Everybody Pulls The Tarp

Eric LeGrand: Perseverance

March 03, 2021 Andrew Moses / Eric LeGrand
Everybody Pulls The Tarp
Eric LeGrand: Perseverance
Show Notes Transcript

In 2010, Rutgers football star Eric LeGrand became paralyzed from the neck down after fracturing his C3 and C4 vertebrae while making a tackle. At the time, doctors told Eric he’d never be able to walk again, eat solid foods, or breathe without a ventilator. 

In 2012, Eric won the ‘Jimmy V Award for Perseverance’ at the ESPY’s.

In this conversation, Eric shares with Andrew important lessons on maintaining a positive attitude amidst adversity, turning tragedy into hope, and how to achieve big goals even as the odds are stacked against you. His positive spirit is truly inspiring. 

A few show highlights:

3:03 - Eric talks about the “lowest point” following the injury

6:06 - Role nurses played in Eric’s recovery

8:22 - Not taking things for granted

12:06 - Maintaining perspective amidst challenges

16:30 - Eric’s relationship with the player he collided with

25:16 - Obstacles are opportunities

27:10 - Advice for setting and achieving goals

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Andrew Moses (00:01):

You're listening to Everybody Pulls The Tarp, the go-to podcast for high-performers. I'm Andrew Moses. Each week you'll hear my thought provoking conversations with Olympians, pro athletes, CEOs, elite coaches, bestselling authors, and other high-performers to uncover their secrets to success. Get ready to be inspired each week when we talk about leadership, teamwork, work ethic and more. Are you ready? Let's go.

Andrew Moses (00:38):

Hi everyone. Welcome to Everybody Pulls The Tarp. We have a very, very special guest today. Former football star, motivational speaker, philanthropist, entrepreneur, and one of the most inspirational people that you will find on the face of the earth, Eric Legrand. Welcome to Everybody Pulls The Tarp, Eric.

Eric LeGrand (00:55):

Hi, thank you for having me on. I appreciate it.

Andrew Moses (00:58):

Eric, so many of the listeners know your story and have followed you. But for those that haven't, let's set this up a little bit. Just over 10 years ago, you're playing football at Rutgers University. You're one of the best players on the team, a star player. And you go to do something that you've done thousands of times in your life at this point. You go to make a tackle. You sustain a very, very serious spinal cord injury that leaves you paralyzed from the neck down. Take me back to that moment. What is going through your mind at that moment?

Eric LeGrand (01:32):

When you make a tackle, like you said, a thousand times as I've done it in my career. You think it's just very routine. I had it planned out that, everyone knows if you play football, you have to see what you hit. You keep your head up. But I didn't think I was going to tackle the guy with my head. So I put it down thinking my shoulder was going to tackle him. One of my teammates got down there a little bit before I did, and he tripped a guy up. So the trajectory changed and the crown of my head went into the back of his shoulder blade. And next thing you know, you're laying there motionless. You can't move, you can't breathe here. The trainers are asking you all these questions, and you're trying to tell them that I can't breathe...I can't breathe. My head coach comes out and tells you have to pray right now. And honestly, when he said that to me, I thought my life was over.

Andrew Moses (02:20):

How long after the injury do the doctors tell you just how bad the prognosis is?

Eric LeGrand (02:25):

Well, they told my mom that night after they got me to the hospital. They brought my mom into the room, as well as my teammate and his mother. And they said, your son has fractured his C3-C4 vertebrae. He'll be paralyzed from the neck down for the rest of his life. He'll never walk again. He'll never eat solid foods. He'll never breathe on his own. And we're hoping that he's strong enough to make it through the surgery. That's what they told my mom the night of. One doctor was very blunt with her and he left after that. And my teammate went down the hallway, storming down the hallway, cursing, screaming. His mom went to console him. And then the other doctor stayed with my mom and tried to give her all these different percentages of what could happen.

Andrew Moses (03:05):

Take me through the first few weeks after the injury. Was there, besides that moment, when you and your mom understand the prognosis--Was there a moment that was particularly a low point that as you think back just over 10 years ago, stands out for you those first few weeks?

Eric LeGrand (03:21):

The lowest point I had those first few weeks, I call them the terrors of the night. You know, the outcry of support that came in for me, it was just amazing. So many people reaching out, coming to visit me, wanting to just be there with me, but at night, because everyone went home--my mom, my family was staying in the hotel. My head coach, Greg Schiano, would stay with me until about 2:00am in the morning. Then he would leave to go get some sleep, but from 2:00 AM until 7:00 AM were some of the scariest moments of my life. Being by myself, I could not sleep. All the thoughts,go through your head of what happened, what my life is going to be like. And the only thing that really helped me is finally having a conversation with the nurses that were taking care of me and just not being treated as a regular patient. I wanted to know more about them. I wanted to have a friendship with them, and I tried my best to do that. And they were so open to me.

Andrew Moses (04:18):

Talk about that for a little bit Eric. This show, as you and I have talked about, is called Everybody, Pulls The Tarp. It's based upon a philosophy I have that great teams, great organizations are powered by individuals who contribute in unexpected ways. You mentioned the nurses there and some of the other staff at the hospital that you wanted to build friendships with, a real relationship. Talk about the role that they played in terms of going above and beyond to help you through those challenging times.

Eric LeGrand (04:46):

It was huge. You know why? Because I was so stuck in my bubble as being a college athlete. You know, you're going through your class, you have your classes, you have practice, weight room session, study hall. There is really no outside world. All I really knew was Rutgers campus in New Brunswick and Piscataway. I didn't know what was going on in the world. Once this happens to you, all of a sudden, you're in a real life situation. And you're kind of like who are all these people that are taking care of you telling you this, telling you that? And the only way that I knew how to overcome those fears was actually talking to the people. So they weren't talking to me just like a regular patient, those regular checkups and what they had to do. And those nurses, they were fantastic. They understood the situation that I was in. Some of them would pull their carts in the room and just chart with me just to be in the room with me. So I wasn't by myself. I started asking them more about their life, how they became a nurse and why. And after that, it just, I don't know why, but some sort of comfort and ease comes throughout your body where, you know, I'm comfortable with these people. They're here to help me.

Andrew Moses (05:53):

As somebody who grew up playing competitive sports the relationships you build with the nurses did that essentially become like your new team, those were the people you're going to battle with--that was your locker room?

Eric LeGrand (06:06):

Oh, they definitely became my team. It was my day nurses and my night nurses, the physical therapist team that came, the aides that were taking care of me. We all definitely developed a special relationship. And I know, you know, as a doctor, and an aide, and the nurses they kind of teach you don't get too close to your patients and what not because you have to move on and they just, you know, shuffle over and it messes with their mentality. But we definitely all got pretty close. And like I said, they were my team. I trusted them. My life was literally in their hands. And it allow me to have that comfort while I was with them for those first three and a half weeks in the hospital.

Andrew Moses (06:41):

So one of the topics, Eric, that's been prevalent in America the last 12 months or so with the pandemic has been ventilators. And how many Americans are on ventilators fighting for their life. You spent some time on a ventilator. How long were you on the ventilator and what went into the decision process to start to transition off?

Eric LeGrand (07:03):

Yeah, I don't know if you can see it, but the scar is right there for you, Andrew. I was on it for about five weeks, five and a half weeks. The whole thing it was the most uncomfortable feeling. It's like, something's literally in your throat, you know, it's breathing for you. And then trying to change out the drainage. Let's just say it's not a pleasant feeling or it doesn't look pleasant as well, but I know one night when I was at Kessler Institute in West Orange, New Jersey, where I went for inpatient rehabilitation and then eventually outpatient, I was laying in my bed and I could not sleep because of the noise the ventilator was making just imagine. I'm laying in bed andI'm like to my respiratory therapist, can you please take me off the ventilator for a minute?

Eric LeGrand (07:53):

I just need to not hear that sound and fall asleep. They are like Eric if we take you off, you might last one minute. I said, fine, give me that one minute to try to fall asleep. They took me off an hour and a half went by and I was still breathing on my own. Let me tell you it felt like I just ran the New York City Marathon. I felt like I was huffing and puffing, but I was breathing on my own. And then they started saying, oh, maybe you are ready to wean off of this. And about a week and a half later, I was fully breathing on my own again,

Andrew Moses (08:22):

As you're going through this and you're having moments like that do all of the sudden things that maybe you took for granted throughout your life--do these things seem like the most glorious experiences on the face of the earth? One minute without the ventilator. Things of that nature.

Eric LeGrand (08:38):

They can became my gameday victories. After something, you know, the doctors told me I wouldn't do this and I wouldn't do that. Then I started proving them wrong, you know, a month into my injury. Those were my gameday victories. And it's funny because I use the example of when I was in physical therapy I go from this big, you know, division one athlete benching 415 pounds to now doing breathing exercises where they're literally taping a balloon to my chest and I have to go [breathing sound] and hold, inhale, exhale, and hold the balloon off of my chest for like five seconds of that inhale and then do it again. It was just such a crazy transition, but it was just something that I had to do, but it made me have a newfound appreciation on life and things that you can do.

Andrew Moses (09:22):

So you mentioned the phrase there "gameday victories." Those little moments became your gameday victories. Did those moments propel you through the difficult times?

Eric LeGrand (09:35):

Propel me? I don't even know if that's the word to explain it. It was yes, yes and more. Cause you start to--you come off the ventilator, they tell you you're never going to eat solid foods. Again, I got hurt October 16th and that Thanksgiving I had a full solid meal with my family. They tell you you're never going to move, you'll never get full range of motion back in your neck. That starts to come. That February at a Super Bowl I had up at Kessler I started to slightly move my shoulders a little bit at the time. And then now you see me, I'm shimmy shaking and moving around. So that kind of stuff. You're like, wow, things are coming back to me slowly but surely, but this is my new life. But these are my victories now. These are what I worked so hard for, and here I am.

Andrew Moses (10:17):

So when the doctors tell you that you're never going to do any of these things again and within weeks your--well actually let's take a step back. So when the doctors tell you that you're never going to do certain things again, what's your mindset, because you said you had a lot of conviction that you were going to do some of these things again and you are going to do that and even to this day, you still say, it's not a matter of if I'm going to walk again, it's a matter of when I'm going to walk again. What gave you that confidence and that conviction when the doctors would tell you things to say, no, that's not going to be me?

Eric LeGrand (10:50):

Yeah. You know, after they told my mom the bad news my mom asked me about the conversation--do you want to know what happened? It was about a week into my injury and she explained to me everything, what they had told her and right away in my mind, I was like, no way. I have too much faith. I'm too stubborn, too determined. Everything that I learned as an athlete for the past 15 years, as a football player, baseball, basketball player, I'm going to use that because there's so many times in my life where people tell you, you can't do this, or you can't do that. Or that's not possible. There's like a flip switch. And it's like, tell me what to do. And I'm going to control what I can control and everything else I'll leave in God's hands. And I'm going to outwork anybody that comes in my way. And that's the kind of mentality that I took going into my therapy, doing whatever I can do. It wasn't easy. That wasn't fun. But I had been doing that my whole life. Football practice isn't easy. Weight room sessions aren't always fun, but I felt like I was built for this physically and mentally.

Andrew Moses (11:48):

How did you overcome those moments where you felt more resistance mentally, maybe than you did normally, right? There had to have been times when it was more challenging mentally to get through what you needed than others. How did you get through that?

Eric LeGrand (12:06):

Andrew, if you would have been in my situation where now that I went from, you know, playing football, to being in the inpatient rehab with hundreds of other people that are in a similar situation as I'm in. Sometimes you look at your situation and you start feeling bad for yourself, but then you realize the guy next door to you has nobody coming to see him, the guy down the hall passes away, a girls' family stops coming to see her--her boyfriend or husband break up or divorce her. And then you see all the people that are coming to see me, visit me, wish me, well. It made you get into a mode where you're like, what do I have to complain about? Yes. My situation may suck, but look, what's going on around me. I don't have the right to complain. And that's how I got through it.

Andrew Moses (12:52):

It's such an important perspective to have for anyone, right? The last 12 months for everybody have been different than we've ever experienced. I had a COVID positive test myself. My grandfather in New Jersey passed away from COVID. And the thing that I have always said to myself, no matter what challenge I'm going through, or what challenge anyone is going through--there's always someone who's going through something more challenging. There's always someone who's staring more adversity in the face and coming through it. And to hear you describe that there is inspirational to me and I'm sure to everyone listening. I mentioned COVID there again. I'm curious, how has the COVID-19 situation impacted your rehabilitation and therapy processes?

Eric LeGrand (13:41):

So funny, you actually say that because my saying is no matter how bad your situation may be, someone always has it worse. I say it all the time. That's what I say. No matter how bad you may be going through it, someone always has it worse than you. Remember that. But COVID, it has changed my life drastically. I went from going to therapy two, three times a week. On the go, go to this event, having speaking engagements, meeting up with friends, family, all of that, and it all got put on hold. Everything stopped. Didn't have as many speaking engagements as I had and plans with that went out the window. Meeting up with friends all the time that was done, traveling done, not going to therapy because I didn't want to put myself at risk. Thank God, I'm blessed and I have enough equipment at home that my mom, my aide and my nurse, they helped me do therapy at home. But life has changed, but I used it to take actually a step back and reflect on everything that I do have. And I started listening to audio books and it got my mind spinning in all different ways that I never probably would've done before. And especially my entrepreneurship mind.

Andrew Moses (14:48):

I want to talk about the entrepreneurship, Eric. You've got your hands in lot of exciting ventures, but none, maybe more exciting right now than the LeGrand Coffee House. Tell me about the LeGrand Coffee House.

Eric LeGrand (14:58):

LeGrand coffee house. It's funny how this started actually. When I tell people it's such a millennial thing but it started with a group message of friends sending pictures of their coffee every morning. And our group message joking around talking about, ooh...mama got a latte today, or look at, look at how much cream I got in mine or I drink my coffee black every single day. I never had my first cup of coffee until August, but I've always loved cafes. And I loved their vibes. And the opportunity opened up in my downtown area where I said, you know what? Why not create my own--LeGrand Coffee House. Set up the perfect vibe that's built around unity. Everything that's going on in this world I always bring people together when I speak. Here's another way I can do it because you know what, how many people drink coffee? 85% of the world. How many people have meetings over coffee? Or the different foundations built over a cup of coffee? I said, you know what? With this situation, when people drink my coffee, they're going to remember to be appreciative. They're going to remember the good things in their life. And they're going to go out there and attack their goals. Every day they get to drink our "daily cup of believe" we call it.

Andrew Moses (16:14):

The daily cup of believe. Every morning when people drink that daily cup of believe--that LeGrand Coffee, they should think about your story and your perspective. That again, no matter how challenging things are, there's always somebody who has it worse and to stay positive. Things of that nature. So Eric, you talked about coming together and one of the things that I've always been curious about is Malcolm Brown, the athlete who you collided with on that day in October 2010. I've always been curious. Do you have a relationship with Malcolm? Do you guys keep in touch? What's that relationship like?

Eric LeGrand (16:50):

You know, we still talk from time to time, but in the very beginning, yeah, we talked. I remember he wrote me, you know, one of the nicest letters, he felt guilty for what happened to me and I'm like, listen, I tackled you. You didn't tackle me. I tackled you. It happened. He broke his collarbone on the play. That following year, they came down to Rutgers campus and in the summer of 2011 I got to show them around Rutgers campus. The following summer I went up to Army's campus and you know what, it made me appreciate what I have and what I get to do because football to them is just a hobby. What they do to serve and protect our country everyday that's their real job. That's the real mission. I got to go through a day in the life of a cadet and wow.

Eric LeGrand (17:31):

Talk about just mental toughness, you know, the things that they have to go through on a daily basis, it's special. And that's why, you know, still to this day, I have a relationship and I'll never forget. I want to tell you one text message that he sent me in 2014. I think he was based out in South Korea at the time. And he texted me saying, Eric, I know you're about to graduate and give a great commencement speech. I just want you to know you're still an inspiration to me. And when I go into battle with my cadets, I share your story with them and motivate them. And that's how we go about our business. And no matter what we believe and I was just like, wow.

Andrew Moses (18:07):

Wow, wow, is right. But also a lot of credit to you, Eric, for being open-minded and not making him feel guilty. I'm sure there are folks that are in your shoes who would look at it differently and maybe be critical of Malcolm and not see the positive, the opportunity, the blessing, and the relationship that the two of you have formed. But how special and inspirational that he's sharing those stories with other cadets around the world. Your story Eric is one that you now continue to share with the world. It inspires so many. In 2012 you won the 'Jimmy V Award for Perseverance' at the ESPY's. In 2011, you returned to the Rutgers stadium and you led the team out onto the field in your wheelchair. Sports Illustrated called it the best moment of the year in sports. What was that moment like for you?

Eric LeGrand (19:06):

Oh, man, that was a cold day. I'll tell you what snowy on October 29, 2011, but I told everyone I was going to come out that game. And I said, you know what? All the adversity I've been through over this past year, no way I'm going back on that word. And I got in the tunnel. I was freezing cold. But as soon as I heard my teammates behind me started yelling, yeaaaa. You know, getting all hyped up the adrenaline juices just started flowing. And, and then we got out there on a field and I'll never forget, Coach Schiano brought it up on me. And all he said was, God, please heal this man. Family on three, amen. Family on three, one, two, three family. And I saw my teammate, Brandon Jones and my other teammate Steve Beauharnais start crying. And that's one time during this injury, I can say I almost lost it. I got the frog in the throat. I was like and then I got myself back together and I went off the field and I'll tell you what. That was a moment that I'll be able to bring with me forever and with everyone I got to share it with that day.

Andrew Moses (20:05):

You talked about Greg Schiano again there. And you mentioned him earlier spending a lot of time at the hospital in the initial weeks after. Talk about that relationship because you know we talked about my "everybody pulls the tarp" mindset that people do things--when you live by the "everybody pulls the tarp mindset," you do things that are well outside the boundaries of what's expected of you, well outside your job description. And certainly a college coach at Rutgers has a very, very busy schedule. You know these college football coaches work 16, 17, 18 hours a day. And Coach Schiano would spend some of his 24 hours in each of those days at the hospital with you. And you described how much it meant to you. Talk about Coach Schiano and the relationship that you guys have.

Eric LeGrand (20:56):

And of course Schiano I always say, he molds young boys into men. We go in there at 18 years old and you leave 21, 22? You feel prepared for the world. You know, the outside world that you're going to face. You know, the things that we go through at Rutgers as I said it's not always easy. It's not always fun. It's hard. It's a grind. And Coach Schiano demands the absolute best and the excellence out of everything you do, whether it fits into classroom, practice field, weight room session, it's always one rep is your best rep. Last rep. For every one. And when you do that over and over and over again, it's tough, but it becomes a mindset for you. But no matter what you do, you have to make it your best. And if you don't, you feel disappointed. You feel like you let you let somebody down.

Eric LeGrand (21:41):

And there's a definition that he always used to preach to us and I live it. The definition of success is the peace of mind you get knowing you did everything you could to be the best you can be. You're the one that looks yourself in the mirror at night and says, you know what? I gave it my all, and you are the only one who can judge that. And if you did, you should be able to put your head down on that pillow at night and sleep at ease. And if you did it, God willing you wake up the next morning, you look yourself in the mirror and you say, today, I'm going to make it my best day. And then you do it over and over again. Watch where your life takes you.

Andrew Moses (22:14):

So Eric, one rep, make that one rep your best rep.

Eric LeGrand (22:17):

Over and over and over again.

Andrew Moses (22:20):

That mindset, like that had to have been at the top of your mind as you're going through everything at Kessler and the rehabilitation, the therapy, it's just like you talked about that balloon--one rep is my best rep. One rep is my best rep. Like you said, you were built for this. You were built for this.

Eric LeGrand (22:38):

I truly feel like that. I really feel like physically, mentally I was, and people that as a source of inspiration. I use it and I look at it as a responsibility. People are looking to me, they look up to me, how can I give up on them? I feel like, you know, God put me here, put me through everything that I went through and my teammates too, to go out there and be better people in this world to help people and be that beacon of light in their life. And that's what I try to do. And that's the best part about it is I don't fake anything. What you see is what you get. That's the best part of this whole thing. You're like, it's not to have to, okay, I'm talking to you today so I put on my front now before a camera. No, I am who I am. I'm genuinely a very happy man. I wake up every day with a purpose and ready to attack what's in front of me.

Andrew Moses (23:25):

There are people in your situation, Eric, who would complain, they would be angry. They would be frustrated. You have taken your situation and turned it into a blessing. You've turned it into an opportunity to help others. I know you talked about some of the philanthropy and the work that you do. You've raised a ton of money for people for research and to help others. Talk about some of the Team LeGrand work. And again, it's just amazing. I'm sitting here smiling, Eric, because the stories that you're sharing, the wisdom that you're sharing, it's truly inspirational. Talk about the Team LeGrand stuff, because you truly mean what you say here.

Eric LeGrand (24:04):

Yeah. Team LeGrand of the Christopher & Dana Reeve Foundation was formed in the fall of 2013. And it was my foundation. I partnered up with the Christopher & Dana Reeve foundation. For those of you who don't know who Christopher Reeve is, because I didn't either until my mom educated me and I was like, oh, big time guy. He was the original Superman back in the seventies and eighties, and had a paralyzing injury in the mid nineties. Then he passed away I believe around 2004, 2005. And I feel like there was a shadow after that, that went on spinal cord injuries. I never knew anything about them until I got hurt. And then all of a sudden, you start doing research about it. And what they're doing is today's care, tomorrow's cure. You know, we want to find a cure for paralysis. In the meantime, we want to educate people on spinal cord injuries, bring awareness, be a peer mentor, help people along the way, employment opportunities, and you learn this whole new field and what they're doing. I partnered up with them and we've been able to have so many different events. Our Walk To Believe where I've raised over $500,000 for, you know. All these different events. I always say spinal cord injuries they don't discriminate. So I take myself out of my comfort zone and do other things like CKO kickboxing events, Zumba events, flag football tournaments. And I'm proud to say today, since our inception, we've raised over $2 million for spinal cord injury research.

Andrew Moses (25:18):

That is absolutely fantastic, Eric. You live by this mindset clearly that obstacles can be transformed into opportunities. And I know in your speaking engagements, you speak to the mantra that anything is possible. What deep down gives you that belief that anything is possible?

Eric LeGrand (25:39):

You know you see miracles happen every day. You see unfortunate things happen every day, but when the unfortunate things happen, how do you respond to them? I've never been a complainer. I've never been a quitter. I always, as an athlete, I was always a dog. You back me up into a corner. I'm going to fight through it, whatever it is, you know, you give me, it's like that no man left behind mentality. You've got one man versus 500 men. I'm going to go out fighting. And that's how I approached my life. You know, I'm just whatever it is, I'm not going to complain about it. The situation is what it is at the time. Now, when you get those good moments in your life and you really genuinely appreciate them, you start by saying, you know, I want more of that. I'm not going to live a miserable life.

Eric LeGrand (26:24):

I'm not going to live a life complaining and being upset all the time. This is just not a good feeling. I've been like, I was like that before my injury. I don't like to complain and I don't like to be upset. And it wasn't always easy to, you know, life challenges that you deal with as a college athlete. But now I feel like in life, I'm just genuinely appreciative for everything that's around me and these past 10 years, since my injury, I have so many blessings to be appreciative for.

Andrew Moses (26:53):

I'm appreciative that we're getting to spend a few minutes here. One more question. What's one message that you would send to any leader in sports, in business, or anyone, you know, going through something challenging or someone who's who set a goal for themselves and they just need a plan to achieve it. What's one piece of advice you would give?

Eric LeGrand (27:12):

Don't focus on the things that you don't have. Be appreciativefor the things that you do have. And if it's something you want, take a step back, look at the situation, set up a plan and execute with no excuses. Build a team around you that has the same mindset and that will challenge you as a leader. Not someone that's going to overstep and have an opinion all the time, someone that's going to challenge you that, you know, that gives you that weird feeling in your stomach when they see something that's wrong or that you may be off on something, you look at them and you're like, alright, maybe I might be off a little bit here. Let me rethink. I tell people, don't be afraid to put people around you that will challenge you to bring the best out of you, not the worst out of you, but the best out of you. And I have people in my life that definitely check me all the time and, make sure I'm staying on the right path. And I think every leader needs that.

Andrew Moses (28:08):

Eric, this has been such a humbling experience and so inspirational, truly an honor to spend some time with you. As you and I have talked about, I live in the Washington DC area, but, I've got New Jersey roots. I grew up in New Jersey and have followed your story for a long time and it's truly inspirational. We also share a birthday on September 4th. And I'll be sure to wish you a happy birthday this year. And as we've figured out, it's also the day that Beyonce was born. Mike Piazza was born. Google was incorporated on September 4th. And Eric LeGrand was born. An absolutely special day on the calendar. Eric, I sure will not forget these 30 minutes that we've spent together. And I know our listeners won't as well. Thank you for spending some time with Everybody Pulls The Tarp. We're all rooting for you. And like you said, it's not a matter of if you're going to walk. It's a matter of when. An we'll be cheering loudly and proudly when that day comes.

Eric LeGrand (29:10):

I appreciate you having me on Andrew. And you got the Jersey background in you. You got the toughness, you got the grit, virgo lifestyle baby. Love you my man. I appreciate it.

Andrew Moses (29:21):

Take care, Eric. Thank you. Thank you for joining me this week. Be sure to subscribe on your favorite podcast app so you can catch all of our upcoming episodes. And if you're like me and want a world full of tarp pullers, then leave a review to help others find us. You can also follow me on Instagram @AndrewMoses123 and sign up for my monthly e-mail newsletter at everybodypullsthetarp.com/newsletter. I'll share tips and insights to help you achieve maximum success and happiness. Today's a great day to pull the tarp. I am rooting for you. See you next time!