EY CEO Outlook: Telecoms, Trust and Transition with Shay Walsh, Managing Director of BT Ireland

In this episode of the EY CEO Outlook podcast, Shay Walsh, Manging Director of BT Ireland, joins host Richard Curran to reflect on a career at the cutting edge of telecoms and communications, the challenges of leading your people through major strategic change, and the future of data and connectivity. 

Shay Walsh’s journey began in Cabra, Dublin, with Irish-speaking roots and a childhood immersed in technology - his grandfather a radio operator, and his parents civil servants in Posts & Telegraphs. After studying electronic engineering at DCU, he entered the world of telecoms just as the industry was being transformed. 

Having joined Esat Telecom as a field engineer when the company was still in its very early days, Shay has spent almost 30 years helping to shape the evolution of communications in Ireland, rising to the highest ranks of the telecoms industry along the way. Today, as BT sells its Irish wholesale and enterprise business units, he reflects on a remarkable 29-year career with the company and looks ahead to his next chapter. 

They also discuss: 

• BT’s decision to sell its Irish domestic and data centre businesses to focus more on the UK, and what will remain of its presence in Ireland. 
• The power of honesty and clear communication when trying to build trust during a period of big changes. 
• Shay’s view on Data Centres, their economic importance, and their energy requirements.  
• His pride about BT’s 20-year partnership with the Young Scientist Exhibition and its role in helping students grow in confidence.  
• What Shay plans to do next, after he wraps up his 29-year career with Esat / BT Ireland. 

Transcript

EY CEO Outlook: Telecoms, Trust, and Transition with Shay Walsh, Managing Director of BT Ireland

Carol Murphy, Head of Markets, EY:

Welcome to the EY CEO Outlook podcast, where our host Richard Curran chats to some of Ireland’s leading CEOs about life and leadership. Hi, I’m Carol Murphy, Partner and Head of Markets at EY. In this episode we welcome Shay Walsh of BT Ireland, one of Ireland’s leading communications services providers. Shay reflects on a career at the cutting edge of telecoms and communications, the challenges of leading your people through major strategic change, and the future of data and connectivity. Over to you Richard.

Richard Curran
 Thanks Carol, well Shay you're very welcome to the podcast I sit here with a lot of CEO’s and it's a little bit unusual to have a CEO in front of me who is leaving the company and coming to the end of your time there how soon is that happening

Shay Walsh
 That is going to be approaching towards the end of august early September this year as we sell our domestic business to the speed fibre group so yeah it's a brought a career twenty nine years and I’ll be two months short of thirty years in BT and esat before that so

Richard Curran
 well it’s a good time to reflect now on that career and starting even with esat as well because you have been there a long time but just for people not familiar with what is happening with BT and I have because some units are being or have been sold off what's the picture

Shay Walsh
 sure well I suppose the BT group strategy has evolved over the last twelve months to very much focused on the UK and ensuring that they get a return on the capital employed in the UK and put more capital into the UK and what that means effectively is putting a lot of fibre into the ground stripping out all the copper network which is being a hundred sixty years being put in place so taking that out and replacing every single piece of copper with fibre, so a lot of capital intensive requirements for that capital to be invested in that and really outside of that they're trying to optimize how they run their operations outside of that so they have an international group set up now it used to be called BT global and we were part of that and we were always a because we have a large a fibre network ourselves a domestic network here and data centres there are kind of slightly off strategy really so and with the emergence of that new strategy and to optimize bt they're going to and sell or close down but in our case cell and domestic networks and data centres which they've which they've divested for the last twenty years or so

Richard Curran
 so really the shape of things in Ireland has been dictated by the circumstances of the wider group and what they want to do yet to be a bit more UK centric but still with an international focus on customers for you running the bt operation in Ireland for a long time. Did you get all of that at once and from London did you get the full picture how did that feel when you discovered this is the way it's

Shay Walsh
 you know to be frank bt have been looking at how to optimize and divest domestic networks not in the UK so we did have a we did look at selling the business a number of years ago bt pulled out of that process and on this occasion we've done a slightly differently in that we follow the strategy so we have. Effectively three perimeters we have our data centre perimeter which is about twenty people in it our domestic perimeter which is our local fibre network our voice network or security networks etc data networks. And then we have our what we're going to retain because bt is going to continue to have a very substantial footprint in Ireland in terms of the people because we serve all our large global customers as you can understand 

Richard Curran

So that will still be a sizeable business. 

Shay Walsh

It'll be about three hundred people plus bt source which is a procurement facility also have over a hundred people here so still be four hundred people in BT.

Richard Curran
 What's it been like to implement that strategy knowing that this was the sort of the path that was going to go down in terms of keeping staff motivated keeping yourself motivated as well.

Shay Walsh
 Yeah and very tough is the honest answer because as the leader people look to you for kind of are we okay is the first thing and I suppose what I’ve tried to do and you know leadership style is always been to be to be clear and open in communications and then. Get people to trust that what I’m saying is true another certain thing you can say because you're in a process you're under nda and you can have to say to them look. There's things under nda that I can speak about what when we can when we can tell you about what's going to happen we will tell you what's going to happen and how it impacts you most importantly and that's everybody wants to know how it impacts them personally and then their job and then the people around them. So yeah, it's been tough because you know we were actually and every well you know we were generating cash, and we were generating profits and generating growth so there was a few questions from the from our from our employees saying why because we're doing very well. We're going our business and it's simply just the implementation of strategy we were we were I can understand the strategy actually think it's the right strategy for the growth to bt and it's kind of been shown in the share prices that over the last twelve months. So, it is the right strategy unfortunately we're just on the wrong end of it know I having said that I think the two companies that are buying both their data centre business and our domestic business and that's Equinix and speed fibre group. Are better owners for the comfort for the areas in the long run because they are going to invest it's their core business Equinix run six or seven data centres in Ireland and hundreds globally.
 And speed fibre group of gosh a large fibre network as well which they can leverage and together with you know it's a strong company and it be a strong competitor as a wholesale competitor in the marketplace. And then of course then what's left is a very vibrant growing part of the business which is serving our large global multinationals google, amazon, apple etc who want to land in Ireland and expand into Europe so it's leveraging the European and the global voice data networks.

Richard Curran
 In a situation in a situation like that where change is coming to an organization if I’m an employee in the organization I’m over at the water cooler and everybody is saying what's happening what's happening. And it's it is in a way about trust, and you mentioned trust because you can't say everything you need to be as open and clear as you can be as a leader but you can say absolutely everything because for obvious reason so. In a way countering any mistrust that might be there or building on that trust how do you do that or can you just rely. On the trust that you have built up as a leader with those people over a number of years

Shay Walsh
 yeah like I certainly think there's you have to put the credit into the bank you know you can't just rock open expect people to trust you so that so that there's a long track record and we're lucky to have a fairly low. Turn employee turn bt so there are a lot of employees I would have twenty five thirty years experience just like myself so they get to trust you and they when you know and that and that core people obviously talk to other people at those water coolers and say no look when the leadership team here is that stand up and say what they have said. We can trust them but I think it for me it's down to communication it constantly communicating we have we don't sure go away I think when people see when change happens like this people tend to retrench from communication. We double down on so we have a very strong and engagement and function and that's led by a great guy called John Loftus and we continually communicate through all hands calls every month we have people managers forum we have brown bag lunches we have and of course communications on a trip to our to our media channel our kind of localized the media channel and that and that ensures that people are continuously in the loop.

Richard Curran
 And that was a fear then that people might look elsewhere or leave

Shay Walsh

Well there is of course and. You know that that's a that's a reality and that there's two there's two sides to that coin though however because people who also have long service want to know what's going on because there may be if there is a down the line if there are redundancies obviously they've got significant service and. I accept just so that they want to see how that's going to pan out but all but actually what people want to know is my job okay and it and allow you can actually say that was a with a large degree of confidence for the majority of people. And therefore people tend to just kind of get back into the day job when we do we do say to people look these things have happened before and nothing is nothing is there are process of started and nothing is gone so we can guarantee this will finish. In in the sale of the business and the only way to guarantee that we will continue to have a good future is to continue to look after customers and continue to work at the at the service we deliver improve them and give great service. And that kind of secures everybody's future at whether you're going to be within BT or whether the company that's buying you takes over because they want their buying us for those reasons that great service the great network that we have.

Richard Curran
 I want to talk a little bit about your own career journey to esat and then bt but first your own background you're from Dublin old Cabra road

Shay Walsh
 That’s right between the canals yeah I’m just a house where avenue just off the old Cabra road born and bred and. Youngest of five and my mother is from castle island Kerry my dad was a dub from arran quay and they both classic they met in the GPO as civil servants ironically in the post and telegraph so my link to telecoms he goes back there and actually on my mother's side my. My grandfather was a radio operator in the Valentia cable station and I have an interest in that I’m on the board looking for UNESCO world heritage status for that.

Richard Curran
 That’s the ultimate telecoms.

Shay Walsh
 I never thought I could it was a bit of an outlier and then I realized actually hang in a sec of on both sides were we've got telecommunications and.

Richard Curran
 So your mother had the Kerry connection and you went to a Gaile scoil Irish speaking.

Shay Walsh
 Yes, a Gaile school for all of my primary and secondary education so I went to scoil cholmcille which is on Marlborough street just be beside the pro cathedral handy for the GPO and my father could drop us in.

Shay Walsh
 And I went to collage Mhuire to where my sisters went to scoil Caitriona so me and my father was a was a proud Irish man proud republican and. And was very interested in Irish language even though he wasn't a natural Irish speaker growing up in the Arran quay.

Richard Curran
 So it was something that your folks felt strongly about and your mother had a Kerry connection and were you all on side with that.

Shay Walsh
 I mean like it's funny. He didn't have much choice and you know learning applied maths and physics in true Irish was a challenge and close to where I can say that much but no I’m like it obviously. And it's not just the Irish language of course there's a culture the you know we were we were taught GAA football and hurling handball and of course played a little bit of bodhran and in a in our local band and in Coláiste Mhuire but. You know I’m like it was it was kind of being proud of being Irish was probably the main thing and that that came through strongly.

Richard Curran
 Do you get a chance to speak Irish much is it so good or have you forgotten.

Shay Walsh
 ‘Tá sé beagáinín cáilte agaim inis’ usually at the young scientists I give a bit a bit of Irish but. yeah it's funny my youngest daughter has gone through her leaving cert and she's saying why didn't you speak more Irish to us when we were younger if I spoke Irish and when they were younger they would have like. it's all your fault she is saying

Richard Curran
 And in terms of school and what you wanted to do.

Richard Curran
 What were your thoughts when you were growing up

Shay Walsh
 Well we obviously in Coláiste Mhuire we had a garam hurry which is a career guidance teacher and she we'd read some aptitude test so it was pretty strong and math’s my brother who was seven years ago I was in first year he was he just left sixth year. went on to UCD to become a mechanical engineer so engineering was that was the rubber stamp for me so I never really thought usually about it and you know I’m like a I went to DCU as an engineer electronic engineering and I you know it was it was a tough course have to say but. Engineering you know is a great primary degree in my view or base degree for lots of things that you can move into.

Richard Curran
 And you went on to study then in that area you ended up in telecoms and so forth along the way one of the companies you work for is the company that later became Galileo.

Shay Walsh
 Yeah so I started out in t mast and just to you know kind of putting cables together and as a network engineer and they were one of the one of the. Subsidiaries of the year aer lingus and the car group so they actually their primary function was to deliver and the data circuits into the travel agents in those days people may not a younger may not remember but. Every ticket sale was through either travel agent or through the airlines themselves so we know these it was the Galileo network that it became which was effectively a very basic and low bandwidth network that would be able to deliver airline tickets right across the country.

Richard Curran
 And you mentioned your daughter and studying Irish your wife Eunice is an actress yeah.

Shay Walsh
 she's definitely not in the same industry as I am the very often. Subsidiaries of our industry so she was yes she now teaches drama and a little bit of dance as well but yeah her. Her claim to fame is that she was Fidelma in Glenroe so she was she went to trinity players and studied acting and then got a part as a in the Glenroe.

Richard Curran
 I remember Fidelma in Glenroe yeah if I’m not mistaken did Miley give her away at the wedding he did. It's funny because he didn't show up for yours did he.

Shay Walsh
 He was certainly invited to ours as was most of the Glenroe class because ironically we were married in august of ninety five and I think and. You know Fidelma was married to the doctor who's Mario Rosenstock in the same year so we had a people were kind of very confused understandably seeing her on the. The front page of the RTE guide and Mario to rose Mario and also getting married to me in the same year but yeah so she but she's also done some stage acting and now she's teaching young children how to and their fledgling careers of acting and getting them enthusiastic with being on the stage.

Richard Curran
 I'm back to the career and joining the telecom you were one of the one of the earliest employees of esat

Shay Walsh
 yeah I think I’m employee sixty seven so in those days it was very early days and they had they were on the way to getting the mobile license and but the esat telecom was the was the was the main company at that point and it was effectively selling voice services very simply there with their pitch was simple. I will take fifty percent off your international voice bill and we installed kind of a little red all dollars that would redirect the phone call into the sat network and we connect using us carriers so

Richard Curran
 I remember at that time writing about telecoms and business. Back in the nineteen nineties and one of the things that esat telecom the mobile digifone business was transformative for the scale of the company with the telecom business you were taking on the incumbent which was telecom Eireann, Eir. And it was a kind of a battle a day wasn't it because a lot of the a lot of the policies and the legislation and the fact that it was an incumbent wasn't easy.

Shay Walsh
 No and Dennis O’Brien and he had this phrase which was like when he was trying to g up the troops which was like where were the is like the Vietnam war and we were with the bag of rice and armour and we're fighting the Americans which is telecom eireann at the time. Things obviously change since then you know we work well with a good publicity. But it was it was everything between the company was a brave move because in those days and people the market wasn't you regulated so there was there was just one operator in Ireland it was it was telecom eireann and.

Shay Walsh
 And there was one mobile operator and the work that had to be done in the background of the there is a guy called jarlet burke who worked in Dennis a brown's area you straight out of law school. Dennis went into UCD and said give me your number one student he once he graduated came in and he went straight into Europe. And argued for the deregulation of the market here and you know it was very slow what we had was virtual lease lines so it kind of was a way of getting around the regulation at the time. And what those virtual lease lines where was that the phone call that was made was effectively a local phone call to on a lease line and then we connect the call out from that and we use a pin to be able to build a number so it was on the agent and telecom air and. At the time for tooth and nail to say that was a legal and but they were kind of obliged to delivers lease lines because they're the only people we could buy it from and then after that then we started to build our own fibre network on the railway networks and in the in the local metro area. And then we were able to deliver our own services.

Richard Curran
 And then BT came along yet bought the business yes for you obviously stayed and stayed with bt and the opportunities that that brought.

Shay Walsh
 Yes so when I actually started in esat telecom I started out as a field engineer on the tools going out to service our customers are voice customers. I moved on the great thing about esat telecom and in an entrepreneurial spirit that Dennis had created there was that you just constantly learning so you're constantly moving and changing roles. And then when bt bought us it was obviously a massive company at the time I think it was over two hundred thousand employees

Richard Curran
 I remember being at the press conference when they announced the take over deal yeah.

Shay Walsh
 And it was a huge it was a huge deal at the time and a great deal for esat and obviously once we got into bt it was a completely different world it was much more.

Shay Walsh
 Structured it was much it was much less entrepreneurial but then again you know it was it had vast opportunities as well so what you know I moved into what would have been the early days of the global. Network that are structured the time and I took on a role looking after a network management centres across Europe so it was it was certainly opened up horizons from being very entrepreneurial very say to the pants. You know every penny was a prisoner and into an organization where there was lots of resource and not just financial but educational as well and network.

Richard Curran
 That whole period the end of the nineties the beginning of the two thousands was this exciting time until comms particularly in the mobile area because the world that there was capital investment required with the role of these revenues coming in as people were adapting the technology buying phones text messages people were paying for all of that. When you look back on it it's changed so much hasn’t it.

Shay Walsh
 I mean it particularly I’m like fixed as all I mean fixed was always a little bit more of a struggle to get those type of revenues in and those margins. Mobile was just so profitable as soon as I’m like obviously the network cost of installing all the network and the towers and the interconnectivity was huge and the switches but once you had that up as you say, make you the good old days you're getting twenty thirty cents for a text now no one uses text everything's free voices is WhatsApp is free over internet so it was it was you know the apus the revenue generated per unit. And were massive and they just they just collapse since then yes the infrastructure has actually got even more complex so going from four g to five g cost a huge amount of money after place all that network so as you know from twenty years ago the margins of have come down. I would say from a in fixed the margins were always fairly tight so we have seen kind of a little bit of pluses and minuses but it's been a lot tougher in the fixed business and it has been. In terms of margin and then the mobile business and then of course mobile had only two operators and then three than four so it got a lot more competitive and then they hit the type of competitiveness that we were probably a little bit generation hair ahead of that. But yeah I’m like mobile has transformed obviously the way the way everybody works and obviously from a fixed perspective we deliver a lot of fibre into mobile networks so that they can. Be able to handle the bandwidth that now come through these phones

Richard Curran
 and voice is such a small part of times now, particularly with a younger generation who have a mobile phone the last thing they want to do is use it as a phone.

Shay Walsh
 I mean ironically obviously everything involves right now soon as the smartphone comes out and the apple it just transformed mobile networks in that the load shifted away from voice.

Shay Walsh
 To data and then they had to ramp up the data on that but yeah you know I think I think very few people. Make or receive a phone call nowadays over the phone using the traditional channel you know they usually if they do it's usually over WhatsApp or. Or Instagram or whatever but it's but it's a very rarely they use an actual physical what would be in the past and network so yeah it is good is completely changed and smart phones are probably had the biggest impact and how we interact and how we use mobile networks.

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Richard Curran
 As you describe the industry and how it has changed how it is today with that still a requirement for capital investment maybe lower margins that always implies after a while consolidation yeah. Add that is happening to think that will continue.

Shay Walsh
 That is an effective that's what is happening in in our world as well you know with speed fibre merging with our business buying our business and merging the two networks and that's what that's what it is and indeed it is already taking place here with that three and O2 coming together and in the UK it was I think there was at least there was six networks now it's down to two to four and then soon to be three. So yeah I make the only way you can you can compete and that there's a term used commonly in telecoms I’m sure it's used in other industries but it's rocky or roce which is return on capital employed and that is a key metric when people are investing in. If you look at BT’s share price or any other share price in the telecoms and you track the return on capital invested and you track cash and then you look at their share price it usually follows the cash so if you're producing more cash your share price goes up if you're producing less. And the cash produces very much to put the dependent on the amount of capital you employ in building the network so you have to get the return on that and sometimes. Multiple networks just don't doesn't work because I effectively you can you can cover this entire country and any space with just one carrier and so you don't need multiple carriers but obviously for choice and for the consumer you do.

Shay Walsh
 But effectively and that is why consolidation because there's no point having three or four operators that are unprofitable not investing in network and having black spots or you know networks coming down so there has to be some return for those who are who are putting vast amount of capital into these networks

Richard Curran
 When it comes to big investments one area that is in the news a lot generating a lot of controversy around energy usage and planning is data centres and you guys had had data centres

Shay Walsh
 still until the end of this year we have two data centres and yeah

Richard Curran
 so and but they're in the process of yes exactly yeah. What do you think of that strategic argument that is going on in a lot of places but in Ireland as well about data centres and about their energy usage and do we need to do we not need them.

Shay Walsh
 Yeah look I mean it is it is it is a very complex area and I can absolutely understand and empathize with people who are fearful that data centres are going to rob domestic consumers of electricity. But it I think unfortunately the conversation has moved to an area where it's pitched one against the other it's either data centres or it's or it's electricity for homes.

Shay Walsh
 The reality is you can have both are out there can be a win-win situation here and obviously it does require investment and we have offshore wind in in the planning we have interconnects with France and with the UK. In the planning and not put not yet done and that's a whole other conversation around delaying and planning but data centres are essential I’m like it's a bit like the argument I don't want five g masts in my in my in my near me but I but I want to use my mobile phone and expected to work all the time. And you know people need to understand that your most of your photos that you take on WhatsApp etc not stored on your phone or stored in the cloud. The cloud in most cases is not open the air it's actually a physical centre and that's the data centres and there's a Ireland has probably. If you look at the environment Ireland is and that's why there's so many here it is because of our ambient temperatures don't range too huge we don't get too cold in the winter we don't get too hot in the summer so we're ideally placed in terms of. For the environment how to run a data centre most efficiently it you run it in an area like Ireland for the weather temperatures that could there set temp temperature sensitive these large data centres and service. Create a lot of heat now there are there are there are communities is it is it is that if we work together with data centres you know the heat that's that given off can be used to heat water and local and community water for people's homes etc. So this is definitely a win situation you get

Richard Curran
 If you could get the power generation off I don't think people would have a problem with it

Shay Walsh
 no and I think look at the moment there's no more data centres being built so that's you know that's kind of. What fear level one unlocked terms of that but you know that's not that is not a good thing you know we are there are there are large organizations like you know is talking to the to the country manager of amazon at an IBEC event recently and he said that there's amazon are investing twenty five or thirty billion in Europe none of that is coming to Ireland not a single red cent is coming to Ireland because they can't build a two centres here. And that is a real problem for the future of Ireland if we you know our future and I look at our corporate tax intakes is very much reliant on the tech sector and large organizations you know multinationals coming to Ireland. They come to Ireland because we have all these services here so we absolutely have to have more data centres we just have to make sure they're not built and it's not a other data centres or people. You know go have blackouts during busy times that that can't be the contentious that had can't be a contended area like that it has to be. The availability and there is the capacity in Ireland to capture natural resources and natural energy resources to be able to fuel these

Richard Curran
 We just need to get moving on that yeah and Shay.

Richard Curran
 What would you say when you look back on your time in bt any particular stand out memories best day in the job worst day in the job.

Shay Walsh
 Oh I think the well the probably the worst day was when we have we've to do to. Subsea cables and we had a fibre break on the on our on our railway network on one of the legs and on the other leg we had a troller hit our day are our subsea cable so that was that was a black Friday of all black Fridays that was one of the worst moments. Look there's been so many good moments there they dwarf the bad moments you know I’ve been had a privilege to be to lead.

Shay Walsh
 In in many areas both in the sales area in the wholesale area winning large deals and have been obviously exciting but to be honest if I reflect on my time. And the proudest moment have been doing the young scientists actually you know that you know because that's really something that you can be really proud of the brand and proud of the people that you work with.

Richard Curran
 And the association with young scientists and bt has been there for so many years as it is synonymous but there's a new sponsor

Shay Walsh
 yes and as part of as we as we started out we you know we started out with the with the bt in Ireland changing and obviously and bt and we have made the decision that. It takes a lot of energy it takes a lot of money it takes a lot of but it we because we organize and we don't just sponsor we organize the events were the custodians event. We just felt that when we were we were reducing the business that we you know we didn't want the standards to drop in any sense so and working with the with the young scientist board which I also sit on and we looked at and looking at the next tron so it's a it's a five year sponsorship and ours was coming to an end. So was the right time to step back and yeah the process was run obviously I wasn't directly involved in in selecting stripe and as the ex sponsor but absolutely it has been a fantastic sponsor

Richard Curran
 it does look like a very good sponsor one of the colosons one didn't he

Shay Walsh
 Yeah Patrick one is and john one of one of the one of the top prizes and so they were both heavily invested in it themselves and they do they do allude to the young scientist being. You know, being a you know, a real formative part of their career, giving them the confidence and to go

Richard Curran
 You could always play that up and say we made the colosons

Shay Walsh
 Well, if we. think if we had a bit of percentage of it we probably wouldn't be sitting here Richard but yeah look at make we and it's not just them and it obviously there's been you they've been hugely you know commercially successful but we've also had other. And ex winners have gone on to form their own business of Shane Curran and that the Kate and Annie Madden and lots of lots of others and. You know it gives them a great grounding but the great thing for us is seeing you know 1200 or 1300 you know terrified teenagers come into the. Come to the RDS to the young scientists every year and three or four days later walk out a couple of inches taller with the confidence and that that's really a vein of the Colosons would talk about the confidence that it gave them and to be able to communicate your idea.

Richard Curran
 And over the years the standards in it have been so high I mean I’m always kind of just gobsmacked at the quality of what the teenagers are able to produce and maybe in a way that feeds off itself that that sets the bar for many people.

Shay Walsh
 I think it does make obviously a huge credit goes to the teachers and the parents who put a huge amount of effort into getting their students there and their sons and daughters there. But yeah the standard of the young scientists is so high we start we have about this year in January had about 2200 entries we can display 550 and so we pick the top 550 out of that so that's one and four so immediately. The people who actually the students who get to the young to the to the event and in in January are already have gone through a screening process to be the best of up to over 2000.

Shay Walsh
 And projects and but I think the proof point the external proof point for how good that is that. The Irish winner goes on to compete or the young scientists winner goes on to compete for Ireland in the European young scientists competition. And I don't have one that 17 out of 34 years or 35 years so you know one in one and two and I think that really goes to the depth of it is taken really seriously by the students it's taken really seriously by the judges who judge them on during the week. I am and the process itself just works so well every year and stripe are going to take over that process they're not going to the core of this remains the same that the badge obviously in the people change. But I think the process itself is core to the success of the young scientists and we're talking to I was talking to one of the. The judges who's a is also the president of UCD Orla Feely she was she was saying that you know a large degree of Ireland's ability to engage with the facts the scientific facts around covid and take it seriously and follow the. She puts it down to the fact that you know the young scientists is such a part of Ireland's.

Shay Walsh
 Calendar in January everybody looks forward to everybody engages with everyone listens to it is on RTE give us great coverage and so do all the press and both the printed press and. Give science a prominent massive promise and I think people I make a it's probably you know whether you maybe there's a maybe there's a project in this in itself but I think it is such a core part of Ireland and it's 61 years on the go it's the longest running and largest. Young scientists and every time we bring visitors in from BT they are blown away. Not only by the size and the scale of it but then they say what you know the public why the public here and you know are they invited in a certain are they actually paying to see to see this to see it so they're just they're completely amazed and they're very jealous actually a lot of. Countries would love to have what we have

Richard Curran
 a lot of them really looking for a good business idea

Shay Walsh
 well that's true as well we do have we do have on the pole we do have a boot camp that we run in in kind of late February at the first. First term break and we take 30 of the students and projects and we run them through the basics of setting up your business you know. Accounting but most importantly once again communication skills that's the key to it having confidence to be able to convey your idea to other people.

Richard Curran
 So what would you like to do Shay as you wind down your time in BT.

Shay Walsh
 Well certainly Eunice would like me to take a few months off to look after some DIY projects that have been on the on the to do list and yeah look I think I would I would not kind of. You know even if I if I stayed within the industry certainly wouldn't I wouldn't move into another. Large or is it would be it would be very difficult for me to. To get into an organization to then go on and I don't have to compete with my colleagues so it's certainly not something that that area would be would be of interest to me I think I'd like to go into something a little bit smaller you know that I could add some value to. With the experience that I gained over the last 29 years I'm also interested and passionate about supporting charities and my background as a you know you mentioned my father earlier on even though he died when I was nine he was a very passionate supporter of the death and dumb.

Shay Walsh
 And through the legion of Mary so that kind of always obviously was in the back of my head so you know an NGO opportunity of the came up might be interesting as well working with some of the charities even maybe in a part time basis or. You know so it's certainly a maybe it is like change the maybe a step back in the because it is a pressurized environment you know this is six hundred and fifty people to manage into. To keep secure and look after jobs and stuff like that so I'm of course the pressure we look after the 999 service. And that's you know making sure that works all the time that's not a call you want to get and touch wood we've had a great service for the nine nine nines but yes something a little bit less stressful and a little bit more smaller.

Richard Curran
 Well before you go there's a series of questions that I put all of our guests on the podcast you could call it the quickfire round throw them at you now and what CEO or leader do you most admire and why.

Shay Walsh
 I'm going to actually pick an Irish leader and Brid Horan who's. She's I sit on the governing authority of DCU she's the she's the chancellor and but for her she was a co founder of the 30% club and a real a real advocate for advancing women and gender equality. I'm breaking the glass ceiling and but also her roles in ESB she's an actuary as well and I've worked closely with her but she's an inspiration she's just you know just to such a nice person but also hugely. Effective and very personable and I like that authenticity and the way in which she conduct herself so I got a I got a pick Brid.

Richard Curran

Favourite book or film.

Shay Walsh
 Gosh on the basis of the amount of times I've watched I'm going to say it's a wonderful life is my favourite film it's a it's a Christmas one as well which I was a bit of nostalgia around Christmas as well Jimmy Stewart.

Richard Curran
 Jimmy Stewart at his best, and do you have a mantra in life or in business that you find helpful.

Shay Walsh
 hard to pick out one but I think.

Shay Walsh
 What I'd like to kind of live my life by is the kind of the looking after people and that are less fortunate than yourself and also treating people and the way in which you'd like to be treated and leaving things in a better place than you found them and like if you followed if we all follow those three I think the world would be a better place not just in business but outside of business too.

Richard Curran
 And leading on from that as you move to come towards the end of your time in BT Ireland what would you like people to say about what you achieved and how you did it.

Shay Walsh
 I think what I achieved I think they did you know I achieved it with the people and not I didn't I didn't ever say the word I always use the word we and that I was fair I gave everyone a fair shake and some people would say and make I was I was able to be directive on I need to be. But that I was always fair as I set the standards I didn't I didn't expect anything anybody to do anything that I wouldn't be prepared to do and but that I achieved it through the people working with the people with and for each other rather than just you know grandstanding and saying you know I did this and it was it was my success it was our success and that's the way you see you gain trust and authenticity.

Richard Curran
 What would you say is your biggest regret or mistake career wise life what would you do differently.

Shay Walsh
 God I tend not to try and look back I always look forward I think I think regrets you know mistakes are actually learning points and I think converting the reality is that nothing life isn't a straight line upwards.

Shay Walsh
 Progress you make mistakes and most important is you learn from them and you know I think they're probably too numerous to mention because you can make mistakes on a daily basis I think the most important is to be is to recognize them and to tell people that you're sorry if you if you've done something wrong and again you know that that leads to building trust I think.

Richard Curran
 Any advice for someone starting out in a leadership role.

Shay Walsh
 Be yourself and you know I think leadership is about for me leadership is about you know setting a strategy or setting whatever it's a project or a large strategy that you have to set out it's getting the right people around you to deliver on that and then to execute and I think.

Shay Walsh
 Authentic leaders you know and good communicators are needed and to be a good communicator and a good leader and builds trust and authenticity and I think if people if you want people to care they about what you say. They need to believe that you care so I think authenticity it for me is the most important thing and again that that man that that that point which is you know you have to achieve through other people if you're if you're a leader. You're probably the least important person in the room it's everybody else it's being able to delegate that authority to trust people and to support them when you can. To do that I give you give them the confidence and look you know people are going to have to make mistakes and you just can't pounce on every single one, yeah if it's repeat mistakes and it gets it gets silly then obviously you have to do something about it but I definitely think that communication is probably the core of being a good leader.

Richard Curran
 Well Shay Walsh CEO of BT Ireland it's been a pleasure talking to you and the very best of luck with all of your endeavours in the future.

Richard Curran
 We hope you're enjoying the EY podcast CEO Outlook series remember you can catch previous interviews we have done with lots of other CEOs until the next time thanks for listening bye bye.