ATE-Understanding Debt with Russell Nova and Alana Murphy

Learn how debt can be understood, not feared, and how to acquire properties with Russell Nova and Alana Murphy.

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Russell Nova
Russell Nova is the Managing Partner in Stone Street Multifamily Group, a privtely held, real estate investment company. Russell has been investing primarily in Multifamily properties for over 5 years. Russell Nova is also a Principal at The Cornerstone Group, which is an active Debt Advisory firm with over 1B+ in secured financing on Commercial and Multifamily portfolios. The Cornerstone Group is located in New York with offices in Miami. Today, Russell owns and operates 575 Doors with $50MM AUM from a GP/KP perspexctive and 925 Dors from a LP perspective. Russell is an avid investor in Multifamily and personally invests in every property that he puts under contract.
Visit his website https://www.stonestreetmfgroup.com/
Invest with him on his upcoming deal https://stonestreet.invportal.com/login

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Alana Murphy
I am an engineer who has worked for some of the largest defense firms. Currently an Engineering  Executive. I house hacked a 3 family in Boston in 2002 before house hacking was the cool name! I’ve since acquired one more 3 family and another duplex and was an active landlord prior to leaving Boston for Dallas 3 years ago.
Connect with her on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/adtyler/

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Your host, Brian Briscoe, is a co-founder and principal in the real estate investing firm Four Oaks Capital.  He and his team currently have 629 units worth $36 million in assets under management and are continuing to grow.  He will retire as a Lieutenant Colonel in the United States Marine Corps in 2021. Learn more about him and the Four Oaks team at www.fouroakscapital.com  or contact him at brianbriscoe@fouroakscapital.com - be sure to let him know where you found him.

Connect with him on LinkedIn or Facebook.

Transcript

Brian Briscoe: 0:00

That said, Alanna, we've got Russell on the line. What do you want to ask him?

Alanna Murphy: 0:03

What are your thoughts on hard money loans? So buying it for hard money and then refinance?

Russell Nova: 0:09

Oh, that's a very good question. I'm gonna answer that very simply right? Debt is not to be feared debt is to be understood, right. So if you understand that kind of debt that you're getting, you're going to thrive. I'm all for bridge and hard money. I don't like to use the word hard money because there are many bridge options that you can get a five and a half to like a six and a half percent rate. So I would say go for it. I would say if you have an opportunity to go so but you're limited on the amount of cash. I would say go for the bridge product, right understand what you're getting, understand what type of loan you have in front of you, and purchase that property.

Brian Briscoe: 0:53

Welcome to the diary of an apartment investor podcast with your host Brian Briscoe. In this podcast we bring some of the top professionals in the apartment investment field to discuss various aspects of the apartment investing journey with the sole purpose of educating listeners to make wise investment decisions. The Diary of an apartment investor podcast is sponsored by four oaks capital bringing you high yield returns through apartment complex investing. Welcome to the diary of an apartment investor podcast. I'm your host, Brian Briscoe with four oaks capital. Very excited for today's show. We got another Ask the Expert episode for you. We got two amazing people on the line with us. We have our experienced investor Russell Nova. And we got lon and Murphy in the aspiring investor role today. So Russell, you're up first. So you know, welcome to the show.

Russell Nova: 1:38

Appreciate Thank you very much for having me, Brian. I appreciate thanks so much.

Brian Briscoe: 1:41

Yeah, awesome. So first of all, great meeting you and see was Orlando a couple weeks ago, right? Yes, yeah. Yeah. So all these conferences are awesome. Good to meet people. Great to meet you. And that said, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself?

Russell Nova: 1:58

Okay, sure. So my name is Russell Nova. I'm I have two roles, actually. So I am a principal at Cornerstone capital. We're a debt advisory firm, where we specialize in financing multifamily properties, you know, commercial mixed use industrial healthcare. And my second role is that I'm a managing partner at Stone Shri multifamily Group. We're a real estate investment firm, where we purchase value add and cash flow properties. We've been doing now for about four for about four years now. So aggressively, I'd like to say, and, you know, that's just me. And that's my, you know, that's my day to day I have I have two jobs that take tons of my time. And I'm very happy and fortunate for that. And it was, it was great to meet you at the event as

Brian Briscoe: 2:45

well. Yeah. So So one question Which came first, were you in the capital job first, or in the, the the acquisition role?

Russell Nova: 2:54

It was actually the capital role I've been on. I've been doing financing for the last 10 years now. Okay, on we started with the residential prior to 2008, we were doing primarily only residential properties. Then, after 2008, when, when we had the meltdown, we decided to just go ahead and just merge out into the commercial world. So effectively, ever since 2009, I would say we, you know, we've been doing on the commercial route. So I have been financing, and I've been in this space for a very long time. So I'm familiar with so many different aspects of multifamily. So, you know, definitely on the residential and the commercial side of the capital market side.

Brian Briscoe: 3:36

So, So what made you decide to switch, you know, move from the capital market side funding the the properties to actually being on the ownership side?

Russell Nova: 3:46

So it actually, so, we've been doing financing for, let's say, for last 10 years now, right? And four years ago, something triggered in writing, saying, Hey, listen, I'm helping on all of these sponsors. I'm helping all of these operators acquire these properties. Now. I'm there. I know the aspects of it. I know how to underwrite I don't want to analysts, I know how to analyze. I know how to do all the due diligence. And at some point, I said, Hey, why don't we switch? Or why don't we try to get involved on the owner operator side. And four years ago, in September, we went on and we purchased our first property, which was a 33 unit in Miami, Florida. And we never looked back. It was something natural, it was something that came together because of the relationship that we have. And that we built over time. It just felt good. It just felt like this was the right move. And, and ever since then, I've always been learning and kind of just going and speaking to other people and just having, you know, mentors come to me and I come to them and just having those, you know, those kinds of conversations.

Brian Briscoe: 4:50

Nice, nice and being in a related market. I mean, you mentioned it was a pretty smooth transition. I mean, just just just tell us what it took to To go from one side of the fence to the other.

Russell Nova: 5:03

So it's a good thing that I do have a very good support system here, right? So at Cornerstone capital, I have an entire team that really handles the debt side. Now, I haven't taken a step back from from Cornerstone capital, I do have a great part of that handles that but on stone street side, you know, just going and leaping over kind of made sense, because of all the financing that we're able to do. Right. So your biggest partner in this business is your capital partner, right? That is one of your biggest partners. So if you have done in line, you can really learn and get all and just get familiarized with what it takes to, you know, running a property from asset management, property management, and all these other things.

Brian Briscoe: 5:45

Yeah, I think that that understanding, or that lack of understanding, you know, several years ago, kind of impeded me in a way and I'll say why, I mean, most brokers know what it takes to get a commercial loan. And and when I first started calling brokers, I had no idea what it took to get a commercial loan. And brokers are smart, they try to weed out people who who aren't aren't ready for that commercial loan step, right. So you have to have your your key principal, your loan, guarantor, if you've never done it before, you have to have your net worth, you have to have, you know, liquidity and a bunch of other things in place before you can get that loan. And I would say, for me not having that understanding, definitely set me back. Whereas, you know, you were able to, you know, really quickly make that transition. So in a way, I kind of wish that I was in a related field to multifamily, you know, for, you know, 10 or 15 years prior to making the switch myself, but yeah, it is what it is. But so talk about, tell us about one of the properties you guys have done, you know, pick your first pick your favorite, but give us an idea of the type of properties that you guys do.

Russell Nova: 6:51

So, um, that's a good question. So one of the properties, let's just, I'll just throw it out there. You know, we've been doing a lot of business in the, in the Texas market, right, because that's where everyone is kind of fluctuating towards. So in 2019, and 2020, we've been buying properties in the Texas market, right? The properties are great. It was it was still saturated, but not as much as it is now. So we co sponsored a deal. It was 240 units in, in Houston, Texas. That was a very, very good one, only because the cashflow and the capex project was was really, really good. And we saw the value right away. We also purchased 104 doors at in Lubbock, Texas. So that's something that we actually purchased during Corona, which was the mecca of Corona. And obviously, because of our relationships with our banks, we're able to really get financing, even during those times. It does help to make sure you have a good sponsor, you have you have the net worth and liquidity as well. Let's see some other great deals that we've done. We've done a we get 109 units in Augusta, Georgia, which was which was really good, which we're planning on exiting in January. So that's pretty good. And we have a couple of deals under our belt as well. But you know, you know, since you asked what was what was my favorite type of deal, I'd like to say that a good deal was, was the Lubbock deal only because it is a tertiary market. And not many people want to jump into that. Because also the banking situation, they may not like it because it's a smaller market. But we see value in that. And that's really the way that I work.

Brian Briscoe: 8:35

You know, a lot of a lot of the bigger players now are actually moving to tertiary markets. And if you got in a couple of years ago to places like blood, like, I'm here in Lubbock more and more frequently, you know, today than I did two years ago, you know, so, you know, Neil, Neil bala, You know, came on the podcast and talked about the Tertiaries are going to be the next next big wave. So and I happen to live in a tertiary market myself, so I can see the growth that you know, some of these Tertiaries are getting and I think it's I think it's a smart play for lots of reasons and viewing negative to it, I think you just mentioned is a lot of times lenders aren't as comfortable in tertiary markets as they are in primary markets. So you can you have more opportunities for growth, I think here just your your debt, you gotta be a little more careful planning for your debt.

Russell Nova: 9:22

Absolutely. I mean, you have to get creative when you get into the into on tertiary markets. But at the end of the day, if there was a way there's a will, there's a tremendous amount of capital out there right now. And if you position yourself correctly, and with the right people, there's always a way of you getting the financing.

Brian Briscoe: 9:40

Yeah, I think that's absolutely true. You know, you know, that people say, you know, if you have a good deal, the money will come and you know, debatable how true that is. But, you know, if you're persistent and you have a really good network, I think that's more and more true, you know, so that the better the more persistent You are and the better you have better develop your network is, you know, I think that that statement tends to ring more true. But yeah, I remember talking about that Augusta property, you know, briefly in Orlando cuz we've got, we've got an Augusta property and one that we should be closing on soon. So lots of lots of good stuff there. And I was I was very happy, you know, when you said what your exit price was going to be because our basis is a lot lower than what you think your, your what your exit price is going to be. So, but yeah, knock on wood, you know, and I wish you guys wish you guys the best selling that thing. But it's a Alright, so that said something, something I'd like to ask everybody and it's kind of peering inside, you know, your, your heart and soul here, you know, what is your motivation? What is your big burning? Why, for doing all of this?

Russell Nova: 10:51

Well, I gotta say, I'm generally a motivated individual, right? It's, it's more or less when I wake up in the morning, right? And I, I don't want to sound cliche, but I have a switch that goes over my head, right? As soon as I wake up in the morning, it's more or less, hey, it's time to get to work. It's time to do a lot of great things. I even you know, I have conversations with my girlfriend, she's like, Hey, you never have an off switch. It's even harder for me to until to relax on the weekends as well, because there's so much going on. There's you know, there's stuff on the financing stuff. There's deals that are happening right now that were best and final. So I'm generally a motivated individual. Because I've been in this business, I see the potential, I see the future, right. And it's really about just just getting out there and continuously making the connections that you're making. Right? So I'm all about that. Just, it's just who I am. I don't think I need other people or anybody else to tell me, Hey, I need you to do this. I need you to do that. I'm there already. So that's just who I am.

Brian Briscoe: 11:51

Nice. Nice. I love it. You know, I wish I'm similar in a lot of ways. But you know, I wish my internal drive you know, it was a little higher gear a lot of days. But you know, I appreciate that. And so last question for you. Before we bring on Elana, what's next for you?

Russell Nova: 12:11

The question. So, we have, we have a couple of things that are in the pipe right now we were closing on a 92 unit. And so next week, we're closing the 92 units in Jacksonville, Florida. We have a live offering right now in Tallahassee, which is 136 units that is steered to close in December. And we're best and final for two other properties in 2022, one Orlando and one in Atlanta. So we're already cooking, and we're already strategizing for what we're gonna do for the following year.

Brian Briscoe: 12:45

So So you guys are hot and heavy on the southeast. It sounds like you know, two in Florida, three in Florida, one in Atlanta that you guys are looking at, to to contract ready to close and to hopefully new acquisitions.

Russell Nova: 12:57

Absolutely. So that's our business plan. And that's our model going forward, we're gonna stay in the southeast, we're gonna only concentrate on the Florida and the Georgia markets for 2022. I can't say if I'm not presented with a great offer, you know, somewhere outside of those two states, I wouldn't jump in. But my main focus is somewhere where I can serve as debt. If I need to get on a plane, and I have to get it within an hour, an hour and a half time. I'm there. So you know, that's where it is. And that's where our heavy focus is going to be for 2020. Till. Yep,

Brian Briscoe: 13:26

I think that's smart Bo being being responsive to the brokers on one side of the fence into your property managers and asset management. Being able to get there quickly is absolutely crucial in this business, you know, you want to be make good use of your time you want to be able to get to the properties and and make sure they're operating properly. So super, super, super simple. All right, let's shift gears and bring a lawn on. So a lot of Murphy, welcome to the show.

Alanna Murphy: 13:54

Thank you for having me. Yeah,

Brian Briscoe: 13:56

yep, no problem, no problem at all. So do us a favor. Tell us a little bit about yourself.

Alanna Murphy: 14:02

Oh, my my my name is a lot of our feet. I have been brought my first three family about 19 years ago, when you're out of college. I had a person that was friend of a family that basically said always buy real estate and land with any of your extra earnings or extra savings. And then I one time said you know, buy something and live for free. So I essentially lived for free for my whole life until I moved down here to Texas, where we actually bought a house. I read the purple book like a lot of folks did. So and I subsequently brought two more three families and a two family thanks to my husband. But we've been property managers pretty much our whole lives. And now we're ready to step into the commercial real estate side of things

Brian Briscoe: 14:55

Nice nice. Yeah, I'd like to I mean purple, the purple Bible every everybody knows what that is. I think I think that started a lot of people's, you know, journey in collecting assets, you know, buying the assets and a love your idea, you know, let's try to live for free. You know, it's typically the largest expense everybody has. But, you know, you can figure out a way to, you know, buy a property and live for free. I mean, you're taking that expense away, you're adding equity. I think that those are those are all really smart moves. So so good Anya. So let me ask you the same question that, you know, I asked everybody, what did your big burning why?

Alanna Murphy: 15:31

So two things. The first thing, I think, the kind of seeing the chaos around, I kind of saw my life, kind of from a bird's view. And although I did some good things, I think, with the stock market, you know, buying Amazon when it was down to 1800. And now it's back up to 3300. I realized that the passive income that wasn't reliant on whatever craziness the stock market was doing, I didn't have enough. And so that was one reason. Second reason, you know, I have two boys age 10, and eight, they will be going to college. And that's going to cost me an arm and a leg. So I have to step up my game. So those are my two, my two eyes and to just have that that passive income to support my family.

Brian Briscoe: 16:15

Awesome. Awesome. Well, sounds like you got a really good start so far. And, you know, hopefully, we can help you make the leap into, you know, multifamily. But, you know, that said, a lot of we've got Russell on the line, what do you want to ask him?

Alanna Murphy: 16:27

Hello, Russell, thanks for thank you for being here. Yeah, so my first question is around financing. I know you guys talked a little bit about that. I have been putting in loi with a couple of partners, probably since February. I've built some relationships with a couple of finance foods. But there's so many questions around how does a new investor get into commercial real estate? How do you guys see us in a good light? And what sort of things can we do? You know, we can have the liquidity we can have? Whatever the credit score, I can have the three families but I don't have commercial real estate. How do I crack that nut?

Russell Nova: 17:10

That's a good question. So when it comes to the KPS, a lot of lenders are looking towards that because it's more or less the key principle, right? It's the network and the liquidity. A lot of lenders want to see that, that they are an active member within your group. Now, let's say for example, you don't have the experience, right, and you're trying to go after a larger deal, I would tell you, Hey, start out with something smaller, go after a 10 or 15, or 20 unit, don't go after the 100 unit right away. Because you personally want to have that experience you want to learn right? Exactly what it takes them to do all of that, once you get on a deal 1020 30 unit deal, you will then have the experience with the lender, right, the lender would say, Hey, there, she's already on my approved list, you can then move on into larger deals, you can easily avoid that step, of course, by bringing on a KP, a known principle, and other sponsors that fit that the actual criteria, but don't forget that many of these lenders require at least 10 to 15% sponsor equity into the deal. So the larger your deal is, the more money's everyone has to come in. And usually these Capys don't want to come in with any extra money, because they're signing on the loan. So you know, to answer your question, I would always say, and this is what I tell a lot of people as well, and I speak to individuals, is that startup smaller, you don't need to go for that 100 You know, what you in a deal on your first second or third deal? Learn everything there is to know, get on the approved lenders list, and then you can start making moves for yourself. Okay, thank you,

Brian Briscoe: 18:49

I'll just add add one thing, you know, try to try to look at it from a KPI point of view as well and do everything you can to mitigate the risk for the KP, you know, they're signing on the loan, you know, they're putting their balance sheet on the line. And if their multifamily operators and that loan goes south, you know, there's a chance they may never may never be able to get another commercial loan again, or or have to fear a lot of things up. So do what you can to mitigate the risk. And I think what Russell said about the smaller properties, you know, there there's a lot less risk in the smaller numbers, you know, smaller properties, you know, if I'm putting my balance sheet on the line, it's a lot easier to do for a $1 million property than, you know, $10 million property.

Alanna Murphy: 19:31

Okay, thank you. And I want to ask one question, follow up to that. What are your thoughts? So get a small property, let's say, you know, a million or 1,000,005 What are your thoughts on hard money loans? So buying it through hard money and then refinancing through?

Russell Nova: 19:48

Oh, that's a very good question. I'm gonna answer that very simply right. That is not to be feared. That is to be understood. Right. So if you understand the kind of debt that you're getting, you're going to thrive I'm all for bridge and hard money. I don't like to use the word hard money because there are many bridge options that you can get a five and a half to like a six and a half percent rate. I'm all for it. Right when you go after a bridge product, you can get a little bit more LTC, right because it's a cash flow, it's a cash value, you're building the value. So I would say go for it, I would say if you have an opportunity to go so but you're limited on the amount of cash, I would say go for the bridge product, right? Understand what you're getting, understand what type of loan you have in front of you, and purchase that property, do your business model, just get in there, fix everything that you need to start bumping up the rents and refi out. And just one of the thing I always want to let you guys know is that bridge lenders are not here to hurt you bridge lenders are here to work with you because they understand if you're in this field, you're going to do bigger and better things at at some point. So not to be feared.

Brian Briscoe: 20:59

I love that. I'm probably gonna make some, you know, definitely social media posts on that and bridge debt or debt is not to be feared must be understood. I love that.

Alanna Murphy: 21:08

That'd be absolutely love that. Russell, you talked about. I think you said we. So you have partners, I wanted to understand how you found your partners. And why do you think it's a good relationship, and any advice for new folks going into partner?

Russell Nova: 21:27

So. So partnerships in this business is, is very, very crucial, right? Because you can't do it on your own. And even if you want to do on your own stop, because it's never going to work, you need to have somebody there that you can rely on when it comes to the financing business and the debt advisory firm. So my partner is a is a childhood friend. We've known each other since we were five years old. And we've grown up together and we work together and we're best friends. When it comes to the multifamily acquisition side, you know, believe it or not that I met my partner and one of these events, just like I met Brian, it was more or less just meeting somebody clicking with them and saying, Hey, you bring value, I bring value, let's do something together. I think that if you initially point out exactly what each individual has to do in the partnership, I think that you guys can really go far away. Now I'm sure that you're going to overlap each other and say, Hey, I know I can do this, or I can do that better. But that's okay. It's all about really communication. So I'm all for partnerships.

Brian Briscoe: 22:32

You know, in our partnership, we have a lot of overlap, but between between the partners, we have every direction covered, you know, as far as you know, skill set and whatnot, but 100% agree with what was what Russell said there.

Alanna Murphy: 22:47

So Russell, I know you've been in this space more on the financing side for a long time. But, you know, what do you wish? What do you know now, right, five years later, that you wish you would have known earlier about the commercial real estate?

Russell Nova: 23:02

You ready for this? Yeah, I wish I started earlier. I wish I could have started earlier. But you know, I, I knew things were happening. But I was so embedded into what I was doing. Because I was literally helping people, I was helping them achieved, you know, their goals of buying property and ownership and, and we saw the potential. If I would have gotten involved a little bit earlier, though, it would have been amazing would have been great for everyone that I work with, because the value was there, you know, currently up to date. You know, in four years, we own 1500 units and counting. I could have I could only imagine if I if I would have gotten in this business eight years ago or so, and really got into mark, but that's okay. Because I'm still bringing value to every individual that comes in front of me. Right. Every individual that I work with, we always bring value. If there's no value, there's no point.

Brian Briscoe: 23:55

Yeah, I would have started a lot earlier to I mean, that's, that's, I think everybody is gonna say a similar thing that would have started earlier. Yeah.

Alanna Murphy: 24:05

100% agree with that, I think. You know, I started buying in Boston, and you know, I got real nitpicky, when I was buying additional three families, and I'm like, I should have just brought it. It doubled in price in the last 15 years. So, okay, my next question is about jayvees versus syndication, wanting to understand your thoughts around both, maybe with the financing spin side of things. And do you do both?

Russell Nova: 24:35

Yes, so you know, syndications and jayvees. I'm all for both of them. I love them all. I've done many syndications. And I'm actually doing a JV right now, which is the 90s which is the 92 units that we're closing. When actually next week, when it comes to a syndication investors require a certain return at a certain timeframe, right. So you have to really get back to them. You have to return a certain amount of bounce them at a certain time. When it comes to JV, it's just everyone getting together, there's no time you can keep the property for 510 15 years, right? You could accumulate them on the actual depreciation that you're having overall time. It's really about, like who you're speaking to, when you come to a JV, you're all coming together and you're figuring out, okay, we're going to do this together. Here it is, versus a syndication where you have to raise the funds, right, you have to get a 506. C, you have to get a syndication attorney, it's a little bit more work when it comes to a syndication because there's a lot of steps involved. But I would say that with a syndication, you're getting much more people in Bob, you're growing your network, right, with a JB, it's just small groups of individuals and individual like yourself, I'm assuming you want to grow your network. So you want to allow people to come into your network, you want to want to make sure they are aware of the deals that you have going on. So both are very, very similar. It just depends on what you're trying to achieve for that certain property.

Brian Briscoe: 26:03

You know, Russell, you brought something up, I never really thought of I mean, we got we have nine properties. Seven, were syndications two were jayvees. Most people in our network don't know about those two JV properties. Because we didn't go through the process. We didn't send out the email blast, we didn't set we didn't do a webinar for people, you know, and I think that's a really good point that I never really realized is you know, when you do a syndication, you're out there pushing it, especially if it's a 506 C, and you're blasting out on on, you know, your emails are going out your social media campaign, you know, it's gonna do a lot more for your your marketing, you know, having a syndication, you know, our jayvees, we just did very quietly with the partners we brought in, and we're quietly operating them. So I, I never really thought about it from that perspective. And thanks for bringing that up.

Russell Nova: 26:54

Absolutely. I mean, when it comes to syndications, I mean, you're going to grow your network, like it or not, you're gonna have people come to you and say, Hey, what do you have next? What's going on? So that's why I am a fan of the syndication model is because I'm getting it out into the market, or saying, Hey, this is what I have. You're not ready for this one. Get ready for the next one.

Brian Briscoe: 27:14

Absolutely.

Alanna Murphy: 27:16

So this question is kind of a play on what I asked earlier, but I don't know what your involvement is with newbies. But what is some of the mistakes that you see newbies coming into commercial real estate

Russell Nova: 27:28

doing? So? So yes, so what we do work with new individuals that are trying to get into this business. One thing that I would say and and, and what I'm seeing is that they're trying to shoot for the stars, they're trying to go after properties that are a little bit outside of their comfort zone. Right, I would say don't do that, I would say start with like 10 to 30 units, just get comfortable with it. Obviously, Fannie and Freddie require that you have experience in this in this business. So unless you can bring on KPS, and sponsors of bridge route would be best for you. If you can go after those small properties and build your portfolio and put your and put your experience on that. You can then go after and I've worked with many people in Texas and Florida and North Carolina, because they see others doing these larger properties. They all of a sudden want to jump in and say hey, maybe I can do that. But you're not learning the business when you're trying to go after things that are not real. So I would I would strongly advise that you don't shoot for the stars. Learn everything you can get a couple of deals under your belt then you feel compensate Yes, I can go up to 150 units I can go up to 250 units

Alanna Murphy: 28:46

so I want to switch gears a little bit what keeps you up at night? Oh, worship

Russell Nova: 28:52

deals. There's so many things like It's like anything else we're in the business of doing deals, right? So you're always thinking what if this doesn't happen? Or what if that deal doesn't come in? Or what if the markets just shift and not in our and not in our direction? What if we don't hit the right rents? Right? What if we don't capture the rents that we projected for prior returns? So there's a lot of things that really go on you know through my mind every single day especially since I'm active on the debt and on and on the acquisition side but when it comes to work when it comes to that it's those are my fears is like hey, what if we don't hit the project in markets? What if we don't hit the returns that were supposed to be specified to our investors? You know, you don't want to do that because you want to continue to grow your network and you want to make sure that you return the returns as needed. That's my you know, that's my thing and I'm sure many others can you know, can relate as well is that they don't control the markets they can only project and do the homework that they can do.

Brian Briscoe: 29:55

Man if I had a magic wand, you know controlling the apartment investing be a lot of you The biggest, biggest unknown is that market, you know what's going to happen to the market? What's going to happen to, to rents? What's going to happen to cap rates, what's going to happen to interest rates, those are all the unknowns that yeah, you try to try to mitigate the best you can. But end of the day you control you control. And I hate to say you hope, but you really have hope that those things go the right way for you.

Russell Nova: 30:20

Now, you asked me, Why can't sleep good at night? There you go.

Brian Briscoe: 30:25

So many things. Yeah.

Alanna Murphy: 30:27

So in talking about the market in the world, are there things that you do differently now, based off of what we've or are we on, like 20 years of Corona? But are there things that you do differently now, after Corona? Or during Corona that you didn't? You didn't do before?

Russell Nova: 30:47

Yes. So now I communicate a lot more. Right. I mean, you know, Zoom has become a very, very popular thing. Now, prior to that it was it was more or less just phone calls, we didn't think to get onto zoom, and really have these kinds of conversations. You know, we've been doing a lot of zoom calls lately, I've been traveling even a lot more now. And really seeing the properties prior to me getting into contract, one of the rules that I have for them, for my entire team is that I need to be on site, I need to meet with the broker, we need to review all the documentation, the asset, you know, on the T twelves. Prior to you know, prior to Corona, it was more or less, hey, if it made sense. It made sense. I went online, I looked it over, you know, things have changed. So I really want to see that there are individuals in these units, they're paying rent, because there are some times you know, during, you know, during Corona that people aren't paying. So you want to make sure that that reflects the rent roll. Right. So, to your point, I now travel to make sure that there are people actually living in these units. And that versus what they say on the rent roll prior to grown up. I didn't care. I took their word for it, you know, versus anything else. Now, you know, what things have changed.

Brian Briscoe: 31:58

So somebody in my network going along the same point, somebody my network was talking with them last week, they bought a I think a 24 unit property. The previous owner said collections were about 20,000 a month, right? And he's like, we collected 8000 This month, he's like, I mean, we realize a lot of these people just haven't been paid, you know, and that's one of the things I think, you know, Coronas allowed people to do is just not pay. And, you know, if they go through certain steps in certain locales, their their eviction, you know, so you file certain paperwork, and that's absolutely something that's come up because of Coronavirus, is, you know, the eviction moratoriums, and some cities and states are making those even you know, putting more teeth into those the eviction process but absolutely, you know, a thing you know, you have to make sure there's people there you know, get into it when you're when you're out there when you're doing your due diligence, get into every single unit do exactly what Russell's saying, make sure there's somebody living there. And you know, make sure they're, they're paying their rents, you know, do what you got to do to have that warm and fuzzy feeling before you jump in further.

Russell Nova: 33:06

100% And if not, it should be a reflection of price.

Brian Briscoe: 33:11

Yeah, absolutely. Well, we have time for one more question. So Elana, if you've you've been saving one up, go ahead and shoot your shot here.

Alanna Murphy: 33:19

All right, well, so last question. So I'm a learning junkie. I love podcasts, audible training, I signed up for a coaching program. So I have a coach going through this process. Anything you can share from books to podcasts, of course, this this wonderful podcast, training, anything that you would suggest for newbies?

Russell Nova: 33:40

Yes, so I'm a learning junkie as well. I love to learn, you know, there's, you can't stop learning in this business. You have to learn you have to listen to people, there are a tremendous amount of events that are happening all the time. There are many other many mentors that um, that you could actually go and listen to, for example, Jake and Gino guys, they're great, they're smart. They have a lot of mentors and coaches that can really you know, just teach you everything the multifamily Masters is is another great one that I'm actually personally speaking on when it comes to though when it comes to the financing panel. Rod Cleef, for example. You're so is another great guy had has been through everything. And all of these people that I've just mentioned to you have mentors in house and have individuals that want to teach you it's never about spending money so they can help you. They're open and saying, Hey, if you want to be in this business, join my community, join my group, right? And I can teach you everything that I've learned. So these individuals have been through it all the good, the bad, they lost millions and millions of dollars. They've gained it back through ownership. So I would say Never stop learning. And always and always reach out there are people that do want to genuinely help individuals.

Alanna Murphy: 34:53

Thank you.

Brian Briscoe: 34:54

Awesome. Hey, thanks for that we are coming up to the end of our time and time limit so One last question for each of you. And Russell, you get to go first, how can listeners learn more about you?

Russell Nova: 35:07

Alright, well, um, you know, so personally, I'm on the financing side, it will be our pleasure to assist on any owner operators with financing of multifamily property. Our team has been extremely aggressive. We finance roughly anywhere from 750 to about a billion a year in volume wise. In regards to stone street multifamily group, we have an active deal currently right now, which is 136 units in Tallahassee, Florida. It is a student to market conversion, you can reach out by visiting Stonestreet, MF group.com, or stone street dot i n v portal.com. That has all the information on there, we should be closing roughly towards the end of November, beginning of December, on something of that nature. But on there, we'll have all updates. So,

Brian Briscoe: 35:57

a lot of same question for you. how can listeners learn more about you?

Alanna Murphy: 36:02

I believe LinkedIn is probably the best way to reach me it's Elana, Tyler Murphy, there are a whole bunch of a lot of Murphy's, but a lot of Tyler Murphy on LinkedIn. All right,

Brian Briscoe: 36:13

and we're gonna put links to the methods these these two said we can contact them with in the show notes. So LinkedIn websites, whatnot, it's all going to be in the show notes. So if you want to reach out to any one of these guys, definitely, you know, check out the show notes. And you know, tap the link to learn more about them. So that said, thank you so much for coming on the show show to both of you today. Very much. Appreciate your time. And this was a lot of fun.

Russell Nova: 36:39

Appreciate thank you so very much for having me a lot. It was a pleasure to meet you. And Brian, thank you very much.

Brian Briscoe: 36:44

Thank you. Thank you for listening to the direction apartment investor podcast today brought to you by four oaks capital. If you'd like to know more about how to invest in apartment buildings or want to be a guest on our show, visit our website at four oaks capital comm slash podcast or email us directly. If you're still listening, you obviously like the show. So pull out your phone app, subscribe, and leave us a five star rating on your favorite podcast app. And we'll see you again next week.