Almost Brothers Podcast
Whats up whats up whats up.. welcome to your new favorite podcast. Join your hosts Michael, Richard, and Tyler as we discuss God, church, life, and the journey through this crazy world. Get away from the stresses of life with this podcast. We will be hitting on various topics from sports, to life with Christ.
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Almost Brothers Podcast
Trapped and Found
BONUS EPISODE WITH OUR BROTHERS FROM THE VERTICAL PODCAST.
The room already felt different—like a youth weekend that refuses to end when the lights go down. We invited Michael Simmons and Rich Randall into a raw, wide-ranging conversation about what it means to be “trapped in sin,” and why lasting change starts when love—not guilt—pulls you toward God. From David and Samson to Judas and Barabbas, we explore how scripture opens up when you stop assuming you’re always the hero. Maybe you’re Delilah under pressure, or Uriah blindsided by someone else’s choices. That shift isn’t just interesting—it’s freeing.
We also wrestle with the practical stuff no one wants to talk about: how to balance clock-time and compassion, why discernment matters more than rigid schedules, and how a “late start” became the timely welcome a hesitant visitor needed. Along the way, we get honest about anger, lust, anxiety, and the difference between pulling weeds and treating the soil. Surface fixes don’t last. Root work does. That means naming the real issue, setting guardrails, and choosing the right people to walk with you. It’s not spectacle; it’s discipleship.
Leadership isn’t spared. Pedestals are lonely and dangerous, and polished distance invites collapse. We press into transparency, accountability, and the relief that comes when a church expects humanity from its leaders while aiming for holiness together. And we light a path forward for students who refuse to let graduation end their growth—building a young adult bridge, creating mission opportunities, and protecting the spark that started this weekend. If you’re hungry for faith that goes beyond altars and into everyday choices, this conversation will meet you where you are and point you where you’re going.
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Welcome to the Burbab, where you want some rocks. That's where Teddy looks better than flying from the shipbox. Moody's gonna have a club or hair over the next hour. And trust me, you don't want to miss this thing in a second.
SPEAKER_05:We really are. Um, we are here with Michael and Rich. Um, Michael, why don't you start out and kind of tell us who you are, why you're here, and then Rich can tell us all his life story.
SPEAKER_06:Oh boy, yeah.
SPEAKER_05:You can just tell us whatever you want to tell us and kind of where we're going this weekend with everything. So if you don't mind, Michael Simmons.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, what's up, everybody? My name is Michael Simmons. I'm the lead pastor at Rector, Arkansas. Just glad to be here. I'm the speaker for the weekend and just absolutely blessed and honored to be able to be in the house, man. Just be here leveling up some youth and pouring into everybody, and and it's it's an amazing time. Just glad to be connected with Jerry. We connected probably five years ago, four or five years ago. And yeah, it's awesome to be here.
SPEAKER_05:Dude, I it was three years ago? Is it been that long or is it two?
SPEAKER_02:It's two years. So not last D now, but the D now before that.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So two first time we were like down.
SPEAKER_05:Two years ago. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Um what had happened was the first D now, I got hired about four years ago, and I called a guy, and this is a tragic story, actually. Um, he was gonna he was gonna come to our D now. He's gonna be our first D now speaker, all this good stuff. And the month before, it may have been two weeks. It was two weeks. It was close, yeah. Yeah. No, that was when you came. Yeah. Yes, that's right.
SPEAKER_02:So it was close to when it started.
SPEAKER_05:Yes. And I uh this was two or three years ago. Um, his son died in a car wreck. His he was like his son was like 18, 19 years old, and it was like one of those two in the morning knocks at the door type things. It I mean, I hated that. And I remember uh the next guy had line, like everything, I was like, No, not that you're second to that dude. I just had talked to him for a while. Um and I thought, I wonder who this Michael dude is. Okay, I'm gonna give him a ring or whatever, and it just kind of went from there. And he brings down Rich and his son Zeke and all those guys that do the D now, and I thought that's awesome. And it's just really bloom from there. And I'm it's been awesome, man. Um, sup, Rich.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, uh Richard Randall, aka Big Rich. I didn't ask, I didn't ask for the name. Are you sure? I am positive. But uh yeah, I'm from well, I live in Kenneth, Missouri right now. Um, I am a deacon, associate, pastor, rector, whatever you want to call my title. I don't know. I just help in everything.
SPEAKER_05:I love the no titles thing. That's that's awesome. Like that's what you do, but you're just like, whatever. I that I just want to help.
SPEAKER_03:I just do whatever whatever Mike tells me to do. That's what I do. Okay.
SPEAKER_02:And If he only did those two things, he would get a break from all the things that he does.
SPEAKER_03:But yeah, it uh me and Mike have been connected for six, seven years now, something like that. Yeah. Um, and I'm I I'm just super excited to be here this weekend because it's even I mean, it just started just like last night, and it already you've you've seen breakthroughs in some of these kids, and it's man, it's just an amazing thing to be a part of.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, absolutely. Uh disclaimer, um they have a podcast show called Almost Brothers Podcast. Almost Brothers Podcast. And we love that show, we heavily support that show. I wear this hat, Almost Brothers Podcast. I think every time I do this podcast, I have mentioned you guys, you called mid podcast one time. Yeah, I think that one had like five and a half thousand views just on Facebook alone. So they heard you. Yeah, and now that you can put a face through the voice, yeah. That's he called, we were in the middle of it, he called, and I was like, hold on, this is gonna be good. And I said, Hey man, you're on a podcast. I put on speaker and they could hear him in the it's that was pretty cool.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, I'm sorry. He's like, No, it's okay, you're wrong, man. And he goes, What are you doing with your life?
SPEAKER_05:Subscribe, what are y'all doing? Yeah, but it's awesome. Um, I'm glad you guys are here. I I agree about the weekend so far. Um, it's probably been one of the I'm not gonna say the best one because they're all great, but this is one that I've been anticipating. I'll put it that way. And I knew it was gonna be good because we've had speakers that we've had in the past. I think yes, everybody that's been a speaker or a worship leader or something are are here this weekend, either leading worship, speaking, or pouring into the kids. Like they all know you guys, and it's awesome having a familiar face.
SPEAKER_01:Um I think the best thing about this one is our our youth have been anticipating this for a while now. So, you know, we we made it through the summer, did all the mission trips and all the youth camps and everything, and we kept going through the whole summer. And when school started, we kind of started talking, you know, like things that we're looking forward to this year and and and where we want to go with things. And you know, it's it's gonna be very hard at the end of the year because we got a lot of seniors this year uh in the youth group. Um, and they all know it's their last year, but they've been talking for a while about how amped they are for this weekend. Um and they have brought so many of their friends in that I've never seen before. Same here. And and so it's like, man, that's awesome. Like they're going out, they're reaching out to their friends, they're bringing them in, getting them, you know, here for at least for the weekend to try to get them to to pour in and and you know buy in to uh to to being a part of the youth group and not being a loner anymore. And and just seeing the connections, seeing them at the host house, you know, last night, and and they're already bonding as one, even though they may not know each other and stuff like that. And so even the kids you guys brought down, I mean, they're already meshing. Right. Uh, and and so it's great to see you know how far a year has come from where they were last year at this point to where they are this you know now, and it's like, man, it's it's only getting better.
SPEAKER_05:Dude, something to take away from that, it's I've I know teenagers, and this applies for adults too. They fight it. They they're nervous, they don't know anybody, they don't want to go. And then they'll it and a lot of them what's sad is they'll come that senior year. It's like, well, I'm just gonna go because it's the only one I would get to go to. And then they go first night in. Why haven't I been doing this for the last three years? Why have I not been doing this? Why have I been fighting this? This is so good. It's not some weird cult experience where you know it's it's yeah, you know what I'm talking about. And they love it, and then they're sad at the end because they think, yeah, I'm about to graduate in like five four months, five months, and I could have been doing this for the last six years.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Oh man. And I try telling that you can talk to them till you're blue in the face, but then they come and they're like, but either way, I think about adults, you know what I mean? But it's it's like they fight going to a good thing. Yeah, like, man, well, I should have been this a long time ago.
SPEAKER_01:The nice thing about that though is because both of us have started a young adult ministry now. Yeah. Um, you know, being one to two months into it. Uh, and so the nice thing about that is even though they're starting late, yeah, they're yeah, they're not done. Like we get we hook them, you know, we get to we get to pour, you know, all the love into them now, and it and it's not just for this weekend. Get them through the school year, and then like, hey, you're not done. Like, we have this young adult ministry. Yeah, yeah. Let's you know, get you plugged into that, and they're gonna be, oh man, like let's do that because I started late. I want to keep, you know, I want to keep going.
SPEAKER_05:And I want to make it to where, okay, was it was it Rich or Mike I was talking to last night about uh my son wanting to get in. It may have been Sean. I'm not sure, but I was talking to somebody about how I'm sorry, he couldn't wait to get in sixth grade so he could be a part of all this. That's my son. Yeah, um, he's in fourth grade, and at sixth grade is when it starts, and he cannot wait. And every fifth grader, they're just like chomping at the bits. They want to be in the youth and do all this cool stuff. Well, by 12th grade, I want them to be able to have something that that's that same amped up, can't wait to do. It's gonna be a little bit different. In our first young adults class, they've got their phones to put them up at the front.
SPEAKER_01:That's awesome. And it's funny, because they all asked, they were like, Can we can we do this too? And we're like, You're adults? That's right.
SPEAKER_05:I said, guys, you don't have to. And I said, Well, can we put them up here? I said, You can if you want to. They put a couple of put them up there at the I was like, that's crazy. Like, you're adults. If you want to be on Facebook while I'm teaching, I mean, that's on you. I mean, I'm not gonna do that in a sermon, like, call out an adult, be like, what are you doing? I mean, I saw you're adults now. I'm gonna treat you like one. Um, but yeah, it's an awesome transition. And there are things I have set in place for them, and it's and it might be next October. But I'm talking to a guy in Scotland in the Highlands, and we're talking thinking about doing like a mission trip over. They don't know this yet, by the way. So if they're watching this podcast, dang it. It's out of the bag. A little bonus for walking muscles. Right, a little bonus, and you keep it to yourself. So don't tell anybody else. And I don't even know if it's gonna work out or not, but uh I didn't know they have a big problem with their young adult ministry out there. Uh it's around a brewing factory where they make a lot of uh whiskey and stuff, I guess. And it's like they say it's tore that town apart, yeah. And it's over in the highlands, and that the pastor over there, it's north of Edinburgh, and he was he was telling me, I haven't actually spoke to him on the phone. We've been emailing and texting each other. Yeah, and uh he said he'd like to do a FaceTime call sometime. He says he's very keen on seeing uh where this could go. He words things like a true Scottish person. I think that's pretty cool. Um but anyways, I thought about doing that with them. So when the guys graduate and they're like, wait a minute, these guys are going overseas, they're getting a not that it's more important than what's here at home, but it brings back that excitement when you get home. It's like, okay, let's I don't know.
SPEAKER_02:So man, puts a you know, lights a fire under everybody.
SPEAKER_05:So yeah, yeah. So this weekend, uh Michael, you're talking about trapped in sin. Um and I love the scriptures you're using for that, how you went from David, and I didn't know where you were gonna go with that. You know what I mean? I thought, where what's next? What character's next? And I walk in the sanctuary because I was doing some things outside and I seen the verses. I thought, oh man, yeah. Samson and Delilah. So now I don't know where tonight's going. Are you gonna give us a spoiler or come on, man?
SPEAKER_00:Like they cannot hear us.
SPEAKER_02:This is a soundproof room. Please. That's what Richard's always trying to get. Like, hey, give me give me a little bit of a heads up on what you're doing. Like, no. Nothing? No.
SPEAKER_05:Not I mean, what if I turn all of our stuff off and they can only hear you?
unknown:No.
SPEAKER_03:But I I I teach a class on Wednesday night, it's called Digging Deeper, and it's on his sermon from Sunday. Yeah. And he still won't give me a heads up to give me more prep time. No, you don't even care about my life at all.
SPEAKER_05:I even if you're hurting at that point. Come on.
SPEAKER_02:Like uh, you know, we have somebody that does like our words and stuff, scriptures on the screen. So I even I even try to keep that to the last minute. So I I really like I like those click moments, those, oh, you know, I really, really feed off. I love that. And and getting people to see the the scripture or the story or whatever in a different way is like something that I really enjoy. So I try to get that to like which I'll do a QR code at the beginning. Right. Here's all the scriptures for today, but you know, I try to keep it.
SPEAKER_03:And I've I can tell you I have seen a version of this series before. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Do you have an idea then?
SPEAKER_03:Man, yeah. I'm telling you, tonight's gonna blow your mind.
SPEAKER_05:That's awesome. That's awesome.
SPEAKER_03:I'm looking forward to it, man. I'm excited.
SPEAKER_05:You need to tell me.
SPEAKER_01:You're not leaving this room until you tell us. Blow my mind. It's stuck in here. Which does does Bobby know what we're doing?
SPEAKER_05:I don't know.
SPEAKER_01:I know part of what you told me.
SPEAKER_05:About the prison cell, the the cage.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Okay.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. Okay. Your dad's actually bringing the chainsaw.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, the chainsaw. Yeah, I was about to say you could say it, yeah. I don't know if well they shouldn't be able to hear us. They can't hear us. Yeah, we're like three rooms away from it. That's gonna be so good. I'm I'm pumped, man. I've done it probably four years ago. Something like that. Okay. And and anytime I redo like a like a sermon or a sermon series, I try to change it up to where it's not just the same. Yeah, it's not the same. A little bit different.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, that's important because not only for you, but also for someone that has learned it before. And like Jared and I talk all the time, it doesn't matter how many times you read something in here. Yeah, every time you read it, you're gonna get something different because it's based on where you are at that moment and what God is telling you at that moment. And so that's the nice thing, is every time you you're like, hey, I've already done this before, I'm gonna dust it off. But then when you go through it, you're like, oh, well, God's telling me right now I need to focus on this instead of last time I focused over here. And that's the nice thing about it.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, that's like this morning, um, everything's focused on David, and it should be for lesson purposes. But it hit me, I was looking at that and I said, When have I ever been Delilah? When have I ever been uh the guys coming in the room looking for it? Or last night, I was like, when have I ever been Uriah? When have I ever been uh Bathsheba? You know, like and I know I'm not saying like people are looking at me and wanting me and all that. I don't mean that. I'm not that I'm super desirable or anything. I'm not talking about that, but like where you're the ire of something bad's coming your way and you don't even see it yet. Um just different points of view from it, because I'm looking at it and I thought, well, I mean, what if I'm not David in this story? What if I'm somebody else?
SPEAKER_02:Man, and I and and that's good. I love that. I I've talked to to some ladies, like, you know, how how about like there's certain stories in the Bible where we kind of focus on the guy. Yes. And it's like, man, think about Delilah in that. Like you had you kind of had to listen to him. Like, yeah, hey, the king said, Come here. So like she she fell into all this nonsense because she had to listen to him. Or, like, you know, we talk about the woman who's caught in the act. It always talks about the woman who was caught in the act, it never talks about the man that was caught with her.
SPEAKER_06:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:So it's like, he got off scot-free, like stoned her and just know. So I I love saying things like that. It's like, oh, I never thought about that. I never seen it that way.
SPEAKER_05:It's like Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane, we all put ourselves in the disciples' shoes. The other eleven watching this happen, like, how dare you? When it's like we do this every day, what he did in that garden, Judas. Like we've done that, we put him there in that place. We we put him in that position. And I don't think a lot of people think of it that way, because I naturally think of myself as being one of the disciples, like, dude, like the the betrayer in in parentheses, like it has in the gospels, is like, how dare you? But I think internally, I do it every day. Yeah, I may not say it, but it happens.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I mean, there's that song that I am barabbas, you know. How many times, like you're sitting there, like as I listened to that song the first time, I was like, whoa, like I am Barabbas, like I have done all this and everything. And so just now when you were talking, you know, from the other side of you know, different characters and stuff, one of the points I wrote down uh was be careful who you talk to. And many of times as you do, you know, doing self-reflection, am I being a good person? Because I tell people all the time, you can call me at any any hour, any day, no matter what, call me. I'm a good listener, and and I'll be your person that you need. Um but how many times have I failed when I said that? Yeah, that was I actually being the person that they needed, and and was I being a true caregiver, or did I take what they did and I and I funneled it you know for evil or something like that? You know, like was I the weakness at that point?
SPEAKER_03:Well, inevitably they're gonna call at the worst possible time. Yeah, so even just putting everything else to the side to be like, okay, let me let me focus on what you need right now, just just even doing that can be difficult sometimes.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, absolutely, man. Because you can hear it in your voice. Yeah, and and you know that person call, oh hey, what were you doing? Oh, I was just doing this. Oh, I'm sorry, I will call you later. Right. No, like go ahead, like I'm I'm good. But that the whole time you're talking to them, you can tell it in your voice. And and when you feel it, you know it sounds that way, even though they can't see you, but they can feel it through the tone of your voice and everything.
SPEAKER_05:So when your body mannerisms that itching to go, or yeah, with me, I'll say walk with me, and we'll just start walking and talking. It's like yeah, just I really want to hear what you gotta say, but I'm I'm on this time schedule I gotta be on, walk with me and talk. But I I think there's something said when you just set aside that time. I'm done. What do you gotta say? Right. And I you gotta just relax in it and just actually listen. That's hard for me.
SPEAKER_03:That's what Mike says all the time. You know, it's every Sunday, people will come to him at service starts at 10 o'clock, so it's 9 45. Like, hey, can I talk to you? Now? Like right now.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, you're not the only I've seen that I mean here, I've seen that in other churches where the lead pastor, they're back there, they're doing this, they're getting ready, even days where you're doing baptisms and all this other stuff. And it's not just one person, right? Hey, pastor, and they'll go up to them and then the the chatting starts. And it's cool, awesome. And then they'll say, Can I ask you something? And I and you know, I know in their mind what's going on, but you would never see it. And they're like, What's going on? They're laughing. Yeah, and the second that conversation's over, it's you can they're hightailing it.
SPEAKER_02:Like it's time to say, I gotta get to get out of here. Like, I really do.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, like the internal clock is ticking. Yep, yeah. And you're like, okay, I can only talk to you for about two more minutes because I gotta go do this. I gotta go do this.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I've had somebody grab me, like I'm standing by the stage, like we have a countdown, and I'm waiting, and they're like, Hey, can you come meet so and so? I'm like, there's a minute fifteen, and I've got to be on stage. Like, can it's not wait-well, I think they're gonna leave right after. So I had to go and meet somebody, and like the whole time I'm just like, and it's like you you want to give them your attention, but it's like okay.
SPEAKER_05:I'm not I'm gonna play devil's ac advocate here. Yeah. Just okay, when time that can be an enemy. Yes. We put that restraint on ourselves, yeah, but we're trying to also be good stewards of the people that the other hundred, two hundred, three hundred people that are in the room of their time. So you want you you only have a certain amount of time you can give your message. Right. But at what point do we say flexible of, okay, I got two or three minutes. I just need to chill out. That that clause gonna go off after that. I just need to chill out, and maybe this is gonna change their day.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and that's good.
SPEAKER_05:And it's I don't mean to be that guy.
SPEAKER_02:I'm gonna go, I gotta go. And it's kind of in the moment deciding, like, okay, how do I feel about this? Is this something that is an important thing to wear? Okay, we can because you do. If you've got one person that needs something, but a hundred people that they need to be out on time, yes, you kind of need to respect people's times. But you know, trying to make trying to make some allotment for both of those. So like what I'll do is is like I'll usually tell someone, hey, can we meet right after? And if it's just a no, okay, I'll make time for you right now. Right. Let's let's figure this out now, you know. And now we've got a secretary where it's now like, hey, go get with her and I'll make sure I carve out time for you. Because you also, for that person, you don't want to give them three minutes when it's a 20-minute conversation. Yeah, you know, so it's trying to steer them that way, and if it's impossible, then hey, you know, we'll we'll figure this out.
SPEAKER_05:Well, you can't have a hippie mindset. Right. Like we're if they call it Malawi time when I'm in Africa, you're on Malawi time, that means they don't have watches, they just show up when they show up and they leave when they want to leave, and that's chaos.
SPEAKER_03:It can be, yeah, you know, so it's like I got a I got a really good story to tell about time and exactly what we're talking about. It was also one of the multiple times that Mike had to correct me, but oh no. Yeah, it it happens that pastors have to correct people sometimes. But so they call me the time Nazi, and it's not a fun nickname. It's not like ha ha ha. Yeah, that's me. It's a yeah, it's awesome. Oh, I love it. Yeah, so I I I like to be on time. I'm a punctual guy. Airbunt. Yep, that's I got you. Yeah, that's me. You look so confused. Yeah. Look like some Power Rangers, I don't know what's going on. Sorry, didn't mean to interrupt you. So we are uh we're getting ready to start service, and I'm I'm telling Mike, hey, it's it's it's time to start. You know, we're talking about why we are not starting at the time.
SPEAKER_04:Right.
SPEAKER_03:And so I go to him the first time, I'm like, dude, it's it's it's time. We need to we need to get going. Uh and then he's like, yeah, we'll we'll we'll do that in just a minute. Come back again. I'm like, dude, it's like 10 after. I was like, what's what's the holdup? You know, why are we not starting? And he's he just looks at me and he's like, Richard, look, we're gonna start when I'm when I start, right?
SPEAKER_05:Right. So that's when the the fire and the it starts boiling.
SPEAKER_03:That temper raised up a little bit, and it it took a little bit, like it took till after service to be like, all right, I I got it. So there was a guy that came in and he came after service, he came to Mike and he's like, I I didn't know if I wanted to come today. He said, but I'm glad that y'all started a little late because if if the music and stuff had been going, I wouldn't even came in.
SPEAKER_02:Oh wow.
SPEAKER_03:So I was like, dang it.
SPEAKER_02:Wow. Yeah. So I had no idea. He was like, oh yeah, if it if I'd have been late, like if I'd have got to the door and then and it was just I wouldn't have came in.
SPEAKER_05:Wow.
SPEAKER_02:It's like so it was perfect timing, and I was like And it was just a moment where it just happened to work that way, you know, and we were just running late, and it's like and it was one of those things where you didn't feel I didn't feel rushed. Like it's like no, there's something going. Yeah, it's like, you know, the because there's a lot of times where you feel the r you know, it's like okay, we need to keep going. Like, why is this not going? It was like in that moment, it was just like, no, it's it's okay. We're gonna we're gonna wait a minute.
SPEAKER_01:And I always feel like during those moments, if you had other people that are in charge of different things, like the you know, if they're playing the music or if they're singing a song, or you know, take take leadership, take ownership of that moment, like you can see there's still people praying at the altar. You can see that the pastor's talking to somebody, maybe there's like three people that came up and he he's gotta talk to each one, so they're all waiting, and you know, he's giving them time with this one, giving time with this one, you know. So it's it's just going. And when you're just standing there in the audience and and it's kind of like we're just listening to the music, but no one's singing, it's just kind of like dead, and we're all just like watching, like, okay, let's go. I think in those moments, when you're the ones that are like leading the music or leading the whatever, like let's be a filler, be see that God is moving right now, and and be an instrument while that's happening, right? So that way everyone else, even though we did go long, it doesn't take away from everyone sitting there going, Well, why are we not done yet?
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I think it's a lot of that's discernment. Yeah, and the Holy Spirit, you just kind of know, and some people have that in spades, like they can read a room, they know if it if it needs to go longer, yeah. And if it if it's if it's time, like that. And people say some people really have that. Some people have none of that whatsoever. And I think it's a gift, like discernment is a gift. I totally agree with that.
SPEAKER_02:Um really really helped teach me in in this moment. It was probably six years ago. And he was like, well, you you also have to understand that there are people that are in charge of kids, in charge of in charge of other ministries. And if they have a plan for 45 minutes, and now you go fifteen, you wait fifteen minutes to get started, now they're at the tail end, they're sitting here having to figure out what to do for an extra however long. So it's like respect your like if you're trying to build something, you're trying to build leaders and get volunteers and get people to buy in, think about them too. Right. You know, because that's that's a whole different panic. If you're in kids' ministry and you're like, oh, it's going 15 minutes longer in service, like we're done. How do I, yeah, how do I keep these kids in line? And you you can get people to go, no, I don't, I don't want to be in front of that if you don't respect their their time as well.
SPEAKER_05:You know, so that's hard for me. Um before I was even in the military, my dad and my mom, I mean, extremely precise on time. My dad's early, and there's a saying, I heard it when I was a kid growing up, and I heard it in the military.
SPEAKER_02:Very stupid saying.
SPEAKER_05:Well, I don't know. We'll see. I'll I'll tell you what he said. And he and also I heard it in the military, but I heard it growing up. If you're 15 minutes early, you're on time. If you're on time, you're late. If you're late, don't even show up.
SPEAKER_02:Amen. This is the dumbest quote in the entire world.
SPEAKER_05:And that's how I live my life.
SPEAKER_02:And this is what Richard used to say that this is. Do you though? Yes, I do. But words matter, okay? So when you say, Well, if you're on time, you're late, no, because the word on time means on time. No, that means it's starting.
SPEAKER_05:It's a speech. It doesn't mean late. That is on time means on time.
SPEAKER_02:It is not a literal thing. It's a figure of speech. It is a literal thing. It is not a figure of speech. Okay, I'll tell you literally then.
SPEAKER_05:All right, you start a service at 10. You don't walk in the door till 10 o'clock then see what happens. That's right. You gotta be early to be on time, right?
SPEAKER_02:No, you're early to be early. Like you're early to be early. Like that's the the meaning of the word. So we don't tell people. So instead of going, hey, if you're early, you're on time, we tell people be early. Not be on time, which means be early.
SPEAKER_05:Well, okay, this is saying for go-getters who take it serious. See, they're early.
SPEAKER_02:Go-getters are early. Yeah. Mike would have hated this part.
SPEAKER_03:It's because we're a little nervous.
SPEAKER_02:It's like saying, well, saying hat means shoe. No, it's not the same. It is the same. Amen.
SPEAKER_01:It's apples and oranges right there.
SPEAKER_02:And when you're not words, words have meanings.
SPEAKER_01:They do. You would have hated them, because in the military, Jared and I unfortunately had this experience of the leader tells you, you know, we're going to start thing at let's say four o'clock. Okay, cool. Four o'clock. 16 or 04? 16.
SPEAKER_04:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:We'll say 1600. And then it gets passed down from them down to the to the officers. So then the officers are like, back it up 15 minutes. And then it gets passed down to the to the platoon leader. Back it up. Back it up. By the time you get told what time to be there, you're now showing up an hour and a half early from someone else because they don't want to be late because their boss told them. So then we're like, why are we sitting here for an hour now? So the saying in the military is hurry, hurry up and wait. I've heard that one, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:That's why. But then you tell again, you tell people, be early. This is what time we start, be early.
SPEAKER_03:We've literally had this argument for six, seven years. That's just nonsense.
SPEAKER_02:You make it extra complicated for no reason. It's not complicated. It is very complicated. When you tell somebody, okay, we're starting at 10 o'clock.
SPEAKER_05:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:You would expect your leader to do what? Show up in enough time to make sure they're ready to go. Right.
SPEAKER_05:On time, which is early.
SPEAKER_02:No, it's on no. Are you you expect them to be early? So when we tell somebody, hey, be early, that means be early. If we tell we we don't ever say, like as a leader, never tell your people be on time. You tell them be early. Agree to disagree.
SPEAKER_05:Uh yeah, I agree. I agree with Rich on the agree to disagree.
SPEAKER_02:Just to clear that up. Because then it's like, okay, we're we're starting at 10 o'clock and someone shows up at 10 o'clock. You can you cannot at a job, you can't anywhere now say you're late, so we're gonna get it. So if I was a manager at Metropolis and I said you start at five and they got there and started at five. If it's on the dot, that's fine. But then he's come in all out of shape and then if it's on time, you can now you can't then say you're late. No, I'm not clocked in at five o'clock.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, you're the manager. You see a guy come in, he's clocking in right at five every day. Yes. And then he jumps right into his job. Yes. Okay, then you have this other guy, girl, whatever, and she's getting there 15, 20 minutes early and setting everything up, making sure her stations are ready and all that. Then it comes promotion time. Who gets that promotion?
SPEAKER_02:So number one, who's the responsible one? I would hope the one that comes 15 minutes gets the promotion because they've been working for free. So you can't tell somebody work for 15 minutes before we pay you.
SPEAKER_05:But they get the promotion because they have initiative. They got there. They're gonna be a good thing.
SPEAKER_02:The better worker is the promotion. Because they may not be a better worker. She's already shown that she's the better worker. They may not be the better work. Just because you come in early.
SPEAKER_05:This is all fictitious scenario. I can say she's the amazing worker, and that other guy just shows up at five and then goes to sleep.
SPEAKER_02:So same, same scenario. The one that shows up at 15 minutes till or 15 minutes before they clock in, so they're working for 15 minutes for free. I don't look at it as free.
SPEAKER_05:I don't look at it as free.
SPEAKER_02:That can be the case. Or the person that shows up on time at 5 o'clock and they're a great employee. They do what they do, they're helping advance who gets the promotion.
SPEAKER_05:But we're talking about after the time begins. We're talking about before the time begins, based on the 15 minutes prior or lack thereof.
SPEAKER_03:If you're asked to be there at five o'clock. I can see where this goes. And you're there at five o'clock, you are good to go. You cannot convince Mike he's wrong on this.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, I'll tell you something from honest experience. Well, because I because I Worked at a place that that didn't pay you for getting rented 10 minutes before you started.
SPEAKER_05:Can I give you just and then I'm done. I'm probably I don't want to say anything after this.
SPEAKER_01:At least we know how to write a check, though.
SPEAKER_05:This is true. We'll talk this is on our podcast, so we can talk about this. They they haven't heard this yet. We'll go there in a second. So my dad, my grandpa, they all own sawmill businesses, lumber comp stuff like that. Um just woodwork and things like that. So it's really hard because people don't want to work that job. It's a hard job. And when they come in, the ones that, okay, from experience, the ones that come in, like because they'll they'll be there 15 minutes early, 20 minutes early. They're getting their gloves on, they're setting their station up, getting everything ready, making sure the pallets are set up just right, making sure they got their banding ready so when the meal kicks up and that that starts sending that thing down there fast. They're stacking railroad ties and everything else, and there's there's those guys that come in early and they're getting everything ready, and then there's that guy that comes in right on time, or maybe two minutes early, they're running in there, and I nine times out of ten, the guy that would come in there early taking their job serious, or the ones that they'd be there for five, ten, fifteen years, and the other guy was there for a month, would do really good those first three or four days, and then within a couple weeks, they were getting there a little bit later, a little bit later. And that's every now and then you get that guy that they're on time and they're there for decades. But I've noticed when the guys that get there early and they're that's like they take it serious. They want to I don't know, and it's like me. I want to make sure my stuff's set up, it helps my mind, and that's why I get in early. It just gives me that opportunity to settle in before the chaos starts.
SPEAKER_03:And that's all it is, is a mindset. It is mindset. Well, and that's it's not I it's not grammatically correct, I guess, for lack of a better, it's not the the words, yes, have meaning, but it's not it's a mindset, it's not you know what I mean.
SPEAKER_02:Well, mental preparation. One here's my mindset behind it. If I'm working at a place for 10 years, yes, and I come in early and and and am doing things for this workplace, setting up equipment, getting things prepared at this work site 15 minutes every day. I am now thousands of hours of work that I am not getting paid for by this company. That is not okay.
SPEAKER_05:But you're not working during that time. So you are just your own personal stuff, kind of getting around.
SPEAKER_02:That is preparation for that job. It's a mindset. That is preparation for that job.
SPEAKER_03:What time do you come in on Sunday morning, Mike?
SPEAKER_02:You could be a rent for them. Workers' union is part of what I get paid for. I don't I don't come in and do it because I want to come in and do it. Oh, yeah. When was your last day off? What does that have to do with coming out of the house?
SPEAKER_05:He's gonna be over the pastors union.
SPEAKER_02:But it's it's you're talking millions and millions of dollars of employees that are expected to come in. Hey, get your station clean, get your equipment on, get that's and they're and the company shouldn't expect that.
SPEAKER_03:Let's let's make that clear. No, we never made them.
SPEAKER_05:That's on their own accord. As long as you're here at this time, you're good.
SPEAKER_03:And that's I where I work now, I we've gone way long on this particular subject. Yeah, we did. But uh we really did. Yeah, but I I come in early to do my pre-trip on my vehicle off the clock, and I do it just because it's it's done, I don't have to worry about it. It's it's done. They don't expect me to do that, they don't pay me to do that. I do it because I want to do it and I want it to be done. It's not an expectation, it's just the way I do it.
SPEAKER_05:Right.
SPEAKER_03:There are other guys that don't, that's on them. I don't care. It's the way I do things.
SPEAKER_05:It's because we're big boys now.
SPEAKER_02:Do those are are those guys worse workers than you?
SPEAKER_03:I have no idea. We don't work together. But you work overtime for free? I do sometimes. Work for free. I mean, obviously I come in before clocking in and do my pre-trip, so that's technically, I guess, overtime for free.
SPEAKER_05:I did overtime back when I worked at a paper plant, and we clocked in 30 minutes early, and we didn't we clocked in at 5 30, our pay didn't start till six. But we did that so the guys coming off shift could leave at 5 30. Right. So we would hook each other up so we could leave.
SPEAKER_03:I did I definitely understand what you're saying. I get it. Oh, I do 100%. You're right.
SPEAKER_05:They they don't need to start till five, they're not getting paid till five, and if they work awesome till the end of the clock, there's nothing wrong with that. That's great.
SPEAKER_02:Now 15, now 30 minutes. Now two hours.
SPEAKER_05:That's personal, that's a personal preference that we're talking about. It's it helps me set up my mind for the day. Sure. Some people don't need that. Some people can just rock and roll right when they get in there. So there's no real right or wrong. That's just preference. At the end of the day, wow. Living on.
SPEAKER_03:All right, here we go. Oh boy. I told you, like moving on. I told you, I told you 20 minutes ago that you were not getting anywhere with this.
SPEAKER_01:The problem is he likes rabbit holes and he chases the rabbit hole with them.
SPEAKER_05:It was good. Uh huh. But we both yeah, I don't think I see where you're at. I don't think you see where I'm at. Yeah. But you do. It's like it's not you don't have to, but it's just a man.
SPEAKER_02:You can have yeah, you can have that mindset. But people with that mindset. You're moving on, we didn't move on. We didn't go into that. But people with that mindset usually put it on others. That's that's because they brought it back up again.
SPEAKER_05:Because I'm a good guy. I stay in my lane, man.
SPEAKER_03:I and that's and he's pointing at me because I absolutely expect other people not to be early to everything. Um my my point is I expect people to respect other people's time. And people that come in late, it irks my nerves to the nth degree. I can't stand it. It is so disrespectful, so disrespectful. So it's actually late. Yeah. And they'll come in with with like drinks from Sonic, and it's like, yay, I'm finally here. Don't come in, just leave. I don't even want you here. Yay, like that. Yeah. I don't know.
SPEAKER_05:Bobby does that when he comes in a podcast sometimes with drinks. But I'm also here on time. All right. So can we I think we're gonna move past this. Okay. All right, because it is time to move past it. Yeah. Bobby, you've been looking at your at your paper there for a little bit for about a good 20 minutes now.
SPEAKER_01:So back to you know, last night's topics and stuff and everything. Uh there was a point that you had had mentioned last night that I really liked that I really think the youth really got a lot out of. Um, and that was that God doesn't want you to come to him out of guilt. He wants you to come to him out of love. And so many times I find myself feeling guilty. Um you know, a few weeks ago, a few episodes ago, Jared and I did our testimonies on here, and so as we we start talking about it, and it's just like during all of those times, I know I'm doing wrong. You know, I'm I'm on the itch, you know, flirting back and forth with everything. Um and and so there's so many times out of guilt that that you go to him. You're like, man, I've I really messed up with this, like I feel guilty about it, like you know, and and it's so many times that that becomes the routine and not the routine of I love you, and I'm gonna go to you because I love you and and I want your love um and you know, out of that side.
SPEAKER_05:I I think about when I was a kid, and I'd feel super guilty about something, and guilt doesn't make me want to go and tell my dad what I did. But him being loving and understanding, it's like, okay. I know I'm not about to just get smacked with every insult and why you're so stupid and all these things. I'm not gonna go with that guy. I've if no matter how much guilt I feel, but if I know he's loving, he's understanding, and he's sitting there waiting to give me good and sound advice, I'm gonna go over there. And that's like I messed up. Like I messed up big time because there's love is a massive part of the equation.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I agree. And it That's how it was when we grew up. Churches would guilt trip you into coming down to the altar, because that's how pastors viewed if my sermon was good, the altars were full. Not if lives are changing.
SPEAKER_06:Right.
SPEAKER_02:And and what happens is we we go to God, like you said with with your dad, we we go to God out of guilt because we're scared to get in trouble. Not out of love because we need help. So when you understand that I need help out of this situation and not, oh, I just feel bad and I don't want to be punished for this situation. Now it goes from a get out of jail free card to a relationship with Jesus. Yeah. So it's not just oh yeah, I believe in God because I don't want to go to hell. It's I believe in Jesus because he loved me while I was still a sinner.
SPEAKER_03:Well, and it's it's it's harder to come to that place when you didn't have a good earthly father. Yeah. I didn't I didn't have that, you know. So so for me to understand the love of a heavenly father, I had to first understand that there are better earthly fathers. Yeah. You know, so it it was which I didn't come to Christ till I was 38 years old. So I was one of those, like we were talking in the beginning, that just waited and waited and waited and and and then I came to it and was like, man, I I wasted a lot of years waiting to come to God. So so I think that's part of it is just is just getting over that that that understanding of what God has for you.
SPEAKER_01:And and I think, you know, um like you had talked about last night, the root cause. Like a lot of times we just I got depression, I got anxiety, okay, cool. I you know, I had this in whatever, and I just try to f get rid of that one thing, and I and I never take a step back to look at the bigger picture of what is the root cause of all the things that I have right now. Yeah, uh, and like you talked about this morning, what is the weakness? Where's the weakness in my life that's about to cause the pipe to burst?
SPEAKER_06:Right, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Um, and once I figure out what that weakness is, once I figure out what the root cause is, then I can go through and I can get because so many times in our life, we'll sit there and I'm gonna pull this weed out, I'm gonna pull this weed out, and the weed keeps coming back. Well, why is the weed keep coming back? Because you never all you did was pull the weed out. You didn't put any of the weed killer down, you didn't do any of the other stuff, like you didn't get to the root cause of why that weed is is still right there and festering. Um, and and so as I've learned over really the last year, you know, 18 months since I've been back and and been back involved in the church, and my relationship with God has gotten better and closer, you're seeing these things and you're seeing what was the root cause for 20 years why I was down all these rabbit holes. And and you felt guilty, you knew you were doing wrong, but you know, I I couldn't get rid of it. I didn't want to get rid of it, but you know, why was that? Yeah. Uh and so when you start examining your life and you get to that that root cause, it allows I don't know, I just I just love that. Once you once you identify and look for it.
SPEAKER_05:I noticed when I was a teenager, because I watched all them boys out there, I used to be that teenage boy, and I think about how what the makes the pipe burst, what what where that weakness is that the enemy can come in and go boosh and just cause it to fail um changes every decade or every four years or whatever. It changes over time because what got me back then doesn't get me now. What got me in my 20s doesn't get me now. What got me in my 30s doesn't really get to me anymore. Now it's different, it's not the same things. I don't have the same struggles I did back then. It's those are almost minute issues. I don't even think about it, it doesn't cross my mind. I tell you what gets me now, anger is my biggest one. And that is because frustration can build up, and I'm really good about putting on a good, and I'm just being honest, transparent, I'm not perfect. And I can put on a very good face in front of people. Um, but when I get home and I and something doesn't set quite right, I've learned to just be quiet because I'll get very vocal. Like, what are you doing? Go to your room. I can't just right now before I say something I shouldn't. That right there and of itself, my nine-year-old son goes, What is he gonna say? Like it's just full of wonder, and he sees his dad being this awesome guy around all these people, and then he gets home, it's like, what just happened? Who is that? Is that who he really is? And that's a struggle of mine, I'm just being honest with you.
SPEAKER_01:So we had a conversation, you know, not go into full details about it to keep it, you know, some privacy for people out there. Um but there was a person that passed that to the outside world was this great person, um, you know, really good love for the Lord, uh, good ministry, good fellowship, good everything. And then, like you were just talking about behind closed doors, you know, we we got you know, we saw the the the ugliness. Um and so I told that person at this at the time, you know, when we're talking about it, was you know, I I can't understand why everyone got to see all the good and all of this, but we never got to see it. Uh, and I and I told this person, I said, we took all the ugliness so that way they could show God's love and mercy to everybody else. So as much as it it hurt for us, um, we were able to take that burden so that way she was you know able to still use God's light um out there for others.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Um and being retired from the military now and knowing, you know, having been diagnosed with PTSD and depression and anger and all of that stuff, it is there. But I've found recently now that I've gotten back in the word, like you were talking last night with medication, everyone always, you know, just give me more pills, give me this. And and there 100% there are things and times when you do need to get the pills, yeah. Um but for me, I know how addictive my personality is, and if I start on that train, I'm never gonna get off that train. Yeah. Um, and so I've looked into well, how do I manage, how do I keep the triggers at bay? I mean, I'm still gonna have the the bad days, the bad explosions, the all that stuff. Um, but the more time that I, you know, listen to Josh and Jared preach, the more time I read, you know, the word, like I find I'm able to go longer periods of time without the episodes. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:What do you think about that, Mike? Well, and it's and it's usually the the people closest to you that see the explosions, that see the bad side of you because you know, the closer you are to something, the more you see the problems with it. I'm a watch guy. Like, how do you know a fake watch from a real they have to literally get into the get into the the deep part, they have to get close to it, they have to see. From far, it looks the same. You can't tell the difference between either one of them. So a lot of times we get home and because we haven't dealt with the real and usually the blow up has nothing to do with the person we blow up on.
SPEAKER_01:No, not at all.
SPEAKER_02:It has everything to do with something else, because there's there's something else that is taking root that caused the anger, that caused those things. And a lot of times you blow up on them, it's like, I'm not even really mad at you. I'm mad at something else going on. And if we we don't get to the bottom of that many times in our life, that that seeps into everything. So now you're short-tempered, now you're upset, now you're getting anxious because you're short-tempered, you're scared to blow, you're you're scared these things are gonna get to you, and it's because you aren't getting to the root problem of what is going on. Right. Of what really is bothering you. You know, it it may be an anger issue, but the root of it is disorganization. And because you're not you're disorganized, you get flustered, and then you get to this point to where now you're short and you're angry at people, you know, and that was a big thing with me. I had to really restructure, and I liked Richard a few weeks ago. He said, Man, I like this new restructured, you know, organized Pastor Mike. Yes.
SPEAKER_05:On time.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, because right. Because because I was, I was, I was hurting myself and being, well, I it'll all get figured out. I know what I'm doing today, but I don't know like when, and it's not scheduled, and I'll figure it all out. Then at the end of the day, I'm flustered, I'm tired, I'm upset, I'm running around trying to get things done because I didn't have that organ. So it's like you can blow up and you can try to to cover it with other things, but if you don't get to the prior, it's just gonna keep happening. Yeah. So it's gonna keep happening.
SPEAKER_01:I'm gonna ask you a question. For those that are listening and they're sitting there going, okay, I agree 100%, we've got to get to the root cause. How do you get to the root cause? Be honest with yourself.
SPEAKER_02:That's the first thing is we we like to pick fake ourselves out.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, that's not really the problem, it's something else because we like that thing. That's really the problem. You know, oh, it's not alcohol's not the problem, it's something else. No, it's alcohol. Or, you know, oh, watching TV is not the problem. Yeah, it is. You're not spending time. Your wife's mad at you because you're not spending time with the wife, because you're spending eight hours watching TV. You know, so being honest, a self-evaluation and being honest with yourself because others can see it.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But many times what others can see, we don't want to admit. Right. Like, uh, well, it's not really a problem.
SPEAKER_03:I don't mind saying that the the person in his sermon today he was talking to about having their phone locked down is me. I I ask him to lock my phone down because I struggle with lust and pornography. So But the problem is I don't know the root cause of that because I've got decades of of crap built up in my head that I'm just now dealing with. A lot of my childhood is blocked out, probably to guard my psyche. But the first and what also what you said was be careful who you talk to, right? The first person I shared this this with uh at the first church that I started going to, he immediately said that, well, if you're dealing with that, we're gonna have to take you out of any leadership. Which is fine, but that that doesn't help me. That's the problem. I mean, that's whatever you need to do, but what about my problem? You know, what are we gonna do to help me? And it it was never addressed.
SPEAKER_01:It was just if anything, I'm gonna make it worse.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it was just and it's like Mike said when I talked to him about this, he's you know, he said, Well, that pastor that I talked to apparently doesn't struggle with any sin himself. He's a perfect man, yeah. Yeah, if you have nothing you struggle with, why are you in a leadership position? Right. So it I have not had the opportunity to get to the root cause of my problem. So I think it's hard.
SPEAKER_02:I think it's hard, especially in in Richard, since he opened open it. I think open it, baby.
SPEAKER_05:Uh I try to be too.
SPEAKER_02:I think I think a lot of a lot of yours, and it's some things are hard to get away from the root cause. The root cause of I think a lot of your stuff, especially like sexual trauma, is your family.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So sometimes it's hard to get away from, you know, because Richard's got things in his past that was done to him. He's got, you know, people that should have been there for him to help guide him in a certain way or celebrating sexual devancy. You know, so it's like that is a lot of that gets instilled in you. So now your brain is warped around that thing. So where now it's hard to get a good, clear view of it. I think that has a lot to do with with even your your past relationships and marriages. It's it's it's hard to have that grounded-rooted thing when you grew up.
SPEAKER_03:Wait a minute, did you just call me warped?
SPEAKER_02:That's not what I took from it, but so it it is. Sometimes it's it's it's something that can be as simple as as, you know, you you you better with depression because you're anxious about everything. You're just an over-anxious person. But that is the the root of it is is your faith.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:You know, be be anxious about about nothing. Wow, by keeping faith, by doing these things. And it's like, if you keep going, okay, well, if I can just control my depression, I could troll. No, but it goes deeper than that. Right. It's you're not leaning on God, understanding like He is gonna make a way.
SPEAKER_05:What bothers me is we were talking about how the pastor, like, you can't do this. Well, this is what bugs me. This is what I thought as you were saying that. I was thinking, as Rich was saying this, I thought about we make a certain sins, like the leprosy. Like, you can't unclean, unclean. Like, don't don't come around me, get in your own little colony over here and stay away. You don't need to be around leadership, you don't need to be around the church. And when in all reality, like everybody has issues, everybody sins, everybody has struggles, and the thing, and you're we are all if I'm trying to word this right, we're trying to do the right things. Yeah, we're we're seeking God, we're we're we're asking for accountability, and then you got this guy over here whose obvious sin is pride because they think that they can just walk around and everything they do smells fantastic. Yeah, and that's not the case. I mean, when I see that, it and like we're talking about David uh last night when they were looking for the future king and he anoints David, he looks past all these other guys because God didn't see the outside, he seen the inside. And I think when he sees a repentant heart, somebody's looking, that's who needs to step in because they've dealt with these things. They're relatable, they're open, and they're transparent. So people feel like, oh man, I'm dealing with this stuff. I can't go to that guy. I mean, what what do I do? And then you see these other guys over there, and they're like, they know the word, they're like they're very open about their past or what they're struggling with currently. That guy knows. That lady knows what I'm going through, and then they secretly go to them. What do I do? What are you doing for that? And then you can help them and guide them when the other guy's gonna say, I don't really know how to do this, but in the future, you're probably not gonna be in a leadership role. In the future, you're probably not gonna be able to be a deacon, or even for sure, not a pastor. Because heaven forbid a pastor have something wrong with them. Right. I don't know. That just that struck a nerve when you said that because I have probably I mean, I've been divorced in a lot of Baptist churches. If you have a divorce, you're not being a pastor at our church because of the qualifications, man of one wife. Well, there's a lot of other things in front of and behind that qualification that each one of them deals with, but that's like the golden pony that they put up here and say, you can't have done this one or you can't preach. It's like, well, a man of God is a man of God. If God put him there, God's gonna keep him there. I don't know, man. I just when you said that my whole mind just went, yes.
SPEAKER_02:And it and it does. It's like they they take that there because there are there is expectations of leadership. Absolutely. You need to be able to do that. Yeah so far, and what it has caused, it's caused a lot of leaders to hide what they are dealing with. So that's why we're seeing, oh my gosh, this pastor that's been pastoring for 50 years did this, did this, because it didn't start with an affair, it started with a lust problem, right?
SPEAKER_05:Grew into that. Was it you that said they no, I think it was on a podcast. It may have been you, I don't know. But they were talking about he fell so far. Did I hear that somewhere else? I did. I don't know. Okay, they're saying that pastor fell so far. And they said, No, he didn't. He fell just a very short way. You just didn't see the steps it took to get there. Is that you?
SPEAKER_02:No.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, I've I've heard that on podcasts then.
SPEAKER_02:Because it is, it starts, it starts as as this problem that doesn't get dealt with. They they felt they have to hide it. So they hide it and hide it, and it grows and grows and grows until finally. Right.
SPEAKER_01:And it goes back to what you talked about to the youth just now with Jared. I mean, it's a very lonely position being the youth pastor. It can be, yeah. Um for sure. You know, and and that's where I was sitting there thinking about that, and that's where I'm grateful, you know, for Rich with you, and you know, now that I'm here with Jared, being able to be confidants in that, and uh, you know, trying to realize, you know, you guys are human.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:You know, just because you're a pastor, yeah, doesn't mean I'm perfect, nothing ever happens, like I don't feel any of this stuff, I don't have any of these temptations, none of this other stuff. Right. Um, you're human. Yeah. And you're living in the in the flesh right now, trying to be a Christ-like figure, and it's a very lonely, tempting world.
SPEAKER_05:Well, the crazy thing is, people actually expect you to be perfect. And I mean, we we know what to do, we try our very best. It's that slow perfecting each and every day, sanctification. Um, and we try that. We know and we submit ourselves to God, we die of the flesh. But what happens? We're sinful human beings, we're gonna mess up from time to time. Everyone will fail you except Jesus at some point in time. I'm gonna fail Bobby, I'm gonna fail Rich, I'm gonna fail Mike, I'm gonna fail my kids, my wife, my parents. List goes on and on and on.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and and with that, if if you have the mindset of I've I fell out of faith, you know, with the Lord or you know, with God because my pastor did X, Y, and Z, then your faith was never in God. Right. Your faith was in the in in a in a man. Yes. And and your faith needs to be on God. Yeah, and everything we do, and this is what I love, you know, about Josh says it every Sunday for us, is it's always all about Jesus. You know, so it is are we doing something? No. Why? Because it's not about Jesus.
SPEAKER_03:When it happened with Jimmy Swagger, you know, yeah, thousands of people fell away from God because of this man. Your faith was in the wrong thing. Yeah. And that's why I love when Pastor Mike preaches, he's he's he's so trans, and it's what everybody loves about his sermons is he's he's up there just saying, Look, I'm broken. Okay. Come to me if you see something wrong, if you, if if whatever it is, I am I'm here for you. He he's a servant pastor, is what I'd call him, because he doesn't he doesn't get up there and say, I got this all figured out. Y'all just sit there and listen to what I, the man of God, have to say.
SPEAKER_05:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:It's not that's not how it works.
SPEAKER_05:He said something at the conference I went to that you allowed me to preach at that I went far too long on.
SPEAKER_01:That's so awesome. We still talk about that.
SPEAKER_05:And that's it. I told Amanda I was sitting on the back row last night while you were preaching, and I didn't even look at my watch. I said, I I he I owe him one.
SPEAKER_06:So if he wants to go like two hours, it's okay.
SPEAKER_05:I didn't, I told her that. But when you said at the conference, I don't know if you said it before I started preaching or if it was after, I can't remember. It was before because I think I used it in the sermon. You said, uh, I'm broken. If you're looking to me for the perfect man, you're not gonna find it. But the illustration you used was it stuck with me because I didn't think about it. I said, if this roof fell in, it's gonna land on me too. Like I'm not perfect. I've never heard that before, and I thought, that's so true. Yeah, every one of us are gone.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, that's why they might say, Oh, the roof will fall in. Lightning will strike him. Well, I guess we'll both get in stuff. Yes. Yeah. And that's what that's what I love about Paul's writings is Paul was the first one to go, I am the worst of the worst. Yes. Like I I I am an apostle and I am the worst of the worst. Because it's how people lean into them like, wait a second. Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_01:Because it's being transparent. Yes, and I love it.
SPEAKER_02:People will listen, listen to what you say, but they'll relate to you by by who you are, by your mistakes, by your shortcomings. You know, so being able, you know, we we are we have overcome by what? The blood of the Lamb and the Word of our testimony, the us saying, We were broken, but Jesus.
SPEAKER_03:But this is but this is a a system that has been put in place for years with pastors acting that way.
SPEAKER_02:Well, and it's because they got special treatment. Yeah. It's because they got the oh my gosh, he is just up on a pedestal, and and it was an epidemic because people got in that position and they yearned for that.
SPEAKER_05:Well, and to have that much, it's almost hard to blame them. I mean, I haven't put in that position, and you really have to have a good relationship one-on-one with God. Yeah, and it has to be daily, more than once a day, being in God's word, being with Him, because I I know how it gets. I get so busy doing stuff, and it's for God, but I don't have personal time with God. Yeah, and I start to feel it. I feel that strain, that distance, and I can see how guys in that position, especially when people put you up on this pedestal, and some people have addictive personality, some people have uh lone wolf personality, and everybody's different, but you get the right personality or the wrong personality with that kind of treatment. I can just see it getting elevated to a part where that's gonna happen. It's almost inevitable unless God, but God, takes over. But that's what I love about free will. I don't care what anybody says about predestination or Calvinism, we have a choice. Satan got cast out with a third of the angels because they chose to rebel against God. It wasn't the ultimate grand scheme of thing, God's not the author of evil, and we have a choice, and those pastors chose to do what they did, those people chose to follow that pastor and then fall away after he did what he did. It was just a bad combination of choices being made. Right.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:That was a really weird way I went with that.
SPEAKER_01:And it was good. And I think I think now, you know, I look back to when I was a kid, and you know, seeing how the church was and um to my twenties, thirties, I kind of went here and there not really going to church again, and then uh here recently going going to church again and and having Josh and the way that he does things and the way that that we talk um in our one-on-one times and stuff, I can see that people are starting to realize that there is a difference between knowing God and following God. Oh huge. And I think, you know, um there's this famous reel that's going around of, you know, what's the furthest distance in this room? Uh, you know, you know, it's a wall to wall, side to side, and all this other stuff. And and the guy says, you know, the the six to twelve inches from your head to your heart. Yeah. Um you know, that that's gonna separate you from eternity in hell or eternity in heaven. Yeah. Um, and and I think the newer generation is starting to they're actually seeing that and they're understanding that, and we're actually starting to see people follow God and not just know about God.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Um And this morning when I was driving in uh to come in to to make the breakfast and everything, I was, you know, just really listening to a bunch of praise music and everything and wanted to get my mind right for the day and everything. And uh Sea of Victory came on. And so uh I jotted down these little notes uh as soon as I got here. Uh, because my one of my favorite part of the whole m of that whole line is uh you take what the enemy meant for evil and you turn it for good, uh, for the battle belongs to you. And and I mean, just everything in life, the enemy, you know, is meaning it for evil. You know, people die, and I and you know, the enemy's gonna use that for evil. Um, you know, you did this bad act, the enemy's gonna use it for evil. You did this other thing, the enemy's gonna use it for evil. But God's gonna take all of that and he all that evil and all that's what it was meant to be, and he's gonna glorify it, and he's gonna make a good thing out of it. Um and that he's already won the spiritual battle. And you know, I mean, it's he's already won. It's already said, you know, he's gonna run.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, and now you just get to choose which side you want to be on. Right.
SPEAKER_01:And so I mean that was it kind of just gave me peace this morning, you know, with all that as I was thinking about you know, everything that's been going on, not only in the world for the last couple of weeks, but in my own life and everything, and I was like, man, like that song came on at the right time at the right moment.
SPEAKER_05:Awesome, that's good. Um I'm gonna go ahead and wrap this up if you guys are okay. Yep, I'm gonna go around this way with concluding thoughts. Uh Bobby.
SPEAKER_01:Um, so I would just say I know you guys aren't gonna watch this or hear this until until Monday. Um that's right. And so it was good to be away. Uh, and you know, I that wasn't a part of last week's little 10-minute devotional that Jared did. I was out of town. Uh, so it's great to be back. Um, but I'm really excited for what tonight has hold, what tomorrow has hold. Um I really see the youth growing. Um and just in some of our our small group conversations last night, yeah, I was telling some of the ladies I was working in the kitchen with this morning, I said, I was reflecting that I've been here for a year now. Last year at D Now, I was a part of it, but I was still kind of timid. Like I didn't really know all the kids. I knew some of them because my niece is in there, so I knew her friends, but I didn't really know all of them. And after being here for a year and getting to actually really know all the kids, feeling fully accepted with them, uh, being able to actually lead and mentor them, and then seeing where they have grown from last year to this year, it's just unbelievable. And I'm and I'm really proud and excited for it. Uh, and I just can't wait to see what God has in store for this weekend.
SPEAKER_02:No. So good.
SPEAKER_03:So I just wanted to comment on what you were saying about um people learning the difference between knowing God and following God, and I think that's why it's so important that y'all are starting y'all and us are starting this young adult ministry because because of that transition that's missing between youth and adulthood. So I think it's really important to do that. But I I'm I'm just super excited. It was two years ago that we were here at D now and and and these seniors are the ones that we kind of poured into at that point, and they I mean, just to see how much they've grown in their faith and their relationships what y'all have here is special. What you built here is special. And I I I don't I I want to encourage you in that because it's it's you built it. You and God, obviously. God built it, used you, but I want to encourage you in that that you're doing the right thing. Thank you.
SPEAKER_02:That goes a long way, it really does. Yeah, that's good. Man, just so on time. It's no, I'm just kidding.
SPEAKER_05:Dude, I mean my wife's calling, so I we can't go down that road.
SPEAKER_02:No, man, just just blessed to be here, man. Like last night just took some time to just think about everything that that's going on here and just the the preparation that takes the prayer, just all the things, and just just blessed to be connected and and and I just appreciate uh the opportunity to come and and do what I felt God has has put me on this planet to do is to preach and teach his word. So I'm just thankful for you, man, and and just watching every kid and and understanding that every kid that is here, every youth, every leader is better because they have you in their life.
SPEAKER_03:Amen.
SPEAKER_02:So I don't want you to to to ever forget that that you are laying the foundation for these kids and the rest of their life. I wouldn't be here if it wasn't for a man that did that for me. Like I wouldn't. Um laid my foundation of faith. My of course my nana and and was was the foundation of bringing me to church, but if it wasn't for a good youth group, a good youth leader, and a man that helped lead my life, I want to be here today. So um I it's awesome to watch you be that for other kids. Thank you. I appreciate it. You too. I don't think you understand how much that means for him to have somebody. I try to tell him this all the time because he's he's my you know go to, and and it's hard, man. It really is. And it's awesome when you have somebody you know that you can lean on, you know that you could say, Hey, I need help in this. And to get it done, it takes a weight off. It really does. So he couldn't do what he's doing for these kids if it wasn't for you. So I understand. It's not, oh, Pastor Jared, Pastor Jared, Pastor Jared. It couldn't be Pastor Jared without the support of people around him. Right. That's right. All right, he's got somebody. You know, last time he agreed, he didn't have anybody like that, you know. So watching that, to seeing you in the morning helping cook breakfast and do stuff like that, it means the world. And and you as well are laying seas in these kids' life that they're gonna be married, teaching their kids things that y'all poured into them when they were in youth. Yeah. You're you're affecting generations. Oh, let that sink in. That's awesome, yeah. It's kind of scary, but it's we are there. We're having youth that are now married looking at having kids that we helped you know, they're 11, 12 years old. You know, I got to marry Abby and her husband Jacob. Like I Jacob was at our house at eight years old.
SPEAKER_04:Wow.
SPEAKER_02:So now we're getting to watch them be married. Look at having kids, look at having jobs. Like it's it's crazy, man.
SPEAKER_05:Well, I appreciate it, Michael. And when I say scary, I don't mean like scary way. I'm it's sobering. Yeah. Like, wow. Yeah. This is this is this is heavy. It's not something lighter to take.
SPEAKER_02:We've got youth, his son. I had a son in youth. He has a baby now.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And now he's gonna be teaching his kids things that I taught him as youth. You know, it's like, ooh, man. That's awesome.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I appreciate it, guys. Michael, Rich, thank you so much for coming on here. And uh, we got a busy day ahead of us.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, man. We do. It's gonna be a good day.
SPEAKER_05:We're gonna be going to uh coffee shop and we're gonna be there for an hour. I think that Sean might be coming and playing some music for us and getting to encourage and uplift some young adults 18 to 30 years old. It's today, Saturday. Well, this is gonna be recording. Never mind. I was gonna put out a promo for it, but uh you guys are gonna be hearing this uh two days after it's already happened. So hopefully you were there and you had a great time.
SPEAKER_03:If you aren't, you're definitely late now. What are you doing with your life?
SPEAKER_05:Late? Oh, we're kidding, kidding, kidding. He's talking about if you're definitely late. You didn't catch that, did you? No, I didn't. Okay. Well, guys like us catch those things. That's right. Um, but yes, thank you, Bobby. Thank you so much. You're doing awesome this week. Um, but that's it. Tonight will be the last night of D now, praying for uh people to really, really grow deep in their faith. But most important thing to me is if there's somebody who doesn't have a relationship with Jesus that they did get it taken care of tonight. Right now, I mean if somebody came in the door and said, Hey, Pastor Mike, Jared, Bobby, hey, Rich, come over here. Can you pray with me? I want to I I really want to know what this is about salvation. I'd stop the show or we'd be like, gotta go. Gotta go. Gotta go. Um, but yes, thank you so much for watching uh the vertical podcast. As always, I'm Jared Morphe, and sitting across from me is a man who goes by the name of Ricky Bobby. I wanted to say that so many times, but it's Bobby Cooper.
SPEAKER_01:Ricky Bobby.
SPEAKER_05:No, you don't have two first names. You're okay. Yeah. Um, does any of us have two first names? Richard? No. Is Randall a first name?
SPEAKER_03:My name is Richard Douglas Randall.
SPEAKER_05:Okay, you're good then. You're good. You're good.
SPEAKER_03:It's really gap. Three first names. Whoa, whoa.
SPEAKER_05:You know, I've heard I've heard if you put capital letters while you're writing and off and mixed with mixed inside of your writings that you could be a serial killer. And I thought, well, that's me because I do that. I do. Okay. Okay. I didn't know who you're really listening to. Okay, well, thank you so much for watching. Uh, as always, let's be not hearers. I've messed up every time. I mess it up every time, but when I'm talking, it flows so good. So, as always, let's be doers of the word and not hearers only. Thank you for watching. Thanks, guys. Later. Later.
