Inside Soccer
Inside Soccer
Episode 14 - The Great Eric Wynalda, Hall of Famer
A fantastic Episode. Eric Wynalda, Hall of Fame player plus professional coach joins Inside Soccer to discuss his upbringing, great moments in his soccer career, and what it takes to succeed on the field, business, and life. Insiders will really enjoy this vist with Eric Wynalda.
Hello and welcome back. You're listening to another incredible episode of Inside soccer when your host bill Peterson inside soccer brings you a soccer fan expert analysis and opinion on the critical issues facing the game today. also bringing guests that have incredible stories and historical perspectives on the game. With soccer experience spanning 20 years, a Rolodex is open to bring you the voices and opinions you want. Sit back at wherever you are in the world. enjoy today's episode.
Unknown Speaker :Welcome listeners to inside soccer. This is Episode 14. And we're going off the script today. That's right, no opening, no reading stuff. We're going way off the script. And there's two reasons why one, if you're a regular listener to inside soccer and one of our intelligente you've already figured out that I just said Episode 14 and the last one you heard was Episode 12. So you're trying to figure out what happened To Episode 13 Well, it is in a digital garbage can. we wrestled with it last week for hours, and decided that the quality of audio was not up to par for our listeners, and we trashed it and threw it away and there will never ever be an episode 13 unless the Chinese CIA find it. Where are we? So it's gone. And for those of you that are awaiting your seat for 13, we're going to 14 and we don't need a script for 14 because we've already made the show once it was called 13. The second reason is maybe even more important, and that is today's guest has been off to script since probably birth, and for good reason. He is smarter than most scripts, and has done an incredible job as a player coach, talent evaluator, international player, national team player, member of the Hall of Fame I have great respect for his innate ability to out think and out see people. When people talk about seeing around corners, this guy can do it. His eyes in his mind Don't lie to each other. What he sees he knows what he knows he sees is able to pick out talent and develop it like no other person I know of in this country has been a great player and plays with a rage to be successful and attention to detail that the great ones have so we are fortunate to have a member of the US Soccer Hall of Fame with us today. Eric Wynalda Welcome to Inside soccer Episode 14. Right so we're
Unknown Speaker :basically like a, a
Unknown Speaker :hotel that doesn't have a 13th floor so you don't have to push 13 on the on the elevator.
Unknown Speaker :That's right, you know, and I'm not superstitious and if you remember as we were trying to record what was called Episode One dash three I actually refused a call at 30 which probably is what jinxed I've never I've never been superstitious until last week and now I will never ever out of those words again welcome to Episode 14
Unknown Speaker :yeah awesome. I'm glad it worked out I do apologize that's that's what I get for taking the first vacation I've had in years so we'll just dealing with the repercussions of that that's fine.
Unknown Speaker :We're happy you gave the old college try so here we are. So let's get started. We've got listeners from around the world actually who are will tune in and follow along and again, we're we're really excited to have you here. So let's start with the basics. How and where did you get involved with soccer and why did you get involved with soccer?
Unknown Speaker :All right, so here we go with a deja vu but it'll look it was there was the mid 70s soccer was very new in the United States and it was new to my family and specifically my father. Who was, you know, a Princeton football player. So this was all stuff that we were kind of learning as we went but I do remember it vividly. The first time I was introduced to the sport was at a McDonald's on Canaan Boulevard in Thousand Oaks get well actually in Agoura California. Just off the 101 my dad had it all planned he we went to McDonald's and we were going to go watch a soccer game and I had never heard of soccer before. That was the first time I remember my dad saying to my brother, and I want you guys to be soccer players. Now that the word itself scared me because I didn't know what it meant. I was young, I was only five. And I thought it meant like sock like punch, you know, and at that moment, some kids woken walked into McDonald's and we're just eating and they all had soccer uniforms on so that's that visual that big white, a YSL patch right in the middle of a right on the crest of the shirt and I remember I went to a game, we sat on a hill, this little park called orchard I believe it's called. And we watched the game. And back then it was 11 versus 11. with six year old kids run around, so it's a full field. So you got some kids over there in the corner picking daisies and they got other kids that look like they're engaged. But for the most part, sometimes you could be 7080 yards away from the ball. So it's very different than the way it is today. But I just remember one kid, getting the ball and watching him play and recognizing immediately that he was on a different level than everybody else and the things that he could do with the ball the way he could manipulate it, and his movement, his speed and just make another kids look silly. And that was the moment I was hooked. I just wanted to be in that moment. I wanted to be that kid. I wanted to be just like what he was doing. And of course, we went out bought a soccer ball and the rest History I just was attached to whatever ball I had. And I got lucky I lived right across the street from a park. And to this day, it's still a memory in our family that was always the same deal. My, my, somebody from my family would have to come outside and honk the horn twice, because it was usually pitch black. And that was the cue for me to come home. And that's that's something we still joke about today. But that was the moment that was really the moment where I I just, I just fell in love with the game. And that's that's when we got involved. We quit we we played our first season very shortly thereafter. The funny story on that and was by Kyle What was his name? Dan Galvin was my first coach. And I was on the little Eagles was the name of the team, and they made me goalkeeper. And it was the worst day of my life. They score it on me six or seven times. And every time I pick it out or throw it out there, come right back in They'd score and I was crying and my dad was behind the goal. And he was don't you? Don't you walk off the field and stop crying and just being being dead, right? I eventually made a save, I put the ball down, proceeded to dribble the entire team and score, ran off of the field, took my shirt off, threw it at my coach, and put my hand in my hands and cried on the sidelines. And the next thing that I don't really remember, but my dad tells a story that one of the other parents said, well give them a green shirt. Yeah, let's get them out of the goal. Dammit. And that was the beginning of my opportunity to be on the field and play but I was so frustrated that my first my first day was a goalkeeper. We're in the big white long sleeve jersey and all the other kids are wearing a green and white jersey. And then I finally got my chance to just dribble and I said forget it. This is this is the way this is going to go and it's a it's a it's a bittersweet memory but it really was something that still stuck with me to this day. But ever since five man five, five and a half years old with an older brother about 18 months older we get my butt kicked every week made me better but that was the that was the origin of everything.
Unknown Speaker :You've managed to stir up a bunch of memories for me and just remind me how poor of a father I really was and am some days My oldest daughter also first touched a soccer ball in Southern California, probably five or six years old. Luckily, it wasn't 1111 yet. And she scores five goals the first time she's ever been on the field. And the next week we're driving up and I remember very clearly she's like that. I might score seven right this week I pull over and start lecturing her out most games are 0010 and she needs to put it in perspective and you know, button it up a little bit a little thing. And now I'm thinking maybe she could have been the most prolific scorer ever. I think about the fire and Second game ever?
Unknown Speaker :Well, I think kids are great. I mean, with my children. My oldest is now 21. My second oldest is 18. And I have a 15 and a half year old who's just as of I guess, June 15. colleges were allowed to call her and we got about 47 calls. So we were navigating through what could be a pretty promising career with her but but the story behind that is, I remember being at the old Home Depot center. And they they did a game where they honored some of the older guys, so they put us up and it's like Marcello, and john and tab and Tony and all the guys that we they put this great video up of us, in our heyday, and all of us had our kids on the field and I was holding hands with my at that point, Timmy was about five years old. So he's right at that same stage where he's gonna be, you know, asked you know, he's gonna start playing and He looks up at me. He broke my heart. He looked up at me and he said, Dad, I don't want to play soccer. Right? And then that in that moment after watching that video, and I thought this would inspire him. And I said, why not buddy and he goes, I'll just never be as good as you. And it really hurt. It was like No, man, that's not why you play it. So that you go into dad mode and say you play for fun and it doesn't matter and you know, whatever. So flash forward a couple years later, when Tatum might now 15 year old was about the same age. She plays her first game, and my dad was on his way there. But he wasn't there yet. And Tatum goes out there and proceeds to score six goals in the first five minutes of the game. And she is amazing. I mean, it's either seeming like it right I'm so proud. I think all these dad emotions going on. I call my dad I got you got to get here and see this. This is unreal. So to give you an idea of how different she is from my My son, at the end of that game, I walked over to her, she had the little pigtails and she looked all cute and, you know, ribbons in her hair and the whole bit and I walked up to her and I said, I'm so proud of you. You did great today. And she motioned to come here, like, get come close. And she grabbed my face bill, and she looked at me and she said, I'm gonna be so much better. Did you ever work? And then, yeah, at the age of five, so it gives you an idea of how different kids can be and how, how this all works out and I'll tell you what she might be right. She is splitting the DA last year. Clearly the DA got shut down. The guess the last couple of gay okay. They send out reports and she was the number two leading scorer in the whole country. So and that's from right wing, so she's clearly got something. She's got her her mom's mind and her dad's aggression, let's just let's just use that but she's uh she's she's doing really well. So that's that's a long story but that's that's how it works sometimes with kids you never know.
Unknown Speaker :So we're gonna keep an eye on this because this whole college process is something that I want to do a podcast on in the future and I'm just sort of gathering some information but I find it interesting how things have changed in the days when when I was recruited to play American football and what's happening today with these kids and how it's done and and how many people are trying to reach into my pocket and having money and I'm like, I don't think I need to do that. But anyway, that leads me to the next question then and that is when did you know you were something special?
Unknown Speaker :Hey, honestly, and this is gonna sound really arrogant and crazy, but first time I ever played first time I ever touched the ball. I I just had this This inner feeling that one had loved it, I loved plan. I couldn't, I couldn't get enough of it. And I just did the idea of figuring out new ways to out think or outplay somebody just became an obsession for me. And, you know, when you're younger, it's always the same that some kids really, you know, aren't going to be very good right away. And I just really, really enjoyed the aspect of of dominating. When I was young now. I used to my father has clearly had a huge influence on my life. He, he put a couple of thoughts in my mind, which I never forgot. He said, The worst thing that anybody could ever say about you is that you had great potential. So that was always something that drove me and the other one was, every time I thought I had done well, he would always say, I don't know that other kid number 14 on the other day, I think he was A little better than you drive just would drive me crazy. So I was always, always pushing myself to get better. But I think that that was a, it was a good relationship. You know, it was it was, it was always something that I viewed as a positive even though there were plenty of times where I got knocked back or a notch or beat up a little bit, or I didn't have good games I tried to play up and i and i got reminded that this is a tough game, especially when the kids are older and bigger and faster. But all of those, all of those aspects of it just kept driving me to get better. And I always wanted to see how far I could take it almost to a fault but it was very young. It was very young, I just loved and there's It's crazy, I could still close my eyes. And remember goals that I score when I was 789 years old. And that's, you know, a gift and a curse at the same time. But it's it's those little moments that stuck with me. It's always interesting for me to think back to my memory of what were the most influences and what things do I really what did I take with me? What did I remember about my childhood and it's they're always soccer related
Unknown Speaker :it's interesting I watched a show last night I don't know it was called it was on one of the platforms Netflix or whatever I don't even know which one it was it had Wayne Gretzky on it.
Unknown Speaker :And
Unknown Speaker :Jerry Rice and actually some some pay lay in there although that seemed a little bit almost token and they were talking about being you know, great, great players and their sport. And and and to the things that really struck me one was this sounds like you won was they never thought of it as work and even though their parents may say hey, you need to go out and and take 1000 shots here on the back board. They never thought it was work and most of the time just like you said they had to be called in you know, they would stay out there all day. It was it was fun. It was that is that soccer to you.
Unknown Speaker :It always has been Yeah. And the the The other one that I always think of because I was very fortunate in when I was just in my beginning stages of my career, I got to meet Wayne Gretzky through some mutual friends and got to spend a little time with him. It's actually a Westlake Village residents. So I'd see him, I would see him when I would go to this place called GLaDOS. And watch the Champions League. He would always come in with his family. And I actually very briefly got to know his son Tristan, who was an aspiring soccer player, but we used to talk about that. And just because soccer was growing, and he had a lot of questions, but his childhood and his love for hockey was always the driving force. And, you know, when you go, you start talking about other athletes who have had great careers or and or just just lasted a long time, but it's always going to come back to that love of playing. It always will. And it's Something that you need to be really cautious of all of us do. Because we we make that assumption that if you work at something for a long time, you'll just naturally get better at it. But there's also this thing of what what kind of work is it? And how much are you putting into it? Because even when I train my teams today, everybody says, Well, you don't train long enough. And I said, exactly. Because when that's 65th 70th minute comes around, I'm blowing the whistle, and we're done. And the same thing happens every time. Eight or eight or nine guys can't wait to get out of there. Eight or nine guys are like, come on, coach, let us keep going. And that's when you find out who the players are. That's when you find out who's there because they love it and who's there because they're obligated to be there. So it's a it's always a true test of character.
Unknown Speaker :Yeah, that's they touched on that they touched on soccer specifically about the great players. You know, are the ones that played a lot more unstructured. And you're gonna tell me this back in 2000 great players have always spent time playing, you know, unstructured football. And that's one of the challenges in this country is they grab these kids at an early age and say, This is gonna be your position for the rest of your life. And chances are, that's not your position. And you don't really get a chance to learn a game because you're stuck in one hole. But Jerry had an interesting comment last night that plays into what you just said. And that was, they started questioning like, well, Jerry, everybody, you know, it's professional sports, everyone gets paid to work hard and train and be ready to go. And Jerry being Jerry just sort of pauses and looks at the person asking the questions and go Yeah, I'm not sure that's 100% accurate. Because Because I'm not sure everybody does give 100% he goes no, right. Their talent is beyond anything the average person has But that doesn't mean that given 100% He goes, I gave 100% every day, every minute to this game. And so my question to you, you've, you've had an international career. So let's take this one step further. The difference between being a domestic player and playing internationally for the National Student national team first because we're gonna hit Bundesliga, but let's hit national team first. what really separates those two groups of players?
Unknown Speaker :That's a great question. And it's something that I've struggled with. I guess a one way to do it as I won't bring the name into it. But it's consistent with my upbringing. But I remember, at the end of my career, I was 31 years old, I was still on the national team. Bruce arena was our coach. And let's just say this young, forward was just breaking into the team. And we were just doing a little possession game five versus five and he had an attitude He kind of called me the old man for some reason, and elbowed me in the face. And I was, I had a small cut the top of my lip, and it was a it was. It was deliberate. And it was his way of sending a message to me as if I'm here and I'm thinking to myself, no, embrace this. This is good. This is a guy that, that that's that wants to prove something this is in no way shape, or form personal. This is a guy that wants to be on the national team. And a lot of people were like, Wow, I can't believe you didn't let that guy have it. And it's if that's not the way this works, the difference in the two attitudes. What I did say to him, as I said, You know what, I've been here for over a decade you don't think I've seen you before. The one thing I know about you is that you come and go and I'm still here, you got that. And I said that privately in his ear. And he turned around and looked at me and I said because of this. We're war. you'd already be dead. And I got my message across. And I also told him, the next time you get the ball, I might break you in half, because I wanted to see how he'd react. But he didn't get scared. He wanted play. He was he was ready and and, and he was gonna have fun with that. I'm gonna say the name it was quite math. And Clint and I are brilliant friends even to this day. But the reality was, is there's a guy who's going to put the jersey on, he's going to stand up in front of his nation on television, will all those people watch it or all those people care? And you're going to have a moment where you have to be able to trust yourself and your abilities to the extent where you almost have to just say something to it doesn't matter because it matters more than anything, but you have to let go. You have to let go of your mind. And you can't let your mind control what's going to happen in the next 90 minutes. You have to let your ability take over. And that's the difference. And it's really hard to get there. Sometimes there's, there's four kinds of thought processes if you're or it's what's called an incompetent, unconscious incompetence versus incompetent consciousness. And then competent, conscious and conscious. Income incompetence. So it's so those four versions of it, the reality is, is unconscious competent behavior is where all the beautiful stuff happened. And it's only equates to about two to 3% of what you see out there. Those are the moments where you're not thinking about it, you're just doing it. That's, that's, it's called being in the zone. It's He has a whole kind of everybody has different ways of describing it. However, the players who have that trust themself and have trained themselves appropriately can go to unconscious competence. And if you can't get there, you'll never be special. And that's just the reality of it. No one. Everybody always assumes that if you're a conscious behavior and competence, that should be the best, you are aware of how good you can be. But that's, that's, that's your crutch. That's because instead of the ball coming to you, and you're not thinking about it twice, you just smash it in the top corner. And that great moment happens because your your ability took over. It's the ones who think about it. That usually Miss and that's a really weird answer, but that is the difference between the highest level and a very high level. And it's those moments where a way you want to call it being in the zone or whatever. The scientific term is unconscious competence. That's and that's, that's a that's something that that that that you can get there. That is the difference. And it's a hard place to be.
Unknown Speaker :I think that's well said, well put, I understand it. I'm sure some others will want to rewind and listen to it again. But I think that's absolutely spot on, and definitely the truth. So thank you for that. So let's, let's keep moving. You played it in Germany. And I want to hear in your words, a little bit of that journey. But today's player is faced or some of the better players are being faced with the question. Should I go play in Europe? Should I not go play in Europe? And maybe the Times have changed Eric since the time you went over and you're, you were plowing snow when you went over there as far as an American. But let's start off with how did you end up in Europe? Europe, did Europe come for you? Did you go for Europe? Was it a Mutual a sort of journey to get started over there. And and finish it off, if you will. What's your thoughts on if? If a young player today has a choice of playing in Europe or not? Should they do it?
Unknown Speaker :Right? And that's the hundred million dollar question or specifically the $73 million question if we're talking about Christian pulisic. But if if I'm being honest when I and plowing snow or wherever you want to call it, when I made my way over to Europe, it was always the goal. It was always because at that point in 9192, and 93 I mean that's where the best soccer was being played. We didn't have a domestically that we could call major and in any sense of the word, and to be perfectly frank, I still don't think we do. But if we look at what was out there back then and what you were watching and watching AC Milan, do what they were doing it Watching Bayern Munich. And what that was like to the German Bundesliga at that the year before. I was actually Stuttgart finally knocked them off their pedestal and it was a different ballgame. But I always wanted to go to Europe. And even today, you'll have thousands of players and kids say I want to go to Europe cheap. Where do you want to go? This I don't care. I'll go anywhere. That is the most naive, stupid thing that you can ever for one second think. But just because it's across the pond, that means it's better. There are so many pieces to to being in Europe and the right fit for the player. Because you could be a great player and go to Spain and it just doesn't work. It's not you're never going to you're never going to be able to play there. It's just it's just not the style of football because of the player that you are. So there's so many other small little details that that made be considered the biggest difference is and always will be that that 5% of how much more important it is over there. How much more important it is to the public, to the community, to the history to the the 87 year old grandfather, who comes and watches practice, and wants to talk to you about what it was like in 1960 and 1950. For that matter, though, those that consistency and that history is all part of it. But the importance of each game and each minute to the public. It's not just something that they watch. It's not entertainment to them. It's not, it's their life. This is our club. This is this is who we support. We're not fans, we're supporters, and we will support you no matter what. And when when you lose over there. It hurts them. You know, and I made a joke about this on a German television show about A month and a half ago, I said the problem in America is that, you know, you lose the game and everybody says, Oh, we lost What do you want for dinner? About? So you would say,
Unknown Speaker :and in
Unknown Speaker :Germany or in Europe, for that matter, when all the clubs that I've been associated with when you lose a game, you don't feel like eating at all. You're sick to your stomach, because you know of the implications and the ramifications of the loss. You know, what, Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday is gonna look like and what's gonna feel like, and the responsibility that you have to your public into your city into the, to the jersey you're wearing, that's the difference. And that little percentage really creates the environments that that are so much more competitive than what we're able to create here. Because at the end of the day, we're going to lose, everybody's gonna go to dinner. And the subject is going to change and people are going to pretend to be sad, but what do they really lose? Right is that it does not Have a monetary value. But when you lose respect from your constituents from the people that you are watching you from, from the fans from other teams, your career is going in the wrong direction. Over there, over here, it's just a bad day. over in Europe, it's a life changer. And every, every moment matters and you learn that when you're in it until you're in it, you don't know what you're talking about. Until you understand that and ffiv to on a Friday, before a really big game of your own teammates tries to take you out. And you accept it because it's a professional understanding that he's going to try and make you better every day. And also he might have a buddy that he'd rather see make money on Saturday then you but you don't get mad about it. You just jump higher, you put your head on a swivel. And you recognize that this is important to everybody. And when everything's important to everybody, everybody gets better. Now, can we can we duplicate that in the United States? I'm not entirely sure that's, that's all the way there. And when I in the answer your question, if I was given the option to stay here or go, the answer is go. If you have the right situation, and you have the talent to not, not just embarrass yourself over there, but you can have the ambition and the talent to grow and put yourself in the right environment. The answer is right now you need to go you need to go over there.
Unknown Speaker :Yeah, I tend to agree. I think if you've got the talent to go play, you know, even a second or third division, and you love the game. You want to go experience that because everything you just talked About is is true and it's it's magnified 1000 times. I grew up in western PA, we didn't even have soccer in our school, we played football, everybody played football, if you're a male, he played and there was no choice. I'd raced motorcycles and the guys in the neighborhood said, well, you're ready to start playing football. I said, No, they said, we'll beat you up every day. And they're dead serious. So I started playing
Unknown Speaker :well, you know,
Unknown Speaker :I took less of a beating. And, you know, I can remember go on to away games, and we had to have multiple buses, everybody lay down in the seats and people in this town, were throwing rocks and oranges at us and the whole thing and little kids throwing rocks at us on the field and it at some point in your life, you're like, you look back, you know, that was a little strange. But then after spending time in Europe and seeing how popular soccer is and starting to understand that culture, I go back and start to realize how important you know football was culture in western Pennsylvania. It was everybody's acting Escape, but it was life it was it represented our area. That team represented our area. If we were winners, they were winners. If we were losers, they were losers. And I saw the same thing. I lived in Europe for 10 years, different locations. And it's just really hard to explain to someone who hasn't been there. Just how powerful that microscope is. What it really means to everyone in a community or in a region even sometimes. And I mean, it's generation after generation. And it's, it's really cool. It can get a little scary at times. I've been at some scrap matches, but it's important and I agree, I think if somebody gets a chance, even if they're not going to be the next Christian pulisic you know, to go over there and live and yeah, experience it live on your own and, and it feels a game at a different place and then come back if you want to and To finish it up, so Yeah, I agree 100%. So, okay, so let's move on to one more question. And then we've got a few of them, we're going to do sort of rapid fire because we're chewing up the clock here, which is a good thing. This is going fantastically well. But share with our listeners, what it meant to you to be selected and inducted into the Hall of Fame.
Unknown Speaker :Well, I mean, clearly the Hall of Fame is a reflection of, you know, the full body of work. And you'd like to think, you know, when you're done, that you've had an influence. And that's, that's, that's really what it is about. I mean, did you really dedicate yourself and yeah, of course, yeah, there's a couple of really outstanding moments along the way that define how people remember you what your legacy is. But going into the Hall of Fame, it's really it's the full, full body of work where you you've recognized for your your contributions to the game. I saw a really great interview
Unknown Speaker :with Jurgen Klopp the other day and
Unknown Speaker :one of the things that was asked is, you know, is it all about winning? is it all about trophies? And he just said a typical German, you know, German big smile. Look, he says, you know, I'm going to kneel before my God when this is over, and I don't think he's going to ask me how many trophies I want. I don't think that's going to be the question. I think it's it's was a good servant leader was I, someone who helped people around me grow not just as in the footballing world or soccer but as human beings. And I tend to think that, that that's what the Hall of Fame really represents. When you when you When I was inducted, I was inducted with Paul caligiuri and Michelle Akers. And God love her. She is probably one of the greatest soccer players this country has ever produced, but she's also one of the greatest human beings you'll ever meet. So I'm so honored to go in with her and Paul because they're the two people that I love dearly but I it means the world to you, you know you you but the part of it that that's also important is is the work doesn't stop you. You don't stop caring like oh, I made the Hall of Fame. I'm done here. What am I gonna do with my life? You You really
Unknown Speaker :responsibility there's actually more responsible, right carry with and it's
Unknown Speaker :and you got to give back and it's those who give more or or less. It really defines what kind of person they always were. But I think that the accomplishment itself isn't really what it's about. It's being a part of so many great people who have made so many things. great strides in this country, for example, to make us a better soccer nation. So be a part of that group is the way I look at it, and I get to vote every year. So I, I have my criteria as to why I vote for certain people. And some of my selections might surprise others. But I'd like to continue the tradition of the Hall of Fame being full of people that really deserves to be in there, but not for just for what they did on the field, but off the field as well.
Unknown Speaker :Well, we're gonna try to do a Hall of Fame podcast in the second season. So we'll keep you in mind maybe come back and offer some of those thoughts as to the thinking you have and also what you think the Hall of Fame represents today and should represent going forward. Let me get through a few questions. I call this rapid fire it can be a one word answer can be a minute or so but we're going to move a little bit quickly and then finish with a couple of More serious questions that I think our listeners really want to hear your thought on. So, here we go first first question, toughest competitor.
Unknown Speaker :I will always go back to one guy
Unknown Speaker :that really does ruin my my ideas of what I thought I was as a player. It's Juergen Kohler as a German, but you know, if you watch that guy played you Ventus with Dortmund, or, you know, throughout his career, I just never had a good day against I never really even had a decent moment against that guy. He always got the best of me. You know, and I think you know, even in the same game, I remember having a couple of times where I beat Luther Mathias and you know, it's a great compliment when when he tackles you and he's trying to put that that you know, that captain's attitude towards the referee like Oh, sorry, I didn't really mean to hit him or what he leaned over and he whispered in my ear, he said, You're too fast for me. And I always thought, God, what a great compliment from it. One of the but that's just the way he is he was always so kind but that that there was there was some malice behind that that compliment somewhere down the road in the game so you're again you're exactly but you're gonna wasn't that way you're gonna you're gonna which was just all business but there was a smile on a wink when he knew he had you in his back pocket and it was just devastating the guy but I played to get some of the better players in the world at that time, whether it be by AC or Maldini on the Italian side. Christian borns was a guy that mark seemed like Mark me a lot in those those years but there was a ton of great German defenders goalkeepers yen's Lehmann Oliver con Botha I mean all of them were very good competitors but cooler stands out the most he was that was one tough, tough sob he was he was this goes against
Unknown Speaker :well qualities make a great coach and who was who would you call your best coach?
Unknown Speaker :I think I think listening and communicating is such a big part of, of managing. If the beginning of leader I guess leading is by show Alex Ferguson, there's, there's a great little line in there about how, you know, he's seen coaches that could talk underwater for days, but they don't really employ them the most important aspect, they have another job and that's to listen and it doesn't cost you anything, just to listen and to learn. So I try to implement those kind of things into my my coaching style, the greatest, the greatest coaches, I think the biggest influencers on the American side were Bob, but to Bob's Bob ganzer and Bob Bradley. Really just people I have immense respect for and Kind of like, it just makes sense. They got me they, they took the time to figure out what made me tick. They didn't tell me what to do and they weren't gonna go there with me they would simply they simply are in their own way figured out how to get the most out of me and I think that's what it's all about Klaus top molar in Germany for me was, was just a different level of just intuition and understanding of the game. tactically, he was on a very high level but he he was never It was no fear in that man of, of trusting his instincts to change a game. And as players we we listen to them and we believe them and it was always I look back at it now and I really am blessed that I was coached by Klaus because he really he had an understanding of america he played in America but you know, this is a guy that took Liverpool's into the Champions League Final And last is add ons beautiful volley, but this is a guy that knew how to manage the top top players and get the most out of them, and then inspire the younger players, or maybe the players with lesser talent to get the most out of them as well. So I've always appreciated him as a manager.
Unknown Speaker :I've talked to you about this before, I think there may only be a limited number of people who truly understand your gift here, but you really do have a gift. What makes a great talent evaluator?
Unknown Speaker :I think it's, it's, as some of the things I just mentioned, but I think you got to know what it looks like. You have to really, it's it's such a weird thing. And we were just talking about this with with, you know, some other friends and some coaches and we all have these scouting jobs or we all have different opinions about players and, and I have found over the years that my opinions about certain players, you know, differ. I mean, we were on totally different sides of the spectrum with some some players And and you know when I said many, many years ago that I thought Jeff Cameron was a lot better than we thought he was. And he ended up having a amazing career. And there's a lot of people that said, This guy would never even make it into Major League Soccer. And there was people that I had hold in high regard that just didn't see it. Now, what makes a great evaluator is seeing what they're great they're good at and figuring out how to make them great at that and honing in on the the positives too many times our coaches in this country will turn into what I call a Yeah, but uh, yeah, but it's somebody that no matter what you say to them, the first thing out of their mouth is Yeah, but he can't do this. Yeah, but he can't do that. Yeah, but and it drives me nuts because the habits are not important. What is important is what does this player have what is the personality of this player? What are they good at and recognizing what it is? Really good is the important part, what happens so many times is that the negatives are the things that they can't do outweigh that one gleaming positive thing that they're very, they're very good at. And it would make them a very good asset to any team if you can structure the team appropriately. So I never give up on people and I when I see talent in somebody, I love to hone in on the good. I think it's, I think it's the biggest difference because you've we've forced players into play in positions they're not good at we teach their bodies to learn the game all over again, physiologically, and that's just wrong. It's we need to recognize the player identify what the talents are, really know what you're looking at, and then know how to apply that into a game and that's that's that stuff. Somewhere along the line. I don't know how everybody else manages to mess it up, but they, they certainly do more often than not,
Unknown Speaker :I think a lot of people miss certain experiences. You know, you've been fortunate enough to play Coach, and scout. And I think a lot of people don't have all three of those. But to me, and I was fortunate enough to scout American football players for a couple years when I was younger, good ones, NFL guys. And I coined this term. So I'm going to continue to use it and use and use and use and use it. But your eyes and your mind have to be truthful to each other. They can't tell you what you say, your mind has to understand exactly what it is. And you can't make it into something else. It is what it is. And at the same time, your mind has to understand what your eyes see. And then that's where the creativity comes in. You know, can we take this that I'm looking at and make it into something else? No guarantees, but do we think there's a chance so anyway, I mean, we should do a whole we should do a whole damn week on town evaluation and more importantly, how we're going to get it done in this country because it's it's is such a big geographical challenge in my mind. It's easy to scout players in Holland or Germany. It is really really
Unknown Speaker :but it's, but it's a great it's a great point. But the what else what also we need to realize? And before I forget, I would encourage all of your listeners to go watch the movie Seabiscuit. And there is a scene in that movie. The name of the actor is escaping me. It's Chris something but he he is the traitor. And he sees Seabiscuit for the first time at five o'clock in the morning on a walk. And he's gonna wesen is his voice and and there's a scene. Whereas he just looks at him and says God Damn, and it's like, that's what it looks like he could see talent for some see right through all of the stuff that other people get caught up in. And he looked the horse in the eye and saw something and then this story, you know turns in to what it what it becomes. But you know what my point where I was going to make about the United States is we need to encourage each state and each region to start accepting the influences of where they live. And allowing that personality specific to the region to be who they are, as opposed to try and collectively change them into one big style of play. It's impossible. It's impossible to take the Cuban out of the kid in Florida. Don't try. Let embrace it and allow that kid to be who he is. It's impossible to take sometimes like almost like a like a blue collar. You know, in Chicago, where you got these kids who come from different backgrounds, and maybe they're their parents or Polish or whatever, and that kids just mean and he's going to play the game his way. We try to change that, as opposed to try to figure out how to put the puzzle together. So to your point, it's a big geographical problem, but it only until unless we make it into a problem.
Unknown Speaker :The influence is accepted rather than find it. Our article awesome.
Unknown Speaker :Our personalities of our players should change across the country just as much as their accents do. And that's and a dude, let's go surfing. That's still an attitude that can be implemented into the game because the way they're going to play as the same as the Hey, what are you looking at from New York? I mean, there's, there's attitudes that that are sometimes even specific to the way they talk, but and we need to embrace that and understand that Yeah, the United States is big, we get it, but trying to pigeonhole everybody into a certain specific role is not Not gonna work? Because guess what? Germany's the size of Texas? And it's easier for them? Yeah, okay. It's just easier. Yeah, Portugal is not even as big as Florida. So they, but they're gonna play the way they want to play and look at what Earl Grey has done. Look at what Belgium has done to really hone in on a specific way of playing in a winner personality. It's easier when there's less people. But you got I don't know how many people live in Belgium. I know. It's a little over 4 million. I live in arroway. And that's a team that almost made it to the semi finals of a World Cup. Look at the Netherlands. These are all countries that once they have the ability to hone in on one way of thinking, of course, it's going to be easier. Our challenge is to figure out to have a methodology and a philosophy that's going to work for very different people as we go along the way. from position to position, personality, the personality, the name, the name, as you can see the the influences of of where their backgrounds and the person that they become the player they become because of their ethnicity. I think that's a big part of it, we got to start thinking about that I got my wheels spinning. Okay,
Unknown Speaker :we got I think we're gonna have to come back and spend more time on that one because that makes a lot of that's a whole show
Unknown Speaker :on its
Unknown Speaker :show. And it's an important show though, because that's the first time I've heard it articulated that way. And I have said, I'm not taking credit for anything here. I've said we should divide the country up into six regions, and just let them organize themselves and take each other on And the winner is the winner who gives a shit but right you know, it's it's it's stop trying to come up with one answer and but I didn't articulate it the way you did, which makes a lot more sense and I think is more sellable. So we'll be back people. We're gonna come back and do this. Two more questions. Eric one, we asked everybody this so it's not it's not special. Just for you. But what do you do better than anyone else in your mind?
Unknown Speaker :I think this is a very more more recent thing. And I learned this as a coach as I get older. You know, 51 now it's hard to believe that I'm 51 years old. I think they put up something yesterday on Twitter that I scored a goal for Chicago 19 years ago in the last section of the game, and I'm looking at that picture going.
Unknown Speaker :But as a human being
Unknown Speaker :and as a dad, and just somebody that's that's dedicated to the idea that you got to always keep learning. And then a lot of that learning has to be about yourself. You have to learn about who you are and what what you are good at. And I think this is more recent for me, but I've become a better person to be in the moment to live in in moments and it helps me immensely. It helped me immensely as a player. And it helps me now as a coach, but more more so than anything. I think. What I do better right now is I'm present. You know how many how many people have you met in your life where you're at a cocktail party or a game or a meeting or whatever and or airport, it doesn't matter, and they're talking to you, but they're so distracted that they're looking over your shoulder. They're thinking about the next thing they're going to say. They they're not really focused on listening. And more recently, as I've gotten older, I've recognized the importance of that being present, especially with my kids, especially with my kids that that phone call is not as important as I can pretend that it is. Whatever she or he is about to say is more important than anything and it deserves my undivided attention. So that's, that's something that I'm striving to get better at. But it is the one thing that I'm very proud that I've been able to change as as, as time has gone on here that I can be more present in a moment. And I'm seeing I'm seeing that it helps me in a lot of different ways, not just not just at the Soccer World.
Unknown Speaker :No, absolutely. There's some mindfulness there that will reward you over and over again in all different sort of scenarios in your life for sure. But it starts with that starts with being present. And especially for those that you share a roof with so that's, that's fantastic. Last question, Eric. What is next for Eric Wynalda?
Unknown Speaker :So
Unknown Speaker :and I think you and I have discussed this on a different plane maybe but you know, I it's not out of frustration. It's not out of maybe just a misguided anger. It's nothing like that at all. But I you know, we just spent some time talking about Europe and what what that's like, and that experience
Unknown Speaker :and my memories come back
Unknown Speaker :Force these days, I do have an opportunity to, to jump, jump back over to Europe, discuss it with the family, the wife is on board. And I think it will be the case where I want to coach I want to manage. And if I can't seem to figure out the right destination in the United States, I don't want to wait. You know, for that to happen, I there is some opportunity for me in Europe and so I will be eating food and going about life a little differently and providing a pretty unique experience for my kids. But Europe is going to be my destination within the next couple of months, specifically Germany. So I'm looking forward to that challenge.
Unknown Speaker :Well, we're looking forward to being able to share it obviously, with our listeners when the time is right and and to follow you and see what those next challenges are and how you address them. But Again, Eric, I want to thank you for taking time out to join us and to share with us. And if you're a listener on inside soccer, you've been treated to a heck of a ride here and a great journey deep into the game, which is what we promised you from the outset. And we hope you enjoyed it. So we've got one more to do in season one, one more episode to do in season one, and we'll regroup and come back later this summer, but stay tuned Friday for one more episode. Eric, best of luck with everything you do. And thank you again for your time and for your insight. Thank you.
Unknown Speaker :Always a pleasure talking to you.