How to Build a Legacy Business with Anthony Perrone

What’s your business succession plan? How do you know who to hire? How can you keep customers happy? In this episode, Anthony Perrone, CEO of Chasing Pins, answers all these questions and more. As the leader of a dynamic, contemporary bowling company that just celebrated its 60th anniversary, Anthony shares all the best information about building a successful, happy business that lasts — and making sure it stays that way. 

Transcript

spk_0:   0:00
So it's one thing to build a business for a few years. It's another to build it. For 60 years on this episode, I talked to Anthony Peroni. He's the CEO of pin chasers in Tampa, Florida His dad started working at this business when he was 14 years old, emptying ashtrays for 25 cents an hour. On this episode, we talk about how they've changed their brand over time, grown and learn toe thrive in an industry that is kind of a legacy play. So it's amazing to hear this story and all the insights around how he uses happiness with his staff and their core principles for success and growth without any further ado. Here's my interview with Anthony Thay Anthony. Thanks for being on the show.

spk_1:   0:50
Thank you very much for the invitation.

spk_0:   0:53
So you know, this show is all about kind of speaking into the lives of other business owners and helping them understand how to build a business that lasts. And you guys as a company are celebrating your 60th anniversaries. And first of all, congratulations on that.

spk_1:   1:09
Thank you very much.

spk_0:   1:10
That is a huge accomplishment. I mean to be around that many decades. That's a company that has gone through all kinds of economic cycles and technology changes and cultural changes and everything else. So I'm really excited to dig into our conversation today. I know you have been that the CEO there for quite a while. Tell us a little bit about your kind of leadership role there and kind of how you ended up where you are today. Leading pen chasers.

spk_1:   1:38
Sure, I've been, um, I've been with our company for working for a company for 30 years. Well, in

spk_0:   1:46
I'm

spk_1:   1:46
a second generation proprietor of the company. So my stepfather, William Morris, came to the company when he was 14 years old, and back then, in 1958 the building, our original bowling center, Regal Lanes and Tampa was opened by the Palace Ola family, which had relocated to Florida from Michigan, and my stepfather went to work for him when he was 14 years old. He, um, literally his job was to empty ashtrays and do that all day long for 1/4 an hour

spk_0:   2:22
at the top.

spk_1:   2:24
And as he grew older, by the time they had gotten into his early twenties, he had asked the family. They'd asked, you know if he wanted more money, one of this, one of Ray's things like that. And he'd always said Amy and Stock. So by the mid eighties, their family had, you know, basically the men that were in charge of died and my father was left with the business, and I came to work in 1989 and from there I got to experience kind of what the business was all about and loved it. I have six other siblings which, along with myself, are the shareholders of the company. Now we bought the company from our dad, and we've been operating under the pin chasers brand, which we developed in 2006 for the last 13 years. So we've really been able to take a legacy company in 100 plus year old industry and remain competitive by keeping our focus on our customer, as I think any of your listeners and anybody who's in business will say, Hey, we're focused on the customer. But along with focusing on the customer, making the changes necessary to stay contemporary and to stay relevant, as as the company chores, and it's it's been fun to develop a brand kind of out of nothing. At the same time, we've been able to transcend some of the stereotypes about the bowling industry. And whenever you're in an industry that is old as the bowling industry, there's only a few of them, you know, like churches or government that kind of at 100 years, the day. So it's kind of Ah on off at the burden just to remain created to stay relevant.

spk_0:   4:21
Yeah, that is super interesting. I think it's amazing to hear a story like that of your dad, you know, starting at the age of 14 and then kind of working his way. I think it's just it's so easy for people to look at companies that have been around for a long time and not really know the depths of where people came from, what they've been through, to get to where they are, and I find that often there's a lot of hard work behind the scenes that makes that happens. There's quite a few things I want to dig into here as relates to have talked about one is just the whole family business thing that's a complex or can be a complex thing. Sometimes when you have family involved in business. Look, I'd love to talk about that. And then I also want to talk about just how you guys have been able to adapt over time, because I think this is a big problem for a lot of people and will continue to be a big problem because technology is advancing at such a rapid pace. How do we take something like bowling, which has been around like you said forever and make it something that still appealing to people that they go? Yeah, I'm still interested in showing up for this paying money for this and making it kind of, ah, regular event. Hopefully. So let's delve into the family business side first and then we'll come back to the bowling peace. Ah, lot of people out there have probably either had done business with family or tried to do business with family, and I've heard plenty of stories where that doesn't go very well. I'm all sorts when the word goes really well. My aunt and uncle worked together and they love working together, and you've got six siblings, which obviously has a lot of personalities involved there and a lot of different insights and faults and feelings, especially. You're dealing with something that your dad owned it for a very long time. So what's that been like? And ultimately, what kind of strategies have you found? Have been successful in kind of negotiating the realities of working with family?

spk_1:   6:09
Sure, I think, first and foremost, just to give a little bit of history. So of my six siblings, I think the very first step that our dad took many years ago is that none of us were ever groomed, made, influenced, cajoled, manipulated into being in the business. And he realized very early on as being a dad and being our provider, that that was his business. That was hiss life, blood in his passion. And he didn't go out of his way to to have us have that same passion, which I think was the groundwork for making decisions as time went by to set us up for success of the family. And the real key to that is that succession planning waas a very, very important part of his daily life early on, when we were very small Children, so not only providing for us in the present, but creating a framework to provide for us and our heirs in the future as well. So that was really important. And I think any family, the missteps or that they don't think about succession planning until somebody dies.

spk_0:   7:35
Yeah,

spk_1:   7:35
and that's really ah, really key part of our success. So that being said of my six other siblings that seven of us, three of us work in the business and one of us, my brother Michael, he is a C P. A has a C p a firm and serves as our CFO. And, um, you know, I don't want a part time, but but obviously he's running his own business on a daily basis.

spk_0:   8:05
Sure.

spk_1:   8:05
And, uh, you know, is our CFO in terms of, you know, making sure our compliance is in order and all those types of things. And then one other brother, a younger brother, is a wiz on the mechanical property side. So he takes care of basically the investment of the buildings and makes things work so mechanically. So from that standpoint, none of the other siblings are involved in the business except at of shareholders, and another interesting on very critical decision that our cad made is that once we came into the position that I was interested in the business, it's not. He was going to sell it many years ago and because I was interested and found myself capable the leadership position and doing great things on her own. He made it to where only two of us have voting stock in the business, and then an attorney who is our succession planning attorney is kind of the tiebreaker if we ever needed to do that. But my brother Michael and I happen then making the decisions, and I make the daily decisions that as the chief chief executive and managing partner, But any time that we're, you know, investing heavy dollars. Oh, are you need that he and I make those decisions together, and it has worked wonderfully for our family and work wonderfully for our business.

spk_0:   9:34
Well, it sounds like your dad put a lot of ah wisdom and thought and effort into preparing you all, which I'm selfishly very interested in, because I have. I run the agency. I have run now for 20 years, and I also have five young Children, so I got the idea of what they're gonna do next is intriguing to me. But I actually I love that he didn't kind of push you all into that. I actually have a quote at the beginning of my book that I wrote where I dedicated it to the kids and I said, Follow your dreams But remember, your dreams don't have to be my dreams and absolutely And it sounds like that's kind of what he did

spk_1:   10:08
E. P. None of us grew up thinking that, you know, arse except as people will be tied to the business or tied to the bowling industry

spk_0:   10:18
and the

spk_1:   10:18
success. And although we were very aware and very grateful for the life that bowling has given us, we were, ah, always always encouraged to follow her dreams. So one of my siblings is a mechanical engineer. Another one is an executive for Unilever, another sibling. ISS. Really a, um came to be a maven in the Internet car sales world. She's worked for ah, there in large group dealership group, but kind of started their Internet sales 20 years ago. So, you know, we all have a lot of different things that we do, and he has always encouraged us as Children and as adults to follow. Our passion and one other real key part for are part of our success and part of his life. Success and things that he gave to us is, you know, is very strong faith.

spk_0:   11:15
Yeah,

spk_1:   11:15
and strong phrase has been the framework that we each can rely on no matter what we're doing in our lives. But it's part of our business, and strong faith allows us, Teoh, you know, I would say give beyond lip service to the fact of that people are the most important things in our business whether they be staff, family, our guests. And I think that's, um, something that's really baked in tow. What we do and baked into our DNA.

spk_0:   11:47
Wow. Well, it sounds like your dad did an awesome job, So I'm gonna do my absolute best to copy him through the next few years. As my kids grew up. What are some other like, big things? Because I just find this fascinating. And it's encouraging as well that you underestimate our big things that you kind of took from your dad that he kind of instilled in you either in the business or just young in life that you feel like have helped you kind of grow and even your, you know, siblings like they've all done very well for themselves. So what was it that he kind of encouraged you guys with That allowed youto keep growing as individuals

spk_1:   12:21
obsessive attention to the little thing to the detail. And that was under the context of not everybody, the detail person. And if you're not have somebody with you, that is so he's not. He's a big idea person that hadn't extremely extremely detail oriented administrative assistant who who helped him navigate that process. I'm not, and I have used other people and also worked extremely hard to be detail oriented. So at the end of the day, I think the one big lesson businesswise that that he left with me is to be obsessive about the details and that the big things work out. Another thing is to be obsessive about the people in our business and the people again being staff, family and guests. And I think that, um, from a very young age when I first started in the business, you know, it was very easy for me to tell that you just have to be obsessive about the people in the business and all sides of it, not just customers. We've seen plenty of folks kind of flame out being obsessive about customers or end up giving it a very shallow meeting because they're not obsessive about their staff. And I think that that's, you know, the things that have led us to be able thio change our ability to adapt to our surroundings. And our business climate would not occur if we were not obsessive about our people.

spk_0:   14:06
I love that, and I think it's so critical. I'd love to hear from you, like, on a practical level, what that looks like because I hear people say things like this. But then I want to know, like one day to day basis, what is obsessive about our people look like? What does that mean with regards to how you handle things from a company perspective hiring, firing, daily care of people? What does that look like for you guys as a company that makes you feel like they were hitting this goal of being obsessive about our people in a positive way.

spk_1:   14:34
Sure, operationally, that takes on a couple different sides first and foremost, the hiring and training process we've learned over the last 10 years. As we're really competing for entry level staff, 80% of our workers are 20 years old and younger. And when you deal with that level of staff, you have to find ways to have it mean something to them. So are our selection process. Very, uh, much based on just happiness and not skills. We can teach people a lot of things, but we can't teach him to be happy about what's going on with them. So we do everything we can to identify happy people first, because because we're not splitting atoms, weaken, basically teach anything we need to do if you're a happy person and whether that's to be kind to other people you work with. Be kind to the people who pay the money, could be in our business and to bowl. We think that really starts with people being happy, and the other side of it is that we've learned specifically in the last 10 years is to always give people the authority to make other people happy. So so many businesses and see, especially in hospitality. They have these these multiple layers of management and responsibility that basically forces the guest to kind of navigate their system to get something done or solved. And part of our rebranding, you know, six was that that was the one thing that just was not working for me as a leader in our business is to constantly have guessed, seek out this guru manager to get satisfaction. So we tour all that down, and every single person in our business has the authority to make somebody happy from the get go. If something's not right, they have the ability to refund their money. If something. And that's our guarantee, basically, you know that you have a great time are telling us, and every single person that works for us has the ability to make that happen and make somebody happy. So those two things start with happy people and give everybody the authority to make someone happy. Are the two kind of rails that we use to solve the people side of our business, but the staff and guests and it's something that you know. It's been fun to watch mature over the last 13 years when we wrote these things down Number one, my dad thought I was nuts. Increasing. Give everybody the authority to give away money, basically. And the reality is that used so infrequently that it sometime astounding to me where I'm saying, Hey, are we doing everything with everything we can to make people happy? It's been kind of fun. Another part on the debt side is to is to, ah, get rid of every rule that doesn't have safety as a priority. One of the big things about our industry is shoe rental, and you know, we don't rent shoes to the public. It's kind of, you know, I see it is kind of grocery stores don't wrenching shopping parts,

spk_0:   18:01
right?

spk_1:   18:01
So, you know, we tour down a lot of the stereotypical business process that in involved in bowling industry and kind of started from scratch with what happens with the mom and kids who come in the building. And what we found early on when we were doing our research is that sometimes they might spend 20 to 30 40 minutes before they throw the first ball because of all the kind of baked in hurdles. There were two having a good time. We tour all that down and kind of built the experience over again, and that has been a nice piece of our success as well.

spk_0:   18:42
That's some awesome stuff, a couple things there that really stood out to me. One is I love that you said that your dad thought it was crazy. And yet you did it anyway, because there's a couple things there that resonate with the one you obviously respect your dad and appreciate his wisdom and guidance over the years. But you were, But you were leader enough to go. Hey, things were changing. We have to be able to change with them. And then you said when we wrote these things down and that seems like a little thing. But it really resonated with me because I think so often when we're running along and business leaders at all stages make the mistake of just not writing down the goals, writing down the vision, writing down the priorities. And there is something about putting those ideas on paper that I think changes them

spk_1:   19:27
absolutely. And, uh and I'll tell you that. So in 2000 and five Basically, that was the year that, you know, my dad stepped down and was going to retire from the business and finish the sale of the business to his Children and do something else. So in 2005 I felt that, you know, our company was basically everything it could be at the time, and I also felt that being a legacy business model for bowling, which was that we were a league based business. About 65% of our income came from league bowling, which was a historically extremely strong product for the bowling industry in bowling centers in the U. S. Market and what I came to, The conclusion is that we'd also experienced about a 5% of attrition in decline in league business historically for the previous 10 years. And that wasn't only happening in our business, but it was happening in the bowling industry of the whole nation wide. And that dilemma basically said, Hey, we're either going to rethink this business or we're going to be doing something else with the investment of this business and transforming into some other kind of business. So faced with that, we took our executive management team at the time, which many a member is still with us, and my brother and I and we hired a marketing company out of Chicago. All this fire and this marketing company, which was run by a woman named on the cold Baldwin, Their expertise Woz rebranding churches and my dad had met them because the church he was at had looked into what they could do to grow their their base and kind of change what was happening to them, which was some severe attrition. And they had looked into him, so they ended up not hiring them. But we hired, and it was an extremely, extremely good decision to do that. It was really expensive, you know. And then people think back in 2005 you know at the time were, you know, $5 million company sales wise and had three units, and we basically, you know, spent a couple $100,000 with this company, and they let us know that everything we were doing on the positive side that people really liked, we're going to be the things that would seem that our fate of being out of business within the next 10 years, and that was an eye opener. And it was something that we, uh, you know, fortunately, had the intestinal fortitude to embrace and not argue with. And I think that's where so many company that times fall into the trap of thinking that they always know best. Yeah, and and they get away from who they are. And but the end of the day, any any business in any company, the entrepreneur and the steward of their business is tasked with the survival and success of their business and whatever train jizz that makes and whatever twists and turns that you know that a company that journey, you still have to be responsible to survive and to be profitable. So we heard everything about what we did right? That was making us wrong. And we took it and basically started over and rebranded the company to create something totally different and new in the bowling industry. And I think proof positive of that is that ultimately a number of other people are industry started taking the same steps, and now we have a very different bowling industry, and it's all based on the entertainment side of bowling as well as the food and beverage opportunities that bowling presents. And now we're a totally different company and we re branded to the pin chasers brand. And we've never had success that we've had, especially in the last five years. But we weathered the 7 4008 many depression and came out of it. Number one. We made money through it. Number two. We came out of it stronger than we ever were because of that rebranding, and we're really positioned to grow now, and it's really exciting. But listening to an outside company tell us that what we did well, I was going to be. The thing that would do us in was really hard.

spk_0:   24:46
Mmm.

spk_1:   24:47
And, uh, coming through that and starting from scratch and putting in the place, formalizing that people equation that my dad had always operated under. But nest didn't necessarily formalize and write it down. That became basically our playbook, and we call it our playbook. So everybody who works the pin chasers has given a playbook and all the that playbook, you know, has all of our ways to be successful policy procedure, you know, our guiding principles, and it's basically the you know, the story of our success and everything in there. The most important things are scaled down to a business card sized credit card, basically, that has the most important principles of our business and away for staff to remember them. So we hand them out, and at any given time I walk up to anybody workforce and and ask them. And if they don't know, they can pull out this index card and read it.

spk_0:   25:58
And

spk_1:   25:58
that's really been a key piece of what we d'oh.

spk_0:   26:01
I love that I I actually steal that idea. I told my wife when I first started, this podcast was like, You know, selfishly, the good thing for me is I'm gonna get to talk to all these different business owners who've been in business for a long time. I'm just gonna get to take great ideas and use them in my business to help my people so selfishly, I love slip when I get little nuggets that are really helpful, but about their that's listening, a couple things I want you guys to hear that Anthony's been talking about are easy to overlook. I think it just the midst of a conversation. One is Anthony talked about basically hiring expertise on the outside. But even before that, you were willing to look at your own potential risk and see far enough down the tunnel to kind of go. Okay, this is not going to last and current state, we may have to change. And there's so many companies that didn't do that. I mean, the biggest examples are like Blockbuster Video, and I just would love to have been in their executive board meetings as Red Box came out and Netflix came out, and they seem at least from the outside to have just sat stagnant. Lee, you recognize you had an issue, You sought out expertise to help you solve that issue. And then when they gave you things that you didn't want to hear, you still trusted them because that's why you hired them in the first place. And you followed that guidance, and that has paid great dividends for you. I think that is just such a big principle. People are not willing. Sometimes toe look to the outside to get feedback, and I know for me there have been plenty of times where I needed somebody who wasn't inside of the circle toe. Look at it and go, Hey, what about this Over here? And we're like, Oh, I mean, God, I didn't realize that it's just such a huge impact. So thanks for sharing that.

spk_1:   27:40
Absolutely. I think that that's a, uh you know, when you when you there's plenty of other examples in the in the Netflix and Blockbuster example is a very top of mind example these days, but in another side of example is even in the bowling industry. So the Brunswick Corporation, which I think most people will identify with bowling the Brunswick brand. And I will tell you that when you look at the history of Brunswick, Brunswick's first money 100 plus years ago was made in horse and buggy. Yeah, they, um you know, we're woodworking company. They made carriages and things like that, and at the turn of the century, they started making pool tables and billiards, and they found themselves in the bowling business. And today they have divested themselves of bowling business, a least the brand of Brunswick, to the division of their company that made bowling lanes and um, bowling equipment. And as a capital goods supplier for the bowling industry. But the rest of the company basically became the largest marine and boat manufacturer in the United States. Own brands like Boston Whaler and they liner Mercury Marine, which is the You know, the outboard motor Company they own, have owned those things for decades life fitness, gym equipment. And that's what the Brunswick company does today. And they even were in the music producing business and had owned the music, writing a lot of the African American acts

spk_0:   29:31
in the

spk_1:   29:31
fifties and sixties, Brunswick in the forties. Brunswick owned them and was in the music business and music publication doesn't. So you know, they were. They were, ah, kind of, ah, homegrown or industry example of you do what you do to survive and to be profitable. And it may not. Look what you did to start.

spk_0:   29:56
Yeah, I think

spk_1:   29:56
a great lesson. And, um, you know, when I see it playing out a lot today, you know, when I look at Google and the guys that were so incredibly intelligent to create search and to give it a format information and make it easier and better, But they didn't really create search. And now I don't even know that that they found that said, Hey, we're gonna be in the advertising business when they created Search and created Google. So you have to take what the customer gives you. You have to be where the people are and you have to do the things that people want and are willing to pay for, to be successful today. And right now we're in the bowling business. But more importantly, we're in the entertainment based business. We're in the location based entertainment business. And as we are going to mature and grow in the next few years, you know our biggest threat. So no Longbourn, other bowling businesses or other bowling centers, or even movie theaters or restaurants. Our biggest threat is somebody sitting at home with Netflix and binge watching something on their computer or iPad or device. And we have a whole generation of people who on Lee no, their devices, their entertainment. So, you know, we're faced with some of the biggest threats we've ever been faced with, not simply whether to be entertainment based bowling or league baseball ing, and business is still very good, but it's just not 70% of our business anymore. Read those challenges are going to be what challenged business owners and entrepreneurs from here to eternity is. Can you something compelling it up that somebody wants to buy. And can you change often enough where people want to keep buying? And I think that sometimes it never gets any more complicated than that.

spk_0:   32:03
Well, what's interesting to me is you have to what I consider to be two very large hurdles that a lot of people would use as complaining points for business growth. One is you're in what could be called a legacy business only because it's been around for so long as an industry. And so as a result, it's easy to feel like some other thing that whatever the new shiny apple is will supplant you. But the other is on. This kind of takes us back to something you were talking about earlier, but I want to circle back to it. I think it's really valuable is you're talking about like the age of your staff, and this is something that's really interesting to me, because I have a relatively young staff years, probably even younger than mine from a team structure standpoint. Sure that it is. And it reminds me a lot of like a chick fillet type situation where, yeah, you can go toe Burger King or McDonald's or whatever, basically any other fast food place and ultimately not have great service. And then you got a chick fillet, you were going to have great service, and they're going to say my pleasure after you say thank you and they're gonna say, Have a blessed day and the like and they're the same age people like It's the same populist population they're hiring from from the McDonald that's across the street. And yet somehow they're able to produce these people that are like, you said, happy. I mean, what is it that you guys do that that helps you isn't just in the hiring. Failures are just good at selecting the right people. Or is it a cultural nurturing that's happening? Or is it both?

spk_1:   33:28
It's a culturing cultural recognition.

spk_0:   33:32
Um, what happy

spk_1:   33:33
is, and then the the commitment to teach happy or reinforce happy. I don't think we could ever make someone that's unhappy, happy, you

spk_0:   33:44
know, in

spk_1:   33:44
terms of, you know, they have pieces of their lives. But at the same time, if somebody is inherently a happy person but has just honestly just been dawned on there are whole life or have bad living situations, or and so many of our, you know, teenage people. The parents are in a bad way. They don't have a great home life. Sometimes you can find happiness where you're at, and sometimes we're the escape for staff as well. A cz our guests. So when you're in the location based entertainment business like bowling, you're an oasis for your guests, and we always treated that way. But we're also in Oasis for our staff.

spk_0:   34:29
Something's

spk_1:   34:30
not great at school. If something's not great at home, when you come in the door, it could be great. Well, and I think we we do everything we can to make that happen. And I think that Chick fil A does everything they can to make that happen because we do share the same people and they do a wonderful job of teaching people how to be successful in their situation.

spk_0:   34:56
Yeah, and

spk_1:   34:56
another part of that is, is, is really doing everything can to help them realize their their goals as well in their life goals.

spk_0:   35:06
So when

spk_1:   35:07
we have so many students and someone is burned their their way to college or what have you and they leave us, we're not sad. We're happy.

spk_0:   35:16
You know,

spk_1:   35:16
somebody works for us through college and achieves their degree and goes on to work at an agency or work, Uh, you know, is an engineer or a counter whatever. We're happy, and we feel that we can be influential, influential with them, as young people give them success, no matter what they do later in life.

spk_0:   35:39
That's awesome.

spk_1:   35:39
That's something we've always embraced. And it's a real big piece of our success. Is that, um, you know, as long as we support people being happy when they're in our doors, that will be really happy for them when they're when they're moving on. He has a part of it, too. It's hard to be unhappy are to be happy if you don't get paid,

spk_0:   35:59
certainly

spk_1:   35:59
can't always pay on the you know, the the higher end of that entry level position, and I think that chick really does as well, and that's part of what they do is, and they can afford to do that. And we can afford to do that by being good stewards of our business.

spk_0:   36:17
And, uh,

spk_1:   36:18
you know, we never compete on price. That's really important in our business. Plenty of people go down the slippery slope of always compete on price, where we truly, truly, by taking care of people staff wise and guest wise, you know, it's our our experience that creates the value. And we're the most expensive bowling center in town. To be very honest, and not that we target that either,

spk_0:   36:43
right?

spk_1:   36:43
We focus more on building value for the experience. Then we do on price, and that goes hand in hand with keeping our staff happy.

spk_0:   36:53
I love that, even in your logo and those of you listening on the podcast can't see this, But you can go to penn chasers dot net and go see it. You have a little bowling ball that even has a smiley face on it. So even that happiness elements have been talking about is reinforced all the way across the brand. It reminds me a lot of Amy out there. That's not let's read this book. You should go get it. It's called excellence Winds by Horace Schultz is the cofounder of Ritz Carlton and what you're talking About And then a lot reminds me a lot of a story that he told. And this is actually where Truett Cathy, a chick fil a, got the idea of using my pleasure and have a blessed day it actually came from, or a Schultz in a meeting that they were having together. And he said at Ritz Carlton, the language that we use matters a lot, and as a result, we say that we're ladies and gentlemen serving Ladies and gentlemen, I don't care if it's the person that's in the back of the kitchen washing the pots. That person knows that there, lady or gentleman serving. Ladies and gentlemen. And the other thing that reminded me a lot of what you said about the authority to make people happy or kind of the permission really to make people happy. They have a similar thing where every team member at a Ritz Carlton basically has the ability to make a decision up to a very large sum. Not great. It's a luxury brand, but still they don't need to go ask a manager or talk to somebody else, and they all know that their number one priority in their case, it's not happiness. It's treat the customer in a way that they're gonna want to come back, which is kind of the same thing to some extent. And I mean, when I read that, I thought, Wow, what what an idea and horse basic was like. If I go in the back of any kitchen a Ritz Carlton and asked the person washing the pots what their number one priority is, they will say to wash these pots in a way that makes people want to come back. And I was like, That is awesome and that's kind of what you're saying But I know what you're saying.

spk_1:   38:42
Well, I want to shed some light on that. So I, too, have used Rich Colton and read about their experience and their commitment in another book. And one of the one of the one of the motivating books that we used in the brand formation. Time for Penn Chasers was a book called The Experience Economy by Joseph Pine and James Gilmore, and they illustrate some of the Ritz Carlton experience in that book. There's been a number of other ones that draw attention of Rich Colton. I remember the story of how ah, concierge in front desk person somebody had asked for a certain brand of ah, drinker or something like that. And he went out on his own time on his own money and went to buy this for

spk_0:   39:30
the guests in the hotel and,

spk_1:   39:32
uh, stuff like that. And, you know, our staff will do the same quite honestly, if, like, of you asked for a liquor at our bar that we don't have. We give them the authority to take money out of the till on Go find it

spk_0:   39:46
on,

spk_1:   39:46
and we'll handle the aspects of it later because, quite honestly, it's against the law in Florida to go. Just go buy a bottle of liquor and selling

spk_0:   39:56
systems, but we'll do what we

spk_1:   39:58
can to make them happy Brand that will work out those other details later, which we d'oh but to be compliant. But the experience economy, by Joseph Pie and James Gilmore was really the first time that we learned about how we're going to be a contemporary business with bowling as a background and be able to survive and do well. And then another story in book that I read years ago. Waas, about a deli in Flint, Michigan, called Bingaman's. And they have this like little you know, 80 page book but the attention to people in detail in that book about how they run their deli. And I'm pretty sure they're, you know, world round belly now.

spk_0:   40:43
Yep,

spk_1:   40:43
that people know about. But that little book had so many good ideas on how to organize what's important to your business and how they present it to their staff and their guests. And it's, you know, part of their success. And we certainly were never too proud to borrow. And we borrow readily from people who are having success, especially from the, you know, the hospitality and entertainment world of business. We'll do everything we can tow to use it to our advantage as well.

spk_0:   41:15
Yeah, I think that's wise. I mean, the fastest way to scale in a lot of cases is to model after those who have already been successful. I mean, that's what I think most successful people do. And then they learned to make it their own. You know, none of us want to be carbon copies of some of their business, but there's no reason that we should reinvent the wheel. If somebody else has found something that works really well, that's good advice. We're running out of time, but I always like to hit on this last subject before wrap up so to last questions. And then we will call this an episode that the 1st 1 will be around work, life, balance. Everybody asks about this talks about this. I don't really love the term that much, but I want to hear your perspective on what that even means to you and how that's changed over different seasons of life. And in the last will be last question will be any kind of parting advice or faults you would give to aspiring entrepreneurs or business owners who are trying to build a business that lasts. So 1st 1 work life balance. Was that term mean to you? And how has that changed over different seasons of life?

spk_1:   42:12
Jerk? I mean, I think it goes into our framework for people, and if you recall when we first discussed it, today are people. Equation is staff, family and guests, and from myself family. I got married very late at 34 and I'm 53 now. And I have always committed to organize my business life to never miss anything. And sometimes I miss and I don't beat myself up about it. But I coach every team that my sons play for. I have two boys that are 10 years apart, and, um, I do everything I possibly can to be influential in their life on a daily basis for my sons and my wife. And everything that's good in business happens because of that and for the guy who sweat being away from the job or being away from the business to go watch your go coach, a Little League baseball teams or a bowling team, or what have you. I've made more connections that have helped my business being in those other environments. Then I do in the building that times so never miss an opportunity to be somewhere else, especially with family and as the context and make that very important. And that creates that balance. And I don't like that term work like balance, either. I just like to say that you know, family is part of our people equation, and we make sure that we support that from our staff is well. And about the only thing I kind of insist on from a rule standpoint for our staff is that they take their vacations and many times in the hospitality arena, especially people can trade their vacation for money and things like that. I will never do the last week. So they've earned two weeks of vacation. They have to get out of the building for atleast one of those weeks. I'll pay one week of vacation, but I won't say any more than that. And and I want them to be outside and doing the things that matter so that they could be happy and make sure the people who walk in the door pay us are happy as well.

spk_0:   44:32
That's really good. All this talk about happiness and I'm literally smiling on the other side, just thinking about it because it is just so encouraging to hear stories like this of I think so many times people think that the focus has to be so focused on just the numbers. We got to know her numbers, but it's right. It's about the people and At the end of the day, it turns out that when you actually care about people and everybody's working towards the same goal, it can produce amazingly successful, thriving businesses. And that's what's happened for you guys. And I always tell people secrets when it comes to the family stuff and I have to tell myself, there's a lot of times, too. To be honest is when we lose or if we lose money, we can always go get more of it. But when we lose time, especially time with those that we care about in love about, we don't get that back. And so when we have opportunities to do that, like actually this is happening to me right now. Monday I had a really full schedule, had a lot of stuff going on. But the kids also have a holiday, so don't have school on Monday and my wife was that we have universal passes down in Orlando. Let's go, let's go take these university. I had a really full day and but I've also was gone a lot this week and I thought, you know what? I have the power to clear my schedule on Monday and all those meetings can get done the next day or the day after the day after that. But I got five kids who I could take the Universal on Monday, and it works out for them and for her. I should do that instead, and I just found it. So thanks, I've just found it's worth making those decisions. Even when it's hard. There's a lot of stuff going on in business. I think I've had so many times where I thought, Well, I want to get through this project. Then I'll have time And there's just always another project.

spk_1:   46:09
Absolutely. Those things change over time.

spk_0:   46:12
You

spk_1:   46:12
know when you're when I would say, If you're in the incubator stage and you're an entrepreneur from you're developing a business that hasn't come into fruition yet, your life could be different,

spk_0:   46:23
you know,

spk_1:   46:23
in that manner. But when you you know if you have a business, it's operating. If you cannot be away to do something with your family, then you haven't built a very good business yet.

spk_0:   46:35
You just have a job. You don't have a business at that point now

spk_1:   46:39
and won't build it if you don't take those times to make the other people in your life happy.

spk_0:   46:44
It's really work. We haven't really appreciated the just insights you've given. I know I've learned a lot of things. People listening have learned a lot that they can apply to their businesses as well. If there was any parting advice that you would give people about building a business that lasts, what is it that comes to mind?

spk_1:   47:00
Focus on the people you know, no matter what widget you do, no matter what business your end, whether it be the digital landscape for hospitality. I haven't seen anybody who is not focused on people and people being staffed family and guests. There's just no way to be relevant to anyone if you're not doing that. So I think focusing on the people side in the people equation is where values driven. And I think that's where you know everyone has an opportunity to be relevant and to be worth spending money on. And it doesn't it doesn't really change much from that. Everybody has their expertise and what they do to be compelling. But at the end of the day, it's not gonna be long lasting if it's not focused on people.

spk_0:   47:52
That's great. That's wise counsel. Well, I know next time I am in the Tampa Bay area, I'm gonna bring my kiddos to a pin chasers so we can experience what happy bowling is like. Anthony, thank you so much for being on the show today. I really appreciate it.

spk_1:   48:06
Thank you very much.

spk_0:   48:07
If you want to find Anthony's company and take a look at Penn chasers, go visit one other locations. You confined them online at penn chasers dot net, get all the info about them and see their happy, smiling bully ball. Thanks for listening and good luck with building a business that lasts. I hope this episode has given you some ideas or inspiration. It will help you grow your business if you found it helpful and you know somebody else who might benefit from it as well. I would greatly appreciate it if you would take the time to share this with him. Maybe on Facebook or Twitter were linked in, or even shooting e mail over to a friend with a link to this podcast in it. And if you haven't already, make sure you sign up for email list at building a business that lasts dot com