The Rochelle Christiane Podcast
Welcome to the Rochelle Christiane Podcast! This is the space where spirituality meets self-discovery and personal growth. I’m your host, Rochelle Christiane—your guide to holistic health, emotional regulation, embodiment and soulful alignment. This space is all about helping you reconnect with your body’s wisdom, master your emotions, and align with your unique energy using tools like astrology, Human Design, and holistic wellness practices. Each week, I’ll share transformative conversations and practical guidance to help you heal, embody your truth, and create deeper alignment in your life. This is your invitation to step into your power, trust yourself, and master your emotions. Let’s dive in!
Are you ready to connect deeply with your body, align with your energy, and unlock your fullest potential? Through my Wholistic Human Design Academy and one-on-one coaching, I help women like you embrace their intuition, understand their astrology and Human Design charts, and cultivate confidence in their unique energy. Together, we’ll create the alignment you’ve been seeking—whether it’s deconditioning limiting beliefs, attracting abundance, or finding peace within.
The Rochelle Christiane Podcast
264. Tarot for Empowerment: Finding Your Center in Chaotic Times
Leah Jones-Marcus shares her journey from religious fear to embracing tarot as a path of self-discovery and empowerment, revealing how these cards can ground us during astrological intensity.
• Overcoming religious stigma around tarot and divination tools
• Using tarot as a tool for self-understanding rather than fortune-telling
• Reading cards from an internal perspective rather than projecting externally
• Navigating intense astrological periods by finding your center
• Learning to embrace your emotions as an emotional manifester
• Breaking down big changes into manageable steps
• Using the Major Arcana to get out of your head when overwhelmed
• Understanding how cards like Three of Swords and Eight of Cups represent change
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Welcome to the Rochelle Christiane podcast. I'm Rochelle, your host. I'm here to help you come back to your body, take charge of your emotions and live life on your terms. This podcast is a space for raw, real conversations about what it means to trust yourself, lean to your power and create a life that feels aligned and alive. We'll explore human design, astrology and other tools to help you understand your unique energy. More importantly, though, we're going to talk about what it means to actually live and embody these aspects. So each week, I'm going to share stories, lessons, guidance to help you navigate life's challenges and really own your magic. So if you're ready to step up, take control and show up as the most authentic version of you, let's begin. Welcome back to another episode on the podcast.
Speaker 1:Today I'm talking with Leah Jones-Marcus, who is an astrologer, a tarot reader and writer of the Transformation Forecast. We really talk about tarot sort of unhooking from maybe stereotypes or outdated narratives unhooking from maybe stereotypes or outdated narratives. Leah shares how she came from, a sort of religious upbringing which I think a lot of us can resonate with that experience when it comes to specifically learning or using the tarot as a you know divination method or just as a tool to sort of connect deeper with ourselves. We really talk about using it as an impairment tool, and when we recorded this podcast gosh, I think this was actually back in February, march, so it was quite a while ago. This was before I began my own personal journey of really deepening my knowledge and information with the tarot, so it was really cool to listen back to this. We really talk about grounding ourselves right within this current astrology because it's really and again, it's interesting, having had this conversation at the beginning of 2025. And we all know how intense it's been, and, especially this month when this is being released, how intense the astrology is specifically this week, right as this comes out on Thursday, september 3rd, I think, yes, september 3rd. We have Uranus stationing retrograde tomorrow and then we have our full moon total lunar eclipse on Sunday. So this is just like the astrology is really big. If you want to read about the Uranus retrograde, I wrote a sub stack on it, which you can click the link below and head over to my sub stack. That'll be over there. And, yeah, it was just a really, really beautiful conversation.
Speaker 1:I am being more intentional, moving forward about podcast interviews. I'm I'm really have been reflecting and sitting with where I want the podcast to go and I love, I think, every single person I interviewed on the podcast really comes at a perfect time, perfect place and in the past I've kind of said yes to like everything and again, I love every single conversation I've had and moving forward I'm just, I feel, like again the podcast, I desire it to be a little bit more intentional. So I again I've been sitting with it and just feeling through it and I haven't fully formed what it's going to look like. But yeah, I just want to share that. I know I put a little poll on Instagram and some of you responded on things that you liked about the podcast because, again, it's for you, but it's also for me and it's also for you. So it is a lot of work, right? And when you're doing it yourself, the whole you know process, start to finish, and I appreciate the journey of being able to do this because there's at the point where I can do it, start to finish. There may be a point where you know I have other people supporting me and then I won't be in this phase of doing all of the work, but yeah, there's, there's so much going on astrologically, if you're listening to this on Thursday as the episode comes out, we are hosting a full moon eclipse circle this evening at 8 pm Central Standard Time.
Speaker 1:So if you want to join us, you can click the link in the show notes and join us again, 8 pm Central Standard Time. On the 4th yes, on the 4th. Today's the 3rd, today's the 3rd yes, today is the 3rd. I don't even know what day is anymore. It's, you know, one of those days. So that will be on the 4th. If you can't make it live, it will get emailed out. So if you decide you want to get the replay, you can just get the replay. We're going to be doing a lot of journaling around this because calling in that experience within ourselves Because next year, the first six-ish months of 2026 are massive and giving us this opportunity to really choose what timeline we're going to be on and the Kabbalah says that Libra season is actually a season, a time when we get to choose what timeline we're on.
Speaker 1:So Virgo season, which makes sense because Virgo is organized, analytical, it's all about health, daily routines to support us, to sort of become this air quote perfected version of self, which there is no such thing as a perfected version of self. But we're working on the internal, like knowing of ourselves, coming into ourselves and just doing better, right, being better, doing better. And when we're, you know, thinking better, when our perspective is different, then we can change our reality, a new reality, right. And so we're doing all this work in this Virgo season to get clear and call in these things. Then in Libra season, we can kind of like move on those. So there'll be a little bit of that journaling in the full moon circle as well as just like an understanding and overview of the bigger astrology that is at play, because it's big. Everybody's been talking about it, right.
Speaker 1:This 2027 shift in story is started. Right, it started like five years ago, but we're really kind of ramping up on all that energy and there's so much more I could say, but I'm going to leave it at that. So check back next week for another episode and enjoy this one. Let me know what you think. Go, follow Leah on all the socials, everywhere you can find her. Her YouTube channel website all the things are there. Follow me on Instagram, tiktok, at Rochelle Christian R-O-C-H-E-L-L-E dot C-H-R-I-S-T-I-A-N-E YouTube you can click the link below if you prefer to watch. And, yeah, everything else that you need to know is down in the show notes. Today I have Leah Jones-Marcus here who is a tarot and oracle reader and who writes the transformation forecast, so astrology forecast. So we're going to dive into all things tarot, astrology, all the fun stuff. I'm going to hand you the floor just for you to introduce yourself and sort of share your story Anything pivotal on the way that sort of like got you where you're at today, and then we'll take from there Sure.
Speaker 2:So I have been running this as my own business for a little over a year now, full-time, not having another career, so this is like my full-time thing. I fell into tarot. I had always been kind of curious about it, but I grew up in a really religious household that definitely thought that using tools like tarot were of the devil, and so it took me a long time to be able to get to comfortability with even trying things, and so once I did try all of these wonderful tools, they literally changed my life, and so that is why I have like fully shifted out of the career that I was in before and into practicing tarot full time, studying astrology, studying my human design. All of it is, I think, so pivotal. All of it is, I think, so pivotal. I'm the kind of person who dives really deeply into things once I find that I like them, and so I just am one of those people that feels like we should use every tool that we have at our disposal to learn more deeply about ourselves, and so that's kind of been the journey that I've been on is just diving into whatever is interesting or sparks curiosity for me, and so just kind of diving in and doing all of that Right now I focus on.
Speaker 2:The transformation forecast is my big thing, and that is horoscopes that come out every new moon, every full moon and at the beginning of every astrological season, and those are horoscopes and tarot scopes. Use tarot in conjunction with the astrology to really talk about what is going on in the cosmos and how we can utilize those energies to really transform our lives in practical ways. And then I also am going to be coming out with a tarot class soon to teach tarot in the way that I have come to use it most often. I think there are so many ways that you can use tarot, so many different perspectives from which you can read, and so I'll be coming out with a class soon about my perspective, um, on tarot, which is going to be really fun and exciting too. So I just think there's so many ways to go, so many ways to dive into it and pick it apart, and that's my favorite part about it.
Speaker 1:So yeah, I think that's what's beautiful about tarot. I think there's not really like a right or wrong way to do it, you know, I think it's really being intuitive with it and kind of like leaning into it. For you and I would love to I would be curious just what was that journey like for you, going from this religious household where it's more seen as something like dark and something that you shouldn't do. I know I grew up Catholic but my parents never really like I went to church but it wasn't really a thing. I guess we didn't really talk about it, that kind of stuff. But in my house I know my daughter she's taken some tarot decks over to friends' houses that and they're just their moms are like no, you can't do that in this house and she's like mom, what's wrong with it would be a pretty big subconscious belief that you would have to overcome to be able to work with these cards.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think for me it was overcoming a lot of fear. I had to really confront a lot of the fear that had been drilled into me that these were tools that I couldn't trust and I didn't know where the energy was coming from, um, and so how did I know who I was talking to type of stuff, and it's like you're actually just talking to yourself. It's your energy, like, um, it's so safe and so affirming, and so I think, like, what really helped me get through that hurdle was out. The thing that actually spurred me to start reading tarot is I was going through a really difficult time in my last career where I just felt like I was going nowhere and no one saw me or my potential or anything, and I was putting everything I had into it and I was just hitting a wall Like why is none of this working? Why can't I move forward? What is this block that I can't seem to get past? What is going on? And come to find out it wasn't where I was supposed to be, and that was the universe telling me it's time to move. We got to go do something different.
Speaker 2:But so I picked up my first deck because I was just like I got to try something to get out of this. Like nothing. None of my other coping mechanisms were working. Um, so how do I dig myself out of this hole that I'm in?
Speaker 2:And I think what really allowed me to move past my fear around tarot was that all of the readings that I was getting back as I started reading for myself were so affirming, and it felt like tarot became a friend to me in that it gave me language to explain what was going on inside of myself, and I before didn't have the tools or the words to understand what I was going through internally and so it really helped me externalize and verbalize what was going on inside of myself.
Speaker 2:And so I think that that was what drew me to it so much and really got me over that hump, because it just allowed me to really see myself in a whole new light. See myself in a whole new light. So I think that that was like the biggest thing that helped me kind of get past that hurdle of fear. Um, just trusting myself that this is affirming and not negative, it's not harmful, it's not leading me down a bad path. This is stuff that just helping me understand who I am at a deeper level and leading me essentially back home to myself.
Speaker 1:So yeah, yeah, I love that. I had someone come over once and they saw my tarot deck and they were like, oh, I'm not going near that. And I was like, why? And they said something about like talking to God and they'll do it other ways. I'm like, but why can't God talk to me through that too, you know?
Speaker 1:And they're like, oh well, I guess, but it's just like it's so interesting how that is so held on specifically tarot, like I feel like Oracle decks, like I didn't necessarily have it, doesn't hold the same weight as, like, the word tarot, you know, it's really it's just so interesting how it like brings up a lot of that. You know attached to it, but sort of like you, I will sometimes I'll be journaling or if I'm going through something challenging, it's like I journal everything out or I'll read something and then I'll pull a couple of cards and it's like the cards even like when I open the book to like read what it says, like the words, are specifically things that I had written or things that I'm going through. So I definitely resonate with that being. It's just, it is very affirming when you kind of like just pull them and it's like literally exactly like what you need.
Speaker 2:It's really beautiful. Yeah, it's definitely my favorite thing, and I think like one of the pieces that I've had to like navigate with my family around is, you know, they think I'm just like trying to read the future or like I'm going to tell them their ex-boyfriend is doing so and so whatever, and I'm just like that's literally not how I use the tarot at all, like not even close, and so just like resetting what it even means to read tarot to them, just taking them out of the typical stereotypes of what it is in the movies or you know whatever they've seen, and just letting them see how I use it and how empowering it can be. And I think that that's really helped open their minds a little bit more and be more comfortable with me doing this as a career. Now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that and I love that you're bringing it around your family. I think a lot of people, when they get into things like this that are, I guess, against the normal of what the household rules were, growing up with the standards. A lot of people kind of keep it to themselves, right. So it's not I don't know if tainted is the right word but it's not influenced, I guess, by other people. So I think that's amazing that you have brought it in and it's sort of you know, being accepted and showing them that there's a different side to it. It's really really cool yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure so how do we use, how do we use the tarot Like? Do you have any set not rules, but like practices that you use either with clients or just like with yourself, as you're sort of like navigating, like and also weaving in astrology, cause I know like right now there's some really intense astrology out there and there has been right, but it's like how do we lean into this to like empower us and help us move through some of those things?
Speaker 2:yeah. So I actually like my perspective in the way that I read tarot. That I'm writing this course around is really a self-focused version of reading, so like a card that typically would be read as an external facing card like, say, let's say, the five of wands is typically a card that people associate with something outside of themselves, like, oh, I'm in a conflict with another person or I'm feeling competitive against so and so, and so it's this card where a lot of people would read it, as you know, outside of themselves. I kind of flip that and say what internal conflict is going on within me? So when I read the cards, I want to look at it from my perspective, because it's a lot more empowering to do so.
Speaker 2:When I'm looking at it outside of myself, what happens is you feel disempowered because you're like well, I can't control this other person, this conflict is happening outside of me, and it kind of takes you out of your power a little bit, whereas if you look at this from an internal perspective and you're like what's going on with me that's causing this conflict, you can really empower yourself to change whatever's going on with you, um, instead of kind of throwing your hands up like, oh, I don't, I'm not in control of this, um.
Speaker 2:And so I think that that really helps ground you, because it's giving you practical steps that you can either like dive deeper and like dig into more of what's going on, or you can take like action steps that will kind of move you out of this energy, because we're the ones in control of our energy. Because we're the ones in control of our energy, we have the power to shift ourselves out of it. If we're not happy that there's conflict going on, we have the power to shift that and change that. And so I think it's just about recognizing and taking your power back in that moment to say like no, I'm not gonna keep going with this, I'm gonna shift this and move how this energy is flowing.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I think that that is one of the biggest ways that I read a little bit differently than most people, and I think that that right now the world feels very chaotic, pulled in a million directions, and a lot of things are happening outside of ourselves that we don't have control over, and so pulling it back and focusing on what you specifically so I think the world outside, what is happening around us right now, feels really chaotic and it feels like our attention is being pulled in a million different directions and it's almost exhausting to try to keep up with it all. And it's going. If we look at the forecast for 2025, it's going to continue to be chaotic, it's going to continue to throw us for loops, and so what we have to do is we have to take our power back and really sit and say what can I specifically do in this moment? What do I have control over? Because we don't have control over everything. We don't have control over other people, and I know that that's really really hard to grasp for a lot of people. It was really hard for me to grasp for a long time. I have a Virgo stellium and so I really like control and order, and so that was a big one for me.
Speaker 2:But I think, with the astrology of what is coming for us in 2025, and what we see already beginning to play out, it's just going to continue to be chaotic, and so what we need is to really cultivate a strong serenity inside of ourselves and a strong connection with who we are grounding ourselves in, who we are at a deep level, so that we aren't pulled off center by all of this that's happening around us, and so, the more that we can stay in our power and focus on what we can control, that's how we to stay able to like bend instead of break as the chaos kind of swirls around us, because eventually this chaos will fall away, things will shift and change. We know that as the energies shift and change, everything else shifts and changes as well, and so this is not going to last forever. It will change and morph into something different. But we have to be able to kind of be flexible and move through whatever is happening, and the best way I think to do that is to just really have a strong center.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I do think that following things like astrology and tarot or reading your human design all of that stuff really helps anchor you in who you are, so that you don't get so far pulled off center when things trigger you, cause you to feel out of control.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think if we're using really any of these tools in an empowered way, we're the point of it is really to come home and to come into yourself right and to have that solid foundation. So I really I like using the, the cards in the way that you're describing. And how do we like reframe cards, like maybe the death card or the tower card, like things like that just naturally hold a little bit more weight, like especially when you know, like you said, like the chaos and the all the change that's happening now, and like say we're just continually playing these cards, like how do what would your reframe be? Or like how do you look at those cards coming up?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so for me, um, the tower is actually one of my favorite cards.
Speaker 2:I'm a Scorpio rising too, so you know that is part of that, um, but I think what it is well, and I'm a human design manifester, so that is a whole nother level of of that energy whole nother level of of that energy, apart falling apart is always for our highest good.
Speaker 2:I genuinely believe that the universe is benevolent and has our best interests at heart, and so, if you can ground yourself in that belief, whatever happens outside of you is always going to be for your highest good, to move you forward, to help you learn and grow, and so I really look at everything as being a learning tool. I really look at everything as being a learning tool, a way to grow stronger and deeper into who I am, and so the tower is actually one of my favorite cards, because it means that you can see, you will get this clarity and this visibility around one of these things that used to hold you back, and now it's not going to hold you back anymore because it's falling away, and so you get to build something new in its place. So how exciting is that To kind of get to start fresh and build something even stronger than before, fresh and build something even stronger than before.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I think, like with anything, you will see what you believe, right, like if you believe these cards are negative and they're going to hold whatever, then I think that's what you're going to see, and so I do. I love that and that's. That's been a big shift of mine over. You know however many years I've been like on on my journey, right as being more excited for the things that are kind of scary and challenging, because it's always giving you an opportunity for things to shift and change, and we know change can't happen unless it's uncomfortable, right, because that's the only time that we really do change it. Can you share a little bit about your charts, your astrology and your human design chart as well, and maybe anything that, like once you learned those that kind of helped you, you know, navigate, whether it's your business or tarot, like your relationship with that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think one of the biggest things that I realized about myself and this is like fresh and new in this new year that I really, at the end of 2024, I really-on-one clients every day, for multiple hours a day and as a human design manifester, that is not sustainable. I was really, really drained, really exhausted and just forcing myself to live like I could be this productive driving force because that's trusting that. That was accurate. I had to really be honest with myself and, as scary as it was, I actually closed my books completely, like I don't take one-on-one clients at all anymore because I physically it's not what's best for me or my energy, and so that was a really scary decision as a business owner to completely shut down a whole line of my business. But it's something that.
Speaker 2:So I did that at the beginning of the year, um, this year, and it has radically changed how I'm able to show up. I'm so much more creative, I have so much more energy, um, and I have so much time to do the fun things that I love to do, have so much time to do the fun things that I love to do. So, like my day now I spent, you know, I went to yoga first thing after dropping my kids off. I wrote for like three hours and then it was time to pick my daughter up from school and we went and took her to the playground in the park and just played outside and my life couldn't have looked like that before.
Speaker 2:And so I just have, by listening to my design and trusting that that is what is right for me, I've actually created a life that I didn't think was possible for myself, and so I think that that's really important to just kind of listen to these things and trust that your body knows what it's supposed to do and allow that to kind of take over and make decisions with that stuff in mind, even if it doesn't necessarily seem logical. I'm a very logic minded person in general. Again, virgo stellium and I have a lot of air in my chart as well, so that is all like. I've always made decisions from a logical standpoint. What these systems are telling me is what's best for me, and by doing that I've actually freed myself from a lot that was holding me um back before. So that's been really really special um and helpful over this last little bit here for sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think sometimes with human design or any of these modalities, we're so used to being in the mind and doing things logically and then on top of it to have, like you said, a Virgo stellium and that sort of structure, and it's scary to like follow something that like makes no sense, right, it's kind of like just jumping off the ledge and you're like well, it's going to work or it's not, we'll figure it out, I guess, right, but it's so, so affirming too, because it's like I've been, you know, in this, this practice, with my human design and astrology and everything for like over six years now, and it's like I, I know what my beliefs are Right and it's like I believe it. And then I still hear stories and I'm just like blown away. So I'm like look again, like it's, it's, it's there, right, it's, it's there for the taking, if we just really experience it and experiment with it and, I think, not make it so mental right and actually bring it down where it's supposed to be. So I love that. Yeah, how do you like?
Speaker 2:so, yeah, we sort of getting out of my head has been one of my hardest, hardest challenges. What does that process look like for you? I actually just shared one of my like tarot tips on my Instagram the other day about how I get out of my head by using tarot, and the trick that I actually use is to pull I do a past, present, future using only major arcana. Like I pull all the major arcana out and shuffle just the majors and do a past, present, present, future, because when you take the minors out, the minors are the things that have to do with our day to day. They're like the smaller pieces around what's going on, whereas the major arcana are all these large themes, these bigger archetypes that have huge stories around them, and so I can get out of my head by focusing on those bigger themes instead of the minutia, instead of the details of the day-to-day.
Speaker 2:That has been a huge help for me. When I'm feeling overwhelmed, I'm like, okay, let me come back and see what are these major themes that I need to be focusing on? How can I just zoom up, zoom out and get back to these bigger ideas? Because a lot of times, bigger ideas, um, because a lot of times I will get pulled down into the minutia and I'll feel stuck and I don't know how to get myself out of there. And so it's. It's a really easy way to kind of do a quick zoom out, if you, if you look at it from that perspective Hmm, yeah, that's interesting.
Speaker 1:I've never, I've never separated the deck and like played with a different, the different, the major and minor cards. Um, I've just sort of like always pulled from the same one. But I'll have to try that for sure. I've never. I've never thought about that. How long did it take you to really like, I guess, learn this or integrate it as like a daily practice, like something that you just have like now is in your tool belt to to use?
Speaker 2:something that you just have like now is in your tool belt to use. So a lot of things in my chart. I said a little bit earlier that I really dive in deep on things. I go hard when it's something that I'm interested in, and so I have actually only been reading tarot for two and a half years, but I have read tarot every single day for two and a half years and a lot of that. I am talking about reading tarot for six hours a day like big chunks dedicated to learning, integrating, diving deep, studying the archetypes, reading people. That that really just goes hard, all in on something and, um, this is what it was for me.
Speaker 2:You know, somebody may pick up a deck and they'll dabble and they'll read for themselves, like a 15 minute slot on a weekend, you know, and not pick it back up until next week.
Speaker 2:I'm kind of the opposite, where I was like I need to know all the things doing all the spreads. I have notebooks thick full of, like my journaling from when I was reading for myself and I think for me too. When I first started I was so disconnected from myself and once I started seeing that connection to myself and finding ways to understand myself more deeply. It was like I couldn't stop peeling back the layers, like I was like oh my gosh this, oh my gosh this, and I just kept diving deeper and deeper and deeper and I just went really, really deep inside. So it's definitely something that I've, like dedicated a lot, a lot of time and effort to um. Even when I was learning tarot and working full time, I was like reading for like two, three hours a night, um, and then you know, my, my, I stopped having a corporate nine to five in December of 2023. And so since then, like I, every day when my kids are at school, I'm doing tarot all day, reading about it, practicing it, all the things.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's amazing. I love that it sounds like within that amount of time you've really done a lot of the unpacking and self-discovery, because you described earlier having to face those shadows that you held with it. So that's really, really incredible that you've gone all in like that. I know a lot of people that listen are entrepreneurs as well. So just out of curiosity from that lens, how long did it take you to feel like confident enough with your like skills and knowledge of the tarot to then make I mean, you know, make it full time, or to really start, or I guess like maybe the question more is like what was what did it look like when you first started doing sessions for people Like was there any sort of imposter syndrome that was held within there, or you were just like completely on?
Speaker 2:Um, I think that it took about a year of myself doing it like on nights when I still had a full-time job. I think it took like a year before I felt confident enough to start trying to even possibly read for other people, and I think it was probably three, maybe three months before I started reading for other people. I started an Instagram account for reading tarot, but I was reading for myself and posting reading tarot. But I was reading for myself and posting those readings that I had done for myself, in a way to kind of share part of my journey. But it was resonating with people and so that's kind of what helped me kind of start to open the door to potentially reading for other people.
Speaker 2:So after that was going for a couple months, I started reading for friends, people that I could ask for feedback around, trusted people who would tell me the truth on where I was at on it, and that gave me a lot more confidence. And from there, people were just finding me on Instagram and somehow local people were finding me as well. I'm not even sure how that happened, but local people were finding me as well and I was booking like parties where I was reading. You know, 20 people in an in a night, um, and so that really helped me to build up my confidence, um. So I was doing that at like much lower rates than than I would have now, um, to start out.
Speaker 2:So I think that that's really just kind of starting slow and building to get to something that's more sustainable. Was would be like. My answer to that is just kind of like taking your steps one at a time. Like don't jump over any, any steps, try to really, you know, go one step at a time and in trusting the process as you build your business, um to kind of expand and grow it so that it is sustainable, so you don't like get in too far over your head and it gets out of control.
Speaker 1:Yeah, do you ever use like the I Ching?
Speaker 2:I have not. It's one of the things I'm I really am interested in the I Ching. I'm really interested in Kabbalah. I have not, like looked at either of these systems more in depth than just knowing what they are, and so these are definitely other systems that I'm like really dug into in the past. I would say, like six months is runes, so I've really I've added runes to my personal practice. I'm not using them really with clients yet, but it's definitely a whole other system that's been really cool and unique to learn and just kind of see the different ways that it works. But I am really passionate about really any divination method, especially ones that are related to our psychology and like how our minds work and how we process things. So I'm definitely I'm interested in other systems.
Speaker 2:Can you explain what runes are? Sure, um, so I have my little rune bag here, um, but essentially runes, my ones are like these little stones. Mine are clear, with like flowers inside of them, but they have these markings on them. They originate in Norse religion and Norse cultures, so they come from that area, but they each it's like tarot in that each symbol has its own archetype and its own meaning. So there are these translations of poems that we have from the epic poems that were written, and so we're kind of doing our best to pull out what it meant to them and what that now means to us, because things will be very different between the Vikings and who we are in the now.
Speaker 2:So I think that that's part of what I'm building is like you know, I can look at what the Viking meaning was for a rune and how does it apply to me now?
Speaker 2:And how does it apply to me now? So, like the rune that I just showed you is a Thala, and that one to Vikings is supposed to represent like legacy and home, like this place that you come from. And I think that now that's a harder archetype for some people to relate to, because our world looks so different now, like we may not vibe with our ancestors or we may not have a good relationship with our family or the place we were born, whereas they had this very deep, powerful passion about that, and so it's just one of those things where you kind of have to make meaning for yourself, like what does home mean to you? And I do think that that is such a cool thing to be able to do. But yeah, it's its own system as well. It's its own system as well, but it it very much has, like archetypes, as as Tara would like, a general meaning for each symbol, which is cool.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've never seen anyone practice with those. The only thing like the runes that I think of are just like things from the little like fantasy books that I read, like all the little magical practices. I was like, Ooh, that sounds interesting.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and there are so many things that you can do with runes as well, like you can combine runes and they then have their own created meaning that combines the symbols, which is, would be like a sigil, um, so there's, so you can go so far down the rabbit hole. On on what that is, and how to use them.
Speaker 1:Um, so it's fun to just kind of dig it when you use them. Are you like just kind of sticking your hand in a bag and pulling them out, or is there like a set way of like deciphering them, or you throw them or like how does that work you?
Speaker 2:can you can do. You can do multiple ways. I typically shake the bag up, like I have the bag closed, and I'll shake it up and pull out a couple. Another way that I've also practiced is to pull out a decent handful, like five or six, and throw them onto a I typically try to have like a mat or something so that it has boundaries, because that's if you throw them, you need to look at where they're located. You want to look at like is it in the center part of the mat or is it out towards the edge, because that helps you understand what its meaning is. So it's definitely one of those things. Like you can do with charms too.
Speaker 2:I also dabble with charms and throwing those. So with those type of systems where you're throwing them, it's typically what is in the center, is what's most prominent that you're dealing with at that moment. And then as you go wider and wider, it's things that may not be as important or central to the story, but they have an impact on the story. And then you can also read whether they're flipped upside down or right side up, whereas like right side up is the meaning, and upside down typically means either you're not ready to deal with that energy or you can't see yet how that energy is a part of the story that you're looking at. So it's definitely. There are a lot of ways to do it and and see how they work together but, it's definitely fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that sounds, sounds a lot like a lot of fun. How much of this like practice, whether it's with this or tarot, like how much has it been in intuitive practice for you? And then how much has it been like more of like a mental, like knowledge?
Speaker 2:based.
Speaker 2:I think at first it was getting a mental knowledge base to really understand what I was looking at.
Speaker 2:I think you do need to study the archetypes, you do need to understand, like at least a tarot, you need to understand a little bit about the numerology behind why the cards are the way that they are, um, and so I think that that part is the, the sound foundation, that's how you build your foundation is the having the logic of it. But then I think, once you have that down, it's really all intuition from that point, by really just building your practice the way that feels comfortable or feels natural to you, like I don't shuffle the way other people shuffle, I don't shuffle the way other people shuffle. I will sometimes use spreads, sometimes I won't, sometimes I'm just kind of like seeing if cards fall out, sometimes I don't. It just is all I think. Like, once you have that base, it's really all intuition and just kind of meaning making of your own, and that's kind of how I, you know, develop this other style of reading too is yes, there, it's this other style is based on the archetypes, but it's this other way to look at these archetypes.
Speaker 1:So, and that's all coming from intuition, yeah, yeah, can you talk about maybe some common cards that hold themes of like change? I mean, I'm sure you can find in any of them, but if there's any like ones that maybe come up that are significant, that?
Speaker 2:like one of the hardest cards that I really disliked at the beginning. That actually is about change for me is the three of swords, and every time that card would come up I would be so irritated because I was like, no, I don't want to do this, I don't want to deal with this pain, I don't want to mess with this. This is not where I want to go. But I think that now I see it as pain that I am holding inside that is ready to go. It's pain that is ready to be felt and seen and once you feel and see it, you can release it, you can let it go. So oftentimes now when I pull the three of swords, I know that big feelings are going to be coming up, and I will just prepare that big feelings are going to be coming up. Typically I'm a big crier, so I will just put on a really sad movie and I will just cry my face off because it helps me get these feelings out. And a lot of this is like old stuff that's really deep inside of you that is just ready to come out, and once you clear that space out, it opens up space for new things to come in, and so I think really letting go of pain and so I think really letting go of pain not harping on it, not holding on to it, allowing it to flow and releasing it allows for change to take place. It allows for space for things to come in.
Speaker 2:Another card I would say that I really love to do with change is the Eight of Cups, and that, for me, is all about being okay to leave behind something that you have built in search of something that's going to fulfill you in a bigger, better way. A lot of times that one's hard for people because they're having to walk away from something that they've put time and effort and work into. But what that card represents is that more fulfillment is available for you. More fulfillment is available for you, but you're going to have to leave some things behind to go and find it. There is something more fulfilling out there for you. So trusting yourself to kind of go on that journey to go find that inner fulfillment.
Speaker 1:How do you recommend or work with people let's say that have a reading to make it more than just like oh, I had a reading, that's cool and I'm going to move on with my life. How do we integrate? I guess the question is, how do we integrate these lessons that are coming up for us?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that is actually why I put so much time and energy into writing the transformation forecast, because that is how I help move past idea into action. So, with the transformation forecast, like I said, I use tarot and I use the astrology of what's going on in the moment. But I'm writing these horoscopes for every sign, and part of that is I always include an affirmation that you can use that helps you to really embody the energy of what the opportunity is. All of my horoscopes are written as opportunities, because I again think that we do have control over how things impact us or don't, and so you have an opportunity to work with this energy that's coming your way to shift or change this thing. Here's the opportunity. Do with that kind of what you will. Here's an affirmation to embody it in the most empowering way.
Speaker 2:And then I also include what I call magic in the mundane and this is a practice that you can take to actively work with the energy of what's going on around you. So, for example, one of the horoscopes that I was writing earlier today was about moving through energy that kind of has you feeling down and you want to shake it off and move forward in a more optimistic way. And so the magic and the mundane for that is literally to shake it off. Shaking is actually. Humans are one of the only animal species who don't shake after trauma occurs to them. In the wild, animals who have had trauma happen to them will jump up, shake it off and run, like a deer that gets hit by a car. Will will literally jump up, shake it off and run. It's a, it's an instinct, it's a survival instinct, and we're one of the only people that don't do it. And so, um, I literally I wrote in this horoscope a playlist and I'm like here's a couple songs. Play these and dance your butt off, shake it, get it all out. And it's one of those, like, sing at the top of your lungs and just let it go. Like, sing at the top of your lungs and just let it go and it really will change how you move. It will change your whole energy and how you feel moving forward.
Speaker 2:So all of them come with, like these practices that align with whatever the energy happens to be going on for that sign. Um, so I really think that that is powerful and it's how I've need to function. Um, because these are all, every, all the advice that I'm giving is advice that I'm taking myself to, and so I really need to feel grounded in myself, and I can't do that unless I'm taking practical action. I can't live only in the 5D world. I can't live only in the theory. I can't live only in the 5D world. I can't live only in the theory. I can't live only in my head. I have a reality. I'm a mom, I have pets, I have a life, a house to take care of, and so it's like I have to show up in this reality.
Speaker 2:So this is the way that I can make these practices real. Make these practices real, make them and, honestly, that's how you, that's how you shift your life, that's how you change your life is to take these beautiful theories and these beautiful ideas and make them real. And the only way to make them real is to take action around, whatever it is and sometimes the action is that you need to be still, but it's an. That's an action that aligns you with whatever is going on. So I think it's just about finding, whatever the action is, that that happens to align with the astrology of the moment.
Speaker 1:I love that Very, very Virgo to Stellium a Virgo. I'm trying to like visualize your chart. Would your, would your MC, be in Virgo or cause? I'm thinking like it is Okay, cause I was like it could be Leo or Virgo. I wasn't sure that's amazing. Yeah, yeah, so it's like literally bringing that into your business. That's so cool. Yeah, yeah, um, are there any like I have?
Speaker 2:like two more questions, but were there any cards that if you pulled for like 2025, if that was part of your practice or, as you were maybe like contemplating the energy?
Speaker 2:Were there any that like stood out?
Speaker 2:That I am kind of holding close to me for this year is the King of Cups, and kings, for me, are all about mastery of that energy, so mastery over your emotions, but in such a way that you then also can be an example to others.
Speaker 2:So for me, kings are about like queens are embodiment, but kings are mastery and sharing, and so I think, with the cup suit, it's about being able to master our emotions in such a way that we can be the calm in the storm and in doing so, we serve as an example to other people that you can find calm in the storm and you can be that, and I think it doesn't even have to be like to the wider world, it can be like in your family. Even that I'm going to be the one who is, is the strong center for my family, and I'm going to show up and just really allow our home to be a safe space and to be a place where we can feel comfortable in expressing our emotions and moving through them and letting all of the emotions come and go, but still being solid in who we are. So I think that that's the card that I'm really holding close this year.
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely feels like a big theme for the year. That's been coming up in a lot of conversations and podcast conversations as well. My final question for you is kind of going back to that emotional manifester energy. Like how do you, I guess, what has your relationship with your emotions been or transformed or how has it shifted, since you have sort of a use, begin using the tarot is like an everyday tool and then also like really kind of like learned and maybe integrated more of it. Shifted since you have sort of a use, begin using the tarot is like an everyday tool and then also like really kind of like learned and maybe integrated more of like the human design aspect of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So for me, I will say for a long time, for most of my life, I have felt shamed about my emotions. I have always been told that I am too emotional, that I feel things too deeply, that my emotions are too much. Whenever I would cry, I would be told why are you crying? It's not even a big deal. Or whenever I would get angry, I was too out of control. And so when you can't accept those bad big feelings, you also can't embrace the happy big ones. You can't get to that big joy if you can't feel that big sadness.
Speaker 2:And so I think for me, a lot of it, a lot of the journey, has been learning to accept my emotions and allow them to pour out of me and to show up, because a lot of times before I would suppress them and hide them.
Speaker 2:I would like, you know, bite my lip to keep from crying, or I would like leave the space from other people and retreat and go be by myself to do whatever I needed to do, um, or I would like push the feelings deep down and tell myself I didn't really feel that way and so kind of digging all of that back up to allow myself to feel my emotions, because, as an emotional manifester, I have to be able to feel my emotions to make right decisions in line with my intuition.
Speaker 2:So if I'm not feeling my emotions, I'm not in alignment at all. And so and part of being an emotional authority is having and needing to ride the wave, so having to go from bottom to top and back down again, and holding space for that, because until you allow your emotions to flow and calm down, you don't get clarity, you don't know where you're supposed to go or what decision you're supposed to make. You're supposed to go or what decision you're supposed to make. So it's really, really important for me to allow myself to feel and express my emotions as they come.
Speaker 1:So that's definitely been a journey and a practice. Was it challenging for you either before or after, kind of like leaning into that emotional authority, to wait through a wave to make a decision?
Speaker 2:Yes, very much. It was a quick yes. Yeah, I also have my Mars and Aries and so I really like to move on things, like if I get an idea, I'm like we're, let's start doing it. But what I had to learn the hard way is that just because an idea is exciting doesn't mean it's the right idea to act on, and so I have to go through the full emotional wave of that idea before I commit to moving on it, my energy on it.
Speaker 2:I feel all the feelings related to an idea, the highs and the lows before I commit and start moving, which has been difficult as a as a Mars and Aries person.
Speaker 1:What is? What is your moon in Virgo? Virgo, okay, so sun moon MC.
Speaker 2:No, my, my son is Lib, oh, um. So I think that that's where this balance comes into play, where I'm trying to find the balance between all of these things. But um it, my moon, my venus, my mc, and I know there's one more, I don't know what it is, but there's one maybe, um, my mercury's in libra. I also have a, a lot of libra in my chart, but yeah, yeah, yeah, one of the one of them I love that.
Speaker 1:Well, is there any um, I guess, like any tips or any last like guiding words you would give people as they're maybe exploring tarot, like if this is new to them or if they're really trying to like establish a practice in it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think like the biggest thing that I like to impress on people is a lot of times we fail to make change because it feels too overwhelming.
Speaker 2:We don't want to learn tarot because there's so many cards and there's so many meanings and I don't know.
Speaker 2:Or we don't want to make this big change in our career because then we have to start over, we have to do all these things and we get too overwhelmed with the bigness of it. And I really want to impress on people that every big idea can be broken down into smaller steps and some days you're going to feel like taking 10 of those steps, and other days you're going to feel like taking 10 of those steps and other days you're going to take one or maybe none, and that's okay, but not not starting because the idea feels too big. Take the step, no matter how small it is, because eventually you're going to hit this place where you're like, oh, I can actually take 10 steps and you'll, you know, shoot forward in different directions. So just a reminder to keep going to make the changes that you want to make, even when they feel overwhelming. Just take the first step towards it. The universe will meet you where you're at and help you keep going on your path.
Speaker 1:That's beautiful. Thank you so much for coming on and sharing all of your wisdom and knowledge and guidance. When it comes to tarot, it really is so fascinating. I have my decks everywhere and every time I look at them I'm like pull a card. I need to make it more of a daily thing, but I absolutely love it. So this conversation has been really fascinating. Where can people find you and how can they work with you?
Speaker 2:Sure, so right now my website is liamarcuscom and on there you can find all the my links to my socials and the the link to transformation forecast. If you want to subscribe to get that to come to your inbox, I have also recently made the transformation forecast a podcast, so I just basically read the horoscopes. Um, well, if people prefer to listen rather than to read them themselves, uh, so I have that as well. Um, and, like I said, I will be coming out with a tarot course very soon, and so that will be up on my website as well when that comes out. But pretty much I'm on every almost all the social media platforms at Leah Jones Marcus, so they can find me there.
Speaker 1:Beautiful, and I'll have everything linked in the show notes as well. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you, I really appreciate it. It was a great conversation, it was. I loved it.