Hustle Her
Hustle Her
Hustle Her - Linda
As we wade through the complexities of self-discovery and social justice, it's rare to find a beacon like Linda Bogle-Mienzer , who not only navigates these waters but also charts a course for others. On the latest episode of Hustle Her Podcast, I'm joined by Linda, whose 25-year tenure with the Bermuda Police Service has been a testament to the power of advocacy and the pursuit of equity. Her stories aren't just experiences to be shared; they're lessons to be absorbed, particularly when it comes to advocating for Black individuals and the LGBTQIA+ community. As Linda recounts her journey from an introverted child to a formidable force within her profession, we're granted a glimpse into the essence of true growth and transformation.
The conversation transcends personal anecdotes, evolving into a nuanced dialogue on the role of work in our lives and the importance of maintaining boundaries between our professional and private worlds. Linda's insights extend into the significance of unions, underlining their role in fostering supportive environments where people do more than simply work—they thrive. The discussion is a contemplative exploration of labor struggles, the necessity of ensuring fair treatment in the workplace, and the personal equilibrium each of us strives to achieve in the elusive pursuit of work-life balance.
Finally, we tackle the layered concept of empowerment, especially within the context of intersectionality, and the responsibility Black women carry in shaping a better future for the next generation. This episode is not solely a narrative thread of Linda's life—it's an imperative call to readers to stand for equality, to uphold each other through adversity, and to embrace the legacies we create. Join us on Hustle Her Podcast to witness firsthand Linda's inspiring journey and to absorb the wisdom she imparts on empowerment, empathy, and advocacy.
I'm a hustler baby. It's time for Hustle Her podcast. I'm your host, deshae Caines. Hustle Her is all about inspiring women through real life experiences that have helped to mold and develop not only me of motivation, a bit of tough love and some actionable takeaways to be the best. You, girl, you are in the right place.
Speaker 1:Hey guys, and welcome back to Hustle Her Podcast. As always, thank you for spending some time with me today on the podcast. Make sure you head over to hustleherpodcastcom. Sign up to be a VIP listener, as well as, if you're watching this episode on YouTube right now, make sure you head over to hustleheartpodcastcom. Sign up to be a VIP listener, as well as, if you're watching this episode on YouTube right now, make sure you subscribe to the channel so you can stay up to date on all of our new episodes that are coming. So my next guest I'm really excited about. I went through one avenue to another to get her number to figure out if she wanted to be on the podcast today, but the beauty of connections and we are finally sitting here. My next guest is the amazing, the disruptor, ms Linda Bogomizer.
Speaker 2:Hello, how are you? I am fantastic, yes.
Speaker 1:I'm so excited we're here. The, I guess ways that we were talking about. I was like I want Linda to be on my podcast, but I don't know, no, no Linda. But I know my dad knows Linda, so I reached out to my dad and then my dad forgot. So I'm glad we're finally here, hey, your.
Speaker 2:Your dad is is one of my favorite people, and so whenever he makes a call, I am generally always accommodating, all right I love that.
Speaker 1:I love the generally not always, but we'll see what we can make it work Because we have some connections that don't come with friendship.
Speaker 2:It happens, but he's in his employer capacity of not always accommodating.
Speaker 1:Oh goodness, that's hilarious. Yeah, but we'll get into that a little bit more as well. So we always start off. I want to get everyone to get to know you a little bit, so we'll just start off with a few rapid fires Ready. Yeah, all right, I'm. We'll just start off with a few rapid fires ready.
Speaker 2:Yeah, all right, I'm happiest when, when I'm with my family, yeah, absolutely all right.
Speaker 1:What do you like to do on the plane?
Speaker 2:like, when you get on the plane, you put your suitcase up like what's your go-to um, get my last prayer, because I always think I'm gonna die on a plane, and so I am terrified of flying as much as I fly.
Speaker 1:I do not like flying are you a middle aisle window seater? I?
Speaker 2:have to be by the window, okay, and and if, if somebody I know it's not is by the window, then I have to go in my negotiation and get the window okay, yeah okay, what's the skincare routine? Um, generally it's just been soap and water. But recently I I've been, I've gotten into Anzuri and I found that it works for my skin, so I've been loving it.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right, what do? Oh sorry, who's your closest friend?
Speaker 2:Uh, judy Simmons, BFFs, my BFF, my ride or die Love that I remember. At my wedding, judy told my wife that please know, I will help her bury the body, and then I will have to kill her too, because she tells everything. So that's how it's going to go.
Speaker 1:That's hilarious, that's a serious, that's a welcome and a threat all wrapped in one right. That's the kind of friend she needs. There you go. Everybody needs one of those, all right right, that's the kind of friends you need there you go.
Speaker 2:Everybody needs one of those. All right, what does love feel like? Um? My absolute favorite, one of my favorite meals is um scallop and potatoes by my mom, and that's what love feels like when I eat that. It just everything in the world feels right and that's how my love feels.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, it's like a bite of scalloped potatoes. Or your mom's scalloped potatoes.
Speaker 2:Any of my mom's, there you go. I mean, my wife made it once. You know she's getting there. Ooh, ooh, ooh. She's getting there, Ooh, ooh ooh, mm-mm Getting there.
Speaker 1:What we're not going to do is talk about wifey and she's not here, all right, what are you listening to right now?
Speaker 2:I tend not to listen to a lot of music. I have this app called Blink it, so I listen to a lot of books. Okay and yeah. My favorite app Perfect.
Speaker 1:What's a hidden talent about you? People don't know?
Speaker 2:That I am very electrical minded, like I fix everything in my house yeah, I could fix pretty much anything all right, well done.
Speaker 1:They'll save a little money there too, right? Yeah, of course and then, finally, as we've started the new year, it's appropriate to start having these conversations. Who's your cut match team?
Speaker 2:well, there is only one cut match team well, let's hope you can stay.
Speaker 1:well, it's summer, so there we go, thereet, there we go there, we go, there we go.
Speaker 2:I don't even know of another cop match team.
Speaker 1:Lara's outnumbered again. There's three to one, but it's all right, we love her anyway. All right, so let's jump right in. So tell me about Linda as a child. What did you like to get into?
Speaker 2:Where did tell me about little Linda? I was very introverted and I had a couple of years where I didn't speak at all. I just spoke in general and so I was very, very quiet. So a lot of the people that knew me from my childhood or from my past they're surprised at the current Linda because they're like where did she come from, right? Um, so I didn't really get into it much.
Speaker 2:I was always with my grandmother, my parents, of course, were um, working two, three jobs, so I didn't see them a lot generally, just one day out of the the weekend when we went to football games. We were huge fans of somerset children's okay. So that that was our life, but I spent a lot of time with my grandmother I'm going to work with her at Elbow Beach Laundry and just being in her presence. So, yeah, I'm a grandma's girl for sure.
Speaker 1:Big time? Yeah, absolutely. What were some of the things that your grandma taught you, or you learned from being around her all the time?
Speaker 2:The one thing that I've carried in my life and I stick by is my grandmother always told me they could take anything from you, but your integrity. That is something you gift others, and so I have stuck by that, and so I am a person of huge integrity that's that's what I live by yeah, I got that from my granny that's amazing.
Speaker 1:I love that. My nana, I just recorded my nana. She was right before you so it was like kind of fitting. I love that a little bit. Okay, so I was told, so I read your bio, right, and you said that you liked cricket and tennis. But I was told you played cricket yeah, for Bermuda at one point. So fill me in on how you got into cricket yeah, I think liking cricket is an understatement.
Speaker 2:I love cricket. I think it is a national treasure that Bermuda I don't think we exploit enough, but the way that we play it here and the way it's really a connection with families and community.
Speaker 1:Culture yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:It's part of our culture right. So, of course, I played cricket as a child, I played tip-to-go in the backyard, and then, of course, I played cricket as a child, I played tip-to-go in the backyard, and then, of course, when I got older.
Speaker 1:I have no idea what tip-to-go is, by the way. No, not a clue.
Speaker 2:Okay, I definitely will put that on my list.
Speaker 1:Yes, please, we have to do that. Yeah, you have to play tip-to-go.
Speaker 2:You get hero status in the neighborhood if you can play tipifty good. Well, but that's how I started my my love of cricket. Okay, and as I got older and I wanted to really play it more, of course it was at a time where, um, girls cricket wasn't being developed, it wasn't heard of. And so when the national cricket program came along and a friend of mine, peter philpott, said, hey, linda, you should come in and try out for the national team, because at that time I was with police. Anytime police had cricket games I would go and play, try to play, with the guys. And so that's how I got into the national program. And then when the opportunity came for Bermuda to try to get into the World Cup and we had to go to Canada to qualify, then that's how we really emerged on a national level. And then when we beat Canada which was not expected we got to go to the qualifiers. That was like amazing.
Speaker 1:Wow, yeah, Because when we think of Bermuda, most people don't always come to us for our sports right, Like when they think Bermuda, like on this. You know world stage when it comes to that. So to find people that are really passionate about it and actually played because you never really hear about women playing cricket, so I love that for you. And then being in Canada too, that's a big one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was huge. But I mean, cricket was always around. Bermuda usually actually had a national cricket league way back there. You're talking in the 60s, right, that was huge, but it was never really developed. And so, of course, everything with money, when you have money coming into programs, it generally goes south to the men's and the boys. And so from Bermuda to be Canada, when we left to go to play over in Canada, we just like sharing bets and stuff, right. And then when we won and we came back and of course we got sponsorship, yeah, and so when we went to the, the world qualifiers, we were way out of our league. I mean, our training program was nothing. They were coming off the field and having ice baths, you know, and we were like what ice bath?
Speaker 2:you know we don't do that sort of thing yeah I say that to say where our levels were, and so the fact that we were there and competing was an incredible feat, and I don't I don't think people give us enough credit that to make the qualifiers we had to be in the top 16 in the world.
Speaker 1:Wow, and so that is something yeah that no one talks about that, nobody talks about that.
Speaker 2:Nobody talks about that. Wow, and how? Yeah, how bermuda put, we put ourselves on the map. Yeah, they always talk about the defeats were terrible. Yeah, because we were way out of our league, but still we were there right, and I think that others, um teams that we played with out there, they were able to see how a an organized structure could be, because that's what put me ahead. We just didn't have that level of talent, but if we had continued, we could have, we could have went pretty far, absolutely well.
Speaker 1:It's a shame, though, to think about that you didn't could, that it didn't continue. The program didn't continue because you just never know.
Speaker 2:Well, I just don't think that we're equally vested in women's sports in the country.
Speaker 1:if we're being honest, it's a conversation to be had, yeah.
Speaker 2:It doesn't happen. When you get the money that comes in and you start to divvy it out. It always goes to the boys and the men's teams, whether they accomplish anything or not yeah, and now we're starting to see consequences of that in our national team absolutely.
Speaker 1:I mean, if you look at our girls football program, they are excelling at the moment. You know what I mean. They're going into their tournaments, they're winning, they're coming back, and you're definitely correct where they're not getting the same recognition, um that our male teams uh get, especially on the global stage, and even with local funding they don't um, so hopefully I think they started that program younger, so hopefully it gets a little better for them. But um, what I do love, though, on a world stage, is flora. Flora brings home that, that female side of it for us. When her race is the last race of the triathlon, it's always, like you know, it's always the men's race. That's the last race, right? So that's always cool to watch. So tell me about tennis. What was the? It says?
Speaker 2:aficionado in tennis as well, yeah, I mean, I played tennis as a fluke. You know, I lived in Padgett and some of the kids out there played tennis. I didn't really know what it was about, so I went with them one Saturday and I turned out. I was good at it but my family didn't have the finances that came with it, so I was never pushed even though I had the talent, Sometimes I would go Saturdays and couldn't play because my you know, my parents hadn't paid the dues that were due at that time.
Speaker 2:And so it just sort of I was never, never pushed, but I always had the talent and I continued to play like right up to adulthood. I don't play as much as I used to because I just don't have the time. But yeah, I could play tennis. Yes, I love that. Of course, I'm a huge Serena fan.
Speaker 1:Yeah, big time, yeah time, yeah, I mean that's kind of an understatement I mean, yeah, I feel like you got kind of gotta be, but now I'm getting into coco.
Speaker 2:I love coco the way, the way she advocates for herself on the court, the most her most recent one love it yeah, so I'm a big coco fan, yeah yeah, and I think what I love about the era that we're in is that coco could do that and not have as much backlash as Serena 100% Serena. Serena was doing it and people were like oh, get her off the pitch Angry.
Speaker 1:Yeah, People are rallying around her and they're like she's absolutely right and she should be doing that. And every time she does it as a tennis fan, knowing the the rule, she's absolutely she was 100 right especially the last one, when the when the umpire called that out or called it before or after, I can't remember um and she advocated for herself she's a millionaire, you know, so she could do it and do whatever she wants at this same consequence as serena here serena wasn't making a million dollars, not at all, I mean I'm not hating.
Speaker 2:Serena's gonna be fine, she don't need any. My advocacy for money serena's all right.
Speaker 1:Serena's gonna be all right, she's gonna be all right. So tell me about, uh, your 25 year career in the bermuda police service. Like, how would that how? First of all, how did you even get into the police service?
Speaker 2:I was working for customs at the time. Um, they had these training um customs posts and I just wasn't feeling it. And so it's like what, what am I gonna do right? And so I looked at my plan and my sister, who has been a police officer all her life, you now she came up to the cadet program and uh, she was like, oh, they have these jobs at police. Um, they're looking for station duty officers who be the initial face of reports. And I was like, yeah, they need that because the police service front end was crappy.
Speaker 2:It's like you're not sure if you're the victim or the suspect when you was called in the police department and so I saw that as one a way to um be in an advocacy position for people, but also like hey, I can make a career out of this, so that's where it started yeah, and so how would you say that shaped your approach into labor relations and advocacy?
Speaker 2:Well, it definitely shaped my approach because I noticed the difference of the treatment of people when they came through the door, and I vowed that whenever and I've never made an apology for it, I never will but when a Black person walks through the police department doors, I want them to know that they're going to get what they deserve in justice and equity when they see me behind there and I always did that from the day that I left. I think that makes a huge difference in the relationship, one with the police department and the public, but also with the relationship of people when they're coming in and they're victims. Right, you're a victim. You should never be turned into a suspect. Absolutely, and I saw it and I advocated for and I still advocate for absolutely, but you, you have to.
Speaker 1:You need people and organizations who see the treatment of how things are going, and it's you make it your responsibility to change that narrative around that, because you know people, the police, don't have the best rep when it comes to in the community, the man. All these types of things people look at in a very negative way, so it's not always a welcoming place for people to come when they are victims. So knowing that there's someone on the other side being an advocate and giving them the proper treatment, I I think that's commendable.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I didn't have the best treatment in the police department.
Speaker 2:It was in the police department that I actually came out, and my experience in the police department, first as a closeted gay person but then as an all gay person, was terrible, and so I vowed that I would leave, as a part of my legacy with police, an environment where everybody can be themselves and bring their whole self to work Absolutely, and that has. I've always advocated for that at the police Senate. It changed over the years, but it was a difficult time. It was a very difficult time.
Speaker 1:What made you decide to come out during your time at the police?
Speaker 2:Um, because I got tired of bringing somebody else to work. Hmm, that's deep. Yeah, just got tired of it. You know, you, you think of basic conversations at work. Hey, what did you do this weekend, right you?
Speaker 1:generally tell people what you did.
Speaker 2:I hung out with my boo or me, or so whatever it is but when you can't bring yourself to work, you're you're making up these things or you're not telling the truth. You're saying, oh, I did nothing but I had amazing weekends. They just weren't things that you felt comfortable saying, right, I could not say I could not say yeah, because the police department is a homophobic culture wow, interesting.
Speaker 1:It's so interesting when we think about where we are in society when it comes to LGBTQIA rights and when it comes to people being able to be their whole selves and to work. And we live in an environment where there's still people who are uncomfortable coming to work as their whole selves. Like what would you say to someone knowing what you know now if they were trying to be authentically them at work?
Speaker 2:I would say what my grandma used to say six one, one way, half a dozen, the other right. If you come to work and you're out, they're going to treat you some way. If you come to work and you're not out, you're going to treat yourself some way. Either way, you're losing, all right. So you pick what's the worst, and anytime you're not being yourself, that's got to be the worst, because you're already telling people by how you treat yourself that listen, I don't even think myself's good enough, so it's okay for you to treat me like that. Wow, you can't. That can't.
Speaker 1:You can't win like that you can't do that, not at all. So I guess that self-advocacy, right. How did that morph into advocacy at work? And then now we're finished with the police and you're transitioning into your union career, how does all the self-advocacy morph into the roles that you've had, into your current role now?
Speaker 2:Well, I came into my labor role as a result of a tragedy. It was Fabian, our shop store at the time. Gladys Saunders lost her life at Fabian and my best friend, Chicken Simon. So at that time, um, we didn't have any advocacy Right and because of the noise that I was making around Fabian, my colleagues were like, hey, you're going to be our shop store. It wasn't.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and for those who don't know, sorry because not everyone that listens is in bermuda. What is a shop store?
Speaker 2:so a shop store is a uh union elected official that is actually in the workplace that represents the workers of that work, okay all right.
Speaker 1:So you were saying the colleagues were like you're going to be the shop, yeah, so as, as the uh current person responsible for shop store the elections.
Speaker 2:That's not how it's supposed to go. It's supposed to be a proper election process and then you get voted but it wasn't like that right, they're just like you're it?
Speaker 2:you know you, you speak the most, you advocate the most, yeah you're it, but I and this is another result of being a grandma's girl my grandma was like when you get into something, whether you put your hand up willingly or not, right, you have to earn it. And so once I took it over, it wasn't just like, oh well, you know, they asked me to do this, I guess I'll show up. It wasn't like that. It was like, okay, I'm going to be that person. And so I did the research. I did the research, I did the education. I got really into what the union stood for currently because my association with the union came from my uncle, david Bell, who was president of the BPSU, which I represent, but I wasn't connected to it. I knew about the big union events, the island-wide strike, but I wasn't connected to it. And so once I became a union official, I thought, hey, I better figure out what is the real advocacy for workers. And once I got into that, I am here.
Speaker 1:And what is the real advocacy?
Speaker 2:here and what is the real advocacy? Employment is about the task you perform and remuneration for those tasks. Right jobs are not your family, right employers are not your parents right, so they don't get to tell us we have moved where it's almost like employment is like your, your, your family and your parents, and they're telling you what to do, what to wear at work, what to stay at work, how to do everything. That's not what they're supposed to do. Yet you have tasks that they ask you to complete and you complete those tasks and you get paid right. So the real advocacy for me is workplaces are supposed to be an extension of your household circles, where you can be the best person and perform these tasks.
Speaker 2:Well, we've become more into getting those tasks performed. Whether you're the best person, a good person, a bad person, it doesn't matter the person and in that we're just losing a whole culture of people, because everybody's obsessed with the remuneration for these tasks and so you can't live and work. We can't survive and work places like that, and that's why we're seeing the results of this. We're seeing increased people and drugs and alcohol and domestic violence and all of these things Depression, burnout, burnout, everything Because it's just all about the remuneration for these tasks and these jobs are taking over our lives. There is no work-life balance. Yeah, when you start to talk about work-life balance, people start to look at you sideways I actually have a love-hate relationship with work-life balance because I think it's not attainable, right.
Speaker 1:Like I don't think true balance in either of those ways. Like I think we're giving people a goal that is not something that they're going to be able to reach, right. I think it's work-life balance for you. It's different for you, then it's different for me, maxie Lara, whatever works for us is different for each person. So I think when people are aspiring to work-life balance, I think that what that looks like, and not being able to look at your phone and all these things is different for everybody, and so I think once we kind of come around to what that is, I think people would be easier to kind of, I guess, take on what that might mean for them.
Speaker 2:I don't think that it can be defined because it's individual. Yeah Right, so I never want to say this is what work-life balance looks like. Yeah, I want to know when you're balanced, and I know when you're balanced, when you're your best you. When you're not your best you.
Speaker 2:There's a imbalance somewhere so you have to figure out what it is yeah, right, and so the advocacy of the union comes in is creating these platforms in these places, in these safe places where you can have that conversation with your employer. But also, we have an employment act that governs the workplace. We have our collective bargaining agreements that govern the workplace. These are things to make sure that the workplace remains equitable and the same for everybody. That's all they're there for. But what your workplace balance looks like is for you to have that conversation with your employer, but what we've done is we've made it so rigid that everybody has to follow. Workplace balance looks like is for you to have that conversation with your employer, but what we've done is we've made it so rigid that everybody has to follow the same thing, and that is where then people fall away or we're getting people coming into work.
Speaker 1:That's not their best yeah, I know, I totally agree. But what do you say to people who don't have the most positive experiences with the union? Right, and it's usually employers, but like some people who are not in, you know, unionized environments and I don't think people fully understand the purpose of unions. Or they say things like union, the time for union was back then and not now. Like how do you kind of get people on side with the belief and the advocacy and the actual purpose of what unions are for, based on what you do?
Speaker 2:I ask people to tell me something employers give willingly. That's outside of the requirements of the collective bargaining agreement or the employment act. It's fair and so. Without that, there will always be a need for unions, because everybody has benefited from the advocacy of unions. You didn't wake up and the employer says hey, I like you so much, let me give you maternity leave. I like you so much, let me give you paternity leave. I like you so much, let me give you a lunch break. My grandmother tells the story of how she had my mother on a Tuesday and by Friday she had to be back to work or she wasn't going to get paid. That's crazy, right? Could you imagine?
Speaker 1:that happening now.
Speaker 2:Right. There are still employers in this country today who do not give people annual leave. That's why we had to put in the employment act. There are employers that still in this country don't pay people who are off sick. So people drag themselves and we saw it during COVID, when people were coming to work no matter how well they were sick, but they couldn't lose the income. So when people say to me me, oh, the time for unions are gone, I say show me a time where employers are morally fulfilling their obligation and legally, and I'll say, okay, it's time for unions to go that's a fair point.
Speaker 1:I've never been in a unionized environment. I'm actually not as familiar with what benefits you get from a union and in a unionized environment, so I'm always very interested to hear like what, like you as a shop steward or being involved in the, in the roles and things that you do now, but I've never been in an environment where I benefited directly from it. Like all the other things you just mentioned maternity leave, all of those types of things 100%. I get that, pensions, all of that but I've never, and I think there's a large segment of people who are in the same boat and they don't see the value behind that either. So that's good to know.
Speaker 2:Well, let me tell you a prime example. Came over the period of COVID. Right, there were employers who you would leave. When you leave your place of employment on a Friday you have the weekends off Everything in your mindset tells you you're going to work on Monday. Right, you're planning out your life for the income that you're getting for the rest of the year based on the fact you're going to work on Monday. On Monday, your employer calls you into a room and says hey, because of finance or because of whatever, we're just not going to need you anymore. We're going to pay you for the rest of the month. Check you later. What can you do? Nothing. That doesn't happen under a union umbrella. Okay, that does not happen.
Speaker 2:And a lot of people found out the safety of that union umbrella during covid because that was happening all over bermuda. Yeah, right, people were being laid off, allegedly fired. We don't need you anymore. Without any sort of agreements and nothing. You're just out there. You don't know where your next income's coming from, and these were from companies who had the resources right, but just had no obligation.
Speaker 2:When you're on a collective bargaining agreement, that doesn't happen. Yeah, we have those parameters in there and any anybody in our bargaining union wakes up one day and says, oh, I'm just gonna fire linda today. Okay, try that again. Okay, because I always say unions are like that commercial. You remember that verizon commercial where the um gangster told the person to come and meet them and they were gonna to beat them up. And then they came and all these people were behind us. And the gangster said hey, I tell you, come by yourself. Who are those people behind you? He said oh, that's my network. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's what we are. We're your network. Wherever you go, the whole union and all of its membership goes with you.
Speaker 1:Okay, but what do you say to people who think that people abuse the union in that way when it comes to the strikes and you know things like that, like you know, because they know the union is going to back them or call out or things like that and I'm playing a bit of devil's advocate here. But, like, what do you say to people who are like, oh, they're just exploiting the fact that they know the union are going to lay you know down tools because of this person they may not have, they may shouldn't, may not have the right to do that?
Speaker 2:every family has one of them. It's so true, though, every family has one of them Union to family.
Speaker 2:We're not perfect. Yeah, we have employees that should be held accountable more. They're not. And we have employees that take advantage of some of the benefits under the union and use them in ways they were never intended for.
Speaker 2:Right, I am that person in the union who will tell you no, no, no, you're wrong. Right, and there are consequences. Yeah, and all organizations must hold themselves and their membership accountable. Absolutely right, and so I don't put the union outside of that. But what I do say is that, when it comes to bigger things that may come to the public's um knowledge, they don't know everything, right, so they see something, they only see the black and white of it. But the union has this collective bargaining agreement and rules, right, even the worst person that you don't like on a job that, when they get fired, oh my gosh, you can't wait to see them go I have some of them, right. It's like, oh, there is a God, right. But then you find out that the process used to fire them was incorrect, and so we're fighting for the process and not always the person, because if we allow that process to be used, then what happens when it's used for?
Speaker 1:the innocent person, right.
Speaker 2:So you see us marching in the street for that person and you're like what? You're fighting for that person, that person, this and that, right, but we and this is some places where the union has failed is we don't always say this is the reason, right, and so people are left with this impression that we just fight for any person. Yeah, but it's not true.
Speaker 1:No, I agree with you there. I was going to be my next thing about the communication of it, because I think that's a. I think that's a lapse period in Bermuda with a lot of things that can be very controversial. It's not always explained properly.
Speaker 2:And I think if that the process of it as opposed to the person was explained, I think people would be a bit more understanding around that for sure. I, I agree, I agree and, and I said I take ownership I don't think that we do a good enough job of it, but sometimes in the mix, like we don't always get that chance.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and to be fair.
Speaker 2:The media doesn't always give us an opportunity to yeah, to get our side of the story out before they create a narrative around something that isn't true.
Speaker 1:That's yeah, that's. That's a conversation for a different time. So I'm so disappointed you don't have on a bow tie today, because I literally wrote this question. I was, like you're often seen sporting your signature bow ties right, but it's okay. But you are often with your bow ties with your mantra I'm just a worker who fights for all workers. Do I guess these personal elements of you? How do they reflect in your approach to advocacy and this is just throughout your life? Like, how does that? How do you bring you into your advocacy?
Speaker 2:Well, the bow ties are from my grandfather my grandfather. If ever you are a child and you meet somebody that their presence in the room just changes how you feel about life. I used to see my grandfather and whenever he came he used to have on the crispiest white shirts, suspenders and his pants and a bow tie, and I always just was like, oh my gosh, he looks amazing. And I would tell, of course, my family members that I want to wear a bow tie and suspenders, like grandpa or whatever, and they're like no, girls can't do that, right, right. And so when I got the opportunity to define my own style.
Speaker 2:I went back to that little girl and said I got you, I love that, and so I start wearing bow ties everywhere and of course that came with its own, you know, backlash. But at that point, like I didn't care, and I think I think that's part of my advocacy, because wherever I go, I tell people you get to do anything you want in the definition of yourself, and I don't think we say that enough. It's not about sexuality, it's not about any of this, it's just that how do you want to define yourself? Because people automatically make the assumption about my sexuality, which is fine because I back it up, because I've said it Right. But what about those people who haven't said it? You're making assumptions that may not be true.
Speaker 1:And that's difficult, right. I mean what I think when I hear you, and I hear you speak on things like this and you know you're so confident and so you know you're so aware of who you are, how did you get to that level of self-awareness where because I hear you saying, you know, I don't mind, I welcome the challenges, things that are coming my way? How did you get to that point?
Speaker 2:It was life or death. Ok, uh, it was life or death, okay. One day I I was so over how I was being treated that I actually thought that death was way better than how I was living. And I drove down to my favorite place, which is watchers hill, and I drove my car right to the end and I said, okay, I'm done. And I said, god, you're gonna have to save me, because I've done everything to try to save myself and there's nothing left for me to do. Right. And my nephew, who was a child at the time, right, called me on the cell phone his mama's cell phone. He was playing, okay, and that I took that as a sign from go up.
Speaker 2:But that triggered me, as how could I want to not be in my nephew's life, who I absolutely adore, because of all these other people that don't give a flying about Right? And so that when I, when that switch was like that, I came out to my family, came out to my friends and everything since then, it was just like, yeah, well, this is it. And so everything that I've done from that day forward is about being unapologetic about my authentic self, because how I think I arrived at my sexuality could be entirely different from what you think, but all that matters is what I think, because that's what I have to live with, and so that's how I'm able to carry on. And so I do that with my, my style. I do that. If I I shave my hair off, people's like, oh, are you sick? Or whatever.
Speaker 1:No, it's just my hair that's what you want to do. So going back to you saying after that moment with and honestly it, it breaks my heart to think that you at a point where you felt like the only option at that time was to take your own life because you had done everything that you can do and I, and I don't know this means anything, but I'm sorry that you felt that way. I think being able to show up as your authentic self every single day and people just loving you for who you are is taken for granted by people who do not have to face things that you've had to face before in your life and I apologize for that.
Speaker 2:It is taken for granted. It's something that most people that fit into the box that we've created will never, ever have to experience right, but they will experience, have to experience right, but they will experience. But they may not take ownership of it. Because, if we're real right, that box was not made for women, first agreed, definitely wasn't made for black women. No, definitely wasn't made for black gay women and definitely not for black gay women who are advocates, right. And so if you accept that there is a box for you, then it's fine, you're going to be fine Because you say, listen, it's a box, I got to be in it, no big deal, yeah. But if you say I am not prepared to be in that box, you have to know that the rest of the world is going to keep trying to close that lid on you. And so every day, every day, it's a struggle. Every day I have to be intentional about making that choice. Every single day, it never gets easy.
Speaker 2:I still get invitations just for me and who doesn't know? I have a whole wife right. I still have to justify my dress. I still have to, in my family, say wherever I go, my wife goes. I mean, it's a constant in the workplace. There are people that love me on this side and hate me on that side. So it's a constant. Yeah, but inside of my intentional space I'm fine. I'm fine. I have love right and anybody that's married or in a relationship, and you've been there for quite a quite some time. You got there because it's intentional. You have to work on it every day. I work on my marriage like a brush my teeth. I have an incredible, unconditional love for my puppies. I love that. Dogs we don't deserve them. We don't deserve them.
Speaker 2:We do not deserve dogs, they're amazing, and I tell people all the time I don't know if I would have survived COVID without my puppy, because I was in policing. My wife is a nurse at the hospital, a clinical manager. We were literally crossing each other in COVID. There were times when we hadn't seen each other for weeks because of our schedule, but we always had our puppy right To cement some normality, and I'm a person I don't like to be alone, and so having my puppy there even helped me get over my fear of thunder and lightning, because I became more concerned with how he was going to react to the thunder and lightning than my own fear of it. Right, and so I have that. I have some amazing friends and I have a piece that is connected with my humanity, and so it's easy for me to advocate because I associate everything with humanity. Yeah, absolutely yeah.
Speaker 1:so you mentioned something a little while ago about, especially in your union work. People love you for one thing, but then they don't embrace you on the other side. And so I think that intersectionality and like, I guess, the synthesis of that personal identity versus your professional dedication, like how do you balance that? Because I'm sure in the union right, people love you for your advocacy in the bullying space, you know, when it comes to being an advocate for something's going wrong at work, all of your knowledge there but then when you are out at the pride parade or you know you've you're getting married to your wife, things like that, I'm I'm assuming that that level of support is not the same. How do you deal with that intersectionality in your life? I?
Speaker 2:can't change people. I can only hope they change their heart. When you come to me and I'm your representative, I'm going to be the very best representative I could be, but I knew that I saw you march against me right, that's got to be hard.
Speaker 1:Man like I how, how do you, how does that make?
Speaker 2:I know you're, you've got this exterior now, but that feeling of I'm fighting for someone who literally marched against like who I am as a person uh, because in one sense, you're coming to me because you're paying me to do a job right and it's a job I believe in, and, whether I like you or not, I believe that you are entitled to rights. I wish everybody felt that way about me, but they don't. But that's for them and their own consciousness to come to grips with. At some point you're going to have to answer it right, but for me, I'm okay with that. Now, am I going to have you at my house? I don't think so. I could tell you that I don't think so. I could tell you that I don't think so. But every time you come in there as a union member, you're going to get the very best.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that and I think it's important because a lot of times in Bermuda in particular, right with, I guess, the adversities that we see when it comes to LGBTQIA plus community, it's not very warm and welcoming on the outer side of Bermuda, but then we have a community of people who are very well connected in that space but don't feel as open as you do to be themselves, and I love the fact that you are this open, but you're also advocating for people in this space as well, because you're also that representative in the union space too, correct?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I am internationally. I am the representative for the Caribbean sub-region, which includes Bermuda, for Public Service International, so I do a lot of work there In Bermuda. I am the rapid response officer for bullying and harassment, but I'm also the LGBT rep and so, listen, I wish everybody could come up. But I also know that when we were getting married, I couldn't find a place to stay, and it could not be because I couldn't afford it, and it couldn't be because I'm not a fantastic person. So it could only be because you didn't want to rent to a gay person. Fine, that's your choice, it's your property.
Speaker 2:But here's the thing If everybody genuinely looked at how they have faced some sort of discrimination and took ownership of it, they would not be the people they are to other people, right. But people look at their adversities. If something happens to them, oh, this just happened to me, and once it's over, it's over, but it's happening to everybody, right. And so I'm not asking you to run down the street like the poster child for being gay, but I want you, as a gay person, as a white gay person, to realize that there is racism in the gay community, right, I want you to take ownership of that. So in the gay community, I'm over here fighting racism. In the black community, I'm over here fighting homophobia. I see community, I'm over here fighting racism in the black community I'm over here fighting homophobia, marcy.
Speaker 2:Well, I can do both, because I understand that there's a lack of equality and equity in this country, right, but each of those sections have to take ownership. You can't be black and say, oh, you know, it's racist out here and the world's set up against us and your foot's on the neck of gay people, right. And you can't be gay as a white gay person or a person of non-color, and be over here saying it's just wrong how they treat us gays, right, and your neck, your foot, is on the neck of black people. You cannot do both. You can't do both.
Speaker 1:Right, you cannot do both.
Speaker 2:And so you got to put your hand up and accept what you're doing too. And you know I often, you know sometimes my wife says hey, you know what I've in in all the years that we've been together, you've never been invited to um, be on any panel for for um, women's day, or you never get to speak out here and whatever, because you don't want me to come and speak and be myself. So when you ask me to come to your space, I'm bringing my whole self. Yeah, that's what and people don't want to hear that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, in the gay community, they just want to hear about gay rights. Okay, in the black community, they just want to hear about black. But it don't work like that. No, because people are not just one thing, and that's why intersectionality is important to me yeah because I have to take my whole self everywhere.
Speaker 1:I go everywhere yeah, I know I totally agree to you. I think I was on um listening to a panel, I want to say, two years ago kathy duffy was talking about literally the very same thing and she said certain issues only become issues to people when it is relevant to them. So, for instance, if LGBTQIA rights were not relevant to you but then your child came out as gay or bi or whatever, that then becomes something that you advocate for or becomes relevant to you because it's now within your space, it's something that's now important to you because it immediately affects your immediate family or whatever that looks like. And she was like essentially the same thing that you said. She was saying until we get into a space where discrimination from the, from race, from gender, from you know, sexuality, ages and whatever that is it's something that is relevant to everybody, We'll continue to still be in the same space as that world, but that we're in right now listen it.
Speaker 2:You have to take ownership of what you believe, right? I was having a conversation about somebody and we were talking about um haiti and gaza, and this was on the union front, and um what's happening in haiti what's happening in in gaza and all of these places right and and also in in gh, in Ghana with the new rule that they've passed.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes.
Speaker 2:And people say, oh well, what's this got to do with us?
Speaker 1:Mercy.
Speaker 2:We're in Bermuda. We've got so many things happening. If the rights of workers globally cannot resonate to you as a unionist, that's problematic. There are workers who are being killed for going to work in Gaza, trying to get to work right. There are people that are waking up in Ghana who have advocated for gay rights, who now will be criminalized right. There are people in Haiti who have no stability, workers who are doing the work that we're doing and are not safe right. So when we don't understand global solidarity, then we're not going to advance, and that is why, when the for me, the Progressive Labor Party settled for domestic partnership, right, as a black, predominantly black, grassroots party settled, that tell me everything I needed to know about what they really believe about equity.
Speaker 1:Marcy, it's a conversation. It's a conversation that has to be had, because we cannot say that we want equal rights for every people, but it's only equal when it comes to race right. It's not fair. It's not a fair conversation. You can't say it.
Speaker 2:It doesn't align with everything that you've said about yourself, especially as a labor party. As a labor party, and you can't say, here, take these little tokens, and then be mad when the white community gives you tokens, right, you can't be mad because you set up the perimeter of what's acceptable, right. And then, when we don't want to talk about it, when you say to somebody you should be grateful, then I ask you, as a black person, are you grateful for the nuggets you've gotten? Because if, if we want to talk about it, we can talk about it. Right, I would prefer you to say, yeah, I get it, but this is the choice I've made. Then I can accept that. Well, when you stand on it, yeah, stand on it, right but when you don't stand on it.
Speaker 2:I can't respect you, yeah, and I think this is where we're moving and I'm telling you, this generation that's coming behind us, they are not going to operate that way.
Speaker 1:Gen Zs are not standing for it. Yeah, they're not going to.
Speaker 2:And so, even from a small political point of view, you suddenly should be clicking up here to say, hey, we're going to have to change our narrative, we're going to have to change our mindsets and that is how I, that's how I frame my advocacy right.
Speaker 2:Whenever I go places, or even from a union, from a union perspective, I say to people you don't need to take no notes, I'm here to change your heart. Okay, if I'm not changing your heart, none of those notes are going to make a difference. It's true, and that's what I, that's my advocacy I'm here to change heart Because I don't want people to live in the same environment that I grew up in, that I lived in. But sometimes I feel I'm saying the same things my grandma said, and my grandma would be disappointed that I'm saying those things under a party that she fought for. Wow, and that's a painful reality so what does I guess?
Speaker 1:um, not necessarily success, but what does, I guess I don't even know. I'm trying to say what does it look like for you to be done with this fight like? What does that look like for you to not still be having the same conversations? What does that look like you wake up and still be having the same conversations? What does that look like you wake up and it's like, oh, don't have to do that today, like everybody kind of gets it.
Speaker 2:When people can say my name and not attach any titles to it, when people could just say Linda or Christine instead of you know, linda the gay girl, or Linda, you know representing this or representing that girl, or Linda, you know representing this or representing that, when we can just address each other by our names and just have respect for that, whether it's about our color, whether it's about our gender, whether it's sexuality, then there is no more need for fighting Because it's listen, it's Women's Month, right, yeah, may 3rd. But we as women also try to define what we see and accept. What a woman is, what business is it of you? None, yours, what?
Speaker 1:um, hello, this isn't the impeachment of uh women's rights at the moment is.
Speaker 2:That's a completely different conversation, but it's abysmal yeah, yeah, right, and so and and and so in in those communities when we drilled on if we collectively just used our power as women you take over the world yeah, are we ready we're not ready.
Speaker 1:I think we want to be ready, though I think there's a segment of us that want to be ready, that want to do it. I don't know. I struggle a little bit because I think Black women in particular have fought so long and so hard to be strong, to be this, to be that, to be everything for every person in their family. I think we're at a point now where a lot of Black women are tired. They want to enter into that soft era of life and I think, if we're going to be continue to push some of these things forward, we've got to get back on that. You know what I mean, and I I'm not sure if that can be done. If black women are tired of fighting, well, surely?
Speaker 2:they should stop being tired. But they should stop being tired, but they should stop being tired of each other yeah they stop talking about each other.
Speaker 2:they should stop trying to hold each other down. Oh lord, pull each other off. Oh, oh, I mean, let's start that if we want to talk about how black women treat each other, right, we don't create safe spaces for ourselves and I walk into a space and see another black woman, I should feel safe. Yeah, immediately Right. But if that black woman is going to judge me because of how they see me or why she dressed like that, oh, I don't like gay black, like, am I safe around you as a black woman? Or what? Are you doing the same things to me that you accuse other people of doing to you?
Speaker 2:We cannot have it both ways. Yeah, right, and I think collectively. Now, listen, we don't have to like each other. Where are we all gonna like each other? Never, I may not like you, but I'm gonna hold space for you to be whoever you are. But am I gonna sit down and say come over here, let's break bread, let's break bread? No, but in this space I'm going to hold space for you, because we can't get it done alone. We cannot get it done alone, not at all, and we need when we have. You know when I talk about the issues inside of the workplaces. The vast majority of HR specialists are women. One, yes.
Speaker 1:Yes, I would almost venture out to say 100%. And usually black In Bermuda. Black women, yeah, usually, not all the time, and if you start adding one plus one.
Speaker 2:As Cat Williams said, the math ain't math, it's the truth. So the key, though if we're not going to hold space for each other, if I go in an interview and I'm not confident when I see you across the table, when you treat me the worst, I'm like hello, that's a problem.
Speaker 1:It's a problem and it's something that we have to talk about as well, and, you know, it's something that we have to figure out how to address it. I do think that that generation of women are starting to age out of the workforce. That may not have treated other black women well. However, I still think they're mentoring the ones that are coming up today. Sure.
Speaker 2:Of course they are. Yeah, of course they are. And in their defense, they're mentoring, because we were raised to think, in order to get in those spaces, we have to take on the persona of men in order to be acceptable, in order to be heard, right. And then, when we take them off, they say we're angry, like, or aggressive, or aggressive, right, but this is what you told us we had to be, to get here and stay here. And now that we're doing it, then you know you're labeling something else.
Speaker 2:We, the the goalpost keeps getting moved. Yeah, you're labeling something else. We, the the goalpost keeps getting moved. Yeah. And and I'm saying, if we really want to see change, we're gonna have those tough conversation, take ownership of it and then say how do we then move forward? Yeah, right, because when we say things, oh, yeah, we want, we don't want our little black girls growing up into this environment, well, who's creating this environment and who's going to change it? Yeah, who's lifting down and pulling up instead of lifting down and say I only want to pull you so far because I don't want you to take over my job oh, they think you're coming to take the job.
Speaker 2:Yep, absolutely but you can't have your job forever. You sure can't. I'm not, so who's supposed to take it over? If you don't pull me up, then somebody who doesn't look like me is just going to jump over me every time and go into that job, and you're okay with that because you still have yours, oh, linda.
Speaker 1:Well, we are definitely wrapping on time, but we are. I have so many more things I want to talk to you about, but no, I think it's important for people to understand that you one, you need to advocate for yourself. I think that's the first thing that you kind of said here today was advocating for yourself, and get into a space to be able to do that, but then using that advocacy to learn to advocate for others too. So when you keep like those things in mind and everything else you've, you know, been through, and your family, your dogs, friends, all of that type of stuff, what do you want to be remembered for? Like, what do you want people to say about Linda when she's no longer and obviously a very long time from now, no longer here? And you know, and they are talking about you or mentioning your name in a room.
Speaker 2:What do you want to be said about you?
Speaker 2:remembered for, excuse me, I want people to remember that I work my, my, my dash, your dash born, died that dash in the middle. Okay, okay, got you right, I worked that dash. I didn't just, I wasn't just existing like, I worked that dash that time in the middle, from the time I was born to the time I died. Right, I worked at that. I was seen, I was heard, even if we didn't want to hear. Right, yeah, she worked that dash. I'm glad she said she was here.
Speaker 1:I love that. Thank you so much for spending some time with me today. I appreciate you, yeah, I appreciate you bringing your authentic, authentic self to this space. You know, when I reached out, I wanted you to do that, but I wanted you to be comfortable to do that, and I appreciate you talking about things that might not necessarily have been something that everyone will be comfortable with, and I'm very grateful for you for being vulnerable here today well, I'm grateful for the invitation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know I, I always enjoy spaces I could just go in and be myself, because sometimes people put it out there, but then there's all these caveats, yeah, and so I I always take advantage of those spaces to just bring my whole self.
Speaker 1:I love that. Perfect. Well, I'm glad we were able to foster that for you today. All right, thanks again. All right guys. All right, thanks again, all right guys. Uh, we just wrapped an amazing episode with the amazing disruptor, miss linda vogelmeiser, who dropped some amazing gems on us today. So make sure you guys head over to the website hustleheartpodcastcom. Sign up to be a vip listener so you can catch the blog on this episode, as well as some behind the scenes that we had here today, as always. Please subscribe to the youtube channel, um, so you can stay abreast of all the things that we have here today, as always. Please subscribe to the YouTube channel, um, so you can stay abreast of all the things that we have coming up and when we have new episodes dropping. Thank you for joining me today on hustle her pocket.
