Over Here, Over There

Another State Dinner? Really?

• Dan Harris and Claudia Koestler • Season 3 • Episode 38

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Over Here, Over There co-host Dan Harris speaks with BBC Radio Wiltshire presenter Graham Rogers about the implications of Donald Trump's unprecedented second state visit to the UK, exploring the political dynamics, public opinion, and the expectations from both sides regarding trade and international relations. The risk is mainly on the UK side as it tries to score diplomatic points in the background, away from the pomp and pageantry on display before Trump. Will it be a risk worth taking? Tune in for the conversation, and please don't forget to like, share, and subscribe. Thank you!

Graham Rogers (00:21.48)

Afternoon show from the BBC on Tuesday afternoon. This is Graham Rogers with you through till six o'clock. Well, he is on his way. Air Force One has taken off. It's heading for the UK to bring Donald Trump back to our shores for an unprecedented Second state visit now. As you would expect, it's not without controversy. You might remember last time it was back in June of 2019, as well as taking tea with the late Queen. The US President called the Mayor of London, Sadiq Khan, a, and I'm quoting here, stone-cold loser. He backed Boris Johnson in a Tory leadership race and suggested the NHS should be part of US-UK trade talks. All of that was accompanied by a petition saying he should not receive a state visit in the UK that was signed by more than a million people.

 

As well as noisy protests involving thousands of people and a huge inflatable effigy, which became known as the Trump Baby. Which does beg the question, what is going to be happening this time round over the next few days? Going to bring back onto the show this afternoon, Dan Harris. Originally from upstate New York, he's worked at the White House and on Capitol Hill. He is now the host of the Global Affairs podcast Over Here, Over There. Dan Harris is back with me on the show this afternoon. Hello, Dan. Good to talk to you again. 


Dan Harris

Hello, Graham. Good to be with you.


Graham Rogers

This is a second state visit for President Trump. It's never happened before. Why then? Why is it happening now?

 

Dan Harris(01:53.996)

Well, you could be very cynical about it. 

 

Graham Rogers

Come on, let's be very cynical.

 

Dan Harris

I think anybody could be very cynical, not just you, Graham. No, it really is. I think it is actually, you can add in the fact that it’s the height of irony to say that Americans don't get irony. I think it is misplaced because when you think of it, Peter Maddelson was sacked for his relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. Prince Andrew is persona non grata for most events. And then you give a state dinner for President Trump, who was Jeffrey Epstein's best friend. So that all factors into the mix. He's got an unfavorable rating in the UK of about 78 to 80 percent in most polls. So, it's a bit of a risk giving him a state dinner for sure. But what is it nowadays, why did he do it? Why did Starmar do it? And it's got to have to do with power politics. He's just looking at how he can handle Trump. It’s very unpredictable and also having to manage the affairs of state, especially trade, in getting the most favorable deals from Trump. So, it's just learning how, over time, to manage Trump and how to do that, so that was his big gambit here.

 

Graham Rogers

Let's get a positive out of this because there should be things to be gained for both sides here. What do we in the UK want out of this state visit, and what do the Americans want out of it?

 

Dan Harris

Different people have different answers to that. But really, on one hand, the US, especially Trump, wants optics. They want optics. They want to look at something that is being received and honoured during the state visit. And how that plays back home will depend on how the media handles it. And so that's really important because there are a lot of things happening back home, like the Epstein files, inflation, immigration, the ICE raids, you name it. There's a whole bunch of issues.

 

He's getting away from that. He's trying to elevate himself through this state dinner and make himself look a lot more favorable than what the polls suggest back home. And here, you're just looking for some, some people just want to solidify the relationship, get clarity on a lot of issues, say from Ukraine to NATO, to Gaza, to the tariffs, and just get clarity on that. Just know exactly where the UK stands and be consistent so they can plan.

 

Dan Harris (04:19.554)

There are others who just want to emphasize a special relationship, showing that the UK is still important in the US foreign policy. Others are hoping that we can still act as a bridge to Europe. I don't think that's possible anymore with this administration. But it never hurts, at least, to have these types of events to solidify relationships. Now, I would say, really, if you're going to go for something, like I know the UK business and trade committee in parliament really want them to pressure Trump to sign on the dotted line and be very specific on a lot of trade and tariffs, investment, and nuclear deals. But I don't know if you're going to get that out of this, really. In Trump's mind, this is to honour him in a way. He's taken this very personally, I'm sure.

 

Yeah, well, it's going to be an interesting few days. It will certainly be making headlines, certainly here, and I suspect in the United States of America as well. Dan, it's always fascinating to talk to you and to get your perspective on this. Thank you for joining me. Dan Harris from Over Here, Over There.