Hustle Her
Hustle Her
Huste Her - Laurie
Laurie Shiell from the Center Against Abuse joins me on the Hustle Her Podcast to share her heartfelt journey and insights into combating domestic violence. From her passion for Somerset cricket and morning rituals to her adventures in Korean skincare, Lori offers a personal glimpse into her life. We uncover the vital services the Center Against Abuse provides, such as counseling and legal advocacy, while discussing the pressing challenges of finding safe housing in Bermuda and the critical role of community awareness and support in addressing domestic abuse.
Understand the complexities behind why victims remain in abusive relationships by exploring psychological and societal factors. Our discussion dives into the addictive nature of brain chemistry and how societal norms pressure both women and men to remain in toxic environments. We also touch on the unique difficulties faced by men, highlighting financial dependency and emotional manipulation as significant barriers to leaving. This conversation aims to foster a deeper understanding that can translate into more effective support for those trapped in the cycle of violence.
Recognizing early signs of abuse is crucial, and Laurie and I walk through subtle indicators that can easily be overlooked. By examining behaviors like excessive control disguised as care, we stress the importance of trusting one's intuition and seeking help. We talk about the profound effects of abuse on children and the vital role of child services and school counselors. Friends and family play an essential role in supporting victims, and our discussion offers actionable guidance on how unwavering support can break the cycle of violence and create a path toward healing.
I'm a hustler baby. It's time for Hustle Her podcast. I'm your host, deshae Caines. Hustle Her is all about inspiring women through real life experiences that have helped to mold and develop not only me, of motivation, a bit of tough love and some actionable takeaways to be the best. You, girl, you are in the right place. Hey guys, and welcome back to Hustle Heart Podcast. As always, thank you for spending some time with me today. Big shout out to our season sponsors, 59 Front and Brown Company. This episode's sponsor is Scooter Mart, as well as the Women's Resource Center. My guest today is someone that I reached out to after seeing some pretty interesting numbers online about domestic violence. So I reached out to the Center Against Abuse and the lovely Lori Shield agreed to be on the podcast today.
Speaker 2:Welcome, lori. Thank you so much for having me. Deshay, it's a pleasure to be on the podcast today. Welcome, laurie. Thank you so much for having me to share. It's a pleasure to be here yes, thank you so much.
Speaker 1:So before we jump right in, I always jump in with some rapid fire questions just so people can kind of get to know you, um, and then we'll go into the meat of the conversation. Okay, I'm out for it. All right, let's go. I know it just passed, but who is your cut match team?
Speaker 2:Somerset, of course. Oh, Lori Sis, I'm a winner.
Speaker 1:This is what I love to hear. I love it, I love it, I love it. All right, what's your favorite time of the day?
Speaker 2:Morning, oh, so you're a morning person, I am a morning person. Okay, I get more done in the morning.
Speaker 1:By the afternoon I'm right, got you okay, um, all right. What would you say is your biggest strength?
Speaker 2:listening um perhaps providing feedback as well all right, I love that.
Speaker 1:Okay, and what's your favorite color?
Speaker 2:it depends on the year. Each year I have a different favorite color.
Speaker 1:So what is it for 2024?
Speaker 2:2024. It is like a kelly green.
Speaker 1:So what was it 2023?
Speaker 2:Yellow.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay, I love that you switch it up. I've never heard that before.
Speaker 2:It's never the same color. I don't have one favorite color. Next year maybe it will be a different color. It's just like something catches my eye. I'm like, oh, I love that.
Speaker 1:I love that Okay.
Speaker 2:What's your favorite thing to do with your husband? Like the best date date night. What's the best thing you like to do? The best thing I love to do with my husband is to travel. We both love to travel, um, and so planning the travel for us is even exciting, nice. So this year we are planning for next year and so we're hoping to do ethiopia, we're hoping to do a European cruise, and those are the things we have planned.
Speaker 2:We usually do three big trips a year, so one more is. We're going to figure it out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there we go. I love it. Love a little travel time. Got to get off the island, definitely we do minimum two weeks every time.
Speaker 2:Love it.
Speaker 1:Okay, and you have amazing skin, so tell me about your skincare routine.
Speaker 2:I just started using a Korean skincare, so I've been using it for the past three to four months. It's fermented ginseng I can't pronounce the name Hi, hi, da, ba, ba, da, something like that. My sister lives in California, in Koreat korea town, and so was there and she's right down the street from a korean mall and was in there and happened upon this product and I really love it love it.
Speaker 1:Okay, well, that's really good to know, okay. So when I reached out to you, um, I I had seen an article online that the police commissioner had posted about the numbers of domestic violence rising during the last hurricane that we had I can't remember the name of the hurricane, yeah, but it was the last one that we had last month and how the domestic violence numbers increased in Bermuda. And it actually came from a friend of mine who sent me the article and was like I had no idea that the domestic violence numbers in Bermuda were the way that they were. And so I reached out to you and you were like, yeah, it's, it's pretty staggering, you know. And I asked you know, would you like to come on and talk about it? And so we definitely want to definitely get into that. But what I want to do first is for you to tell me a bit of an overview about the Center Against Abuse and its mission for Bermuda.
Speaker 2:So Center Against Abuse. We are in our 45th year.
Speaker 2:We started back in 1979 under the name the Physical Abuse Center, and we currently provide services which include counseling. We do legal advocacy, which includes assisting people with protection orders, summary offense letters, going to court with them if they have a criminal matter to support them. We work very closely with the police department of child and family services, as well as aging and disability um that them and us make up a group called the multi-agency risk assessment committee. We meet every other week to discuss high-risk domestic abuse cases in Bermuda. We also provide what we call community awareness and advocacy and training in the community on domestic abuse. We try to hit the three R's. We call it recognize and responding and referring, and so that's the basis of all of our training that we do in the community and whether it's a church, whether it's a lunch and learn at a business, whether it's at a school with teachers, when it comes to children, we try to refer that to Coalition for Protection of children Um.
Speaker 2:We assist people with safe housing and resettlement um. That is becoming more difficult, I have to say, because of the prices in Bermuda and costs um, but we're working through it. We work with him on that Um and so we try to assist individuals who um find themselves in abusive situations, so anyone over the age of 18, male or female, and below the age of 65, we assist, and we provide assistance to survivors of domestic abuse. Well, let me put it this way we provide assistance to survivors of intimate partner abuse. Okay, okay, so we intimate partner abuse. Okay, okay, so we're very specific not just the entire brand of domestic abuse, but intimate partner abuse. And then we also assist those who have been sexually assaulted.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right. So I guess, before we go on, just a little bit. How did you get involved in the center against abuse and become the ed?
Speaker 2:I tell people god placed me here. Wow, I um. It goes back to childhood. So I grew up with my grandmother in my ear about abuse, believe it or not, because she was a child that was a victim of domestic abuse where her parents were in an abusive relationship. Her father was abusive to her mother and she would tell me and my sister this story about how she was raised in an abusive home and how she um, didn't want us to repeat the cycle and she would say it runs in your blood. Wow, and now we're learning how trauma now comes through the bloodline. This is a lady that had a primary school um degree, okay, and but she understood back then that abuse, trauma, is handed down through the blood. And so she would say I'm telling you this not to shame my dad, but so you won't repeat the cycle. Wow, and so that was her job not to repeat the cycle in her family, to cut it off.
Speaker 1:Yeah, wow, that's crazy. So then you transitioned.
Speaker 2:So then I transitioned into this by chance, to be honest with you A friend of mine, deanna Durham. She was on the board at the Fiscal Abuse Center and she was like, oh, we need somebody. I'm moving on, loree, and I would like for you to replace me. And she reminds me she said I chased you for about a year and so I eventually came on.
Speaker 2:At that time I was in HR and they needed someone with HR experience and so came on board, was on board for about a year and then my HR job was being made redundant. The executive director at the physical abuse center at the time she was going on a sabbatical for her full-time job. Because she was part-time, they asked me to come on for a year. Here I am, 15 years later wow, that's what they say.
Speaker 1:You look back in 15 years have flown by. I was supposed to be here for one year one year and look at you 14 years later, still here yes, and making an amazing um impact on our community so when in when we think of domestic violence or intimate partner abuse in the sense of what we're here to cover today, how does it present itself in the bermudian context like what do we, what are we seeing the most here?
Speaker 2:we see everything from physical abuse to verbal abuse, the emotional abuse of it all. Socially, people being abused, religious abuse. We see as well find a lot of financial abuse, and that shows up in a lot of different ways. Well, and some people see it when they remove themselves from the person, so withholding child support, using the courts as a means to financially deplete you through your, you know, having to pay for a lawyer, and things like that. And then the newest one, technological abuse. We see a lot of tech abuse now, where people are now using your phone to send you harassing emails, sending you harassing voice notes, um, threatening, threatening you as well as demanding your passwords, throwing your phones up against the wall, breaking you know, computers, phones, all of that you know and even then themselves putting information that's untrue about you on social media.
Speaker 1:And we're seeing a lot of that in the tech space.
Speaker 2:Yes, Wow.
Speaker 1:And then, with you know, things like WhatsApp and Facebook and Instagram, yes, and then you also have, like you know, certain social media is like Snapchat, where you can see it and then it's gone.
Speaker 2:And then it disappears. And so a lot of my clients now, as soon as something comes through screenshot, they screenshot it immediately before it disappears.
Speaker 1:So one of the things that stood out the most to me were the statistics and the prevalence of domestic violence in Bermuda. Right, and some of the statistics show a significant number of women and men in Bermuda experiencing abuse, right, can you share some of those alarming statistics that most people don't know about here? So?
Speaker 2:one of the most alarming statistics is that the major call outs for police is domestic abuse, so the most call outs they have is for domestic abuse. Prior to gang violence, the murder rate was due to domestic abuse, wow, you know, and it continues today. It didn't stop because of gang violence, but it just is now overshadowed by that. The Bermuda Police Service started because of a domestic abuse murder, you know. So domestic abuse didn't just start here recently. It's been around and we are still tackling it. Unfortunately, we saw our numbers go up to 170 during the pandemic. Prior to that we were around 120, 130 a year.
Speaker 1:And this is when you say 120, 130, you're saying clients, clients, okay.
Speaker 2:Clients coming into our office, right, and that's not services, because services go into, you know, 700s and all of that right. So clients coming into our offices annually, so, and today we are at 123 clients today, today, and for those are men, and so we are now seeing another increase. What we have seen an increase in since the pandemic is, year on we have seen an increase in our numbers for counseling. So last year I hired an extra counselor, so our counselors are on call. And last year I hired an extra counselor and this year we surpassed our numbers from last year by May. Wow, this year. So our counseling piece has grown tremendously and we find that people are now calling and asking for counseling which is something specific yes, which was something that wasn't happening before we were.
Speaker 2:You know, especially in the black community we find that people kind of shy away from counseling. But we are finding more and more people of color calling and saying I need some counseling, I need some help and what do you think that is?
Speaker 1:What do you think the narrative has changed a bit when it comes to counseling, especially in the black community?
Speaker 2:I would say people that have completed counseling are now telling their friends look what it did for me. I encourage you to do it. You've been in this too long. You can't get yourself out. You need some help. So that has definitely assisted.
Speaker 1:So when you've been in this too long, you can't get yourself out, you need some help, yeah, so that has definitely assisted so when I was going through the website, I read and I want to read this specifically that over 7 000 women have experienced domestic abuse in their lifetime, which is about 27 of our population, female population here in bermuda. What are some of the, I guess, factors that contribute to the prevalence of this abuse in women specifically?
Speaker 2:yeah, and I would say specifically, even in bermuda, we have such a tiny island and a lot of it that contributes to women staying is that they don't want everybody know their business. Okay, speaking specifically about women, right, they don't want everybody to know their business. Okay, speaking specifically about women, right, they don't want others to know their business. They don't want it to appear as if they failed. I failed in my marriage, I failed in my relationship. I failed, as they feel as a failure as a parent, especially when they're children.
Speaker 2:Another contributing factor is this is how I was raised, and it's normal.
Speaker 1:Wow, that generational thing we spoke about, the generational cycle. Right.
Speaker 2:And then there is I love my partner.
Speaker 1:Despite the abuse.
Speaker 2:Despite the abuse, because they're not bad all the time. I want you to understand because they're not bad all the time. I want you to understand that they're not bad all the time. They have bad, bad moments, yeah, and so I put those bad moments behind me and I look at the good and when you are in an abusive relationship. Um, studies show that there is a chemical reaction to the abuse, because there's a chemical reaction to the makeup and so you crave the makeup, right? And so the brain quickly forgets the abuse and craves the makeup.
Speaker 1:Wow, Because once you get past the abuse, the makeup is so nice. That oxytocin that pulls you in that dopamine.
Speaker 2:All of that is raging in your body, and so that is what's at the forefront for you even even when you're being abused, regardless of the type of abuse that it is you're mentally, you're just focused on when it gets better again exactly when it gets better again and you know the conversations that we have with our clients is you know, you are actually addicted to this person. Wow, it's an addiction.
Speaker 1:It is an addiction wow, it's crazy how our brain works right, how we process things and, like you would think and that's one of the things I want to talk to you about and we'll get to it in a little while is you think, when someone is being abused, your natural reaction is to leave? Yes, but because it doesn't happen all the time, like what you're speaking about, your brain is making you think oh, this is not that bad.
Speaker 2:You stay in the situation in the situation and because a lot of times when you're in that situation with that person, you're seeking to help them, not yourself. They need the help and women traditionally and women traditionally are fixers like that.
Speaker 2:Right, we want to help that person and the conversation that I have with clients is is that if you're not a professional, you can't assist this person. You can give them a place to go. They have to help themselves. You can only help yourself. You cannot help someone else other than giving them the information so that they can go when they are ready.
Speaker 1:So you mentioned earlier that you've had some men come in with domestic violence. I think it was four for this year. What are you, what would you say, are some of the differences in the trends you've observed between men and women facing domestic violence?
Speaker 2:believe it or not, men stay in it longer because a male ego will not admit to being a victim will never admit to being a victim, because they can handle that person, whether that partner is male or female. They can handle that person because it's the male ego that's speaking to them Right, and so they tend to stay in it longer Wow.
Speaker 1:So when we think men in domestic violence like most people, I guess when it comes to domestic violence and intimate partner abuse, we tend to automatically assume physical right. Violence and intimate partner abuse, we tend to automatically assume physical right. Are we seeing physical when it comes to men, or is it more emotional, verbal or, in certain situations, is it all of the above?
Speaker 2:it's all of the above right. Um, they experience the exact same thing. A female will go through, but, like I said, they tend to stay in it longer, in particular, especially if it's in a same sex relationship.
Speaker 2:It's hidden, more got you it is, it does appear to us that it's hidden more um, and while the person may be publicly homosexual, same sex, um, that part is still kind of a taboo for a homosexual relationship to have that right. And so we find that people feel that they may be judged, and so that's another reason why they hide it. They don't know how they're going to be perceived or received. It's like, oh well, what do you expect, especially if they go to a church or your senate?
Speaker 2:It's sinning so that's a part of the sin, and so that's a part of the sin. And if they were raised in church, they may feel that guilt of it as well. So it's a lot of factors with the same sex. But Center Against Abuse is here for you. We're a judgment-free zone. Like I said, we assist anyone who is a victim of intimate partner abuse.
Speaker 1:So we touched on it briefly around why it's difficult for victims to leave their abusers, and you said it's definitely a chemical reaction. Are there other things that we can essentially kind of educate people on, on the reasons why people don't leave? Because, I said it earlier, like the minute I hear that someone or anyone hears someone's being abused, like well, why would they stay in that? So, outside of what we kind of spoke about already, what are some of the additional factors and why people stay in these abusive relationships?
Speaker 2:they stay for the children they stay because they think it's going to get better, because, remember, I fell in love with this individual, and so that's the person I'm staying for. I'm not staying for the abuser, I'm staying for the person. I fell in love with this individual, and so that's the person I'm staying for. I'm not staying for the abuser, I'm staying for the person I fell in love with. Um finances, I can't make it on my own out here. You know how expensive it is.
Speaker 2:It's very expensive yeah and not only is it expensive. To make it on your own to to move is expensive, right, yeah, and so those costs are astronomical. Yeah, I also stay because I am being told constantly that nobody else is going to want me. I'm being constantly belittled, and so leaving is not even in my mind because I'm dealing with the here and now. I'm just fighting fires constantly. I'm trying to keep the peace constantly, and so leaving? I can't think about that, because I'm just trying to keep peace in my house. Every day is trying to stay alive.
Speaker 1:Every day is trying to stay alive. Every day is trying to stay alive. And if there's children factored into that, taking care of the kids I'm taking care of the kids.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to keep the peace.
Speaker 1:I'm just trying to keep the eggshells on the perimeter until because you're preparing for the next time that I'm preparing for the next time, because I know it's going to happen, but I'm just trying to keep those eggshells on the perimeter yeah, so when we were talking initially, we were speaking about um sexual abuse, intimate partner abuse, and a lot of times people think if you're in a relationship, um, it technically isn't abuse, but we still were speaking about no means no, even in a relationship even in a relationship. No means no yeah how often are we seeing those types of things happening when with intimate partner abuse?
Speaker 2:in majority of intimate partner abuse there is sexual abuse. Wow, because your partner has a lack of respect for you, has a lack of um respect for your views and even your voice, in particular your voice and so you're no means nothing, because to them they own you, you are theirs and so you're no means nothing. In Bermuda we even have on our books, we have spousal sexual abuse as an act of a crime. You know that people can actually take their spouse for sexually assaulting them to the courts.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I mean it's in the, I guess in the definition of it. You understand that that is the case and that is abuse. And if I say no, it means no, but you don't in, I'm assuming in the moment, or when you think about it that way. It's like how can your partner, someone that you've already been intimate with in that way, abuse you like that? So I guess I don't know it. Just I understand it Right. Right, it makes complete sense when you explain it. But then when you think about it on a deeper level and I guess that's where the mental part of it comes into is like I've already been intimate with this person, but then they're violating me in that way. That's got to be a.
Speaker 2:And you don't initially see it as that. Right, it's just like let's go this again.
Speaker 2:You know, not listening to me and forcing themselves upon me and you see it as that and okay, let me just do this and get it over with. But then, once they're sitting in my office and I have this conversation and say, you know, has there ever been any sexual abuse? And initially it's like, well, no. And then I continue with the conversation. Have you ever performed sexual acts that you didn't want to, that you said no to, that you were forced to do? Well, yes, you know, that's just a part of marriage. Do you know, if I explain this to you, what sexual assault is? It's lack of consent. If you did not consent, that sexual assault. And it's like if the same thing happened with a stranger, what would you call it? Abuse, assault, sexual assault.
Speaker 1:and that's the aha moment because I'm telling you you don't think about that, you don't because this is the person I love? Yeah, and if you have children with them, you've clearly already been intimate with them and I've been intimate with them wow so do you think that there's adequate legal protection in bermuda for domestic violence victims?
Speaker 2:no, what could we do better? We could definitely tighten up all our laws, you know, in particular around domestic abuse, because we don't have an overarching domestic abuse act. We only have a domestic abuse protection orders act that only speaks to protection orders.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And so if we had a overarching act which spoke to domestic abuse in Bermuda whether it's with intimate partners, whether it's someone else in your household, whether it's with a senior we would have an understanding of what it looks like, what it is, what's not going to be tolerated right, and so we need to hold abusers more accountable in Bermuda. What I find is, with the Protection Orders Act, if someone breaches I've seen people breach 10 times and they're bailed, and they're bailed, and they're bailed, and they're bailed and they're bailed what do you think that that does to the victim?
Speaker 1:Yeah, what's the point of?
Speaker 2:me reporting it. I'm reporting it, I'm reporting it. I'm doing what I'm supposed to do Exactly. And the person gets arrested, the person goes before the courts, the person gets bailed and it may seem like, oh well, they're just stalking you, oh, they just called you. But do you know what that's doing to me internally, to my mental health, and especially if I'm the primary parent, how am I now parenting in fear? How is that being now translated to my children? Yeah, and so these are the things that need to be looked at when someone continually gets bailed, because it's also reinforcing with the perpetrator what it is no big deal, no big deal, no big deal.
Speaker 1:I'll just go to court, get bailed out. I'm gonna get bailed and it'll be fine.
Speaker 2:It'll be fine and I'll be off to do whatever I wish to do again so if someone does violate that protection order um act well, I guess order right um and they get bailed.
Speaker 1:What happens? Do we have a rate of people going to prison or jail for abuse?
Speaker 2:Very low. Even if they are, there is a criminal area that they go through rather than the civil, which is the protection orders.
Speaker 2:It sometimes takes a year, two years three years for the matter to actually finally be heard in the court, years for the matter to actually finally be heard in the court. And some people feel as if the matter is taken so long so that you could, you would just go away. They feel like their matters aren't important to the courts and you know it's because it's personal. This is personal to me and so I'm feeling offended by the courts because I keep getting put on the back burner. Oh well, we have a murder trial and and your lawyer has to be in that, so that's more important than your matter. So these are things that victims are constantly hearing when it comes to criminal matters for domestic abuse, and it has has an impact that I don't matter to even the courts. They don't see this as important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so what does the Center Against Abuse do in those instances in terms of support for people who are going? They've done what they're supposed to do and it's not coming up in the system? You know, in a way, that we would like to see, in terms of expediency, how do you support them in the system?
Speaker 2:you know, in a way, that we would like to see in terms of expediency. How do you support them? So once we hear something, I may call the police. I may even work with the DPP and say listen, this person was released. Or we try to head it off prior to, especially if it's a high risk individual. It means that we're going to call the police and say have a call, have a talk with the DPP and say have a call, have a talk with the DPP and say objections to bail. Objections to bail because of A, b, c and D and those are criminal matters right.
Speaker 2:And so we have been good in that area. Where objections to bail have been upheld by the courts, or if they haven't, we've kind of put something in place. Okay, we're going to ask the police to do drive-bys by your house, and we discussed with them a serious safety plan put in place. They may not even be staying, they may be staying somewhere else. That is safe. But we have to work as a team with the police and even Department of Child and Family Services, if there are children involved, to ensure that everybody is kept safe.
Speaker 1:So you mentioned earlier that most of your clients, or your clients that you have remit over, are between the ages of 18 and 65. That's correct, but pre-show. We were speaking about how, a lot of times in these intimate partner abuse situations, the children are witnessing, yes to this, what happens in those situations?
Speaker 2:in those situations, especially if I'm hearing your full story. Um, I will ask you is department of child and family services involved in your life? Do you have a case worker? Because we want to get the children some assistance. If it isn't, I might say to you have a conversation with even if you are involved with Child and Family Services, I will say have a conversation with your school counselor.
Speaker 2:There's someone that are going to see your children on a regular. Get them to understand what your children have seen, what they have witnessed, so that they can bring them in. And they have that someone that they see five days a week, from 9 to 3, 3.30, that can assist your child through transitions. Even speak with the teacher, right, because if your child's acting up in class, the teacher needs to understand. My child's not acting up because my child's being rude, my child's tired because we were up late last night because I had a domestic. My child woke to me crying or woke to me screaming, right, and so once a teacher understands that they're going to understand. Oh, I see you acting up. I'm going to need to hug you or let me just have you spend some time with the school counselor today, because those are the children we need to love rather than discipline.
Speaker 1:Absolutely so. You mentioned, when we were talking pre-show as well around some of the new findings that you've been made aware of about children who are experiencing domestic abuse as opposed to actually being witnessing it, as opposed to being abused. Tell me a bit more about that.
Speaker 2:So studies show that children who experience domestic abuse have rate mental health issues higher than children who are being abused directly themselves. That's a wow, and so if we don't get a grip on that, it then continues the cycle, right. And so that's why it's important that your child, if they are in an abusive situation, that they receive some type of assistance, that they understand what love is, because right now, love is looking a lot crazy to me, and I'm feeling it crazy because here are my parents in front of me having issues. Who do I go with? How do I protect this person? I don't want to see my other parent go to jail. I don't want to see the police it to jail. I don't want to see the police. It's a lot on a child's mind, right, and they're going to school with it.
Speaker 1:They don't know how to process it yeah, and then when we talk about cycles, um and generational, you know cycles, these things, even if they're witnessing it. But they can potentially be in environments where they are either being abused or being the abuser as they get become adults oh, yes, most definitely.
Speaker 2:Um, you heard me speak earlier how my grandmother was in a household where her parents were abusive. Now she made a conscious decision that no more for her and her family. She had a brother. She had two brothers and one. Both of them were alcoholics. One was an alcoholic and an abuser, just like their father, and him and his girlfriend fought like cats and dogs. This is how my granny tells the story, and he must have went at the girlfriend one day and she said I've had enough. She stabbed him 119 times. She was the last female to be hung in Bermuda.
Speaker 2:This is what happened when the cycle is not broken, and this is why it's so important that people are going to counseling right this is why it's so important that people get counseling, and what studies have also shown is when those children are being loved upon by family members, those that they trust, this can also change their brain.
Speaker 1:Waves can change the chemical makeup in their brain to remove the abuse and the turmoil that they're feeling in their lives and give them some hope for a healthy future so what can people do who are witnessing or know of abuse that's going on in relationships with children and the person who is being abused has left, but they've gone back? How can they support that family or that person in their journey through domestic abuse, especially intimate partner abuse, which is what we're specifically talking about? How can they be supportive of them as opposed to well, they won't leave. So I'm done helping.
Speaker 2:How can we be more supportive? And's hard, let me be honest. It's very hard to support a victim who continually goes back right um, but we have to yeah we have to.
Speaker 2:We have to be in there for the long run, because isolation is the perpetrator's biggest tool, isolating you from friends and family. That's when I have total power, right. And so friends and family need to stay in the life. Friends and family need to stay in that person's ear and have those conversations with the importance of raising the children in healthy spaces, being in a healthy space yourself so that you can be healthy for your children, being in a healthy space yourself so that you can be healthy for your children, because a lot of times when you're not in a healthy space, somebody else is watching and will take advantage of your children. And so getting that point across, that making yourself, making your children number one in your life, encouraging them to seek help, going with them to seek help if you need to, um, just intervention, intervention, intervention. You know it soon becomes reality for them. It soon becomes reality every time you intervene there's a seed being planted in that person, and so don't stop.
Speaker 2:As hard as it is, as irritated as you may get, don't't take it personal that they they, you're not offended, that they didn't listen to you. They have listened. It's just really hard right now. And ask them how can I help? Yeah, how can I help you, because it may be something as simple as listen. I need a place to stay. I had to go back because the place I was at was only temporary.
Speaker 2:I didn't have a permanent place to stay. You know, maybe it means a couple of family members getting together, paying $100 each a month to assist with rent for a time until that person gets on their feet, you know. So there's a lot of things. But ask the person how can I help? Also, we also focus a lot on the victim. We also need to focus on the perpetrator. If that perpetrator is your friend, you need to be having conversations with them in the same way. That's not on Understand. I see what you're doing and I'm not going to stand for it. I'm going to assist the victim with getting some help, with calling the police police, with supporting them, with supporting your children. No, I'm sorry you can't be a part of this group anymore because we don't accept that type of behavior. You need some help me. You need some help, yeah ace girl.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's a good call out because, in a community as small as bermuda as well, more than likely not all the time, but more than likely if you know the victim, you know the abuser, you know the abuser, the abuse is not walking around here friendless.
Speaker 2:You know it's the truth, it's the truth. So you know people need to step up to the abuser whether it's siblings, friends, parents, cousins, whomever and have a serious talk. Listen, if you don't toe the line how you're supposed to, some things are going to happen to you. You can end up in case mates, I'm sorry, I'm dating myself west gate, yes, at the other gate, and and or you know, we find this behavior unacceptable. Yeah, you can't be on this like this especially because there's no consequences for your actions.
Speaker 1:Exactly right, I mean, it's one thing if the legal system, but then if life goes on as normal, if your friends are still your friends, if your family is still treating me the exact same, what? What is the need to change?
Speaker 2:what is the need to change? No, you need to get some help. We need to assist you and putting you in a program, because this is clearly something that you you don't have a handle on and that you're not interested, but we need to assist you with getting interested you're absolutely, honestly, it's.
Speaker 1:I'm so grateful that you said that, because even when I was doing the research for this and I was looking up the different things, uh, about abuse, very rarely do we talk about the help that the abuser needs in order to stop, you know, doing the things that they're doing to the victims. We want the victims to get counseling, want them to get all the support that they need, but if they're trying to get a hold and healed and their abuser isn't, what is the point?
Speaker 2:Right, because I've left the person and guess what? They're still abusing me, they're still harassing me, they're still stalking me. The behaviors are still there. And that's the sad part is that sometimes, when you leave, the behaviors do not stop you just have to set up these tighter boundaries and tighter boundaries. So there's a hole there. Let me set that up.
Speaker 2:And you know, sometimes it means I need to change my number, I need to change my routines and in bermuda it's got to be so difficult because you could run into them and at any point run into them at any point right and so you may, I run into you and I tell my clients I don't care how scary you are, show no fear, because you actually have the upper hand, and you have to remember that yeah, wow, so okay, I'm just, I'm so blown away because you don't think of all of these things right, and in a community such as small as bermuda.
Speaker 1:Once again, I had no idea the numbers were that they the way that they were, and then, knowing the all these additional details, it's like really eye-opening that this is what a lot of people 7,000 women in Bermuda are dealing with. So when we think of abuse like abuse doesn't always just start out as abusive, right, like someone doesn't just come right out and they are immediately physically abusive to you like what are some of the things for someone who's never been in an abusive relationship before, um, that they should be looking out for when in a relationship with an abuser that they don't know is an abuser just yet?
Speaker 2:so it usually starts with controlling behaviors that appear to be really nice. Um, and so it's those telephone calls all the time. Oh, how's your day going um?
Speaker 2:what you do today, simple right but me checking in with you, asking you to call when you get work or when you get home. But when you don't do those things and it's now an argument and the person is angry with you, that's control, that's abuse, that's how, how you know it's not genuine and after a while that person stops calling because they now have you in a cycle of calling and making contact all the time something as simple as a phone call, something as simple as a phone call starts you on a journey where you are now on eggshells.
Speaker 2:If you've missed a phone call, because you know what that means, oh, I've just started. I've just started arguing. You see how it starts? Not, they're starting the argument. You now are blaming yourself for starting the argument because you didn't answer that phone. You could be at work. You didn't anything, anything.
Speaker 2:The person's trying to monopolize your time. They know you're out with your friends, your work colleagues. They're calling you. They're blowing up your phone texting you. That's a sign that that person is trying to even control your time and you're not with them so that they are always on your mind. And even if you say, listen, you know, as I said, I'm out with my friends, I'll talk to you later. Oh, so your friends are more important than me. The guilt trips, yeah, and so those little things that seem like nothing are actually warning signs that this person is controlling, because they're not outright abusive immediately. It might be that you've had male friends or female friends for some time and oh, I don't like those people, I don't like that person, and they try to now isolate you from your friends yeah yeah, telling you what to wear.
Speaker 2:I remember one lady saying that she went out on a date with some guy and he came to her job with an outfit for her to wear this. This man did not know me, she said, and bought an outfit for me to wear on my first date. She said it felt weird. She said, but the ladies at her job were like, oh, he's a good catch. Wow, look what he did for you. No one at her job said no, honey, that's not a good first date. He's trying to even control what you wear.
Speaker 1:That's a sign and that was early on, after she had become a client this was.
Speaker 2:This was a person that wasn't a client. Okay, got it. This was just a friend telling a story and she was saying that that happened and she was like, she felt like it was weird. She ended up not wearing it, um, and luckily it was just a casual date. She's like she went off to school and years later here comes somebody saying, oh, do you know so and so, and she's like, yeah, kind of, and it's like, yeah, you know, they were abusive to her, their wife, and she was like, ah, there you go. That's that feeling that I felt because he was being controlling my first day, on a first date, but it came across as super sweet, super sweet, nice. Oh, he's thinking of me. Yes, he's thinking of me. Yeah, but what I tell clients is, if it doesn't feel right, follow that first feeling, follow your gut, follow your intuition, follow your Holy spirit. Whatever is telling you this ain't right, don't silence it Absolutely.
Speaker 1:So I mean, as we kind of wrap up here, cause I told you the time goes by so quickly, right? Um, what is it that you want for anyone listening today who may be experiencing domestic violence or, like now I know, intimate partner abuse, to know what help should they take, what steps should they take to get help? If it doesn't mean immediately come into the center against abuse, like, what would you want them to know after listening to this conversation?
Speaker 2:I want you to know that there's help available number one, and get help in your fear. Don't wait for some epiphany to come over you, because you're always going to be fearful. Get help in your fear. Let us assist you through that fear onto a space where you know yourself, you understand yourself and you become strong and you understand your strength and it will come. It will come. You will always be fearful. You actually have the upper hand. Let us assist you with showing you how you have the upper hand. Bring your family with you, bring your friends with you for support, and even those that are family members and friends and they're on the periphery and saying I've been doing this for five years, six years, seven years, and it's been stressful on me. You give us a call too so that we can strengthen you, to assist you with strengthening your loved one.
Speaker 1:And then what would you say to people about breaking the silence, because obviously we live in a very small community around people we mentioned earlier, around people being very ashamed to come forward. What would you tell people around that silence and that shame?
Speaker 2:The shame is not yours to wear. The shame is not yours to have. You've done nothing wrong. You're trying to assist that person, to help that person, to even, at times, fix that person. The shame's not yours. You'll be surprised by the outpouring of support that you get once you speak up and you speak out.
Speaker 1:I love that. And laurie, I know this is not a traditional hustle her episode, but one of the things that I always want to know from my guests is something that they want to be remembered for, and after 15 years in this space dealing with, you know, abuse on all levels what is something that when someone mentioned to you in the work that you did in this space? What is something that you want to be remembered for having done this work for so long? Having done this work, for so long.
Speaker 2:I want to be remembered for being gentle, for being kind, for being open, for having a listening ear, for understanding. I want to be remembered as someone that helped another person.
Speaker 1:And then, finally, if anyone listening today is experiencing abuse, know someone that is experiencing abuse, where can they go and how can they make contact to get the help that they need?
Speaker 2:So if you need help right now, 24 hour basis, we do have a hotline. Our hotline number is 297-8278. You can also call our office during Monday through Friday, nine to five, at 292-4366. We're on Instagram. We're're on facebook. We have a website, as you mentioned earlier. Um you can get us through any of those channels. You can send an email to info at center against abuse, dot bm, and center is the english way. C, n, t-e. Um. We are here to assist you. You don't need to give us your name right away. You can. We've had calls from friends. We've had calls from loved ones. We've had calls from workplaces. Um, we're here to assist you in every way in maintaining your physical and mental safety and health thank you, la Lori, so much Thank you.
Speaker 1:I really appreciate you. I feel much more informed than I was before and I'm hoping that everyone who watches House of Heart podcast feels the exact same way.
Speaker 2:Thank you, I hope so too.
Speaker 1:Yes, thank you. All right, thank you, guys for spending some time with me today. We just had an amazing episode with the executive director for the Center Against Abuse, ms Lori Shield, who came and shared some amazing statistics with us and some background around domestic violence here in Bermuda, as well as intimate partner abuse and what that toll has on all of the victims, as well as the abusers and as well as the additional family members in those situations. If you or anyone you know are experiencing domestic violence or need the help that you believe that they require or you require, please reach out to the Center Against Abuse here in Bermuda. Thank you for watching Hustle Heart Podcast.
