Generating Business Referrals Without Asking with Stacey Brown Randall

Let’s face it, most business owners dread the idea of asking for referrals. But word of mouth is still one of the most successful methods for generating new business. So how do you go about building referrals if you don’t feel comfortable asking directly? Today’s guest, author and entrepreneur Stacey Brown Randall, has developed a five-step system for generating referrals without having to ask. Listen in for more ideas to help you start generating more referrals! 

Transcript

spk_0:   0:00
Michael always told me, Do a great job for someone asked them to tell someone else and you'll never run out of business. Referrals are such a huge part of growing a successful business, and most of you out there listening probably get your best business from referrals. But here's the question. Do you have a clear defined process of how to generate those referrals on this episode? I talked to Stacy Brown Randall, and she has written a book called Generating Business Referrals without asking a simple five step plan to referral Explosion. I don't know about you, but that sounds super interesting to me. And this is the kind of topic in the kind of idea that's really tactical riel practical. I'm gonna help you actually build a business that lasts without any further ado. Here's my interview with Stacy. Hey, Stacy. Thanks for being on the show.

spk_1:   1:02
Thanks J for having me. I'm excited to be here.

spk_0:   1:04
I'm really excited to have you because I was reading through your bio and it says a member of the Business Failure Club, that's a very unusual way to start a bio. Tell me about that.

spk_1:   1:17
You know, sometimes I just think you have to just accept what has happened and own it and make sure you're learning the lessons from it. And so I think by that by always telling people I'm a member of the Business Failure Club. It gives me a chance to define that label without that label being defined for me. It gives me a chance to obviously own what happened with my business failure, but at the same time use it to my advantage and for motivation, kind of moving forward. So I know a lot of people are like You shouldn't use the f word and I'm like, Oh, in this case, it's It's I mean, if it fits perfectly, there's no wayto sugarcoat this or like use mistake and like no, like when your business fails and you have to go get a job because it's financially taxing when your business fails. And then, of course, it's mentally and emotionally journey, and the blow to your ego is Ruutel. You just need to own it, right? I mean, you just need to call it what it is. The business failed. I had to go get a job, and so I think that I always try to let people know it's straight out of the gate like I am not perfect at this. And when I tell people I've actually started a couple of businesses, I always say it's not because I'm good at it. It's good that it took me a couple of times to figure it out.

spk_0:   2:26
That's great. I love that we're starting off with that because I think that that level of transparency and just reality, frankly, is really important, especially in today's, like Instagram, entrepreneur life, reality, fantasy land. So you know when you're thinking about just that, for example, like Waken any any of us can open up our instagram accounts or Facebook counter, even linked in and see all these people who are just so successful and they have all the things they're doing, everything right and everything's great. And if we could just run our businesses like theirs, and how have you kind of has that ever been an issue for you? How have you overcome it if it has? You know, you talked about having gone through failures of your own What? What gave you kind of the gusto to pick yourself back up and go Now I'm gonna try again.

spk_1:   3:11
You know, I think that's such a great question from the perspective of everything we see. Let's be honest. For the most part, everything we see in social media is somebody's perfectly polished front stage, right? I mean, it's just And I don't know if you're this way because you're a guy and I'm a girl, and I know that I'm this way. But like I choose the pictures before they get posted on social media, right? I'm like, Oh, wait, do I look right in this ridge It right. So I know everyone else that the most part is doing that. What filter should I use? Does that make me look better or whatever? So I think that we find ourselves in this comparison society all the time, and we're all susceptible to it. And even those of us that try really hard to kind of like block it out as best we can, we're still susceptible to it. I mean, I'm in a mastermind with a group of other business owners, and we were just on Sunday having a whole conversation at a text thread about that, about what that looks like about feeling like, No, we know we're making great progress, but we should be further along and we're comparing ourselves to others, and I think that what we lack is some transparency of what it looks like. I love it when it gonna entrepreneur who's successful says Yep, and it took me 17 years to get here. Like, I think there's nothing better than hearing an entre never say that. So for me, with my business failure, you know, and it wasn't one of those things where I started a business, I don't know what I was doing, so to speak. It was I started a business and I fell into a trap. I think that a lot of business understood all into which short changed how long my business actually would last. But it wasn't like my business failed in the 1st 18 months, which is the majority of when businesses will fail is in their 1st 18 months. I don't know the exact statistic, but and then it's like us, even a much larger person who won't even make it to five years, and I made it to four years before my HR consulting business, which is my first business actually failed. And I think that it's one of those things when we have to constantly remind ourselves of why we're doing what we're doing, why it matters to us and to just kind of eliminate all the comparison that is out there in the world and not try to fall into that societal trap of constantly comparing ourselves to others, because somebody will always look better than you. And someone will always have a better car than you. And you probably have a better car than everybody else, right? That's looking at you. So it's just kind of like that reminder of where we are in our journey and understanding that that's an okay place to be in our journey and then, of course, to keep moving forward.

spk_0:   5:29
Yeah, I think that's really important in the reality of what you just talked about, What just perspective of knowing where you are? I think for me one of the biggest things is I don't really care what my competition is doing. I really am only comparing myself. Or at least I try to I should say only compare myself to myself a year ago, and so, like that's how we've grown over the past 20 years is like, What are your goals? And I'm like, Well, I don't know. What did I do last February? Well, here's what I did. I want to be that that's it. That's how it's always worked. And it's always worked well for me that way, at least up until a certain point and you talk about entrepreneurs that took a long time to be successful. I love one things, Dave Ramsey says. He says, Uh, I busted my tail for 20 years and all of a sudden I was an overnight success. I think that's what happened last time. People see these people pop up. They think a while they're really successful. But what's happening behind the scenes is a whole different ballgame. One of things you have mentioned was a mastermind group. That's something that I'm hearing come up a lot with successful folks. I'm involved with a couple, a couple of master, my groups, actually a different kind of communities. I'm curious what that looks like for you, how you got involved in that and what kind of impact it's had on you and on your business.

spk_1:   6:35
You know, I've been in a couple throughout the years, and this one is probably one of the better ones that I've been in on Lee because we're all in the same space. None of us are competitors of each other, but we're all we all have businesses that used to be brick and mortar or some siblings. For some of us in the group, there's like this tiny piece that's still a brick and mortar, and I mean brick and mortar, not like a retail store. I just mean like the service based, like providing a service to your clients. And we've all been moving into the online space over the last so many years. So there's a couple of us are a little further ahead of where some of the other ones and and the group are. But we all are in the same place of learning what it looks like to go from No my case. I was a business and productivity coach. I grew my business by figuring out how to generate referrals without having to ask for them. Realize that was what made me different. And that's what all my clients wanted to learn. Started teaching that and then realized I could help so many more people if I had an online program and that would give me the ability to work people all across the world. And we have students and my growth ever feels program in seven different countries. And so what I needed was a space to be with other entrepreneurs who were in that same movement place. And we're trying to grow a business online because growing a business online dust look entirely different than, you know, growing up coaching practice where I'm on the phone or we'll resume or face to face with my clients. And I'm trading dollars for hours. And there's different folks in the group from kind, all walks of life. We are all female. I have been in mixed gender masterminds before. I think either fine don't have a preference. Just so happens this one happens to get all females, and there's seven of us and we're spread out all across the country when we get together once a month and this is a free one, like we we it's evolved into your driven like one of the ladies that I was in another mastermind with. We were having a conversation and she was like, This mastermind is great But I spend most of my time talking to you three because we're building online businesses and the other ones aren't was like Then let's create that. So we kind of just created that and add. It's more people that we knew to the mix and it's been great. We do a lot of learning and sharing together, which is wonderful, but we do a lot of like helping remind each other how far we've come and picking each other up and like, Hey, you're actually better at this than you think. It's like having our little support team, but at the same time, we're not afraid to call each other out, like do the work. I mean, sometimes we find ourselves having that conversation with each other as well. It's just a great I think. Masterminds were great safe space for you to like. Let your hair down, so to speak, or let the wards show when you feel like it's going to be a nut safe space and you can have that conversation because the truth is, I don't care how successful you are. I don't care if you're the most successful person in the room or the least successful person in the room. We all have doubts. We all have fears. Dave Ramsey. To this day, he still has a doubt. He wakes up. There is something that can still rattle him the same way it can rattle us. And so I think having that space to have those conversations as we grow is really, really important.

spk_0:   9:25
Yeah, I think that's great. You know, one of things that people say a lot, especially in ownership of companies or entrepreneurship in general is it's lonely at the top, and that is or can be true. I know for me, like for ages, especially as I started to grow a team, all I really wanted was to just be one of the team. And at some point you realize, like when you're the one who has the ability to say, Hey, you don't have a job here anymore. When you're the one who signs the front of the paycheck, you don't get that. You don't get the opportunity to just be one of the team you have to lead, and as a result, that can be lonely. But I think something like a mastermind group when you're putting yourself in other stairs, where other people are in that it doesn't have to be lonely at the top. You choose to put yourself in those environments. I think it's great that you mentioned, like group of Durian is a free volunteer. German groupies don't have to be things that cost tens of thousands of dollars like you hear about sometimes sometimes just getting the right people together in the mix and having consistency. If they were gonna consistently meat on these dates, these times has a huge impact. I want to specifically transition a little bit because you mentioned it and I don't wanna kind of narrow in on it. You talk about this idea of generating business two referrals without asking Number one. I love referrals. I think that they're still the best way to build any kind of business anywhere. And I run a digital marketing agency so people like, Well, isn't that in contrast with what you do like No, it's not. Our job is to help amplify those things in the right places. My uncle always told me, he said, Look, just do a great job for somebody. Ask him to tell somebody else you never run out of business. That's been true. But in his part, he said, Ask them to tell someone else you'll never run out of business. You say you considering a froze without asking. So what does that look like?

spk_1:   11:03
Yeah, it's It's interesting when I have an opportunity to talk to people about my methodology and what it looks like to generate referrals without asking. There are usually two types of people, right? There's your uncle who I would have a conversation with, and he'd be like, What? You talk about asking us? Fine. It works great. And then there's what I like to call everybody else. That's like it could work. I think it's great that it works for you. I'm just uncomfortable doing it. And what I realized when I kind of started paying attention to how referrals work and looking at the human dynamic and the psychology behind why referrals typically happen. I started. You can really start to see an unpacked why it makes, I think, in my opinion, a majority of the people uncomfortable no matter the scripts that you get them or the tactics you tell them to use or how easy breezy you tell them to ask. There's a fundamental issue about asking somebody else to refer someone to you that makes a large majority of people uncomfortable. And a lot of people will tell you if they're in the space where they believe you should ask for a referral. Their advice back to you has always been You just need to ask. And if you're not comfortable asking, well, then you don't get any referrals because if you won't ask, you can't receive. And what I find through that process is that cuts out like 99% of us. It's like Okay, great. So I won't ask. Why can't receive great. That means I just have to wait and hope those were for a little to show up sporadically or randomly. And I just found like that was me, like I love receiving referrals to, and I think I do wonderful, great work, and I will receive referrals. But they were sporadic. It was like the cream of the crop, right was that it was just like, Oh, look at this. It's just this great thing that happened that I wasn't expecting. But when I started studying them and realizing how and why they work, I started actually doing things to take care of my referral sources, the people who were already kind of sporadically referring me to take care of them. And I noticed that as I started to take better care of them and specific ways and planets in specific language with what I call referral seeds, I started to get more and more referrals. And I realized, you know what, asking and not asking the way that I teach it have one thing in common and that is obviously being able to be front and center with a referral source. I just do it in a way that allows some people to feel more authentic, to really focus in on the relationship that they appreciate, that referrals were sending them, business it in, taking care of them and then suddenly planning in language that allows us to kind of get that in Russell. Obviously we're ultimately after, which is to receive referrals, but it comes from a place of feeling really authentic and knowing that it fits who we are in our values, like we get to take care of people that are taking care of us. Of course, we should be taking care of them. And so it kind of feeds together on all those principles that becomes really just a process that business owners need to put in place within their business. It's not complicated. It's not hard. Most people who go through it they're like, Wait, that's it. I'm like, Yep, that's it, are like I could do this. I'm like, Yeah, just the same way that someone who's comfortable asking can go ask if you're not comfortable asking for 30 40 years there hasn't been another way. And now there is. There is another way to generate referrals with consistency, with the level of volume, depending on what your needs are without having to ask, there's still work involved. You still have to. If you're gonna ask, you have to go ask somebody. If you're not gonna ask you to follow my methodology, you still have work to do. There's no easy, but there's no silver like Silver Bullet is gonna make everything easy, but it's just another way for people who aren't comfortable asking, and I just think it's really long overdue. And I think if I had had my system today, that I teach my very first business that failed never would have failed.

spk_0:   14:35
That is awesome. It makes me think about the one of the reasons a lot of people failing businesses sales in general because they started doing whatever it is that they do. And they're good at baking cupcakes, for example. And they started cupcake making businesses. Everybody said Your cupcakes are the best. You should start a cupcake business they do. But then, like actually having to sell those things or get in front of people to do them, and that's a very simple example. But if it's a more complex cell, it's a whole different ballgame. And they think that I'm really good at this thing, that selling is a whole different ballgame. So how can referrals or the right referral system that you're talking about help somebody kind of get over? That kind of stopped having to sell, at least in the traditional sense of prospecting and all that kind of stuff, and instead lean on their referral system. Does that look like

spk_1:   15:20
Yeah, I think that's a great question because it's true, like that's What I always tell folks is that there's a lot of different things you can do to grow your business. I call it having like a number of tools, right in your tool walk when it comes to your business development strategy or your sales strategy. And there are things you need in the marketing side, and there are things you need in the prospecting side. When I teach. That was, We need 1/3 piece to that tool box, which is the referral side, because the mentality you bring to the table when you are trying to generate referrals, everything about it, the language, the mindset, who you're speaking to, everything's different for marketing and prospecting. And it's that sales component that most people and you're right. It's kind of like Michael Gerber Zenith Revisited writing. It's that idea that I became. I became a productivity cook because I was really good at productivity, like people like they teach me how you do that. And then I got certified, and then I built a business on it. But I still have to figure out how to run a business right. I sought to figure out making sure that the sales component was a part of it. I don't ever tell somebody. Hey, you can implement any type over for all strategy and then never have to worry about having a website and never have to worry about ever go into another networking of it. I would never say that because I think you need a well rounded toolbox of the different things you have that will allow your business to grow in different ways. Same way with Nate, right? It's time here being interviewed by you on a podcast, right? That's part of a strategy for me in terms of being able to reach more people. I know the best type of people who roll into my business. We're gonna come by referrals, but others come in other ways as well. And so it's an important part to understand that people who no, they're really good at something. But then they have to go sell. They're always looking for the easy way to do that. And I always tell them, Hey, you've gotta have some marketing basic marketing. You really need to have some basic prospecting and then you need to have a referral plan in place that allows you to receive referrals from people you're going to ultimately take care off. But people are attracted to me, and I get this a lot, particularly from my, um, service business based businesses like my c. P. A. Is my attorneys, my business coaches, consultants, things like that. They come to me and they say, or like my interior designer's home voters, they come to me and they say it doesn't feel like selling. You still have to know how to close them if you receive that referral. So there is a part of the sales strategy that still exist in us. I teach a very specific way too close. They were for a prospect, but the idea here is is that they were attracted to me because it doesn't feel like sales. But I'm also want to be like, but you still need a website and you probably still need some type of marketing behind it, and you need to do some prospecting as well while we're building up your referral strategy. But ultimately, referrals do drop into your lap and they are the easiest types of prospects too close, and they're always yours to lose. But there's still a sales component to it, and you still have to be ableto cultivate and nurture relationships with those referral sources to get there. So it is true. I mean, a lot of people are definitely attracted to my methodology because it doesn't feel like sails. It doesn't feel like sales to be. It's great. But at the end of the day, there's still work to be done, and it still fits it to a larger sales strategy.

spk_0:   18:21
That's really good. A couple things that stood out one I really like that you knew that was the myth reference about cupcakes, and that's one for you. And,

spk_1:   18:29
well, you know, actually tell us a story about pies and you

spk_0:   18:32
just Yeah, but it's the same. It's the same like idea.

spk_1:   18:35
I wasn't gonna call you out.

spk_0:   18:36
I always forget, but it's the baking, baking,

spk_1:   18:40
baking. You're right. It's something we get to eat.

spk_0:   18:42
That's right. If the other listening and you have a list, read that book and you wanna be an entrepreneur that's on the top Five must read list for sure. A couple things that you said now just now distracted myself. A couple things that you said that released it out to me. The first Waas was really about having like this system for referrals. And I think back to early on in business. And I remember this like old school like paper based ask for referral type system. That was again my uncle used to do. He taught me a lot about business when I was a kid, and we don't do that anymore. We do get business from referrals. Our best clients usually come from referrals. But I'm sitting here internalizing, thinking. But we really don't as much as I push intentionality and like having a plan for things and executing against that plan consistently over time, after 20 years of business and being a multi $1,000,000 business, we still don't really have a consistent plan for referrals, and it makes me think, How much business are we missing? I'm having that in place, missing the best clients even as a result. So when you first start working with somebody and you're teaching them the system a five step system that you have, what is it? It's kind of like the big aha moment for them. They go. Oh, my gosh, I can't believe we haven't been doing this. What's the What's the biggest thing kind of stands out. The folks.

spk_1:   19:58
Yeah, it's typically step one So and I'm happy to break down those five steps. So you're on. It's kind of have an idea of how the system and the pieces kind of fit together. But I always told folks, Step one is the most important. It is also the one and most. We were like, you put the most amount of work up front like, aren't you supposed to ease us into the system? And I'm like, Here's the thing. I mean, I am. I'm okay with separating the men from the boys and I'm okay. Luciferase eating right, the women from the girls. The truth is, is that if you want to have referrals arrive in your business on a consistent basis, and let me just give a little examples of people understand, I'm talking about it's like for me taking on on hold marketing company that sells like that on holding that you listen to write when you're on hold to go with taking them from 40 referrals a year, pretty off. I'm pretty much on average and trying to get them to 80 referrals. That was our goal was to double him from 40 to 80 and in their first, like eight months, they had 187. So there's this idea behind, like So when I tell folks yet the most amount of work is upfront and about to explain it to, I want you to know what it looks like if you can get past this most amount of work, right or it's and you know that's for a larger company that had capacity and team members and things. But it's like looking at the cellar pra newer attorney. That's like, Hey, we get two or three referrals a year and in two years getting them to 40 referrals a year. So that's what. So when I say yeah, here comes some work. I just want to put it in context. If the reward is there, the results are on the back and they're there. But here's the work that very first I want to make a disclaimer. First. I'm assuming you do great work. I'm assuming that you have what I call a sticky client experience and that you are worthy of referrals because the work you do speaks for itself, and people would want to talk about their not embarrassed right to tell somebody else about you. So that's an assumption I'm going to make when you start into my system. But that's not your reality. We have some other work to do before we can really start getting you referrals because I believe and everybody deserves referrals, you're just not owed them. So because we're not owed them, we actually have to be willing to do a little bit of work. So Step one, it's actually identifying who your referral sources are. And that's a really important piece that most people would prefer to skip because it means they actually have to go back and pull the data to know who was actually been referring them nine times out of 10. When somebody goes back through, pulls the data of where their clients came from and then looks for those clients that were sent by referral sources and then can identify the first and last name of each of those referral sources, two things typically happen when you're looking at that list. They're surprised by who is not on it because we use a lot of anecdotal evidence in our life to make ourselves feel good about the decisions that we make right. So they feel like, Hey, spend a ton of time with Tommy And he's definitely referring. May we talk business all the time, he mentions. He's talking about me. He mentions. He prefers me, and then you pull the list of clients. You're like, Wow, not one single one has actually come from Tommy, but wow, and the other thing areas is so it's who's not on the list, the other surprises. Who is on the list that they've probably been ignoring? And so then they look at that, listen like, Oh my gosh, Tommy's not sending us anybody And I spent like, every week right, grabbing a beer with him after work and the whole isn't here. Sally, over here, who's like consistently giving you referrals every year. And it's not that you don't think Sally right? And it's not that you don't appreciate Sally, but you're not paying attention. You're not paying attention. So what is it that Sally's not sending you right that you could be leveraging? So there's always this concept that people have to understand is that when I tell people how to take care of their referral sources, I don't teach the how until you've identified the who. So who are you? A referral sources. The easiest way to do this is to go through your list of clients. Now, if you have a list of prospects that did not become clients, I want you to pull that list to A lot of people. Don't have it if they don't have some type of Sierra Ram client relationship management tool or some type of database. But if you can pull at least your clients that were and all your clients go back, depending on how many years you've been in business, go back three years at least for I would prefer I prefer more. But I got somebody who worked with They went back to 1998 was like, What, too far right? So you've fooled all that, Dad. And of course, he had a database. He was like, I just pushed a button right and like, thank you, because so many people don't I mean, I work with a lot of multi $1,000,000 business, isn't it? How do you not track this information, so it's really important. And it here's the thing. And if you just felt like I judged you, that wasn't my intention. If you don't track this information now, you know. So start right. Like start tracking your data. You should know in a prospect, roles in the door where they came from. And it's not just that you met them at a networking event or someone on your team that met them at a networking event. It's which networking event did you meet them up? It's not that just someone rolled in do a Google ad. Hopefully, it's which Google or Facebook at they will throw it right. It's not that so. Once it was, just refer to its who referred them to you. So captured the detail of the source as well. One. To have all your client's three years. Let's just say for sake of argument, three years and that of your clients you've gone through, you identify where they cut where they have come from. You're just looking for the clients that were referred to you, and then you have the name of the referral source for each client. They referred, and then you start paying attention. Why? Who sends me one a year, right, who send me once five years ago and never again have never received another referral. Who sends me two or three or 10 or 12 every year. So in some cases you may have levels. And because you'll have people who send you more consistent referrals and others, lots of business owners won't in the beginning. I That's one of the things that I teach people asses. As you start receiving more referrals, you need to start different jiating how you treat your referral sources. And so it's one of those things is like We just need to start with the who who's been referring you in the past. If you go through this exercise and you're like, Okay, nobody refers May it's not the end of the world, right? I wouldn't tell you to continue line with steps two through five. What I would tell you to do is you need to back up and you need to start turning people into a referral sources. And of course I have a way that I teach that. But what it really comes down to is find the people that you think should be referring you and then go take care of them. They'll do something for them, nurtured that relationship with them and make it about them and be consistent. And that just one time I'm like, OK, where is my referral? Because, remember, I'm teaching you not to ask. So it's a little bit of a slow burn in the beginning, but the relationship that has created is very authentic. And so it has sustainability toe last, and that's really important. But back to the people who are gonna go through their list of clients and identify their referral sources, that's step one. Here is my guarantee promised to you if you go through that step and you do it correctly. And I outlined exactly how to do this stuff, actually, in Chapter eight of my book generating business referrals without asking so you could go back and go right to that information. Most people like Wait, that's a module in your paid program. But yet you give it away in your book, and I always say, Yes, because I know if you won't get past that step, you're not going any further anyway. So what does it matter. So if you can identify who your referral sources are, I also know it's gonna motivate you. It's gonna motivate you to be like, Wait a minute. There is gold here. This is my list of gold, right? And there was gold here that I can actually take care of these people better in a very specific way and use very specific language and get more referrals. And that's going to be a great way to continue to grow your business. And so once we know who our referral sources are, you never have to do this step again. So that's my promise. Goes to the work. Pull out the data. If you don't have the dad, you're gonna walk down memory lane. You're gonna write this, that you can apply the list your clients and try to remember. I try to remember Excuse me where you heard from them. Maybe you're gonna go back into a paper files or digital files. Maybe we'll email them and ask him. Hey, do you remember how you heard about me? Maybe you'll find an email thread that will mention it in the very beginning. Calendar knit. Something to try to compile where these people heard about you and then from there. Once we know who has been referring you, now we know what we're about to build because we know who we're gonna build it for. So that's effectively step one.

spk_0:   27:40
That's really good. I want to reiterate something that's really important that you talked about there, which was feelings versus data, and I think I actually had this happen to us. Not that long. Goes a few years ago had two guys on my team who did a lot of networking and did some sales work and kind of about relationships, and they were heavily involved in a local network and group. Each of them were in separate groups, and all three of us said we felt like it was worth the time that we felt like it was. There was a lot of activity there, a lot of relationships, a lot of positive anecdotal evidence. But then we pulled up our system or retract sales and leads, which was pipe drive at the time. Now he's hub spot, but we pulled it might drive, we pulled up the list, we sorted it by most valuable clients and we looked at the top 25 clients for the past year, and only one of them came from all of this work that both of them were investing over this time period. And we both just sat there and looked at the screen like, Oh, my God, what in the world were spending so much time on this? And yet they were like, Well, these things right here came from these communities that were involved with him, were hardly doing anything in there like and so that is so, so important. So I would like just double down and put three explanation points on the end of it is you have tohave the date and if you don't have the day to start collecting it, I was just telling our team this morning we were working on some profitability stuff for projects and three or four, we've been missing for 20 years, and three or four years ago I had none of this data. None of it. Now I have three solid years of data. Well, I can make really good decisions now because I know exactly what the truth is, not how we feel about it. And the other thing that makes me think about everything that you're talking about right now is you are the biggest thing people have a pain with. With business is running out of time like you here. I'm enough time of the day. I just need more hours. But that is Warren Buffett and jump Bezos and previously, Steve Jobs and everybody else in the world. We all get the same 24 hours. But we're wasting so much time. And what I love about a system like yours is it sounds like the idea behind it. Just go. Okay, let's focus on the things that actually are working, and and that's kind of what you're doing. So that was Step one step one is Know who your you should be targeting who's actually produced results. Let's go find those people in the book. You have some real practical ideas about that. I'm time to go through all five steps because people can go get the book. But let's close Number two and just give us a little bit teaser of what's next.

spk_1:   30:07
Perfect What? Most people when they hear me talk about step two, they're like, uh, why is this step to it? feels like you just forced in there. It doesn't really fit. But when I always so, folks a step two is it? Here's the thing. I believe that if you have the ability to identify who your referral sources are, and then you do step three and step four, which is built on a plan of how you're gonna take care of them and then use the right referral seeds language to generate referrals. It all comes from a place authenticity of you actually caring about these people who send you business. If you were dead inside and you don't care, I've held the people who send your business. My process isn't going to work. So Step two is here because it's almost a reminder to you that you are needing to show gratitude and gratefulness for what you are receiving. So Step Two is actually writing a handwritten thank you know, every single time you receive a referral like every single time. And so most people are like, Well, I sent the text to recent an email and I'm like, Who cares? It took you 12 seconds. I need you to spend 32 seconds. Well, I don't know art and write a hand written note, and it's not about what you write, though there is in the book, I give exactly what your thank you card should say. It's not necessarily, though, about what you write. It's also about how that card makes them feel. And if you were in the habit of knowing who your referral sources are, and then properly the way your mama taught, you write properly, thanking them when they send you a referral with a handwritten thank you note. Then you're in a space for everything else to make sense that I'm going to teach of understanding that you ultimately we are after more referrals, and ultimately I do want you to get it from 40 referrals to 187 or whatever your number is. I want you to hit your referral. Explosion is a calculation. We do my program, but I want you to hit that number. But I want you to do it from a place of understanding that these people make your life easier, and so I'm about to teach you how to make sure you take care of them. But it starts with some basic politeness, which is when you receive a referral, make sure you have an immediate follow up process to send a handwritten thank you note. And don't you dare delegate that handwritten thank you note to someone on your team. You are capable of writing a thank you. No, I don't care if they address it and let the omelet for you. Put the stamp on it, but you were going to write this note, and it's really, really important that that comes to replace of gratitude. That's what makes this whole process and system work, because when you do step three and four and you start taking care of me as I'm referring you, I I start feeling it. It starts building gratitude. I feel like Oh my God, J really does care about me. And it's not just what the business I'm sending him, it's a key. Actually cares because he's taking time to invest in me. Yes, there's a whole process behind it was step 34 and five. But Step two is getting your intention straight in your own mind and in your own heart that you are thankful for these people. And they, at least Adam minimum deserve a handwritten thank you note to get more from them. They're gonna need more than that.

spk_0:   32:50
I can't

spk_1:   32:50
have a referral explosion with thank you notes, but it does have to start with that.

spk_0:   32:54
Yeah, I think that's so important because it's so easy to in our digital world. So just take the easy path and to feel like, Well, it's like you said a Senate text. I sent an email, I whatever. I said, I'm a Facebook message or D m And there is something so powerful now when people are not doing these things to have something tactile, a physical thing that you write on and send them in the mail they get has so much more impact because you think about how many e mails and text messages do we get in a day that we're like, uh, delete, delete, delete, delete, delete and take six cans. Quick, quick process. Some of us have be able to check your e mails for us. You know, all that kind of stuff. We don't even see it if it's something super basic. But if it's a letter, that is my name on it, it's gonna come to my desk and I'm gonna open that letter and I'm gonna read it. And there is really impact there. I think as simple as something like that sounds the question that was asked, people, What are you doing? It?

spk_1:   33:49
And they're not

spk_0:   33:51
right. I don't do it occasionally, but I don't do it in all the time. Okay, I know, I know, I know. But that's just really that's the real truth, you know, like I do it occasionally, but I need to have an intentional system behind it. What happens all the time? That's what you're talking about is have a system that is consistent works every single time.

spk_1:   34:09
Yes, absolutely. And it's just, you know, we use a lot of ifs, then rules in my business. So, like, my assistant knows that if I receive a referral and I ford it to her, she knows instantly what to do. It goes on the masters in the database just to be tracked. Then she responds back to me and she sends the referral sources address. So it is so simple. And I can't have an excuse for not sending a thank you note when that e mail comes back to me. and it's got the the address in there. It's like, Okay, just print it out, leave it sitting on my desk and I don't like clutter. So if it's sitting on my desk, I will do whatever it takes to get it off my desk, which so I will use myself against. All right, I'm definitely using What's that? You know what my interesting parts are about myself against myself, right? So that I could make the habit happen and get that, thank you know, in the mail and out the door. So, yeah, I mean, it's just it's all about craziness. There's, like, these little port little points that you can create systems around that makes something happen that we years I don't spend any time on. And we definitely definitely should. So there, to your point, there is a Step three step for Step five. It's all in the books, and people could go grab it, generating business, work girls without asking. But I really do think those 1st 2 steps of those two resonated with you, and that felt good. Then you're probably gonna like the rest of what you read, because it's all about taking care of your referral sources. The people who are growing your business, the wider world. Wouldn't you want to take care of them?

spk_0:   35:24
Yeah, I think the reality is most of us most business owners do not have a clear system for this. I mean, I don't And I have been doing this stuff since I was a kid. So the fact that I don't like man, this feels really convicting. And I imagine a lot of people are thinking the same thing at the state of your intention. Reminds us to make anybody feel bad, just listening, ballistic, kind of light a spark and go back to what you're talking about. Really? I think this is really important. I want to say it. I won't say it again. You talked about like, if you really care for people like this will work. And I think that's so important because I was talking about that as relates to sales is people don't like the idea of sales, usually because they've had an encounter with a bad sales person. And and I think that if you have a product or service that you really honestly believe and you know it was gonna help that other person overcome. Whatever the problem is that you're helping them solve your almost morally obligated to sell them into it because it's gonna be in their best interest. And the difference between persuasion and manipulation is I'm persuading you to buy something that I know is in your best interest. That's good, cause it's for you. If I'm manipulating you in front of conventional bustling, it's not in your best interest, and that's bad. I think a lot of I've had that experience and what you're talking about. You miss this a few times. I want to hear what you mean by this. You talked about referral. See, that language took a bit more about like that. What do you mean by seed language?

spk_1:   36:47
Yes, so that actually comes up and step for. So I'm like, just back up. So I'll talk a little about Step three and step for kind of together because they really go together. But to your point, you mentioned something about having a system for this, and that's actually what Step five. It's like what I teach was Step five is is how do we take this? This thing we just built it's called a referral generating plan. But how do we take this referral plan we just built and then make sure we actually execute on it and make sure that we systematize it. We call it, process it, sizing it inside my program. I don't know if that's a word. I just like saying it. So I made it a word. There was actually a chapter in my second book coming out as, like, Process It. Sizing is in the title and, like I'm one of the publisher, will let me keep that. But so from that perspective, so there is a system behind this so that it's It's not a cookie cutter approach, and it's not having everybody else do everything for you. But there is a way to delegate and to outsource and to make sure this becomes part of your workflow. So there is a system behind it, cause I know we need that is busy business owners to get anything done so that does exist. But step three and step for really the meat, potatoes and the secret sauce. So Step three is like okay, you know who these people are. You know how to thank them properly when they send you a referral. What do you do in between receiving referrals from them? That you can start taking care of them to cultivate more referrals from them. And so Step three is really looking at Cam. I'm gonna take care of my referral sources for an entire year. So we build our plans out. Kind of like a one year process, but we've repeated every year you can change things up, but you really build it for that one year because this isn't a one hit wonder, right? This is not like I'm gonna do one thing and the referrals are gonna roll. And I never have to do anything. Get there like this is a consistently nurturing a relationship. So we call it outreach or touch points. When I teach it, we got touch points. But it's this way that we're gonna take care of our referral sources and once we know who they are, makes a whole lot more sense to figure out what is unique about them or unique about us that we want to highlight. What are these touchpoints look like? And then Step four is actually the language that we use that allows us to plant referral. See, it's when we're sending that handwritten thank you note from step to or any of the outreach or touch points we're gonna d'oh within step three. And so it really the language that we use is really based on what we're doing. But I'll give an example cause I think this will help your listeners a lot. Let me just go ahead. It's in the book to you can get it if they don't capture through, you know, cutting the grass right now or something you're listening to this are shoveling snow. But from the perspective of the easiest language, I can give you two come to show you how this works is what you should be riding in that hand written Thank you note. When someone sends you a referral again, you don't just write notes and get a whole bunch of referrals. That's not how it works. You have to fit and step three and step for, and you have to create a process with it was step five, but in that handwritten thank you note, the number one thing you need to be doing is you need to be thanking by name. What? So instead of just saying, Hey, thanks for the referral. You need to say, Hey, J thanks so much for referring Stacy Randall. Jimmy, Right. Thank you so much. So put my name in there. So the k J Thanks for hurrying Stacy Ground Randall, I remind you what you did and who you did it for. That is very that use of the word referral is obviously one of the easiest ways to plan a referral. Stayed. There are indirect ways to do it, so we don't could. You can't overdo this. And then it becomes very obvious what your intentions are. And it's not often dicker genuine anymore. So But it's like, Hey, Jay, thank you so much for referring Stacy Brown Randall. To me, it's an honor and a pleasure to help the people you know and care about. I could do anything to help you. Please let me know. That's three simple sentences you may have to hit. Rewind on this to hear me say it. But that was three simple sentences that goes into a thank you know, but to your point, when I received that note and I read it I realized Oh, yeah, that is what I did. I didn't refer her to him, right or whatever the situation is, and then I usually keep it. And if it goes up on the border, it goes into a box. Then when it gets moved again, it gets reread. And so it's there, continuously being able to play those referral states. But it's just thinking the person for exactly who they refer to you, which is why you have to track who these people are. You have to track the referral source, and you have to track the client. They refer. But that's just language in one place. There are so many other places we plant referral seeds. I mean, we plant them during the buyers journey, we can plant them, and any note that we're going to write any outreach we're going to do is part of our one year plan of how we're gonna take care of our referral sources week. I mean, we can plant them with soon to be referral sources. People were trying to turn into a referral sources. There were lots of opportunities to use were for all season to plant that language. What I teach my students is once you kind of know the formula, Then you kind of just know how to use it. That's gonna work for you. There's just some basic needs to understand what kind of how it works. And then it's like, Oh, I get this. I know exactly what I'm supposed to do here, and as long as your intentions were true, that's when the system starts to work.

spk_0:   41:24
That's really helpful. I think that having those like very specific guidelines and I'm not going to get a copy of the book, I think that those five steps make it so clear to know, here's what I need to do. Let me just follow this system. There's no point me trying to reinvent how this thing works. I could just copy ah, program that you already have put together. But in some of those, there might be nuances with regards to how I language like you might have a here side of right thinking it, but I might have just a few things to make it sound like me always tell us, ignore the system but have a system, and what I mean by that is basically just because you do something in a specific way or I do something a specific way, let me. They have to exactly do that. But do that unless you know you have a better way. And I know from you right now I don't have a specific way to do this so I could just follow your way. And then if I need to adjust along the way, I will. So

spk_1:   42:08
I say that I always tell people like I write a certain way. I write very gender neutral and very like where it would be normal, uncomfortable. But it has to sound like you, So change it if it doesn't sound like you,

spk_0:   42:17
so we're almost out of time. But I want to shift gears just a little bit because I always ask this question every single podcast guest, because it's really important to me. It's about work. Life, balance Now don't like that word usage. You only believe that's what it is, but I want to hear one. What do you even like believe about the idea of work, life balance and too, like you got more going on than just your work. So how have you over time learn to go. Hey, let me put all these things in the places where I need them to be. So I'm not destroying one thing at the cost of another. What is work life balance mean to you?

spk_1:   42:50
Yes, I hate that term as well. I think it's even more and justice coming from a female perspective. I think it's even harder, Um, a few mil perspective because of expectations that we have. But I'm a wife and I want to stay married forever. And we have three kids, two or biological, and one is our nephew that four years ago we took custody off. So we have three kids. My husband works. He's owned his own business for a number of years, so there were moving in a lot of different directions. We've got to middle school boys and a daughter in elementary school, and there's a lot of moving pieces and parts, and somehow I have let my family talk me into a puppy this year, time totally regretting even how cute she is, totally regretting. So I think for me, what I've learned is there's a couple of things that I always kind of live by. and I had to learn that over time, but want to shrink the container. And so for me when I shrink the container, I don't allow myself to say I can do that later because later becomes in the evening when I should be with my family on the weekends when I should be relaxing. We're spending time with my friends and family. And so I tried to say, like there isn't a later it's drink the container. I try to get my most productive work done when I need to. Between the hours of dropping my Children off at school and picking my daughter up because my boys come on about an hour and 10 minutes later. But like from that idea is like really being focused on what is my most important thing and not allowing myself to say I can do it later because the minute you say later, you have literally just increased the container of places in time in which you will do work. And if you shrink the container and say no, gotta be done by four. Nope, gotta be done by 2 30 Whatever it is, it forces you to just move a little quicker and be a little bit more intentional about what you're choosing to work on. I am not perfect at it. There are lots of times I work nights and weekends when I wish I didn't. But I am definitely much better than I used to be.

spk_0:   44:31
Yeah, I think that's really good. I have, ah, ton of little ones. I have five kids. My two youngest are actually adopted and we do not have a puppy. I have not been talked into that foolishness yet, although they have tried many, many times and even my wife is slightly on board on my what? What I thinking like There's no way we can handle this right now, but I love that idea of shrinking the container. I think that's a great way to put that in perspective. But none of these are the boundaries that I'm gonna put on this thing because otherwise when you run your own business, especially when you love what you do like I love the work that I do, I could work all day long, 18 hours a day. I would be fine, like I would enjoy that. But I also have other responsibilities number one other people actually love and care about. And so, like, for me, one of the kind of guiding principles is basically eat dinner with my family like that's That's like a thing. And so what that means doesn't mean I always do it almost. I'm not with the people that really believes in always and never. It's usually somewhere in between. But for me, it's a guiding principle to go. Hey, if I'm going to miss dinner because of travel or because of a client dinner or something else, is it really worth it? Like, is it really worth it? I have to ask those questions, and what you've done with that idea of shrinking the container is just that which is No, no, Here's the time I have available on. What I often find interesting is when we have those constraints, even if they're artificial, constraints are brains somehow managed to get a lot more done in some of those time periods. And if we go well, I've got all day and all day because you like, I'm not that anything, you know?

spk_1:   45:58
Yeah, that's so so very true.

spk_0:   46:01
All right, so we're gonna wrap up. I want to hear if you had to think about talking to us. New business owner They've been in business less than five years or trying to make it work, trying to build a business that lasts. What is that guiding principle that you want to leave them with? Just say, Hey, if you want a last in business, think about these things.

spk_1:   46:19
Oh, my gosh, I need a whole episode.

spk_0:   46:21
I know, I know

spk_1:   46:22
to talk about all the things, all the things. You know what? One of the things that I learned some three significant lessons with my business, my first business failed and that I put into practice for making this business so much more successful. And we talked about one of them, which is my concept around referrals about asking, because that's how I figured out how to touch business development every day. That was the lesson learned, and what that looked like for me was creating a system generate referrals, cause that fit who I am and going to do that without asking. But the other one of the other really important lessons that I learned was protecting your mindset. Unfortunately, no matter if you come from a family of entrepreneurs like I do, and so they get it. When you decide to go out on your own, there will always be the naysayers. So always be even some well intentioned meaning people who say things to you. And if you allow those things to take root in your mind set when you're trying to go to business or grow it to the next level, that will not be helpful. And you have to protect your minds that you have to get back to reminding yourself continuously and constantly. Why in the heck you decided to get on this entrepreneur a rollercoaster, knowing that eventually the ride will not be so up and down and it will level out and you will master it and you can control it. But you have to protect your mindset because they were gonna be people in your life. It even the people who love you the most that maybe just don't get it. And when things get hard like Ossie, I told you, you should just say that, you know, safe W two that was probably gonna lay. You often hear to anyway, right or whatever like or that you felt dead in protect your minds that figure out what that means for you, whether that's who you listen to, whether that's but how you spend time with God, whether that's meditating, whether that's the podcast, you listen to the music you allowed and infiltrate your brain. But turn on the tape. Yeah, because I'm a child of the eighties and we'd listen to tapes back then, right? Turn on a tape that plays the right message that remind you why you're doing what you're doing, regardless of how hard it is. A regardless of who doesn't understand.

spk_0:   48:12
I love that it made me think about. Actually, there's, ah, one of my old favorite speakers, the guy named Zig Ziglar I'm sure you're familiar with. He used to say this, he'd say, You know, people always tell me, Actually, send the Southern trusting. People always tell me that when they feel kind of down, they put in one of my tapes that makes him feel better. And I always said, I don't know why you wait until you're down to put in one of my tapes. You don't wait into your car's out of gas to put gas in it and like, well, every now and then that might happen. But But that's it's like such a great principle. That's basically what you're saying is like What we put in here has so much impact, and I think that what I've had to learn to is not even just what we put in. But what we say to ourselves is a record that gets played over and over and over again. And those words have riel impact in our lives. So thanks for that, I think that's wise counsel for everybody. So if you want to find Maura about you and find you online and find your book, where can they do that?

spk_1:   49:03
Absolutely Summer home basis? Stacy Brown Randall dot com Stacy is spelled with an E. M. Sure, you'll put it in the show notes, but Stacy Brown Randall dot com is the home base on there. You can find lots of information, but my book is available wherever books are sold. It's called Generating Business Referrals without asking, and that is my first book book number two will be out, probably fall of 2020 and that's gonna be on sticky client experiences and how to build those, even as a small business owner. So any of those resources are available on my website. You can find my book as well. And there's lots of downloads and quizzes you can take to figure out how good you are at generating referrals. Lots of information there.

spk_0:   49:39
Awesome. I think this episode is gonna be really helpful for people. I think the book is gonna be really helpful. I'm gonna go buy my copy right now. Generating business referrals without asking by Stacy Brown Randall Stacey, thank you so much for being on the show today. I really helped me, and I believe you're gonna help a lot of folks listen to this podcast.

spk_1:   49:56
Thank you, J, for having

spk_0:   49:57
me. I hope this episode has given you some ideas or inspiration. It will help you grow your business if you found it helpful, and you know somebody else who might benefit from it as well. I would greatly appreciate it if you would take the time to share this with him. Maybe on Facebook or Twitter or linked in, or even shooting e mail over to a friend with a link to this podcast in it. And if you haven't already, make sure you sign up for email list at building a business that lasts dot com