The Truth About Building Businesses Nobody Warns You About

Schedule a Call here to build and Scale your Ecommerce Brand → https://www.ecomcapital.com/demo/schedule

In this exclusive workshop, Sasha and Hamen sit down with three community members - Priyanka (a corporate product manager with no business background who built an ecommerce brand from scratch while her family thought she was wasting money) and Dean and Jill (a couple who combined their passion for dog rescue with a pet product business and just hit their biggest month at nearly $30K). We break down the Five P Framework for scaling from $30K to $100K, why doing more things kills more businesses than doing fewer things ever could, and the exact mindset and measurement behaviors that separate founders who make it from those who quit one bad week too early.

If you're new to this channel, my name is Sasha Karabut. I went from $137,000 in debt to building two 8-figure eCommerce brands. Through my company Ecom Capital, I've generated over $75 million in client revenue and helped 1000+ brands scale their businesses profitably.

Connect with Sasha
Instagram: https://instagram.com/sasha_karabut
Facebook: https://facebook.com/the.real.sasha.karabut
LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/sashakarabut

TIMESTAMPS
0:00 - Intro: Three Founders, Two Businesses, One Stage
1:00 - Priyanka's Story: Corporate Product Manager, Zero Business Background
3:00 - Why "Loan Success" Pushed Her to Build Something of Her Own
5:00 - Why Ecom Beat University (And What the MBA Gets Wrong)
7:00 - The Overwhelm of Starting With No Framework
9:00 - The Hardest Part: Creatives, Traffic, But No Conversions
11:00 - The Army of Ads That Works While You Sleep
13:00 - Dean and Jill's Story: Pet Rescue Passion to Product Brand
16:00 - Nearly $30K Last Month and Improving Fast
19:00 - The Risk Equation: Why Calculated Risk Beats Playing It Safe
22:00 - The Five P Framework: One Product, One Person, One Platform
25:00 - Level One vs Level Two Skills (And Why Mixing Them Kills Growth)
28:00 - The Fishing Shirts Story: How Multi-Platform Almost Ended the Business
31:00 - Why $270K a Month Came From Saying No to Everything Else
34:00 - The Three Things You Can Actually Control Right Now
37:00 - The Shopify Dopamine Trap (And What Happens When Sales Drop)
40:00 - Why You Should Do More When Things Get Hard, Not Less
43:00 - The Six Departments of a Business (And Where to Focus)
46:00 - One Product, One VA, Multi-Million Dollars: The Case Study
49:00 - Building as a Couple: Splitting Departments, Not Decision Making
52:00 - Priyanka's Takeaway: Focus and AI as the Next Unlock
55:00 - Dean and Jill's Takeaway: Staying in Level One Until It's Mastered
57:00 - Closing: The Fear of Taking Risk With More Experience

Ready to take your business to the next level?

Follow Sasha below:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/sasha_karabut/

Facebook:  https://www.facebook.com/SashaEcomCapital/

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfVhWUtWBs_Hm-FrQJot8-Q

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sashakarabut/

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Conversation installed today with a couple of cases of community who were doing their businesses and putting off to that. When you start the business website, I do not have any business platforms.

SPEAKER_06 0:14

I have been successful, but it was not my own. So this is where I've been thinking if I spend the same amount of export, same amount of time. I put something of my own. I spent as well. Coming up with creative, I put those creative on a Monday morning. And I've not even done off and I'm making money. I guess that's like top if I allow it.

SPEAKER_01 0:39

We might put on it. Our last month was probably our biggest month. So we had to go out 35, which is which is great.

SPEAKER_04 0:55

What do you think some of the hardest things in terms of like I think this is going to be easy? And then you were like, ah, before we jump into that though, Kriyanka, just wind us back to where you were when you started the business in the first place. You mentioned to us before the conversation here that you uh you weren't even a believer that it was even possible. So talk to me about what was going in in your life uh when you had no belief that this was even possible.

SPEAKER_06 1:20

Yes, of course. Uh I'll start by saying um I have never been um, I do not have any business background. The whole family, no one has even sold a pen. I have a friend circle full of corporates and um yeah, and no one even from marketing. So absolutely no background on marketing, sales, or how to sell anything.

SPEAKER_04 1:45

So I take it you haven't got much support from your family then.

SPEAKER_06 1:48

Oh, they they think I've been wasting money on this. So I've not showed uh my um monthly or daily profit tracker to them. I've not shared that with them yet. But uh yeah, we are a bunch of non-believers in this. But I've been working in corporate for so long, and I've uh spent like my blood and tears and sweat in the things that I do at work. I make digital products for customers, so I know how to work for customers, what they want, what business wants, and building things from ground up, delivering it into the hands of customers. So it all has been very fulfilling. And I love the success that this job has given it to me, and that's all I knew before, right? But in the end, when you move out for a company or even from a project, none of it comes with you. So that's what I call it like a loan success. It has I have been successful, but it was not my own. So this is where I've been thinking if I spend the same amount of effort, same amount of time, and build something of my own, that gives me more pleasure, like ability to have something of your own and see its scale and grow from nothing to X, wherever it can go. And then I started looking for coming from the background I am, I was actually looking for universities who can teach me how to do it. Yeah, looking for e-commerce or looking for business and MBA and other things are so expensive, none of us can afford it anymore. Um, and then I found you. Uh, and I was like, this is much better than uni.

SPEAKER_00 3:33

Yeah, and and you and just like to interrupt you, but you realize that you know, the MBA, just like use that as an example, you know, you pay 50, 100k plus for at least two years, I would say, if it's part-time, it's a full-time, maybe a year, but you do that. But the job, like the average, you start with like 100k plus per year. And and we're talking about an e-commerce that could do millions, so it's a very different kind of career, is that you're aware.

SPEAKER_06 3:58

That's right. Again, as I said, non-believer. I thought, yeah, 100k a year, 150k a year, being an MBA is the thing to do. And uh then I saw, you know, you that we can do this and calling out people and challenging people. Like, are you willing to take the next step? And I was, I was, because I do want the flexibility. I do want to pick uh pick up my kid from school and drop at whatever times I want. And I'm not shy on putting more effort, so I can work through the night, but I do not want to wait for permission, like, hey, can I go out? I'll be out of office, or I have this appointment and things like that. So flexibility was definitely number one. And then when I wanted to do this, I had to uh learn a new skill, right? I had to invest in myself, and that's what I mentioned. I was looking for a uni, and then I found you, and I thought I prefer learning from someone who has done this rather than just teaching theory. So in MBA, they will teach you chapter one, chapter two, chapter three, and exams. But here we sit with each other and do things, real life business from day one. So that has been amazing.

SPEAKER_04 5:10

Was there um, what was there any like, because it sounds like that idea that you had of like uh maybe like building your own thing, doing your own thing, like that was something that was going on for a little while, and then you kind of got to the point where you were like, okay, uh now I need to do something different. Was there anything that happened specifically? Usually there's like a a moment where I'm not sure you you you worked a whole bunch of hours on a project, and the boss goes, Congratulations, other person. Well done. And you're like, like, was there anything that happened for you specifically that kind of was the final straw that made you go, you know what? I'm gonna go and take a risk and go against everything I've been taught, you know?

SPEAKER_06 5:51

Yeah, no, I think I did get the due credit, so I have a very boss and like one of those boring people who will always say, I love my job. But it's the inner thing where you want something your own, right? So I did so much hard work, but it's not my own product. I can't say that I built this, I did it, and then I move on to the next project and the excitement dies, and you are not connected with the other project anymore or the other thing that you worked on anymore. So nothing stayed with me, and I did not feel very satisfied with that emotion. So because of so much hard work that went into it, like I worked 14 hours a day, not seeing my family, not you know, missing bedtime with my kid. It was really hard, but it was not mine. So this time when I do hard, I want it to be mine.

SPEAKER_04 6:44

Love that. Um, and and and and how has it been in terms of like the building of the business? You know what I mean? In terms of you said you you kind of came in as like a a non-believer, and then you were like, was it difficult to kind of like identify a product, like learn all of the adjusted skills that you had, like obviously, obviously corporate skills, but then the entrepreneurial skill is very different, you know. So what was that a different adjustment? Did you what was it like, oh my god, this is a lot of information? Like, how was that process?

SPEAKER_06 7:12

Yeah, what you said when I started the modules. Like, one thing good with e-com is it doesn't bombard you with everything, we have everything structured, but uh being an outsider, never known what how to run a business, how to start a business. When I came in, each and every module, there was so much information to take in. It was so hard to understand like product. My thinking was what should I sell? Because everyone is selling everything today, right? There's nothing that you can't find in the market. We are not in an era where we are inventing things or building new things. So I was very overwhelmed at that point, but then e-com had a um proper, what do you call it, like uh a framework, step A, step B, step C. So following those steps made it easier, it made me uh focused. So um, all those motivational talks in between Sasha that you put in in your modules, they are so helpful more than you would imagine. It's like it just brings you down, like, oh no, don't focus on 100 things, just this one thing for today, one thing for today. So it's dreamlined, but my I was very overwhelmed. I didn't know what product to pick, I didn't know how to work with suppliers. I contacted so many suppliers, finding the right supplier who is reliable with and supports my small MLQ. Uh, I couldn't go and order a thousand bags or something, right? I wanted to small start something small, so I needed a good supplier. Even after that, the whole journey of branding, the whole journey of content creation, ads, like running through it, it is still overwhelming for me. I still sit down and think, what um that what is that one thing that I want to focus on for today? So coming from that non-entrepreneurial journey into this has been a big challenge. Uh, but I couldn't have done it without e-comcap.

SPEAKER_04 9:12

What what do you think some of the hardest things um were you were for like in terms of like you were like, I think this is gonna be easy, and then you were like, oh, this is actually challenging. And then the reverse, in terms of like things that you felt were like, I don't know, the most like exciting, and you were like, oh my god, like what were some of the really big challenges that you were really perhaps stuck with and you were maybe doubting yourself? And then on on the other side, what were some of the things where you're like, oh my god, this is the best moment of the last six months?

SPEAKER_06 9:40

Yeah, uh a lot of things actually. I thought uh coming up with creatives will be very easy because I am a bit creative myself. I'm good with colors and designs and whatnot, but it's not about that, it's about messaging, it's about emotions, uh learning what turns customer to buy. They like you, but they don't hit buy. So that was that still is most challenging for me, coming up with ideas of these creatives and thinking like, oh, I have traffic on my website, they're spending five, ten minutes, I can see that, but they're not buying. So, what else can we do? You know, so that kind of thing is still very challenging for me, which I thought it'll be easy. You come up with a beautiful website, you do beautiful photography, and if they are on your website, they are they are going to buy. It doesn't happen that way. I'm so sad. So I go to other yes, uh like so much hard work, okay, not working, so we have to keep focusing. It's like it's like it never stops. One something, it's next, it's next.

SPEAKER_00 10:50

Yes, but just just just one thing here I wanted to tell you. Um, I have one of my clients and and and and they had the same thing. They were saying, well, we're doing the same thing over and over again. But the one thing you need to think about is from a business perspective, for an e-commerce tour, running new creatives. That's the main thing that's your biggest kind of job is to focus on production of content because those ads, when you're sleeping, they're making you money. So you need to think about their kind of an army you're building that they can be working for you. And it's like think about them as employees. And I think about it like that, it just makes things easier. But I have one one client, she was like, I produced, like, she was producing every week 75 ads, 75 ads, 75 ads, and I was like, okay, that's really good per week. And then we're doing like massive numbers. And she was like, Well, I'm not gonna lie to you. I cried yesterday. I was like, why? She was like, just because that is so tough. And I was like, let's look at the PL and we looked at it, and she was making 50k profit per week. I was like, is it good? She's like, Yes. I'm like, but she was like, it's just tough building 75 ads, spending eight hours every day just on creatives, and that's how much time she was doing. And and and this thing, this standard is when you look at, well, I'm gonna do more, but I'm gonna also make much more. That's the that's a that's a link. So just to let you know, you're gonna do more creatives in the future, even at scale, that's still the thing we work on, but just gonna be with more money, and that's probably exciting.

SPEAKER_04 12:04

And I think just to add to that, is is is like the the reason that the focus thing is so important, um, is because when you when you when you truly understand how difficult it is to do something really well, like you actually don't have the capacity to do more than one or two things. You know what I mean? And and and what happens usually is is people they have a very limited and delusional view of like what it takes. And so naturally they start a whole bunch of different projects and they do all of them really poorly, and then they're like it's not working. Maybe I need to do something else, and it's really like no, no, no, like you're actually just not doing anywhere near enough in terms of even potentially getting a result, uh, and you need to just do less and just do the one thing and just continue focusing on it over and over and over again. It's it's a conversation I have constantly with my team where it's just like, can we do a lot more of what we're doing? Can we do more brute force of this current thing? Because it's like once you have the strategy that works, once you have the creative system, the messaging, the average or the value, it's like, how do I just drive as much force into that thing as possible and continue exploiting the little crack that I've got and then just open it up as opposed to being like, I've I've just started to carve out this little crack, and then all of a sudden, what's that? Well, let's just come back over there in a minute. Let's go and see what this is. And you go, distracted mode, looking for new things, you know. So I don't want to interrupt. Um, talk to me, um, Priyanka, about the the most exciting maybe parts of the journey in terms of any key learnings, any key, like maybe aha moments. I found I was sharing it yesterday uh with uh the content creator around for me personally, um, still to this day, the the most I don't know, like eye-opening money that I've ever made was like the first $130 that I made overnight, and it still makes me feel like a kid. Um, when I woke up and I checked my phone and I was like, oh my god, this is just out of control. I'm like, what just happened? Like I was asleep, you know, and and and it's it's it's never been um matched by any other amount of money or any other different kind of money that's been made. It's like that small amount of money going from working like a job to then seeing that.

SPEAKER_00 14:24

I was like, Yes, and the fact it's online. The thing is, like you when you think about it, it's virtual. So for me, that was like like I've had kind of the same kind of feeling. It's just the fact it's virtual money. So I was like, I've never really like we didn't do anything, just money appeared. So for me, that that that's really magical, just generally, yes.

SPEAKER_04 14:40

What about yourself, Grian? But was there any key moments for you that stood out?

SPEAKER_06 14:43

Yeah, I've experienced what you've just said, um, and also you, Haman. I've spent weekends as well coming up with creatives. I put those creative on a Monday morning and I'm working these nine to nine hours, and I've not even logged off and I'm making money. I get that like Shopify alerts. Uh, even on the weekends, you're out with the family and you come back home and like, yeah, there's money in your account. I was like, Oh, all that hard work. Okay. So it is real, it is real money. I wouldn't say I don't call it passive income. It wasn't passive, it was very active. I did a lot of work in it, but then uh it is more scalable. So you do the work over the weekend, which pays for it for days and days, and that's what I love about it. It's scalability of it, and the more work you put in, I believe, the more money it can generate for you. And we've seen this with so many others in our community. I just want to achieve the same. But yes, aha moment is definitely how you put your R's in and then keep those money coming in. Like that's that's amazing. You don't get to see that in any other profession, and it's more hard work than any other as well. So I don't want to cut charts saying, Oh, easy money, it's not easy money.

SPEAKER_04 16:01

But I think the thing is with it, like there's a lot more hard work, but the rewards that you get are also like so much bigger, you know what I mean? Like you have that win and you're like, now that's a win. You're like, you know what I mean? It it feels so worth it when you have the win, as opposed to, for example, maybe when it was working in your job, like you work so hard, and then the win is like, yeah, nice, yeah, cool.

SPEAKER_06 16:24

Nice, good work, good work, excellent.

SPEAKER_00 16:26

Yes, but also, but also think about that. This is you at the lowest point. You're just starting. This is the first year, I'm assuming, right? So look at this. If you have like skills of the past, that's a whole other thing. But um, if this is the year where you launch your business and you're in that first year, my view on this would be in five years, what would happen if you do the same thing? I'm assuming you're gonna be like sensing Shopify and sensing the ads before you get the sales. Think about that process. That's the exciting part, is you're gonna be better and better and better as long as you stick to the plan. But in 10 years, we're talking about almost like you just know the thing. So, my view on this would be this is you like at your lowest level. And I think Sasha mentioned this in some of the podcasts. I really value that view, is that we're gonna grow more rather than it's gonna be the same or you're gonna be declining. So, my view on this could be this is the lowest we have. This is like our biggest bottleneck. We're level one.

SPEAKER_04 17:18

Um, Dean, Jill, tell me a bit about your guys' experience um and in terms of what was going on before you started the business, what was going on in and around your personal, professional situation that led you to start um Evertel.

SPEAKER_01 17:31

Yeah, we we both work full-time, but um, we were always involved in um the pet um rescue side of things, and that's it's all blended in around that that piece. So we we had an idea to to be in the pet space, so that that was a pretty much a given, but what sort of product to use um didn't sort of develop until we got um with you and we we nutted that out. But yeah, it's um it's giving back to um part of that community with uh so care is giving your dogs a um a soft place to land was was that that element that we had, which is working really well. But we um yeah, we we knew what was there, but we didn't know quite how to do it at that stage.

SPEAKER_04 18:15

So, as in you kind of had like a an idea, like almost like a loose idea of like something in the pet space, but not too much like fleshed out or specific.

SPEAKER_01 18:24

Yeah, for sure. So there's a lot of products that we've seen come and go through the rescue animals, and it was um how do we improve this and how do how do we build something that's um a brand and that's got a bit of passion, a bit of meaning about it as well, too?

SPEAKER_04 18:39

So what was um what was difficult or or or different to what you expected when you were kind of building and going through that process of you know, going from uh there's a few product ideas that I have, and then here's our product. Okay, cool. Now let's take the product and move into like more of a marketing. Like, were there any key things that you found particularly challenging or difficult as part of the uh the the build of the business?

SPEAKER_01 19:02

Not so much challenging, I think it was more direction um on where. So once you taught us how to niche down and and look at something very um granular on getting to that pain point from a customer's perspective, that was um we knew what direction to go then. So once we understood uh the product that we've got now is slightly different to what's out in the market now, so there's not a lot of um that style of product in there, too, which is great. So we can really ha hone in on um a specific target and and person to do it.

SPEAKER_04 19:34

So love it, very good. Anything from your side, Jill? Um, anything that you saw, any experiences that you found interesting as part of the build process initially?

SPEAKER_02 19:43

Definitely, so but asked for me especially, it had to be functional, it had to have meaning of why we built what we built. So Dean was doing obviously more of the admin side and more of the creative sides and things like that, but the the product itself for me had to have meaning, had to have a story behind why we created it. Um just for it to be real, um, to sell that from a real big heart place sort of um yeah, passion. Um, you know, I I use this, I created this, I you I'm really giving you something that's um that's usable, that's friendly, like but yeah, the the the back end of that, like the the volunteering, the dog loving, the pet loving, you know. I talk to people, they're my they're our kind of people, like people who buy this are our kind of people, they're people who love their pets. They you know, they they want their pets to be comfortable. Um, yeah, so we created it around our older dog because we take her camping and you know, just things like that. So you use it, I really believe in it. I believe it's a good product, it's not just something that we've changed the design from somebody else and gone, oh, but because ours looks better, or it's really functional. It's really something that I go, oh, that's awesome that someone's used that.

SPEAKER_04 21:04

Was it like because this this sounds like something that you both of you guys have had for quite some time in terms of like um number one, like the passion to like really make an impact on the community the community in terms of the dog, the dogs themselves, but also the dog owners. Um what what had to change for you to make the decision to actually move into building the business? Because it it almost sounds like you you both of you guys had a lot of, especially how you spoke about it, Dean, a lot of clarity with like, okay, we kind of know like the direction we want to go in in terms of like the pets. Uh we know we want to make an impact, we know we want to use what we've got with the rescue situation. Um, but it's like what uh had to change or what maybe did change for you to actually start as opposed to just you know continuing doing what you guys were currently doing. Was there anything that happened?

SPEAKER_02 21:49

Dean woke up one morning and decided he wanted to do something um creative and said, Let's go on the journey together, Gelata. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 21:57

Very simple, but but but but just one thing here I want to say is. That you guys actually have an advantage because if I was to think about time, it's almost like you started a business partnership, because this is how the business would operate. If I was to just ignore kind of that you guys are together, but you're two people building a business, so the time is actually double that you have available, and also the vision can be kind of complementary. And I think that finding a person to build a business with is very challenging. But if you're already like you know each other for a while, you kind of know a little bit kind of how you operate, and I think that could be an extremely rewarding, but also very high ROI partnership because you have the same goal and also you know each other. So I think that's an advantage rather than anything else. I've just observing this.

SPEAKER_02 22:42

100%. We um we we bounce off each other, um, like obviously personally and then business-wise, um, where I I obviously Dean does more of the online things and more of the learning things where I will then take what he has to say, listen, give maybe just you know, a customer feedback of just not analytically what it looks like. If I was going to buy that product, that's what we so we've we've always worked well together. So it went it works well.

SPEAKER_01 23:11

I think what uh changed Sasha was seeing your ads and seeing your the capability to but to be able to do that, have a system in place, have something simple that's you can you can manage and work with. So the more ads that I seen coming through from you, the more it made sense, and the more I went, hey, this is um we can do this.

SPEAKER_04 23:32

Was it uh I'm just curious on this point, like uh because I think I think I remember when I was one of the guys watching the ads, and the position was kind of like, yeah, right. You know what I mean? It's like it it takes a lot to kind of believe it, kind of like preamble because she's like, I was a non-believer.

SPEAKER_00 23:52

I actually feel like I'm the opposite. I would have said yes and jumped on the first thing. I'm actually opposite completely. Some different avatar. I would have been like, This is amazing. I'm just gonna jump on this.

SPEAKER_04 24:01

The first thing that happens is he's clicking on and he's buying that thing.

SPEAKER_01 24:05

Yeah, no, it's um it's definitely um it made a lot of sense. Every time I saw your ad and and seen things coming through, I thought, Well, we can actually do this, and we can if I have this support and help to to work through with e com uh capital, then yeah, it's we can do it.

SPEAKER_04 24:22

Yeah, it's what we through the last 90 days in terms of like any particular standout results, any things I know there's been a lot of activity happening in the business. I know you've improved margins, I know you're focusing on some different areas. So talk me through some of the things that you're excited about at the moment in the business and some of the things that you've been doing that are helpful towards getting you to the next level.

SPEAKER_01 24:40

Yeah, for sure. So uh last month was probably our biggest month that we had, but just shy of 30k, which is which is great. Um average order values um improved a lot now. So we've we really looked at that process. We're heavily discounting uh to start with, and once we run the numbers and had a look where we want to take it further down the track, it wasn't scalable and wasn't um workable. So that that was a challenging process because we sort of went back a step to to make it work, get the pricing correct, getting the the messaging correct, um the added value perception on on how we how we did that. So once tried two or three different things and um took a couple of um offers away that we had, but then we hit hit the mark, saw that um things were working, and then uh improved that those areas. So average order values up, our volumes up, um ad spends up, obviously, but we're getting the conversion rate too. So conversions are probably um 2.9, I think. A RAWAS is about just shy of that too, just on three. Um yeah, so it's um we're just on that tipping point now, I think, where I can see things are are moving and orders are coming through. And I like uh pre-anchers that um Shopify bills um a bit addictive, I suppose. Every time you hear that I say, I'll come through. Which is yes, exactly, yeah, which is great. But um, yeah, look, we're certainly moving in the right direction. We need um to understand the next steps of the next level on on how we how we move forward with that.

SPEAKER_00 26:21

So yeah, it doesn't seem like you're like a like an impulsive buyer, to be honest, when I think about it. So yours seems like you're very like controlled plan, and I was thinking that's opposite to when I like wake up just to the decision. I'm just thinking about it. I was like, we're completely different. You're actually like like I can like hearing you, I'm like, you plan. I'm like, I don't necessarily do that much in terms of decision. Like I do believe I'm just gonna tell you this is my view on it. I do believe that there is a tied, like kind of risk if I was to think about everything in life. I don't think that smart people they make a lot of money at all. I don't think that. I do believe that the money equation comes with risk most of the time. So if I was able to lower the risk, like essentially increase the risk, but have an informed decision, that's the delta I would look at. But at the same time, if I was to just optimize, I'm gonna be very positioned, I'm gonna calculate, I don't see that bring results. And I've been exposed to clients and I've been looking at what they're doing, doing millions, and I'm thinking, how are they doing millions a month? And the only thing that I can flag was that they actually take more risk. That's it, more risk by default. That's the risk equation, and I think it's tied to money rather than being smart. That's what I'm trying, and I want to mention like I make a decision fast. I'm trying working on that actually. I think it's a positive thing rather than a negative if it's calculated, obviously. But just to let you know, there is an equation, and the risk is where we see things kind of move most of the time. That's my view on it.

SPEAKER_01 27:43

Yeah, I'll I'll pull the trigger. I haven't got any issues um with with moving forward and seeing something I don't know how it's worth, but yeah, it's the there is an element of risk there you've got to take up totally agree.

SPEAKER_04 27:54

Um, I'd like to go into I'd like to just share this first because I think that this is relevant for uh both of you guys. I'm just gonna share my screen for one moment here. I was just explaining this um yesterday to some different team members, and and and so the the thing is that happens here, uh, if you think about um as you're building your brand um and you're kind of like trying to scale to the next level. So, what happens is you get super excited. Um, these are like levels of skill sets. So, say for example, when you came through uh initially creating your product, going through and understanding the product margins, uh, going through and starting to put a little bit of positioning, maybe some messaging around the avatar, um, and then starting to you know go live and understand some of the basic measurements of the ad account, right? Let's let's just classify that as like level one, right? Um now, similar to what we were saying before in terms of like uh the depth and the volume that's required to be good at something, the majority of the time that I find people um fail and fuck up uh is because what happens is they get through this level one skill set, which is kind of like, okay, so do we have a front-end selling system in terms of do I have one product selling to one person on one platform with one promise profitably? This is like the five Ps that I put together here that I think is indicative of uh essentially you being able to scale your business, right? So it's like one product, one person, one avatar that you know really well on one platform. We're not doing Google and a whole bunch of different things, right? With one promise, meaning one offer that converts profitably, which is the last P profitably, right? Once you've nailed those five Ps, you can be in a position where you can advance to the next level of skill set, right? Uh, which which then can kind of move you into more of a okay, we can look at multiple products, we can look at multiple people, we can look at multiple platforms, we can start to structure front-end offers and back end offers, right? But the thing that ruins people getting to level two, uh, which is usually 100k a month, level three, which is usually 300 to 400,000 per month, is doing the level two and the level three things before this is dialed in, right? And so what happens is it's like I think about it um from the lens of okay, so let's say, for example, um I was to grab anyone off the street as hey, do you want to come in here and learn how to build a business? Yeah, yeah, sure thing. And I sat them down and I said, Okay, so I want to explain to you um this is how you find a product, this is how the margins are in the product. These are some basic metrics about how much margin you want to allocate for cogs and then uh ads and then profit. Okay, cool, makes sense. Uh, and then this is some of the base metrics in your ad account. Like it would be pretty reasonable that most people could follow a process if it was very specifically and clearly laid out with a lot of accountability. I I would say, and they could stay in level one and just do level one and just sit there over and over again and be like, I'm gonna sell this product to this person, and this is how much margin I'm gonna make, and I'm gonna rinse and repeat over and over again, right? But what prevents people from getting, like I said, to this level two, level three, level four, which is kind of a million dollars plus per month, is doing the level two skills um at the cost of level one, right? And this is where people completely mess up. And this looks like, for example, um wanting to scale multi-platform uh way too early at the cost of the current platform even performing, or dropping multiple product lines here before we even have one front-end selling system or one product that's even selling profitably. Hold on a second, this sounds like a great idea. Let's get more products into the mix so I can make less money. Sounds like a good idea, right? And so it's like this is the very real situation for both of you guys because what needs to happen um from a uh so so so there's there's uh uh capacity and then production capacity or or or P and then PC in terms of this is uh Stephen Cubby's uh seven habits of highly effective people, he talks about this, and so what needs to happen is um you need to get really good at owning this first level to the point where it's just mastered, right? And then we start to advance into this next level here, and then you do not do the second level without still doing the first level, so they both get done at the same time, but by the time you've kind of completed this and done this so many times over and over again, um, it's become like uh autonomous. Does that make sense? It's like you're driving a car, but it gets it gets done to it's it's like if Hammond was in an out account compared to someone who's like day one in an ad account learning stuff, there is a stark difference in terms of analysis, mapping, data, review, metrics, and Hammond would automatically do things that someone else would be like, wait, explain that to me. I can't even understand. Do you understand? And so, what gives you guys the capacity to grow quickly is being able to grow through the levels of skill set at each of these particular stages in a way that supports the next level and doesn't put you in a position whereby what sometimes happens, and I see this too often that I'd like to admit, is people go, okay, so I've got level one uh kind of okay, like it's a bit of a fucking mess, but it's all right. Uh, I'm gonna jump up here and launch on a couple of platforms, I'm gonna launch a few more products, and we're gonna do some stuff over here with uh God knows what international at 50 grand a month. And I'm saying this because I've done this. And what happens is eventually, at some point or another, whether it's your decision, meaning you have to make the call, or the bank account of yours makes the decision for you, meaning it runs out of money, you have to come back down here again, right? And you go through the process of cutting back your products and cutting back your ad spend on that platform and cutting back uh partnerships that you've started to build and cutting back distribution because you're like, I cannot sustain all of this stuff all at once because it isn't built on a sound platform of foundation. Does this make sense, guys? And so each of you are going to feel exactly like what Hammond said at the start, as you go through this stage of 30 to 100k per month, it is it is really just a 3x. And and if you take all of the it's a hundred thousand per month, um, and you focus on the the metrics of control in terms of profit margin of your product, um, a creative testing, uh, and then back end selling via email as some of the primary levers and almost cut anything else and just think about how deep you can go into those things. And then at that 100k plus per month level, then you start to look at okay, now I'm gonna need to increase lifetime value with more products, or now I'm gonna need to tap into new avatars and slightly sell to different people and experiment with uh a different targeting mechanism so I can continue branching up and scaling. But doing this, doing this too early is what causes uh uh stagnation, and it also causes massive amounts of overwhelm, and it also causes um huge levels of capital inefficiency, or meaning you just lose a whole bunch of money because your money is scattered everywhere in a whole bunch of things, and you're like, I cannot possibly think for the life of me. And and and so, exact as an example, um, with the the fishing shirts business some years ago that I had four years ago, I think it was, uh, and at that point we were using like this partner agency. Okay, we were doing about $50,000 a month, uh, and we were just using meta ads. That's it, just meta ads, nothing else. Um, and and then they were like, Hey, we've got like this um Pinterest partnership, and um they're amazing. Like they come into your uh ad account, they'll help you to build creatives, they'll they'll work with you as an account. This back four or five years ago was like you would never ever ever have anyone from an ads agent or ads uh platform supporting you. So this was like, wait, what they're gonna do this, um, and so it was very attractive. TikTok, very similarly. Hey, we've got this TikTok partnership, uh, they will uh come and help you support you, get your ads live and help you to run the ads. We've got this creative agency, they're gonna help you do creators for organic on organic on TikTok, and then we're gonna do some Google and then Google split into search, branded, PMAX, and also YouTube. And I was like, strap in, ladies and gentlemen, here comes a million dollars a month. Let's go. All things firing, everything looks amazing, and I kid you not, within three months of doing that, um, we were making $52,000 a month, and we were losing $22,000 a month because every platform was underperforming, every platform had different attribution windows, different creative strategies, different measurement protocols, and the resources that were required from the founder to measure, check, and understand all of the particulars across all of those platforms. It was just not physically viable, and the margins of the business couldn't sustain it, let alone uh retainers, payments to different people to go and manage these things. I was like, this is a hot mess. Right. And so I had to revert that down and go back to simple old glory meta-ads. And I was like, now you learn, and now you stay here until you do 150, we do 200, I think we did over $200 and something thousand dollars a month just on meta ads and a small bit of like branded search. Um, and I had to learn this the hard way of going through that process that um diversification, more equals better, um, more platforms me means more views, means more exposure, means more potential conversions. And it's like it could not be further from the truth in terms of um strategy because what defines um information versus useful information is the sequence that you're able to actually understand, uh comprehend, and then implement the information, right? I had a meeting uh two weeks ago with the the TikTok people, and the TikTok people they went through this uh 400-page uh series of training information on how to use the platform. Okay, and this is what we're releasing soon for our community. Uh and I went through all of the stuff, and um, this is another fantastic example of exactly the situation, right? Um, all of these slides laid out and amazing, very nicely designed, cool stuff, incredible. Um, and then what it has is it has every single product feature, platform feature, use case, creative example, creative style, AI search, AI um uh tracking, everything and anything. And so you go through all this information and you're like, and I stopped the girl a couple times, and I was like, so what would be the first step? That's what I mean. It's like I've got all of this extra stuff now, and then I still have to make the decision of what I need to do. And for both of you guys, that's the most important thing because right now you're building skill set and you're building capacity as far as your ability to execute on level one skills really damn well. Right now, your capacity should be focused on really mastering level one, right? And level one can get you to 100,000 per month. Once you're at that level and you're like nailed it, margins are strong, often solid, conversion is consistent, email marketing producing you know, 20 to 30 percent of back end revenue, then we go. We have a sound model here. Let's not scale more chaos and create more founder headaches and more chaos and panic and late-night wake-ups, middle of the morning, sweaty palms being like, What am I gonna do with this business? How am I gonna keep this thing going? It makes no money, but it's pushing out tons of revenue. That was me, you know what I mean? And all of you guys, like I said, you will have this opportunity, and it feels so natural. And I just hope when these little shiny objects get presented to me, you can have this little bit of a voice of warning to be like, you know what, it's okay to just continue doing what we're doing and do it really well because every single founder I've ever met doesn't have any shortage of ambition, right? They're like, hell yeah, we can do this, hell yeah, we can take over the world, let's go and launch in every market. What they do have a lack of is disciplined focus and disciplined attention, right? And that is usually the causation of most of their demises. I mentioned it previously. There was an individual that I met in that Wool Mosey workshop in the boardroom, and uh he was uh an e-commerce founder making $30 million a year, um, and he was making tons of money in the uh Mexican market, right? Uh and what happened was made a whole bunch of money, very profitable business, got super excited, started using all his profits to go and do a whole bunch of other different businesses, started four other businesses, all of them failed. The main business wound back down to about six million dollars a year. He retracted, shut everything back down, and then limped his way into the workshop, being like, Can you uh please, please, please help, please? You know what I mean? It was like this uh uh I've I've messed up the last like 18 months because of my indecision, sorry, because of my lack of ability to focus. And so uh Priyanka and Dean and Jill, you guys have this exact equation in front of you right now where um the main focus of your attention wants to be continuing to do these things that you're currently doing, similar to what Hannah mentioned, um, at a really deep level to the point where you feel like highing. And you're like, again, creatives, again, creatives, and really dialing those things in, getting so clear with the avatar, the messaging, um, the way that avatar aligns with the particular offer, the structure, the front-end profit of the offer, the back end profit that you can generate in terms of email or kind of you know uh post-purchase revenue, and then seeing that full system come together, balance really well with efficient turnaround times of your stock. Because Priyanka, the issue that you're gonna have and continue having if you don't solve it is continuing to scale, pre-sale, gap of conversion, gap of potential profit, selling product on pre-sale at not the same degree of profit, and essentially we're just losing money during that period. Even if you're not losing money, you're still losing its opportunity cost, right? And so this is I just wanted to share this quickly because this is very front of mind at the moment. I'm seeing a lot of founders go through this, and I'm seeing it across a whole bunch of different areas of team members, entrepreneurs at the moment, these levels at the moment, and it's it's every skill set, every area of expertise and domain, uh kind of knowledge all has the same relationship where it's like you can't ever stop doing the level one skills, they just become more automatic and they move into those different layers of uh of competence. I don't have you guys seen those layers of it's like um conscious comp uh it's like this. I'm sure you might have seen this before. It's like um unconscious, um unconscious incompetence. This is essentially what you don't know that you are bad at. I have no idea. And then you have conscious incompetence. I know that I'm pretty bad at playing um, I'm not sure badminton. Yeah, I'm pretty bad at that thing. And then you've got conscious competence when you focus your attention exclusively on that thing, you are able to do it to a reasonable degree of competence, and then you've got um unconscious competence when it doesn't matter what tap time of the day or night it is, uh you can wake up, get slapped in the face, and be like, let me run my freaking Facebook ads. That's like time and static, right? And so um, what happens is people get to somewhere in here, and then they start learning new skills, and then it's like, oh god, this is the worst time. You're not even remotely close enough to be wrapping your hands around how big that skill is, and then you're Already starting to do something new. And that's where people fall off and they start just spiraling into overwhelming and having. I'll stop there for a moment, but does that kind of make sense in terms of what I shared there today?

SPEAKER_00 44:12

And I wanted to say something just like quickly while I remember this. Um, based on what Sanja showed you, I would say for a new business, uh, you're initially, and I've seen also Alex Ramosi talked about, like, talked about exactly the same thing, but you're rewarded to do new things. So when you start, you're like, I'm I'm doing something new, it's a new risk, I'm gonna do this new thing, it's gonna get me returns, that's positive, all good. Thing is, for phase two or level two, or whatever it's say, we look at term of sales, it's gonna be doing the same thing, but doing it better continuously. And this is something I had issues with as well. But I think it's mastering the same thing over and over again every single time. And the skills deficiency is not visible to a certain degree, to the point where you know the expert versus not, but you know that you need to work on it. So the same thing that we just saw. One thing is this this is the thing for me if I was to really tell you what I've seen almost skill of business in your stage or at your stage. Um, it's gonna be you get to 3050k, you had one bad week or one bad month, regardless, and you react like with I'm gonna do new things. So it's not again that we're having anything but just ideas in terms of scale that are good. It's more of a bad week or a bad month, I'm gonna forget about all of that. I'm gonna do something new because this product doesn't really work, or because I want to launch a new product, new market, whatever it is. So if your one bad week or one bad month would change your behaviors, then guess what? That's a weakness that we can kind of flag right now. Have some clients, we had a like a very good business, very scalable. We did like four million plus, and then we had this one month where we're making less profit margins, right? They didn't really react to it, we just kept doing it, and right now we're still like doing well. And I told them after that, I actually literally was like, you guys will succeed from what I've seen, because one month, like I understand how we build this business essentially. One month you had really less, like I expected you to react. You have some days where they're negative, they don't, they just do the same thing over and over again, and they don't expect things to be like I need to change every time. So I think this lesson that it took me took me actually years to understand, which is focus on the same thing. And every time I do also many things, but I'm thinking I probably should revert back to that. I just focus on this. That's my deficiency. I need to do the same thing. It's you have three things you can control your ad, production, your pricing, and your conversion rate. So you can probably max out all those three anytime, and I'll probably look at maxing them out before I get into another product where I need to max the three. Make sense?

SPEAKER_04 46:29

But I think this is also like to this point, Hammond, what makes that possible um is knowing the numbers. You know what I mean? Like if you are making decisions on just like emotion and you're there and you're just like, hey, like, let's just see how we go. Today's a great day, I feel great, today's a bad day, I feel bad. You know what I mean? It's like you're in a position where you're it's like the business owns you, you know, because you you you don't understand any of the particulars, the details, the metrics, what you're looking at, what you shouldn't be looking at, what looks good, what looks bad, and then so you have a quote unquote bad week, and then you're like, I'm just gonna slow down my creative, I'm gonna not do emails, I'm gonna not show up on any calls, I'm gonna just completely wipe out and wait until things recover. Or the second thing that I see people do is wait, wait until things get really fucking bad before doing anything, right? I I was I was actually making this example yesterday as well. I'll just share this here, it's very relevant. I've shared this in some of my content before, but Priyanka and Dean, both of you guys said how much you enjoy the Shopify notification, right? Um, what happens is the Shopify notifications up here when you're winning and you're checking it, and you're and you and you're entering your profit tracker and you're looking at wow, I made $400 for profit today. Wow, I made this much profit today, wow, I made this. I'm gonna get out there and create ads today, like you wouldn't believe it with so much energy and so much passion. Wow, I love creating ads, ads are amazing, and you're so happy to do it because things are working, right? And then you have this little dip, and the things start to decline. And then what happens is um your production of ads, of measurements, of creatives, of anything related to improving the business goes, man. I just I I'm supposed to get on that call today. I just can't be I you know what? Next week, it's been a bad week. I'm I'm uh let's pour a glass of wine, honey. Let's just, you know what, let's just take it easy today, you know. And so we slow down and slow down and slow down. Um, and then what happens is you go down to the bottom of this dip right here, and you continue going down, down, down, down, down until you reach the point of desperation. And then you're like, oh my god, it's worse than I thought. Hammond, I need a call, it's a rescue, please. Emergency, come and help turn around my business. And then it's like at that point, where it's it's way too late in the game, and we have to do some like you know, insane turnaround skill sets of the business. And so I think what Hammond is saying there is very similar to what I've seen across so many founders who win, don't win, is just like if you can maintain the the inputs from like a uh a measurement perspective, the behaviors, the activities, the things that you do when you are winning at this level. And then usually what happens is when you actually start losing or going down, declining, you almost want to do the opposite of what feels like uh normal. So what feels normal when you start losing is to uh retract away from doing more activity, less energy, you have less certainty, uh you feel worse about your business, you feel like you just want to throw in the towel a little bit. I uh it's true, right? Some days you're just like, you know what, stuff it. Not today, you know? Um, and you need to do the opposite of what's actually feeling like in that moment, which is do even more activity, measure even more frequently. It's exactly why every time when I work very closely with a new founder in terms of very close one-on-one intensive level, I'm like, I will not work with you until you documented and tracked seven days of your performance over 15-minute intervals. Because I'm like, I have no idea what's going on in all of this vague, ambiguous time, right? And so, in the same way here, as you start to see a decline or you see movements kind of shift into a downward spiral, we want to get even more intense with the tracking. We want to get even more intense with uh the uh the actions relating to creative development, um, creative uh volume increase. We want to really start doing more things to turn the performance around. And by more things, I don't mean getting in the ad account every day and upping budget, turning down budget, upping budget, turning down budget. That will that that will ruin your performance. But in terms of just the activities relative to uh improved performance, such as your creatives, such as like sticking your head into your PL every day and being like, I need to fix this. Because the the the greatest thing about um entrepreneurs is if they are presented with a number that they don't like, they generally will find a way to influence the number to look better, right? So they'll they'll they'll they'll they'll work harder, they'll do more hours, they'll do more volume, they'll find ways to make more profit, um, and and they'll do these things, especially if it's in their own business. Or if they don't see the number, then they'll go and find a different number to pursue and push more on. This is why exactly every single founder sometimes scales revenue at the cost of profit because they fixate on one number that looks good, that makes them feel good, and go more, more, more, more, more. Right? And so if you track the right numbers through this kind of a process uh and remain really focused and diligent in terms of doing the particular inputs, irrespective of how you feel, and the the for both of you guys in this stage, the next like three to six months, you are going to definitively experience some moments in relation to your business that will feel like, oh my god, this is hard. And you will want to, you know, if this Dean, this is yours for this week, mate. Do you just take over? Whatever that looks, those conversations will happen, you know what I mean? And so it's like whenever those uh kind of like emotions happen, it's like you need to remind yourself of your commitment to where you're going to, what you're building, and then either right, increase the action back up to the appropriate level, or reduce the commitment level and be okay with doing smaller amounts of action. It's a very simple equation. Things get hard and you go, but the only thing that makes it hard is the big goal you want to get to. Like, say, for example, if say, for example, right now both of you guys said, I just want to get to 10 grand a month. Effectively, right now, you could just be super happy and be like, wow, this is so nice, amazing. Oh, I'm so happy. But it's like you want to get to the bigger things, naturally, the action needs to kind of move up to a certain level to accommodate for that particular level. And the main moments where you get tested on that are the moments of difficulty when you're way down at the bottom and you're like, I don't know if I can still push this hard, you know, and and all of you will feel this and experience this over the next three to six months. Does that make sense, Teddy?

SPEAKER_06 53:01

Yeah, I think uh I relate to what both of you mentioned. Uh it's the novelty at first that keeps us going. Oh, everything is new, everything is exciting. Uh, first time of doing things, you'll put more energy. Uh, but yeah, I take it out of the session that we have to keep doing the things over and over and over again until we reach a certain target. Uh, it might sound tedious and then doing the same thing, it might not be of the same excitement, but I guess that's where the work is. So just not lose that momentum and keep doing it and uh not lose focus, right? Not get distracted and doing multiple things. I liked your lane one, lane two, stay in your lane kind of theory. So I'm taking that one out of the session.

SPEAKER_04 53:48

And the last the last thing here I'd like to just go through is this. This is um uh one other drawing that I haven't prepared here, but this is something that so in in your business, you always have um just like these are the departments of your business, right? You've got like the branding department as an example in terms of all of the maybe like nice uh PR relationships, events, um really big top of funnel type things. You've got the uh marketing department, which is what you have right now, your performance, your ads, your driving media and getting conversion, uh, you've got the sales department, um, we've got the product department, we've got the operations department, and then we've got the finance department. This is every company, and then you can, I don't know, have different versions, technology department, IT, all the rest of it. But it all kind of chunks up into around about these uh six main levels, okay? And so when you're starting out, especially in the stages of uh you know 10 right up to probably 200,000 per month, the majority of your focus wants to be on these areas here. Okay, but what happens is, uh, and then obviously you want to make sure the product is good, we want to make sure that's covered. But what happens is is as um we get more volume of sales into the business and there's more kind of like um velocity, more customers, um, there's more stuff going on. What tends to happen is founders start to focus on these things, not to say they're not important, they're very, very, very important, but they it's like you can have the best finance function, the best operations function, and a wildly good product and no business. Make sense? And you're making no money and you're flatlining because these activities here, not so much the branding aspect, but mainly these ones when you're in the performance stage of marketing and selling, right? These are the things marketing, meaning ads, creative content, all of that good stuff, selling meaning average order value, offer, bundles, uh, front end, back end, all that good stuff that happens here. These elements here, that is what generates the income for your company. And what happens is as the business gets bigger, there is a shift because when you first start, you're not making any sales, so most of your attention is predominantly shifted on this side, and then as your company starts to grow, there's a there's a feeling that starts to shift, and you start to almost move uh your attention over here, right? And more and more and more attention goes on to operations or finance or developing new products or doing these things, and then the the aspects over here, relative or linked directly to revenue, right? They get less attention, right? And that's when the business starts to get overcomplex, much more cost-based gets accrued here. We start to put people in and processes in and add more products here that aren't even selling, and then we need to remind ourselves that hey, we just need to focus on the front. Hammond's uh demonstrated this heaps of times. Founders that come onto the call with a half a million dollars a month, $700,000 a month, uh, and they sell, I don't know, one or two products, they sell it on just Facebook ads, maybe a tiny bit of Google ads, uh, and they almost have zero operations, no people, no teams, like that's it.

SPEAKER_00 56:52

And so it's like and they're actually the most, I would say they're the most dangerous. You know why? Because actually one one hero product mainly, and they do the same thing over and over again. So they're like, they have if I was to think about what is the advantage, they just do the same thing over and over, and it's very dangerous on a longer horizon. And the thing is, two years ago, they did not have the money to just buy things, they were like literally telling me, and they mentioned this um on a podcast, um, that they literally didn't have money for right just paying for food normally, like they were trying to get discounts and all of that, and they did this massive kind of shift in trouble of their business for two years. They took this to like multi-million dollar, doing the same thing over and over again with again them, one VA, and me. Just that it and an operational agent to fulfill.

SPEAKER_04 57:38

Um, what's landing here, Priyanka and uh Jill and Dean? I'd love to just hear your feedback in terms of what are you guys taking away from what we've covered here so far.

SPEAKER_06 57:45

Okay, I already mentioned that I liked your view of how we can achieve 100K is that sheer focus that needs to be there. Uh, doing the same thing over and over again, improving it, not losing the focus, not losing modification motivation. So that's going to be my goal. And uh yeah, I will join your uh page as well. I've not done much of AI yet. I know you're big on AI, so there's a lot to learn in that space as well. Maybe that will help me uh push more and more creatives and help me grow in that direction. So that that sounds scary and fun. I've never done anything like this. Like for most of us, AI is just chat GPT and cloud these days, right now. So uh yeah, keen to learn more there.

SPEAKER_00 58:38

It's really gonna be a good ride. Like you're gonna be very surprised about what we're doing right now because it's a whole other thing. And I do believe that it's still required time, but just the level of production and quality would be significantly higher. And in my opinion, if you link data to AI and then you're kind of the operator, you could really just do more. So in the past, you spend the time editing, you spend the time doing things with AI just gonna be less and less, and you can actually scale up to a whole other level without paying the fees, agencies, fees to do content, things like that. That's like thousands of dollars. So we're just saving on that and using AI and kind of automating that.

SPEAKER_03 59:12

Very cool. Dean, Joe, what about yourself? Any um key takeaways or learnings or outcomes that you guys captured from what we covered off on here so far?

SPEAKER_01 59:19

Yeah, for sure. Home and um home. Sorry, Sasha. The It's like that's laughtering.

SPEAKER_00 59:24

I was like, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 59:27

Must be the camera, the levels, I suppose, and understanding um the different stages and where we get to. So, yes, totally identify and understand um taking focus away from the the foundational stuff that that works. Um, I don't think Jill and I have got the issue of um of hard work or dedication. I think it's more around skill. Um, I think I'm like the frog with the pelican choking the areas. I don't I don't never give up on that. Jill's gonna put me away the majority of the time, but yeah, look, having having support to get that um next stage or level is um is probably what we need with it. Seeing I'm seeing all these indicators now where you're getting the focus areas that that we need to to move with and and really hone in on and understand those those well.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:16

So I'm just excited for the future, I think for me. Sorry, my I'm just excited for the future of what we can build just with what we've thought of the small part that we've done so far, how that can create in the next few years, and you know, in the next, you know, we're not even 12 months in, so it'll be great to have a 12-month um statue where we can now next year we can do better. And you know, we've always done that in businesses that we've worked with, so how you can improve next year, and so that that's exciting. Um it's exciting watching him um do all those figures and and all those sorts of things as well, and you know, listening while those all those figures all those things that he talks about is exciting. It's exciting to to listen to him, to you know, to to do it for us, to do it for you know for our future. So it's exciting for me then to come in and you know do all the the fluffy stuff that I do for him to to be grounded, to to work the balance, because it's not just one direction, it's got to be other directions. Well, we work well together. So it's exciting, it's exciting for the next year, it's exciting for the next project. So like the next step for me. Like, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:28

I think I think one thing for you guys that you'll get a lot of value from, and you may have already done this, but I find it very helpful for couples partners is just to and it seems like you've got a lot of clarity on this already, more than most, but just like get really clear and specific on um the similar to what I shared with those departments. It's like okay, Dean owns X, Y, Z department. Jill owns X, Y, and Z department. You know what I mean? Like, don't don't don't bother fucking with my shit. This is mine, I got it. You just stay over there, you know what I mean? And and like really helping each other by supporting and trusting that I've got this here, you've got that there, and we both can double. And it sounds like you're already pretty well all over this in terms of your structure.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:05

Jill's the 15-minute increment window, she plans it to the so you do this, this, this, and this, and I'll do this.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:13

Yeah, no, we I we've got we've got that down pat. I I am the most organized person on the planet, I think. So to organize him, you've got two hours to do creatives, and then we move on. So it's five minutes to go. I hope you finish because we've got to move on to this part. You know, I'm I'm wrapping boxes, I'm doing like the the um inventory side of things while I'm watching the football on a you know Sunday afternoon or something because I've got two hours, so I'm very time management structured. So yeah, because otherwise he can go into all day sitting in his office doing creatives and not have a plan. So yeah, there might be the wife in me, I'm not sure the mother part of me, like, no, we've got things to do.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:59

I I I heard something recently um that was essentially the the this this the success of a man is um defined by the belief of his wife in him, and I was like, I love that because I see so much in my wife, and and the ability for them to see more of you uh makes you push harder. So I don't know if that's relevant for you guys, but it's certainly relevant for me.

SPEAKER_06 1:03:20

Yeah, the weird on all social.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:23

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love that. Yeah, very good, guys. What a way to end the conversation. This has been really um interesting. I really enjoyed this. I hope this has been helpful for um each of you as well in terms of like some of the stuff we've gone through. Uh, there's a lot of sound foundations that you've all built so far in your business in a short amount of time, and very similar to what Hammond said. Like, one thing that puzzles me and continues to, I don't know, trouble me uh at early in the morning and late at night is the idea of like being afraid to take more risk into the future based on the fact, and Hammond said before, that me right now with the business and everything that I've got, it's like look how bad you are. Like, you're 12 months in and you're doing this. Can you imagine how good you can become? But there's so much fear that gets in the way of like, oh, my offer is kind of working, maybe I should just hold on to it. Oh, maybe we should not change that creative. It's like you 12 months ago, you didn't even know what Facebook ads were. Like, imagine in two years, if you keep swinging for the fences and hitting home runs and having a whole bunch of mess ups and screw-ups along the way, it's like you will be an exceptional entrepreneur. But that fear of like holding on to something that was your first launch offer, I'm like, get rid of that thing. You you think that you're not gonna create something better in the future with all this experience and knowledge and ability? It's like, good God. So keep swinging for the fences on the right things, the right fences with the right ball and bat. Don't be over there being like, hey, that looks good. Let's not do that stuff. But super excited for you guys. I appreciate your uh involvement in the community and working with uh the team members that you work with. Get on to Hammond's call. I know you'll be mind blown by the stuff that he's going to go through with uh everybody in the call today relative to creatives and all those good things. But uh, this has been a great conversation. I really enjoyed it, and thank you so much.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:13

Thank you. Yeah, thanks, thanks, Sasha.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:16

Thanks, Hammond.