Destiny Rojo & the future of small-town philanthropy

This week on Givers, Doers, & Thinkers, Jeremy Beer sits down with Destiny Rojo of the PY Foundation to explore how place-based giving can transform a community. Rooted in the legacy of Peyton Yates, the Foundation is deeply invested in Artesia, New Mexico—supporting everything from education and public art to economic development and nonprofit growth. Destiny shares how local philanthropy strengthens community identity, and why unrestricted and operational funding matters. 

Let’s go!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Hey, join us for the next Givers, Doers, and Thinkers as we speak with Destiny Rojo of the PY Foundation of Artesia, New Mexico, about why local place-based giving is often the most strategic. Let's go. Welcome to Givers, Doers, and Thinkers, a podcast on philanthropy and civil society. I'm Jeremy Beer, and it's great to have you with us. It is February 26th, 2026. And this season we are talking to American givers, philanthropists, about the most interesting, innovative, strategic things being done in the giving community as we celebrate America's 250th birthday, so to speak, at least the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence. And to that end, we are excited to have with us Destiny Rojo from the PY Foundation in beautiful Artesia, New Mexico. And how did Artesia get to be as lovely as it is? That's what we are going to be talking about today with Destiny, a lifelong New Mexican who is the program officer at PY and one of its most energetic representatives in the wider world. We're going to talk about strategic giving as local, place-based, communitarian giving with Destiny here today. Destiny, how are you?

SPEAKER_00 1:27

Doing well. Thanks, Jeremy. Always great to see you.

SPEAKER_02 1:30

And you are speaking to us from Artesia, New Mexico, your home in Artesia, New Mexico. Where you grew up, correct?

SPEAKER_00 1:36

Where I grew up on uh the land my dad purchased when I was in high school. And he has some about 10 head of cattle and about 12 horses, and he grows alfalfa on about 10 acres of the property. So really quiet, remote, different than the Phoenix area, Chandler.

SPEAKER_02 1:57

Yes. Not not not to mention the East Coast. So Artesia's in southeastern New Mexico. I mean, how far is it? I think the nearest sort of big city is El Paso, or is it Albuquerque?

SPEAKER_00 2:10

How do you define a big city? Because really, we're about two and a half hours away from Lubbock, Texas. So Texas Tech, you know, university. We're about two and a half hours away from there. Where I say Artesia is centrally located, even though we're in the southeast quadrant of the state, because we're two and a half hours away from Las Cruces, El Paso, Lubbock, Midland, and then three and a half hours away from Santa Fe and Albuquerque. Las Vegas, New Mexico, too.

SPEAKER_02 2:40

So centrally isolated.

SPEAKER_00 2:42

Centrally isolated.

SPEAKER_02 2:44

It's on the western edge of the Permian Basin. Would that be correct to say?

SPEAKER_00 2:48

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 2:49

So it's a it is an oil and energy kind of place. Yes. Which takes us to how the PY Foundation got started. It is um named a PY stands for Peyton Yates, um, who's very much still with us and active uh in the foundation and the community. Tell the story, destiny of uh the foundation and and Peyton and how all this got started.

SPEAKER_00 3:15

Peyton's famous actually from the East Coast. They were westward bound trying to find opportunity, and they stumbled across Artesia. Now I'm about Artesia because at the time it was not called Artesia. I forget what the town was called at the time, but we have Artesian wells, and then Artesia became the name. And about 1924, Peyton's grandfather started oil exploration. And so he had he partnered with a man and they had enough money to dig for three wells, four, maybe four wells, but they'd kind of put all of their money into these things. So they did the first two, and nothing came about. And Martin looked at his wife, Mary, and said, Well, where do you think? And so she pointed, and we actually have that statue here in Artesia. We call it Woman's Intuition. She pointed to a spot, and that's where they dug. And lo and behold, the Illinois number three in 1924 uh spouted oil. And the very first oil royalties in New Mexico happened in 1924 for$50, I believe. And now we cover man, maybe$14 billion for the state of New Mexico. Uh the Permian Basin is the third largest oil-producing area outside of Russia and Saudi Arabia. So we have the capacity for lots of oil. And the Permian, especially, well, our area of the Permian is very rich, especially just south of us. It's like almost untapped. But there's they can't, they don't know how much is possible to be tapped. And they haven't even like tapped the surface of what is available in this area. So it's quite exciting. With that, though, then you know, Peyton's grandfather had three sons, and they started Yates Petroleum. That was a huge economic driver in our community for a really long time. And Peyton's family began getting involved in philanthropy, mostly because of his mom, Estelle. She came from the East Coast as well, from I believe the Boston area. And she came here to this rural tiny town and saw There could not be a starker difference than Boston and Artesia.

SPEAKER_02 5:30

Certainly not now, certainly not in whenever this would have been the 40s or so, 50s, or whenever she would have.

SPEAKER_00 5:36

Yes, I heard a story that she had that involved chickens, where she kind of was walking around and just saw chickens like running in the front yard of places, and she's like, What is going on? So I'm sure it was quite comical for her. And she's like, What did I get into? Because because back then, trains. So she came on the train and she made her teacher her home. And the very first thing, you know, Estelle loved the arts and Estelle loved uh reading. And so she always kind of called them the window to the world, and just being able to have access to those things. And so she was just so passionate about those. The very first thing she did when she came here was she built the library I grew up going to as a child.

SPEAKER_02 6:20

You never knew her, you told me earlier, but never knew her. But you went to the library. Is that the library that's still there?

SPEAKER_00 6:26

No. Um, but it is a library that I used to skip class in high school and go to. So most high school students are skipping class and not going to the library, but they would hold books for me and I would go and read. And so I loved that library so dearly. I helped with the summer reading program and things. I never knew Estelle was a part of that story, but it just kind of feels so providential that it ended up all being connected. In about 2012, I was still in college at the time, but they began sooner than that, actually, or later than that, 2020, maybe the library had kind of seen better days. And so they began talks about building a new library and fundraising for a new library. And you and I have discussed him before. Peter Hurd, famous artist of our area, uh known to have painted the ugliest presidential portrait of all time, which I just think LBJ was not, he was a little prideful, maybe not so humble, because it's a great, it's a great portrait.

SPEAKER_02 7:25

Peter Hurd, people don't know. He was based in New Mexico for most of his life, to the west of Artesia, as you kind of go up into the mountains. Uh, what's the I forget the name of the little town?

SPEAKER_00 7:35

Mondo Valley. It was San Patricio, Mondo Valley.

SPEAKER_02 7:38

Yeah. But he he was married to a Wyatt. He was married to Andrew Wyeth's daughter, if I have this correct. So he's Henrietta Wyatt. Henrietta Wyeth, yeah. So he's connected to that whole Brandywine Valley artistic tradition as well. But anyway, continue about the great Peter Hurd. It's one of the great little surprising discoveries, discoveries you make if you go to visit Artesia is that, oh wow, this is uh Peter Hurd country.

SPEAKER_00 8:01

Yes, it's Peter Hurd country. Roswell, just north of us, has the largest collection of Peter Hurd paintings in the state. And this mural that's in our library, our library was built around this mural. It is a curved wall that came from the Prudential Insurance Building in, I believe, Houston. They were tearing it down, and they kind of went out and told people, hey, this mural is going to go away. If anybody wants it, let us know. And of course, Peyton and all of the artesians got together and they're like, we need this mural. We have to acquire it any way we can. So we acquired the mural for a dollar. But then you have to get structural engineers and architects because a funny story I learned during the 10-year anniversary is that it is all in one piece. It was moved in one piece. And it is this 200-pound, huge, massive mural. And the architect kept saying, Peyton, we could do this in three pieces here. It's like a seamless cut. If you just cut from here, nobody will ever know. And he said, No, all one piece. And so the Yates and the Chases kind of worked together to bring the mural, many others, but it stayed in the Chase airplane hangar in Midland, Texas for a couple of years while the library was being built. And then they brought it in from Midland, which again, about two and a half hours away, and they had to get state police and local police agencies and electrical companies in each of the towns that they crossed to go and hold the lot power lines up so that the mural could pass through. So it's quite an adventure.

SPEAKER_02 9:43

Big mural.

SPEAKER_00 9:44

Big mural. And the way that they brought it in, the library was already built. The shelves were already up for the books. The mural was the last thing to go in. And they craned off the roof, craned in the mural, and had welders weld it into place on the beams. And they weren't sure if the beams were even going to be able to hold the mural, the weight of the mural. So they had told me This is great.

SPEAKER_02 10:07

So we're already sidetracked onto sort of an example of Peyton Yates's PY. Was this a PY Foundation thing, or was this before PY Foundation?

SPEAKER_00 10:15

It was probably around the time that PY Foundation was formed.

SPEAKER_02 10:18

It's a great example, though, the sort of spirit of first of all, thinking big and following the footsteps of his mother, you know, arts reading. And third, uh yeah, sparing no. It's all about it's a great example of just uh uh uh thinking about your local community without any sort of ulterior motive other than like, let's just get something great for our local community.

SPEAKER_00 10:44

Yes. Well, the photos are so endearing because you know, there are all of these people that are outside watching this mural be brought into town and then watching outside as the mural is being craned in. They had kids from all of the elementaries there. They had actually signed PVC pipe, and then it was dropped in to the root from the roof of the mural at that time. And so a couple of years ago, it was my job to try to find the PVC pipe from 10 years prior of all of these kids, which is impossible to find. Let me just tell you. Nothing can find it. I tried all things, but it I think is such a beautiful story because it does speak to who Peyton is and who and who his family is. I mean, he really did get his gibbing side, his philanthropic side came from his mother, and that was really a stealth project. She passed before she could even see the mural or and the library completed. But I think that they're just such a special family.

SPEAKER_02 11:38

Yeah, did Peyton go into um was he also working for the in the oil and energy industry?

SPEAKER_00 11:44

Yes, and they were, you know, the the largest oil producers in New Mexico. And Peyton's dad didn't just hand him the job, like most uh, I think good family members who kind of come into wealth, he made his sons like really work for their role. And he made all of them work in every single aspect of the field in the oil patch. He told them if you're going to be managing people, you need to know the job. So you can't manage people if you don't know what's going on. And I think that he was well, well formed. He tried to go to the east coast, Dartmouth, his mom's footsteps. Didn't really like the east coast as much. I think for some of us in the southwest, it's a little intimidating, I think, sometimes to be out there. It's just a different world. But it's not bad. It doesn't have to say it's uh it's bad, it's just different.

SPEAKER_02 12:30

No, I'm not I'm not sure that there are two areas of the country that are more different than each other than sort of the rural southwest and the in in the northeast. Uh so that's not terribly surprising. These are very different places.

SPEAKER_00 12:42

So he ended up going to the University of Texas and studying petroleum engineering. And then right after his, I believe it's he was an undergraduate degree, he enlisted. It was during Vietnam. So he is a Vietnam veteran. He served his country and did some petroleum things, engineering things in in Vietnam. I'm that I'm not 100% sure on in his history, but came back and had got married and had kids and stayed in Artesia. And he's always been all about Artesia. Um, he loves to travel. I think you and I, when we were first talking about Artesia and just kind of our traveling bug that we have, um, I think you and Peyton are very similar in that you all stay in small towns, I think, and get to know a place really well. That's probably one of the first things that we bonded on is your love of Artesia. And I was like, what? I can't believe you've been there. Peyton is very similar. So Mason, Texas is probably one of his favorite places to stop on his way to Houston. Many people don't know the hill country Mason, Texas, but Peyton does, and he has a place and he is a creature of habit. I think you see that in the way that he's given. I think you see that in just the projects that we've done and just the places that he's been and what he wants to bring back to our community. He's always learning, he's always moving, and he's great.

SPEAKER_02 14:01

Yeah, and yet he's very rooted in his in his hometown. Um, talk about, tell people what Artesia is like today, like what the population is, what county it's in. Are there any what are the major industries? Are there any others other than oil? Give people a sense of what Artesia is like, and then we'll talk about kind of how Peyton got to focus his giving there.

SPEAKER_00 14:20

So Artesia today is really wonderful. Uh, thanks to many families, the Yates included in that, and who just were these titans of industry in the oil and gas field and gave back to Artesia because they truly believed that it was a great place to live. And they wanted to make it better for future generations. And so we're just so blessed. I think we have one of the most beautiful downtowns in all of the United States. I tell people all the time on my tours that I believe we have the most bronzes per capita.

SPEAKER_02 14:51

That I think is definitely true. There are all these bronze, beautiful bronzes dotting the downtown area, really well done. Of various, what are they, what would you say, Destiny, kind of depicting various sort of stages of the sort of the pioneer days of mostly of Artesia.

SPEAKER_00 15:09

And the cowboy, so really our industries. I think that there is always just giving honor and recognition to where we came from in Artesia. I think that that's something that's really special. Here in Southeast New Mexico, we were agriculture, oil and gas. We have the federal law enforcement training facility here that trains Border Patrol, Bureau of Indian Affairs, Secret Service, and then does some flight marshall school things for pilots. And so we're really, oh, and our local refinery that just celebrated 100 years. And so we really have quite a unique area here. It's it's not a lot of industries, but they're good industries, and they've really given back to our area. And everything in our downtown depicts those industries and just kind of how they've shaped our community. 13,000 people live in Artesia.

SPEAKER_02 16:02

I'm talking about it, it's this pretty small town. And that the county, how many in the county total?

SPEAKER_00 16:07

That's a good question. Probably close to 70,000 because we're oil and gas. We are, and also we have the border patrol facility, and there's there's constant, you know, trainees. We're probably closer to about 70 or 80,000 in our area, maybe more, because it's so there's so many transients, you know, that kind of come to work and then will leave. And so they're here two weeks on, two weeks off, or three weeks on, one week off. So it that is kind of hard to pick, but actual residents, according to our census, about 70,000 in any county, and then in Artesia, 13,000 of those. So Carlsbad is slightly larger than us.

SPEAKER_02 16:45

I think Carlsbad is the uh uh city to the south that is sort of obviously the gateway to Carlsbad Caverns if you're headed south.

SPEAKER_00 16:53

But stay in Artesia because it's better.

SPEAKER_02 16:54

And yeah, stay in Artesia because it's better. And Roswell is just to the north, about what, half an hour or so to the north.

SPEAKER_00 17:01

Yes, we're um almost directly, like exactly 30 minutes, 35 minutes away from each city. So just 35 minutes south of us is Carlsbad, 35 minutes north is Roswell. So we're smack dab in the middle. If you make it to the bottomless lakes and then to Carlsbad Caverns, you hit Artesia. So we have let's see, our industry's kind of touched on those, our bronzes and the downtown district. We have a lot of public art. I like to say we're a little bit of an urban oasis in some ways. Like it's a rural. I don't think that you see the artwork that we have in a lot of small or rural communities, small towns like us. I I think we're quite unique in that way. We have five student murals, which our high school students have painted. One of them is a senior now, and she has been involved in our art or mural program since she was in eighth grade, which is kind of cool because she has now about five murals that she's painted around town that she can add to her portfolio.

SPEAKER_02 17:57

Well, and not only that, you have a this uh there's lots of other things. We'll we'll talk about because of big large because of PY Foundation and others, but largely because of PY Foundation, Artigia has this like punching way above its weight for a 13,000-person city kind of that is, as we said, centrally isolated. How did Peyton, John know if you know the answer to this question in Destiny, but what led him to make the choice? You have a choice when you have the resources that he had to really, really focus basically almost all of his giving through the foundation anyway, is just in southeastern New Mexico, right? Maybe bleeding into western Texas a little bit. But how did he make that choice? Because I'm sure you know he's asked all the time. I'm sure still today you guys are asked by national organizations for support. Why the focus just so heavily on the area?

SPEAKER_00 18:45

I think because he loved the area. I mean, he truly loves your Tia. You know, he has his bulldog hat. He goes to the same coffee shop all the time. He's wearing his orange on Fridays, which is our school colors, high school colors here. And we're a little, we're in New Mexico, but we're a little like Texan when it comes to football. So Friday night lights for sure, the city shuts down, football stadium is where everyone is, except me. I go shopping during those times. Grocery shopping. It's the best time to go. But, you know, everyone else is at the football games or listening to the football game on the radio or watching it online. So Peyton just, I think, recognized how special the people in this community were and just wanted to really keep people, I think, here. Because I do think that there are benefits, I think, sometimes to moving to some of the bigger communities that around us, like Lubbock, there Albuquerque, El Paso. There are opportunities that don't exist here. Austin, Phoenix, you know, there we don't have a lot of access to some of the opportunities that an urban city has, and we never will. But I think he saw that the people here were so special and they really wanted to to support kids, support one another. And I think it really and he's like that too. I mean, I think he's very much the epitome of who an artesian is, is just giving back to the community and loving our community and just always speaking highly of our of our town and getting people to come and visit. And I think that's like probably one of my favorite things. I I hear so many people talk about where they grew up and they don't always speak about it with joy. And I love Artesia. I want everyone to come and visit Artesia, um, experience it.

SPEAKER_02 20:34

But Destiny already knows. I'm also a big fan. I went to Artesia, my wife and I did well before we knew anything about uh PY Foundation, but we were struck by how there's something different in this town. Like, where are all these statues from? This public art, this beautiful library. Um, like what is happening here? And then later realized why. And it was because of these very localist philanthropists who had invested so much in the town. So let's talk about how it's done. I want to make sure we touch on things here, Destiny, that are like how to do local giving well. I think it's probably more difficult than it looks like. It is not the same as if you're doing a big national giver um trying to invest in certain two or three causes or or movements or or missions. Uh, it is it's very broad, right? I mean, uh PY Foundation, because of how big Artesia is and the the region, you're investing in almost every corner of the nonprofit world.

SPEAKER_00 21:34

We fund every sector. Every sector.

SPEAKER_02 21:36

Yeah, give us the sorts of things you guys support.

SPEAKER_00 21:39

Yes. So we fund all sectors education, arts and humanities, health and human services. We call it civic enhancements, but really it's you know economic development initiatives, parks, rec centers, pools.

SPEAKER_02 21:52

Our TJ has a beautiful pool and rec center, by the way.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

That would make pool. And I think it is the largest man made Square footage wise, man-made pool in the United States or North America.

SPEAKER_02 22:05

Yeah, it's something crazy like that. It's it's it's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 22:07

Very slight. There's there's little slight things that happen in Artesia that are like, well, we might as well add two extra square feet if it's going to make us the biggest.

SPEAKER_02 22:16

Yeah. That's the technical spirit of the show, too. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:20

We're in every sector. And so as a program officer, I've I've met sometimes I have a hard time when I go to conferences or when I'm speaking with people because most foundations will have a program officer for each sector that they fund, that then kind of becomes an expert in that area and really kind of develops those giving strategies for that area. At the PY Foundation, it's just me. I'm the sole program officer. So then I'm a little bit of an expert in each of our areas of giving just because of the nature of how we give. And I think Peyton's biggest thing is just anything that helps benefit Artesia. And so any of our outside grants, even that we've given that are outside of our geographic area, are always like, how is this helping the citizens of Artesia? We have worked very closely with Lubbock UMC Health Services or Health Center to fund like a burn unit, a cardiac unit, a cancer center, because in our part of the world, that's you wouldn't have had those things. Well, and that's where our people are going. When you go to Texas Tech Health Services and you go and you see at the cancer center, most of the license plates are from New Mexico. We're not going to Albuquerque. We're not going to El Paso. And so Texas Tech really is the area where most of our and UMC are is the area where most of our patients are attending, you know, and receiving services. If they have to be flown out, they're flown out to Lubbock. So we, you know, also with through the city, we give a grant for Medivax services. And I really do think something special that we have, and I don't know how it would be in any other setting because the only foundation I've ever worked for is here, but we really do have an open door policy, and our grantees kind of know we we get to know them intimately, you know, very well. We know what what their struggles are, we know how they're doing, we know how their fundraisings are going or their events are going. We're really involved, we're kind of in the weeds a lot of times with them. I'm helping them grant write, I'm helping them draft letters for donor mail.

SPEAKER_01 24:29

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SPEAKER_02 25:00

That's one of the ways in which you do local giving well, I think, that you all model is that you do not just give grants, although you do do that. You don't substitute for the grants, you give grants. But you provide like really uh uh deep training and a suite of resources for basically, again, every nonprofit that wants to take advantage of them in your area. I would imagine that's key because um you have a lot of these nonprofit organizations, they're not, these are these aren't people who went to, you know, got master's degrees in nonprofit management somewhere necessarily, right? These are just people with big hearts who are attracted to a mission and are wanna see it flourish in your part of the country.

SPEAKER_00 25:43

Yes. And and I think that that probably is one of the things that I would say for us is in giving, I mean, with our nonprofits, we meet them where they are. And so we kind of understand that, yeah, they didn't get a master's degree. And so if we're asking them for these really extensive data sets and trying to measure this impact in this way that maybe nationally makes sense, in a small town, the capacity isn't there. You probably have one person who's making 20,000 a year realistically, and they are running this 60,000 a year operation, and they are serving 200 clients, 300 clients with such limited resources. And they're not tracking in the way that a national organization has the capacity to do. And so, really just recognizing that and saying, like, okay, I get you can't do that. Maybe tell us, like, of your 200, how many graduated? Do you have that? And you I think just really trying to find where the nonprofit is and say, like, okay, how can I support you? What do you need? Because we see the budgets, we see how much they make, we know what they're bringing in, and we know most of the time we're the largest donor. I think for us, what I have seen in my time as a program officer is we're one of the rare foundations that gives unrestricted operations. Because so many people want to give to programmatic uh initiatives. And I think that that is really beautiful, and that's great that you want to fund a program, but if the lights can't go on, programs don't happen. And I think that that's something that Peyton really taught us is like if the lights can't go on, if staff can't get paid, there are no programs. So this nonprofit is not working. And really saying, okay, yes, we want to fund a program, but also like just pay the bills. And or we'll pay an executive director's salary because there's nothing worse in a nonprofit that's struggling than an executive director that has to fundraise their salary. If they're fundraising their salary, they're not trying to also then fundraise for the program. Because they're too busy stressed out trying to fund, you know, how they're going to be around. And I think a lot of the times our executive directors are working really long hours. I think you see that with a lot of nonprofits. They are burnt out, they're working way more hours than than they probably should be working, and they're not making nearly enough money for the amount of work that they're putting in and just the amount of services that they're providing for our area. So I am a big supporter, and I I talk to a lot of our foundation partners and trying to convince them like, I get that you want to fund programs, but here is how to look at it in this way that maybe maybe let's fund capacity building. Because what they really need is a new staff person so that this person can come and meet with you and can come and take time. But if they're tutoring for 10 hours out of their day, they can't come and meet with the funder because they're helping a client.

SPEAKER_02 28:40

It just strikes me that uh you say, you know, you can't um expect a number of your grantees, not all of them, because I've I've met a number of your grantees. I know some of their are very highly professional and they do things in a really incredibly good way. But you know, you can't expect a lot of them to be able to track a bunch of like sophisticated data and to be able to show um, you know, impact metrics that are really sort of uh impressive. But collectively, when you think about the impact that uh this local foundation is making on the community, it's it's unparalleled. Like it's hard to mean to think about of a foundation that has a bigger impact on a place that, or put it this way, many national foundations spend a lot more money and have less to show for it when it comes to impact than a foundation like yours that is so like the backbone of the community is funded by much of it by PY Foundation. Whatever isn't covered by taxes, you know, it's it's you guys. I know there's some others too. You're blessed in that community with some other um really uh generous philanthropists, but it's collectively the impact must be astounding.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

Yes, I was trying for the 100-year anniversary. Peyton son Hansen, who's on our board, had asked me, you know, can you please try to quantify how much has been given to this community because of the oil and gas, because of these foundations? And I couldn't reach a number. I mean, I was close to maybe 80 million if you like, and that's just in giving. That's not in what has happened because of that. Just in the amount that has been given in a hundred years in this area is just astronomical. I mean, it's so crazy to think Peyton wanted to build a pool because we had seventh graders who didn't know how to swim. And he thought, a seventh grader who doesn't know how to swim, what happens if they go to a river in college or something and they drown? Like so he was like, We need to build a pool. Kids need to know how to swim. That's a basic life skill that all kids should have. And so the pool came about. And we just have such a really special, I think something we also do really well is public-private partnerships. We build on a lot of private land and gift to public institutions, so to our school district, to our mainly to our city, um, or we build on city property. So one of my favorite projects that I led was a local park. It's a six-acre park, really small. It's a neighborhood park, and our teachers flat. We're desert land. We added a four-foot hill to add some topography to the area and a walking track, and it's well loved and well used. And that was probably one of my favorite projects. And that one, in comparison to other grants we've given, small, but so impactful. You see moms out there, you see kids out there. I think you and I had kind of talked about like the beauty of real philanthropy. And I think for me that it's just we have so much freedom and innovation that we can kind of bring to situations. And we don't always try to start something new, but by default, sometimes we are the only ones in our field that are doing what we're doing. And we're always happy to share our knowledge because we never want people, there's no reason to reinvent the wheel. Sometimes we're the ones who are building the wheel, just by nature of how we do things.

SPEAKER_02 32:05

It's an interesting point you make that by being so local uh in your giving, you uh, and then and that therefore having built so many powerful partnerships with just about everyone, you have a level of freedom to innovate with your giving that is really high. You're saying you you can test all sorts of different things, you know, uh, do all sorts of different things. And uh whatever's called forth by the situation, you're able to do.

SPEAKER_00 32:29

Well, and what I think is really special is just in this role, I think we've just built trust. I think it's something that you all talk about at AMFL a lot is really building relationship at as, you know, in in fundraising and trying to give donors a sense of belonging. I think with the foundation, we've done a very similar model, which is I think why we've meshed really well in all of our conversations and our trainings, is because I do think that by default, Artesia kind of has that model and and our givers, you know, have that model here in town and they've really built that trust. And so I can call the city today and say, I really think I would like to build a park in this area. Here's what I'm thinking, because I've been seeing that kids are walking around on wagons. Like, what if we added a little train station? And it's where there's this landscape architect in Albuquerque, and they just know whatever we do is going to be with the community first, you know, kind of that that thought in mind. And it will be so that it benefits the city. And the city will tell me, yes, let's do it. You just let me know when you have a plan and let's set a community meeting. And I think that's so cool.

SPEAKER_02 33:34

I admirably non-bureaucratic. That's uh very impressive. But what are the okay, but destiny, let's we let's try to find something negative here. What's uh what are the some of the pitfalls of the sort of intensively local giving? Or what are some of the what are some of the challenges that often come up, or maybe even some challenges for Peyton? He's so visible and such a big player. I mean, I would imagine he gets both a lot of flattery and a lot of flack, because I know what small towns are like. I grew up in a small town. What what would you see on that side of things is kind of the challenges or pitfalls?

SPEAKER_00 34:06

I think a lot of funders want their nonprofits to have diversified funding models. It's hard here. And we're usually the sole funder. And so I think really impacting the public support percentage for a nonprofit is something that we run into. Sometimes we know that they need help and we want to help, and we can't because if we do, we tip them. And then trying to find other funders to come in again, because we only there's maybe four of four foundations here in town that that are large that kind of contribute. So those four funders will tip the funding. So we can't always bail out nonprofits. Also, again, bail out. Here I am saying bail out nonprofits. I think because we get to know our grantees, we form such a deep relationship and we love the people so much that sometimes they don't do the greatest things. And it's not scandalous embezzlement things, but maybe it's just they are really bad with numbers and they don't know how to balance their checkbook. So, and so they don't, or maybe they don't know how to fundraise or meet with donors. And it's a struggle for us to then see that and and we really want to help them and we really love them and we support them 100%, but maybe they're not the most organized. And so it's really hard for us to go and tell maybe a donor in Phoenix, hey, you should invest into this program because it's so great. And then they look at them and they're like, this looks like a risk. We're like, no, you're great. You should. So I I think sometimes our nonprofits like I think we give them a lot of opportunities or we try to help them out of these situations that maybe other funders don't do. They're kind of they wipe their hands clean. And I don't know what that means.

SPEAKER_02 35:46

But they're not as embedded in the community as you guys.

SPEAKER_00 35:48

They're not as embedded. And you see the impact, so it's also kind of hard because if a nonprofit in our community fails at serving a lot of people, you're like, we can't let them. Like that is that's so many people in town that are receiving those services. So even if it's a disaster, you're still trying to help. And you feel that kind of like need for that fool to help. I would say probably another hard thing in town is I think there can be some entitlement. You know, when when you grow up in a community that has been given so much and a lot of the donors don't want any recognition, um, I think that there are community members who feel like they deserve to have certain amenities or have this sense of authority of kind of dictating how things should happen. And so I do think that we kind of run into just kind of that it's people aren't as grateful, I think, sometimes for the amount of work that goes into a project or the feeling behind it, I guess, or why it was taken. I think they can criticize really quickly or be like, oh, you did a swing set. Why didn't you do this?

unknown 36:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:59

It's also very human. It's also very, yeah, it's these are the these are the characteristic vices of small towns. Yeah. Yeah. Now the other thing I thought you might say, it's also got to be a challenge for not necessarily your challenge, but your your grantees challenges has to be to kind of finding and retaining really talented leaders for these nonprofit organizations. Is that would that be a challenge?

SPEAKER_00 37:25

I think somewhat. I think we'll run into that soon. We have some executive directors who have been at the helm of their organizations and they're strong organizations and they have really strong board members, but they're all getting to be a little older. And what happens when they start to think about retirement? And I do think that we will run into that issue is just having that that leadership. I think there are some there, but I'm sure you see it. I feel like the workforce is a little different and they're maybe not as loyal as I don't know if loyal is the word, but they don't stay at a position as long as as people used to. And so I do think you see them switch jobs a little more with some of the younger people that we've kind of seen. And I also think there's a shift in this kind of like work-life balance, which is good. Saying that that's bad, but I do think that some of our nonprofits in the past are executive directors, have given their all. And there is nobody that I know that is around my age that has kids that is going to dedicate as much time as some of these executive directors are are currently giving.

SPEAKER_02 38:35

So you're not the only foundation person to say that to me. That's widespread feeling.

SPEAKER_00 38:41

Yes. So I I think currently we've had really good leaders, and we, as you know, put on like nonprofit training for our executive directors and our staff and board members um regionally. So anybody in our area can attend these classes for free. But I do worry as people start rolling off, what will happen. I think I see it with board members more so right now than I do see it with leadership.

SPEAKER_02 39:06

One more question for you uh on the pitfalls. We feel I think we, and I not to end this on a negative way, I think we think we were sufficiently positive in the first half an hour. Do you ever get frustrated, the foundation, that maybe local government or other private actors are counting on you to do too much because you because you do do so much that you're unintentionally crowding out like government action or where it really would be appropriate, or the action of other private actors where it would be appropriate.

SPEAKER_00 39:36

I think that is something that we struggle with sometimes. Is I think a good example right now, we're in the midst of two huge capital campaigns, huge, and$50 million that we're giving to these initiatives. And we really thought more people would come in and step up because in the past, we've committed monies and people have come and matched. And that is has not happened. And I do think that probably a lesson learned is maybe like don't fund a fool capital campaign and then expect someone to fundraise because if it's given, then they're not going to have any incentive. And it was a model that worked for us for such a long time, but we're it's just been such a shift. And as we've seen our area change because of corporations coming in and buying out all of the mom and pop gas industries, we just don't see that same sense of community giving.

SPEAKER_02 40:31

Yeah, that's that's something else. Yeah, we we you and I have talked about in the past. I'm glad you just brought it up here. I mean, that talk about how that's happening. That there used to be, I don't know if people would know that there were mom and pop oil businesses and and businesses servicing oil producers that are being, as you say, bought up and consolidated and uh now owned by people who uh or corporations that are based far away or even foreign corporations, right?

SPEAKER_00 40:59

Yes. I mean our refinery was one. I mean, it was like locally owned and um and they're still in here and they're really great community partners. But now, you know, before they used to just write a check and give to a program. Now it has to go through an application process, it has to be vetted, it has to go through. So something that used to take two months maybe to make a commitment now can take half a year to a year, which if you want to affect change, can be kind of difficult. Or you have to be okay kind of taking that risk and saying, like, okay, well, they'll come in, they'll come through. And I think also with some of our corporations, again, it's not that they don't want to give in our area. I do think something that I see with a lot of corporations is we're the producers, but we don't always receive the benefits. I think some of the bigger cities will receive the benefits as opposed to smaller towns where the business is actually happening, where the money is being made. There's not as much investment. There is still some, but maybe not as grandiose or or huge or out in public to be seen as it is in in the bigger cities. I think those are kind of some some areas I think where we're struggling. I think people also, for instance, in at a countywide level, I think there's this mentality that like PY Foundation will cover northern Eddie County and like we never have to give to northern Eddie County because PY Foundation has it covered, which I think for a really long time was really true. But now with these big capital projects, it does kind of say like, okay, well, you have to step up in this way because we can't continue to give at the level we were, because if we do, then we cease to exist and what happens.

SPEAKER_02 42:35

Is the foundation sunsetting uh at some point or is it perpetual?

SPEAKER_00 42:39

It's set in perpetuity. Peyton, I think, has talked something that he and I think a lot of founders don't like to talk about what donor intent means when they pass. So I think that that's a pretty common issue that I think people see in foundations. I think Peyton has said it in perpetuity. He is in recent years has been spending more of his foundation dollars, and we've always spent more than our 5%. But in recent years, I've seen an increase in giving, which is really great because he gets to see these projects out in his lifetime. And I think that that's something that you all, you know, always kind of say is is having the donor give while they're alive so that they can see those projects. And Peyton has been doing that, but he does have plans to continue the foundation on after he passes.

SPEAKER_02 43:22

And it's a splendid example of how to do local giving well, I think. And I uh and how why it is extremely strategic in in uh supporting the growth and and well-being of the community. So thank you, Destiny, for talking to everybody here today about beautiful and unjustly unknown Artesia, New Mexico.

SPEAKER_00 43:46

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 43:46

It's been a pleasure.

SPEAKER_00 43:47

Thanks. It's been a pleasure. And anytime anybody wants to come, I will happily give a tour.

SPEAKER_02 43:51

So look up Destiny Rojo. Go to what's what's PY Foundation's website?

SPEAKER_00 43:56

pyfoundationnm.org.

SPEAKER_02 43:59

There you go. So there's your tour guide, your local tour guide in southeastern New Mexico. And she's a good one. Thanks, Destiny. We'll talk to you later. Hey, thanks for listening to this episode in what is going to be the last season of the Givers, Doers, and Thinkers Podcast. Nevertheless, I invite you to like and follow us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube. And as always, if you want to learn more, check out mphil.com. Thanks.