1 00:00:03,024 --> 00:00:06,049 Speaker 2: This is the Rebel HR podcast, the podcast about all 2 00:00:06,149 --> 00:00:08,151 things innovation in the people's space. 3 00:00:08,151 --> 00:00:09,614 I'm Kyle Rode. 4 00:00:09,614 --> 00:00:10,595 Let's start the show. 5 00:00:10,595 --> 00:00:16,961 All right, welcome back, rebel HR community. 6 00:00:16,961 --> 00:00:19,864 I am going to be extremely excited about this conversation. 7 00:00:19,864 --> 00:00:22,187 Today With us we have Peggy Sullivan. 8 00:00:22,187 --> 00:00:26,871 She is a busyness addict and author of the brand new book 9 00:00:26,931 --> 00:00:31,896 available now Beyond Busyness how to Achieve More by Doing 10 00:00:31,977 --> 00:00:32,216 Less. 11 00:00:32,216 --> 00:00:35,985 She is also a consultant and speaker, and we are going to 12 00:00:36,027 --> 00:00:40,395 talk all about how to achieve more by doing less today. 13 00:00:40,395 --> 00:00:42,508 Peggy, thank you so much for joining us. 14 00:00:43,700 --> 00:00:45,145 Speaker 1: I'm excited to be here. 15 00:00:45,145 --> 00:00:47,170 New year, new possibilities. 16 00:00:48,982 --> 00:00:50,024 Speaker 2: New year, new you. 17 00:00:50,024 --> 00:00:53,470 Everybody's saying that and it's funny, you know. 18 00:00:53,470 --> 00:00:56,704 I think the recording of this podcast is timed fairly 19 00:00:56,723 --> 00:00:57,204 appropriately. 20 00:00:57,204 --> 00:01:02,222 I have a feeling many of us are trying to find balance and that 21 00:01:02,222 --> 00:01:05,751 , in some way, shape or form, is some of the resolutions that 22 00:01:05,790 --> 00:01:07,561 we've made for 2025. 23 00:01:07,561 --> 00:01:12,793 Certainly, that's some of my goals, but I think so often we 24 00:01:12,813 --> 00:01:15,584 talk about that, we talk about, we throw around these terms like 25 00:01:15,584 --> 00:01:18,564 work-life balance, and we talk about terms like you know, 26 00:01:19,027 --> 00:01:22,099 focusing on what matters, but then we all fall back into these 27 00:01:22,099 --> 00:01:25,668 patterns of just doing what we're used to doing, the inertia 28 00:01:25,668 --> 00:01:30,066 of staying busy, and so that's why I think your book is really, 29 00:01:30,066 --> 00:01:32,391 really powerful and I want to dive into this topic today. 30 00:01:32,391 --> 00:01:35,750 So I want to start off with kind of the general question 31 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:42,271 what motivated you to write a book about busyness and how to 32 00:01:42,510 --> 00:01:44,614 change our perspective on being busy? 33 00:01:47,510 --> 00:01:49,659 Speaker 1: busyness and how to change our perspective on being 34 00:01:49,739 --> 00:01:49,920 busy. 35 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:56,201 I started a nonprofit about 10 years ago. 36 00:01:56,201 --> 00:01:58,224 I worked in corporate America and worked for very large 37 00:01:58,243 --> 00:02:00,727 companies, had many, many successful jobs, traveled the 38 00:02:00,808 --> 00:02:06,073 world, made great money, and at the end of that I took care of 39 00:02:06,153 --> 00:02:10,811 my ailing father and I wanted to figure out, after he died, what 40 00:02:10,811 --> 00:02:13,600 I could do, what was my legacy, what was I going to do back to 41 00:02:13,621 --> 00:02:14,201 the world? 42 00:02:14,201 --> 00:02:18,350 And so I started off with market research, because I'm a 43 00:02:18,411 --> 00:02:21,223 research geek and that's where everything begins from my 44 00:02:21,264 --> 00:02:22,004 perspective. 45 00:02:22,004 --> 00:02:25,652 So I asked a couple of thousand people what's your biggest 46 00:02:25,693 --> 00:02:26,354 challenge? 47 00:02:26,354 --> 00:02:29,945 And it kept on coming back I don't have time for what's 48 00:02:29,985 --> 00:02:30,608 important. 49 00:02:30,608 --> 00:02:37,949 So it became very interesting to me that people were looking 50 00:02:38,150 --> 00:02:43,326 for a how-to guide, that they knew where they were at and what 51 00:02:43,326 --> 00:02:44,008 they were doing. 52 00:02:44,008 --> 00:02:46,789 Traditional time management wasn't working. 53 00:02:46,789 --> 00:02:52,044 And as I started writing the book, I started realizing that 54 00:02:52,145 --> 00:02:57,823 my whole life was a series of raise the bar, run hard, run 55 00:02:57,962 --> 00:03:01,332 fast, do more cha-ching success. 56 00:03:01,332 --> 00:03:06,435 Raise the bar, run hard, do fast, cha-ching, you know. 57 00:03:06,435 --> 00:03:10,243 And I wasn't really looking at the price tag that it would cost 58 00:03:10,243 --> 00:03:10,405 me. 59 00:03:10,405 --> 00:03:13,570 I wasn't looking at happiness. 60 00:03:13,570 --> 00:03:18,266 I wasn't looking at at you know , things that really lit me up 61 00:03:18,328 --> 00:03:20,352 the small things, the everyday things. 62 00:03:20,431 --> 00:03:25,948 So about 10 years ago I started off on this journey to really 63 00:03:26,048 --> 00:03:30,955 figure out how to not be so busy and how not to be a busyness 64 00:03:31,275 --> 00:03:31,616 addict. 65 00:03:31,616 --> 00:03:36,729 And I think the first thing is just getting right past the fact 66 00:03:36,729 --> 00:03:41,943 that busyness is an addiction, even though the American Medical 67 00:03:41,943 --> 00:03:44,445 Association does not acknowledge it. 68 00:03:44,445 --> 00:03:47,790 An addiction is anything that keeps you from doing what you 69 00:03:47,850 --> 00:03:50,655 should be doing, what you need to be doing, what you want to be 70 00:03:50,655 --> 00:03:54,250 doing, and for me it's an addiction. 71 00:03:54,250 --> 00:03:55,419 I can't help myself. 72 00:03:55,419 --> 00:03:59,346 You know it's like crossing a leg my left foot goes over my 73 00:03:59,425 --> 00:04:00,729 right every single time. 74 00:04:00,729 --> 00:04:08,500 I don't even know why I'm doing it single time. 75 00:04:08,500 --> 00:04:09,201 I don't even know why I'm doing it. 76 00:04:09,201 --> 00:04:10,705 So what I found out was that the addiction is complicated. 77 00:04:10,705 --> 00:04:14,431 But really there's a process that you can use to mitigate the 78 00:04:14,431 --> 00:04:17,281 addiction that works beautifully in the 79 00:04:17,382 --> 00:04:21,567 organizational environment as well as for individuals, and 80 00:04:21,627 --> 00:04:26,675 it's just as simple as one, two, three and you know, step number 81 00:04:26,675 --> 00:04:30,665 one in my busy busting process is about subtraction. 82 00:04:30,786 --> 00:04:36,074 We just don't spend too much time on low value activities. 83 00:04:36,074 --> 00:04:38,081 We just do. 84 00:04:38,081 --> 00:04:42,730 You know, whether it's looking at email for five minutes and 85 00:04:42,771 --> 00:04:46,639 that five minute turns into 10, or maybe we'll multi-casting, 86 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:51,649 but it's actually taking us three times as much time, you 87 00:04:51,689 --> 00:04:54,560 know, or maybe we're letting interruptions in. 88 00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:57,288 The other day, my husband's like I was working on this 89 00:04:57,408 --> 00:04:59,072 budget, I'm so into it. 90 00:04:59,072 --> 00:05:00,701 My husband's like do you have a minute? 91 00:05:00,701 --> 00:05:04,571 And I knew, I knew that if I said yes, that would be the end. 92 00:05:04,571 --> 00:05:08,125 But sure enough, I said yes and that took me a half an hour to 93 00:05:08,165 --> 00:05:12,322 figure out what formula I was working on and where I left off. 94 00:05:12,322 --> 00:05:19,216 And so there are lots of reasons why we spend time on low 95 00:05:19,216 --> 00:05:22,283 value activities, but most of them are habitual. 96 00:05:22,283 --> 00:05:27,740 So I worked with dozens of HR people and some industrial 97 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:34,271 psychologists to identify 21 areas in which we commit this 98 00:05:34,831 --> 00:05:39,425 type of self-sabotage, and I developed this tool that I call 99 00:05:39,446 --> 00:05:42,153 the busy browser and a test for all of these. 100 00:05:42,153 --> 00:05:46,610 And so, really, step one is, you know, getting rid of your 101 00:05:46,740 --> 00:05:50,526 low value activities so you have time for what's important. 102 00:05:51,187 --> 00:05:56,762 Step two in the process gets back to happiness and how. 103 00:05:56,762 --> 00:06:00,788 Happiness is a superpower, because when we're happy, our 104 00:06:00,827 --> 00:06:05,855 brain lights up, they send us endorphins and we actually focus 105 00:06:05,855 --> 00:06:11,108 more, we're clear-headed, we're healthier, we live longer, 106 00:06:11,588 --> 00:06:13,132 we're just in a better mood. 107 00:06:13,132 --> 00:06:17,649 So we tend to think oh, happiness is a definite thing. 108 00:06:17,649 --> 00:06:21,100 I'm going to be happy when I get the promotion, I'm going to 109 00:06:21,120 --> 00:06:24,346 be happy when I get married, when I have a baby, but we don't 110 00:06:24,346 --> 00:06:27,793 think about happiness as micro moments we create. 111 00:06:27,793 --> 00:06:32,721 So step two is about creating micro moments on frigging day 112 00:06:32,781 --> 00:06:37,891 long to just ignite your happiness muscle, and it could 113 00:06:37,911 --> 00:06:43,706 be something as small as I am a rock star, or it could be 114 00:06:43,805 --> 00:06:45,829 something that I do every day. 115 00:06:45,829 --> 00:06:50,884 At 11 am, I pop three pieces of dark chocolate into my mouth, I 116 00:06:50,884 --> 00:06:55,978 close my eyes and I moan with delight, and that is just a 117 00:06:56,019 --> 00:06:58,343 crazy thing I do, but it resets me. 118 00:06:59,144 --> 00:07:03,468 And then step three, which is probably the hardest stuff to do 119 00:07:03,468 --> 00:07:09,221 , is really using your values as a filter for every decision you 120 00:07:09,221 --> 00:07:09,543 make. 121 00:07:09,543 --> 00:07:14,315 So you really have to get in tune with one of your values. 122 00:07:14,315 --> 00:07:15,779 What's most important? 123 00:07:15,779 --> 00:07:20,728 And because I'm a research geek and I started talking a lot 124 00:07:20,889 --> 00:07:24,985 about values, every time I talk to a group asking people what 125 00:07:25,026 --> 00:07:27,718 are your values, they look at their neighbor or they Google 126 00:07:27,819 --> 00:07:32,968 that, and so I got curious about what are the values that equate 127 00:07:32,968 --> 00:07:37,666 to happiness and fulfillment, and what I learned is actually 128 00:07:37,687 --> 00:07:38,963 that there are four. 129 00:07:38,963 --> 00:07:44,961 One of them is energy management, then there's growth, 130 00:07:44,961 --> 00:07:49,492 then there's growth, then there's authenticity. 131 00:07:51,879 --> 00:07:58,350 And then the fourth value that it ignites is what did I say? 132 00:07:58,350 --> 00:08:00,274 Energy, human connection. 133 00:08:00,274 --> 00:08:02,343 How can I forget human connection? 134 00:08:02,343 --> 00:08:05,692 Because when we're busy we tend to put human connection on the 135 00:08:05,732 --> 00:08:06,492 back burner. 136 00:08:06,492 --> 00:08:14,512 And you know, like our Surgeon General said, you know there's 137 00:08:14,632 --> 00:08:16,115 loneliness epidemic. 138 00:08:16,115 --> 00:08:20,062 One in every 10 people are lonely on a weekly basis, one in 139 00:08:20,062 --> 00:08:24,605 every three on a daily basis, and it's equivalent to smoking 140 00:08:24,665 --> 00:08:25,887 12 cigarettes a day. 141 00:08:25,887 --> 00:08:31,324 So you know, it's really for me as easy as one, two, three 142 00:08:31,464 --> 00:08:33,809 eliminate this low value stuff. 143 00:08:33,809 --> 00:08:38,164 Make sure you're doing things that make you happy, tiny little 144 00:08:38,164 --> 00:08:40,549 things that don't cost time or money. 145 00:08:40,549 --> 00:08:44,846 And then, three, get in touch with your values, really get in 146 00:08:44,907 --> 00:08:47,361 touch with them, and then keep yourself honest. 147 00:08:47,361 --> 00:08:53,374 I can go values report card and uh, you know I am not flowing. 148 00:08:53,374 --> 00:08:57,789 When there's a value I'm not flowing on, then I'll focus on 149 00:08:57,870 --> 00:08:59,273 it for the next couple of days. 150 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:06,524 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I, I mean sound advice and I think, um, 151 00:09:06,583 --> 00:09:12,388 as I hear that it all makes so much sense, but just because it 152 00:09:12,427 --> 00:09:15,811 makes sense doesn't mean it's easy, right, or it sounds simple 153 00:09:15,811 --> 00:09:19,452 Like, yeah, I should connect with other people, but the 154 00:09:19,552 --> 00:09:23,936 actual practice is more difficult, and I think so many 155 00:09:23,975 --> 00:09:27,042 people struggle with this, and so I know that you did a 156 00:09:27,101 --> 00:09:29,287 significant amount of research as you were writing this book 157 00:09:29,386 --> 00:09:33,302 and just in general in your day-to-day practice. 158 00:09:33,302 --> 00:09:36,850 So can you share with us some of your findings and some of the 159 00:09:36,850 --> 00:09:40,693 research that you think would be particularly interesting for 160 00:09:40,714 --> 00:09:40,995 this group? 161 00:09:42,023 --> 00:09:45,572 Speaker 1: I just crunched the numbers on last year's research, 162 00:09:45,572 --> 00:09:52,505 so this is all fresh out of the press, but 75% of individuals 163 00:09:52,605 --> 00:09:56,333 find self-care like giving a good night's sleep a challenge. 164 00:09:56,333 --> 00:10:01,791 79% of working individuals struggle to identify their 165 00:10:01,870 --> 00:10:02,734 priorities. 166 00:10:02,734 --> 00:10:07,860 80% of the population feels stressed, overwhelmed and 167 00:10:07,941 --> 00:10:09,484 struggles with mental health. 168 00:10:09,484 --> 00:10:14,594 79% have lost a sense of purpose. 169 00:10:14,594 --> 00:10:21,985 They're why 74% struggle to make meaningful connections and 170 00:10:22,206 --> 00:10:27,375 83% of people-task is their core strategy to get their work done 171 00:10:27,375 --> 00:10:27,375 . 172 00:10:27,375 --> 00:10:31,105 So those are pretty startling. 173 00:10:31,205 --> 00:10:36,053 And I get back to this one, two, three, because you really need 174 00:10:36,114 --> 00:10:38,785 to eliminate low-value activities If you're going to 175 00:10:38,826 --> 00:10:41,873 find time for things that have more meaning. 176 00:10:41,873 --> 00:10:43,904 You have to eliminate the unimportant and you have to know 177 00:10:43,904 --> 00:10:44,145 what it is. 178 00:10:44,145 --> 00:10:46,474 You have to eliminate the unimportant and you have to know 179 00:10:46,474 --> 00:10:50,405 what it is and you have to set a plan. 180 00:10:50,405 --> 00:10:56,399 You know, I often, you know, tell a story about a friend of 181 00:10:56,458 --> 00:11:01,966 mine who was a single mother, lives down the street and raises 182 00:11:01,966 --> 00:11:07,514 three children all under 10 on her own and also is a CFO for a 183 00:11:07,554 --> 00:11:09,582 very large international company . 184 00:11:09,582 --> 00:11:13,410 So she's in the state of time poverty all the time. 185 00:11:13,410 --> 00:11:16,985 And she was like, oh my God, there's no time for self-care. 186 00:11:16,985 --> 00:11:19,269 And I'm like, okay, you know what? 187 00:11:19,269 --> 00:11:20,692 Let's start off small. 188 00:11:20,692 --> 00:11:23,205 Can you find 15 minutes a day? 189 00:11:23,205 --> 00:11:24,528 Just 15 minutes? 190 00:11:24,528 --> 00:11:25,769 Do one thing. 191 00:11:26,230 --> 00:11:31,528 So she started off by getting 15 minutes up earlier so that she 192 00:11:31,567 --> 00:11:33,392 could have some peace and quiet. 193 00:11:33,392 --> 00:11:36,684 She did that for a week and she found, okay, I have to do both. 194 00:11:36,684 --> 00:11:37,707 A micro step. 195 00:11:37,707 --> 00:11:41,241 And then the next week she decided wow, I'm going to take 196 00:11:41,322 --> 00:11:44,265 15 minutes at work and I'm going to actually take a lunch. 197 00:11:44,265 --> 00:11:45,548 I always eat at my desk. 198 00:11:45,548 --> 00:11:48,613 I'm going to take a lunch and feel the sun on my face. 199 00:11:48,613 --> 00:11:49,313 She did that. 200 00:11:49,313 --> 00:11:51,825 She realized how much more productive she was. 201 00:11:51,825 --> 00:11:55,197 And then the thing that she did that helped her the most was 202 00:11:55,238 --> 00:11:58,566 the 15 minutes she did before she went to bed. 203 00:11:58,566 --> 00:12:02,581 Instead of doing her to-do list , which was her habit, she 204 00:12:02,701 --> 00:12:05,669 counted her blessings and what she was grateful for. 205 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:10,455 So there are all these little micro steps that you can do that 206 00:12:10,455 --> 00:12:11,700 get you a little closer. 207 00:12:11,700 --> 00:12:13,788 And then you're like, yeah, this works. 208 00:12:13,788 --> 00:12:20,264 So I'm going to do it again, and for me it feels a lot better 209 00:12:20,264 --> 00:12:24,350 to be healthier, happier and productive than the alternative, 210 00:12:24,350 --> 00:12:30,705 that hamster wheel that I call busyness, and I fall back into 211 00:12:30,765 --> 00:12:31,729 it all the time. 212 00:12:31,729 --> 00:12:35,567 I mean, I get into time, I'm about to launch a frigging book 213 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:42,443 and so there's lots to do and I stop myself and I remember the 214 00:12:42,585 --> 00:12:43,408 one, two, three. 215 00:12:43,408 --> 00:12:45,749 What's not important. 216 00:12:45,749 --> 00:12:51,667 You know, do these happiness rituals and you know what values 217 00:12:51,667 --> 00:12:54,493 are you ignoring and focus on them. 218 00:12:54,493 --> 00:12:58,607 And it really got to tell you anybody I've ever coached, every 219 00:12:58,607 --> 00:13:00,952 workshop I've ever walked into. 220 00:13:00,952 --> 00:13:05,134 Everybody says they're happier, healthier, but so much more 221 00:13:05,154 --> 00:13:05,756 important. 222 00:13:05,756 --> 00:13:08,485 They're more productive, they're getting more done in 223 00:13:08,544 --> 00:13:11,952 less time, and that's what really lights us up. 224 00:13:11,952 --> 00:13:15,488 Well, we can get good stuff done and feel good about it and 225 00:13:15,548 --> 00:13:19,383 aligns with who we are and what we want, and if a win for the 226 00:13:19,562 --> 00:13:21,826 organization, that's a win. 227 00:13:22,407 --> 00:13:24,590 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's. 228 00:13:24,590 --> 00:13:28,796 You know I, first of all, I guess, maybe before I jump in, I 229 00:13:28,796 --> 00:13:31,990 have so many questions, yeah, and before we hit record, I 230 00:13:32,009 --> 00:13:35,942 mentioned like this is like so important for me, like this is 231 00:13:36,001 --> 00:13:40,892 literally like a book for me, um , and so you know I, I use that, 232 00:13:40,892 --> 00:13:43,183 but I use that excuse a lot I don't have time, I don't have 233 00:13:43,203 --> 00:13:45,168 time, I don't have time. 234 00:13:45,168 --> 00:13:49,142 I got CHRO, I got to do this stuff, I got three kids, I got 235 00:13:49,182 --> 00:13:53,431 all these things going on and trying to find five minutes to 236 00:13:53,471 --> 00:13:56,480 meditate, 20 minutes to meditate no way, right. 237 00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:57,842 But the reality is it's so. 238 00:13:57,842 --> 00:14:01,972 Much of this is about, you know , it's about prioritizing what 239 00:14:02,100 --> 00:14:05,910 actually matters and being aware of these patterns and habits. 240 00:14:05,910 --> 00:14:09,326 But I want to talk about the term that you used, because I 241 00:14:09,768 --> 00:14:12,433 like this term, this term time poverty. 242 00:14:12,433 --> 00:14:16,076 So what is time poverty and why do so many of us struggle with 243 00:14:16,135 --> 00:14:16,176 it? 244 00:14:17,821 --> 00:14:20,586 Speaker 1: You know, I mean, normally, when we think about 245 00:14:20,686 --> 00:14:25,072 poverty, we think about, you know, lack of resources, you 246 00:14:25,113 --> 00:14:26,235 know, lack of wealth. 247 00:14:26,235 --> 00:14:33,311 But time is something that we all, 95% of people don't believe 248 00:14:33,311 --> 00:14:36,375 they have enough time in their day to get done what they want 249 00:14:36,395 --> 00:14:37,037 to get done. 250 00:14:37,037 --> 00:14:39,288 So that's a problem. 251 00:14:39,288 --> 00:14:43,807 And so, you know, just acknowledging that we're all in 252 00:14:43,868 --> 00:14:48,600 a state of time, poverty, we don't have enough time, and that 253 00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:53,091 busyness is a catalyst, because busyness, we're in a hustle 254 00:14:53,130 --> 00:14:53,972 society. 255 00:14:53,972 --> 00:14:57,205 You know, every time we get something down like that, a hit 256 00:14:57,245 --> 00:14:58,447 of adrenaline. 257 00:14:58,447 --> 00:15:01,793 You know, that doctor is so busy I can't see him for six 258 00:15:01,933 --> 00:15:02,254 months. 259 00:15:02,254 --> 00:15:03,364 He must be good. 260 00:15:03,845 --> 00:15:07,336 All of this mentality is like hustle, hustle, hustle. 261 00:15:07,336 --> 00:15:09,221 The more you hustle, the better you do. 262 00:15:09,221 --> 00:15:14,511 You know, and all the statistics show that it's not 263 00:15:14,552 --> 00:15:19,245 about the hustle, it's about focus and concentration, and so 264 00:15:19,485 --> 00:15:25,634 it's a very, it's a huge shift in our paradigm for people. 265 00:15:25,634 --> 00:15:27,503 I mean, we all love social media. 266 00:15:27,503 --> 00:15:28,485 It's so much fun. 267 00:15:28,485 --> 00:15:31,292 Go on social media, see what your friends are doing. 268 00:15:31,292 --> 00:15:34,591 Gosh, I looked last this morning and one of my best 269 00:15:34,692 --> 00:15:37,481 friends went to a bowling party and I started scrolling. 270 00:15:37,481 --> 00:15:40,067 It's like, oh my God, look who's there. 271 00:15:40,067 --> 00:15:42,883 And then, before I knew it, I'm like nope, this is a low value 272 00:15:42,984 --> 00:15:45,791 activity, this is not what I need to be doing today. 273 00:15:45,791 --> 00:15:52,030 Done, and it really becomes a discipline and it becomes a 274 00:15:52,091 --> 00:15:52,852 practice. 275 00:15:52,852 --> 00:15:58,063 And you know, that's why I do so many workshops with so many 276 00:15:58,144 --> 00:16:02,714 managers, so that it can, you know, they can learn how to do 277 00:16:02,833 --> 00:16:02,894 it. 278 00:16:02,894 --> 00:16:08,542 They all of a sudden see how well it's working and then they 279 00:16:08,702 --> 00:16:14,379 kind of really try to promote it within their teams and their 280 00:16:14,399 --> 00:16:19,631 groups, because what happens is productivity goes up all of a 281 00:16:19,711 --> 00:16:20,052 sudden. 282 00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:24,149 I mean, I tell this story about this guy I used to work with at 283 00:16:24,190 --> 00:16:25,592 Blue Cross and Blue Shield. 284 00:16:25,592 --> 00:16:29,741 His name was Randy and he was the biggest go-getter of all and 285 00:16:29,741 --> 00:16:35,442 he was CMO and he was always being promoted and he had this 286 00:16:35,583 --> 00:16:39,711 great, big, huge opportunity, so psyched to do it, going to 287 00:16:39,750 --> 00:16:43,881 definitely get it done, and time got away from him and he 288 00:16:43,902 --> 00:16:47,894 realized he had a deadline, so he pulled everybody in his, in 289 00:16:47,934 --> 00:16:50,923 his group, into a conference room and said we're gonna work 290 00:16:50,962 --> 00:16:52,427 until we get this sucker done. 291 00:16:52,427 --> 00:16:57,260 And it was the middle of winter in buffalo, new york, and about 292 00:16:57,260 --> 00:17:00,823 two hours later there's a knock on the door saying there's a 293 00:17:00,884 --> 00:17:01,825 snowstorm. 294 00:17:01,825 --> 00:17:06,126 You cannot see two inches in front of you there's a driving 295 00:17:06,186 --> 00:17:09,288 ban and Randy's like this is great, we're going to get this 296 00:17:09,349 --> 00:17:11,530 done, I'm so excited. 297 00:17:11,530 --> 00:17:15,433 But then he looked around the room and he realized how worried 298 00:17:15,433 --> 00:17:18,955 and exhausted his team was, and then he started to think about 299 00:17:19,076 --> 00:17:26,260 how important human connection was and he had this aha moment 300 00:17:26,320 --> 00:17:28,084 that we're not going to work on this project, we're just going 301 00:17:28,104 --> 00:17:29,246 to connect as human beings. 302 00:17:29,246 --> 00:17:32,531 I'm going to learn more about these people that are sitting 303 00:17:32,592 --> 00:17:33,534 across the table. 304 00:17:33,534 --> 00:17:37,595 So they all went around and they laughed and they cried and 305 00:17:37,634 --> 00:17:41,497 they told jokes and they hugged and, lo and behold, his 306 00:17:41,537 --> 00:17:47,137 departmental performance went up 11% in 31 days. 307 00:17:47,137 --> 00:17:51,106 11% their performance metrics. 308 00:17:51,106 --> 00:17:55,125 So you know, the metrics don't lie, the metrics tell the truth. 309 00:17:55,125 --> 00:17:59,030 And once you give it a whirl, you try, you see how the metrics 310 00:17:59,030 --> 00:17:59,351 work. 311 00:17:59,351 --> 00:18:02,173 It's like this makes sense. 312 00:18:02,334 --> 00:18:06,224 And I'm not a rocket scientist, I'm not the smartest of smart 313 00:18:06,325 --> 00:18:11,560 people, but for me, I need process, I need to like when I'm 314 00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:14,606 in the thick of it, I'm like okay, what can I eliminate? 315 00:18:14,606 --> 00:18:18,843 What happiness thing can I do right here, right now? 316 00:18:18,843 --> 00:18:24,604 You know, I just gave my first 10X and I got nervous and then I 317 00:18:24,604 --> 00:18:26,569 went right before I got up on scale. 318 00:18:26,569 --> 00:18:27,241 I was. 319 00:18:27,241 --> 00:18:28,686 I was crazy nervous. 320 00:18:28,686 --> 00:18:34,363 I got so nervous I I forgot my words and I freaked out and I 321 00:18:34,403 --> 00:18:37,367 thought to myself I gotta do something really fun right here, 322 00:18:37,367 --> 00:18:39,145 right now, get out of my own head. 323 00:18:39,145 --> 00:18:41,359 So I did a handstand. 324 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:42,846 I love doing handstands. 325 00:18:42,846 --> 00:18:44,306 I love being upside down. 326 00:18:44,306 --> 00:18:45,665 I did a handstand. 327 00:18:45,665 --> 00:18:48,757 People are looking at me like what the heck is this woman 328 00:18:48,817 --> 00:18:49,240 doing? 329 00:18:50,284 --> 00:18:51,648 I get a morphine rush. 330 00:18:51,648 --> 00:18:53,425 All the nerves are gone. 331 00:18:53,425 --> 00:18:55,768 I walk up on stage and I have fun. 332 00:18:58,786 --> 00:18:59,146 Speaker 2: I love it. 333 00:18:59,146 --> 00:19:03,685 Side note disclaimer to the podcast audience if you're not 334 00:19:03,766 --> 00:19:06,891 comfortable doing handstands, I don't recommend you do that on a 335 00:19:06,891 --> 00:19:23,500 regular basis, but Peggy is qualified evidently to me that 336 00:19:23,520 --> 00:19:24,806 we get into this hustle and bustle and you see these, you 337 00:19:24,826 --> 00:19:25,548 know like, you use social media. 338 00:19:25,548 --> 00:19:26,973 So it's a great example of this , right Like, you see these 339 00:19:27,114 --> 00:19:30,346 influencers and everybody looks like they're just going a 340 00:19:30,426 --> 00:19:33,417 million miles an hour and everybody's doing all these 341 00:19:33,459 --> 00:19:36,003 amazing things. 342 00:19:36,003 --> 00:19:39,950 But you get sucked in this trap of thinking that you have to be 343 00:19:39,950 --> 00:19:46,166 constantly on and running full, full speed and you forget to do 344 00:19:46,166 --> 00:19:48,791 the things that really matter to you. 345 00:19:48,791 --> 00:19:51,965 Right Like, connect with you, know you're, you're the people 346 00:19:51,986 --> 00:19:56,279 that you care about in your life , or you know, or, or protect 347 00:19:56,380 --> 00:20:00,307 your, your, your energy, or take care of yourself, or you know, 348 00:20:00,648 --> 00:20:04,643 go to the gym or have five minutes of peace and quiet, and 349 00:20:05,605 --> 00:20:09,953 so I think it's such a valuable framework and so easy for us to 350 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:12,241 lose sight of. 351 00:20:12,241 --> 00:20:16,185 So you know, the statistics are startling. 352 00:20:16,185 --> 00:20:19,750 I mean, you know, what I heard is we're struggling. 353 00:20:19,750 --> 00:20:29,846 We are struggling as a society, as employees, and I also like. 354 00:20:29,846 --> 00:20:34,884 For me, this just makes perfect logical sense, and I've gone 355 00:20:34,903 --> 00:20:38,269 through a lot in my personal life, kind of an awakening that, 356 00:20:38,269 --> 00:20:41,634 hey, this busyness isn't the right thing for me. 357 00:20:41,634 --> 00:20:47,188 All the time it ruined my personal relationships and I was 358 00:20:47,188 --> 00:20:50,433 lonely as I could possibly be. 359 00:20:53,501 --> 00:20:58,349 And I'm curious what recommendations would you have 360 00:20:58,390 --> 00:21:01,154 for us who are in an HR profession? 361 00:21:01,154 --> 00:21:08,702 Our job is to help our companies and I think what I'm 362 00:21:08,722 --> 00:21:12,130 struggling with is I can't go to my company and be like 363 00:21:12,349 --> 00:21:13,894 everybody's got to stop working too much. 364 00:21:13,894 --> 00:21:18,888 We have, since the beginning of our careers, we've been coached 365 00:21:18,888 --> 00:21:19,671 to stay productive. 366 00:21:19,671 --> 00:21:22,846 You've got to stay focused all the time. 367 00:21:22,846 --> 00:21:24,641 Every minute's got to be accounted for, you know. 368 00:21:24,641 --> 00:21:26,587 You got to make sure that people are people. 369 00:21:26,587 --> 00:21:30,435 But what you're saying is essentially that that's not 370 00:21:30,537 --> 00:21:30,778 right. 371 00:21:30,778 --> 00:21:35,469 Right, that being too busy or being, you know, being so 372 00:21:35,548 --> 00:21:38,662 focused on filling the time actually makes us less 373 00:21:39,265 --> 00:21:39,907 productive. 374 00:21:39,907 --> 00:21:42,047 So what advice do you have for us that are? 375 00:21:42,047 --> 00:21:45,163 Maybe we understand this topic, it makes sense to us, but we've 376 00:21:45,163 --> 00:21:48,295 got to like convince others to be thinking in these terms. 377 00:21:48,295 --> 00:21:48,900 What would you tell us? 378 00:21:50,204 --> 00:21:54,200 Speaker 1: What I love to do is I love to walk into a company 379 00:21:54,319 --> 00:21:58,326 and say take this busy barometer , find out what your employees 380 00:21:58,425 --> 00:21:58,907 are doing. 381 00:21:58,907 --> 00:22:01,885 What's the corporate culture, what are your low value 382 00:22:02,026 --> 00:22:02,669 activities? 383 00:22:02,669 --> 00:22:06,630 Let's run a workshop and let's eliminate those, a couple of 384 00:22:06,690 --> 00:22:06,971 things. 385 00:22:06,971 --> 00:22:11,990 And hey, you know, by the way, can we throw in a little bit 386 00:22:12,009 --> 00:22:15,827 about happiness, rituals and what I call values vibing? 387 00:22:15,827 --> 00:22:19,340 And they always say yes, so I go in there and we do this, and 388 00:22:19,362 --> 00:22:22,740 then I'm like at the end okay, so how do you measure success 389 00:22:22,821 --> 00:22:23,061 here? 390 00:22:23,061 --> 00:22:25,827 You know, in your department, what are your metrics? 391 00:22:25,827 --> 00:22:29,984 And we'll share the metrics and then I'll go back in a month or 392 00:22:29,984 --> 00:22:32,230 two and say, okay, how do your metrics look? 393 00:22:32,230 --> 00:22:34,161 And they'll be like crap. 394 00:22:34,161 --> 00:22:36,202 My metrics have improved. 395 00:22:36,584 --> 00:22:38,786 I'm like statistics don't lie. 396 00:22:38,786 --> 00:22:43,191 So you know, if people will just give me a little bit of 397 00:22:43,311 --> 00:22:48,742 time and kind of try something a little out there, and oh, by 398 00:22:48,803 --> 00:22:50,970 the way, we're going to have a ton of fun. 399 00:22:50,970 --> 00:22:56,778 Everybody in that room is going to be laughing and enjoying 400 00:22:56,877 --> 00:23:03,050 themselves and the paradigm of work and play and fun, it's just 401 00:23:03,050 --> 00:23:03,311 all. 402 00:23:03,311 --> 00:23:05,962 The boundaries are going to be crossed because this is your 403 00:23:06,002 --> 00:23:09,631 life and you're going to spend eight, nine, ten hours. 404 00:23:09,631 --> 00:23:13,585 You're going to be having fun and you'd better enjoy it, um. 405 00:23:13,585 --> 00:23:19,153 So I always say to people take the busy barometer. 406 00:23:19,153 --> 00:23:24,474 Um, and I give it to people free, but I don't give them all 407 00:23:24,494 --> 00:23:27,288 the answers on how to eliminate their busyness. 408 00:23:27,288 --> 00:23:31,806 But you know it starts with data and once you see that you 409 00:23:31,926 --> 00:23:36,045 are not, you are like everybody else and you know I go into 410 00:23:36,105 --> 00:23:39,623 corporations some of the improvement stats, they're 411 00:23:39,682 --> 00:23:43,702 startling, they're really startling, yeah. 412 00:23:44,463 --> 00:23:47,970 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I think it's. 413 00:23:47,970 --> 00:23:51,919 I know you used the term addiction earlier. 414 00:23:51,919 --> 00:23:55,190 It's almost a disease. 415 00:23:55,873 --> 00:24:03,269 As I see it, what I've observed, certainly and I've worked in 416 00:24:03,289 --> 00:24:08,979 the Fortune 500 organization actually a very similar kind of 417 00:24:09,338 --> 00:24:14,608 story to yours, organizations, similar, actually, very similar 418 00:24:14,628 --> 00:24:15,794 kind of story to yours, um, but, um, you know, you see these 419 00:24:15,874 --> 00:24:17,138 people and they it's almost, they almost look sick, right, 420 00:24:17,159 --> 00:24:19,207 they're, they're, they're sick with worry, they're, they're 421 00:24:19,287 --> 00:24:23,641 sick with, like, like, staying focused, like as an hr person, I 422 00:24:23,641 --> 00:24:28,734 I can, honestly, the minute I walk into a room, usually people 423 00:24:28,734 --> 00:24:32,184 who are, like, struggling with this get really nervous because 424 00:24:32,265 --> 00:24:35,152 they think I'm there to like audit how busy they are or audit 425 00:24:35,152 --> 00:24:39,269 productivity or judge them for how hard they appear to be 426 00:24:39,328 --> 00:24:39,829 working. 427 00:24:39,829 --> 00:24:43,155 But it's not really, it's like it's not helpful. 428 00:24:43,155 --> 00:24:51,130 And I you know my personal opinion and experience is as an 429 00:24:51,289 --> 00:24:55,272 HR professional or a senior leader in general to get people 430 00:24:55,313 --> 00:25:00,096 to slow down a little bit can actually help them make 431 00:25:00,577 --> 00:25:06,362 significantly better decisions and just get them to relax a 432 00:25:06,402 --> 00:25:09,712 little bit, like, hey, let's think about it. 433 00:25:09,712 --> 00:25:10,556 I love humor. 434 00:25:10,825 --> 00:25:14,053 Speaker 1: I love to tell funny little stories to people, make 435 00:25:14,073 --> 00:25:14,674 them laugh. 436 00:25:14,955 --> 00:25:15,396 Speaker 2: I love that. 437 00:25:16,288 --> 00:25:18,140 Speaker 1: And kind of illustrate the point. 438 00:25:18,140 --> 00:25:21,315 I mean, I had a wake-up call one time. 439 00:25:21,315 --> 00:25:24,859 You know, I was working for a healthcare company in the 440 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:29,626 Medicare field and they had changed a lot of regulations and 441 00:25:29,626 --> 00:25:33,007 I needed to redo absolutely everything I've been working on 442 00:25:33,147 --> 00:25:35,634 for the last 30 days and get it done in two weeks. 443 00:25:35,634 --> 00:25:37,866 So it was like holy cow. 444 00:25:37,866 --> 00:25:41,298 This is a really hard, hard, hard thing, right? 445 00:25:41,298 --> 00:25:43,103 So I'm working all the time. 446 00:25:43,103 --> 00:25:44,346 I'm a single mother. 447 00:25:44,346 --> 00:25:47,391 I come home from work and I am ravenous. 448 00:25:47,391 --> 00:25:48,772 I haven't eaten. 449 00:25:48,772 --> 00:25:52,480 So I go into the cupboard and find anything to eat and I find 450 00:25:52,525 --> 00:25:57,234 this stale bag of pistachio nuts and I chop them down and I feel 451 00:25:57,234 --> 00:26:01,470 this pulling on my leg and I look down as my cat dazzles, 452 00:26:01,509 --> 00:26:04,596 saying I haven't eaten in a couple hours either. 453 00:26:04,596 --> 00:26:08,855 So I throw him some kibbles and I go lie on the couch and I 454 00:26:08,895 --> 00:26:13,412 wake up and I hear this cat noise and I look up and it's my 455 00:26:13,512 --> 00:26:16,409 cat throwing up pistachio nuts. 456 00:26:16,409 --> 00:26:19,711 And I look down and I realize I just ate cat food for dinner. 457 00:26:20,385 --> 00:26:22,192 Speaker 2: Oh no, I didn't even realize that. 458 00:26:22,753 --> 00:26:28,367 Speaker 1: Oh, you know it's crazy the things that we do, 459 00:26:28,769 --> 00:26:32,054 because we're in this rainfall, this mindless haze. 460 00:26:32,054 --> 00:26:34,693 I mean, how many times have you forgotten where your car is? 461 00:26:34,693 --> 00:26:38,473 How many times have you forgotten where your glasses are 462 00:26:38,473 --> 00:26:39,616 , where your keys are? 463 00:26:39,616 --> 00:26:43,330 I lose my keys all the time and it's just a reminder that 464 00:26:43,351 --> 00:26:44,474 you're not focused. 465 00:26:44,474 --> 00:26:46,023 You know you need to be focused . 466 00:26:46,023 --> 00:26:51,596 So I think people need to begin to not feel shame and guilt 467 00:26:51,796 --> 00:26:55,449 about their busyness because, hey, it's a hustle society, it's 468 00:26:55,449 --> 00:26:56,270 what we're taught. 469 00:26:56,751 --> 00:27:02,711 Busyness is good, it's a status symbol, and really what we need 470 00:27:02,791 --> 00:27:03,654 is the tools. 471 00:27:03,654 --> 00:27:08,066 And your busyness is probably different than somebody else's 472 00:27:08,146 --> 00:27:12,017 busyness and that's why there isn't a one size fits all. 473 00:27:12,017 --> 00:27:17,034 That's why I really believe we roll up our sleeves and we find 474 00:27:17,194 --> 00:27:21,268 out what you're over the top busy on, make you aware of it, 475 00:27:21,347 --> 00:27:26,597 and then one micro step, one tiny little change, like my 476 00:27:26,657 --> 00:27:28,626 friend did with 15 minutes. 477 00:27:28,626 --> 00:27:32,336 She had no time for self-care and then you know, at the end of 478 00:27:32,336 --> 00:27:36,325 four months she's spending 45 minutes a day on herself, which 479 00:27:36,486 --> 00:27:39,271 was like unimaginable to her. 480 00:27:39,271 --> 00:27:43,634 But she's healthier, she's happier, and then she's like 481 00:27:43,736 --> 00:27:44,159 okay. 482 00:27:44,159 --> 00:27:47,365 Well, you know, she did that about six months ago and she's 483 00:27:47,385 --> 00:27:50,555 like okay, now I'm going to go for an hour a day for me, and 484 00:27:50,575 --> 00:27:51,425 what are we gonna do? 485 00:27:51,425 --> 00:27:53,590 Fun with that extra 15 minutes. 486 00:27:53,590 --> 00:27:57,259 And you start to see how magical it is and you're like 487 00:27:57,846 --> 00:28:01,773 this, this stuff, it's like fairy dust, it's like magic dust 488 00:28:01,773 --> 00:28:01,773 . 489 00:28:01,894 --> 00:28:04,904 Speaker 2: It just you'll do it, it works, and then you'll do it 490 00:28:04,904 --> 00:28:10,429 again absolutely, and I think you know, I, I, you know, I I've 491 00:28:10,429 --> 00:28:12,309 had, I haven't eaten cat food. 492 00:28:12,309 --> 00:28:13,671 I'm going to put that out there . 493 00:28:13,671 --> 00:28:17,212 That's thankfully, but I don't have cats, so I haven't had the 494 00:28:17,272 --> 00:28:18,232 opportunity to eat cat. 495 00:28:18,232 --> 00:28:35,467 Of the more humanistic jobs, like we're paid to think and 496 00:28:35,487 --> 00:28:38,915 we're paid to help people, and if we aren't helping ourselves 497 00:28:38,976 --> 00:28:42,130 and we're not like having good decision-making capability, 498 00:28:42,171 --> 00:28:47,989 we're not taking care of, like our ability to connect, reflect, 499 00:28:47,989 --> 00:28:49,472 you know, have a little bit of fun. 500 00:28:49,472 --> 00:28:52,607 Oh my gosh, how dare us, you know, how dare we talk about 501 00:28:52,648 --> 00:28:55,194 having fun at work, like, like, what are we doing? 502 00:28:55,194 --> 00:28:55,916 You know what I mean. 503 00:28:55,916 --> 00:28:58,190 Like, like, like, what would you say you do here? 504 00:28:58,190 --> 00:29:02,365 Yeah, and, and so I, just, I, I love the, I, I love the 505 00:29:02,425 --> 00:29:06,332 framework, I love the, I love that you put this into tools and 506 00:29:06,332 --> 00:29:08,955 that it's not overwhelming, right, you know? 507 00:29:08,955 --> 00:29:11,400 Because, to go back to our conversation on time poverty, 508 00:29:11,684 --> 00:29:15,030 what you're really talking about just carving out a little bit, 509 00:29:15,271 --> 00:29:19,728 right, and starting to change habits, and that's really where, 510 00:29:19,728 --> 00:29:22,509 like all the research, that's where the change actually 511 00:29:22,549 --> 00:29:25,393 happens, right, it's these little kind of micro things that 512 00:29:25,393 --> 00:29:29,644 we do that eventually add up to a big change over time, right? 513 00:29:29,644 --> 00:29:35,178 And so one last call again to the listeners there. 514 00:29:35,265 --> 00:29:36,730 The book is available now. 515 00:29:36,730 --> 00:29:40,815 Go out, click into the podcast show notes. 516 00:29:40,815 --> 00:29:45,195 The book again is Beyond Busyness how to Achieve More by 517 00:29:45,236 --> 00:29:45,696 Doing Less. 518 00:29:45,696 --> 00:29:49,652 With that, we're going to shift into the Rebel HR flash round. 519 00:29:49,652 --> 00:29:50,053 Are you ready? 520 00:29:52,076 --> 00:29:52,416 Speaker 1: Got it. 521 00:29:53,157 --> 00:29:53,880 Speaker 2: All right, perfect. 522 00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:56,891 Question number one when do we need to rebel? 523 00:29:59,726 --> 00:30:02,836 Speaker 1: Oh, I color outside the lines all the time. 524 00:30:02,836 --> 00:30:10,732 I think it's just really a fun thing to do, so I rebel in any 525 00:30:10,772 --> 00:30:12,836 way that feels comfortable for me. 526 00:30:12,836 --> 00:30:15,186 You know I'll eat ice cream for dinner. 527 00:30:15,186 --> 00:30:19,516 You know I'll be the one who stops drinking for three years. 528 00:30:19,516 --> 00:30:23,092 I, I, I just like doing new and different things and seeing how 529 00:30:23,092 --> 00:30:23,775 they feel. 530 00:30:23,775 --> 00:30:28,288 So you know, to me, coloring outside the lines is what makes 531 00:30:28,630 --> 00:30:31,817 my blood boil, which is a good thing. 532 00:30:33,786 --> 00:30:34,650 Speaker 2: Well, I love it. 533 00:30:34,650 --> 00:30:35,353 I'm the same way. 534 00:30:35,353 --> 00:30:37,112 I'm like every once in a while I just get bored. 535 00:30:37,112 --> 00:30:39,534 I'm like I'm just going to try this weird random diet. 536 00:30:39,534 --> 00:30:40,851 Like I went vegetarian for a year. 537 00:30:40,851 --> 00:30:43,472 I'm like I'm just going to see if I can do it and see what it 538 00:30:43,513 --> 00:30:46,608 does, and then I stopped because I'm like okay, I'm bored with 539 00:30:46,628 --> 00:30:46,929 this now. 540 00:30:46,929 --> 00:30:51,678 So I think we're wired similarly in that regard. 541 00:30:55,224 --> 00:30:59,984 Speaker 1: Question number two who should we be listening to? 542 00:30:59,984 --> 00:31:08,049 Well, I'm a big Mel Robbins fan , and she said a couple of 543 00:31:08,089 --> 00:31:09,333 things over the years that have stuck with me. 544 00:31:09,333 --> 00:31:11,378 And one of the things that she says is nobody's coming here to 545 00:31:11,519 --> 00:31:14,291 save you, you need to save yourself. 546 00:31:14,291 --> 00:31:19,126 And she said something on the Maria Shriver podcast I think it 547 00:31:19,126 --> 00:31:24,648 was two weeks ago that resonated with me so much and it 548 00:31:24,648 --> 00:31:29,130 was like I'm finally letting myself feel a sense of pride. 549 00:31:29,130 --> 00:31:32,594 I'm thinking to myself you're freaking, mel Robbins. 550 00:31:32,594 --> 00:31:33,816 What You're not proud. 551 00:31:33,816 --> 00:31:37,361 I mean, like you've been on Oprah, you've done all these. 552 00:31:37,361 --> 00:31:38,665 How can you? 553 00:31:38,665 --> 00:31:43,314 And it just made me realize that you know, the self-sabotage 554 00:31:43,314 --> 00:31:46,640 that we all do to ourselves is exactly that. 555 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:51,851 So I'm a big Mel Robbins fan and oh yeah, by the way, she 556 00:31:51,931 --> 00:31:52,894 endorsed my book. 557 00:31:52,894 --> 00:31:56,856 I was the person that ran out in the middle of the street 558 00:31:57,017 --> 00:31:59,244 literally when I got her endorsement. 559 00:31:59,244 --> 00:32:01,489 It was like at one in the morning. 560 00:32:01,489 --> 00:32:06,078 And I'm like Mel, my blank Robbins, just endorsed my book. 561 00:32:07,488 --> 00:32:10,338 And like somebody turns on the lights and comes outside like 562 00:32:10,459 --> 00:32:11,542 what the heck is going on? 563 00:32:11,542 --> 00:32:14,569 And something on fire and I'm like, oh no, no. 564 00:32:14,569 --> 00:32:17,696 Mel robbins just endorsed my book I love it. 565 00:32:18,258 --> 00:32:20,109 Speaker 2: I love it, yeah, and I, I'm a, I also. 566 00:32:20,109 --> 00:32:23,923 I follow mel robbins as well and just absolutely, you know 567 00:32:23,963 --> 00:32:26,515 wonderful content, yeah, and it's great, great point like, 568 00:32:26,555 --> 00:32:29,507 yeah, if mel robbins struggles with imposter syndrome from time 569 00:32:29,507 --> 00:32:34,490 to time or feeling accomplished , then my gosh, what a little 570 00:32:34,550 --> 00:32:36,757 old me you know doing. 571 00:32:36,757 --> 00:32:41,259 But I think, yeah, and congratulations, by the way, on 572 00:32:41,279 --> 00:32:43,269 that endorsement, that's amazing . 573 00:32:43,269 --> 00:32:49,924 And yeah, just really appreciate the time that you 574 00:32:49,944 --> 00:32:52,353 spent with us here, peggy, and appreciate you putting this 575 00:32:52,393 --> 00:32:53,256 content out there. 576 00:32:53,256 --> 00:32:56,410 Last question how can our listeners get their hands on the 577 00:32:56,410 --> 00:33:00,417 book and how can they connect with you to learn more about the 578 00:33:00,417 --> 00:33:00,939 work that you do? 579 00:33:02,365 --> 00:33:05,151 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean they can connect with me on LinkedIn or 580 00:33:05,192 --> 00:33:09,599 go right to my website, peggysullivanspeakercom. 581 00:33:09,599 --> 00:33:13,476 I love meeting new people, I love helping people, I love 582 00:33:13,565 --> 00:33:17,737 shifting the paradigm and making people look good. 583 00:33:17,737 --> 00:33:21,406 So if you give me a chance, I think you'll find that together 584 00:33:21,507 --> 00:33:23,570 we could do pretty amazing things. 585 00:33:23,570 --> 00:33:25,394 And it's about we. 586 00:33:25,394 --> 00:33:26,897 It's not the power of me. 587 00:33:26,897 --> 00:33:30,894 It's about igniting the possibility within ourselves, 588 00:33:31,055 --> 00:33:32,987 our teams, everybody around us. 589 00:33:34,670 --> 00:33:35,191 Speaker 2: Absolutely. 590 00:33:35,191 --> 00:33:37,294 Couldn't agree more. 591 00:33:37,294 --> 00:33:39,858 Open up your podcast players. 592 00:33:39,858 --> 00:33:41,949 We will have all of those links in the show notes. 593 00:33:41,949 --> 00:33:46,057 Get your hands on the book and connect with Peggy Peggy. 594 00:33:46,057 --> 00:33:50,714 Thank you so much for joining me here today and thank you for 595 00:33:51,317 --> 00:33:51,857 the work that you do. 596 00:33:52,464 --> 00:33:53,811 Speaker 1: You are quite welcome . 597 00:33:55,826 --> 00:33:59,036 Speaker 2: All right, that does it for the Rebel HR podcast. 598 00:33:59,036 --> 00:34:01,011 Big thank you to our guests. 599 00:34:01,011 --> 00:34:06,373 Follow us on Facebook at Rebel HR podcast, twitter at Rebel HR 600 00:34:06,413 --> 00:34:11,059 guy, or see our website at RebelHumanResourcescom at 601 00:34:11,079 --> 00:34:13,264 RebelHRGuy, or see our website at RebelHumanResourcescom. 602 00:34:13,264 --> 00:34:15,708 The views and opinions expressed by Rebel HR Podcast 603 00:34:15,728 --> 00:34:17,132 are those of the authors and do not necessarily reflect the 604 00:34:17,152 --> 00:34:19,597 official policy or position of any of the organizations that we 605 00:34:19,597 --> 00:34:19,998 represent. 606 00:34:19,998 --> 00:34:23,572 No animals were harmed during the filming of this podcast. 607 00:34:25,536 --> 00:34:25,858 Speaker 1: Baby.