Build From Here
Build From Here
When God Says "Go Train Your Dog" | Seth Vaughn
BFH #068 What do retriever training and life's toughest challenges have in common? More than you might think. In this heartfelt conversation with CGA member Seth Vaughn, we explore how training a golden retriever named Rusty became not just about creating a hunting companion, but a journey of personal transformation and healing.
Seth takes us from his Southern Illinois upbringing surrounded by outdoor pursuits to his pivotal moment witnessing a trained retriever at work in Arkansas. That experience changed everything, setting him on a path that would eventually lead to Cornerstone Gundog Academy. Through candid stories of both struggle and triumph, Seth reveals how patience during fetch-hold-release training created the foundation for Rusty's later success, and how discovering his dog's response to verbal praise unlocked new levels of confidence and drive.
The conversation shifts from technical training insights to profound life lessons when Seth shares how dog training became his sanctuary during an exceptionally challenging 2023. Facing critical incidents as a police officer and his wife's serious car crash, Seth found clarity and restoration in those quiet moments working with Rusty. "Go train your dog" became more than advice—it became divine guidance that helped him navigate life's storms.
With hunting stories that showcase Rusty's impressive abilities (including diving completely underwater for a duck and marking a teal at 75 yards), Seth demonstrates how solid training translates to real-world results. But perhaps the most valuable takeaway comes in his parting wisdom: "There's really only one thing that you can control—how much effort you put into it." In retriever training as in life, simply showing up consistently is the foundation of success.
Ready to transform your relationship with your retriever while discovering unexpected lessons about patience, faith, and perseverance? This episode will inspire you to trust the process and train with your heart, not just your hands.
cornerstone gundog academy online resources to help you train your retriever welcome to the build from here podcast.
Speaker 2:On this episode I've got cga member seth bond on welcome aboard. How are you? I'm doing well. Thank you for having me. It's an honor to have you, first of all, just because you're just such a great representation of a cga member. You've been to the member weekends. You and rusty have absolutely crushed it in the training and you know you're just passionate about this and to see how you and your connection with your dog you know your dog loves you, you love your dog I've got that good, solid bond. I think that's uh, there's a lot to be said for that right. You've been patient through the process and I'm sure we're going to get into some challenges that you face. But so, man, we're just honored to have you here and just really excited to share your story.
Speaker 3:All right. Thank you for having me. I appreciate that and pleasure's all mine for sure.
Speaker 2:Awesome. Well, let's go back to the beginning. Obviously, on the Build From here podcast, we're passionate about waterfowl hunting, we're passionate about our retrievers, but I like to go back to the beginning and get your background. Where are you from? Have you always been into hunting? Where did you grow up? Let's just dive into the beginning.
Speaker 3:So I was born and raised in Southern Illinois, so nowhere near Chicago or anything like that we call spitting distance from Kentucky, grew up on a dairy farm, nice, and so agriculture was a big part of my life Obviously dairy cattle and eventually beef cattle, and you just spend all your time outside. That's really what it was. Knowing you're a kid, definitely one of those. You got to pull me out of the woods and send me to school and my grades showed it. I understand. Growing up I really didn't do a whole lot of waterfowl hunting. I really didn't know anything about it. It was mainly deer fishing, frog gigging and small game. Nice, I frog gigged a lot. That was really fun.
Speaker 2:What's your first memory of frog gigging? The?
Speaker 3:first time? Do you remember when they took you out the first time? I remember it was at a friend of mine's house. His dad took three of us out gigging. We all, we were young, probably right around seventh, eighth grade that time. Oh, that's awesome, and so we all did absolutely terrible. But it's one of those where you don't nothing, you don't get any successes, but you have a great time doing it, and so since then it's stuck and I did it Me and my friends did it all through high school.
Speaker 2:Nice, I've actually never been frog gigging. Oh yeah, what does that look like?
Speaker 3:So the way we'd always do it, we always did like small farm haunts. That's the easiest way to do it, and so when a frog is in the water, it generally will face the water itself Interesting. And so the way we gig them is you have somebody on one side of the pond with a flashlight and you look, shine the flashlight along the bank, and you look for the reflection in the frog's eyes and I'll tell you where they're at. Oh, okay. And you have somebody on the other side that you're yelling to and telling them doing hand signals. Doing hand signals, Nice, when they're at. And then that's how you end up getting your success. And so it's a two-man job for sure.
Speaker 2:But it's fun. So you're grabbing them with your hands, or do you have like a like a poker thing? You know you have a gig, okay, like a fish gig, okay, yeah.
Speaker 3:But smaller, so like a little three-prong pole that you uh gig them out with what's been your best night frog gigging?
Speaker 2:how many uh?
Speaker 3:probably about 10 or 12 nice which is a lot okay so just because, like, you have to go to like different ponds and things like that okay just drive around and get permission from other farmers. Wow, so just like any type of other hunting, that's awesome.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've got a couple. The reason I'm so interested in these frogs in my driveway I've got this drain. There's some big old frogs in there. I call them Jeremiah. Every time we hear it I say there's Jeremiah again. One day I was getting the trash can up. I woke up early. I was just stumbling out the door. I was like I've got to get the trash out before the people come pick it up. A frog jumped up and hit me on the leg. I didn't know what it was. I thought it was like a snake or something. It had me all panicked. All right, that's why I'm curious about this. I'm going to have to get some vengeance on these frogs. I'm going to have to get after them. There you go.
Speaker 3:Well cool. So frogging was a big part. So deer hunting, what was? Lot Coon hunting? Yeah, I did coon hunt Dogs.
Speaker 2:You used dogs for it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we used dogs.
Speaker 2:Did you do a lot of that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, my dad was really into coon hunting Okay, and so he kind of just took me along and we did that. We had a couple of dogs we had at our cells.
Speaker 2:Nothing like too spectacular on the training in in with those, but no, they got the job done nice, and so your did your dad? Was he the one that got you into the outdoors originally, or? Oh yeah, okay, yeah, nice, so deer hunting and fishing, uh, and then frog digging, coon hunting, the whole nine yards. So, yeah, sounds like you're all you're ate up with it. Oh yeah, well, where did um, you know? Where did you go from there? So you southern illinois did y'all always live there, or?
Speaker 3:so, um, I didn't. I started duck hunting when I was in high school, about my junior year, and I was really just because I tagged along with some friends. They invited me over um onto some just in public land hunts and I got hooked from there. Okay so, but fast forward to where, um, I graduated. I then joined the service. I was in the navy for five years oh, wow and wow.
Speaker 3:And while I was there, I was state. My first station was out of Key West, florida Okay, fun times out of that being statewide and everything. And then, after that, my deploying unit was out of Gulfport, mississippi, and so, however, when you're just, you know, a little E1 making about $500 every twice a a month.
Speaker 3:You don't have a lot of expendable funds. That's right. Actually get out in the woods and do that stuff, so everything kind of took a step back during that time. Once I got out, though, I moved back home to illinois and used and decided to go to college, and then, while I was in college, man, I, we hunted it up oh, really oh I jumped me and me and I've made a couple new friends out of college and I look for people who duck hunted. I actively sought out other individuals.
Speaker 3:That's smart, we became good friends, and then we hunted up a lot.
Speaker 2:Wow, quite a bit. So you were thinking about duck hunting when you were in the Navy. You just couldn't quite pull it off. Oh, all the time, all the time. So, quite pull it off. Oh, all the time, all the time. So what was the? What was the lure to you on the duck hunt, so obviously doing all this other outdoor stuff? What pulled you in? Was it the first hunt you were on or just the first couple of hunts? Something happened that like clicked for you like.
Speaker 3:This is what I want to do oh, it's really an all-encompassing type thing like, yeah, just because you know I do like to deer hunt, yeah, I still do. Um, but there is a big difference between doing a very silent hunt by yourself into a tree and the camaraderie that comes along with duck hunting. The act like it's a, it's active. Yeah, right, um, I've always wanted to have you know kind of a get out there and get it type personality. I like doing stuff, I like talking to people to an extent and you know whenever no, you got ducks coming in. I know you know more just as good as anybody else. Action starts happening and it flashes up. Then everything dies back down and we can converse and have a good time together. That's cool, and so the camaraderie is really a big part of it. Now, I do love doing my solo hunts every once in a while too and getting back to nature and getting back to God and everything else, yeah, but the camaraderie, I think, is really the biggest part of it.
Speaker 2:That's awesome, yeah. Yeah, I feel the same as you. It's hard to like, you can't let go of any of it. I mean the duck hunting obviously you get into that, especially as a dog guy. You get really into that because you have that connection with the dogs, but still getting out there deer hunting. Or camera guy calling out there has been chasing some turkeys. He almost, he almost, closed the deal. Um, and maybe, maybe tomorrow he'll close the deal. Tomorrow morning it's not too late, so hopefully he can. We've been that close.
Speaker 1:I mean, we're talking about in fact, we need to do an episode with him.
Speaker 2:let him share about that. I mean it was, it was that close, it just didn't seal the deal yet. Oh man, yeah, getting out there and just in general and being outdoors, it's just hard to beat. Something about duck hunting for me. I absolutely love it, obviously with the dogs, that connection being the dog guy. If I didn't have the dog I still love duck hunting I don't know how much I would duck hunt compared to like now. This is something that takes it from a season to you. Do it year round when you have the dog because you're constantly preparing. But even honestly, just training the dog is just fun to get outside, getting outdoors, be out in the field and doing some retrieves and all that. So college you were hammering down on some ducks Dog. When was your first dog experience outside of the coon hunting? What was your first waterfowl retriever experience?
Speaker 3:So all throughout college we never hunted with a dog.
Speaker 2:Okay, so you're just picking them up yourself.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we're just doing that. Like I said, it was all public land, all walking stuff. So having a dog and doing all that and you're walking, you know you're walking a quarter mile with decoys and bags and guns like you're going to wear yourself out. Oh man, and so my first experience with a dog didn't happen until after I graduated college. I moved to Nashville and a couple years after living in Nashville I got a guy, I got a guided hunt out in Arkansas and that guy had a dog and it was really the first time I'd ever seen a dog Like I knew dogs work dogs, yeah, but I but I never experienced it personally. Wow, and then just sitting there watching that I was like cool, I'm getting one of those. That was it.
Speaker 3:I want to do that.
Speaker 1:Yeah this all makes sense now.
Speaker 2:All these years of trudging it out, walking out there picking up my own ducks. I'm like this is smart.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and especially when you start getting into the factors of now. I can sit here and look at him. Look, factors of now. I can sit here and look at him, look at the dog, and he'll see the ducks before I will Wow, it's like. It's like turn the cheat code on Nice. So I was like that's done. Why am I doing this? The whole time I've been a fool.
Speaker 2:Oh man, that's awesome. So when? How long did it dog?
Speaker 3:um so from that was in january of 2019. Um so how it all ended up working out is that we were breeding golden retrievers ourselves okay for pets.
Speaker 2:Okay, so you had retreat dogs at your house already.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and so I'm familiar with dogs and animals. I've trained horses and like coon, hunting dogs and things like that, but nothing to the extent that we're about to talk about. So the day I went on the trip was the same day that the puppies were born. Oh okay, my wife was not happy with me at that time because she had 13 puppies she's looking at and I said he'll have a good time, I'm going hunting. So I leave, I go go. I see this guy work, this duck dog. I come back and I say hey, one of those are mine, she's like okay, you can have them all, just get them out of my head so, so, uh, all the rest of them with the good homes, fortunately.
Speaker 3:And then no, I just ended up keeping one for myself. Wow and so, um it Rusty. It was a different dog. Okay, so not Rusty. No, it wasn't Rusty. I told my wife it's really kind of a divine intervention thing, because that puppy's name was Ranger and the puppy. What ended up happening was so. That's when I started with CGA Plus.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah.
Speaker 3:And so it was back in 2020. And when I got the course, it was the course before you guys even completed it, like you guys had the 16 weeks and that was it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you bought in right. When we first launched it, I was walking by faith for sure.
Speaker 1:And so.
Speaker 3:I started that process and I started the obedience. Everything was going exactly like it should. Of course, it's 2020. And part of how I my trade is I'm a police officer in Middle Tennessee, so 2020 was, you know, the summer of love and all the events that were happening there, so I had to step away from training and all that stuff. But whenever I came back he picked a ride back up. I'm like okay, so at least at that time I knew I was doing something right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that showed that even a little bit the foundation you put stuck.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so we were like it was only like a few weeks I think we were, you know, past place board work, getting into the heel, work this in the place, so like the first month or so of actual training. However, unfortunately for that dog, the reason I say it was divine intervention is I don't think that dog was meant to live. It wound up having a growth issue in its spine, so its back legs pretty much just stopped working.
Speaker 3:That's terrible. However, I'm really glad that I kept the dog and I didn't give that to another family that had to go through that.
Speaker 1:Oh, absolutely.
Speaker 3:So that's the fortunate part of it, and so I ended up, whenever that started happening, I sent the puppy up to my folks' house. I have a bunch of nieces and nephews. I'm like just let it be a dog and play with the kids, yeah, and it ended its life up there and everything, wow, turned out as best as it possibly could.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:So that was. I mean, yeah, you gave, but you know it is what it is. Yeah, but during, even in that short timeframe, I learned quite a bit of what I, what I needed to do, build From.
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Speaker 3:Fast forward a year. I have a son who's born in 2021, in September. I have a son who's born in 2021, in September and in 2022,. I was like you know what, I'm ready to get hurt again. So I originally so I started actively looking for a dog at that time Because I had the program and so, yeah, I had the program already from Ranger. Well, I still looked at it and kept up with it and that kind of helped keep me motivated, right. And I was talking to my wife about it and I'm like, okay, we did the Golden Retriever, like I really want a Lab. She's like, well, I really want a Golden, like all right, so we got a Golden.
Speaker 2:You made it. Hey look, progress over perfection. You, I'll take it.
Speaker 3:No, I'll take whatever win I can get.
Speaker 2:I'd say well, it's turned out pretty well for you. Maybe your wife knew better. This turned out well.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely, and she actually bought me Rusty for my birthday.
Speaker 2:Oh, wow, it was my birthday present. Oh wow, that's a huge birthday. That's amazing yeah.
Speaker 3:So it was yeah, three weeks ago. Three weeks ago, three years ago Wow Picked him up, so um started the process with him, learned a whole lot throughout the way, and here we are. Yeah. We're with him and it's been a ride, man, it's been great.
Speaker 2:I can't believe it, man. That's. That's crazy how that all that's unfolded. Yeah, so, with Kind of picking back up into Rusty's training in the beginning, how was Rusty and Ranger? Were they similar in the beginning? Different personalities?
Speaker 3:A little bit different. So I think it had more to do with the developmental stuff with Ranger. So he listened very well, but he was just a slow acting dog. Now we know why. Right, Rusty, he definitely had a lot more energy with him. But I knew this is like. This is the process, trust it out. But everything went really well, especially in the very beginning. Now, granted, you get some false hope at the very beginning because you're like I'll be sitting there working with him and we're doing the place training. He's healing really well. We're doing great with recalls in the place, Like, oh man, like I could quit my job. People get paid to do this and so, of course, challenges start popping, rearing their little heads out.
Speaker 3:I see why people pay to get this done, oh, yeah, and so I definitely learned a lot that each dog is different, yeah, and so when it comes, definitely the different types of training right, and so I grew up with some really, really old heads when it come to like the coon dogs and things like that. So you know the days of yeah, I know, if you want your dog to not run deer, well you take a deer hide and your dog, stick them inside a barrel and roll them down a hill. You're gonna get some, get some mixed results with that.
Speaker 1:So I don't do anything like that.
Speaker 3:But I really didn't know how to do it right, Like it was definitely a lot of bad information. So that's where I'm really happy I went with the program.
Speaker 2:So you came across Cornerstone because you were already looking to train a dog originally.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, Like I went in, I researched pretty hard before I actually decided, you know the the pull the trigger with it and devote myself, just because there's so much different information out there, yeah, and so I remember I bought a book and I was puppy stage. I'm like, okay, I'm going to get a puppy, I need to get ready. And it was a page and a half long and after I read that I'm like, well, I have more questions than I did before I started this and so this isn't for me, then you?
Speaker 3:go to different videos and everything gets really opinionated and I'm not going to say one person's wrong more than one person other, but I need a full, comprehensive idea of what I really need to do, and the term I use a lot of times when I'm trying to learn a new skill which is really what I'm doing. Right, I'm trying to learn a new skill, which is really what I'm doing. Yeah, right, you're teaching me to teach a dog to that process. Is I need something? Idiot proof, right? So, and that's really what I found whenever I found Cornerstone Wow, and it's processed Cause, like you guys broke it down, absolutely perfect for each thing. And that's what I needed. Yeah, as, as a consumer, as and that's what I needed as a consumer, as a learner, as a student of the process.
Speaker 2:That's cool, yeah, and that was built. You know, we got a lot of feedback from everybody and we had the original iteration and then we just kept improving. We still want to continue to improve, but it's I wish we had the same thing when we first got started, because and you're right it's not that one person's necessarily wrong, but when you're getting all this information coming your way, it may not be right for you, and so we kind of threw all that out and just we went from a clean slate, like let's build the foundation right, let's make sure we start with a solid foundation that works for everybody, and let's just help you understand the why behind everything and the details behind it, so that you can make a good decision in the moment. Because dark training is a decision by decision process and you know sometimes you make the wrong decision and that's okay. As long as you keep making decisions and you keep making progress, you can usually end up in a in a good spot.
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:So it sounds like you, you pull the trigger, you went in, you dove all in. Um so with rusty, what uh in? So with Rusty, what was one of your first early wins with him? Whereas oh man, this is pretty cool.
Speaker 3:So it would be. So that fall you guys had a members weekend, yeah, and then I told my wife I'm like, well, let's just go, you want to go with me? She said, sure, and so we went, got a camper, drove down and hung out for the weekend. The first big win, and I'm going down there I got this young dog. I can't I don't know how to train dogs right, like I haven't trained any at this point, so I have no idea what I'm doing and I'm nervous and shaking. I'm like he's going to do everything I don't want him to do and it's going to be a terrible experience. But I'm going to suck it up, I'm going to go. I know that's the right thing to do.
Speaker 3:So I get down there and it was the second morning and you were leading our group and we were doing a triangle drill. I remember, yeah, and at this point in time I hadn't done any retreats with him outside of a lane oh, wow. And so I was like I was. I was, yeah, there it is. So I was nervous, but I'm like man, we've been, he's been doing really well and you know, we got fetch hold release down pretty well, like enough to where I can get through it and I'm like I ain't gonna worry about it.
Speaker 3:So people start going and, just like all dog trainings do, dogs are a different level. Some dogs are listening, some dogs are not. So I'm like man, he's going to wind up in the next county. I know it, so I forget who it was. Somebody tosses them up, or it's my turn. I send them out to retrieve. He runs out, picks it up, brings it straight back. I'm like gleefully disappointed that he did everything perfect and he did everything spot on for the rest of the day, and so it was just the best results that I could possibly ask. That he did everything perfect and he did everything spot on for the rest of the day Wow, and so like it was just the best results that I could possibly ask for.
Speaker 2:Oh man, yeah, that's awesome. So you were not coming into member weekend expecting that. No, you were thinking, yeah, this is going to be a, you know, a fiasco, but we need to do it to get rip the bandaid off.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, and I just bandit off, oh yeah, and I just really that's what I needed to do. Yeah, and so because I do a lot of um, well, I used to. I don't do it so much anymore, but I used to help train firearms quite a bit, yeah, within my department, and we always have a process to where it's like all right, we go until it doesn't work anymore and then we back it back down and that's really where you're at okay and so like.
Speaker 3:If we're doing like, say, it's a speed drill or something like that, and you're wanting to hit a target, well, you, ultimately you shoot as fast as you can, that you can hit the target accurately, right. Well, once you start hitting outside of the target, well, now you've worked outside your window. But now you know, okay, I know I need to back it back down, work within this area, and that's how you actually get better.
Speaker 2:So that was kind of your mindset coming in. You were going to try to get outside your window.
Speaker 3:Yeah, get outside my window. Now I know a realistic measurement of where me and Rusty are at that point in time, and so that's what I got. I got what I wanted that's awesome.
Speaker 2:Y'all have been back. I think y'all have made it to almost. If y'all made it to everyone since, yeah, yeah, including the member gathering that we did. We did that one recently in the fall, on a smaller scale, and now we've got more, more stuff coming up that everybody will hear about soon. That's going to be, it's going to be awesome. I'm really excited about that that you're taking part in, and you and Kevin, and so let's talk about that. For a second, just community aspect, you did not know that Kevin or Ben was around you. Was that the case?
Speaker 3:No, I had no idea. I didn't know anybody.
Speaker 2:I was doing completely solo. Did you meet them at member weekend, the first member weekend?
Speaker 3:I met Kevin the first member weekend. I think I met Ben the second member weekend.
Speaker 2:And so those are all people that are local to you. Yeah, that you're like this is kind of a small world. We're just showing up to this random field in Alabama.
Speaker 3:It's like, oh yeah, well, oh yeah, I'm right, keep you and Kevin. About 20 minutes down the road from where I'm at, I'm like, oh great.
Speaker 2:That is so cool.
Speaker 3:That is so cool and so definitely great friendships run off to the good hunting trips and, obviously, great training that was all the time you get people like side of mind, like my, like mindsets.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know that's a big thing too. Yeah, Cause I mean, like you said, we, you know we're training a little bit differently at Cornerstone than maybe some of the old school ways. Um, and it's important to be aligned with similar people, right, when you're in alignment, things are just smoother. And let me ask you this coming back, I'm going to kind of take us on a different path. So, coming back from some of those old school ways that you had seen done on dogs, what was your perception when you first found Cornerstone in like learning that we did things a little bit different? Did you have any thoughts like is that, was it intriguing to you, or is it more of like a thing? Oh, let's explore this and find out why.
Speaker 3:So I'm kind of I'm learning a bunch of stuff at the same time, so I'm going to try and make sure I explain it correctly. So, yeah, yes, I do know, like no, the way kind of how things used to be done, which is a, you know, negative reinforcement to get until you get the desired action that you want, and that's pretty much how everybody taught animals, just as far as I know. Yeah, yeah, and but that's also how you also taught people for a long period of time. Yeah, right, I mean, that's just really what it was.
Speaker 3:Somebody did something you didn't like. You know, corporal punishment or whatever military lifestyle, all that. And then, when I was going through teaching the firearm stuff, when I was going through teaching the firearm stuff, this is a critical action I need you to know. I need to know, when you walk out of here, you're going to be okay and you're going to know how to use the tools appropriately. We really drop all the hardness and things like that at that point in time, because I want you to learn, I need you to.
Speaker 3:This is what I want you to do. I want you to have a good time doing it, and the more we realize, oh, the more fun you know these students are having, the better they're getting faster Right and the better they're retaining the information that I tell them, because you know if I'm hot under the collar or if you're doing something and you know I start yelling at you or anything like that, you have absolutely no idea what I'm saying. All you know is I'm mad and you're trying to process why, even though I'm telling you why, but you can't hear what I'm saying. Yeah, and that's what really attracted me to the way that Cornerstone was doing things with positive reinforcement.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Because we love these animals right.
Speaker 2:Oh, 100%. You train a dog with your heart, not with your hands.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and so whenever you're doing positive, it's okay. I have yet to see a golden retriever who doesn't love to just run a pitch, pick up a tennis ball and you throw it 100%. So all I'm really doing is just developing that action to a more structured way of what I want them to do. Well, he's going to definitely work a lot better if he's having a great time doing it and then, with positive reinforcement, you're able to really let that grow and that's what I I wanted, wow and so, and you're actually starting to see it a lot more in like other training communities, so like horses and things like that.
Speaker 3:People are using like clicker treat methods and it's really taken off.
Speaker 2:I've noticed that too in the years. It is taken off and, like you said, I mean it's more about being able to. At the end of the day, if you get rid of concept whose way is better, and all that, and you get down to what is the goal, the purpose. The goal is the outcome. The outcome we want our dog to do X Y Z. So then you get back to what's the best way to get them to do X Y Z. And it's not just I want you to do this, because you can have two dogs do the same exact skill. One dog can do it lethargically or or out of fear and compulsion, the tail between its legs, ears back, and it just does it because it has to do it. You can have another dog that does the same thing except tails up. They're happy and they're excited about it, but both dogs did the same thing. So it's not just about the outcome but it's also about the how of the outcome that you're getting. And for us, like you said, that's kind of what it's all about.
Speaker 2:I love that line. You said you don't train with your hands, you train with your heart. I mean that's the truth, man. These dogs are our family members. They're our buddies. I kids now, and so you, and that really makes you think about it when you have kids. I want my kids to be able to watch me train my dogs and participate in training the dogs and not be afraid of me because of the way I train. I want them to be able to be out there like, oh, this is cool. And thankfully, you know the way we trained our kids. My kids love to train. Every morning they wake up. You know the youngest ones, you know she can't really talk big yet, but she she says rough, rough, rough, rough, meaning let's go get the dogs, let's go get them out and let's go train the dogs. It really is important to the how and the outcome and, like you said, we found that this way works the best because it produces the best how and the outcome, not just performing the skill.
Speaker 3:And I also think that it opens up the opportunity for more dogs. Yeah, and so that's a good point.
Speaker 3:Especially with Rusty in particular. He's a soft dog. Oh yeah, he is what he is. I love him to death, but he's a soft dog. And so even if I get into him a little hard, you know, with just even a verbal correction, yeah, all right, he's going to pay me back dividends on that. And so I'm going to have to work a little harder to make sure his confidence is built up. But especially after the most recent years well, it's all been recent years for the last couple of years the more that I build his confidence, the higher his drive gets. And so that's what, since the end of duck season this year, like that's really what I've been working on. Yeah, just building my confidence, just building confidence, like building confidence, like we'll do drills, he knows what casting and everything is, we get through and all that. But my goal for this entire year is just to build his confidence, because I've seen his drive double almost.
Speaker 2:It seems like oh my, yeah, 100%. Remember weekend. I mean, and just for reference, your dog, for those that are watching, this dog's fully trained. You've been through the whole entire process. You can call it finished. It's an amazing dog. It's got the skill sets down. It's going to perform, it's going to do the tasks. It's going to do it well. Blind retrieves I mean long blind retrieves. We sat some long stuff at member weekend and Rusty crushed it. Rusty crushed it. Mark retrieves, everything in between steady, quiet, not messing around. You actually had your dog sitting on your four-wheeler.
Speaker 1:Remember weekend and I think you were doing something. I was like what is this dog?
Speaker 2:It's just sitting here and you're like way over there eating lunch or something, and Rusty was just chilling under the tree just like what's up.
Speaker 2:So this is a very well-trained dog. So when you're talking about getting you know, building that confidence, this is more of the nuances. But also, like I just I want people to know the magnitude of that, cause. I mean, you've been with us, so three years, is that right? Well, you've been with us longer, but Rusty's been with us. He's three, yeah, he just turned three. Yeah, about 18 months or so to get through it.
Speaker 2:Then you get another 18 months or so of actually continuing the training and then it really starts to show, like all that work you've done just is kind of like you get the snowballs going in the right direction down the hill for you now because momentum is on your side. So with Rusty man, what's you know? Let's talk about member weekend for a second, just any big wins from this past member weekend, and then maybe what we'll do is we'll hammer out some of the challenges that you face in training, cause I know everybody wants to hear that, um, because they're probably facing challenges right now and maybe we can shed some light on how to navigate that. But first we can start with some wins from this recent member weekend.
Speaker 3:So, um, not this member weekend, but I think the one prior to that. We were doing a, a blind drill and so like a three post drill, yep, and so it was during that time he was having to run. I cannot recall the actual name of the drill, but it's where you have the center post closer to you and the other two that are farther out, yep, that would. I don't remember which actual name of the drill, but it's where you have the center post closer to you and the other two that are farther out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, that would. Well, I don't remember which one we were doing with that, and that could have been like a Y drill, or we could have done the uh, three leg pattern blind. Three leg pattern blind. Is that it? That was it Okay.
Speaker 3:So, but the explain, the way I was set up, is that you had one set of bumpers and a post closer to you, yep, and the goal was to get the dog to run past that. So you have to ignore, ignore something pulling in which I knew was going to be a challenge, but I was like, well, that's where we're at, and so, and get on the run past to the farther blind, yeah, and so, no, we've done lines, all that stuff. So he knows that where I'm pointing him at is where I want him to go. But, like I say, he was having some confidence issues, okay, and so I sent him and he starts to get close to that one close post. He doesn't turn towards it because I'm waiting for it.
Speaker 3:I know he's going to turn, I have to give a correction. But instead of doing that, and really just instinctively, I decided let me see if I can just head it off and just give him a good boy. Just yell it out there, good boy. And as soon as I did that, he saw that rear drop down and he just fired off Wow, going the exact direction I wanted him to go. That's awesome. And that's really when it clicked. I'm like this is a verbal praise dog, that's all he wants, yeah, and so yeah, on blinds for sure, if you ever, just if I sent him on one and you just hear me yelling good boy, that's just me getting him to keep going further and further and further, wow. And so that was like a huge. It was a huge win because, yeah, he did what I want him to do. But the biggest part of the win is I now understood my dog better.
Speaker 2:Hey, I hope you're enjoying the episode so far. I just want to stop and ask a favor of you real quick. If you are enjoying this episode, let me know, like subscribe, hit that notification bell, that way you can be aware of any new content that we release. And also just let me know what you're thinking. Maybe there's something that stands out to you, or maybe you just have a thought and you'd love to comment. I can't wait to see what you put in the comments and I can't wait for you to subscribe. So now back to the podcast. That's amazing too, and the communication aspect of that I feel like, and to see him like pick up on it and like turn on the afterburners, and that just that's something that everybody can learn from, because it never hurts to timely communication. But you also said something earlier that I'll kind of weave in. You're talking about kind of the firearms training and how sometimes if you're just sitting there, you know getting after somebody, they don't really know what you're saying, because there's so much.
Speaker 2:They're trying to process, they're trying to learn a new skill and then they're trying to perceive what you're saying. That's the same with our dogs too. So when our dogs are learning those new skills, if we're hard on them too much, communication can create confusion. Oh, that right timing of communication, like in this case, on that three-leg pattern line where it was just like you're watching him, you're trying to head it off, like okay, I think he might pull here, good boy, right before he's. Okay, I'm heading the right direction. So he knows I'm going the right direction. So communication is a very powerful tool in dog training.
Speaker 3:You just gotta get that timing right, yeah and so, yes, like positive reinforcement comes in different, different visions for sure. So like whether you're you know you're giving them a treat, or you're giving them a tennis ball or you're just giving verbal praise they can those little, those little stepping stones, definitely add up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's kind of what I like about the positive reinforcement too, especially the way we've done it. We've did in for the retriever training is. You know? A lot of people ask the question you know you're going to have to keep using treats as you go down. Well, not really. There's a couple of reasons. Number one the retrieve becomes the positive reinforcement itself. You got verbal rays, like you just said, so there's places where you can reinforce them, that you're not having to sit there and use clicker and treat. But the clicker and treat is a powerful tool. You start that early on. It allows you to do things like you're doing now. Have that confident dog and learn to build their confidence even more. Right Cause, you know, maybe something we could talk about with Rusty too. It sounds like confidence has been a challenge for him at times. Is that what I'm getting? Hearing from you a little bit.
Speaker 3:So yeah, it's just really like when his confidence goes down. How does he behave when that happens? Yeah, so like what does that? Look like Okay. So a lot of the times, especially if his confidence gets way down, so if he's in a new environment for one New environment is that like when the skill is not going well.
Speaker 2:Let's say, you're trying to run a drill and it's just like he's getting a failure or just not quite getting it. What is turning him on to that?
Speaker 3:So if it's a failure I'll admit a lot of times that's me and how I perceive it and how I act or if he's not confident, it means he's just not certain on what he's supposed to be doing.
Speaker 2:So he gets confused, okay, and so he wants to be certain. He wants to please you so bad, he wants to really make sure, yeah.
Speaker 3:And I know you said it before he is a he pleasing dog and so I don't even know if I gave him to you and told you to go work him if you could, because you'll give him a command and he'll immediately turn and look at me to make sure it's okay for him to go do it. And so he does to my wife all the time. She hates it because it's aggravating can I do this, bossy?
Speaker 3:sure yeah, she'll like send him out and he'll just I have like just place boards all over the house. You'll eventually then you get in the training he'll. You just build a couple of them and we'll go out. And so I have one I just have sitting out in the yard and she'll be like all right, we'll go use the bathroom and he just goes and sets on his place board. He's like I don't know what to do, but I know this is right.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And especially you know everybody has bad training days, oh yeah, and so a lot sometimes on those bad training days, or if I took the training too long, like I didn't read him right, yeah, he can get to where he won't do anything because he's afraid of doing something wrong and so. But then that's when I know it's like, alright, let's cool down, let's reset, let's know, just have some fun, just do some quick marks, get his confidence back up and then I can get wins after that. That's cool.
Speaker 2:That's just about knowing your dog too, Because, I mean, some dogs are totally different. They don't show that, they're just hard drive all the time. And those can be a challenge too, because it's like, okay, well, how do you navigate those waters? Yeah, so you just learned that about Rusty through the process, I would imagine oh, yeah, absolutely. And was it correct to say that that really clicked for you? Were you seeing some tendencies before it clicked for you at member weekend on that three-leg pattern blind drill where you were starting to see glimpses of this? It seems like that was the moment that that clicked. It's like okay, this all makes sense now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's one of those things. It's like, okay, I've done it before, but maybe I didn't notice the behavioral change as abundantly as that was, because whenever that happened on Members Weekend, everybody who was standing there with me I think Papas, was standing there with us and he's like that dog just took off yeah, it did, and so it was so abundant that you couldn't deny that's what happened. Yeah, and so that's when it really set in. It's like oh, he just wants to, he just wants to do what I tell him to do. Nice, he just wants to make sure that he's doing the right thing, that's awesome.
Speaker 2:So for Mr Rusty in his training, really for your training journey, it's really not just his, it's your training. This was technically your first outside of Ranger, but their first. Like you know, you're going all the way through the training. Did you have any apprehensions about? You know? Will this dog turn out? Um, any concerns about that, or is more of just like let's see how far we can get?
Speaker 3:Uh, I think everybody kind of has those apprehensions, especially during the fetch hold release stage.
Speaker 3:Uh, and so, because I remember I actually last night I was talking to my wife about this, she's like you're going to talk about the times you were pacing the floor wondering if this dog was going to turn out or what you did wrong and all that, and I'm like, oh, I guess I have to, and so, because he's a real mouthy dog and he'll come up, accept it like there's bigger, bigger battles to fight yeah, I'll fight this one later and so he really like kind of tossed the bumper a lot in his mouth and he wasn't doing it just perfect, and which is another issue that I was having.
Speaker 3:You know, I'm trying to make sure he does everything absolutely perfect before we go on to the next step, yeah, which I now realize is not necessarily the right mindset to have, right and so and so, but at the same time I was having very real issues. You know, he wasn't. He was dropping the bumper a lot and wasn't picking up the way I needed to be picked up, cause I'm trying to head off and make as many problems as I can in the early stage because that does pay off.
Speaker 3:But I also want to make, but I also want to make sure I'm ready to move on and so I forget whatever week or weeks that was, but I remember I stopped for about a month, month and a half, while I just like stopped the program and just work that for that period of time and I wound up paying off in the long run. That's good.
Speaker 3:But, that's a long month month and a half when I'm sitting there working on this Granted a very important part of the retrieve. That's a long time we sat here worried about that particular part too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100%, especially in the back of your mind if this is your first time. So, like you said, you're taking a step of faith. Is this going to work? You know, should I abandon ship at this point? Should I try something different? Yeah, but it sounds like you held true to it and it did pay off for you. Oh, should.
Speaker 3:I try something different. Yeah, but it sounds like you held true to it and it did pay off for you. Oh yeah, I'm like calling people and be like you want this dog, you want to go work, and then like, and then finally, like I sit down and I just remember just sitting there thinking about it and praying about it and like I always do, and they're like, oh, just stick it out and just work with it. Yeah and so, but then, remember, weekend showed up and he proved me wrong man, like he loves to do.
Speaker 2:That's pretty impressive too. I mean, maybe that month and a half of work did pay off, because normally they're going to regress in that environment of extra dogs and extra scent and all that. So I mean clearly you did a thorough job.
Speaker 3:If you think you need to stop and take extra time, take the extra time. Yeah, so you can. I really don't think you can go too slow. You can always go too fast 100%, and so I'd rather go too slow than too fast.
Speaker 2:And some of that, I think too. I'm glad we're hitting on this too, because a lot of people struggle with this, and even if they're not using our course, they might be just struggling training their dog. In general, we get so caught up on the end destination that we forget that the journey is what it's all about and each step of the journey matters, and so you don't really want to rush it. I mean, if you think about it, I mean, violet is already six or seven, six, maybe it'll be seven this December. It's like, man, you don't want to. You know it easy to want to rush it. Right, you want to like some of it. I guess let's say let me just put it clearly this way you don't want to rush the training to prove it to yourself that it can work.
Speaker 2:And if you, that's a major mistake I think a lot of people make, especially if they're training the first time. They're just rushing through to see if it's going to work. Is this going to work? Is this going to work? Well, it's going to work for sure. Now I get, you may not know that yet, but if you're willing to, like you said, you can't really go too slow Take your time, especially at problem areas.
Speaker 2:Um, don't try to force it to be fixed. Just go with the flow of the dog and that flow will be probably the right pace, whatever that dog's pace is, and on the outside of that you'll come out way better. And that journey is not in vain, even if you have to take well, it would be called a detour. It takes you longer, right? Maybe you're thinking it's going to take three weeks or four weeks instead of six weeks. Whatever it may be, those extra three weeks or extra four weeks pays off in the long run. Like you said, you create that thorough training. But yeah, it's. That's a big thing, I think. I think think the mistake that a lot of people can make in that area is it doesn't sound like you did it. You just hunkered down and you just went on through. Anyways, you just took your time. But so concerned about the turning out the end result to just prove it to yourself, does it work that you can end up making it worse on yourself before it gets better?
Speaker 3:Absolutely and really. Whenever I came to Members Weekend, that really helped drive up my confidence extremely.
Speaker 2:Wow.
Speaker 3:Because, yeah, I had that big win on the first day, but let me talk about the second day, right and so in the groups I was with you and you looked at me and you're like, well, has this dog had gunfire training yet?
Speaker 3:I'm like well no, I'm not there. I'm like, all right, let's do it, Okay, and so, and then, and then we did, uh, lining memories. He's like you done any lining memories Like you don't know? He's like, well, walk them out, you know 50 yards or however far it was probably wasn't that far 30 yards and see if he'll do it. And he knocks it out. So, yeah, I stopped to make sure that mouth issue was taken care of, but then during three days I actually advanced very quickly. Yeah, Because I didn't have to worry about that prior issue. Yeah, and since he started picking up concepts very, very quickly again, oh, that's awesome. And so everything really really worked out.
Speaker 2:And the foundation was there and that's where you know I've made that mistake a few times with my dogs, not what you did, but the opposite of what you did. I've pushed them further, quicker. I didn't hunker down and then end up going. Yeah, yeah, I did a you know a hundred yard memory with the dog, but the dog's fumbling the bumper, they're dropping into your feet. It's like great. My dog did a hundred yard retreat but the foundation's cracked. Fixing. That is so huge because what you did allowed you to, in three days, make massive progress and I'm sure you were able to build on that when you went home as well.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, that's definitely what. I'm sitting here going through the early, all right. Well, this week we're doing Intro to the Gunfire. Well, me and Josh did that in 30 minutes, so let me check, all right. So let me go past that and see what I need to do to maintain that right, because and see what I need to do to maintain that right, because that's what you got to do, and so you know I had that learning curve, but then it'll work out this way. As long as you keep showing up, you'll dive right back into it and you'll find your way and get right back into it.
Speaker 2:That's awesome, so really for you. Maybe one of the big challenges was the fetch hold and release.
Speaker 2:Yeah absolutely, and just figuring out. It sounds like maybe taking a sec second to reflect pray I always pray in training, that's. You want to know the real secret to training? Uh, everybody wants to get all these like nuances. What's the secret? The legitimate secret is to just stop and pray and ask God for help. If you do that, it's like I can't tell you how many problems I have broken through. I have no clue. What is the answer? The answer here and it's like you're out there scratching your head like what are we gonna do with this dog? Stop and pray. You come out on the other side better. So okay, all of a sudden it just works out and generally, the answer is always the same, just go out there and do it yeah, go out and train your dog.
Speaker 3:That's usually what I get, so 100 go trade him I always feel better at the end of it absolutely, and sometimes you just trying too hard.
Speaker 2:You're trying so hard that you're trying to make it like you're trying to force it and like this whole dog training thing. There's not a lot of good forcing that's going to happen here and there's a lot of outcomes that are negative, that can come from trying to sit there and force it Like come on, dog, just get this. I was talking to somebody and they were like expressing issues at the fetch and they're sitting there, just holding the bumper, just sitting there like dog. Wow, will you not just grab the bumper? It's right here, just grab the bumper. That's what was going through their mind. It's like you're trying to force it, like just be patient, it'll work out. Yeah, it always works out.
Speaker 3:And so I actually have a coworker that ended up getting in the cornerstone separate areas right now, so can't really converse a whole lot. He's talking about kind of the stuff that he's got going on with it and I'm like, listen, just try to make it as fun as possible and you'll be okay. That's all you gotta do. Just try to make this as like, just make it a good time, then your dog will have a good time and your dog will learn.
Speaker 2:Fun for yourself, too, right? It's not just for the dog.
Speaker 3:You have to love to do it, yeah and so. No, it's a labor of love, for sure, 100% and so. But you got to love to do it, man. This is a hobby for me, yeah and so I wouldn't be doing it if I didn't enjoy it.
Speaker 2:Absolutely yeah. I don't know why we would be doing it if we haven't enjoyed it. And how did you go about fixing that?
Speaker 3:uh, mainly just in the struggling parts, or of course, of course that. But also at times, you know, I feel like I don't give rusty all the time that he needs. Yeah, life happens, you know I have no. Since then I've had a second son, yeah, 10 months old now. Um work changes, um critical incidents happen, things like that, and so there are times where, like all right, sorry, bud, the only thing we're doing is we're letting you out for a little bit and we got to bring you back in.
Speaker 1:That's all we got going on today.
Speaker 3:And so and you kind of hate it, but then it's so rewarding when you're actually. It was like all right, I'm going to take, you know, even if it's a short day, 30 minutes, let let's just go out and just have some fun doing it and the fact that he knows everything so well and we're able just to go back and just have a good day of just doing the retrieves he does everything right like you can just tell that both of us are just having a great time and that's a great way to start the day.
Speaker 2:I think a lot of people struggle with that too, even myself as a business owner and all that like sometimes I don't give my dogs the time that I want to give them and so, like battling that, oh man, I feel like I should be giving you more. But in reality I mean the dog is a happy dog. They got a good home, they got a good family. It's not all about training all day, every day, it's most of the time. I mean the vast majority of training is just a small thing and hunting is such a small bit of their life. The rest is really spent as being a family companion, hanging out around the home and I don't know what dog is not happy in America, eating good food, hanging out with a good family. I mean you got to have a happy dog if you got that going. So hopefully that encourages somebody listening to this, because it's easy if you start thinking, oh, my dog deserves more. Well, they're more than they should have, more than enough in your home.
Speaker 3:Oh, absolutely. I mean, he's a great family dog, like loves my kids, does great with them, and so there's actually an incident that we had. So Rusty just stays on place all the time when he's in the house. I believe it, and the reason I did that is because when I got him, like I said I had, I got Rusty and then we had a son a few months later and Rusty's big dog, he's a big fella and so he I just didn't want I know he would never do anything intentionally, but I didn't want him to accidentally hurt anybody, hurt my son, and it all worked out. And, don't worry, rusty's still living his full life, even though he's not running around the house eating scraps Probably actually safer.
Speaker 3:He could have ate something he shouldn't have had, but I've only had one incident to where he got off place and ran outside, and the reason he did it is because my son, uh, figured out how he can now open screen doors when he was a toddler and walked outside and my wife was like Russ, you just ran out, hmm, and so we go out there. And then I see him pulling on his shirt in the driveway Away from the road, trying to keep him like contained and barking man, let us know.
Speaker 3:And so it's kind of one of those things. It's like that sounds kind of almost too far to actually be true. That's cool, he knows what's important.
Speaker 2:Dude, that is, that's cool. It's amazing how and that's just a good example of how those dogs are great family dogs. Like it's amazing how and that's just a good example of how those dogs are great family dogs Like they know what you value, oh yeah, like they know their place and they know you love them too. But obviously the family is going to come above the dog, yeah, and then the dog is going to be part of the family. They know their place. That is that's an amazing story right there, I bet y'all so your wife saw it, or y'all both saw it and she's like, oh, she's like he's outside.
Speaker 3:And of course her first reaction is like, oh, the dog is attacking the kid. I'm like, no, he's outside, he's not supposed to be. He knows that. Yeah, because he's never seen him out there by himself before. Wow and so, but that's cool, he got big praise.
Speaker 2:I bet he did. Yeah, he deserves it. That's a good dog right there. Well, what's been? Um, so that was one of your, maybe one of the challenges. What's been one of your greatest moments thus far with Rusty? Your greatest moments of victory with Stog outside of that member weekend story, obviously that's a big deal. I'm sure you've had many victories at this stage, having a fully trained dog that can do all kinds of amazing stuff. But sometimes it's not even the big stuff that stands out. Sometimes it's the little things. What, in particular for you and Rusty, what's kind big stuff that stands out? Sometimes it's the little things.
Speaker 3:What, uh in particular for you, and rusty was kind of one of y'all's biggest wins together. So we, uh, a couple years ago we I think we all kind of know how that duck season went for everybody, right, they just weren't there yeah, and so we just spent a lot of time just sitting around doing nothing.
Speaker 3:Fast forward to this duck season, we had a different ball game, a lot of good hunts. Um, opening day had a little bit of some struggles, hunting out of the blind. There was some stuff I didn't think was going to be an issue that wound up being an issue and I think it just had to do with knowing the number of guns in the blind. Oh yeah, he's separated at me with me from this point in time, so like the dog box is completely walled off, oh yeah, and so he's kind of affirming me a little bit Now. I'm trying to give him commands but he's not really certain.
Speaker 1:Like I said, he doesn't get he if he's not sure what he wants to do, he won't do anything.
Speaker 3:But I didn't get into him or anything like that. I stepped out of the blind and sent him from there, and so opening weekend had pretty actually had a lot of good, a lot of big wins this season and so. But one was the last duck of opening of one of those days. He's out there and I, you can't. I there might be a way to train for it. I don't know how it is, but for ducks that are not dead but diving. So he's out there. I'm like there's no way he's gonna get that thing. Wow. So we're all kind of sitting there, the blind watching, and I'm just kind of waiting for it to pop back up and I'm like like, don't shoot the duck, while I like dogs out there, like I'll go out and I'm gonna take care of it, and so I'm kind of, you know, get my shotgun. And I'm about to wait out in the water and the next thing, you know, the blind just erupts.
Speaker 2:Wow, like somebody scored a touchdown, like he got it like he just dove all the way underwater and pulled that thing up out of the water and pull that thing back up, wound up being a spoonbill that I'm happy with smiling.
Speaker 1:I'll take it all day and so that was like.
Speaker 3:That was like all right, I got a good dog man and so those are big moments right there and then me and ben had a hunt together and it was a couple moments in that one it's nice to have, and ben and walter, a great team, yeah, great dog, great dog handler. And so the way that the hunt was really going is that it was almost textbook. Wow, the way the dogs were actually handling themselves. Now he would send out his dog on a good mark on his way back. I send Rusty, rusty pick up a different one. And, man, they were just firing off all day. Oh man, and so we.
Speaker 3:Actually I think we had like a three or four man limit that day it was a pretty good day, that's so cool during that hunt I hail mary a teal at about 75 yards. I'm sorry it's all. Skill 100. It was all it was all planned you knew what you're doing. I had a lucky bb out there. I folded this thing. I'm like, well, there's no way he saw it, but I see him looking. He's looking at it and so I'm like, all right, I send him straight to it and straight back so a small bird, that's a long mark, especially what was it?
Speaker 2:uh like fields, field hunting yeah, it was a flooded field, that's. That's a hard mark, because I'm sure there's some stubble poking up.
Speaker 3:There's a stubble poking out and then obviously like we were in a pit. So he's close, he's close to the water at that time, so he's having a a lot of reflection coming up. That's amazing. And so I couldn't even really see it out there, but man, he was on it. I couldn't believe it. That's incredible. And so we actually had some guys at another, blind, that could see it, like we could see each other, and they were like man. All of a sudden I heard them yelling they go, look at that dog.
Speaker 2:Flying way out there. So could you imagine hunting without a dog that could do that? And a team effort too, of another cornerstone member and their dog, I mean that is.
Speaker 3:I mean good dog work makes a hunt man. My hunts are much more relaxing now, like I just remember, like in the days of hunting just flooded swampland where the mud comes up to your knees and having to track around hoping you kill a couple and just trying to get out anywhere. I mean I used to lose a lot of weight during duck season. All the effort you got to put into it, cleaning those things up, that's awesome but it definitely enhances everything tremendously.
Speaker 2:About 100%, there's no question. And I mean to see the dog's passion, like you said, like you can look at your dog and they're seeing the ducks often before you do. I don't know there. And like you said, like you can look at your dog and they're seeing the ducks often before you do, I think I don't know. There's just something about that handler, the duck hunter and the duck dog connection. I mean the fact that they will go out even when we don't want to go out. You know you wake up, it's early but the dog's ready to go, like they know it's time to go.
Speaker 3:And then I hunted him pretty hard. He got like swimmer's tail a little bit this season, so he was busting it.
Speaker 3:He was getting after it and so it was cold. I'm like, well, I got to leave you at the house, but I can't take you with me today Because he was hurting and I could tell he wasn't acting right. But he loves it so much he's going to do it anyway. Yeah and so. But man, I remember I sleep in a camper during all season long and I was like bud. You got to stay here and I shut the door and he heard my, heard me fire off that four wheeler and he's like he couldn't take it. Oh man, he was hot.
Speaker 2:Oh, I bet he was. I could see Rusty doing that. What a dog man. He's a beautiful dog, thank you. We got plenty of good photos and video footage. I'm sure we will layer this podcast so that people can see him, because we got a really cool photo from his last member weekend. He looks so epic.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, so I'll be sharing that one. A bunch Good, that's great Good.
Speaker 2:Well, man, this has been an incredible episode. Just hearing from you, is there anything in particular you wanted to share, outside of what we've chatted about here at about here?
Speaker 3:Obviously, I've got a couple more questions for you, but wanted to leave you room for that if there was anything Really just really embracing the process, yeah, and also how the process is like help me as a person, wow, right.
Speaker 3:And so you know, at this time, I'm going through all this and I have all these changes in my life, like I'm a new father, so I'm learning how to be a dad, right, I know you know that struggle. Oh yeah, I'm learning how to be a dad right, I know you know that struggle. Oh yeah, I'm learning how to be a dog handler at this point, and how the reflection of my relationship and training my dog, being a father, really recertifying myself, my faith, wow, all that kind of at the same time, has really taken me through a lot of challenges. Wow, so like, especially especially um, 2023 was just like a hard year for us, yeah, and so, like, my wife got into a very serious crash at one point in time, oh, man. And then, you know, at work, um has some very serious critical incidents, um, with that, and I'm not going to go into details about those, but enough to where it takes a toll on person, wow, and I remember sitting around and you know, praying a lot, trying to figure things out, definitely questionable times.
Speaker 2:Sounds like it.
Speaker 3:And I just remember like God telling me go train your dog, wow, just go train your dog, wow. And then after some time doing that, I got a couple of weeks like okay, and things just I wind up figuring things out. Wow, so it's not just the result of getting a great retriever, that's amazing. The development of myself as well. That really kind of totally encompassed this whole thing.
Speaker 2:That's truly incredible. I mean that's thank you for sharing that too, and hopefully that encourages people that are listening to this. I mean it is kind of healing to get out there with a dog too and just be out there, Like, turn everything off. It's just you and the dog Just doing the training, Even if it's, like you said, sometimes it's a 20-minute session, just a little thing, or five minutes here, five minutes there, but that's amazing how it made such an impact for you.
Speaker 3:Oh, absolutely, that's awesome. So thank you guys for putting this out so we can actually, like I can learn right.
Speaker 2:So because obviously me doing it by myself when I wasn't figuring it out, yeah, so well, that means a lot, and it's crazy to get to sit across from me here and, uh, obviously we'd have never known each other if cornerstone hadn't been here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely but it really is amazing.
Speaker 2:Like you know, I it like yeah, I mean, we had the struggles as I was going through with Violet and people were very well aware of that because we videoed the whole entire struggles but I didn't realize what I was going to have on the other end of that, which is not just a good dog, a great dog, but to help other people be able to do it, and to sit across from someone who you face challenges yourself and it's made an impact on you that makes it worth it.
Speaker 2:Like I can't even fathom. When I was training Violet, you know, and we're sitting out there I could have never fathomed this to be connected with you and other members that are going through some similar things, or even with their dogs, or even if it's not big stuff, but in your case, maybe some huge things that you're facing in life. I could have never imagined that what we were sitting there doing was going to help you. So to me and I always talk about this with everybody, especially if someone's first becoming a member, and I'll let them know like hey, I love these conversations, uh, because I know on the outside of this, you're going to like I get a lot of reward from training my own dog, right, but there's no greater reward for me than to see someone else take what we've done, you know, and use that to get something great for themselves.
Speaker 3:So it's it's pretty cool to be sitting across from you here, man. It's a, it's a high honor for sure. Yeah, I appreciate it. And you're and I'll kind of touch on that You're talking about some of the struggles you were having on Violet and actually capturing those, those issues, and I know I've heard it on the podcast before and everybody always says it but like, that pays dividends for sure, because it's one thing.
Speaker 3:So, especially in like and I've I've seen this in pretty much any type of professional training environment you live and die by the demo. Oh yeah, if I say I could, if I say you have the capabilities to do something, I better be able to do it 100% and I better be able to do it on the spot when I'm telling you to, and so. But whenever you say it's like, it's one thing for me to watch somebody learn how to train a dog who's a like been through the drill. The dog's been through the drill a hundred times. Yeah, and so if I'm teaching like Rusty and it comes like walking baseball, he is the cheatingest dog you ever met in your life.
Speaker 3:He knows what he's about to do. He's got his body turned halfway, his eyes are looking. Already I'm like there's all right, but I but I can't sell X to tell somebody who's brand new to the program that's how their dog's going to react. Cause they're not, cause the dog has no idea what's going on. Right and so, but actually saying not everything's perfect, you are going to have struggles, and here's an example of some of those struggles that you just might encounter and this is how you overcome them. So, and granted a lot of the times, the fixes to it without you know, being on the outskirts, probably about the same.
Speaker 2:Yeah 100%.
Speaker 3:A lot of solutions are probably pretty close to each other enough to where you can figure it out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it really gets back down to the principle of the matter at the end of the day. Getting back to the root the foundation. Follow that foundation all the way through. That's pretty much how I approach training. All the time it's like I'm going to focus on the foundation and come back to that every single time, and that keeps us grounded. Yeah, you can get way out there if you start trying to all these tricks and tip all this, but if you stick with the foundation, it's going to keep you rooted, keep you grounded all the way through. Well, the famous question, the last question I'm going to ask you what would you say to someone sitting in your shoes if you could rewind to where you were thinking about getting into this? Not necessarily even just like yeah, of course, use Cornerstone, because obviously you're recommending Cornerstone, but like, what would be like if you had like three things or one thing or two things you could say to someone before they like they're starting training their dog tomorrow? What would that be?
Speaker 3:so there's really, there's really only one thing that you can control. That's it and that's how much effort you put into it. That's really it. Everything else is kind of in our control or not in our control, but you can always control how much effort you put into it. And you know, we always know how you, we always know how you eat an elephant, one bite at a time. Yeah Well, just show up. That's the only thing you can do Just get up and just show up. So on days you don't feel like doing it, just show up.
Speaker 2:That's all you got to do, it'll work itself out.
Speaker 2:That's right. That's right. That's solid advice. I mean, you're right. If you listen to this advice that he just shared, you can't go wrong. I mean, it's going to work out. Just show up. That's awesome, man. I love it. Well, man, it's been an honor to have you on and I'm excited about the future and what's to come, and this past member weekend, how you led a group so well and and how we'll continue to see all that with some of the things I mentioned earlier that's to come here pretty soon. I'm really excited about that for everybody. But thank you for taking the time to come down here and hop on the podcast, man. It's an honor and I hope I'm confident if people pay attention to what you just said and some of the other things you said they're going to that should help them. So thank you for helping other people as well.
Speaker 3:No, thank you for having me out here. And yeah, if anybody whoever wants to reach out or anything, just let me know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've got the Nashville Nashville crew right here. Yeah representing.
Speaker 1:Thanks for listening to the Build From here podcast. To learn more about retriever training or our podcast, visit cornerstonegundogacademycom. Slash podcast.