that size pool. So you may have to run that pool eight hours a day and have the output set at 100%, or you can run the pool with a variable speed pump and have it set at 50% or 60%. Again, adjusting the percentage down is something that's helpful, then extending the life of the cell. But as you adjust that percentage down, the production also goes down. So remember that if you need more chlorine in the pool, you want to, of course, run the pump longer and then adjust that production time to 100% or close to that, so that it produces the chlorine that you need in the pool, and the pool has to be running long enough for that to happen. I'll add also to that that your cell system is producing chlorine for the pool, and the water in the pool is going to have the same kind of detrimental effect on the chlorine being produced as if you had a chlorine pool. What I'm saying here is that the pool is cloudy, if there's algae in the water, if there's anything that's using up the chlorine in a chlorine-type pool, for instance, the same thing's gonna happen in a saltwater pool as well. Just because it's producing chlorine continuously doesn't mean that that chlorine is go is not gonna be used up and destroyed. And the secondary factor would be the cyaneric acid level in the pool as well. Most people in the industry believe that you should keep a saltwater pool at 80 parts per million, and the reason behind this, and Bob Lowry explained it really well, is since the salt production is coming out of the return jets, maybe you have two return jets, that means that all that concentrated chlorine is coming out of the pool in a certain area of the pool. And if your cyaneric acid level is at 30 parts per million, or maybe 50 parts per million, in the peak of the summer when the sun's hitting the pool and the UV rays are at the highest, that chlorine coming out of the return line is not being protect protected well enough because it's such a high concentration, and therefore you need a higher cyaneric acid level to protect the chlorinated water coming out of the return lines into the pool at that point. And so 80 parts per million seems to be the sweet spot for salt water pools for that to happen. So if you're having problems with the pool not holding chlorine, you could have high phosphates, which is a factor in a chlorine pool, same in a salt pool. It'll destroy the chlorine level rapidly, cloudy water, algae in the pool, all these are factors that are working against the salt water generator producing chlorine at a sufficient level to sanitize the water and keep it clear. So remember the water factors as well as the cyaneric acid level also affects how much chlorine these salt cells are producing and how effective that chlorine is in a salt water pool. Another common problem with the salt water cell is that it starts to get calcium buildup on the plates. Now, the way of course this works is there's electricity that needs to be conducted in that cell. It's basically a miniature chlorine factor. So when you start to get the calcium buildup on the plates, the electricity won't arch properly, it won't conduct properly. And a lot of times your salt water generator will let you know when the salt cell is dirty and needs cleaning. A light will flash on there indicating the salt cell is dirty. Now, if you have a Hayward Aquarite system, and I mention this all the time because it has this weird 90-day factory kind of automatic your cell is dirty indicator. Inspect cell light will come on after three months, and you have to actually hold down the diagnostic button for three or four seconds to reset that. So every 90 days, those systems are going to say that the cell cell is dirty, even though it's not. So just be aware that the Alky Right has that built-in 90-day feature or three-month feature where you inspect the cell. The other systems typically will start flashing clean cell when there's calcium buildup and it's not getting enough conductivity, it's not producing enough chloride, it's not producing, you know, the calcium is interfering with the production, which means that the pool is not producing chlorine at that point. So a lot of times when you get to a salt water pool and there's no chlorine in there and the pool is running properly, everything looks fine. Sometimes the clean cell light isn't even indicating that's the problem. So I would clean the cell in that case, and a lot of a lot of times that will get the chlorine production back running again. But if the cell is dirty and there's an indicator, just know that it's not going to produce chlorine. And if it doesn't produce chlorine, of course, then there's no chlorine being put into the water. Whatever's in the water at that point is in a drop rapidly. So within a course of a week, if the salt cell is not functioning, that chlorine can go from eight parts per million down to zero. And then, of course, algae starts to form and other things go pretty bad in that pool. So cleaning the salt cell is really critical out there. And most pool pros now charge to clean the salt cell for a customer because it does take time and effort, and it's one of those things where if everyone's charging in the area, you might as well charge as well. It just depends on your area, but anywhere from$35 to$85 seems to be what people are charging for salt cell cleaning. I would say improper salt cell cleaning is another thing that happens out in the industry. So depending on the salt water system you have on your pool route, or if you're a homeowner, definitely check the manual and how much myriadic acid to water ratio you need to use to clean the salt cell without damaging the coating on the plates. I've seen salt cells that have been ruined by people using too much acid to clean them, myriadic acid to clean them, and it's one of those factors that can happen to the salt cell. So be very careful that you don't use too much acid, nor do you want to soak it in the acid water mixture for too long a period of time because that will actually take the coating off the cell plates. Another common problem with the salt water cell is that it starts to get old and die on you, which is a big problem and it gets really expensive, by the way, because I mentioned that it costs a lot of money for salt cell replacement because of the metal and the coating that's used in there. But the salt cells don't last forever. Most of them are rated for about 10,000 hours of use. Some are rated for 20,000, but the majority of the big manufactured cells are about 10,000 hours of use. That means that after 10,000 hours of producing chlorine and running in the pool, you're going to have to replace that salt cell. Unfortunately, what does that equate to? It just depends on your area and how long your season is. But I would say every three to five years, you're going to have to replace your salt cell. So kind of do the math on that when you're getting your system. How much will it cost me in three to five years to replace this salt cell? I believe the JD true clear cells seem to wear out faster, but they're less expensive. So there's kind of it's kind of a wash right there. But the salt cell does have a lifespan. You can check this on the cell. Some of them actually display the lifespan. Others have the ability to display the lifespan of the cell. Like if, for instance, if you have an IC40 cell, just hold the more button down for three seconds, and then the percentage will light up depending on how much life is left on that cell: 20, 40, 60, 80, 100, and whatever that percentage is, is the life of that salt cell. The aqua right cells are kind of tricky. There's a voltage indicator on the system itself, but sometimes you have to call Hayward and find out if your cell still has enough voltage. Of course, the pool store can test the cell for you. There's also bucket tests you can do to test the salt cell. You can find some of those videos on YouTube how to do that. But ultimately, the salt cell will eventually start to die. And certain cells will have different symptoms. I notice with the penta cells, a lot of times you're going to get a flashing clean cell indicator a lot when the cell's dying. The Hayward Ocarite systems are going to show low salt readings all the time, which means the salt cell is dying. And by the way, if you have a Hayward Ocarite system, don't keep adding salt to the pool because this is a problem you're also going to have. If the salt cell is dying, it's giving you a false salt level reading, low reading. When the salt in the pool may be perfectly fine, the level may be at 3,000 parts per million. And if you keep adding bags of salt, you're going to have that pool at 6,000 parts per million. And believe me, I've taken over many pools with the Hayward Aquarite systems where the salt level was at 6,000 parts per million because they kept adding salt to the water, thinking that's going to reactivate the cell or fix the problem. And when a cell starts to die, you can't do much for it at all. And I saved one of the biggest issues for last because it's one of those things where it's a problem, and a lot of pool guys notice this problem, and the solution sometimes is hard to grasp. But a lot of times these salt water systems will blow back these white flakes. Now, if they're white flakes and you pick them up and you can break them in your hand and they feel almost like calcium, it's probably because it's calcium flakes coming off the salt cell when it reverses. Also, there are these flakes that almost feel like dead skin. You know, they're they're kind of mushy, they're they're whitish in consistency, but when you get it out in your skimmer net or your your riptide vacuum bag or bottom feeder bag, it feels really mushy in your hands. And to me, I think that is more related, in my opinion, to phosphates in the water. And a good treatment for that, and this is not scientific, but I've done this before, where I just start putting the maintenance those of the phosphate remover in the pool, and that seems to really help the salt cell in that situation. Seems to be a problem with pentare cells, especially the kind of you know mushy flake-like, not really hard white flakes, but a more of a mushy consistency, and I believe that is related to that orthophosphate in the water. You can also run the pool with a cool-off time to kind of help with that. So, what happens is that salt cell is really hot, and what you can do to reduce some of this blowback, the flakes and everything, is to actually run the salt system on a medium or high speed first, and then kick it into a low speed of 1400 RPMs for like an hour or so. And this that way the salt cell cools off, and you're not going to have a lot of that blowback back into the pool. It'd be nice to have some kind of filter after the salt cell to capture all this stuff because it's a big problem in a lot of areas with these flakes that come back into the pool, so much so that sometimes you have to turn the salt system off entirely until these flakes disappear. And then when you fire it back up, these flakes reappear in the pool, and it's pretty annoying. But I've had some success with phosphoryl removers. You may want to try the REN the SC1000 as well. This helps with the scale on the cells, and this will also reduce some of that white flaking. And again, it's one of those things where it's an irritant for saltwater pools to have this kind of gunk in there from the salt system, these flakes that are in the water, and you can really see it sometimes. Customer, I remember a customer was swimming in their pool at nighttime, they had their pool light on, and they they saw like all this stuff in the pool, like these flaky materials, and they're like, What is all this stuff? And I told them it's just the byproduct from the salt cell, either reversing, kicking the calcium out, or it could be phosphates being elevated in the pool, and then I would try to treat it. But a lot of times these flakes are just unstoppable, and you're gonna just have to deal with the fact that these flakes are produced by the salt water production, they get shot out the return lines, and you have to deal with the situation during the summertime. And there's really no hard and fast answer to get rid of them. If you're looking for other podcasts, you can find those by going to my website, swingingprolearning.com. On the banner, click on the podcast icon. There'll be a drop down menu of 1900 podcasts there for you as well. If you're looking for my coaching program, you can learn more at PoolGuyCoaching.com. Thanks for listening to this podcast. Have a great rest of your week and God bless.