Build From Here
Build From Here
Mississippi Roots, Kansas Wings | Wade Skeen
#070 Wade Skeen's path from Air Force serviceman to Kansas waterfowl guide extraordinaire reveals how passion, community, and proper training methods can transform both careers and gundogs. As a longtime Cornerstone Gundog Academy member before becoming a professional outfitter, Wade brings a uniquely valuable perspective that bridges the worlds of retriever training and professional hunting.
Growing up in Mississippi with a focus on whitetail and turkey hunting, Wade's move to Kansas in 2012 opened his eyes to an underappreciated waterfowl paradise. What began as occasional hunts with friends evolved into Skeen Outfitters, now one of the premier guided waterfowl experiences in the Midwest. Against all odds, Wade launched his business in March 2020 just as COVID hit, yet through determination and a foundation of strong relationships, particularly within the CGA community, his operation has flourished.
The conversation delves deep into Wade's transformation as a dog trainer, contrasting his experience with traditional methods versus the methodical approach of Cornerstone training. His position as both guide and trainer offers rare insights into what truly matters in hunting dogs: "Your dog's demeanor when not retrieving birds is actually much more important than how it retrieves birds." This perspective reinforces how proper foundation training creates adaptable, steady companions that enhance rather than detract from hunting experiences.
Wade and Josh recount several memorable hunts together, including an extraordinary day filming for television where everything aligned perfectly—dog work, hunting conditions, and camaraderie. These stories highlight the unpredictable nature of waterfowl hunting that keeps enthusiasts coming back season after season.
As the conversation closes, Wade shares his most valuable advice for dog trainers: "Throw expectations out the window. Enjoy the process itself—the wins, the losses. Just focus on each 15-minute training session, day in and day out, and your dog will far surpass what goals you ever had in mind anyway." It's a powerful reminder that in both dog training and life, the journey often matters more than the destination.
Connect with Wade at SkeenOutfitters.com or find him on social media to experience one of the best waterfowl hunts available—with the added bonus of bringing your Cornerstone-trained retriever along for the adventure.
cornerstone gundog academy online resources to help you train your retriever welcome to the build from here podcast on this episode.
Speaker 2:It is a high honor to be bringing someone that you probably already know on. If you don't know him, you will know him after this episode and if you don't know him, you should get to know him. He's really just been an amazing CGA member, an amazing friend, but he's also been, you know he does something unique and we'll dive into that. But with with Skeen Outfitters he does something unique and he provides an amazing place really for waterfowl hunting and all types of hunting in general. But for for us dog people, he's my go-to guy. If you want to take your dog hunting, he's the guy to go with. Right, you know he always accommodates us and accommodates the members because he is a member.
Speaker 2:He's a Cornerstone member. He was a Cornerstone member first and kind of the dog thing and the whole hunting thing got him rolling into it. But you know, wade has just been such uh, such a hard worker and such a helpful person for anyone that wants to get their dog out there hunting and just a great guy to know. So it it's a high honor and, uh, I can't believe you haven't been on the uh this podcast already. So welcome aboard.
Speaker 3:Thanks, man. Yeah, it's uh probably a what eight year relationship with you and your dad, uh, between between hunting and started out as a CGA member and um, going back to pictures and videos and meeting you guys picking up dogs in Mississippi, uh, back when when CGA first started and, and you know, over the years have become pretty close friends and I know you y'all have, y'all have been up here hunting, I don't know, probably five or six times at this point, maybe maybe one or two more than that, and um, cga has been been a big part of everything we've done. From you know, a different, a different mentality of training my dogs, going back to the very beginning and then, of course, the, the relationships that have come from CGA, not just with, not just with the Parvans but with with other members, and really is has been a big part of everything we've done. Going back to when I was still in the air force, before I was ever, even before I retired, before I started guiding, you know doing doing training with other CGA, started guiding, um, you know doing doing training with other CGA members and meeting people through that and hopefully helping some of them out and for sure, some of them helping me out and and then transitioning. After I retired from the air force and started guiding um, you know you guys came up and hunted the first year I was I was still in the air force, uh, but I knew that I was going to retire and and start outfitting and uh, you know y'all came up and got a lot of content and and definitely, you know, helped me out as far as spreading the word when, when we were first starting out and and, and I mean I still when we were first starting out, and I mean that still happens now at CGA member weekends and things like that, which you know the community for CGA has and I'm sure always will be the best part of that business and that brand. So you know, being plugged into that has been good for me on multiple levels. So appreciate y'all just as much as the other way around.
Speaker 3:I was talking to Mr Keith yesterday and that was something he said, something about, you know, helping us out and happy to do that. And you know that's always been a two-way street both ways for us and for CGA, because one feeds right into the other. I I love having cga members up here to hunt with us, because I know what to expect as far as you know what kind of dog they're going to bring, or at least what their, what their goals for their dog is going to be if they bring them up here to hunt with us, and it allows us to do something that is a little bit more unique when it comes to outfitting, you know there's outfitters out there that let you bring your dog. A lot of times they want you to have your own group or you know different stipulations like that, whereas there's plenty of times where we have cga member only groups, like it'll be four or five, six, six of them and they might bring four dogs.
Speaker 3:But I know that the dogs are going to be at a certain standard and we can work together to make sure it's a positive experience for all the hunters and all the dogs, because a lot of times that's the whole reason they're doing it, because they spend all this time with the dog and effort and money and everything else, and maybe they live somewhere where they don't get a chance to see what their dog can do or get their dog on the opportunity to take advantage of all that training they put in, and so they bring their dog up here to take advantage of that. I mean it's been a win-win for us and for CGA and CGA members alike. So very, very grateful for the relationship on multiple levels.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we are as well. And you're right, you know it is. We all train for that moment, right, obviously we have family companion first, first. But we all want to get that dog out there and put it to the test and personally I don't think there's a better place to put it to the test than in kansas. I mean, you're gonna kill, you're gonna have opportunity. That doesn't mean you're always gonna pile them up, but you have the opportunity when you go there and you ask for albom boys, you know anywhere in the southeast. It's kind of a little bit of a drive but uh, it's worth the drive when we get up there and at the very least, it's good people well, you, you're gonna be, you're gonna be comfortable and taken care of one way or the other, and you're not gonna go home hungry no, yeah, this last time, man, this last year, y'all crushed it, uh, absolutely crushed it.
Speaker 2:It's been, it's been incredible to watch you guys grow and and all of that well. Well, for the crew, everybody's got a perception of you if they're familiar in the waterfowl industry. Let's go back. Before this waterfowl industry stuff, let's go back to your roots. Where are you from? How did you get into hunting and, in general, outdoors? Where did it all begin?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So it's kind of funny to have this conversation with you from the standpoint of we've. We've talked about all this stuff a million times and known each other for so long, but first time being on here, um so grew up in mississippi, in north mississippi, around grenada. Um was there until I was 17, grew up doing a lot of whitetail archery hunting, um, some some turkey hunting and a little bit of waterfowl.
Speaker 3:Waterfowl in Mississippi and and I mean still is to a large extent, is, you know, very gear intensive and probably a lot of money wrapped up in it as well. And my dad just never was into waterfowl. He had one experience getting dunked in the wintertime and his waders filling up when he was, you know, young and he just never really cared much for waterfowl and after that. But he did, you know, love to bow hunt and love to turkey hunt and stuff like that. So that, being in the outdoors my whole life, I mean my, my younger brother, myself if he was going somewhere or doing something, we were there with him and it didn't, you know, it didn't matter what it was, and so that that woodsmanship, even though it wasn't waterfowl hunting, it still translated into into, you know, any kind of hunting.
Speaker 3:Honestly, um, always, we always had labs growing up, um, and, you know, never really had much experience doing any training with them or anything like that. But once I, once I joined the air force and, um, you know, I was in lou Louisiana station there for eight years, did some hunting on base there. We were really lucky, we had like 20,000 acres on the Air Force base there and did some waterfowl hunting there and had a little bit of success with it and had a lab, had a couple of labs there, had a lab, had a couple of labs there. Um, but unfortunately, between deploying and then subsequently moving hawaii for five years after that, um, just didn't really have a chance to put, yeah, a consistent effort into into training a dog and and really getting the most out of that, um, like I said, went to hawaii for five years from 2007 to 2012.
Speaker 2:And that's not a bad gig right there. Which part of Hawaii were you guys at?
Speaker 3:We were on Hickam Air Force Base, which is just. It shares the runway with Honolulu International, so right off of the airport there butts right up to Pearl Harbor Naval Station. If you've ever gone there and gone to the Pearl Harbor Memorial, it's right there on the harbor and it was cool. I'm glad we lived there.
Speaker 3:We had our daughter Izzy was six months old when we moved there and Lydia, of course, loved it there and Izzy loved it there, and one day we'd like to get back to the point where we could go back there regularly and visit, you know, especially when the weather's not so great here. You know, we still have a bunch of friends there and a lot of our half of my unit that I worked for there was Hawaii Air National Guard, so they were local guys and so we still have a lot of contacts there and stuff like that. So I'd love to get to the point to go back there on a regular basis and maybe even do a little bit of hunting there, because I didn't when I was stationed there. Um, but the I mean plane tickets are just crazy to get there, so we just hadn't yeah, but sooner or later, that that'll probably be a regular thing for us.
Speaker 3:but, uh, we were there for, oh, let's see, till 2012, almost five years, um. And then we moved to kansas in 2012 and I I the way the military works I was, I had gotten a assignment from hawaii, leaving hawaii, what's called out of cycle, so I kind of was able to look at, um, what bases needed, my career field, my rank, and kind of pick out somewhat still based on the needs of the air force, but kind of pick out where I wanted to go. And at that point I uh, scott air force base in illinois was my first choice, off at air force base in nebraska was my second choice, and then here, air Force Base in Nebraska was my second choice. And then here at McConnell Air Force Base in Kansas, just outside of Wichita, was my third choice. I got on the Manning website, the personnel website, and I could see that there was a really high need for my career field and my rank here in Kansas. And totally at that point I was like, hey, I'm pretty sure we're going to get orders to Kansas. I had never been to Kansas at that point, but Kansas was synonymous, even you know whatever, 12, 14 years ago, um, with big whitetails, and at that point that was my main motivation for coming out here was I knew like coming out here, the bow hunting side of things would be really good and that was really what I was most interested in at that point. Kansas was really kind of a sleeper state for waterfowl. At that point Nobody was talking about Kansas for waterfowl. We all know how that's changed, um, but very much so. But at that point I didn't, I didn't even realize the waterfowl potential in kansas.
Speaker 3:I got out here and just happened to link up with a really good friend of mine who, um was doing ducks and lemon stuff, did a lot of, did a lot of waterfowl hunting, um, and it just so happened his main hunting buddy was was deployed at that time. So me and him hunted together all the time and started hunting public land here and it was a. It was a completely different experience because you could throw 18 floater ducks on your back in a in a decoy bag and a blind bag and your and your gun and a stool and you could walk out on a public land, um and shoot a couple of limits of mallards and that was like unheard of to me growing up in the south where you either you know you needed a really high-end lease or you know a really nice boat to get you back in where you needed to go, things like that. So the accessibility of the hunting up here really completely opened my experience up, because I'd always loved waterfowl hunting but it just never was really accessible to me and so started doing that. And he and he had a that buddy, the same David Widger, same guy I'm talking about he had a really, really nice black lab named Jolly.
Speaker 3:That was probably five, six, seven years old at that point in time. And then, um, when I hunted with him and I was like, okay, and I knew at this point I'd been in the air force for 13, 14 years, I kind of I knew I was kind of on the backside of my career, I probably wouldn't have to move anymore. Um, and so got my first dog and started training him. And this was this was a little bit before CGA um, probably two years before CGA had started and, uh, you know, kind of use some more of the more traditional ways, american style training of, you know, training a dog. And this was the first dog that I had really put the time in to train and to what I would consider, you know, a finished HRP level.
Speaker 3:And he was a really good, great dog he was, but he was extremely high, strong American line dog, you know, would run through a brick wall to to get to, to retrieve whatever, and got him really to a high level of of competency. To a high level of competency. Unfortunately, because of his bloodlines and my lack of knowledge really dealt with a lot of control issues with him more in the blind and at the house and things like that, and a lot of that we both know is genetically driven. Know, a lot of that we both know is genetically driven. But my lack of knowledge with training methods probably, you know, contributed to that to some extent. Um, right for sure did. Uh, so about the time he was two, um was, was around about the time cga came out and so it happened I was getting a British dog at the same time and started utilizing CGA, the original gundog, and I'm forgetting the correct pre-52 plus and forgetting the actual name of the classic gundog series.
Speaker 2:There you go, the classic. I like it, we might. We might have to rename it the classic gun dog series, which.
Speaker 3:I still go back and watch now because you can, you can go in there and cherry pick like specific points and and drills and things like that that you can separate out. That stand alone and it's really, it's really helpful for that um. But uh, so I started training her, uh, uli cga, basically from start to finish with her ransom, ransom, um, hr or some ukc test with her. Got her, um, oh j, I'm brain farting. Started no, not started Season title with her. Sorry, was this Bree? Yep, yep, and just kind of kept going from there. At this point I was still in the Air Force. I was still. I deployed a little bit but I had gotten a job teaching where I had more of like a nine to five, monday through Friday job, not deploying Nice game.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it gave me a lot more consistency and stability and stuff like that. And then so Parrish Major from SOK East, who we kind of all know at this point one way or the other, he and a friend of his had come out here just to hunt with me. Um, this was probably 2018 time frame, something like that, and parishes is a retired navy guy and okay, okay, and I was. I was getting, you know, I was getting pretty close to that 20-year mark in the air force at that point and kind of looking at different options as far as what I was going to do when I retired from the Air Force. And I was finishing up my bachelor's degree in organizational management and was actually getting ready to start a master's program in instructional systems design, from teaching and curriculum development type stuff and things like that. And he asked me when we were hunting one day, he's like, hey, man, what are you going to do when you retire? And I was like, oh, you know, I'll go work for Boeing or Spirit or Textron or one of these aviation companies. You know, hopefully's kind of the laid out path for you, given my background, you know.
Speaker 3:And going back a few years prior to that, I guess and this is relevant to how I knew Parrish, how I knew you guys, all this other stuff social media, facebook specifically these groups had come up and stuff like that, to where, like there was all this interaction with people with common interests and you really kind of built some significant relationships through that. You know, through that medium before it was a little more watered down than you'd call it nowadays, saturated, and that's how I knew Parrish, that's how I knew you know you and your dad and so many other people in waterfowl and retriever world was through those. You know those Facebook groups early on. But Parrish, when he asked me that and I told him, you know, go work for Boeing, yada, yada yada. He's like man. And Parrish lives in Charleston, south Carolina, for folks that don't know, but not a waterfowl mecca, so to speak. But he's a fantastic dog trainer and definitely somebody I'd consider as a mentor in the dog training side of things. But he said he's like man.
Speaker 3:If I were you and if I lived where you lived and was doing what you were doing, he said I think I'd train dogs in the spring and the summer and I'd guide hunts in the fall and the winter. I said, well, that sounds like a wonderful idea, but I'd never put pen to paper to see what that looked like. I didn't know, like you know, is this profitable? Is it? You know, is it realistic to? I mean, I have two kids and a wife and you know, is it realistic to to at that?
Speaker 3:I mean, I have two kids and a wife and, and you know, support a family and all that kind of stuff Like how does that pan out? And so that kind of started it and I'd helped some other people guide hunts prior to that and so I'd kind of seen the, the guiding side of things. As far as you know, how to utilize land to where it's affordable, without because originally I thought like, oh man, I need to buy 10 000 acres to be able to do. Well, that's not realistic for for a lot, most people most people.
Speaker 3:But then when I kind of figured out the like, the daily leasing aspect of it and how to build it up slowly without, you know, incurring this huge upfront cost, I was like, okay, this is actually kind of manageable. And by that point people are already reaching out to me to come out here and hunt anyway. And I was, you know I would. I would just take people hunting because I I like to take people hunting, um, and which worked out well, thankfully. But uh, but you know. So I started putting putting all this down on paper and looking at it and I already had a lot of people reaching out to me for help training their dogs, whether it was, you know, just one-on-one or like putting together like a training day type deal to where we'd go out and create hunting scenarios and all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 3:So, like I was already doing all this stuff, I just wasn't doing it as a career. So I just had to look at it and see if there was a realistic way to transition from that being my hobby to, you know, an actual way to make a living. And so, you know, like I said, parrish, come out here. You guys had come out here. I'd had another outfitter locally who was booked out, that had like a group of three guys from Alabama that wanted to come hunt and he was, he was booked up and he's like hey, hey, this is a smaller group. Do you have, um, you know, do you have time off from the air force? Could you guide them? And uh, so at that point I was like let me do this part-time on my own and see, like, make sure that this is something that I enjoy as much as I think I'm going to enjoy it, because a lot of people don't realize how much goes in a guide and waterfowl hunt.
Speaker 2:That is not hunting.
Speaker 3:You know it is. It is literally 14, 16, maybe 18 hour days and it can be. I mean it can be a lot. You have to be a little bit stupid to do it. I mean it can be a lot, you have to be a little bit stupid to do it. I mean you, really, you have to be completely ate up with it to tolerate the silliness that comes with it. But it's only for a certain amount of time, Like we only guide in December and January for waterfowl, but when we do, I mean you know it's every day, nonstop and long hard days. Cold, nonstop and long hard days, cold, wet, long hard cold days.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, it can get long days.
Speaker 3:There are stretches where, like it can really test somebody and you really have to be dedicated to it to get through those stretches I just I love how you say it.
Speaker 2:It can test somebody. Yeah. You just don't know until you know, until you've been there and we have one or two new guides every year.
Speaker 3:that that find that out the hard way, and you know it just is what it is. You have to be. You know, you have to be really, really, really dedicated to it and and you probably have to have some sort of background where hardship is not something that runs you off too easily. I'll just put it that way you probably have to have some sort of background where hardship is not something that runs you off too easily. I'll just put it that way.
Speaker 3:Cause you're just going. There are days where you are going to have to take people hunting that you do not want to do it. Now, there's not many of them, but there's going to be a couple of days every season where the weather conditions and things like that are going to be to the point where you know you're not going to have a successful hunt but you have no choice but to go try anyway. And you've been up here for a couple of those days. Yeah, I remember we probably have it on video, I mean it was?
Speaker 2:uh, it was a 40 or 50 mile an hour wind day. I don't know what the temperature wasn't that bad that day, and we actually killed a few birds that day, but well, we did, but the lake ended up freezing over on us the little pond.
Speaker 3:No, no, no, I was thinking of a totally different day.
Speaker 2:No, no no, that was yeah, but we, we did kill two birds.
Speaker 3:It was a prime example of exactly what. We had no business being out there hunting that day. We were not going to kill anything. It wouldn't matter where. We hunted a pawn that day, but we could have hunted a pawn. We could hunt a dry field, we could hunt in the river, it wouldn't matter. We were not going to have a day where we killed very many birds yeah, those days are more about who you are as a man.
Speaker 2:They're not anything about who you are as a hunter, because, you're just going out there to see if you can do it.
Speaker 3:And as a guide, you have no choice. Like you drove 15 hours from Warrior, Alabama, to come up here and duck hunt and we have 72 hours to do it, I'm taking you duck hunting one way or the other, 72 hours to do it, I'm taking you duck hunting um one way or the other. And so you know that was that was kind of the point of of doing some of those hunts part-time, especially on my own, to see, like, is this going to make me miserable? Is it going to become a job? Because that's what everybody tells you. You know. Oh, you're going to turn your hobby or your passion into your job and you're going to hate it, and that's not If you're really dedicated to it. It actually just adds a new element to it that makes it even more enjoyable 100% Right now again.
Speaker 3:There are two or three days a season, and any guide that tells you otherwise is lying to you.
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Speaker 3:So did that while I was still in the Air Force, enjoyed it, helped out another outfitter as well, enjoyed that. And then, about that time after that duck season was when it was time for me to put in my retirement paperwork from the Air Force and decide when that was going to happen. And, everything Funny, I have the worst luck in the world. There's no denying that. So, I think on March 7th of 2020, we announced that we were going to start guiding hunts. The next day, the stock market crashed because of covid and they shut down everything. Um, yeah, but like the, we didn't.
Speaker 3:You know that first year, we were running one group of hunters. Um, had, you know, a pretty full bulk of hunters by by season that year. I mean, there were still, we were still building, building our groups and stuff like that. But um, definitely, you know, definitely started ahead of the curve, so to speak, for for where we were. But because of just what we were talking about earlier, with those relationships that we had built over the years with, with folks like y'all, um, and you know, of course y'all, and you know, of course y'all came up and hunted with us that that first year and yeah, 2019, I believe we we were all up there and I know we've got some good film footage from that.
Speaker 2:Maybe we'll try to pop it up on this podcast. Yeah, that'd be that'd be cool.
Speaker 3:I don't know if we have any.
Speaker 2:I don't know that I think it was just me and dad. And then dustin, yeah, dustin, yeah, dustin did come and we did, we did get I know you did get some content off of that.
Speaker 3:We had some good hunts that year I remember that hunt.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this is back before you had the polaris ranger. So yeah, I know, I know exactly where this was going.
Speaker 3:Uh, we were hunting that sheet water mud field.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you called us because we tried something that morning and it didn't go well.
Speaker 3:Yeah, y'all went back to the hotel or the Airbnb or whatever, because it was we went to go get lunch.
Speaker 2:We went to Buffalo Wild Wings. Yeah, I remember I was eating some of those fries because those things are so good. And you called us and I heard it in your voice. You were there's something different in your voice, so we roll up, we roll up and you point out to where we're going. I'm like, yeah, which is not that far when you think about it, when you're energized.
Speaker 2:Well, it's 400 yards, yeah, but you're not thinking about what's going to happen after you kill birds. We weren't thinking about that. No, we didn't. We were just. Oh yeah, we just got to carry a couple of panel blinds and a little bit of gear and you know no big deal, and except for the heat, it's warmed up a little bit and it became unfrozen and it became muddy.
Speaker 3:Yes, and it was a plot theft, it was more. It was more suited for pigs than it was us, but we didn't kill birds. I think we limited. Yeah, we smoked some birds. I mean it was a. It was basically a bean field that had, uh, the drainage on it had clogged up with washed out stalks and and trash and stuff like that into the edge of a fence line and it created like a I don't know maybe acre two acre sheet water spot in that bean field and oh yeah, I mean the hunt was fantastic. Yeah, it was great. Getting out of the hunt we all almost had a heart attack.
Speaker 2:Well, we killed a lot of geese.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we killed a lot of geese and we had to huff Big geese, huff those geese out of there, big geese, puff those geese out of there. Yep, so that was that was. You know, that was tough.
Speaker 3:And then now I think that next morning was we hunted that cattle pond when dustin was there, yeah, and I, you know, I think we shot like a six-man limit of mallards that morning, like it was it was, it was amazing, it was one of those like ones you'll never forget sunshine, you know, a little bit of wind and and picking off twos and threes all morning until we had our limit around 9, 30, 10 o'clock, and I mean it was just as as and neil shot the, the magic pintail like oh yeah, hey, we got.
Speaker 2:We got that on the film. I believe we'll pop it up here too. It was a long, long, long shot. We still talk about that today because it was just unbelievable. There's no other.
Speaker 3:He still shoots that ammo that he was shooting to this day.
Speaker 2:I bet he does, I bet he does, he's not airing one bird Like.
Speaker 3:if you ask him, hey, why do you still shoot that ammo? He's going to tell you because of that bird.
Speaker 2:Well, hey, look, this past year we came up he smoked another one, yeah, with the same ammo from a long way away and it, uh, and his dog went and got it. So it's, uh, you know it's pretty cool. Yeah, it, it's amazing too. Just and that was before you really got into the guiding stuff- yeah, you had done that, I was still in the air force at that point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this was just a friend hunt and we got up there and hunted with you and in that last night you're talking about was was special because it was where we started. I mean, actually we were even standing outside the blind just taking turns like they were just coming. Yeah, we were just taking turns, taking shots, it was. We couldn't have done anything wrong.
Speaker 3:No, and as good as it could. One cool thing about that hunt was it was the very first time I had done something, and I don't know if y'all even remember this. You might, though. Um, we didn't have any wind that morning early, that's right, and I took the ice ripper and I put it out in the pond, and it wasn't frozen. I was just doing that to move the decoys early on, and I still do that to this day, and it still works on those real calm mornings If you run your generator far enough back to where it's not making too much noise and stuff like that. But yeah, we that was that was, I mean, a magic, magic morning. It was great. And then, yeah, so that was like I said, that was while I was still in the Air Force Started guiding that.
Speaker 2:Next year, y Next year, we filmed a TV show and it was really cool because we only had one day to do it. Oh yeah, this is. Yeah, we needed to go behind the scenes on this. This was a miracle. Yeah, this was a miracle for all of us. It was quite wild.
Speaker 3:We said, hey, we got to get this done. This is the only way to do it, the only day that we have available, that they have available, and it just so happened that was the only day in january that I had open um on the schedule for for you guys to come in and and and you did and and it worked, and it worked really well. Uh, probably, you know, probably one of the better hunts any of us will ever go on our entire life from the standpoint of just sheer number of birds, how they worked um man, the footage that we got from it and then, yeah, it was just every everything about it lined up, dog work, it was perfect.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, that was violets for. So we had come up the previous weekend with you.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, that's right, you'd come up with two members yeah, yeah, uh, brad, that was honestly I mean, we killed some birds yeah, we didn't kill a lot, we killed a few that first morning we had hunted that cattle pond and it was like 40 or 50 mile per hour winds that morning.
Speaker 2:It was yeah, yeah. We killed like four birds that morning. I don't know if we did any good. The next day, the final day, like right when we were ready to pull out at like noon, the birds just decided to start pouring out of the sky.
Speaker 3:So out of the sky. So we had to stay a couple more hours really cold and and that that cattle pond and frozen over and we went in there and opened it up and uh, you know, as with what happens with us a lot of times and I have to explain this to people a lot, especially guys from the south that are used to killing birds the first hour or two of of the day there's a lot of times, especially when we're hunting these loaf ponds or the river or something like that, our best hunting might be 9, 30 to 12, 30 and it just so happened that last day y'all are here.
Speaker 3:The sun came out, the wind started blowing um and I think we limited, if I'm not mistaken within like within like an hour. I don't remember how many we killed, but we, you know it went from real slow to real good, real fast. Um, we had, and we had a folly hunt that day. And then, yeah, y'all came back that next week to film the TV show and man, that was just as good as it'll ever get, probably for footage dog work, hunting, you know. The whole nine yards was really good.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it all came together and when it does, it does, and that's hunting too. Oh yeah, you just, you just never know. There's good days when it that's what it's. It's a lottery type thing. It keeps you. You win once and you got to keep going until you win again. I mean basically, yeah, you know it, that's why it's so addictive. It's, uh, you know, us hunters, we, we pour a lot of money, we pour a lot of money into the sport because it's, those days are incredible, oh yeah.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. It's what keeps you going back for years and years and years, um, and it's like, it's like hitting that perfect golf shot on the 18th hole. When you shoot a one, oh, eight that day, but you, you strike that seven iron, you know, from one, 60 on the 18th and drop it six foot from the pin. You're like I'm tiger woods, bro, I'll be back tomorrow. I mean, it's the same thing, um, but yeah, duck hunting, I think, is unique, and I say duck hunting, waterfowl hunting is unique in the standpoint of you can do everything right and still suck, I mean, which is what makes it so addictive though, because the, the unpredictability of it is what keeps you coming back for more and more. And, and we see it all the time, like you know well, this year there's when you guys were here this year, like the, I think the second day, you all had a killer hunt. On the first day, absolutely Fantastic, but the second day y'all had a killer hunt on the first day Absolutely fantastic.
Speaker 3:But the second day that you were here, if I remember correctly, y'all hunted that field basically across the road from where you had hunted before. That was the third day. I think we went to the river. Yeah, maybe the third day.
Speaker 2:No, you're right. No, that was the second day.
Speaker 3:Nevertheless, that second field that you hunted had more birds in it than the first field you hunted in. Like from the scout and the setup and everything else, like all things would point to, y'all would have crushed that day and I think y'all did kill birds, but it wasn't anything comparable to that first day.
Speaker 2:And so well, yeah, that first day it was and we've got to release that episode.
Speaker 3:I mean it's we will, we will. I think it's nearly done with. This is probably a pretty good idea, but I think so yeah, I mean it's, it's too good.
Speaker 2:I mean it doesn't get that good normally and it's a dick.
Speaker 3:I mean, when you see that, I mean it's, it's wild you know, we leaned a lot heavier on geese this year than we typically do, um, you know, normally we're really going to push the duck side of things, um, and a lot heavier on geese this year than we typically do. Um, you know, normally we're really going to push the duck side of things, um, and a lot of that's because that's what people are wanting to hunt. But, as you've seen for yourself, when you get the goose hunting right, it's about as fun as anything else. You'll learn, oh, and you know it's, it is a lot of fun to have thousands of birds tornado and above you and and feet down and be toys and I mean it's impressive too. So, like I, it's. It's nice to have that diversity on the hunting side of things.
Speaker 3:When we do struggle with the ducks, because the last two seasons for us ducks have ever have really been tough. Honestly, like late, late migration, um, last year wasn't too bad. Late. This year we still struggled with ducks late. We had them here, um, but everything was frozen up and they had been here for about three weeks with the freeze up and it was just it was. It was tough, um, but when you can go out and drop a 60 stack of geese in a in a field that that makes that steak taste a little bit better for supper that night oh yeah, I definitely had some, you know, some success with that, but you know it's been, it's been a growing process.
Speaker 3:We we started out, you know, going all the way back to that. That first year y'all came up here to do the tv show, we were doing one group of lodging hunters at a time. Uh, for several years we would do one group of lodging hunters, one group of lodging hunters at a time. Uh, for several years we would do one group of lodging hunters, one group of non-lodging hunters, where guys would just go get an airbnb or whatever. And it was cool because it was a more affordable way for some guys to come out here and do a guided hunt. I didn't personally like it because we didn't have the the connection with the hunters.
Speaker 3:Like you know, you'd get done that's right yeah, you get done with your hunt and if, if it was a, if it was a mediocre hunt or whatever, they would go back to their hotel or Airbnb and kind of board type deal. So it was less enjoyable overall experience for guys. And then last season was our first season of having two lodges that are both you know very nice places and they're 10 yards apart. And and of course you you know, having somebody like mr danny here, who's not just a cook, but I mean he's a mr danny makes the experience.
Speaker 2:Oh, he is, yes, he is tier one, he's an amazing, amazing man. Yeah and uh, I mean, I just repeatedly saw him make the experience for multiple people. Right, I just, the way he goes and tends to people, thanks, care, just he cares, he truly cares about you and he can't put a price on that, you can't put a number on that.
Speaker 3:I mean that's just who he is, absolutely not and and man and I could go on all day about him, because you know there are times where you and you know how it is. At this point too, we've had the same people hunt with us year after year after year after year, and they're not clients anymore at this point. They're friends, they're family. It just costs us money to do this, so we have to charge them, otherwise we would just have them come out here and hunt. But, like you know, a hurricane hits on the coast in Florida or South Carolina or something like that, and I get a text message from Mr Danny hey, I just checked in on so-and-so and so-and-so and so-and-so. Uh, the weather didn't get them, they're doing good.
Speaker 3:Um, and before before I even have a chance to reach out to these folks, you know he's reaching out to them and he looks at it just like we do. As far as you know the relationships that we have with these people that come out and hunt with us. So you know he's an entertainer, he's a caretaker, he's a chef, he's a manager. I mean there's, you could go. You should probably just have him on here at this rate.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean we should. I was just thinking that we might have to have Mr Danny for the bill from here.
Speaker 3:So anyway, yeah, he, he, he makes the experience for for everybody, for anything that it doesn't include hunting. Um, so, having the two lodges, having him, and then I mean we have amazing guides from the standpoint of just their dedication and what they'll tolerate between the conditions. And you know me winging it sometimes and what I ask of them and stuff like that, and you know, and I think they, and I think they're as good as it gets. So I couldn't be more grateful for the guys that we have that help us out. And then, of course, lydia, all the things that she does while we're running 90 to nothing down muddy gravel roads and stuff like that to make sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you couldn't do it without her, I mean, and she's been okay with all this and she supported you through it. I mean she's the real MVP of what y'all got going on, because I mean, like you said, 18-hour days, I mean y'all barely seeing each other during the time and it wasn't until recently. Like you said, you've got a good team and this is a lesson I think we could pull to and pull back in the dog stuff too, because there's a there's the progression of where you got to where you guys right now. But when it started, when we came out well before it even started, we were just you had a couple panel blinds, a few decoys and we're shooting a couple of ducks. Then you go, like you said, the covid hit and then you started going full bore. Let's do the operation. But I mean y'all had a lot of heavy lifting during that time and a lot of the work was done by you to begin with. Now you started building a team that's helping you get to where you're at and tying that back to the dog stuff. It's the same with people when they're starting the journey of training a dog.
Speaker 2:What we're really talking about is a journey of success with people when they're starting the journey of training a dog. What we're really talking about is a journey of success, and if you want to have a journey of success, you've got to be willing to grind it out. You got to be willing to put in the work, but you got to be willing to realize, like you're not going to get to where you're at today without, you're not going to get to where you want to be, which is where you're at today per se, without what's in between, and and there's a lot of work that goes in between but if you're willing to do that, you can. You can and, uh, it's pretty cool to see where you guys have come in, actually just a few short years. I feel like y'all have done really well. You've made some great connections and things have just yeah, things have just worked out.
Speaker 3:I think we we just finished our fifth season of guiding and I and I think, like where we are, for the amount of time we've been doing it is is definitely, you know, probably ahead of the curve for for most people. So, those relationships that we've, that we've had and, and you know, going back to the early, the early points and things where it was just lydia and myself most of the time, and the stuff that she does, you know, administratively to organize things and to, you know, keep guests informed prior to their hunts and man, all that stuff a I hate it.
Speaker 3:Um, I I don't like doing excel spreadsheets, I don't like building you building paperwork of what to expect, forms and things like that, and she does enjoy those things and she is exceptional at it, and so having that support from her has been just as instrumental in any of this as anything else. Just as instrumental in any of this as anything else, because without that it wouldn't have even gotten going, much less to where we are at this point. So, yeah, I can't say enough about that, and I mean Yahoo. You surround yourself with 100% 100%.
Speaker 3:And we've always had good people helping us out and stuff like that. But where we're at with it now and the professionalism and work ethic and dedication of the people that we have now is, I think, what really gives us an advantage across the board.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and we always highly recommend you guys. I want to talk about this for a second, ask you a question from a perspective, right Cause you're in this unique place, right You're, you're doing the guide and stuff, but you're also a Cornerstone member and I kind of want to go back and then weave some of the training stuff in. But so obviously you had some experiences with your first dog, the high strung dog, and kind of done it the old way, going back when to when you first got your new dog, brie, and going through cornerstone. What was that like, comparing and contrasting a little bit to the old way you had done things. And then you know, as you've advanced and worked more dogs through and as we've come out with a 52 plus and then so on from there, how has how has that been?
Speaker 2:Uh, for you, let's go, let's put the trainer cap on for a second talk about that. So then I want to tie that back into something we mentioned very early in the podcast, uh, which is you know you're, you know what to expect when you know cornerstone members are coming out. But let's go back with you, with you, specifically, with your dogs, and then we'll kind of tie back into that well, I think the biggest difference that you run into from the start is the expectation when you start.
Speaker 3:You know, originally with Cornerstone and now 52 plus. But it's a process and you have to embrace the process of it and not and you and we still see it every day with with new, new puppy owners and starting to train and they're so amped up and they're so excited. We're all guilty of it. We've all been there the first time we trained a dog. But you know, my dog is 16 weeks old and and, and I'm seeing this and I'm seeing that and what do I have to do? First off, your dog's four months old, so calm down. But that was the biggest difference.
Speaker 3:Starting Cornerstone was like understand, accept and learn to appreciate the fact that this is a process and have fun with the process. Don't get so hung up on. You know expectations at certain points, dates as far as ages and birthdays and stuff like that. Go with your dog, just trust the process. And now it's easy, right, 5 000 members later of going through cornerstone. It's very easy to fall back on that and say, look, this has worked for a lot of people. Um, and, and I've I've personally trained a lot of dogs using these, these techniques, like just just just trust the process, but that was the, that was the biggest difference, you know going.
Speaker 2:Did you find yourself early on, you know, having those questions right, especially being early on? You know, back then cornerstone was fairly new and you know the tendency is to go back to what you know what kind of pulled you through and and kind of got you saying, you know, I just need to just stick with.
Speaker 3:It was it just I mean you think about you think about in those days.
Speaker 3:You know, when cornerstone first started out and, um, you know the individuals that were in there that we talked about dog training. It was non-stop. You know, in the in the cornerstone, you know members, group and stuff like that and and the, the people that were in there at that point and then they're still there and they still chime in and help people now. But, man, there was, there was a group of people in there that was eat up with dog training and so and some, you know, had more experience than others and some were kind of like me that were really dedicated to it. But it had some experience but not as much. And so that that community and and talking with with each other, you know daily, you know, was everything when it came to just trusting the process and sticking with it and and so on and so forth.
Speaker 2:So like hey, I hope you're enjoying the episode so far. I just want to stop and ask a favor of you real quick. If you are enjoying this episode, let me know, Like subscribe, hit that notification bell, that way you can be aware of any new content that we release. And also just let me know what you're thinking. Maybe there's something that stands out to you, or maybe you just have a thought and you'd love to comment.
Speaker 3:I can't wait to see what you put in the comments and can't wait for you to subscribe. So now back to the podcast. Going back to training that first dog with Cornerstone like, just just take your time with it, embrace it and and really enjoy. Enjoy the day in, day out of it and not focus so much on that end goal. You'll get there if you just keep putting those pieces in place. You know, one foot in front of the other, um, and it may take you a little bit longer than some other methods. Honestly, like if you, if you look at it like where you can get with some methods, versus doing, say, 52 plus or or you know the original gundog program, like it, there it. That timeline may take a little bit longer, but your end result that you're going to get to enjoy for the next decade is most likely going to be better and more enjoyable. Yeah, um yeah, there's.
Speaker 2:No. There's no shortcuts to dog training. Right, you know there's. Either, if you can, you can have a band-aid over a crack or you could just feel the crack and make sure there's no gaps.
Speaker 2:And there's no gaps, that matter, for every shortcut you take is it's going to come back to haunt you, no matter what oh, yeah, yeah, especially when we're talking about hunting and situations like you guys are in, like when, uh and colin berry is a great example of this. When we released that episode with him, you know he had put in the, you know, done a fine job with his dog and and just just took his time, you know, but specifically the, the foundation that was there. I mean I don't know how many birds were landing in front of us, but I mean it was thousands and for a Labrador retriever, that's as high, strong as that dog. Milo's got a motor. He's got a motor, I think he's. Is that a red dog? If I'm not mistaken, he's got some red in him, so he's uh.
Speaker 2:I think so. Anyways, he's got a motor, he's fast and but he was restrained and Colin was relaxed himself, Like he wasn't having to wrestle with his dog, like he was just able to trust his dog. And and that right there is, like you said, um early on, if I recall, before Cornerstone. Early on, if I recall, before Cornerstone, you had had a dog that was trained to a high level, but some of those very important things were a struggle that did not allow you to have the most enjoyment. And that's one of the biggest things is that at the end of the day, it's about enjoying that retriever. We've got to take time to make sure you get to enjoy it.
Speaker 2:And this is where I want to lead us to. Next is from your perspective too, because you've got a unique perspective. You're seeing it from a higher level view, because you're inviting people into your journey of let's go hunt some ducks together, let's go kill some geese, and then, when they bring their dogs, you're getting to see from another perspective of obviously you're focused on getting the birds, but then you're seeing them work their dogs and you see how all of that ties together and you've got that, uh, that viewpoint, especially when they're coming in with a, an obedient dog, and I'm sure nothing bothers a guide more than a dog who ruins the hunt for everybody. And that and it's not just a guide, I mean that just bothers everybody.
Speaker 3:Yeah especially, and you know, was in the real world. You're paying thousands of dollars and traveling, you know hours and hours to come do something like this, like that's. That is a big thing and it we're talking about it from a guided perspective, but let's talk about it from a non-guided perspective. If you're leasing a club in Arkansas, um, and you get to go out there and hunt three times a season, um, and it's you and you know four buddies or whatever, if you have a dog or if one of your buddies has a dog, that is detracting from the hunt. It's a net negative, no matter how you look at it. 100%. And I think that is probably, you know, one of the biggest things that people overlook in the training process is I don't care how good of hunting you have, you know that dog's demeanor when it's not retrieving birds is actually much more important than how it retrieves birds, um, and its ability to sit there quietly, stay on the stand, or stay in the in the mow marsh, or or sit by your side, whatever that is um, the ability of that dog to sit there quietly and calmly and not distract you or the other hunters, um from trying to. You know, watch birds, get birds in things like that, that at the end of the day, look, I can walk out there and get the bird if I have to. I don't want to, that's why I have dogs. But if I have to I can't. But if that dog is is acting in a way in the blind, that's keeping the birds from coming in and finishing we're losing this game and that's, you know. That's one good thing about Cornerstone and you know, specifically, 52 plus is building on that, patience, steadiness, let's just call it what it is good manners from the get-go and using that as the foundation.
Speaker 3:And again, like I said, it may take a little bit longer to train a dog with Cornerstone methods.
Speaker 3:It may take a little bit longer to train a dog with with cornerstone methods.
Speaker 3:But that end product that you're going to get if you follow the steps and you follow each piece and put it together correctly, that end product you're going to get to enjoy for the next with you, that pay to go on that guided trip, and that at the end of the day, like is the probably the most underrated thing in dog training, is that steadiness, quiet, pleasure to be around and that you know that translates over to home life as much as it does the dog blind, absolutely.
Speaker 3:Yeah, how much do you think your wife is going to like that dog that she probably didn't want you to get in the in the beginning anyway? Um, you know, how much happier is she going to be if that dog will go lay down on its on its bed and and chill out, um, when you're cooking dinner and and, you know, changing the baby's diaper or whatever it is to you, you know to be a good member of the household and that steadiness and foundation and stuff like that. It's just as important there. Even if you hunt 60 days a year, it's still 305 days a year that you're not hunting when that dog's in the house.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think the most important thing about that altogether too, is that that's a dog you can enjoy, right. It doesn't matter how fast you get there. If you don't actually get there right. We're talking about thoroughly getting to the end goal, which is a dog you can enjoy, that you're proud to take to the blind and that it won't embarrass you, that you can count on, that's reliable, that's going to do the job. And if you do all that stuff right, you get the foundation right. The advanced stuff is no-brainer to you, because then you can do like I mean, we've had some pretty awesome retrieves out there with you guys because there's a lot of land out there. So there's some long, long distance, especially when the guy on the end might not. He pops that bird as it sails away. That leads to some long.
Speaker 3:Well, you think about some of those rivers, you think with the current and you know, swimming all the way across the river or birds that get in the current and go down river and man, sometimes you, sometimes you see some, you see some really experienced good dogs have some tough days my, you know, my own dogs included like it can, it can be, it can be a test for them, um, so yeah, we've seen that, we've seen that time and again. You get those windy day, especially on geese, when you shoot, shoot that goose as they're flying out, and it's already, it's already sailing with the wind and you got a 25, 30 mile per hour kansas wind and next thing, you know, that thing crumples at you know 600 yards out, like, well, we got to go get it, that's right. So yeah, but it also presents an opportunity to see some dogs do some really cool things too, and we see that happen a lot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's pretty incredible. What's been one of your biggest things on the dogs, you know, as a guide, and seeing people bring dogs Like what's one of your biggest things? That on the dogs you know as as a guide, and seeing people bring dogs like what's one of your biggest things that you that you hope to see, um, when they, uh, when they're going to bring them in outside of the stuff we just talked about?
Speaker 3:I mean that blind manners thing is huge, honestly, um, mostly as a guide and and and I kind of have a unique perspective on it as well because I not just in my guide and a hunt there's a lot of times where I'm kind of helping somebody with their dog, um, and so talking to guys ahead of time is really important from the standpoint of you know, even you might, you might have a dog that's two, three years old, four years old, um, that you've been hunting back home with and shooting you know four, six, eight wood ducks between you and your buddies, or some ring necks or something like that, and that dog may have picked up a lot of birds, but there's a big difference between that and 5,000 screaming lessers over the top of you. So really talking to those guys ahead of time and there's a big difference. I mean it's not uncommon for us to have six or eight guys shooting in a blind and if your dog's only accustomed to maybe you and one other buddy or something like that shooting, that's going to be a huge learning curve for that dog and being prepared for that and talking to the handler as well so that they're prepared for that. Because I don't want the last thing I want to see is their dog being nervous because of all that excitement and then the handler being nervous, overreact and overcorrect. And you know, because they're not used to their dog reacting that way.
Speaker 3:So you know, be prepared, you know, get your dog exposed more to that type of environment when you're training as much as possible, whether it's whether it's real gunfire or the most excitement you can inject into a training scenario calling um goose, goose calls, duck calls, all those things.
Speaker 3:But just understand, you know, even if you've got a really high-end dog, that that experience may be drastically different than anything it's ever seen before. And so be patient, be right there with your dog to really assure them that everything's okay and keep them kind of keep them calm. But you know we we've been doing this long enough now that, like a lot of these dogs that come out here and hunt with us, have been hunting with us for years and we've seen that um evolution of the dogs and colin berry is a perfect example, I mean absolutely work that he's put in with milo is outstanding. The dog that came out here and hunted with us the very first time with with him and and milo, versus the dog that came out here and hunted. Last year is not even I mean, it's pretty crazy.
Speaker 3:If I put videos side by side of those two dogs, you would not think that those were the two same dogs. But it's a testament to. It's a testament to Colin's hard work and and and Cornerstone, as far as you know, what he's been able to achieve with that dog, from where we were, what two years ago, three years ago, versus the type of dog he has now. Um, you know, if he didn't have cornerstone to utilize and to trust to get through the process of the, the struggles that they had early on, um, he, honestly, what he would have done is thrown in the towel, because that's what most people would do in that scenario if they were utilizing some of a system that didn't have the constant feedback that cornerstone has, that didn't have the community that cornerstone has, that didn't do member weekends where they could bring their dogs out and and have that interaction and and reassurance that, hey, yes, what you're going through right now is pretty normal.
Speaker 3:We all, we all kind of experience these things. Stick with it, make these adjustments. You know how many times have you been on the phone with him? A lot, right, like I mean, there's a lot of conversations there, not, and that's what I think is the difference between cga and and so other things out there. And then, obviously, what's getting ready to come up with? Building these communities into place to where Josh Parvin's not the only person that can facilitate, you know, some of these more community based events where guys like that can get that reassurance and that help in person, not just over the phone or not just a forum-type conversation, but you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we've actually got the first chapter event we're not even hosting ourselves.
Speaker 3:Nashville. I saw that pop up, I thought that was.
Speaker 2:Yeah, kevin and Seth and Ben. They went out there and got it done, told him about the vision and, uh, they already got it scheduled. So they're there. That's going to be the original, the original event. And one thing I want to pull out of what you're saying there and just for the listeners to really hone in on something too uh, you know, it's not about everything going perfect, because it's just not going to. It's not real life. It's not real life. What is Mike Tyson's quote?
Speaker 2:Everybody's got a plan until they get punched in the mouth. That's right. That's right. So it's really about what happens after you get punched in the mouth. What do you do with? That is what is going to determine whether your dog turns out and whether you get what you originally set out to get, because it's going to happen. You're going to have that moment where it's like this isn't what I was hoping it would be, and that's actually. You know.
Speaker 2:I tell people all the time when you're actually failing, you're actually successful, because that means you're moving in the right direction. If you're, if you're avoiding that failure, if you're avoiding seeing the results of it or putting yourself out there or putting yourself in those situations, well, you're not doing yourself any good because you're not going to grow, your dog's not going to get better. We need those hard moments to push through, just like we talked about with you specifically on your hunting, some of those challenges early on right Not having the big enough team or not having any team and then not having all the connections that you have now or you know all the details that you've got laid out we don't have all the things I screwed up between where you're at then and where you're now is a totally different uh ball game.
Speaker 2:And you know, success doesn't happen overnight. It's just about consistency over time and it's about being willing to be punched in the face and get back up and then do it again until you win. And that's the same thing for the dog training and, uh, you know it's. It's so cool to see that's what I love about the cornerstone members like you and just all cornerstone members that that really get it or they, they put in the work, they fail, they get back up, they keep going, and you know, and that's why I believe like we've hit on something. Here is the community what it is is. We've got a community of winners. We've got a community of people who are go-getters, who want to win, who want to be successful and they don't give up until they win. And that doesn't mean you always feel like a winner. Sometimes you feel like a flat out loser, but you just get up anyways. You get some dirt, you get some mud on your face, you get back up.
Speaker 3:Well, that's a lot easier to get up and get going when you've got other people around you doing the same thing, that are willing to help you out too.
Speaker 3:And that's where that community comes into play, because when you do have those struggles with it, you know and we're talking about dog training, we're talking about life it's the same thing. Yeah, if you get knocked down and and you don't have anybody in your corner to to help you get up and and move on to that next step or or correct that failure, whatever, like it's, it's way easier throwing the towel and be done at that point. But when you've got that community around you to say, hey, look, you know, this is what you can take away from what screwed up here and this is how you can fix it and this is how you can, you know, get over, get over that hump like that. That's the difference between going on and and saying the heck with it and and quitting. And that is, you know, has always been the strength of cga and and really is about to probably exponentially multiply with these local groups that are going to be popping up to really, oh, it's going to be cool.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm excited We've been talking about this for a long time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's finally coming to fruition. We're rounding the corner too. As we're recording this, we're on the last minute details of having everything done to where the the new cornerstone app is updated and we'll be able to have access to all that and the cornerstone members will be able to get you know. You can connect now on facebook, but there's it's not going to be anything like what's coming. Yeah, you're being able to connect legitimately and have your group of people, your tribe of people, in your area, like nashville or Birmingham or Wichita, wellington, wherever you guys are at, and it's I'm yeah, this next year of this is going to be great and you know I'm I'm excited for it. I'm really excited about all that. But I'm also excited about, you know, the connections with people hunting wise too, like I mean anybody listening to this. You know you're probably already booked up next year. I got room.
Speaker 3:I got room you got a little bit of room.
Speaker 2:Well, there you go. Well, if you're a Cornerstone member specifically I mean obviously anyone, but specifically Cornerstone member and your dog's trained, maybe you've made it through week 36 or so You've got a dog that knows how to hunt. Or maybe you've made it through all the weeks, 56 weeks. Maybe. Get a group, find a group of guys and girls and get up there with uh, with way, go put it in the test. In fact, as we get these uh, these chapters rolling, you can get your local buddies in your local chapter and and get up there and do a group hunt with Wade and and get your dog out there and the thing is you're going to eat good, danny's going to take care of you, wade's going to take care of you, wade's gonna take care of you but you're also going to have an opportunity to put everything that you've done to the test.
Speaker 2:And specifically those last four weeks of cornerstone and 56. We do a lot of the stuff we do is similar to what we're doing up there, right, and the type of hunting. We give everybody a variety of different mock hunts, but doing that before you go and then actually going and doing it. I mean, the perfect example of this is violet. We, we did not hunt her until we hunted with you. We hunted that weekend before the grind waterfowl tv hunt and we killed, we.
Speaker 3:I think she got five retreats a week she had some retreats and was around, you know, around the the hunting environment, but that was that was nothing.
Speaker 2:That was her first time, and then the river that was her first river hunt. That was her first real hunt, uh, where we're actually smashing birds and just absolutely doing well, all the conditions you know the pressure for me, uh, the pressure of we're putting it to the test.
Speaker 2:and so her handler was nervous. Uh, you know, I mean, obviously I was nervous, like, hey, we're putting cornerstone's name on the line, it either works or it doesn't. Um, not that I was nervous, you know, I mean obviously I was nervous, like hey, we're putting Cornerstone's name on the line, it either works or it doesn't. Not that I was nervous that it wouldn't work. I was nervous because it was her first real hunt.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there was a lot of exposure happening on that.
Speaker 2:We're gambling. You were a lot younger, then that's right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's been a few years now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, violet is six now, or something like that. Time flies. She was two at the time.
Speaker 3:That was four and a half years ago now. Time flies. Look at how well she handled that adversity being put through the paces of basically just 52 plus, because I mean that was the test bed for 52 plus. You had gone through the program, you know, you had built the program around her and then utilized that and going through all of that adversity and new experiences that she had never seen before, um, and was able to still successfully navigate that hunt um.
Speaker 2:so I was. I was proud of her and and and I knew the way we trained was good, like obviously before 52 plus. We had already helped about a few thousand people train their dogs with the complete gun dog academy and we had trained a lot of dogs doing all that. So I was very confident in that. But you know also, I mean, there's always the thought in the back of your mind Is it going to work? Is this going to work? Did I do everything right? Did I miss anything? And you know I was confident we didn't miss anything. But there's still that just scary thought, especially since hey, well, this is going to go on tv here and if this fails then everybody's going to say cornerstone doesn't work, even though it does work. Tv, tv not, not.
Speaker 3:Uh, yeah, that was before they went to just youtube. That was the tv tv still pursuit channel at that point. So it was still, it was still cable and and you know, and a lot, of, a lot of people saw that, but again it it was a, for I think violet was what 18, 20 months old at that. She wasn't quite too young, yeah. Yeah, she's pretty young to deal with, to deal with that many new experiences and and not shut down. You know, like, yeah, and you know it was cold, the river was up, like it was not ice.
Speaker 2:There's ice in the river. It was not.
Speaker 3:It was not a cakewalk by any means. So, you know, did really well. And it goes back to socialization and training. And the confidence you instill in a dog early, you know, is what builds to that point to where they do have that confidence to take on new things, that even though they may not have seen that specific scenario before they've won enough trying new things through training and socialization, things like that that when they do encounter those new scenarios they push forward and will push through until they're successful with it. And that's the difference between a well socialized and trained dog and one that's not because a lot of dogs in that type of scenario are going to shut down, and she did if we had not built the foundation right, if we'd not put in the work, um, that would have been a wildly different experience.
Speaker 2:She, yeah, she would have failed and it would have been a nightmare. Uh, we have been a nightmare. Uh, we should have had to get put up and and the reason I want to highlight on that is not because I'm a good trainer I want to highlight on the process. The program is what did that? I mean, yeah, and anybody.
Speaker 3:And we've seen, you've seen a lot of 52 plus dogs come out and successfully navigate those new scenarios that they've never seen before. And that's the perspective that I have. That's a lot different than most people is. You know, I get to see I may get to see more retrievers work on a hunt than maybe anybody else in the country because because our environment we do allow, we're so open with people bringing their own dogs out here.
Speaker 2:So it's not good dogs, good dogs that can do the work right. Make sure your dog is ready. Make sure your dog's ready. Don't, don't put yourself in that situation.
Speaker 3:And that goes back to the way we do things. Lydia and I are going to have those conversations with people one-on-one, you know, on the phone, prior to them coming out or prior to them even booking a hunt we're going to talk about oh hey, can I bring my dog out here? Yes, you can bring your dog out here. Let's talk about your dog and I'm going to start finding out the specifics on on your dog at that point. Um, but you know it's not uncommon. We there's several groups of cga members that put a group together and come out here and and they might have four or five dogs, uh, and we don't hunt them all at the same time, hey yeah, we've hunted a few at the same time.
Speaker 2:Two two works pretty good. Two, two at a time works great my.
Speaker 3:My favorite way to do it is to have two good dogs that are guest dogs and then chances are I'm gonna have one of my dogs behind the blind or something like that, and that's. That's not because I don't trust their dogs, but but if we do get that sailor goose or that duck that goes a half mile down the river in the current, I can take my dog and go get that bird and you can stay in the blind and keep hunting yeah, because that's a big detour when you're talking about a sailor that goes way out there.
Speaker 3:I mean that's a 40 minute detour by the time it's all said and done so I would rather, I'd rather have one of my dogs on hand to go to go clean that up so that you can stay in the blind and keep, keep hunting. So, but no, I, you know, we we've definitely hunted four, five, six dogs at a time before, and with the right dogs it's manageable, honestly, with the right handlers is more important than the right dogs in that scenario. But you know, again, having that, having that foundation of you know, a confident, a confident dog, that that is willing to to keep trying even when things get tough and when things are different, um, you know, that goes, that goes back to the program more than anything, and it's been successful for dozens and dozens of dogs that have hunted with me, that I've seen with my own eyes turn into, you know, turn into really good, good hunting dogs.
Speaker 2:That's what it's about. It's about getting out there with the community hanging out and, uh, having a good dog. Well, wade, what would? Um, from the from the dog perspective, just from a regular guy perspective, not a guide, but just from a hey, I got a dog. I always love this. This final question is we kind of wrap up, we'll have to have you back on? I just cannot believe we haven't had you on since it's crazy, but we'll have to have you back on.
Speaker 3:We got several other things we got to talk about too. We got stories.
Speaker 2:we could go for five, 10 hours I mean just today alone. We just keep doing that back to back. But what's, um, what's something you would uh say to yourself, just like a nugget piece of information, like if you weighed scheme was starting cornerstone, or or just generally starting training a dog. You got a puppy seven weeks old. What would be one piece of advice you would tell yourself, other than by the course and all that, like what, what's a little nugget, you could say hey.
Speaker 3:It's easy, man, and if I could go back, you know, if I could go back 15 years ago to tell myself this when I first started.
Speaker 3:And I tell it to people all the time now, and I kind of hit on it a while ago throw the expectations out the window. Enjoy the process itself, the wins, the losses, everything that you're doing day in, day out. Just judge those on their own merits, deep dive into that. Pay attention to what that dog is doing in each training session and pour yourself into that and just focus on the wins on each training session, um and, and how to be a better handler and how to read your dog, and do not worry about what that dog is going to do six months, 12 months, two years from now, because if you focus, if you do that, if you focus on that every 15-minute training session, day in and day out, that dog's far going to surpass what goals you ever had in mind anyway. So don't even think about that. Just think about today and what we're going to do for that 15, 20-minute training session today. Man.
Speaker 2:Well, that's a good nugget to end it on. That's solid. Yeah, we just got to keep that in the back of our minds always, always, always, remind yourself of it and way it has been an honor to have you on and, uh, just get to talk some, recount some of the hunting stories and and recount some of the dog stories and looking for I'm already thinking about kansas now. I mean, I know it's june with this heat I was literally thinking, man, I cannot wait for that cold, cold, crisp air. I can't wait.
Speaker 3:I did maybe more more excited for this season than I have been a long time, because we're all you know, we're all those ponds are filling up, all that sheet water's filling up. We can go back to one of those muddy fields like we were talking about earlier that we almost had a heart attack on. Shoot some, shoot some sheet water birds again. So I think we're we're primed to have a really good season this year. So so I'm excited too. So I appreciate it man it's probably a little overdue and looking forward to the next time we get together and do it again.
Speaker 2:Me as well. And again, it's an honor to have you on. And for those of you that are listening to this, you can find Wade pretty easy. Just search, you know, skiing outfitters. Where else can they? Where's the ways you want them to reach?
Speaker 3:out to you. How can they find you? I'm the only Wade skiing in the world, so Google it skiingoutfitterscom, type it into Facebook, type it in Instagram, whatever, um, and, and my getting in touch with me is not hard.
Speaker 2:Nah, yeah, you'll get in touch with Wade. You'll see him out there. He's very active on the on the social media land, so get in touch with him, go hunt with him and try some of Danny's cooking you. You might leave a couple of pounds heavier, but you'll be happy, I promise you that. And yeah, he's a good guy and we appreciate having you on way. We'll. We'll talk soon and can't wait till next time.
Speaker 1:Appreciate it, buddy. Talk to you soon. Thanks for listening to the build from here podcast. To learn more about retriever training or our podcast, visit cornerstone gundogacademycom slash podcast.