176: Klute (1971) | The Parallax View (1974) | All the President’s Men (1976)

Alex and Nick end season 1 of the WAYW New Hollywood Film Project with Alan J. Pakula's Paranoid Thriller Trilogy. KLUTE, THE PARALLAX VIEW, and ALL THE PRESIDENT’S MEN are three of the best New Hollywood films.

The guys break down each film, Pakula’s career, Gordon Willis’ astonishing work as a cinematographer, the current state of journalism, Watergate, “Deep Throat,” JFK, sex work, and so much more.

Part 10 of the WAYW New Hollywood Film Project.

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Transcript

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Hey, everyone, welcome to. What are you watching? I'm Alex Withrow and I'm joined by my best man, Nick Doerr. So how are you doing there, John Klute? Woo woo, I get it, I wasn't you weren't expecting a nice one. Yeah, I was going to get it. Yep, yep, I know it. Well, you know what I was going to say? You know, we could just, you know, do it all and, fuck it. I like to get business out of the way first, though. I like to do that up front. This is. Wow. This is going to be a really, really fun episode. Welcome back to the. W-why w New Hollywood film project. This is, you know, kind of. We're not doing seasons, but this is kind of a season one ender. This is officially episode ten of the project we started. We did a soft launch with The French Connection, and then this series was kind of born out of that. Like after we recorded that part, we just sat there and brainstormed and our favorite hotel in Los Angeles for a couple hours came up with this concept. I kind of carved out the movies topic. So because we did 1971 French Connection, Soft Open, we're like, all right, let's end with 1971. And we kind of agreed on Klute. We even talked about it in one of the episodes ages ago. And then I had the idea, why not do this kind of really cool, infamous 70s trilogy. The Alan J. Pakula paranoid thriller trilogy comprised of Klute, The Parallax View and All the President's Men. And you said, let's go. How do you feel, dude, these are these are fantastic. Well, one, these are all movies that I think represent what our main goal was with the 1970s project series. So. And, and two of them of I hadn't seen. So. Yeah. So this was but you know, here's the thing, though. Chances are, if Alex Withrow was telling you that something is good, just watch it, everybody. Wow. And oh, wow. Listen to this, folks. Listen, I'm going to cut a trailer a five and a half years in the making, a minute long trailer and that's all you need to hear, folks. Boom. I mean, now I have to qualify all my movie recommendations to my dad. I have to go, like, it's not like a weird one because you like, I recommend so much weird stuff. And, you know, like, you wanted to see Begonia really bad, and I'm like, yeah, it's Yorgos, but it's not Dogtooth like the man loves Yorgos. I gave him Dogtooth for Father's Day. He did not really like it, you know, he did it once, a no. So now it just sits there on the shelf and I'm like, you give it back. You all anyway. Sorry. Yes. It's all just listen to by Rex those folks, you know. But yeah, I'm so glad you liked these because I know you hadn't seen two of them. Yeah, exactly. And I also figured, like, there was probably more of, like, a method to the madness here in terms of, like, all right, trying to put these three together. And funny enough, I just thought it was a paranoid 70s trilogy. I didn't realize that it was all the same director as well. Yeah. So yeah, come to my surprise, I'm watching the opening credits of Klute and I'm like, oh, it's another, Pakula movie. And I was like, oh, that's really cool. So that's a nice little. I was like a little double. And then we get to get the parallax view in there, and then I'm watching the parallax View, and then you should have. I wish there was a camera on my face to do that. I go, I'm a fucking idiot. Like, there's like now it makes even more sense that we're not just doing a parent zine, not just a paranoid 70s thriller to wrap up our time with the 70s series, but it's all the same. Director yeah, I just, I, I literally had to pause the movie for a second just to sit there in my own, like, dumbfounded. This of just being like, this one really takes the cake for me. Yeah, I mean, I didn't tell you, but hey, it's okay. You got there on your own. We all have to, realize things in our own time, but yeah, like, they don't have anything in common in terms of characters, plot, anything like that. But the story's. They're linked by theme. Yeah, they're linked by same director. They're linked by musical score. They're linked by cinematography, by Gordon Willis. They genuinely changed the game. And this is I mean, he also did both godfathers. This decade was just the only thing like he's amazing. So they're linked by that. And you know talking about all of them at the same time. He's just going to be a lot of fun. It's a good way to explore the movies. I'm very, very excited to explore all of them. And I really I think I think you're, you're going to you're going to have a very, very good time with my, w a y w and the d h t. There it is. 76. Yeah. Hot. Take the hot take. A hot take. All right. Yeah. I mean we're going to talk about Pakula a little bit and then we'll talk about each movie. It's not going to be like quite the thorough breakdown that we do for some of these, because there'd be three movies and we'll be here for a long time. We're just going to talk about it and then, you know, see where it goes after we talk about each movie, you know, we'll get to the categories and all that, but I do did. So did you have any relationship with Bakula at all? Just all the President's Men. But okay. If you were to have asked me who directed that movie before jumping into this series, I wouldn't know who it was got. Yeah. Fair, fair. And that's I think that makes him a great choice to pick to cover him for in this series. And or just real quick, I'll go through his filmography. He actually started as a producer for director Robert Mulligan, and I guess peaking with an Oscar nomination for Best Picture for producing To Kill a mockingbird. So then he starts making movies, makes The Sterile Cuckoo, which was just kind of a batshit love story with Liza minnelli. That was first, then Klute, then another. The Sterile Cuckoo was written by Alvin Sargeant. Then he jumps again to another Alvin Sergeant romance. Listen to this title, Love and Pain and the whole damn thing. Not bad. Then there's Parallax View. Then all the president's men comes a horseman. Really good. Another Jane Fonda one starting over. Kind of a written by James L Brooks. Like a divorce comedy of sorts with Burt Reynolds, I liked it. Sophie's choice is probably his biggest. He directed Sophie's Choice. A lot of people have seen that. But again, I don't know if a lot of people associate like, yeah, that's an Allen J movie. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it does. Some others I'm just going to do the big One's Presumed Innocent with Harrison Ford. I love that movie. The Pelican Brief is another big one. And then The Devil's Own with Brad Pitt. Harrison Ford, that's his last movie, but he's a director who also, I think his career hit this peak in the 70s, which is like a lot of the directors were covering. And the template for these thriller movies have influenced so many of our favorite directors. Soderbergh, like Soderbergh always. That's how I found out about Pakula, because Soderbergh, like, dedicates the majority of his career and his work as a cinematographer to these films. So he's an important director, even if you don't know him by name. Yeah, absolutely. And then when you're like, it is kind of amazing that he is not a director that is known very well. Like I said, like how I would not have known who off the top of my head, who directed All the President's Men, which is probably the most acclaimed of all of these, I would say, of the three we're talking about, they were all the President's Men, and probably Sophie's Choice or Sophie's Choice was, you know, popular overall movies, well known at least. Exactly. And that's another one. Like if someone asked me who directed Sophie's Choice, I would have been like, because I've seen that movie a bunch of times, weirdly. And yeah, yeah, I don't know why I've seen that a lot. It's not that I, I mean, I think it's a good movie, but it's not like, oh, I love Sophie's Choice. I just happen to have seen it a lot. Kevin Kline fucking rocks in that movie. He's so good. He is. He is good. That's, Yeah, that's a just a tough sit. It's a it's a tough to see mold. I've only seen it once. It's a tough sit because, like, I think it's 2.5 hours in the first. Like it's it's pretty slow. Like, it's just, it's a really slow two hours. And then it ends with Sophie's Choice. Or it leads up to like that scene, which is, you know, one of the greatest, best acted scenes in history, you know, which is wild because the whole movie is not about that at all. That's what I mean. That's all it really isn't. That scene kind of comes out of it doesn't come out of nowhere like it's been looming in the back. Yeah, the time, but it's not necessary. The movie is not necessarily about that. That's one of the reasons why it's not really I don't know. For me, it's funny because it's, you know, you think if you've never seen the movie Sophie's Choice. Oh, it's all about a movie about a mother who has to choose between her sons to, you know, to die, basically, or to go with her. Yeah, son and daughter. But really, it's more of the love triangle that's going on. Yes. So, I mean, so it's a little bit of everything, but yeah, the whole movie that. Yeah, that's like the end scene, which is one of the most like well-acted scenes ever. But yeah. Interesting, interesting movie that for exactly that we're talking more with Bakula where it's like, why isn't this a director where it's more of a household name, considering everything that he meant to a certain era of this time? Because, I mean, if you have like all the other, presidents men, if you have all the other directors that have existed that made these names for themselves in the 70s, they all kind of stand out. You got Robert Altman, you got Francis Ford Coppola, you know? I mean, the list kind of goes on of the ones that we've even talked about in the series. But yet this director kind of just falls under the radar. And although Pakula's movies won Oscars, yeah, he's just he's one of the ones. I even think John G. Alverson, who directed Rocky. Yeah, is not necessarily known by name unless you just really love Rocky and you know that name, but I don't know if people like I still tell people, hey, do you know the guy who directed Rocky? Also directed Every Karate Kid? And they're like, yeah. And so, you know, it's, it's kind of stuff like that, I don't know what. And he won Best Director, so who knows? Who knows who. Like punches through who gains icon status. But he still made three movies in the 70s that are on par just about with, you know, anyone. I mean, it's not like Coppola level where you make four masterpieces in one decade, but yeah, it's kind of close. It's a lower level. These movies are much smaller budget, and they still resonate deeply in our culture. And as much as they are kind of all to like the point of this episode of being this kind of paranoid thriller trilogy, they are all uniquely different. Like, these are all very, very different movies. But when you do had this same cinematographer and the this the score, you do see these comparisons. But like, man, these are wildly different in terms of tone and, character and all of this. So it's really, really cool to be able to dissect all of these. Oh yeah. Before we start with Klute, I do want to just hammer home the talent of cinematographer Gordon Willis. I'll go quickly through some of my favorites that he did The Landlord, which was Hal Ashby's first film, Klute, The Godfather, The Paper Chase, The Parallax View, Godfather two, All the President's Men, Annie Hall, Interiors Comes a Horseman, Manhattan Zelig did a ton more for Woody Allen, Presumed Innocent, Godfather three winner of Count Him Zero Academy Awards. Idiots. Depraved. Idiots. And that's another example of this guy did change cinematography. He really showed what you can do with little light. I mean, especially I think Godfather two is where he pushes it the most, where you just have key scenes where like, you know, Pacino is in shadow and they're really using as little light as possible when that was not the norm at all to do that. And he goes, you know, whatever, let's take lights out. Let's hold shots for a long time. Let's just have cinematography be like an active participant almost. And it feels like that. And that's a good entryway into Klute. Shot one. Recording device shot two. It's this happy dinner at home and you're like, oh, okay, what? What? And then, you know, it's this set up of, like, a nice dinner guest. Donald Sutherland's there. There's a husband and wife host they share, like this moment of silence, appreciation. When we cut to the male host chair, empty. And I mean, we're like, in second 60 going, what the. Where are we? What is this? I'm in. I fucking shot out of my chair, man. I'm not even sure. Oh, really? Y'all tell me. Let's get into it. Klute, 1971. So. All right, so all I got to start out this way. Started off. I've been thinking a lot about all these 1970s movies that we've covered in this project series, and there's a lot of them I have never seen before. I haven't defined it yet, but there's a very real possibility that Klute might be my favorite of all of them. Wow. I think it's I mean, that's got to be the hot take already. That's, that's that's a big one. I love hearing this, I love this, I am, borderline obsessed with this movie. I, I had no idea what it was, what I was getting myself into outside of the the name. Because, you know how I feel about things like this. The fact that his name is Klute because his name and, you know, and but the thing is, it's not even his movie, I don't think. I don't think it's his movie to even be called Klute. Absolutely agree. I guess they didn't think Bree Daniel was a good enough, you know, title, but it should be called Bree. Like, it's it's much more her movie than his. I just guess they thought Klute was a better title, even in the special features on The criterion. Like everyone says this. Yeah, like everyone involved with the movie. So I don't know. Klute is a good, strong name, but it ain't. It ain't about him. It's not about him. But yeah. And so I remember sat down, put it on and then. Yeah, exactly to your point, we're getting this master shot and, and I'm just marveling at it like this is truly something everyone wearing. Like you're watching a movie, you don't expect to be floored by what you are seeing purely by the cinematography at a dinner. And yet, I like literally just start it and and I'm like, wow, look at, look at this. And then we're, we're we're panning between the guests. There's no real discernible dialog that's going on that we really need to dinner chatter yeah, it's dinner chatter. But I'm looking at the faces and then you just start to kind of track like this relationship between the man at the table and the woman at the other end of the table heads to the table and, and I'm like, wow. They they're, they're they're speaking that unspoken love right there between them. And then all of a sudden that exactly that cut to the empty chair. I literally threw my hands up in the air and I got up. I paused it because I was like, I need to take a minute, like, I oh yes, I, I had to do a walk around and did a lap around my apartment. I'm like holding my head. I'm like, I and I'm like, if you mean to tell me that either going forward that this man is dead or he's just gone from the story in some sort of way, I'm like, this is crazy. And then without any explanation, we're seeing as in essentially the beginnings of an investigation going on to what could have happened to this man. And I go, he's fucking gone. He's fucking gone, baby. He's gone, baby, gone, and I am. I was like, what a like, you just don't get storytelling like this anymore. With no dialog, with no dialog, editing in shot construction and performance. But sight look, sure looking. And it does this in 60s. It's yelling. It's you're reconciling exist anymore and it doesn't. And it was also just beautiful looking like it was it was. Yeah. The craftsmanship, the composition, just the way everything was decorated, like you're just sort of like, oh, this. You get everything you need to know. Like these are some, you know, richer folks, who knows what kind of holiday it is? Maybe it's not. Maybe they're just, you know, just doing whatever, but it you could tell the level of importance that this class of people were and what was going on. And then. Yeah, and then you start to get the, the beginnings of what needs to happen. We're going to send out and figure this out, and he's his friend. And then you get the credits and and then you're you. Then you're like, what the hell is this all about now? Because now you're hearing some pretty provocative stuff going on here. Yeah, over the credits. The credits are a great tone setter, but yeah, we're basically set up with like the guy who, you know, we cut to his empty chair and there's a brief conversation and that man is missing. And there's this guy cable and this guy Klute. They're there with the man's wife. Claude is played by Donald Sutherland. He's really the only person I recognize so far. When I'm watching the movie. I'm like, okay, I know DZ d the questions about New York City, a letter, a girl, and yes, they're going to send in Klute to go find his friend. We think he's in New York City, but over the credits we start hearing this voice. Might sound like it might sound familiar to some because it's Jane Fonda. It's just, yeah, it's a brilliant mood setter. And then once we start the movie proper, this is when we're meeting Brie and cheese, auditioning as an actor. It's just, you know, one one of the heard the all those dismissive assholes, I, it's great the setup of the movie is that this guy, Tom Grubman, has been missing for six months. So the family sends in John Klute to investigate on his own. He's interested and he cares. And we. And so we're cross-cutting that. And we're seeing how this woman, Bree, played by Jane Fonda, is connected. And we shortly learn struggling actress, but also a prostitute in New York City. That group of men had been writing letters to. So Klute being, you know, wanting to investigate. How can I get in touch with this woman and try to maybe she knows where my missing friend is. That's our setup. But kind of from the beginning. Like when we're watching Bree, something feels off the because of the compositions and because the way the camera's tracking her and the lens in the distance, we are from her. Yeah, we feel like she is being surveilled and we are surveilling her. We're watching her. And it's it's weird. The music helps with this a lot too. But just I mean, we're we're still in like minute 12 and everything is being set up so beautifully. But it's great to meet her in this opening sequence and just see, like, her confidence and poise. It's great. It's I was floored by her performance in this movie. I, I cannot say enough good things like this is just truly tremendous acting and and and and ballsy too. Like very, very she she is as honest and truthful and real and, not afraid at all to go into this, that, that, that process, that first scene where we see her, take that. She's in total control. Yeah. With that John in the hotel, like, it's it's great the way she. We were joking about it when we started the pilot, but the way she, you know, conducts the transaction, it's it's great. And she's sweet. Yeah. And and and you know, the, the the cool thing that I like about it is that you know, when you look at, you know, the kind of like performances that you've ever seen for, you know, this profession, I mean, we do kind of start to find out throughout her movie, you know, the, the issues that are underneath her that she has emotionally, like we do start to explore all these, which I love. But we also see that her attitude towards this job is one where she actually it does sort. I mean, I think she does say that she is kind of like she doesn't want to keep doing this, but she does find the value in what this means. Like she doesn't feel like she is, doing something degrading to herself. She doesn't she's not victimized by it. She's not victimized by it at all. And she oftentimes talks about how this is something that benefits others and the way that she even talks to this guy, it's just really a whole different take on the stereotype of what is traditionally done. And I love seeing that. I thought that was just a I mean, it's so weird to say this was 1971, but what a refreshing way to view a taboo profession. I mean, you look at a Nora as a grit, as a good example of like, sex work in the way that the movie did not, it did not it mean it didn't glorify it in any sort of way? And I don't think Klute does either. But it also doesn't set you up as like, oh, well, this is, not where you want to go, kids, like, let this be a lesson to you wagging its finger at yes, man. It's just showing what it is. And it's worth saying that it Nora based. It's. Look, Sean Baker was very careful in wanting that movie to look and feel like a Klute. Like a 70s movie? Yeah. Hence the the film stock, all that stuff. But it's important to mention, and maybe we should have started with this, that Jane Fonda brings up in the special features that she was terrified to do this role. She tried to drop out right before they began shooting. She called, oh, wow, cool, cool. And I was like, you need to hire Faye Dunaway. She'll be able to do it. I can't do this. I don't have the confidence. I don't know how, and all this stuff. And then she also said at that time they there were not a lot of movies where women were the central character. And then I even thought about looking at our 70s list. They the there are women in them, but they aren't the main characters. And this despite the title of the film. Yeah, she is one and it's not a movie that's casting judgment over her. So it's like, yeah, let's go do it. Let's go do the whole thing. And she won Best Actress for this. It was it was her first Academy Award for Academy Award. And this was also someone who, in real life, was steeped in a lot of controversy because of her political views, and she was often dragged in the press for getting involved and, and all that stuff. And so for her to win the Oscar in the middle of the Vietnam War, like 1971, it was a huge deal and a very big announcement to New Hollywood and a lot of that has to do with how she plays her profession in the movie. It's it's I'm so glad to hear that she won because that I, I was as I was watching this, I go, this is one of the best performances that I mean, in just talking about our series that that I was like, this is just towering right here. And we'll get into more as to why it's so good. But, I mean, even going into like the therapy scenes. Yeah, the therapy scenes are fantastic because they're all the same shot. Whoever that actress was that they got, like to play the therapist. I feel like they just shot her out in one day. Oh, yeah. Probably. Exactly. You just hold the shot and it is. I just they just released the leaving Las Vegas 4K. I watched it with like Vegas brand new commentary. And he says right away, like I didn't I knew those were included, but I didn't want to rewatch Klute to like, steal from it. But that is why we did that. It's because of Klute. So yeah, those therapy scenes cutting back to the same shot, listening from her point of view about how she actually feels. It's yeah, again, this is something we see over and over and over now. And I'm not saying it had never been done in a movie before, but this absolutely popularized it. That narrative storytelling device, and only like 18 minutes into the movie is when Klute and Bree meet. I feel like now that would happen, you know, like the 45, I don't know, maybe hour, 15 minute mark of the two hour, 45 minute film. But no, they just they meet. And I love that she's trying to use all of her, you know, resources like coming on to him to try to, you know, manipulate him a little bit when all the while when we see her alone, we know she's scared. We know that she pokes around or, you know, leers around corners to see if she's being watched. We know that she's getting phone calls of this deep breathing. So she just we see her putting on this front for him and he, you know, he's this naive guy. He's not a city. City man. Oh, it's it's brilliant. This is another reason why the acting is so good. I mean, and especially because you look at the shot construction of that scene and essentially doesn't really deviate. It's a long scene to this is like, yeah, like yeah. It's when he goes over to her, the apartment. Yep. We mean were basically really just seeing, a shot from behind his back where it's pretty much almost all his back. So the, the most of the frame is completely blacked out. And it's. Oh, that's right, sorry I wasn't. Yeah, yeah. Oh, God. I wish this is the one thing about having, you know, it's all, audio podcast. It's that. Yeah. If we could, like, pull this stuff up, you're totally like, yeah, this is what I mean about the darkness. It doesn't just mean the characters are in dark. It means, hey, we can utilize for, like, two minutes of this movie. Just make half the screen black. Like, fuck it. Sorry to interrupt, but, yeah, it's such a good shot. And yet we're watching her, do this dance where she's trying to figure him out, and you're watching someone just purely from behavior. Because that's what acting is. Everybody. I hate to break it to you. It's as easy as that's all. Just behavior and watching her find ways of being honest. But then it seemed like I rewatched that scene three times to kind of track what she was doing. And of course, it's all subjective, but it does seem to me that there's times where she felt like she didn't like where this was going. So she's going to now try to advance him sexually, or she's going to go and go to the other side of the room and talk about this or time she's avoiding everywhere. And he you clock him. He's sort of I don't know if he's understanding what it is, but it does seem like he is tracking it as well. And and so yeah. And so we're just and I'm like, you're just learning so much of how this human being has stayed alive is because I'm sure she has been in trouble before she even talks about it. This is how she gets herself out of situations. So she's just playing these tactics and they're not really working on him because he is a good Ole boy. He is just here for a good old yep, good old boy from the suburbs. And he kind of does play into her a little bit. And I think, oh yeah, awareness of what she's doing gains on him. But then I mean she goes from seductive to scared and when he leans into her and you're like, oh, here we go. And he's like, there's someone on your roof. And it's like, oh, so you know, he's track. He's clocking all this other stuff. All the while he thinks this is Tom. His body, like he makes it up to the roof and he's yelling out Tom! Tom! Like he thinks, yeah, it's his buddy who's just obsessed with this prostitute. And then, yes, it's a tremendous scene. It's one of the key like set pieces of the movie. The beginning, the, you know, the apartment to roof scene is so good. And the way that she plays it, she's going through, like, every emotion, the behavior of her, you know, she's going through it. Yeah. And it's amazing love. Like seeing seeing the mask come on. Putting up the front and then actually getting legitimately scared. There's so much balance here. And he's cool too. Like she she is the star of the movie. It is Brie's movie again despite the title. It is for his movie and but he's still great too. He's a great companion to her and it honestly, it feels like he's servicing her. Sutherland I mean, like her performance in a way of like I'm supporting her, not she's not supporting me. Well, you know, it's funny because you go back to the trope of how this was how movies were done forever, where, you'd have a lead male character and the female character. Well, they're they they're fantastic actors in the story. They're just serving the man. Yeah. And whatever journey that they're on. And this is sort of the reverse of that in a way, because, we never really learn much about him. We don't really kind of find too much. We know his profession, we know what he's doing. But outside of that, it's really all his. But then we see no, like they start to have a thing, but this is really her journey and he is like the supporting character for her. And it's really, really great. It's good. And then I want to talk to you about like just about halfway through the movie, about 43 minutes in, I'm going to, I'll admit, the first few times I watched the movie, I didn't really understand the significance of it. But at 43 minutes in, we just cut to a guy listening to tapes, like in a conference room. And if you pay attention, that's cable. That's the guy that sent Klute on the mission. He was like the other guy at the dinner table. What did you take of that? When we start cutting to this stuff, what what are you putting together as a first time viewer? Well, I, I mean, I sort of just was like, oh, this is the guy. Yeah. I kind of put together that this was the guy with the puppet strings that was putting all this together, because we're not really finding out much about Tom. Right. And then we cut to this and now and he's got the tape. So I was like, oh, so this is the this is the bad guy. And I think that's very interesting because he, you know, spoiler alert, he is the bad guy. And I mean, they they don't even it's not even a spoiler. They just reveal it right here. It's not like some shadowy showdown of they do have that and revelations are revealed, but to the audience, right, right here, they're telling us way more than the characters know. And it's just it's it's again, it's something that makes it a little more unique because you're like, oh, okay. Like now it's not a whodunit. It's how are they going to get away with it either. The bad guy or the innocent, you know, prostitute victim, even though she's not playing like a victim. I meant a victim of his crime. You guys know what I mean? Oh, yeah. We understand. Everyone understands generalizing, stereotyping. Just who are you, man? Who? I saw avatar three a few nights ago. I'm ready to stereotype against blue people. Don't get me started. You ready? Stereotype. But yes, we. So we see him. We see him there. It's not like a full reveal, but we hear a recording of himself with Brie and it doesn't sound. It sounds kind of tense. So it's like, all right, what's going on? And then who does Klute want to go see? Want to see breeze? Pimp played by none other than who? That's right, folks, the great Roy Scheider. Oh, I love him in this movie. I love him in every movie. But it's just so good to see him going back to one of my hot takes. It was so key. What is it not? Roy Scheider has the ultimate acting career of the 1970s being even in this movie, small part. But I mean, still, when you look at the list of movies he he's in, these are, these are bangers banger after banger. He's the shamus of the 1970s. I totally get that one. That means, oh yeah, I do, I absolutely do. You could explain it, but we don't have enough time. I mean, when, when they go back to his house and he's got the red shirt, his face is in shadow, he's barefoot on the couch, his legs are open. He's comfortable. Confident. You're like, does Frank the pimp want to fight Klute or, fuck him? I mean, genuinely, you don't it? He's got this, like, charisma, and you just look at Roy Scheider and you're like, that dude could fight. But he's also alluring. But yeah, this is when he's he's on the come up. He was in The French Connection the same year. And we covered all that jazz like his greatest performance. He was in jaws. I mean, just sorcerer, like one of the best actors, one of my favorite ever and certainly one of the best actors of the 70s. Yes. Roy Scheider and just great to see him again. Not a big part, but a memorable one. Oh yeah. Yeah. And he gives clue to a new lead. So then that sends Brie include off because now they're like all right where's Tom. Where's this. And you know oh there's another probably another prostitute who saw this bad John because there's these stories of like this bad John, this guy that like beats up prostitutes. And we're starting to think like, is this Tom? Is this the missing guy? Or, you know, who is this? But, I mean, it really is, but you're really sort of watching this relationship formed between Klute and Bree and I actually, you know, we'll get to it because I like to pose my, my, my new section of, like, with the questions of the movie. And I remember I was thinking about these a lot and, and I realized what is means to cut to it. Now it I was talking to I was talking a lot about like, I was thinking about, oh, is this more of like a movie about like, can we accept like, good in our lives, when we know when all around us is evil? I was thinking about things like that. But then I realize this movie's all about sex. This movie is all about sex. Think about it. This movie, you have Brie's character who has her relationship with sex. But then you look at Donald Sutherland. We don't really know much about him, and I don't think he went into this case looking to find love or whatever. But no, not at all. But he absolutely begins to make decisions for himself that are not discussed. We do not understand his emotional point of view. He just starts to do things. And, you know, actions speak louder than words. And and I feel like even the first time that they have sex, he doesn't even want to do it necessarily. Yeah, that's about the scene we're up to, because we learned that he's basically crashing in her in the basement of her apartment. You know, he's got these he's got recording devices set up, all this stuff. He's wearing blue pajamas. She comes down for little comfort. And yeah, they eventually go at it. But it's but he's kind of resisted at first. Like, I think he's going to sleep on the ground and she's going to be in the bed. And then she's being charming and it's like, oh, it's not going to be about money. And then of course, right after she comes, she plays golf again. It's like, no, I'm this tough girl. Like, I just did that to, you know, when you over now I best you. But we know like not she actually I think does care for this guy. You know in the therapy sessions helped clue us into that too. Exactly. But the reason I think that my question, I think that I put this movie poses is, does sex control all of us? Because that's how Tom was. I mean, he had that, you know, he clearly did these things. He didn't I don't mean he didn't do to what the, cable guy kind of like, sets up. But I think Tom was absolutely going outside of his marriage. Oh, yeah. It's Brie. Oh, yeah. And then you've got the cable guy. You've got, you've got cable. Sutherland. The had the key on the bad guy. And so everyone's really operating when sex is happening. What does that do to us and how does that control our actions after that. That's what this all this movie is. It's this movie's all about sex. I, I dig that I've never really thought about that, but I and it's a little even saying that it's important to note that there there's like we see her, engage in fornication with that first John, but it's not explicit. I mean, you can honestly have a scene in a PG 13 movie now. So while sex is like the backdrop of a lot of stuff, or maybe motivating a lot of people, it's not explicitly part of the movie like shown it, which I, the another thing that I appreciate about it, but yeah, that is a lot of people's motivations and it's something that she's using as a way of commerce, as a way of getting what she wants. Sometimes. So yeah, I think it fits. And when they hook up and then you know that right after, like that's more great acting from her. And she's devastated. It's like, yeah. Or rather he's devastated. And she's again putting on this show of yep haha I got it. Gotcha. But just very dismissive. But we don't believe that's actually what's going on with her. And then based off leads that Frank helped with a find this friend of Bree's, the strung out prostitute, and she confirms that this Tom guy that was not the abuser. It's some dude older and Brie's upset that her friend is strung out. Goes to a nightclub. Frank there. That's great. I love that show. What a knife cut over his eye. But yeah, go ahead. But that one or that long take. Oh my God, oh my God, it's so good. And it's all just about her essentially. Like because we don't know, Royce shares. At this club we end up at a club and we just see Bree making her way through this club. And we then find out that it's on her way back to Roy. Yep. And it's a way from from DDS, from Klute, from The clue. And he's and he's watching it all. And, you know, now he's sort of like, man, this is what happens when you get involved with, with a prostitute. Yeah, yeah. She's not going to be loyal to you, buddy. And, but I mean, just watching her and everything that she does in this because you're sort of like, well, what's the point of us watching this? And ultimately it doesn't matter, because the point is she's on her way back to Roy. But I mean, what a way to do that. It's. Yeah. And her tripping and then falling in with those other guys making out and then leaving and walking and doing all that. It's amazing. It's an amazing one shot. It really is I yeah. Great call. Great pull there I love that shot. The plot's moving along. The junkie prostitute ends up dead. Brie's very shaken by this. But then I love the moment, these moments in these 70s movies. Marathon man does this to where, like, some lighter music plays it. Like, now they're shopping like they're getting groceries together. They're like at home. I mean, Bree and Klute. Like, they're starting to develop feelings, like, everything's good that you just know her being set up for this, like disastrous payoff of things going wrong. And yeah, we do a showdown here of Klute, figuring out it is the cable guy who is kind of behind this all. He's the one sending the letters, and it's this great set up to this final showdown in which, like, you're not at all sure where this is going to go or how it's going to end up. And I don't know if it's worth, like spoiling all of it, but, you know, we'll just see where the conversation goes. But it's a great climax to this movie. Oh yeah. But figuratively. And, you know, take it easy. Take it easy. But no, I mean, it's you know, this the way there are confessions and the shot constructions and then the way that the way that Bree Jane Fonda is so terrified, even though, like, cable, he's not being overtly threatening. It's just a really good balance. And I, you know, I love it. I think the big payoff to me is, is watching her deal with these revelations that you're kind of referring to. That's what I don't want to talk too much about them because like the whole entire movie, like there is something that she doesn't remember that's being blocked. And it's because of just the nature of, of her life and what she has to do to survive. Like if I kind of think about like, what is like, why does this character do everything that she does? I think it's self-preservation. Yeah. So I'm sure there's so much that's gone down in her. So. So you're kind of like like in all sorts of ways that this movie is building to her understanding more about herself and the therapy sessions are a big part of that. Klute. That's why, like, I love that one line, she says to her therapist. Because she's trying to dissect how she feels and and she's like, well, how do you feel about him? And she goes, it makes me want to manipulate him. That's why she does what she does. He does what she does. And then, yeah, so basically this sort of big payoff that you get, you get everything where it's the culmination of the plot. But then her realizing kind of so much and then, you know, Klute doing what Klute does, that's what Jake does, does, does come right in. It can be the cliched scene of like, the villain monologuing and talking like, yeah, and everything, but it's really about her. And then like, a recording is played and we're we're just so concerned about Bree, like, how is this going to end? And yet Clu does what he does. And I think it's a really to me, honestly, knowing, especially some of the movies we've covered in this series that can lean toward, much more pessimistic was I wasn't expecting this ending, necessarily, and I'm kind of, like, pleasantly warmed by it. I'm like, okay, this is yeah, okay. This is cool. Not everyone to. Yeah. You know, with, shot in the eye in the back of a car. In where? Chinatown or. Yeah, or Serpico, where he's just going to be after. After Switzerland. See us. See a Frank. Let's see if he was. And I told him he had to leave the movie. He was devastated. Ephraim is devastated. He was devastated. There's only one other little, thing that I kind of wanted to bring up because I thought it was so great was that that, the actors who played the junkies? Oh, yeah. It's it was one of my favorite lines of the whole thing, because, you know, we're, you know, Klute doesn't say a lot in the movie, and yet I you kind of watch his reactions to certain things when they went to the junkies. I just sort of got like this sort of impression that he really does not like heroin or junkies like, this is like something for him. This or like, this is just like the absolute worst of everything. Like he's got like this look on his face in here. But then the one. So it's a, it's a junkie girlfriend and boyfriend. The sweet sorrow of junkies, you know, they, they miss their, their delivery and, the tragedy that that unfolds, which I'm sure is honestly, it's it's probably actually as, Oh, yeah, they were then as they miss their drug delivery. Yeah. They miss their drug delivery and they're just completely there. Their lives are over. But the woman ends up dying. And so now Klute is at that crime scene and he's like, well, yep, she's gone. And he's. And but then the guy is there, and this junkie just walks up to Klute. She's only met him the one other time, and he's just sort of like, hey, man, can you help me out? And Clint's like, what do you mean? He's like, my baby's dead. I gotta get up. Yep. Can you help me out? And you see Klute? Just look at him. And he's just got this look on his face of just being like. It goes from, like, are you kidding? To then just being like, he starts taking out his wad of cash. He's like, you got to get up. Like it was like this understanding of the situation that goes completely against his moral code of being like this detective and trying to do all this, but he sees a guy where it's probably in the eye. It's useless. Like he's not going to save this guy, but in this moment, he's sort of like, you got to get up. And I just love that. I thought that was such a well played scene. That has nothing to do with anything. They all they needed to do was show the scene where the woman was dead and that Klute was their investigating. That's all you need to get. We didn't get to need to have this little side scene with these two where we see, the humanity of Klute in this way. Love that scene. Just absolutely loved it. Yeah. And sometimes humanity can be very dark, like that's that. Yeah. Can be viewed as an act of generosity, but it's. That's how I view. Yeah, exactly. And I think that's what he is going through in his head like, oh, I can the only thing this man needs in the world is what, maybe 20 bucks so he can get his next hit of junk. And that is going to, you know, what. So okay. Yeah, sure. I'll help with that. And that is another scene that I've seen in movies like but down the line, and this is one of the first ones I can think of where I'm seeing it here. And yeah, that's a great another great call out. I love that scene to love Klute. I'm so glad you liked it. So glad. And yes, Jane Fonda did go on to win the Academy Award for Best Actress. A truly great win. Like, just kind of lights out. Great. So glad that have. Oh, yeah. Me too. I'm glad you said it. I was I was like, tell me that she's won this award. A fun theme in a lot of the cool movies is he likes opening credits as a tone setter, but he usually has a scene that comes first. We spend a lot of time talking about the one in Klute and The Parallax View. The entire movie is set up by a seven minute mark, which is when the credits start and I don't want to get okay. I won't get into the plot yet right away, but this was another one that you had not seen, and I'll to all kind of start here. The Parallax View is a movie that whole I saw once a few years ago. But like, I mean, probably since we've known each other, I saw it for the first time, never really left my head. And then I don't know, in Covid, early Covid, I wanted to explore it. So I watched it. It was either on criterion or some such place. And then for the next viewing after that, I bought it. And this is one like shampoo that I basically become obsessed with on my own. In the past decade, I didn't grow up with like law of the Parallax View. I think this is the least well known of the three, but I mean to tell you how how much I love this movie and how I'm now so obsessed with it. I've watched it so many times just this year. I love this movie. I am also, I don't know how much I've gotten into this other part, but I'm a. You've noted that I'm a true crime fan, but I like I love studying about the JFK assassination and going down all possible rabbit holes. I got that from my father. Thank you dad and not going like crazy with conspiracy theories. Just like reading everything, studying everything. And in my opinion, The Parallax View is the best movie ever made about the JFK assassination. Even though it's not explicitly about that. Anyway, how did you feel about The Parallax View? I was this was a wild ride. I was not expecting what this was. I mean, they give you a clue in the very kind of like, beginning a little bit. Well, I mean, I, I don't know, I mean, how much do how how much should we talk about the beginning? Because the beginning is like, that it's a it's a big moment. Well, here's the thing. And this has been an ongoing struggle, honestly, with the whole podcast, like, this is one of my the whole plan. The whole time we've been doing it is that I personally Alex would not I will I'm not going to listen to a podcast of a movie. I haven't seen yet, but if there's a podcast I like and I see, oh my, oh, they're doing, you know, I always tease what the next episode is going to be at the end of the episodes, but if they see, you know, in their feed, oh, they're doing Klute, Parallax View on All the President's Men, I would go watch those and then listen. But people can decide they it's, you know, they're they're adults listening to this. I don't want kids listening to this. Adults listen to. They can decide, like, do you want The Parallax View from 1974, starring Warren Beatty spoiled right now, or do you want to, you know, go watch, pause, go watch the movie and then come back? My point is, let's just talk about it. Let's just open it up and say. Whatever you want to say, because I'm aware that this is not a very well seen movie, but it is out there, right? I think as of this recording, it's on it's on streaming platforms, I know that. So it's available to watch. It's not long. It's like an hour, 40 minutes and then some credits and it is amazing. But yeah, I just want to talk about it. I love this movie I knew from and without knowing anything the movie was about, I felt the paranoia of an assassination brewing from the first, like 20s. I was like, I don't know what's going on here, but I smell an assassination coming. And essentially that's exactly what happens. Unbelievably staged, as a film like you, it's shocking in the way that, it should be like, you just. You don't really. You don't know when or where, and then it boom, it happens. And then there's an immediate aftermath. And I was clued into what we were into, and I'm just glad they did it, because this movie is also a giant action movie. Oh, yeah. On top of every set. Like I respect that. Yeah. Yes. Oh yes. And and so but it might be my favorite moment of the whole movie, believe it or not. But it's when the waiters are running up to the roof and we're on the roof and we're watching the security guards have like this tussle at the very like top of like the CN tower. It's a space Needle tower. It's a space needle in Seattle. Yeah, they're all in Seattle and they're on top of this. They're on top of the real thing. And and then so it's one shot and you're in, you're in. This guy's got nowhere to go. And there's an angle to this tower. So they're all trying to like run and wrestle uphill and an incline. And then all of a sudden this motherfukers falls right off and we don't see the fall. No screams, and we just, I just I was like, oh, my God, what are we here? What are we doing here? And I was like, all right, let's go. And then you get this fucking style. Style in in profile. And Warren Beatty, this fucking man's man dressed in like I whatever his style was for this movie, I just want it. Oh, yeah. I love everything to do the swearing. It's so good. And he's coming in and he's just fucking like, this is a guy who's out to get his story, does it, and and he doesn't care what lengths he has to go to to get it. This is sort of like I don't know, like it kind of reminds me of Indiana Jones a little bit. Oh, cool. Where because it was sort of like this idea of like, because Indiana Jones is like, well, these things belong in a museum, and I'm going to do whatever it needs to do. And so he's going in caves and doing all this, and I feel like Warren Beatty is like, well, I'm out for the story and I'm going to do it. Whatever I have to, I'll go undercover. I'll blow it up. I've ruined a bunch of things. He costs a bunch of police people a lot of money because of his antics. Yeah he does. He's a man on the mission, for sure. Oh, he's a man on a mission. So. Yeah. So this is a big action adventure movie because of this. I'm glad you're noting that because, yeah, like Klute is and and All the President's Men, they're not. They have these great set pieces, but they're not like, stuff isn't necessarily exploding. And yeah, the parallax View, it's it's tight short runtime and it's just one set piece to the next to the next to the next ending with this tremendous lengthy set piece in Atlanta, where we're just. Yeah, watching step by step. This is a great process movie. But the setup, the thing we're talking about, the Space Needle Seattle like we don't know what's going on. It's for there's a 4th of July parade. There's people trying to get up to the Space Needle. We see Warren Beatty in the background. There's a senator who goes up. There's, you know, a speech at the top, and then we're like, out from outside on, you know, the observation deck looking in at the senator as he's giving the speech and fucking bang from outside. He's like, he I mean, we see it. Our point of view is we're outside. But he shot from inside. We get these really quick cuts of different waiters and we're like, oh, I see a guy over there and he this guy manages to slip out if you pay attention. And if you're a fan of what are you watching, you may notice that man, the assassin is who? The mountain man from deliverance. That's right. Yes. Right. Yes. But you see that very distinct face. And he is not the one they chased to the top of the Space Needle. He kind of sneaks out, gets away. Warren Beatty was not able to get up there. He didn't have the credentials. So he is kind of lost about like everything that's going on. And we get a shot of the Mountain Man assassin smiling as he walks off, and it's moving so fast. And then we get off. This is so Pakula. This like commissioned a scene where it's really dark and we're moving in on this large desk and these old guys talking and it's, you know, they basically conclude that the senator was assassinated. The senator was assassinated by a lone psycho who died falling off the needle in a chase. But we know that to be untrue, because we clocked the other assassin, the mountain man. We they showed us him running away. So just like Klute, where they're cluing us into who cable is kind of early on right here that we're clued into, like there is absolutely a conspiracy. This is not going to be a movie where where the audience doesn't know if there's a conspiracy. And like, he gets to the end and just shrugged his shoulders. We don't know. We know before the opening credits that shit is bad here, and major high officials at the government are involved. Let's go. Yeah. That's it. I'm going to say the that commission is modeled pretty heavily off the Warren Commission, which investigated the JFK assassination. And, you know, it's also concluded that that was the work of a lone assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald. Cut me a fucking break, is what I say. You get. But in the narrative of the film, we jump to three years later and yeah, baby, we get it. You know, we get that one quick. See the film, like in the house and they're like, busted, but walks in, just walks in. But we get we gather very quickly. He's a reporter willing to do anything. Anything. I'm going to get his name wrong. The great Hume Cronyn, I think it's how you say it is. His editor. This guy plays like a sadistic asshole in Brute Force, that prison movie. I love that movie. Such a sick bastard. And here he's like, he's just. He's so good. I love this guy. He was in a lot of Pakula movies, but we learned that one of his colleagues was up in the Space Needle, learned a bunch of stuff, and she's trying to convince him that, like a lot of people who witnessed that assassination in the Space Needle have died under mysterious circumstances in the past three years, and he baity at this point, is writing it off like maybe a quote unquote normal person would. What's the big deal? Like he has all the accent bullet points memorized. They're easy to explain accidents or legit health problems. She wants to help. He doesn't care. And then what happens? Bam! We cut to her fucking dead in the morgue. Yeah. And and she's now he's like, oh, there's another witness who? And I forget what they give her. She died of, like, alcohol and barbiturate overdose. And he's like, this this seems things are adding up here. So it's great though when when we jumped it three years later, he's not leading this conspiracy investigation. He has to be convinced of it. And what convinces him is his colleagues death will end in. This is such a great scene in terms of writing, too, because she kind of like barges in on him. Yeah. He's he's with, with a girl is, you know, well, when she comes out. Yeah, he's remembering he's Warren Beatty and but I got the notion that there was some sort of, like, romantic history between these two. Sure. Because she she was definitely freaking out, and and, you know, he's basically he, he kept saying, like, you always think you're going to die. Like you all like, like that is such a good piece of of writing to be able to sell this because you're getting some sort of backstory history. This lived in feeling, whether it's romantic or not, these two know each other to a point where she can come to him freaking out about this, and he knows what this is and is sort of like, here's what you got to stop doing all this. Like, this is not, you know, like any he didn't exactly that. So then, you know, we're sort of aware of this woman's paranoia, but when exactly to your point that you're making is like, he doesn't he needs to be convinced of this potential conspiracy. And so when we get that cut, when she's dead now, it's thrown right in his face. And you don't get that thrown in your face without writing, like that. Absolutely. And the writing is good in the way that this isn't. We can tell this is not the first time they've talked about this. Maybe it's like first time in a while like that. They're explicitly talking about it. But yeah, him his kind of frustration of like, you have to get over this and just move on. And then yeah, yeah. The lighting of that morgue, that Gordon Willis oh, it's so cold. It's such harsh lighting and just that. Oh, yeah. You know, drank, drank herself to death pills, all that. And he's not buying it. And now he's on the scent and he's like, I'm going to go. I don't give a shit. I'm going to go figure this out as I can't even go to this place. Sam and tail and oh my God, what a set piece showed up to the bar is, oh my God. He talked about his clothes. Like the way he's dressed and I. Yeah, I just love this shout out to Bard very quickly picking a fight with a deputy and just he goes flying through like that paper window and it's it's great. The sheriff sitting there watching all of it. Oh, I like to see him get whooped. It's my my sister's boy or whatever, you know, he's the deputy. It's again this great set up of like, okay, he made he made a friend like the sheriffs on the up like, right, isn't it? We'll see. And what a fight by the. Oh yeah. That's a great fight I love. That's a great fight. I was not expecting a fight like that. I all of a sudden that fights happening and I was like, these fuckers are going at it. And there wasn't like, you know, and this is what's great about the, you know, old kind of way of making movies is like, you know, you you're, you're really fallen and you're really kind of like, you know, I mean, obviously everything is as protected as possible, but they're not really trying to use fancy cutaways to no mask. A lot of this is a long fight. And they they go through walls, they go to tables that they're throwing shit like I mean, it is it it is a whole entire thing. And it's fun. But it's also like you feel like those actors probably like when they got done filming all that, they got bruises. They. Yeah, probably banged up and they're both tired. That's what I always appreciate that about violence, because fighting makes you very tired. It's very physically exhausting because out of nowhere you're just having to exert so much energy. And he's so, you know, can't catch his breath. Like what's going on. And we're still as the audience if you're watching for the first time, you're still kind of catching up. And that's I, I kind of wanted to know from you, like, at some point, did you just give in and go, all right, I hey, I'm along for the ride. We'll see where we go. Oh, yeah. I think, the fight was definitely the official, but I think I was on board with that when the guy fell off the roof. I was sort of like, oh, we're really kind of going for it with this movie. But then we get that fight. That was when I was first clued into the over-the-top ness. Yeah. So I was like, oh, so this is really there's no there's no ceiling here. We're we're we're going to go anywhere. And we will trust me, because, I mean, I also loved it like, you know, we were in Seattle. Now this salmon tell tale thing, we're like, we're in isolated Washington state, like we're not in some big city. And they're just using nature, like using these massive rapids and like going fishing. And then, you know, I love that set piece. When we figure out the sheriff is indeed not on the up and up. And then there's another thing. I can't believe I didn't mention this earlier. This is a really good early example of it, though. He steals the sheriff's car, it goes to his house and, you know, drives the sheriff's car to the house. Deputy who he kicked the shit out of, shows up and just assumes the sheriff is in his own house because his car is there, that he doesn't see him. There's, you know, phone messages. He picks up all this is done without dialog. So there are such long stretches of this movie that. And I've heard Soderbergh say that so many times, you should never be able to watch a movie with your eyes closed. Like you shouldn't be able to watch a movie, like doing chores because they're relaying information via dialog constantly. You should be able to watch a movie like visually, and the frames should be telling you the story. And there are. I didn't time it, but this is a short movie, and there are extremely long passages upwards of ten minutes on occasion with no dialog, where you just have to watch, process and watch him figure stuff out. But I love, I love when he goes to the sheriff's house. And if you, you know, if you pay close attention. That's our first view of the Parallax Corporation, which we see written on some documents. But when you're watching him go into like, we're aware that the deputy is entered in, but, the phone starts to ring and Warren Beatty does not know the deputy is there, so he hears that phone ring. Yeah, but it's not until the deputy answers it then that all of a sudden, you see Warren, baby. Oh, shit. Someone's fucking here. And because of the great cinematography, we're seeing this all in one shot. Because he has baby and the right of frame and the phone deputy in a left of frame a walls between them and. Yeah, it's just great. It's great shit. And you see that reaction from Warren from the phone ring. And then the answer and there's two different distinct like reactions to it as there would be. But you just don't see that's a tiny little thing right there where it's sort of like you could set that up anyways. Maybe it's sort of like I think any other director would do a thing where you hear that front door open, and now all of a sudden you see Warren Beatty realize that he's there. But the fact that this guy enters Warren is not aware. And then it's not until that extra little bit and then you see it. I don't know, it just makes the difference. Yeah. He does exactly like, being that much more compelling. Yes, yes. And it's a different choice because yeah, it's always like the door slams and then they hear that and they hide. And this is no, it's increasing that tension because we're like, we don't know what's going to happen to Warren here. I mean, this deputy could see him in any second. And he's not even aware of it. So there's more of an audience participation in this movie where he he does not it has not been officially confirmed for him that there is a bona fide conspiracy going on, even though the audience knows there is. So it's this great way of like almost yelling at the screen, like, turn around, turn like, come on, turn around and watch out. Yeah, yeah, he's seen these documents. This Parallax Core Corporation stuff. And he now definitely thinks someone is knocking off witnesses to the assassination. What the hell is this? Parallax Corporation? He takes this questionnaire to a professor who has a psycho take it. And, you know, the professor kind of deduces, and I love the glimpse of the questions we get. But, like, this is a really interesting questionnaire. It seems like, you know, it's like they're maybe they're trying to find assassins or like, make assassins. I don't know, this is weird. And then we get our other big set piece. Joe goes, Joe, which is Warren Beatty character, goes and meets with another witness, William Daniels. That's right folks, that's right folks. Mr. Finney himself. Is it Finney? Finney? Mr. Finney? No, the guy from Boy Meets World. The teacher. The teacher. That's who that is. Yes. Yeah. Is it Mr. Feeny? Mr.. Yes, yes. Mr. Feeny, William Daniels, I love his voice. I was like, yeah, where do I know this boy meets world, baby? Wow. That's what I'm here for, folks. I'm here to connect the dots. There's any older listeners like, what the fuck are you talking about? This guy's a veteran character actor, and I. There's, I'm so glad we're talking about him specifically right now, because there's a moment that he has that I'm bringing up my. I'm putting on the acting chops right here. Do it, do it. So there's a lot. So basically like we're trying to Warren Beatty is trying to get this guy like he's trying to find this guy. We get to this boat dock. You see this guy behind it walking, but is his walk is so sort of timid and sort of cautious. Kind of hangs back there. He's not being overly over-the-top about it, but it's just his physicality of you either. Like, like, why is this guy being so, like suspicious, cautious, suspicious. Yeah. And as the actor, you have to do that work for yourself. What would that physicality really be like? What would my behavior really be like? Especially when I didn't know that on the day I was going to have this long shot to walk into? And that's all. And I don't really you're not really in this movie for very long, right? You know what I mean? Yeah. You don't you don't have much of a time with the camera. So here's how you make the most of it. It's a it's really, really great. I noticed it and I go, that's an actor who knows exactly like how to color every moment that they're in I. Yeah, I love that. And he does because he's not in the movie that much. And he has such a presence, even the beard, like he's got this kind of bad beard that he didn't have before. And yeah, he's trying to stay very hidden because he is absolutely on board that there is a conspiracy going on, like Joe's colleague was who wound up dead in the morgue, and now Joe is on board. So they go out on his boat to talk and what can go wrong? Like you're out here on the boat. Mr. Finney has pictures that he says he has pictures of the real assassin, and he says that he has pictures of it. And he's very nervous about all this stuff. And I think this is a key scene of the movie because we're kind of I kind of wonder, are they on to Joe the whole time? Like, is the corporation onto him the whole time? Are they already like tracking his stuff? Because again, there's audience participation. So it's just a fun thing of being like, how much does Warren Beatty's character actually believe at any given time? And then sometimes he feels like he's kind of like out of it. So he just goes and has a thought at the front of the boat, and then the fucking boat explodes. And it's like all right, here we go again. Like we're another witness down. And he he gets away. And then because of the explosion, he pretends to play dead. So he's staying hidden. He wants to do the investigation on his own. This is Michael Clayton. This is exactly what happens in Michael Clayton. There's an explosion. He pretends to play dead again. Michael Clayton, heavily influenced by the three movies we're talking about today. But yeah, the boat, the whole boat sequence is just great, and it really is like an action movie. It's like a 70s political thriller action movie. One thing to the and even earlier you got a whole entire car jump. So 1970s, right? Yeah. Classic 70s car jump. That there's a line that he used when he goes back and he's talking to his editor because there's only one who knows he's alive. Yeah. And, you know, and then he goes, he goes, I'm dead, bill, I just want to stay like that for a while. Yeah. Never a good sign when only one person knows you're alive and a political thriller will, you know, maybe get to that soon. But, yeah, he wants to enlist. Like, go undercover and enlist in the Parallax Corporation to. They thinks they recruit people to create assassins. And, you know, he's got that shitty apartment. And then Walter McGinn is Jack younger shows up. I love this guy, and they're interviewing him. And this is kind of what I mean. Like, during these interviews, does this guy, this Jack know that word bad? He's putting on a show here. They know that this identity is bullshit. Like they know that. And I kind of think they do because they're always a step ahead of him. Like they always have things rigged up. But it's a fun thing to go down. Like, do they know, are they setting him up kind of from the jump? But at any rate, after this brief meeting and I love, you know, baity like, puts on a different persona, like I don't give a fuck attitude with him and stuff like that. And then, yeah, when you get that test at at the Parallax Corporation, he goes the Parallax Corporation, the Parallax Corporation's Division of Human Engineering for video presentation. And this is the game, like David Fincher basically takes his for the game. But I love this little video. It's so weird. It's just so cool. It he's watching. It's so weird. And and it just it just fits to the wild. Just the the overall like when you just think that this movie couldn't really go to other places, it does something like this where it really kind of gives you this very it's very taboo. It's artsy, it's very like experimental. So there's this whole entire thing and then it lasts for a long time. I timed it, it's like 4.5 minutes of photos, a series of photos and title cards, like the same words repeating with some repetition in the photos. But yeah, it's just it's weird. It's like an avant garde corporate thing. I don't know, it's weird. It's very off putting. Yeah, but it does go on for a while. It goes on for a long time and you can see what it's trying to do. Like you can see like the point that it's trying to make is that it's supposed to confuse these more or less, like maybe not as strong minded individuals of what they're, what they values of what America are or what happiness is. And all of this and distorting them in a way where they're probably now going to be susceptible to, to being told what to do to essentially be hired. Hitman's. Yeah, yeah. I mean, even A Clockwork Orange reminds me, like some of the videos are. Yeah, yeah, yeah, the same mentality. He's not being strapped down here Warren Beatty but yeah I mean again, 4.5 minutes in a movie that isn't that long. It is going on for a while and the music's going up and you're like, it's just it's a trip. And then again, this is like, you can't you shouldn't be able to watch a movie with your eyes closed. When he was on the boat, those pictures I mentioned, he did look at them. He was looking at the pictures. And as he's leaving the Parallax Corporation, he spots the assassin, the mountain man, that he saw in one of the pictures. And we get that great freeze frame of him, which Soderbergh does a lot. He does these freeze frames of like, no, here, I want you to make the connection. Like, it's okay. I don't even mind that it would feel like heavy handed or dumbed down. Like, are you getting this? Are you getting this? But it feels so real. Like when you do a quadruple take on someone and then you just kind of stand there and you're like, Holy fuck. And you make those connections in your head. So that can be conveyed very well with just a, still screen. You know, it's using absolute freeze frame rather. Yeah. Oh. So good. So now he's on the hunt for this guy. He's on his tail on this track. Where's he going to go? Season picking up a suitcase. Drive to the airport. Oh. And this is Pakula doing Hitchcock. Now we have the MacGuffin, this briefcase. Follow the White rabbit. It's loaded onto the plane. This. And Joe just walks. I love it, he just walks right onto the. Played like it's a train. You could just walk on it, like, buy a ticket when you're in the air. People are smoking. My God, again, this is a huge not another really long passage with no dialog because you definitely get that feeling of like, this is like, how am I going to get everyone out of here? How am I going to stop this? Well, exactly. This would be a whole movie. Like a journalist has seen a guy who he thinks is an assassin put a suitcase onto a plane in the SAS. The assassin did not get on the plane. So, you know, now Warren Beatty has gotten on the plane, and he's sitting there trying to put this together. And then as they take off, he realizes another senator is on board and, oh, my God, there's a bomb in the suitcase. They're going to blow this fucking plane up to kill this Senator. So now what do I do? Do I how can I possibly signal that there's a bomb without, you know, causing mass chaos or getting myself arrested or. Yeah, another really, really great set piece in they. Well, maybe we should just say because we have to talk about the shot of the plane. Oh, the shot. It's it's it's good he gets he figures out a way, a crafty way to get the plane emergency landed without revealing his identity. And then, you know, he gets off and we just cut to, like, this, tracking shot where the plane kind of stays still on the runway and the camera keeps going, and the camera just shakes and we hear it explode. It's like, the plane did blow up, but we don't need to see it because this movie doesn't have the budget to blow up a plane. I love it, I love that shit so much. It only works because of how over-the-top the movie is already been. Exactly. I don't think you like you couldn't get away with that if you were, like, doing like, Taxi Driver or something. I was thinking of like when the shot goes off to the side, but in this movie, yes. And and and it just enhances it. I was like, at this point now I'd rather see it done that way than an actual explosion. Yeah. So much fun. Exactly. And we, I mean, when we the first thing we talked about when we were talking about the movie like a week or so ago, we were like, how about that plane explosion? It's just fun. It's just really fun. It's just do it well. And it's that same idea where you have with the boat, with everything. It's like he got away again. Yeah, he kind of like warns like the let you go. He's like, he's still alive. And, he's he's he's avoided. He's avoided certain death now like four times. And he just keeps getting away. Yeah. You almost got I mean shot or and or drowned. Yeah. He survived. Oh. Survive the airplane. And now he's still putting on the act with old Jack younger here because he shows up for interview, too. This is like a Gordon Willis signature that babies almost his whole face is in shadow for this scene. And you're like, oh my God. And then this to me is the biggest sign that perhaps the Parallax Corporation, that PC has been really just, duping Warren Beatty the whole time because they kill his editor and the editors the like. How do they know about the editor if they don't know his real identity? So I think they actually do know that he's Joe and that, you know, you don't get this on first viewing. This is like you when you go back and rewatch the movie over and over like I have, I don't know, you can develop these theories of like, I think they're hustling him from the beginning. Like they were not able to take him out. So he, as working for the Parallax Corporation, he is sent to Atlanta and quickly begins following the assassin again. And the move this is from here on in the movie is going to take place in this Atlanta hotel, this gorgeous set piece with, I mean, the tables like Gordon Willis just like shoots the shit out of this thing. The red, white and blue. It's this amazing, huge conference hall where yet another senator is rehearsing for his speech. Joe makes his way up to the rafters. He's tracking the assassin and it's, you know, we don't really know where this is going. You you're watching it thinking like, oh, Joe is about to. He couldn't stop the plane. He couldn't stop the Space Needle. So he's about to catch this assassin before this, you know, other senators taken out, and that's where we think we're going in. We got a few. He got a few more twists for us. But yeah, this whole final set piece is just astounding. It really is like exactly. Like, honestly, I think I would rather watch it without any sound, because the only thing I couldn't stand it was the goddamn patriotic music that was playing there, like all ten minutes of this fucking scene. I hate that music. I hate it so much. It is like the worst type of music I'd ever want to, like, listen to, like dunt dunt dunt dunt dunt dunt dunt, you know, like all that bullshit. I mean, they're hitting it hard, like, you know, America. Oh, fuck. Yeah. And then oh, you got government officials here like assassinating Senator. So. But I hear you. I definitely hear you. Yeah, yeah. And but but I mean, that's that's that's not ruining the scene at all. Because it is really, really it's it is something because you're because. Yeah. Because everything's in the shadows. You it's it's like this giant maze. It's a cat and mouse situation. And like, they do those little swerves where, like, you see, like Warren Beatty waiting for somebody, and then he just goes out the other way. Yeah. And so they're they're always missing each other. But yeah, to your point, I think that they, they absolutely he has no idea like Warren Beatty Joe doesn't have any idea what's going on. But I think everyone who is involved in this plot right here knows exactly that. Joe's here knows exactly where he is on this catwalk and everything like that. And they're just, they're just setting them up. Well, will you occasionally cut to those shots of, like, Jack younger? Just like watching everything. Like drinking coffee? Yeah, he does feel like a puppet, like controlling everything. And this is all part of his plan. And again, that's where the audience participation comes in. Because we know more than Warren Beatty knows. And it's we're running, we're running. And then, you know, as the senators just practice his speeches, riding away in the golf cart, bam, shot, assassinate. And we're like, wait, what? Isn't that great? Shot from way up, he was holding on the golf cart and it runs into the tables. And then, you know, it's like, look, there he is. And they don't point to the assassin. They point to Warren Beatty, and he runs and he's gonna, you know, reach the door and get away. And then bam, he's fucking shot dead. And it's like fucking shot dead. And then, oh my God. We circle back to the commission, giving yet another explanation that the death of Senator Hammond was the hands of a sole assassin, Joe Frady, played by Ward Beatty. And it's like, oh, here it is. It's like he to me was just set up as this patsy, you know, the entire time. But it's maybe that dude at the top of the Space Needle was too. Like, maybe he was looped into some trick and ran off and fell off the needle. I mean, I don't know, it's just it is this great, amazing set piece where you realize that, you know, the hero don't win here. The federal government or whomever. Well, and that and that brings me to the, the question of the movie, I think, is, you know, essentially it's like, like, can we ever beat, corruption? Can we ever actually be like the powers that be when they've decided that they're going to do something? I think that's sort of like what it is. And they get that the movie answers it and it's no, no. Okay. Yeah. And I mean, later in the 80s and 90s when you have like, Harrison Ford in the movies. Yeah, he can beat the corruption. He can win. Yeah. This is a much more realistic, pragmatic view, a response to the times, a response to Nixon's presidency, a response to Vietnam, and to response to everything of going back to this pessimism of like, hey, you try to fight the system and you die. You can't fight the federal government like we are. You may think you're getting closer and closer, but this goes so much higher than you like so, so much. And that the first thing Oswald said would, you know when he was being led away there, like, can you say anything? He's like, I'm a patsy. I've been set up. I'm a patsy. That's what he always said he was. Yeah, with Kennedy. So it again, it's a it's an absolute response to that. And I love this movie and it's so much fun to rewatch like even in quick succession because you're going to see you're going to pick out, you know, the Mountain Man assassin like oh yeah there he is. Oh, okay. Okay. That there is, there's a scene that cracks me up. I had to rewind it because I thought it was so ridiculous. So it's right at when the senator gets shot and the golf cart keeps going. It's crashing all the tables because we're seeing, like this. Very like from up top for, like, from the rafters. We're seeing this overhead shot of this car. Now that the dead guy's dead, is just going through all these tables until eventually it stops. But then because we're indoors, everybody, there's a cop car that is now coming in. You know, the police are here. This cop car is like. It's like speeding through, and it goes right past, and then it reverses and it's like, where did you think you were going? It's the one I'm seeing. It's just like, oh, wait, you can't go back. Go back? Yeah, exactly. It's like it's right there where it's right there where you do. Where you going? I don't see it, but it feels real. Like they did drive just straight to him. Yeah. You're right. It's it is funny. It's it's all like it looks messy. Like the whole thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I just thought, I mean, it had to be a choice like it had. Oh, yeah. Like someone to be like. So how do you want this cop car to drive onto this scene? Have them not know where it is. Okay. Oh, I love that. So you were a fan of this one? Yeah. You liked it as well. Very fun. Like, I like. So how excited are you? Very. All the President's Men. I love this film. I, I did talk about it a little after Robert Redford passed away. I did a solo episode remembering him and his career. I think the I think this is one of the best movies he was ever involved in. I don't, I know, I mean, I said a lot, I don't remember what I said was my favorite performance from him, but this would be right up there. I think he's great in this. This movie largely happened because of him. He optioned the book. He he produced the film Robert Redford. So he brought this all together. That's, you know how he tells it hiring, finding the cool, hiring Dustin, hiring all the great, supporting cast of guys. But All the President's Men is a movie. I was, kind of raised on because I watched it. I don't know, I just watched it a few times as a kid, enough to committed to memory. I watched it enough times to when I entered journalism school, when I was like 1920, I had seen it and had a working memory of it. And every semester at least every professor showed us this. Like, this is I think it is the journalism movie, not even the best movie made about journalism, which it is. I just think it's the journalism movie. And that's kind of a fascinating statement, considering it was made in 1976 and it is 2025, and we've gotten close with some other stuff. The journalism movie even won Best Picture, but I don't think that holds a candle to this. But I also don't think movies like spotlight would exist without this. So, you know, yeah, here we are, all the President's Men. I love this film. A true story about Bob Woodward and Carl Bernstein of The Washington Post helping to bring President Nixon down. And yeah, we're going to get into it. I definitely want to know how you feel, but I'm going to, you know, do a little timeline thing here like I did for Serpico and shampoo a little bit after we get your feelings. But how, you know, what's your relationship? Because you had seen this movie. So. Yeah, I remember watching this one because this was, I watched it purely because I remember being on a really big Dustin Hoffman kick. Yeah. But the thing is, is like, again, as you know, I talk about, you know, watching a movie like this when I was younger and not really appreciating what it was, I was not a very politically informed younger person. I didn't really know the significance of Watergate. I knew Nixon to be a not great guy. But until you ask, you know, depends on who you ask. Yeah, exactly. But that was sort of my relationship. So I remember watching this movie and, and not feeling the importance of what this was to what I realize now is this shit had just happened. And there's a movie being made about how this all went down, and it's crossing a lot of lines that you don't cross. So I was unaware of all of this. So I was watching the movie when I saw it is sort of like, man, these these guys are really just kind of going after a story, aren't they? And that was yeah, this is not an action film like, The Parallax View. This doesn't have any action set pieces. The set pieces are dialog. The set pieces are making phone calls and chasing down leads. And, yeah, six minute long takes the the action is chasing after Ben Bradlee in the newsroom. You know, try to get him before he goes on the elevator. Is it good. Is lead good? Oh my God. Yeah. So as, a young lad, it's not going to be the most like, entertaining thing because you're going, you know, this is a lot of talking, a lot of kind of, you know, leering around corners again. And let's go to order in these offices. Like, we're just watching people make calls and talk to people. I knew about politics. I knew about these big events because of my dad. My dad talked about this stuff, not like in a political way, just as genuinely like as a societal thing. Like he didn't have these sweeping political opinions about the JFK assassination. He'd just be like, I don't know, it's interesting. Let's take a look. And Manson, that whole thing, he was like, how did this happen? Like, how did this fucking guy manipulate this and get people to murder people? So I would just hear about this stuff from him and it's and yeah, I do want to talk about that because very similar to Serpico, All the President's Men is a movie that's released in 1976, but these are the events it's depicting have just happened. So real quick, judge, allow me maybe just like two minutes. June 17th, 1972. A few stand up fellows associated with Nixon's reelection campaign are burglarizing and bugging the Democratic National Committee headquarters at Washington. DC's Watergate Hotel. Gorgeous hotel. I stayed there last December. In fact, the next day, Woodward and Bernstein are reporting about it. Summer and fall 1972. Woodward and Bernstein published several stories per week on Watergate. They're doing this the entire time. November 1972. This is where the movie ends. Nixon wins his second term and a landslide election. That's one of the funny things about it. He was bugging the other side's committee, but like he won, it's one of the biggest landslides in American political history. January 1973 The Watergate burglars are convicted. Spring 1973 this is the gutting FBI director. White House aides. They're fired, they resign. The world learns. The Nixon tapes, his conversations in the Oval Office hearings begin. May 1974 the House Judiciary Committee begins impeachment proceedings against Nixon. June 15th, 1974 Simon and Schuster releases All the President's Men by Carl Bernstein and Bob Woodward. July 24th, 1974. The Supreme Court orders Nixon to surrender his Oval Office tapes. August 5th, 1974 The smoking gun tape is released, proving Nixon was trying to obstruct justice. August 8th, 1974 Nixon gives a televised address saying he will leave office at noon tomorrow, April 7th, 1976 the movie premieres in New York at LA, 1400 days from the Watergate break in to movie release, 608 days from Nixon resigning to the movie being released. That's insane. In any context. Yeah, but like, I'm not trying to be you know? Oh, whatever. But imagine 608 days after the January 6th, whatever you want to call it during that event, a movie is coming out that is going that is made by an Oscar nominated director. The movie is going to be nominated for Oscars. The movie is going to win Oscars for screenplay and supporting actor. It would never happen. It would. That would never happen today. Everyone is so afraid and stuff. So when I watch this, I'm like, this movie is an act of like, heroism, honestly. Like it's it's just fucking remarkable that they did this and they made this. Like, as in the movie stops before the book. The movie stops when he's winning a second term. We get that great shot of, you know, he's giving the inauguration speech or whatever it is, the acceptance speech of winning, and we're just zooming in on them. Still typing furiously. And, yeah, it's one of the reasons why I love 70s movies in particular. You can absolutely tell that the studios had not been run amok by corporations, which is going to happen in the 80s. And just like how Klute is ballsy because of her performance, The Parallax View is ballsy because it's saying outright that the federal government is capable of some wild shit. And here we have a true story based very heavily on a true story of two honest journalists who really help take down a president. And they made a movie about it very, very quickly. And it wasn't a schlocky piece of shit. It was an Oscar winning classic. Love it. This. It's so appropriate that we're ending like, season one of the new Hollywood film project with this movie. I love it. Yeah, yeah. And and I'm here to play folks and it's and it's really something because this is, you know, film has this ability to actually be a, what's the word? Well, it can provoke thought and provoke change. Yeah. It can't like, a movie just can't change something. But it can help, you know, I don't know, get into action. You know, it's like, oh, this isn't. Yeah. Let's look at this a little different way here. Yeah. And it's also in response to things, it's art. Art is always it. It's made for a reason. And if there's political unrest, that's a really, really big reason. We always champion here. On what are you watching the difference though, between, you know, you can make political art, which is exactly what this is. Oh, yeah, but your art does not have to be political. But if you want to, this is what it can do. And this is what it can mean, especially in that timeline that you just referenced. I always kind of think back to like, you know, punk rock as just a genre of music started out because, political unrest. There was it was all done as a, as a, as a, as an artistic response to what was going on around them. Man. It would be nice if we had more of that. You know, we, you know, talking about how, like, all these studios are run today by these corporations that especially as this swirling in this country we're in right now, we're all like, we're just in the midst of, of Netflix buying Warner Brothers. And, you know, you're just this shuffling going on of corporation, a corporation, a corporation where someone's just getting richer and richer and getting more and more, and everything's getting consolidated into one big funnel. Yep. It's just it's sort of just you just have to kind of sit back and look and be like, what is going on that we are all unaware of? Yeah. Like there's something happening right here. It would be great if a movie today or journalism would actually go into I'm not. I have no actual conspiracy here. The, conspiracy theory of what's happening right now, but it isn't really hard to kind of look around our country right now and kind of just be like, It's a little strange. Well, I've gone on this. Yes, it is the very least. Right jag before, and I'm not like it. I don't know how they're teaching journalism in college anymore. Like I went to journalism school. It was fucking rigorous. My journalism schooling was harder than any journalism job I had. We had to write so many stories per week. We were not accredited reporters. We were students. And they were like, I had to go to police stations and like, interview cops. That's how I did ride alongs with cops. Like, I would just walk in and go, hey, I'm a student reporter, like, and I would go to like meetings, you know, and when I was a journalist, it wasn't I wasn't working for like the Washington Post, for example. It wasn't that. But my God, did we have rigorous like, fact checking, editing all this that it just does not exist anymore. I open a Washington Post sometimes, and I'll sit there and shake my head and I'm going, well, I mean, I'm not saying this is poorly written, but there's opinions all over this, and we were never allowed to do that. So I can't really see this happening now. I mean, I don't know what journalism is, what journalists are respected like. No one has a household name anymore like Woodward and Bernstein, and the people whose names we know are usually mired in some sort of controversy based on the corporation they work for. So it. That's another thing like this movie and this whole time period is taking place in a time when, I mean, I think we kind of lived like this up until like the internet came along where you trusted journalists, you may not agree with them, but like you trusted that what they were saying was fact, that they were releasing facts that they dug up through tireless effort, that the average Joe is not able to dig up because we have other lives, but they're dedicating their lives to digging up information and sharing it with the world. They're not writing in their columns like Nixon needs to resign right now, which is something I read in news stories all the time right now that this president, our current president, needs to resign. He needs to do this. And it's, you know, whether I agree with that or not, I'm like that. That was never your job. Your job was to give me the information, not tell me how to feel about the information. And yeah, even I mean, I graduated from journalism school in 2008, and we were still it was not our job to explain, like our opinions on the information we were just supposed to give it. I stopped being and I mean, I stopped being writing news stories, I guess, in 2012 about and I, you know, 2016 is obviously when a lot of this stuff change, but it's, you know, I'm just going to jump to this now. And I didn't know if I was going to. But there's, there's a on the Blu ray, I have All the President's Men. There's a feature length documentary called All the President's Men Revisited, and it's I think it was made in 2012 and released in 2013, and that this documentary is more dated than All the President's Men, because Robert Redford is narrating it. And the crux of All the President's Men Revisited, this documentary is essentially, can you imagine a president doing this today? Can you imagine a president taping his own conversations in the Oval Office having the DNC bugged? Like, can you fathom it's so good this reporting existed so we can stop political corruption like this. And I'm I'm look, I'm watching this in 2025, shaking my head, going like our current president. Like shits a wiretap. Like that's his breakfast. Like that. Like he doesn't. Are you kidding? A wiretap to him is like fucking nothing. Like that's. Are we joking? And I don't care what your political leanings are. You all know I'm right. You know that dude we give a shit about? We go, we hear him on tapes, like, asking for vote like it goes on and on. So I'm shaking it like I'm shaking my head going. They clearly made this in the Obama era when like things were politically, you know, pretty lax and pretty chill and all that change and explode in 2016. But it's, it's it's a very interesting movie to watch with all this context in mind now, because we live more so than ever in a politically charged world where I never used to talk about politics, like going out or like at a social gathering, you can talk about fucking Bill Clinton and Al Gore. We didn't really talk about Bush like you didn't, you know? No. And now it's the only thing people talk about it or it's the main thing people talk about. So it's not even a rant. I'm just saying it. It is crazy. I've been so engrossed in the journalism profession. I was for so long, for so many years, and now I just did my toe in it and, you know, put on the news for ten minutes and I'm going, this is the news. Like you're supposed to be reporting the news and you're I mean, I read journalism articles like major publications that end with exclamation points, like their sentences. And I've got, what the fuck is this? Like we were never allowed to use that anyway. Yes, I love this movie. Great relationship. I mean, yep. From from the get go with the gunshot typing seemed one shot, one plane. Hey, hold hold hold hold wam. I mean, this movie won best sound. This won the Oscar for best sound. How that never happens for, like, a drama with a bunch of talking. Oh, my God, it's so effective. Yeah. Gunshots use. It's typewriting sounds. I mean, you you take that. You have the entire sound of what's going on in these, and in the, in the office throughout the whole entire movie, as people are walking and talking like this, this, this really did. I mean, I mean, even look at any of, like, The West Wing. Oh, so much of all of this is this idea of, like, walking as fast as you can to bring a piece of paper to the other side of the room to tell them about this, bring about this, and this movie's just doing it the whole entire time. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Always this this rush tension. And it doesn't really make you feel like time is passing, but a lot of time is passing. It just it's so it chooses it seems so. Well, like I got to say, this script is written by the great William Goldman. This is a hell of a year for him. He also wrote Marathon Man, which came out the same year. And you know, I was joking in that episode that I can't believe he didn't win the Oscar. He wasn't even nominated. It's because he won the Oscar this year. Like, it's just it's so good. It's such a firecracker script. And Pakula, with the help of Redford, has cast it. I mean, F Murray Abraham is one of the cops who finds the burglars like the Watergate break in is so great. And then we cut to the Washington Post offices. Jack Warden, Martin Balsam, one of my all time favorites there. You know, I just love him so much. Dustin Hoffman as Bernstein's, like, lurking in the background. They send Bob Woodward in to go investigate. And by like ten minutes into the movie, we have a pretty good grasp on the personalities. And we gather because like in real life, these two did not get along like Bob Woodward was a WASPy Republican. Dustin or Bernstein rather was a, you know, chain smoking liberal kind of. He's they portrayed very, very well. The real guys were involved in the making of the film and this is their characterizations are pretty spot on, and I just love getting to know them very, very quickly. Like Bernstein is annoying, impulsive, pushy. Woodward is very polite but persistent. Like in When You're in the Court. He just keeps following that guy and coming back like, I have nothing left to say. I was never here. He's like, well, wait a minute. If you and he would do that, like you would just keep, hey, we got to quit. Like they're when they're driving away from, like, that would be Chelsea. Like. Well, why would you be? But we might. We may as well go back and ask her this. Knock on the door again. That's the shit they would do. Like just being annoying and pushy, but getting the information slowly, slowly, slowly. And this is something about the movie that is sort of like when I was like kind of going back and I was like one of our new Hollywood, you know, category questions, your favorite quotes from these movies. And it's it was hard to pin down in this because so much of them aren't necessarily quotes, because it's just the humor of the circumstance, in the situation, in the way these people are reacting to it. So, exactly. I love that scene where they're in the car arguing about what should we just go back? Yeah. And then it cuts to then being back just doctor like or. Yeah, exactly. And and it's but that's also editing. That's also you know, it's just this it's just it's on, it's on to the next, on to the next, on to the next, on to the next. And you feel that in the relationship, you feel that in the, in the pacing of the movie, it's is really, really, a fantastic piece of filmmaking right here. Oh, yeah. I mean, we kind of I kind of breezed over the opening credits, but again, great tone, setting credits where it's just that thin font. And like, Gordon Willis is just cooking in this. And, you know, I, I also have to say, as someone who was born and raised in a suburb of Washington, D.C., I grew up, it was very normal for me to just go to the city and go in. When I got a car, that's where I'd go to see my Indy movies. I moved away for a bit. Now I'm back and I, you know, work in the city. So I'm very kind of I love the city. And there's not that many good. There's not that many stellar, amazing Washington, DC movies or great movies that are set in DC that I'm like, that wasn't shot there at all. This is like, this gets to the geography. This is a very, very small city. All the places that they go to would not be that long to drive. And then, of course, there's the note of they recreated so meticulously the Washington Post offices in California. They recreated them that this one production design as well, because it was such, it looked so similar, like it just looked exactly the same. And I yeah, I appreciate all that. Art direction is what they called it back then. But yeah, it won. Screenplay for William Goldman, art direction, best Sound and best supporting actor for the great Jason Robards, who we will get to. But yeah, it's a masterful film. Everything, everything about it. And one of the first things that, you know, to your point of saying about journalism is, you know, from the first phone call, that kind. Well, I mean, you get Robert Redford, who's basically kind of starts this whole entire investigation of just because he's sort of like talking to that lawyer and he's like, you're a lawyer and you're here. Why? Well, yeah. And then he hears the guy like one of the burglars go, you know, who do you work for? You know, I did some, contracting security services. For who? The CIA, and then that Redford's reaction, he's like, Holy shit. Literally. It's a holy shit. Then wham! We just cut back to the Washington Post. Offices are fantastic, and so we're watching the bare bones of how to investigate like. And the first thing he does, and this is one of my favorite scenes of the whole movie, to kind of set this off, Ray is he goes to the other woman and like his secretary or someone else's coworker and he goes, you can call the white House, right? Yeah. And, and and it's the first thing he does. He's just sort of like, I'm just going to call the white House as the first thing. I love that shot. He's like, he's like, how do I get an outside line? And we're like to the side of him. And then yeah, he just starts call it making calls. And that these are my favorite scenes of the movie. Him, Redford on the phone drilling leads down and you hear like he does that one. And he worked for. Yeah him him. And there's a pause and the CIA and the CIA or it's like. And the white House and, you know, that was one of the things I learned as a journalist and in school was, don't talk too much, especially if you're on the phone. Just ask a question and let them answer. And when you leave people in silence, it's amazing how nervous they get to fill that silence. And a lot of people will just keep talking and they don't know what they're revealing. And you're like, you just sit there and give, like this kind of blank look like you're interested in what they're saying. But don't don't keep interjecting with like, yeah, yeah, right, right. So yeah, yeah. Just let them keep talking. And that's how you get leads in the scribbling. The doodling. Oh it's just so good. The scratching out when you get like a big clue. And then circling something and like, no, it's this, it's this, It's fantastic. It's so it's a, it's a masterclass in phone acting, I'll tell you that much right now. You're goddamn right I actually don't know if he was talking anyone. You. I would think so. But yeah, he's he's fantastic. Like, I don't know if it's the first one, but it one of them he like flubs a name. He says the wrong name and then laughs. And that was an accident. And they just kept it in and yeah it's great. I mean that stuff would happen. And like, you just hung up with someone and now you, you know, call one, you ended it. But then now you're on with caller two and like, should they get a call back? Caller one and it's going around. And you know what? If you catch someone and they've just woken up and they say something, you know, as long as you make it clear that they're on the record because you work for the paper, anything goes. And it's yeah, it's great, great film. It's it's so good. I mean, everybody like Redford and Hoffman like the way that they're tracking everything. You get Hoffman in the background, all fidgety. This is, I think, their first really great scene together where Woodward is finally, or sorry, you get Bernstein in the background, just like kind of, you know, check and stuff. Chain smoking. And I love this scene of Woodward filing pages like one at a time. And in Bernstein, this goes at it's them. And then, you know, he catches him and just ending with a hammer William Goldman line you're right. Yours is better. I don't mind what you did. I mean, the way you did it boom. And oh it's perfect. And then there, you know, off it's these are two guys who didn't really, like get along that well, but they came together in a common goal. And they had they meshed their their personalities, their clashing personalities. They use that to their benefit and their journalistic styles. And it did it. Did it work? Did it ever? I love, yeah. When he calls, like the librarian on the phone, he's like, yes, I know, Mr. Hunt. It ends with, in fact, I've never met Mr. Hunt. It's just great. Yeah, yeah. And then that Mr. Hunt, I mean, sorry, I do it. All the connections here. Howard Hunt. Right? He's, he was a big key figure for Nixon. If you go to the fucking Irishman, there's a whole gag about how, the Irishman, Robert De Niro has to go buy guns from this guy. Big ears. But don't talk about his ears because they're big. That's Howard Hunt. It's you know. Oh, yeah, it's all connected. Just like the character Joe Pesci plays. And JFK is also in The Irishman, a fairy named fairy, and he references him. Oh, it's connected. Don't I love it? Don't I love it, folks. You can go right from the Teamsters and The Irishman to Casino, because that's the Teamsters built Vegas casino. It's all connected. Let's keep going here. But yes, genuinely like watching these two actors and these two characters find their groove is. It's kind of magical. You just feel their chemistry going with each passing scene. They know how to, like, walk into a lead or like knock on a woman's door and get info and like, go back and not do it. They're not doing it in a way that certainly it's not illegal. You know, they're just doing it in a way that is very persistent and oh my God. The first shot of Jason Robards is Ben Bradlee. I get chills walking out of the office putting on his suit jacket. It's a long shot. He walks all the way up to the boys and one glorious shot, the way he sits down and puts his feet up and he's just smiling and looking through it, and he just smiles and look at him and smiles and looks at him. You haven't got it. Oh my God, it's it's so good. They're like fighting for it. And Jack try to fight for it. So calm, so commanding. You know, I learned a lot about and bad Ben Bradlee as a journalist and his boss who will come up later, who is a key figure in journalism, Katharine Graham, that's is who Meryl Streep played in the post. And Tom Hanks played Ben Bradlee in the post. That Spielberg movie. I didn't really like that movie, actually. I thought I was going to like it. The post basically ends right where All the President's Men begins. That's kind of how they've, like, set it up. But anyway, wow, I did that's. Yeah. Okay. Yep. That that's wild. So Katharine Graham like owned she can't her family owned the Washington Post and later they're you know when they're on the phone with a source, he says something like a source says something very nasty about her. And the only thing we really hear about Ben Bradlee is like, he really said that about Miss Graham. So. But yeah, she was an extremely important journalistic figure who is not featured in this movie. But yes, Meryl Streep does play her in Steven Spielberg's The Post. It's all connected, baby. It's you got to do is listen and it's I not he made the film, okay? I know he did. And then like 30, even 35 minutes into All the President's Men, we get we're starting to get this like, now we're getting the really like cool. Thriller spy shit. Like, the music kicks up in Woodward. It's like, call somebody slipping notes like, don't you know, call me again if you want to get in touch with me. Put a red flag in your plant on your balcony. Brilliant. Shit. This is like 70s New Hollywood. And we get our first meeting with the super serious Deep Throat. The identity, you know, of whom would not be known for for scores for decades. And it's it's just I, I love the process of watching Redford leave his apartment, get in one cab, switch it to Kennedy Center because it's crowded. Switch again. I actually know the parking garage they met in. It's in Arlington, right over the bridge in Roslyn. Yes. I've been there to pay my respects. It does. And I have, I have and yeah, we we I mean, they didn't reveal the source of I'm like, oh my God, I don't remember. It was like 2005 or something when the Deep Throat source was revealed and he, you know, they made that movie about him with Liam Neeson. Mark felt very high up the FBI, but he really helped. And you know, I love these scenes of like, Hal Holbrook smoking and not giving, just giving these little breadcrumbs to Woodward, like, follow the money, follow the money. It's it's so good. The movie is just full of these amazing set pieces. I mean, and it's also like that Deep Throat probably. I mean, one of it developed its own trope like that is used in so many. I mean, X-Files, like they had a whole entire villain for seasons that was just Deep Throat type stuff to like. That's actually make him a character. The cigaret smoking Man. And, and it's like, and it's just sort of like, this is just been going on and it's this movie started it. Do you understand the meaning of that term, why he's called that? Well, I don't and I could only really begin to start talking into which I feel like I would talk myself into a guess, but I'm scared of where that guess will go. Well, hold onto your butts, folks, because in 1972, a mainstream porno film called Deep Throat was on to it to absolutely massive success. The movie at 61 minutes long, costs about 50 grand to make it, and it made more than 30 million, like some reports say, it made 50 million. I mean, this is a huge hit. Yes, it's based on that. That was, a story at the time. It was a popular movie at the time. So an editor at the Post thought it would be funny to call this crazy anonymous source deep Throat. So yeah, that's I mean, I could tell I mean, why the movie is called Deep Throat is a slightly different conversation that I could get into, but that might be a violation of the what are you watching morals? And I also want to say I learned all of this. Oh, you want to do it okay. We have morals. Yeah. So a woman and the woman in the adult film finds out that she can only finds out that her. I'm sorry, folks, her clitoris is all the way in the back of her throat, and she can only achieve orgasm. By what? A deep throat and a large Johnson. And do you see it all? I've seen the film. I've absolutely seen the film. I've seen the documentary Inside Deep Throat about the making of the film. Would anyone like to know how I learned all this for the first time? Not watching the movie, of course, but how I learned what Deep Throat was that it was based on a porno. Yes, that's right, I learned it from my mother when I was 12. When I asked her what it meant, she didn't tell me what the movie was about, but she said, oh, it's you know, based on this popular porno. Oh, that I think she saw in the theaters. I think a lot of people did. All right. Well, I mean, what are you watching? Film. It made it made a lot of money. Made a lot of money. Sex sells. You're goddamn right it does. Nixon gets a nomination. Hey. Keep working. We get that great Jane Alexander meeting the 20 cups of coffee. I love when they're back. Oh. That's, Yeah. It's so good. They were there. Battle of Harvard together. And he just throws Redford a cookie at Redford's like, I don't want a cookie. It's shit. You just believe that. It's that Hoffman is, like, keyed up on a bunch of coffee and cigarets and just fucking motored around. It's one of my favorite lines, because Redford is like, cause they're just got this, like, rat a tat back and forth, and Dustin Hoffman just goes, you be paranoid, too. If you were operating at 70 cups of coffee. Yeah. God, yeah. It's great. And that they, you know, Jack warden has a great line early on when he's trying to convince Martin Balsam to give these guys a story. Like they're young, but they're hungry. Remember when you were hungry and you feel that, like, like journalists, they. These guys did not make a lot of money. They. This is not a high paying job. It still isn't. They, you know, they were runts in Washington Post there that we have those great meetings with the editors. I love those guys. And they're like, should we give it to, you know, someone like bigger, someone more seasoned or. No, it's fine. Let's, you know, stick with it. Bradley's always there, just kind of with his eyebrows raised, just kind of sitting there thinking about everything. It's so good. And, yeah, the, you know, this is where we get the Katharine Graham, the Katie Graham comment, and that kind of helps Bradlee get on board because he's like reading the notes. And I love when he finally, you know, is accepting of one of their stories. And he's like, run that baby. And he just skips out of the office. So good. I love Robards in this, I love him. It was a tough year, Oscar wise, but I love that he won like Olivier was nominated for Marathon Man. It was a tough year. You get the feeling from this. One of my favorite parts of his performance is like for yeah, he is like the boss. And it's sort of like he kind of comes off as like this hardass, but then it's really that he's just trying to make sure everything's covered. But he gets excited by this. Exactly. Because back then it was more important. Most important for the story to be right now. Yeah, it is most important for the story to be first. Who can get their little blurb on line first so that that tweet starts to go viral, that fucking nonsense. Like, that's what it's about now. Yeah. I mean, we get to that scene, that fantastic scene. It might be my favorite scene in the movie where they need one other source to confirm this big story. Bradley's leaving the building, they need the Halderman confirmation. Like. And then you got Dustin Hoffman counting to ten. Yeah, he goes and convinces Woodward that. No, it's confirmed that I love Redford. Like he confirmed it. And in one shot we get I got I get chills. Jesus Christ, they just run. They sprint through the newsroom after burn Ben Bradlee. And I mean, it looks like when I was watching the making of it looks like a straight track, but it feels like we're just weaving in it how to stuff. And they're getting we're going in one direction. They're also getting closer to us. And it's just this one. It's like the whole movie has been building up to this moment of like chasing them down. And the only reason they're chasing him down, like, you know, we can run the story tomorrow. It's okay, fellas, but they want to meet deadline. They're like, it's confirmed. He goes, it is. And then fine. Run it. Yeah. You just feel it all. Like the whole entire movie. Like you feel like the tension. You feel the importance. And I don't know how you do this either. Like, I was thinking about it as I was watching it, I was like, you're building this investigation from nothing. You've got these two actors where you feel they're of like weight, of how it's important, but they're also just serving their scene. So it's like, how is the movie kind of creating? There's not really a lot of music going on. So you don't really have like this kind of manipulation. It is the sound. It's there. There's something that's subconsciously building to the point where even if you weren't like when I was younger, when I didn't know what was going on, I wasn't really tracking the specifics of what was really happening here, but I was feeling I go, man, this matters. Like what is going on? Like they need to like they need to run to catch him. Exactly. All this stuff, I just, you know, you just think about it, like, as, like the director. It's like, how do we actually visually in, cinematically communicate this? And they fucking do it. It's about bringing all the right people together, like Redford, he does a commentary on the movie on the DVD and Blu ray, and he talks a lot about like, I think this movie lives on in is resonant because of the quality of people we assembled, like they are perfect for their parts. Redford and Hoffman are perfect for their parts. Those characters, all those guys, Jack Ward and Marty, Bassam, Jason Robards, everyone is perfectly cast. Hal Holbrook is perfect, perfect. It won best screenplay. It's tremendously written, I can. My favorite line of the movie is coming up here toward the end. It, you know, it won Best Sound. So like the technical aspects are taking care of it. Shot by one of the best cinematographers ever. So you just bring everyone together and taking it seriously. They knew what they were doing. They knew the stakes of this. Like they they knew I mean, it's it's just wild that it all came out as well as it did. That's what I mean. That's when we say like they don't make it like this anymore. It's that's so true here. I don't think anyone would necessarily have the audacity to tell a really commanding story this way about, a very serious political issue. You know, the whole time throughout the movie, the Nixon administration is basically saying, like, these reports are false. So they have that pressure on them to that. These journalists are opportunistic. They're lying. They just don't like me. And they're going that's happening the whole time. And I love the hammer of Bradley writing down like his response to all this. And it just says, we stand by our story. And then you watch to him and he goes, fuck it, let's stand by the boys. Oh my God. It's just one of my favorite lines. Also a great PG movie with quite a few fucks in it because PG 13 didn't exist. And it's just I always got a kick out of that. Like watching it young. They say fuck a lot, but it's still, you know, gets right in there under the PG 13, which I feel very strongly that they should still be able to do. You're allowed one fuck in an R-rated movie now. And I think that's absurd or sorry, and a PG 13 movie now. And I think that's absurd. I think there are a lot of really good movies that have educational, inherent cultural value like this one, that, you know, the barrier to entry would be a little less if they were PG 13. Just my opinion. It's what I mean. I don't I don't think we should have any ratings. Oh, really? That's where I'm going. Shame, shame. Hey why not you know. Well, okay, now I see your point. Hey, why not I you think I'm going to disagree with you? Die, my love. It's all going to die, my love. I you know what an eight year old I think I would rather I think I would rather have there be no ratings than these ridiculous rules. With these ratings. The rules are way too stringent. I absolutely believe that, like, they're it's just it's ridiculous at this point. And it's it's like I was telling you, it's like driving in Italy, you know, like there's no rules. Rules. And everyone figures it out and everyone's better for it. The only reason why we've got the shit that we have in America is because there's too many rules of the road, and everyone gets bent out of shape because it's sort of like you cut you. You broke the rule. You're not supposed to do that. And, you know, people kill each other for this shit. That's a great analogy you got. You just nailed that. And then the movie ends. The movie ends with that great straight shot of, yeah, we get the iconic yard kind of conversation with Bradley, and then that's it. And as Nixon is being sworn in for his second term, which he won by landslide, Woodward and Bernstein are typing away. And then the movie stops here. But we get that. Great. You know, the type written headlines of like Nixon's Downfall. And it ends with the headline he resigned boom. It's it's one of the movie done like you like the the feeling that you get like like You only get that feeling once with an ending like that, like that, that that ending literally takes your breath away. You're like, because you don't expect it, but it just dawns on you immediately how perfect it is. Yeah. And you're just, Oh, my God. And then you leave the theater and you're just like, like, whoa, it's all timer ending. He knows how to open and close. His films, like all of them are memorable and open. Even the cold opens or the title sequences, like, they're such good tone setters. Yeah. And the endings always have these hammers, and you're, like, even presumed innocent with Harrison Ford, which I love. It's like the opening shot is an empty, like, juror box with these gorgeous wooden chairs. And as Harrison Ford is doing voiceover, we just push in and then at the very last shot is Harrison Ford doing voiceover. And we just push out just I mean, very similar to the Parallax View. So but that was but that, that was really I got to say, I felt I'm glad we covered this the way that we did, because I felt like with all the President's Men, you you've been you've been. If we didn't include this into a whole entire, three parter. This was the Alex Show for the for the All the President's Men section. You're, like, just a lot to say, a lot to say, but but in terms of just not just the movie, but journalism. Yeah. All of this and, that was, I just got to sit back and watch that. So, so thank you for the show. I hope you like the history lesson. Yeah. It's like, come, you know, come to me any time for some, conspiracy theories. Nixon, JFK, Johnson, it's all. Oh, it's all connected with the war in Vietnam. Oh, you better believe it. Lying son of a bitch. Johnson. Yeah. So let's do let's go on to the favorite part. Supersize. Supersized new Hollywood categories. What we're going to do is we're combining like, all three. So you can, you know, just talk about the three of them. Freewheeling as you wish. Yes. What makes these three movies New Hollywood? So for Klute, like I was saying during it, it's sex. I think it's gender. Yeah, it's the taboo nature of it being, frankly, carefree. Even the way that she talks about it and not just the going into the areas of her actual profession of it, but nobody is thrown off by the things that are being talked about or mentioned or, it's because, again, it's not gratuitous. There is no actual sex scene. There is like, like a tiny bit of nudity, but it's, it's it's just it's like it's Europe. It's sort of like, oh, it's sex. Oh, okay. Yeah. Which is where the 70s directors, you know, they were taking major inspiration from the 60s directors of Europe. They were not treating it like it was a sin. And, and this was 1971. So I think for Klute, that is what gives it that new Hollywood quality is the is the sex, for parallax view, and not dissimilar to, All the President's Men. But the Parallax View is to just pose that our government is, all corrupt and all powerful and that it will always win by killing the hero. It leaves us with, controversial, scary taste in our mouths. Here's a movie where it's sort of like, hey, there's something kind of fucked up going on in the higher ups here. And, we're going to make a big action movie. Kind of like use that. Yeah. And so that's what I think about for for Parallax View and then for all the President's Men is the timeline. It's to take a real life situation that it was probably one of the most controversial things in American politics at the time. And then to just release the movie the way that it is. And not have a political stance to make, just being like, this is what it was. Boom. Yeah. It's not an overtly political film. Like it's not was a Republican like, it's not. Yeah. And and that is important too. I like all those. It's my general thought just on the trilogy as a whole. What makes it New Hollywood? There is a very direct but not explicit. We don't give fuck like we're not fucking around anymore with these three movies. Like, we know we're not going to show prostitution. It's like this. Oh, they live in these shit. I mean, you know, you get the one junkie like her friend is a junkie, but they show a different aspect of that side in the characterization of Brie and 74 is like, hey, yeah, this is fun. We'll do it under the auspices of having an action movie, and we'll put like, the sexiest man alive in it and all that stuff. But that movie is saying some very politically heavy things. And it it's, it's like it could be a risk. And that, you know, I imagine some powers that be politically were watching it and going like, all right, yeah, whatever. It's fine. We'll just it's this baby guy being a problem, you know? And then all the President's Men. Yeah. It's exactly what we talked about with, Serpico. Just how the 70s were really unafraid to. It's it's not like you can still have movies based on events that just happened, but now they're often done with such heavy political leanings, or they're just not good. It's or and then you'd get something like, I mean, a really, really good one and a tough one is United 93, which was released less than five years after 911. But that again, it's not we're not seeing any politicians in that movie. We never cut to a big I mean, we have some military like goings on, but we're never cutting to like the big wigs doing stuff. It's a pretty on the ground. And then, you know, in the plane movie and that works really well. But it's not it's not necessarily calling anything out the way, particularly Parallax View and All the President's Men are. It's not like you make anyone to task. It's just like, here's this horrific thing that happened. But, I mean, it's all the President's Men. They're literally taking the president to task like it's crazy. Yes, crazy. And I don't see that happening. Hey, we'll see. Maybe in 2030, there's, an Oscar winning film about the nonsense that's all going on now, I don't know, we will end one way. And it's very tough because, yeah, there is a it's, I mean, one battle after another actually does a very good job of putting that all out there. So everyone knows it doesn't take a side, to any of it. No. But but you are absolutely keenly aware that it's sort of like. All right, well, we're talking about there's some real stuff that's going on right now that we're all aware of that is being represented in this film. But that's not what the movie's about in any sort of way. So and everyone is sort of like, I even remember even seeing that and giving like a feeling of like, yeah, that's okay. All right. He's showing this, showing some stuff here. And but that was good. I think like, I don't know how you go forward in this industry. I feel like you have to be a certain kind of director. Something where you have the ability to. And there's only, like, for, like, American directors that could potentially have some sort of, like, carte blanche to being like, no, I'm going to make this the way that I want to make it and fuck you if you don't want to deal with it. But what story do you tell? You know, I mean, it's just it's a it's a whole thing. But this, this idea that art is, run by the corporation. So no one's actually going to be unafraid anymore. That's that's stakes. Yeah. Unless you have, like, a Sean Baker. But you he he can't scale up to like. And I don't think he's inherently political, but someone who's going totally outside the system and making something like. Yeah, that just doesn't really exist in America presently. I mean, some try, but they don't. It just doesn't like, get there and no. Yeah, that's what is Alan J. Pakula's best film. What if I was speaking from, not objectively. I think his best film is All the President's Men. Agreed. What is your favorite? Klute. There you go. Yeah, my distinction as well. My favorite is The Parallax View. I love that movie. It's my new it's my my new favorite. I've seen All the President's Men so many times, but I think that is his objective. Best. Yes. Yeah. Yes. Agreed, agreed. All right. Is this Blank's best performance? So is Klute. Jane Fonda's best performance? I mean, she's great in this. I'll go first, but I honestly. And I've been urging you to watch this, and I would love to cover this. Her the role she was in right before and Cindy Pollack's They Shoot Horses, Don't they? Is just like, yeah, you've been telling me about this. Wow, man. I mean, but that that's like a more me type of movie she gets to that. Is she gets the levels of desperation. And I mean, the movie's fucking insane. It's about like a dance marathon, which they used to do during the Great Depression. The winner will win, like 100 bucks and like 100 people. Sign up for it and you fucking dance until you some people die. This goes on for days, days and days. It's like the long walk. It's exactly what it is, in fact. Actually. I mean, they're not killing you. If you fall over when you're out, you're out. And it is. Yeah, man. It is gruesome and brutal and I love that movie. But yeah. Klute, I you know, she also won an Oscar for Coming home. But I like her performance include More Than Coming Home. But yeah, this is like top tier of her work. And I got to be honest, I'm not, I'm not all that familiar with her work. I really. Yeah, yeah, it's kind of crazy. I looked up her filmography, like, in terms of, like, answering this question, and, and I've sort of realized that I'm much more familiar with her as the in the human being that she is and what she's gone on to do, with her life and her and the way that she's viewed amongst her peers. And, so when I looked at just her acting work, I'm like, I kind of live in a little bit of like a Jane Fonda universe a little bit. So, I don't have enough to really back up other than, like, then my answer to this question is like, yes, because I need to see more. Yeah. Like her early ones walk on the wild side. She's in cat blue. The chase here barefoot in the park here. I think she's still kind of Henry Fonda's daughter. And then I mean, really, I think it's they shoot horses, don't they? That which is 69. And then her next movie is Klute, which is 71. That turns her into Jane Fonda, I think. Yeah, yeah, she was doing some radical stuff, like she wanted to be in a Jean-Luc Godard movie in the 70s, and it's one that now a lot of people have seen. She wanted to she just picked, like, funky stuff. She was in Julia, which won some Oscars. Coming Home Comes a Horseman, which I mentioned, The China Syndrome, another good kind of paranoid thriller about, what is that? You know, like a nuclear reactor. Yeah. The Electric Horseman, which I watch, which is, Robert Redford won 9 to 5 on Golden Pond. These were like, big movies. The morning after a Sidney Lumet movie, I won. And then in 19, 1990, she's not in another movie until 2005 because of a marriage. She just kind of took a long break and then came back. But yeah, I mean, she's great and extremely politically active. There's actually a documentary about her on, HBO now that I watch that is really good. She speaks very, candidly about her career, her life. I liked it a lot in her marriages. Yeah. She. Yeah, she's she's she's a very, very, Yeah. Open person. Like, every time I've ever seen her, it's always when she's been older talking about her life. And I was like, yeah, I want to hang out with her. Yeah. She seems like a great hang. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Is Parallax View Warren Beatty's best performance? We ask this question in the shampoo episode. I still maintain that shampoo is my favorite performance from him, but it's Warren Beatty, parallax, and Bonnie and Clyde. I'm going to agree that it's shampoo. I don't think anything gets better than that. Okay, okay. You know, a very popular podcast just covered shampoo. And I listen to it and I'm just going to say ours is better. Our absolute is better. I'm just they had a really famous director in their episode and some people know what I'm talking about, but I, I, I thought ours went a little more in-depth and I would tell I would be like, shit. They covered stuff that I didn't track, but I liked ours better. I'm just going to say I'm just going to say it were the best movie podcast going today. Like, that's just bar none. I've got. I can get that far thousand percent. We are 1,000% with it. So the size of it's a lock, says the guy who listens to no movie podcasts, including his no. I list. No, I do, I listen to I, I well, I don't listen to everything like I don't listen to like in their entirety, but I do keep a very sort of like what I like to do is I like to kind of like turn one on, start a little bit and take a little bit from the beginning, take a little bit the middle, take a little bit at the end, just so I can assess what's going on out here. And then I'm like, no, it's still us. Oh, you do that with our podcast. Is that what you're saying? No, I do that with others. So I know what the lay of the land is like. That's our guy. That's smart. And with ours, it's still with ours. It's still us. It's still. It's still us. And then with ours, I will, I will, I like to put ours on because I don't really so much review them as much as I like to hang out with us. Yeah, which is weird, because I do, I I'll forget certain pods and then I'll turn some of them on, and then I will like, be hearing us talk, and then I will think about what I would say. And then I say it. That's a trip that happens every time. It is. It is funny. I definitely happens to me. I'm in the stage where I'm like not remembering things we recorded, which is, you know, I've been doing this for five and a half years. So it's a lot of words. A lot of dialog. Is All The President's Men, Robert Redford or Dustin Hoffman's best performance? I my favorite Hoffman is Marathon Man, which I revealed but in the Marathon Man episode but I, I this might be my favorite Redford I love him is Bob Woodward. I was really taken with the great Waldo Pepper, which I had never seen. I watched after he died, but I it might be Bob Woodward. I mean, I don't know, it's tough. I said no to both. I, I've really like him in Butch Cassidy. For Dustin Hoffman. Yeah. It's either the marathon man or Kramer versus Kramer. I still like I still love his performance in that. I also wrote death of a salesman because I forgot about that one. And I think that even though that was that was a TV movie. But, he I mean, there's a reason why, you know, Willy Loman is looked at in, in theater is one of, like, the all time great, like, written like, male characters. And for a long time, that TV performance was, like, the standard for Willy Loman. It's like, oh, watch Dustin Hoffman and Willy Loman. And it really is that good. Yeah, he is good in that he's very good. What's your favorite shot in all three film? Or like, if we were doing Best Cinematography, who would you give it to? It's a tough one. It's a tough one. I actually I would go with The Parallax View because it has such little dialog, and I think the cinematography is really playing an important role in that. But noting that, like, all three look amazing and Gordon Willis did a superb job with all of them. But I just like the choices in The parallax. You. I love the high shot of all the tables down below the, just as the example of that. I mean, the opening of Klute is my favorite shot. Oh, because that is. Yeah. I can't remember the last time I got up out of my chair. Pause the movie just because of cinematography. Fantastic. So good. For Parallax View, I think it has to be the whole opening, the way that that's the way that it's building all of that tension without knowing what's going to happen, the way that we see all of this and then like that one shot on the roof, like it's it's almost like the cinematography is like when you don't, when it's, there's nothing fancy going on. Yeah, it's it doesn't move a lot. It's like these still shots, a lot of. Yeah. And then all the President's Men. Oh, this is good. I, I love the shot of when they're at the library and, and it's like, yeah, the bird's eye view, because it it's not necessarily like, oh, this is a cool I mean, it's a cool looking shot for sure, but it shows you like all of a sudden all these two guys are doing is searching through library cards. Yeah, they're like, and this is the very beginning of this investigation and the by the fact that the camera is zooming up, it just makes it feel insurmountable. Like they're trying to do this one task, and this is a needle in the haystack type of thing that they're doing. And even when they get this, the longer road is still ahead. Oh, yeah. You just you felt that in just this one shot. So that's why I like the shot is because it's there's so much more that that shot is representing other than just a cool shot of it, you know, going up and. Yeah. And then my favorite one from that is what I describe when they're running after when they're running that one, that would be the second one. Yeah. Yeah. And then if I had to give it to one, I'm giving it to Klute. I figured, yeah. Hey, no, no, there's. But it's so it's so different though, because like, you know, like, like All the President's Men is covering such a scope, and cloud is very, you know, it's intimate in a lot of its shots and setups and cinematography. But I mean, like, even that one sequence of when down Solondz going up with the, the flashlight and he's trying to find Tom. Yeah. So. Yeah. So Klute. Yes. Klute, baby. We've been talking about favorite scenes and set pieces, but I'll go quick. Like for Klute. It's honestly probably that setup that we've talked about so much because you don't really know what's going on, but it's so jarring. And then in parallax, you, I mean, God, to pick just one, like the tension on the plane is so good. Yeah. If I'm allowed to say the entire, finale in Atlanta, I would say that because it's this brilliant set piece where, like, how's it all going to unfold? And then All the President's Men, I mean, it's just, it's those damn phone calls I love those scenes so much. Making, calling all the leads, calling them back, scribbling the notes, I love it. I was actually going to say the exact same thing for all the President's Men. It would be nice. It would. It would always be the phone call scenes here. It's it's just something that's there. And then, let's see for Parallax View. Favorite scene. I'm going to give it up to the montage. Oh, God, I love that. Yeah. I mean, it's just because it's such a departure from the whole movie and it's, and it's a pretty kind of ballsy move to do, even though it's the same thing recycled over. But the way it's done and for how long it goes on, I'll give it to that. And then for Klute, favorite, I, therapy scenes, all the therapy scenes. Very. Would you have those? Those are, those are, that is A+ acting by Jane Fonda and all of those scenes. Love it. Great choice, great choice. Favorite quotes. We can I mean, my favorite from all three is let's stand by the boys. Oh, God. There's so many like William Goldman Gems and All the President's Men, but they're all three. Like the script, The Parallax View is not in the dialog, it's in the setups. It's in the situational setups of what's happening, and we're watching it. Klute is kind of the same way, although, you know, there is great dialog. But I mean, if we were just talking about quotes, it's All The President's Men. There's so many great ones. It's just great. There's so many. I do have one in here that you'll like because I was saving it. Is James Robert? Oh. He says I can't do the reporting for my reporters, so I have to trust them, and I don't trust anybody, but damn right, that's, that's the toward the end. Yes. Yeah, absolutely. What would be your double feature pick for any of these movies? You go Parallax View, All the President's Men, because those are your political ones. So you got to double that feature together. It's not exactly political. It's it's it's it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a conspiracy type thing. But you got the political aspect in both parallax, you know, all the President's Men. But you gotta leave. You can't you can't have all the President's Men in any double feature and not have it be the second one, because you got to close out with that ending. Yeah, yeah. Great ending. You could have picked any movie, is what I meant. Not like of just these three. Like, you can pair anything with any one of them, but you kind of did something that I was going to do because I was going to be cute and say, I've done this before. It's actually it's fun. It's a bit obsessive, but if you watch The Parallax View and then immediately watch it again, so your double feature is the parallax, you just a boom boom. You learn, you're like, oh, that's that, that's it. And then, you know, you don't have to watch it for a while. But I did that. I thought it was a lot of fun. But but yeah, I mean but no, I like the way you did that. I also agree, like you got to end with All the President's Men. You got to end with that hammer of, like, the To-Do boom. Yep. You can't you can't start another movie after that. No. What do you get? What what what movie can follow that you're like, I'm sorry, you can't. There's nothing. I'm sorry. 1971. This is where the series started. The new Hollywood film project. Yes. The soft launch of French Connection. But I guess others to look at, dirty Harry was a big new Hollywood movie. A Clockwork Orange wasn't made in America, but that was still a huge movie. Carnal knowledge is a movie we've talked about on this part a little bit. The Last Picture Show, of course, was very big, the 1971 movie. There are there are a few to choose from, but I like how we ended here, because I don't think Klute is like the most well known 1971 movie, but I like the way that we're doing this. So it's been cool. And we already did 74 and 76, so I just wanted to talk about 71 a little bit of the year in general. I got a couple here for you. All right. Let's have and and this would be one that would be I mean, we've talked about this, in depth early on in our, podcast days, but, Barbara Logan's Wanda. Yes. Great. Fantastic. Mini mini. And Moskowitz is 1971. That's true. Yes. It was. Harold and Maude is 1971. You got the, double feature of drive. He said in Carnal Knowledge for Jack, you got Panic and Needle Park and then you have got, in my opinion, the best Godzilla movie of all time. Godzilla versus the Smog Monster. But I gotta say, I haven't seen it. Well, I got the best one as I like this one. I had to look it up because. Wanda, it's a that's another tricky one. It's. I've always considered that 1970, but I'm seeing it premiered at the festival in 1970, but then was released in theaters in 71. But whatever. Like, that's an amazing movie, no matter the year. God, I love that movie. All right, are we ready? Here it is. Hit us with it. I mean, you already hit us with it hours ago, which is that Klute may be your favorite, movie we've done in this. In this series. That's. That's a big one. That's true. That is a big one. But this one's bigger. This one's bigger. Here it is, folks. Hit us with it. I'm putting out my Roy Scheider low key because I feel like it's too big of a it's a too big of a take to just say definitively. But low key. The. Gordon Willis is the go. Oh best cinematographer ever. It's it's it's it's kind it these are crazy. Just these three movies alone and the way that they're shot. And you couple that with both got all three godfathers. Yeah, bro. Though, just those five movies, the three we're talking about today, and then Godfather one and two, which are all filmed in, what, a five year period? That's it. Madness to consider. Like that right there. Gives him goat status. He's it's certainly you can make a very easy and convincing argument that he's your favorite. He's the best. Like yeah I've you know that very fair. It's not a hard I mean it's not a stretch is what I mean. It's not like us. Yeah. I'll say I'll, I'll say this here. We'll go. I will say this one. It can't maybe not give it goat of all time, but I low key. Maybe he's in the conversation but definitely. But by far and away the goat cinematographer of the 1970s. Absolutely that I agree with. We've talked about like Laszlo Kovacs. We've talked about a lot of good ones, a lot of good, Vilmos Sigman, a lot of good cinematographers. But he actually, I think Gordon Willis, certainly among film fans, but has name recognition for what he did and his style just of these films in the 70s. And then after this is when he got linked up with Woody Allen, like after that run and he made, you know, people love the look of Manhattan, that he got nominated for an Oscar for Zelig. He didn't win. But, you know, he became very important to Woody Allen's career. But yeah, one of the best cinematographers to ever do it. And I would agree with that. Best cinematographer the 70s. Yeah. Hell yeah. Hell yeah. Oh man. That's I like it. That was a good hot take. And the hot take of that being your favorite perhaps, perhaps. Wait, wait, w I think it's between that and all that jazz new Hollywood film project. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, I did some great ones. We did all that jazz is amazing. And maybe and maybe, maybe there's more, I don't know. Yeah. I don't think this will be. We might take a little pause on the project, but I don't think this is going to be the end of it. We'll have some talk, some discussions. But, you know, I mean, this episode is going to come out in January, and that means we're in the thick of Oscar stuff. This is the W. This is like the end of the W fiscal year. It ends with a school year. Yeah. We get like we have we do the top ten. We do Oscar nums, Oscar predictions, Oscar reactions. Yeah. It'll be fun. Yeah. It's going to be hopefully this is our. Oh yeah. And it's. Yeah. So, I'm very this is honestly this is sometimes it's my favorite time of the year. Yeah. Just because like, we're able to talk about so much of the movies from this past year and we really devoted to celebrating because say what you will about the Oscars. You know, whatever they mean to anyone anymore at the end of the year, at the end of the day, they are the biggest night of the year for our in for movies and movies or worse. And so to celebrate, you know, the year of film, that it is in the way that we've done it, you know, historically. And, and don't worry, everyone, I'm sure on Oscar Sunday we'll have that, we'll have that live stream going, baby homeboy. Yeah. We'll see. Alex loves those. Yeah. Love them, love them so much. You're good. Yes, yes. We'll see. Well, I know it. You nervous? All right. Well, I w what do you got for us? This is actually kind of perfect. Okay, I, I didn't, I, I, so last night, I got home, and, and this isn't a movie, so we're we're we're going a little bit off, but this fits in terms of the conspiracy. Theory or not conspiracy theory, but their conspiracy trilogy. So Dave Chappelle just dropped a, a standup special on Netflix, like, no, no, no publicity or anything. I it might have just. No, this. Yeah, I do, I think it was last night. Oh. Yeah, it's brand new on there. I really want you to see it. I don't know what he's doing. I don't know what he's. I don't want to ruin it. Oh, you. Oh, you've already seen it. I've watched. That's why I'm bringing it up. Because. Oh, wow. I don't know, I it's there's a very, very hard thing to what to make about what he did, but he is talking about conspiracy in that whole entire stand up in a way that makes me a little concerned. I am a little bit nervous for him. I don't know. Oh, I, I almost left that stand up being like, is he warning us that something is about to happen to him? Because it kind of feels like he's warning us that something's about to happen to him. There's also a lot that he's saying, like, as I like, thought about the stand up special as I go. He's alluding to a lot of of conspiracy things and everything, he notes. Dave Chappelle, you're gonna get, he's got some hot takes on there that people are not going to agree with or all of that, but that's that's who he's been for his whole entire career. But I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about this sort of lasting impression that he leaves you with, and I don't know what to make of it. And I've been thinking about it ever since. And so when we were doing our, when, you know, talk about our conspiracy, trilogy right here, I was like, this is honestly a really good fit. Looks like it's called the unstoppable. And I'm going to watch it five time after we record. I hadn't even heard of this. Did you just watch it this morning? I watched the last night when I got home. Okay. We're in 15 minutes. All right? Yeah. And on am I? I think it's actually called something else that I don't think you can actually say. Well, according to netflix.com, it's called Dave Chappelle the unstoppable dot dot dot. So. Oh, yeah. Yeah, maybe the dot dot dot leads to something I'm assuming. But okay okay. Wow. Yeah I mean he I saw him live last year actually in DC. Yeah. He doesn't hold back from shit. Oh. Were you at. Maybe that was where it was filmed. Was. No, they were no, they definitely weren't filming because they tell you that they weren't. They definitely tell me. All right. Cool. I'm definitely. I'm interested. I'm going to check that out. That'll be your setup. Has me interested as well. So my recommendation also stays in the conspiracy theory vein. Hear me out, folks. What I'm about to say are facts. Literally facts. In the three years after the murders of President Kennedy and Lee Harvey Oswald, 18 material witnesses died, six by gunfire, three in motor accidents, two by suicide, one from a cut throat, one from a karate chop to the neck that is not a joke. Three from heart attacks and two from natural causes. An actuary concluded that on November 22nd, 1963, the odds against these witnesses being dead by February 1967 were 100,000 trillion to 1. Wow. That is the text that concludes the film. Executive action, a small movie released in 1973 about the American government plotting the assassination of President Kennedy, Burt Lancaster, Robert Ryan. This thing is amazing. I cannot believe they made it ten years after the assassination. You can find it online easily. Just type in Executive Action, 1973, directed by David Miller. It's awesome. 90 minutes long. I mean, they're using they're like, no, we're we're going to, you know, make Oswald the patsy. Like, I'd never even heard of this movie. And then that's that at the end. Oh, really makes you think, doesn't it. And that's what the parallax views about. You're just taking out these witnesses. Yeah. Wow. That's a crazy stat. Yeah. And that is a true stat that actually happened because a lot of people who were there in Dealey Plaza said that they saw smoke from gunshots and heard gunshots from over there behind that grassy knoll. When you I've been to Dealey Plaza several times. When you go and see, you see what they're talking about, and all those people died in mysterious circumstances within like 4 or 5 years, all of them. So what does that tell you? 100,000 trillion to 1. Is the probability just saying gives you something to think about. That's what what are you watching here for? Yeah. This is a great series. We got a lot of good feedback from folks, from the fans. I really appreciate it. A lot of people hadn't seen these movies. We kind of gave them the push to watch them. But yeah, this is we're not done talking about new Hollywood movies. We're gonna switch to, you know, 2025, switch to a year in review, switch to the Oscars for a little bit. Top ten is going to be coming soon. I'll probably release this before top ten of the year, but that'll that'll be fun. We got a lot to talk about. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I might even have to, I might have to go back on what I've been saying all year. Yeah, I think 2025 was a bad movie year, especially early on for bigger American movies. But as I've learned, particularly in the past few weeks, there's gold in the Indies and in the foreign films, absolute gold that I'm finding. And I'm excited to talk about those soon. Yeah, maybe find us on socials. Let us know what you watching. Let us know what you think about the 70s movies at Wawa. I w underscore podcast, but as always, thanks for listening and happy watching. Hey everyone, thanks again for listening. Send us mailbag questions at What Are You Watching podcast at gmail.com or find us on Twitter, Instagram and Letterboxd at wri w underscore podcast. Next time it's the most wonderful time of year. The Oscar nominations. Oh I'm excited. Getting excited, getting a little nervous. We'll see. We'll see how it all goes. But as a nice little bonus, at the very end of this long episode, this I'm recording this on January 7th. This little pick up, the SAG nominations were just announced. So I'm going to look at them live for the first time right here at the very end of this very long episode. All right. SAG nominations cast is first. This will be the first year that there's an Oscar for achievement in casting. So that will that will be a new award for the SAG. We have Frankenstein, hamlet, Maadi Supreme, one battle. Encinas. You know, I think Sinas wins this Oscar. I think I think they do that. So I guess that means I think it'll probably win this too, but. Okay. Okay, good. Good showing here, I guess. Nothing. No big surprises there. All right. Lead actor Timi for Mati Supreme. Leo for one battle, Ethan Hawke for blue moon, Michael B Jordan centers. And yes, Jesse Plemons for Begonia. All right, so the first four, I think, are locked for Oscar Nums. And there's this wild card, fifth entry for actor that could go to Wagner Moura for the Secret agent. I still think he's going to get nominated because they I don't know, it just feels like he's going to get nominated for that. But Nick and I were talking yesterday that it is ridiculous that the people from Begonia are not in the running for nominations, let alone awards, this year. Like it's crazy. Jesse Plemons is so good in that movie. So I'm so happy you got nominated, but I don't know if that'll carry through to the Oscar noms. Great to see Ethan Hawke here, too. All right, lead female Jessie Buckley. Hamnett, rose Byrne. If I had legs, I'd kick you. God, I love that movie. We're going to talk about that more. Kate Hudson in Song Sung Blue, a movie that to me came out of nowhere and I absolutely loved God. I hope she gets nominated for the Oscar. She is fantastic in that movie, I love it. Chase infinity, one battle and Emma Stone Begonia. All right. Sags are doing good. They're showing up for Begonia, for Song Sung Blue. I did not expect that. Oh, I love to see it. All right. Supporting male actor Miles Cat. And for sinners. I am not tracking that one at all. Benicio del Toro, one battle Jacob Elordi, Frankenstein. Paul Mescal, hamlet. Sean Penn one battle. All right, so Miles is the surprise there I wasn't I wasn't tracking that. Oh, wait a minute. No Stellan Skarsgard here. Yeah I mean, they don't tend to go toward, you know, the foreign movies as much for the Sags are movies not predominantly in English. So okay, that's that's interesting. Supporting female Odessa for Mati Supreme. Ariana Grande day for wicked for good. Amy Madigan for weapons. 000 wow oh wow. All right. I'm going to try Wunmi Mosaku for sinners. I'm sorry, I tried. I was not tracking that one either. And Teyana Taylor for one Battle of Beverly Hills, motherfucker. Wow. Okay, so they have no interest in sentimental value because I think that's going to get three Oscar nominees. But moreover, what these nominations have affirmed to me is what I'm hoping for most on Oscar nomination day. And this is a big hope. It's kind of silly, but one battle after another has a very rare opportunity to be nominated for five acting Oscars in four categories. That is extremely rare. Almost never happens. Bonnie and Clyde did it from here to eternity. Did it network did it. I'm talking where you have at least one nomination in each acting category, but then one of them has, you know, two nominations. So we have that here with these sags. We have Leo for actor Chase for actress Benicio and Sean Penn for supporting actor and Teyana Taylor for supporting actress. I don't know if any of them will win, but if all five of them get nominated for the Oscar, that will just be something in and of itself to celebrate. It's been fun to. I didn't know I was going to do this. Look at these nominations live. Oscar nominations coming soon. Stay tuned. Bucket list. Standby. The boys.