Hustle Her
Hustle Her
Hustle Her - Shira
Are you ready to be inspired? Join me for a conversation with the remarkable Shira Jatto, the marketing and communications director for One Communications, as we take an unflinching look at her life. From the mundane (her love for gummies and Bruce Willis) to the meaningful (her successful career in the ruthless telecommunications industry and the personal struggles of balancing work and family life), our discussion is as varied as it is compelling.
Together, we navigate the complex and emotional terrain of IVF and pregnancy loss, discussing the heartbreaking realities and the unexpected stigmas. Our conversation isn't just a personal story; it's a narrative that reaches out to every woman who has experienced, or is experiencing, similar situations. We share, we empathize, we learn. And in doing so, we hope to make the journey a little less lonely for others.
Shira’s story isn't just about the ups and downs; it's about transformation, risk-taking, and redefinition of success. We journey from her rebellious childhood to her becoming a diligent leader, a loving mother, and a successful woman who believes in being remembered as a good person. This conversation is sure to leave you moved, motivated, and a little more enlightened about life's many shades. Don't miss out on this episode - it's filled with life lessons, heartfelt stories, and inspiring moments.
It's time for hustle her podcast. I'm your host, deshae Keynes. Hustle her is all about inspiring women through real life experiences that have helped to mold and develop not only me but my guests into the entrepreneurs and leaders we are today. If you're an enterprising woman determined to succeed and looking for a bit of motivation, a bit of tough love and some actionable takeaways to be the best you girl, you are in the right place. Hey guys, and welcome back to hustle her podcast. Thanks so much for spending some time with me, as always.
Speaker 1:Want to say a big shout out to our sponsors, brown and company, as well as 59 front. Brown and company have provided some of the decor that you see here on set today and we're so grateful for them, and we thank them for their continued support for the podcast. Make sure you head over to hustleherpodcastcom, make sure you subscribe to the YouTube channel and sign up to be a VIP listener. We have some cool giveaways coming up and we can't wait for you to get them. So super excited about today and I know I say that all the time, but I actually genuinely mean it every time my next guest is not only a friend of mine, she's also the marketing and communications director for one communications and share a jato.
Speaker 1:I'm so happy you know, I almost said your maiden name again, even after writing it down.
Speaker 2:I know I waited a long time to get a new name because it's a mouthful, and so you know jato, there you go.
Speaker 1:I love it. A fun fact, I did share a day of coordination for her wedding. It was such a wonderful day, such a wonderful day, such a good time. Laura did the videography too right, she did Look at this, it's a wedding reunion. Eight years later, eight years, eight years, two kids, crazy Been a ride. It's been a ride. All right, let's jump in. I'm going to ask some quick questions, get everyone to know you a little better, and then we'll go from there. All right, all right, what food can you not live without?
Speaker 2:Oh, this is a hard one what food can I not live without. I love gummies. Okay, I say candy, I love gummies. I try not to eat them, but I love a good gummy, a sour gummy.
Speaker 1:Okay, oh yeah, sour is always a good. You know, love a good sour gummy. Okay, let's give me something that's currently making you very happy.
Speaker 2:What's my kids? Yeah, definitely my kids. Always a joy I have a day seeing my kids smiling. That definitely makes me happy.
Speaker 1:And then quiet, complete opposite.
Speaker 2:But my kids, and then just being able, at the end of the day, maybe just to have a few minutes to myself, maybe watch some Netflix.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay. What's your favorite show currently? Okay, I'm not going to say it's my favorite. Okay, what are you watching? I'm watching the.
Speaker 2:Ultimatum.
Speaker 1:Okay, I know, a new season just came out. I think it just started. Like yesterday.
Speaker 2:Yes, so I'm only, you know, one or two episodes in, I'm not going to split for anyone, but it is a little dramatic. What does he always say on the Bachelor? The most dramatic season? Yeah, this one is like that oh my gosh. So watch it. It's not. I'm not going to say it's my favorite, but I am a reality TV junkie. I hate saying it, but I am it's my guilty pleasure in life.
Speaker 1:I'm okay with that. Yeah, me too. I love a little.
Speaker 2:Love Island, you know, but the Ultimatum Watch it.
Speaker 1:Okay, cool, all right. What's the title of the last book that you read?
Speaker 2:Oh, who gets time to read books?
Speaker 1:I agree.
Speaker 2:I get through like five minutes of an episode and then the next day I have to go back and figure out where it was.
Speaker 1:Okay. So, last favorite book then.
Speaker 2:It's been a while.
Speaker 1:Been a while.
Speaker 2:Okay, I hate saying that, but it's reality.
Speaker 1:I read a lot of blogs.
Speaker 2:I read a lot of social media and marketing blogs versus books because, as we know, the trends and Instagram and algorithms, and so that's my thing. It's a lot of blogs.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Cool yeah, read a lot of blogs, watch a lot of blogs, blogs or videos now Exactly.
Speaker 1:All right, favorite color Pink. Yes, I love a little fuchsia, magenta, whatever this is purple yeah, I love that, okay. And then finally we access like become a thing now Okay, who is your celebrity crush?
Speaker 2:So I don't think I have one now. Okay, but going back, richard Gere, pretty woman.
Speaker 1:Richard Gere. Okay, okay, I can see it.
Speaker 2:I can see it, but like now that I know a little bit more about what that movie was about, maybe that's a bit weird.
Speaker 1:It's crazy. As we watched it and it was like such a we thought it was an amazing love story, like Patrick, Swayze Dirty Dancing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, same thing, and then I had a weird one for Bruce Willis. I don't know. People make fun of me when I say that Really? Yeah, I don't know Bruce Willis and then Michael Ely, but Barber Shop Days.
Speaker 1:Okay, I agree, because Michael Ely in Fast and Furious Too Fast, too Furious was not good looking.
Speaker 2:I don't know what happened with him there. What's the movie where he's really creepy and he did a really good job in that movie.
Speaker 1:For Color Girls. Was it for Color Girls no?
Speaker 2:I don't. I don't remember what it was called, but it was really creepy and he lost me after that. So we're going to go with Barber Shop Days.
Speaker 1:All right, there we go, barber Shop Days. All right, so tell me about Little Shara. Like, what did Little Shara want to be when she grew up?
Speaker 2:Okay, so this might surprise a lot of people, and I was actually talking to my mom about this the other day, but Little Shara was terrible. No way, little Shara did not behave. She did not listen. She was in her room a lot. Yeah, my mom told me I was the hardest of the three. I was rebellious. I was the kid who snuck out. I did whatever I wanted.
Speaker 1:I was not a good kid.
Speaker 2:And so looking, my mom always said to me I hope your kid, one of your kids, turns out to be like you, so you can see what it feels like, so, just you know, putting it out there please don't be like me.
Speaker 2:I was a bad kid and I I wanted to be a teacher, I think when I was younger, and then, as I got older, I actually had no idea what I wanted to be Sure, I would have never thought that. Exactly so anybody who knows me now, except for my mom and maybe my dad and my uncle's aunts. Um, funny story. My dad at one point I wasn't listening and he took a stuffed animal and he held it over the trash and he said if you don't clean or whatever it was supposed to do, I'm going to throw it out.
Speaker 2:And I looked at him and I said, fine, throw it out. And I didn't care. Oh, no, so I was terrible, but then I don't know.
Speaker 2:I always had a good head on my shoulders coming up Even if I hung out with the wrong people, I did the wrong things. Um, so I went to university and I got a job working at a Rogers video store this is in Toronto, which is like a blockbuster for those who don't know but they also sold internet and TV and cell phones and all that and I thought this is great. I'm going to eat popcorn and rent out movies to people and have a great time.
Speaker 2:And I just kind of found my love for sales and people and customer service and I was doing communications and humanities in university and just kind of fell into marketing. Wow, so I decided to take marketing and then I was in school for seven years Um, but I kind of and then being in the Rogers environment with internet and cell phone, and TV and all that, I kind of fell in love with the fast paced telecommunications world.
Speaker 1:Got you.
Speaker 2:And so I ended up just loving marketing and communication. So I never it's not something I ever you know as a kid this is what I want to do.
Speaker 1:But yeah, and so how did you end up in Bermuda?
Speaker 2:So a recruiter called me at one point for a marketing job. It was actually with North Rock Communication. Shout out to North Rock Communications, crazy, um. And so yeah, a recruiter called me and I had about two weeks to make a decision and I moved here and it was the best thing I ever did.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because, if my memory starts me correctly, you met your now husband shortly after you got here. Six weeks later, can you imagine?
Speaker 2:At Lemon Tree. Of all places, shout out to Lemon Tree. We all miss you. Um, but that yeah. Six weeks later we met and 12 years later we're married two kids.
Speaker 1:That is crazy. We're in Bermuda for six weeks and you met your husband. That is so cool. Where were you guys? Uh, so we're at.
Speaker 2:Lemon Tree Um, we had a mutual co-worker, so he actually used to work at North Rock Communications Really. So one of the guys that was still there was they were on a boys night. I was on a girls night, saw him there.
Speaker 1:And the rest is history.
Speaker 2:I made the first move actually, really, I love that I did. Why not? Yeah, can't we?
Speaker 1:I know it's so crazy. A lot of times people think like, oh, you got to wait for the guy to say something, or come and give you the number and look, it worked in your favor right, it did 12 years later, there you go, still married two beautiful girls. It's amazing. Aw, so you in Bermuda working at North Rock, how did you end up as the director of marketing of one of the largest telecommunications companies on island?
Speaker 2:So was that North Rock doing a little bit of marketing and sales, having a great time loved it? Um, the best thing was meeting all the people, right? You're doing sales. You're going out to your. At that time we called, we picked up the phone book and we called and then co-call.
Speaker 1:Remember that.
Speaker 2:And you go and meet people and you meet amazing people. So I think me and my husband actually went to a party One of our first dates and I said, oh, we're not, I'm not going to know anyone here, and I walked in hey, hey, hey, you know new, more people than you Bermuda?
Speaker 2:But um yeah. So from there ended up at logic, did a little bit of work at DigiSel Um, ended up in the corporate world at Applebee and Astera, which is now a Korean um, and just kind of moved my way through, got my experience, did a little business development, marketing um sales along the way and thankfully now at one communications shout out one.
Speaker 1:Nice. So, when you think of your, your journey as a woman in this industry, do you think it's difficult for women to get promoted in this industry, with telecommunications in particular, or is it something that kind of progressed naturally for you?
Speaker 2:Um, I think for me it progressed naturally, and one of the things they admire so much about Bermuda is we have so many powerful women in such powerful positions, and I admire that so much. I don't know if there's many other places like Bermuda in that way, but when you go to places like we speak and you just go to conferences in general, and.
Speaker 2:Bermuda, and not necessarily in, you know, telecommunications, but in general we just have so many incredible women, and so I think it kind of happened for me naturally, um, you know, being creative and just kind of moving my way through and I've learned a lot from so many people, um, and I've had some amazing managers who were women, and so I think they kind of helped me just navigate through. But I do think it happened naturally and I think we have, like I said, some amazing powerful women in Bermuda who are in some amazing top positions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely Cause when you were at North Rock, they had a female CEO at the time as well, right yeah?
Speaker 2:Um, you know, at Applebee I think it's you know, almost half the partners there were women. Um, you know, I worked for a woman at Oak Orian's managing director managing partner, so I've worked with some amazing women, yeah.
Speaker 1:But you're absolutely right about Bermuda. I mean, we still have a long ways to go when it comes to some things, but when it comes to female leadership, even in the political arena, like we had some female leaders before, it was like a thing. You know what I mean, especially like in the U? S and Canada places like that, so that's actually a very good point. I didn't even think of it that way, but as a leader, as a woman who leads a team, like I said, a large company, um, were there? Have there any been like barriers for you in your career when it comes to being a woman in leadership?
Speaker 2:It's funny. I go back to my days in Toronto. Toronto, I should say I'm so.
Speaker 2:Bermuda in Toronto I can't believe I just did that. My family's going to be mad. Sorry to all that Um. I go back to my days when I was working at Tell us. Tell us is similar again to a one mobile Um and I was working in the call center and I was studying marketing in school and I told myself I am going to get a marketing position at tell us. I love tell us. For those who don't know, they have these fun furry animals and they use them for marketing and it's always what's the next one. It's a lot of fun. And I always said I am going to be in marketing and I was in the call center and there was a job that came up and I went for it and I did my best. You know, I'd gone through school, I'd done everything I could, I was studying, I was putting myself out there, I was working. At one point I was in school two days a week, full time and working five days a week. So I was, I was hustling.
Speaker 1:I was hustling hard yeah.
Speaker 2:And I remember I got the job and this guy came up to me and he said you got the job because you're this, you know, pretty girl or whatever it was at the time. Wow, and I thought that was so strange, right, because we look and we always say it's a man's world, it's a man's world, right, yeah. And he just said it to me like that, and I always think back to that. But now I don't feel that way. I think you know you're a man, you're a woman, you know if you're right for the job, you're right for the job, exactly Right. And it's funny. I saw a post recently from one of my friends and she traveled and she talked about multitasking and why you should hire women. And you know we do multitask. Well, yeah, but no, I don't. I don't think there were any barriers in that sense. Um, I think you know, you're good at the job.
Speaker 2:You work hard.
Speaker 1:Yeah, do you? And I know you said a little while ago like you never thought that you would be in marketing and communications. But whereas there's something else that you kind of in your career, you look back 20 years ago, you know, or whenever it was. You're like you know what I should have taken that path, or you wonder, hmm, what that would have been like.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, I don't know. I think maybe not so much career-wise, but maybe if I look back and I think this is a weird one, but religion-wise. I'm actually Jewish. There's not a lot of Jewish people in Bermuda, but we're around and I actually ended up having a falling out with my dad because of religion and I always think like, well, what if I had gone the other path? And what if I had stayed on this, you know religious Jewish path? What would that look like? And not that I ever want to change that and I love my life and I think I 100% made the right decision.
Speaker 1:But you always think like what would that look like if I made a different decision? Well, you definitely probably wouldn't have been in Bermuda. That wouldn't have been the case at all. That would have been terrible.
Speaker 2:But I look back and I just think what would life have been like if I had decided to stay on that religious path?
Speaker 1:So in marketing, you mentioned a little while ago about, you know, staying on top of the brand and the trends and everything like that. How do you stay on top of that with in doing your job and maintaining and all of that? Because, like you said, everything changes all of the time? Instagram, I mean. Give us a break.
Speaker 2:But you know, it's always something changing.
Speaker 1:How do you stay on top of everything?
Speaker 2:It's hard but literally, by scrolling Instagram, by scrolling TikTok, reading the blogs, you have to stay on top of it. You know what's the latest algorithm.
Speaker 1:Let me.
Speaker 2:Google that and so many different blogs. Thankfully there's a lot of people who do that research and they post it Listen, listen. And then just looking for the different trends. So you know it came across the Sim Simitrend on TikTok and we did it at work and we had so much fun and actually yesterday Beanie man actually went and liked our video.
Speaker 1:Which I thought was so cool, right that's cool.
Speaker 2:So I sent it around to everybody and it looked, you know, not your famous, you know, beanie man saw it, yeah, but I just, you know, that for me is how to do. You just look at TikTok, look at Instagram. We don't have a TikTok, but a lot of those trends carry forward into Instagram and Facebook and, funny enough, that video is doing, you know, a million times better on Facebook than it is on Instagram. Which?
Speaker 1:is what I think it's so crazy. Yeah, with Bermuda and Facebook it does.
Speaker 2:the trends are weird with marketing, with Bermuda it's different age groups with Instagram and Facebook.
Speaker 1:Very much so.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know they're both great tools. But yeah, just reading again the blogs, watching the videos, staying up to date on TikTok and. Instagram very important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how has been. Because you're a boss, right. You know you've got people that are boss. You know own it right. You got to avoid people that report into you. You know managing a big budget, a huge brand on Island. How does that affect family life?
Speaker 2:It's busy. I would say the hardest thing for me is cooking Really Cooking, yeah. So when I went from one to two kids, that changed a lot. So I had my second when my first was already five, so I was able to come home and put food on the table and do my cooking while she was playing or reading or whatever she had to do. Now, with the second, I find it I struggle. Unless I sit there on a Sunday, which a lot of us do with the batch cooking, I struggle.
Speaker 1:So you know.
Speaker 2:I need to find someone to do that for me.
Speaker 1:I'm telling you, there's people that will come in and do it has to be, I know.
Speaker 2:It has to be. I don't like going grocery shopping. Pronto has saved my life.
Speaker 1:Saved my life. Shout out to Pronto. Shout out to Pronto. Thank you, Colin. Yeah, literally.
Speaker 2:But yeah, it's the grocery shopping, it's the cooking, Everything else. I feel like I'm doing well, you know you pack the bags the night before and all that. But then it's going into work, shutting off everything else, focusing on what needs to get done that day, building my team and just making sure I'm successful at work. And then going home and making sure I'm successful at home because you have a relationship with your partner, you have kids at home and you need to make sure they're growing the way you want them to grow up and instilling the values and teaching them. And you know, then you worry is my kid reading? You're like there's a lot Constant worry. So it's going to work and shutting off and being the leader and just making sure that my team is supported and the company is successful with making the right decisions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's heavy, though, because when you think about it, it's got to be difficult to switch off and go from mommy mode to, you know, marketing director mode, like are there times where you ever feel like there's one dropping, one bowl dropping versus the other, or have you been able to kind of figure it out?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think we all have that, no matter with kids, without kids. Whatever it is right, there's always something going on in our personal life and I think, unfortunately, it's easier to drop the family life, to drop the ball on family life, and I try my best not to do that. I try really to have that work-life balance and I tell my team this all the time five o'clock time to shut off because you need to go home. You need to have that because if you don't, you're coming back to work the next day and you didn't have that time to shut off and you need to have that shut off button. I don't necessarily have that. I don't know how to do that. I've always been that person who looks at my phone every 10 minutes, writes the new email coming in. Do I need to make sure I'm ready for the next day? So I will say it's easier to drop the ball when it comes to home, but I try my best not to, because I want to make sure my kids feel loved and supported all the time.
Speaker 1:Why do you feel like it's easier for us to drop the ball at home, like, why is it easy? And I don't think it's just a woman thing, I think it's just a people thing, period. Why is it easier for us to drop the ball when I say drop the ball very loosely, no one's, your kids are fed and well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah but why is it easier? For us, exactly no, no, that's not what we're saying.
Speaker 1:When I say it's easier for us to neglect home in ways where we're not fully showing up as ourselves. When we get home, like home gets the worst of us. Sometimes, If we had a bad day at work, we feel it more at home rather than we truck on at work Like why do you think we're like that?
Speaker 2:I think because you're not being judged the same way, you're not being evaluated, your kids aren't giving you like here's your mid-year review, here's your bonus, here's your pay raise, whatever it is right, they're going to accept you for your flaws and I think we just have to work so much harder and, as women, to prove ourselves in the workplace. Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Whereas I come home and I'm going to be my kid's superhero. But I want to be my kid's superhero and I want to make sure I show up every day for them as well. So it is finding that balance, but unfortunately, it's always easier for us to drop the ball that way because we don't have as much to prove.
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely, and I know you said you recently had. How old is your youngest? Now she's 15 months. Oh my gosh, yeah, she's growing fast, little Olivia, olivia. So, but in between Olivia and your oldest right, you had some challenges with pregnancy and we spoke about this. She told me it was OK to speak about it yes 100% Not calling her out. And we're in that right and having this amazing job and having some infertility issues how was that for you?
Speaker 2:Very tough. You know, as women we have a lot of pressure, a lot of pressure. You know you're a kid. Let go to school and get your education and get a good job and get married and then have kids. And that's what we're told to do and that's what you see in the movies and you put a lot of pressure on yourself. But it doesn't always happen that way and it's not the job, the husband, the kids. You know that doesn't happen easily for all of us and fortunately, with Ava, did you know? We thought, you know we're going to have a baby and six weeks later we can see you and we had Ava and we thought, going into the second, this is going to be super easy. And we actually got pregnant, maybe second month of trying.
Speaker 2:Unfortunately, that ended in a miscarriage while you're working Right, and there's a lot of pressure and you're thinking this is weird. I had my child. What's going on? You don't expect that. We told family early on because, naively, we thought we had a kid, it was easy, everything's going to be fine. And we actually went on to have four miscarriages early, a couple after heartbeats which are absolutely devastating. Someone looking at you and saying I'm sorry, baby. There's no heartbeat Words you will never forget in your life, but navigating that while you're also going to work. I had a miscarriage in the bathroom at work. Well, and having to pick yourself up off the floor and go OK, what now? No, and of course I went home.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And I at the time had a female boss and I actually told her and I think that's something really important, because it's hard to have that conversation where they didn't know you were pregnant and then you're going oh, by the way, I was pregnant and actually I've lost a baby, and now I need to take a day or two off to mourn that and I think we need to start talking about that more. The statistic is one in four pregnancies and in a loss, and that's a big number, huge number, which means if everybody around you is trying to have babies at the same time, you're at a certain age. That means you definitely know somebody going through it, especially at work, and so that could be somebody you know in the bathroom having a miscarriage. And people feel broken and so they don't want to talk about it. They feel like I'm trying to do something and I'm failing. And as women I said it before we've a lot to prove and there's a lot of pressure, and so when something's not working, you don't want to talk about that.
Speaker 2:You don't want to tell people I'm broken. You're not broken One and I had to tell myself that a lot. But navigating work while going through that is a complete roller coaster. You want to show up and be your best self at work. You want to be your best self at home. You're dealing with something. So that was difficult, but I will say it's important to talk about it and it's also important to take the time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so during this right, and obviously it would segue in a little bit, but when? How was her husband? I was supposed to say, addy, how was your husband during this time for you, like, how was that for him as well?
Speaker 2:He was amazing. There were times where I sat there and I don't think I've ever said this to him, so this may be the first time he's heard it, but I would think to myself he should have married someone else, because then he wouldn't be going through this with me. The first time we went to the ultrasound like we had had a heartbeat, right, Everything was fine. And then we went this, you know, the first time we went through it and we went to the next ultrasound and then this was when they said there's no heartbeat and it was his birthday, oh God, and I'll never forget that.
Speaker 2:You know I had gone to get him a hot chocolate and some donuts on the way and I'm all excited. We're going to see the baby again. And you go and they say there's no heartbeat and you're looking at him like happy birthday, Like oh, my God. So you know it was. It was terrible for both of us, but thankfully we are stronger than ever. Going through everything we've gone through, he's been my support and my rock and he, you know, as he keeps a lot in, but thankfully, you know, we talked about it and we got through it and I think we're stronger than ever.
Speaker 1:Just having gone through that, yeah, how was mommy Sharer during this time with Ava and cause? Obviously she doesn't really understand what's happening, right?
Speaker 2:What's going on? Yeah, so it was hard, because you want to go home and crawl into bed and get into this kind of dark hole and just lay there and cry, and then you have this other child to be there for.
Speaker 2:And it was during COVID, actually the second time I had a unfortunately lost a heartbeat another time and it was COVID, so Addy wasn't actually able to come with me to the ultrasound that time. So not only did I have to find out about it on my own, but I had to go home and tell him, and Ava was there in the kitchen and I remember coming home and just thinking, okay, I need to tell him this, but I need to hold it in. And I of course lost it, as you do, and I had the emotions and she just came and gave me a hug and it kind of made it all better.
Speaker 2:And I just looked at her and I thought how lucky I am Right, and I think not everybody. You know some people are suffering through and they don't have a child yet.
Speaker 2:And then I'm looking at my child and going how lucky am I that I have this beautiful and you know Ava and she's just Ball of sunshine, ray of sunshine, and she's just, you know, that smile, and so that just really helped me get through it and knowing that, yeah, okay, let me go and lay in bed for a couple of hours, but then let me pick myself up and just go be around her. Yeah, so it helped a lot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so with beautiful Olivia. Now, like, how did you guys get to the point where you're like you know what. We're going to do this again. You know the loss wasn't, it was a devastating, obviously, but you really wanted another child. Like, how do you continue to try after that?
Speaker 2:It's hard, you take time, and I will say that's one of the things I tell people when they come to me is take time, make sure that you're ready. I found a very compassionate doctor and I think that that's really important is find someone that's going to be on the journey with you. And he sat me down one of the first times I met him and I'll never forget he sat next to me, pulled up a chair next to me it wasn't across from me, but it was next to me and he said to me you need to make a decision. You need to go home and you need to make a decision of how much are you willing to go through Not financially, emotionally how much are you willing to go through? Go home and talk to your husband, and I did, and he said you know, some people will go and they'll go through nine, 10 losses. And I looked at them and I said how? I mean I had four and I was.
Speaker 2:I was at rock bottom at that point and I went home and I said you know what? Let's do IVF, let's do it one round. We had gone to do some testing and he said to me you know, I think it's an egg quality issue and let's do some testing. We'll do IVF, we'll test the eggs and then we'll test the embryos and then we know what's healthy and that way you can avoid pregnancy loss. So I said let's do this once. I am willing, that is. What I have to give is one time, and if it doesn't work, it doesn't work and we're happy with you know, beautiful Ava, and so I made the decision to go and do IVF once. Unfortunately, it was COVID time.
Speaker 2:So we had to put it off for a bit, but we went and we did it and that's an emotional roller coaster in itself. It's a lot of waiting, it's a lot of up and down, a lot of hormones.
Speaker 1:A lot of hormones.
Speaker 2:Thankfully my marriage survived that. But we ended up with one embryo, One embryo and I was devastated. I looked and I said one embryo, how are we getting a baby? But it takes one because we have Olivia. She was our one embryo.
Speaker 1:The one embryo that could.
Speaker 2:And, yeah, the doctor called us and said I have the best news it's a healthy embryo. And if you want to know the sex and I did it, my husband did so I said, fine, you know, let's go with it and she said it's baby girl. And you know, so we. It's a weird concept, though, ivf, because you know they freeze this little embryo and they implant, but we knew what the baby was before they planted and gave birth to Olivia, and she's 15 months. Oh my gosh. And yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's so. It's so crazy when you think of, like the IVF process and cause you posted a video Cause I didn't know what any any of that. I think a lot of people did. You guys kind of kept it very private and you posted a video of all the syringes that you had to take. That's crazy. No one really hears about or talks.
Speaker 1:Well, people talk about it now, I think, more than they did before but you don't realize how many people are going through it and like you weren't in Bermuda for a good portion of it, like so you're away from kind of luckily you have family overseas, but you know it's not home, you know it's not your house, it's not your bed, like we don't have those facilities in Bermuda either. So it kind of we, we think about it in this like kind of mystical land over there right Of like IVF or freezing of the eggs Okay, I'll go and do it here. But there's so many people right next to us that we know and that we deal with every single day that are, you know, injecting themselves I don't know how many times a day to get these beautiful children, and there's a significant amount of people that just Don't. It doesn't happen a lot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that video I posted. You're right, we are quite private. I'm a very superstitious person, so when it comes to pregnancies I don't post anything. I always feel like something's gonna wrong. I also don't like when people feel sorry for me, hmm.
Speaker 2:And so you know, when you post things and then it, let's say, you have a miscarriage, and all of a sudden it's like oh, actually we're not pregnant anymore. That terrified me. But there's this thing a year after you transfer an embryo, it's a transferversary, and people post these videos of here was the embryo and here's the baby, and I, a long time I went back and forth Do I post the video, do I not? Do I post? And then I remembered back to when I was going through it and there was some people who were sharing their stories you know like Tor, and Bermuda was one of the only ones I knew of and I was grateful for her posting her, her process and everything she went through, because it's a less, it's less lonely, yeah, and I thought if I could make one person less lonely, then I've achieved what I set out to do.
Speaker 2:So I put out this video and I was terrified. But I got such amazing feedback from people and just support and just think you're so strong and I didn't think of myself as strong, actually felt again broken. You know my body's not doing what it's supposed to do and I went back and I said, no, you are strong. Yeah, what you just went through and I was so great. I'm so happy to put out that video because to this day I get people messaging me with questions, really support, and they feel lonely and I know that feeling and so actually I'd love for you to post maybe my, my personal email at the end.
Speaker 2:So if anybody wants to reach out. I mean I'm more than happy I, even if it's just a hug, I give good. But you know it is a lot and it can be a very lonely process and, as you said, you travel for it. So I went to Florida. I interviewed six doctors. I'm a little bit you interviewed six doctors.
Speaker 1:I love you, your doctor, I know, I agree, I agree, yes, your doctor.
Speaker 2:I went through six before I found the one I felt that I jibed the best with and we all, you know we have different needs. Yeah, but she was compassionate and amazing and they had such a great Reputation so I went to Florida. But you're right, you do have to go away for about two weeks at a time to do each procedure. It was during COVID, so it's a bit easier to work from away.
Speaker 1:But you know, again you're telling work it's a medical procedure because we need to normalize that we need to normalize, yeah, yeah but also there's no one's business if you don't want to talk about it, right?
Speaker 2:That's fine too, but it's a lot of needles. You're right, it's a lot of bruising. Think for them, okay, with needles. I actually went donated blood recently, which, by the way, really important got to do it.
Speaker 2:I know I did as well. I went and I I didn't realize, though you know how limited a supply they have, you don't realize. They told me that I think on one of the days, a woman had a baby and needed all the blood supply, and if it hadn't been for the people that come that day, sure yeah, she was fine, but the person the next day would have. So you know, if you can please, yeah, I know I donate blood.
Speaker 1:I go once a quarter. They apparently I'm a really good match for a Young kid who has sickle cell. Yes, so they call me once a quarter to go and donate. Yeah, and I never thought about it before until we did this company thing. They had a drive for companies or whatever.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Yes, and I went and did it and they, they called me like four days later. They were like do you mind giving blood more often?
Speaker 2:and I was like I mean shorts, they didn't ask me to, but I'm going to do it. I actually needed a blood transfusion when you had. I was bleeding out after I had her and I needed a double blood transfusion to save my life. So grateful for everyone giving blood and I'm gonna continue to do it, yeah.
Speaker 1:Absolutely give blood is so necessary. I mean, after all of this right and obviously where the segment for us is women in leadership. Like how do you show up for work after four miscarriages and then a round of IVF, being away for two weeks? Like how do you show up for work and Work, like how do you do that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's tough. You know anybody going through grief, you know it's a similar process. I think work is a good outlet, though it's a good distraction, especially when you're in a leadership role and you just have to do it right. Because if you're not doing it, it's the work's not getting done.
Speaker 2:Yeah right, that's visible. But I but I love my work and I love what I do and I love being creative and I love the company I work for and the team I'm with and I think that helps, right, because you come into a sort of a family Environment, right, and and that's helpful. But I would also say you take the time you need. Yeah, after this the first one, you know, I took a couple days after the second and you take a couple more and I think after the last one, I think ended up taking week off, mm-hmm. And then I said to myself, a week physically from work, yeah. And then you take a month, almost emotionally, and I think it's important for people when you're going through any kind of Grape, is set that time limit. What's that time limit where you're gonna say enough's enough, I'm getting out of bed, I'm not hiding, I'm gonna go see my friends and I'm gonna pick myself back up because, it's easy to fall into a deep depression.
Speaker 1:Yeah anyone going through it. Yeah, so when you say grief right like break it down for people who do not understand what that kind of feels like because someone I've never been pregnant before like how do you, how do you explain to someone what grief is for a person or a child You've never met?
Speaker 2:I mean it's, it's like losing a loved one, right, because in your mind you're pregnant. You've now thought about all the things that are gonna come after that. Right, you thought about the Pregnancy and then that, carrying that baby in your arms, I already had a child, so I knew exactly what the process was and what I'm gonna get from it. And so you've already imagined all this. Not only that, you've told your, your partner, your husband, you've told him we're having this baby, and you've had this excited. You know, you've had this excitement and you've celebrated, and then that's all just taking away from you.
Speaker 2:Hmm, and I think couples with this whole and I'm gonna go back to it feeling broken and feeling like your body's not doing what it's supposed to do, and you're all you're mourning that in a way too. Yeah, and so it's. It's a lot of grief, and you've not necessarily met that Baby, and some people have, unfortunately. Yeah, I'm at a later stage and I, you know, so it's, it's, it's similar to losing a loved one, even though you've never met them. It's grief is great.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I wanted to ask that question because a lot of times people don't resonate with how that potentially feels, and I'm glad that you explained it because and I feel like having a child and then going through those issues To the point that you made about you know what it's like like, you know what should be coming next, yeah, and for that not to happen, that's got to be like gut wrenching, right.
Speaker 2:I'll say to Going through each pregnancy after the first loss is terrifying. It's a constant battle, because you're going to an ultrasound and you're going, you're expecting, you're expecting the next time for them to say there's no heartbeat. You know you're expecting them to say there's something wrong, and so, literally every single time I went to an appointment, my blood pressure was up my you know, and I was almost in tears.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and thankfully my doctor in the first, however many weeks allowed every single week I went in for an ultrasound and he allowed me to do that so that I would ease my nerves and I could just keep going a little bit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's the importance of a good doctor, right? Could you imagine if it wasn't, if your doctor wasn't at that accommodating for that, I did switch.
Speaker 2:I did switch doctors after the first couple of losses because I felt I needed the compassion and I need a different Partner in this, and I did. I did get a partner and someone who was with me every step of the way, explained every step of the way you, you needed surgery. Basically, after a loss, after there's no heartbeat, they need to take that, that feed us out, and you know you need someone to be there by your side and checking on you. I actually to take blood thinner shots With IVF. There was a lot. I had gestational diabetes, I had gestational hypertension, so yeah, I was.
Speaker 2:A lot of appointments, a lot of appointments.
Speaker 1:We don't realize how much, or take into account how much, women go through when they're pregnant, right Like what it takes to actually bring a life into this world. Like you deserve the push gifts that the people talk about. You deserve them. Oh, yes, you know it's not even that.
Speaker 2:It's yes, making the baby, having the baby it's it's a lot. The recovery. I don't think people I think people underestimate the recovery, underestimate what the breastfeeding process is going to look like. And feeding your baby, yeah, I don't think anyone prepares you for how hard that really is. And I will say I'm so thankful for social media these days and Moms who are real. Thank you to all the real moms who don't just post the fun like look how easy this is. My baby is always happy.
Speaker 2:No oh there is tears, there is lots of dirty diapers. There are moments I'll never forget with Eva. You know the breastfeeding journey is hard and there was nights where I was just breaking down in the middle of the night and people are posting that now, and people are posting just Inspirational things, but at the same time they're post posting. This is hard. I am struggling and I think that is so real and so amazing, because it's so much less lonely when you're sitting there in the middle Of the night and you're exhausted and someone else is actually saying I'm going through that too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, my best friend of all. She's aria's too now, which is crazy to think about you. But when she was pregnant, like we were, she was sending me like ticktocks and things like that. So like my whole ticktock Instagram algorithm was if I was having a baby. So it was a lot of things I did not know. People go like the mucus plug, like the breastfeeding Like and I know Samantha wouldn't care if I said this, but like she didn't have an easy time breastfeeding like.
Speaker 1:I Know people don't right and you just assume that it just comes in naturally. I thought the same thing and, like you know, I remember first time she pumped, I think it was like two ounces, like she had tears in her eyes, like she was so excited. And then you look at what two ounces is? You just like it's not a lot right.
Speaker 2:I, after the blood transfusion, I struggled with live because I my body had no fluids left in it right, and so my breast milk didn't come in the same way that it would have. I also have Hashimoto's and PCOS For all the women.
Speaker 2:So Hashimoto's is an autoimmune disorder. It's a thyroid, that's your thyroid. So I know a lot of women you know you have your thyroid tested ends up being sluggish around 30 40 years old. I had that since I was 10. Yeah, shout out to my mom who had the doctors test me, yeah, and found it early. But I have Hashimoto's and PCOS.
Speaker 1:So that does PCOS yeah.
Speaker 2:PCOS lots of us, which does make it harder to conceive, but you know that does make it harder to produce breast milk as well. And so with live we were topping up all the time, so it was a much shorter journey with her. But at the end of the day, again, we have so much pressure and I'll go back to that again but we put a lot of pressure on ourselves. She's a happy, healthy baby and that is all that matters, that's all that matters, all that much happiest baby.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so you mentioned your mom and you know I tell you that live looks just like your mom.
Speaker 2:Yes, you do twins.
Speaker 1:I don't know how. No one else says that, but I think that they look like my husband. No way, she looks like your mom anyway, I say all that to say, like, how is your mom been in supportive during all of this? For you, incredible?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, my mom is my best friend, mm-hmm. It's funny when you asked me earlier how I was as a kid, because as a kid we were not best friends.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, if you were not a good kid, I would imagine.
Speaker 2:Not a good kid. I think I told her I hated her all the time, so I'm really sorry for that mom, I think we all do that, though we all have those moments.
Speaker 2:But when I moved to Bermuda, we became best friends Mm-hmm best friends. We talk every day multiple times, and she has been the biggest support system I will never forget. After I had lived, we sent her a picture right. Here's the baby, she's out. And then everything kind of went. I started bleeding. I had to go into the operating room, rushed in. I had three OBs standing over me. It was all crazy, oh my gosh. And she called my husband and she said you know where she are, let me talk to her. And he was kind of like freaking out, what do I?
Speaker 1:say right, oh my god. So he told her all.
Speaker 2:They just had to go check her out. She looks what are you not telling me? So he had to tell her and when I came back I think I was in the operating room about three hours and then recovery. So by the time I guess a long time it didn't feel that way. My poor husband sitting there is no idea what's happening, am I okay? And I go back. And I called her and I had the look on her face, the tears that came down her face, I mean. But but she's been my best friend, my blood pressure issues when I was pregnant with Eva and you know I was going and I was being induced to have even got on the next plane and unfortunately we don't live close by, she's in Florida but only a plane right away. But she's my best friend and she's been the biggest support system for me going through this.
Speaker 1:What would you say? Something that she kind of not necessarily taught you, but like from her parenting style that you kind of mimic now? Yeah, that's.
Speaker 2:She's very warm, but I think we learned independence from a young age I was working at 17. She she gets good advice and so I think, just being there for your kids and giving the advice they need, she's just a warm person and she's easy to talk to and I think I've taken that from her right. Just be open and be warm and make people want to feel like they can come and talk to you. Yeah, and especially going through this, I'm really happy that I've had as many people approach me and come to me and ask me for help and support, because it just means that I'm like her in that approachable way. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So when you think of fear, right, and of everything that you've been through in your journey trying to conceive life, move into a different country, all of these things that. All these things that you've been through, when you think of fear, like, what are you afraid of and how do you manage that? Oh, that's a good question. Thanks, I work on that. You're right, I mean.
Speaker 2:I'm brave at times. Right, I did pick up and move to a foreign country. Like you said, I didn't know anyone my first time in Bermuda. I was literally landing. You know, I went to work the next day and that was an amazing experience. And I'm brave in that way because I know I was gonna meet people, I know I'm personable. So fear, not, not a fear is a fear of fear, not a fear of succeeding, because I am confident and I think you need to be confident as a leader, but I think fear of not succeeding in other ways. You know, we dropped the ball at home and I'm going, fear that I'm not gonna, you know, get food on the table, not money-wise, but in terms of you know.
Speaker 2:Make sure the time to go and do that and fear that I'm not gonna be enough in that way. You know, am I gonna? I want to say I'm a successful wife and I want to say I'm a successful mom. But those are the things I'm most fearful of is being the best I can be at home and being the best I can be for my kids and raising amazing kids who are confident and Fearless and leaders. That's all I want for them, but that's probably what scares me the most.
Speaker 1:Okay, and then you spoke about success and being successful like. What would you define as success in your life?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've had lots of conversations about this. I think it's a really important question and I think we always go back to you know, success is being at the top and success is making a lot of money, but that's not what it is for me. Yes, I want those things, but success is really. Am I a good person? Yeah, first and foremost, am I a good person, because if you're a good person, you're successful. You succeeded in life, right, and Am I? Are my kids good people?
Speaker 2:I Think that, to me, is that's yeah, that to me is is more success than anything else. Yeah, I think a good person.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think I totally agree with you. I think a lot of times we put so much pressure on Success when it comes to how much money we make. You know our cars, our houses, what our kids end up doing. They're nice, like don't get me wrong life, life is easier when you have a little change in your pocket, like I'm not disputing that. But sometimes you have all those things and you deal people who have all those things and they're just not nice. You know, and I mean, and it takes away from all the other stuff because you're gonna end up lonely If you're not a nice person and you know family and I don't know the offspring part of it, but you know family and friends and people you care that care about you and you care about that means way more, because if you have nothing like Life is just so much more meaningful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, totally yeah, and having a great circle of people around you that inspire you and are there for you, it's so important.
Speaker 1:Absolutely so. If you could think of, like, the next generation of leaders that are coming up after you we don't say the next generation, that's a little dramatic, but you know the leaders that are coming up post-share are like what advice would you give another female leader that's coming up after you?
Speaker 2:Be true to yourself, I think is a big one, right? I think we try to be who we think we should be versus who we really are. And who you are is amazing, right, it's. It's easy to look and say they want me to be this way, they want me to be that way, they want you know, I'll take marketing, for example. Right, you have the older generation who didn't understand social media, for example. Right, and you have to take that risk and you have to take that challenge and convince right and say, look, this is the benefit, and without risk, there's no reward.
Speaker 2:I think that's a big one too. Without risk, no reward. But just be true to yourself, be who you are and push the limits and take risks. I think that's really important. And I think too is you know, find that work balance. If we're talking about work Is find that balance, because I think that's really important. It's easy to say you know, if I don't look at my email at midnight, if I don't look at my email at 1 am or respond right away, it's okay. You know, things can wait and things will wait. Some things are urgent.
Speaker 2:We have you know hopefully no hurricanes coming but you know, working in telecommunications company hurricanes have taken on a whole new meaning.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's so true, Because internet no, can't live without the internet right, Nope you can't so.
Speaker 2:Balco and internet, yep, and mobile, yeah, but I think you know it's important to have that work-life balance. So I think try to find that and just be true to who you are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely All right. So final question Everyone gets asked it when they leave, before they can leave the couch is what do you want to be remembered for when you're no longer here on this planet and someone says Sharra Jaddo, I'll say it again what do you want to be remembered for?
Speaker 2:Can I just say again a good person. Yeah, I just want to be someone who. I'm going to my grandmother. She's actually my buddy, that's Yiddish for grandmother Bubby Rose. When we went to her funeral, there were no seats or standing room left in that room. She was the most amazing woman who took everybody in. You know, all the kids wanted to go to her house. She was just such a warm person. She lived, you know, a three hour drive from us. You show up your favorite foods on the table and the cookies, and she was just such a warm, loving, caring person. And as much again as I want to say. You know, known to be this leader or a boss or wherever I am, I just want to be known for just being a good person and I would. You know, I don't think I'll see my funeral, but if I did, it would be amazing to see the no standing room left in that room just because of the impression that you left on people. That's what I want from myself.
Speaker 1:All right, cheryl. Well, thank you so much.
Speaker 2:Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1:I'm glad you mentioned earlier, if anyone wants to get in contact with you, rather to talk about your fertility journey, becoming a female leader, marketing communications what's the best way for them to get in contact with you?
Speaker 2:So it's she-ra-s-h-i-r-a-one-zero-zero-eight, my birthday at hotmailcom. And yes, I still use Hotmail.
Speaker 1:Not a.
Speaker 2:Hotmail I use Hotmail.
Speaker 2:I check my junk folder, don't worry, but please, if anything, you know I'm so open to talking about anything. Any questions? Obviously, I've been through the infertility and the pregnancy laws and IVF and traveling away, so any questions, I'm always here for it and I'm happy to help. What about Instagram? Instagram is actually she-ra-one-zero-zero-eight to make that easy she-ra-jato on Instagram. So you know you can follow me there. There's a couple, I think there's only. I only posted one video, but happy to share it and also just answer any questions. I'm here for it.
Speaker 1:Perfect. Well, thank you again. Thank you.
Speaker 2:Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1:Of course I'm finally glad we got to nail it down.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:And we figured it out. Timing was perfect, so everything worked out well, yes, thank you Absolutely All right.
Speaker 1:guys, thanks so much for spending some time with myself and She-ra today. We're so excited that you spent some time with us and you got to hear She-ra's journey. We got to learn about how bad she was as a kid, but how amazing she is as an adult and as a mom and as a leader in the company that she works for. Like she said, if you want to get in contact with her, make sure you send over an email to her or, if you would like, you can also reach out to her on Instagram. Big shout out to our sponsors for this season Brown Co as well as 59 Front. Make sure you head over to Brown Co and you can get your corksicles for you to be able to keep your drinks hot and or cold while you are drinking them.
Speaker 1:Thanks so much for watching Hustle Her Podcast. Hey guys, thanks for watching that episode. I don't know if you saw, but we did have some books on display. Our sponsor this season is Brown Co and their bookmark curated some books for us. The first one was the Secrets of Tamron, then we had the Mental Wellness and finally we had the Cultural Treasures of the World. All of these books can be found at the bookmark at Brown Co.
