Act One Podcast
Act One Podcast
Producer Nick Moceri
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Act One Podcast - Episode 40 - Interview with Producer, Nick Moceri.
Nick Moceri is the founder of All Night Diner, a production company that works in film, television, podcasts, and digital media, and the co-founder of Nightlight Media, a joint venture with writer/director/producer Adam Anders. Nick is one of the producers of the recently released film, SITTING IN BARS WITH CAKE, for Amazon Studios, which is now streaming on Amazon Prime so check it out.
Nick's film producing credits include A GIRL WALKS HOME ALONE AT NIGHT (Sundance 2014), DEIDRA & LANEY ROB A TRAIN (Sundance 2017), THE KINDERGARTEN TEACHER (Sundance 2018), MADELINE'S MADELINE (Sundance 2018), STRANGE NEGOTIATIONS (SXSW 2019), and FRAMING JOHN DELOREAN (Tribeca 2019).
He was also a producer of the Bill Gates & Rashida Jones Ask Big Questions podcast.
The Act One Podcast provides insight and inspiration on the business and craft of Hollywood from a Christian perspective.
I just love artists. I love storytellers. I love the people of this business. I think that it's an industry with so many dreamers and risk takers. And as a producer, I get the responsibility and the joy of helping to facilitate the creation of art and beauty. And so the you know early interest in movies and movie making has been replaced with kind of a higher calling toward trying to create beauty.
James Duke:You are listening to the Act One podcast. I'm your host, James Duke. Thanks for tuning in. If you like what you hear, please subscribe to our podcast and leave us a good review. My guest today is producer Nick Moteri. Nick is the founder of All Night Diner, a production company that works in film, television, podcasts, and digital media, and he's the co-founder of Nightlight Media, a joint venture with writer, director, producer Adam Anders. Nick is one of the producers of the recently released film Sitting in Bars with Cake for Amazon Studios, which is now streaming on Amazon Prime, so be sure to check it out. He was also a producer of the Bill Gates and Rashida Jones Ask Big Questions podcast. Nick's film producing credits include A Girl Walks Home Alone at Night, Deidra and Laney Rob a train, The Kindergarten Teacher, Madeline's Madeline, Strange Negotiations, and Framing John DeLorean. Nick is a good friend and a smart producer. I think you're going to enjoy our conversation. Nick Maseri, welcome to the Act One podcast. It's great to have you, man. Well, thank you. It's uh pleasure to be here, Jimmy. Nick is a good buddy of mine, and um, you've got a couple things going on. You you've you've been in the business for a while. I want to make sure we touch bases and all kinds of different things, just give people a chance to know you. Um, but let's let's start with the uh the thing that's that's out right now. People can go out and uh on Amazon and see uh your latest film that you um produce. Why don't you tell people about your latest project?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so you can uh watch Sitting in Bars with Cake on Amazon Prime. It's been out uh since September 8th, and it's a movie that's uh sweet, sad, funny. It's a female friendship story, two best friends, one uh unlucky in love, the other sort of vivacious, and uh one of them gets a diagnosis that changes the course of their lives and their story, and it's based on a true story. And um, yeah, I think it's a really special film. It stars uh Yara Shahidi and Odessa Azion and Ron Livingston and Martha Kelly play the parents and a whole just really cool ensemble of actors, uh Bet Midler. Uh, this is kind of a modern-day beaches, so it was fun to have her uh in the in the cast. That's great.
James Duke:And everyone probably wants to know okay, how do you make a movie and get it on Amazon? So let's start kind of at the beginning. Um, how did this project come to you? So uh for for sake of uh clarification, you you are an independent producer, and um so you're out there kind of looking for projects, but people also bring you projects. How did how did this one come about?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so in 2016, I was making a film uh called Deidre and Laney Rob a Train, which is a underappreciated film on Netflix. It was one of the first 12 quote unquote independent films that they made as a company. People forget there was a time before uh Netflix made movies. And my producing partner on that film, who was one of the other producers on Sitting in Bars with Cake, is a woman named Susan Cartsonis, who is just an amazing veteran producer, uh had produced What Women Want and uh Beastly and all kinds of cool movies. And we were on set and she was telling me about this uh cookbook that she had optioned called Sitting in Bars with Cake. And it was about this young woman who'd uh baked 50 cakes and took them to a bar each week in LA as a you know, hoping to meet a guy. And it was kind of like, oh, okay, I like food and you know, there could be something there. And you know, at that premise, you think like could be like a romantic comedy, or is it like a reality dating series or whatever? And you know, a year or two passes, and uh Susan calls me and is like, yeah, you know, I'm headed out of town, the option's almost up on that thing. I don't know what to do with it, you don't know what to do with it. Why don't you take the writer out and you know, sort of one last hurrah, see if there's something there, and if not, we'll we'll call it a day. So I took the writer out, Audrey Schulman, who uh wrote the cookbook and it was based on her life, and we're having coffee and you know, same thing, you know, baked the cakes, met the guys, blah, blah, blah. And you know, we get to the end of our coffee meeting, and I say, uh, well, so we're like, was anything else going on in your life at the time that this all happened? She said, Oh, yeah, well, my my best friend and roommate, Chrissy, uh, was diagnosed with brain cancer, and I took care of her until she passed. And I could feel the tears start welling in my eyes. I was like, Well, that is the movie.
James Duke:That's a yeah, that's a story.
SPEAKER_02:I called Susan, I'm like, I found the movie. And she was on the phone with uh uh Suzanne, uh with Susan Farwell and uh Suzanne Farwell and Brent Emery, who were the other producers on the film with us, and and we all just got really excited. And Audrey had never written a screenplay before. Um, she was a writer's assistant on a show, and so we said, Hey, would you want to spec this and um just see what it is? And she wrote a beautiful script that was this female friendship story that was, you know, more memoir than autobiography, and we loved it, and we took it uh preemptively to Amazon Studios, uh, and it was uh came in through uh Lucia Ledene, who was a junior exec at the time, and to her boss Scott Fondis, and then to his boss Julie Rappaport, and and they uh optioned the script from us, and that was in 2018. Uh, and then the pandemic happened.
James Duke:And then and then nothing in the world happened uh short shortly after that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and then during the pandemic, you know, nothing was happening on that movie, and uh Amazon wanted to get going on development, and so we uh found our amazing director Trish C, who had done Pitch Perfect 3 and uh some movies for Netflix, and then we cast Yara Shahidi, and then from that the film was greenlit in early 2022, and then we spent about six, seven months in sort of pre pre-production casting the film and getting it ready, and then we shot it in LA uh fall of 2022, and then came out a year later. And uh, how many days shoot was it?
James Duke:I think it was a 35-day shoot. Which is fast, yeah. That's uh okay. So uh I I want to go back to something that probably people who are listening caught. Uh this is based on a cookbook. So can you can you explain a little bit? Because obviously everyone's searching for IP, you hear that all the time, right? Um your producing partner read a cookbook and just was it the title? Like, I'm just curious. Obviously, we're you you're the one that discovered the backstory. Um what was it about the cookbook that that made her think maybe there's something here that she would option it?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's a great question. And Susan got the cookbook from uh another film exec named Marybeth Sprouse, who works over at Sonya firm, and Audrey, the writer, was Mary Beth's assistant, and Mary Beth told Susan, you gotta check out Audrey's cookbook, and didn't tell her at all about the cancer of it all or any of that stuff. And I think for Susan, her brand is built around uh female films, you know, so uh female empowerment stories, their their company, Resonate Entertainment, along with Suzanne Farwell and Brent Emery. That is their wheelhouse. And so I think in this, she saw the potential for a story about a woman, a young woman who you know takes the initiative to bake these cakes. And I think she just thought, like, but again, I think it was really the title and the premise. So yeah, uh, cookbook, very, very unlikely. I think that's great.
James Duke:Uh, when you are producing with uh other producing partners, um, can you explain just for this film, for instance, what was your producing role versus say some of the other producers? Did were were what did you see yourself coming in and providing X while some of the other producers were providing Y? Or because you guys um maybe had done, you know, a couple of you had done stuff in the past, it was we're all doing everything together.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean, we so all four of us, and four is quite a few, you know, it's quite quite a few hands-on active producers. That's not always the norm. Um, but we all have a great relationship and and really approach the film as we are all on equal footing, we are all here to do the jobs, and you know, we all got the producers' guild mark, like everyone did the work to really earn that producer title, which was awesome. Um, and then as the you know, as the production and pre-production uh unfolded, we just all sort of took to different specialties, you know, someone was more in charge of business affairs, and other people got really involved in uh the costuming and and hair and makeup and and the the cake journey and storytelling, because we have a lot of cakes in this film. And um, and then but you know, we were all on set every day behind monitor, and um, you know, there's there's always gonna be different opinions. You got that many people uh working on a project together, but we all were making the same movie, and we're making the same movie as the filmmaker and the same movie as the actors, and so in that way, it really was uh it was a divide and conquer partnership as opposed to having to, you know, really relegate roles and responsibilities. I think it happened really naturally, which I think is rare, and also uh testament to uh my great producing partners on this.
James Duke:Yeah, and the film's getting a really good response. I actually read an article um about the the surge in people bringing cakes to bars and starting conversations and building friendships. Is that's gotta be fun to see stuff like that?
SPEAKER_02:It's super fun, and we got to shoot in real bars all over Los Angeles, real locations, and you know, not a ton of movies, especially of this scale, get made in LA. And for people from here, it's fun to see the real bars, the real beach, the real Capitol Records building, you know, all these things that become you know part of the tapestry of the film.
James Duke:Yeah, that's great. How did you get uh how did you get started in the business? Did you um is this a passion you discovered later in life? Did you did you want to get into film uh when you were much younger?
SPEAKER_02:That's a great question. I mean, you know, certainly the cliche is true that I loved movies growing up and all that kind of stuff, but yeah, I didn't I didn't really know that that's what I wanted to do. I I was I grew up in the Pacific Northwest outside Seattle. I was really involved in the music scene and kind of thought that was going to be a direction. Um I went to college. Originally it was gonna be for communications, maybe toward journalism. And uh we were in, I think, freshman orientation before we had to sort of declare our focus of study. And um uh a young woman who was, I think a few years older was having lunch with a few of us and going around and um asking, like, what are you gonna study or what do you want to major in? And her name was Tinkerbell. Uh, true story.
James Duke:And wait, was this the Tinkerbell or just a Tinkerbell?
SPEAKER_02:I don't know. It was it was it, I mean, in in my life, she became the Tinkerbell because she I asked her, I said, What are you studying? She said, film, and she said, How about you? And I said, Yeah, me too. And literally, like that. So I don't know if she was a guardian angel. I don't know if that's great. It's it's a semi-embarrassing story, but it's actually true, and I'll own it. But then um I moved out to LA right after school. I did not know how the business worked and kind of flamed out in about six months. And I went back east and I cooked in restaurants and painted houses, and then I was back in LA for a minute, met my wife, we got married, moved uh up to Seattle where I was from, and and started over. And so we were in Seattle, and I was, you know, in my early 20s, starting a new career in marketing and advertising, and I was managing a couple indie bands and just not sure what I was doing. You know, I was still like writing a screenplay a year and just kind of floundering, and then through a whole series of events that would take much longer than we have in this podcast to tell, um, decided to uh make another uh attempt at the entertainment industry. And so um applied to grad school, got into UCLA and and the MFA Producers program. Uh, we moved our uh young and emerging family down from Seattle. We had two kids at the time and had a third what was in grad school, and then, you know, at 30 years old, came out of the MFA program and uh started at the bottom, started as a writer's assistant and uh through a whole winding journey. Kind of thought I was headed one direction, went back into marketing advertising for a little bit, and then ended up uh producing or as an executive producer on a film called A Girl Walks Home Alone at Night, which was uh the first film from a classmate of mine at UCLA, uh Analily Amarpur, and it went to Sundance the following year, and so it was kind of an auspicious beginning uh to the producing thing. But I think that going back, I I was always a producer. I you know, I was a producer, like and and my sort of I don't know, talent set or skill set as a producer is really uh I'm a connector and I'm a problem solver. And and so I love building the team, bringing them together, uh putting out whatever fires come up and just dealing with the challenges um that arise. And then also I I just love artists, I love storytellers, I love the people of this business. I think that it's an industry with so many dreamers and and risk takers, and and as a producer, it I get the responsibility and the joy of helping to facilitate the creation of art and beauty. And so uh the you know, early interest in movies and movie making uh has been replaced with kind of a higher calling toward trying to create beauty.
James Duke:I love that. That's beautiful. No pun intended. Unwrap that a little bit. Uh, I think I'd be I think our audience would be curious to know what is that what does that look like practically uh for you replacing making movies with creating beauty? What is that what does that look like?
SPEAKER_02:Well, first of all, I think it uh on one level it frees me from the binary of like I have to make movies or television series or whatever, and you can uh expand that into so many other areas. I mean, right? It could be could be a nonprofit, could be a podcast, could be visual art, it could be all kinds of things. And I think that we in a world and time when we get so focused on content and there's just an endless stream of just stuff to watch and consume often mindlessly, um the idea of trying to create something that has some lasting value and meaning um is really what I'm trying to get after. So then how do I, you know, how does that look practically? Certainly it means saying no to a lot more things. So as I have opportunity to do projects, I really put it through the lens of like who are the people involved, what's that potential relationship to build? What is a story? What is the emotional truth of this story? What purpose does it serve? Is it medicine or is it poison? Is it adding to the bank of uh cinema? Is it a deposit or is it a withdrawal? And so that becomes part of the rubric that I and the lens that I I start to see these things through. Um and then it's also just you know, practically it's like, am I gonna show up each day and try to bring that? Like, am I gonna try to strive for that or is it just a paycheck? And believe me, there are way easier ways in this world to make money than independent. We are the only people on uh you know, a budget or a call sheet who do not have health insurance, who do not have a union, who you know, so it's what it is. So um but yeah, I think that uh and I think you can do this at any level. Like I don't think this has to be for a streamer, for a studio. I mean, you can do this independently, you can also do this on YouTube, you can do this on Instagram, and I think that um uh when you or at least for me, when I think about it in terms of this idea of creating beauty, that doesn't also mean that I have to agree with everything that is stated in this, like, but I think their conversations are worth having, or I think that it's um art that's worth making because even art that uh represents a worldview or a point of view that that you don't agree with, you can learn from it and you can appreciate or at least build empathy for like what is that worldview, what is that perspective, why does that exist? And uh I really care more about the relationships that I get to make along the way in making the films than I do necessarily the stories themselves. I mean, obviously that's still important to me too, but yeah, that's kind of how I look at it. I love that.
James Duke:There's a lot there's a lot of really good wisdom in in what you just said. I I I'm curious when you are considering projects and you're kind of taking things through this this filter, which you know you just described a kind of multi-layered filter there. There's got to be days when nothing makes it through the filter, and you've still got to pay the bills, right? So I know you and I have talked in the past about um kind of like the modern producer's tool belt of just being able to do different things. Um kind of explain to our audience you kind of your philosophy on that, being a little bit of a little bit of a renaissance man, a little bit of a utility guy. Um just your advice to, you know. People who are interested in getting into the business, what should they be aware of in terms of the skills as they're looking to create art and beauty, but maybe it's going to take some time. What should they be doing maybe in the meantime?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and I think that's great. And going back even just a bit in terms of there is you know, not a lot of stuff makes it through the filter. And I really do try to think about like these things take so long. I mean, sitting in bars with cake was oh, I don't know, six, seven years in the making. And so you're gonna be working with these collaborators for so long. And so you have to work with people that you like and that you respect and that you can get along with. And I've made the mistakes of partnering uh with people on projects, projects that never saw the light of day, that were just bad fits. And they were either bad fits from a character level or just from just a taste level, and then also just a sometimes it's a personality level, right? There's nothing wrong with the people or the project, it's just not a fit. And so that's you know, another sort of way that I look at these things. And then I think that especially with independent producing, but I think also screenwriting or anything, um, you know, it's really hard to make a consistent living at this. I mean, I've been in this business making films for the last oh man, I mean 14 years or so. And in that time, most of my money has been made in things other than filmmaking. And yeah, so because of my marketing and advertising background, I uh will consult and do media consulting. So I consult uh with companies like Nike and um did some consultation for the uh Academy Museum that opened a couple years ago. And uh and really that's just about keeping the lights on, right? And so I think having other skill sets and things you can do or other ways that you can make money uh to stabilize yourself is hugely important because this whole business is a marathon, it's not a sprint. And and some people are gonna sprint ahead and um and that's fine, but it's so up and down. So, how do you sort of smooth out the waves? And you know, so for writers, they'll often get the job, but then that assisted job will take up 50, 60, maybe 70 hours, there's no time to write. Whereas could they be better off building a career skill set with another job that pays the bills, keeps them employed and fed and all this stuff, but leaves their mental space free to write and create and using that downtime. And so I think, yeah, having skills to weather the lean times is is really important. Um and also just being patient with it, you know, to know that it's you know, it may not happen quickly, but there's still a way to make it happen. And then on top of that, then I think it's so important to have community around you that uh you can celebrate each other's wins, that you can mourn each other's losses, um, because wins and losses are coming for all of us. You know, there are so many times when you think you're riding high and riding that wave, and then you know what, that wave's gonna crash. And it doesn't mean that you're just sitting around waiting for the other shoe to drop, but like it's just life, you know, you don't know what's coming.
James Duke:Yep. That's it's oh man, you're speaking speaking some wisdom right now. Uh uh uh and I do think that that uh you're touching on something that is so important is uh I don't know of anyone in the independent producing space that isn't kind of one fisting it because they because you have to have your you know, in one fist you've got uh you know the projects that you're working on, but another fist you're having to, you know, have a um, like you said, consulting work, marketing, you know, whatever. Yeah. And and I think that that's important to remember, especially if you're going to be uh as you were describing it, uh picky, you know, that you're not you're not just trying to um and and there's nothing wrong with people who just like, hey, I just want to get out there and hustle and work every single day. That's great. And they're just putting content out there and they're just shoving it out there, and good for you know, so be it. Absolutely. And that's that has its own challenges. But um, but when you're trying to find stuff that is is trying to that's that's fits more of your taste and your interest and your passions, it's naturally gonna um eliminate other kind of projects. And I often tell people all the time, like I there's nothing wrong with saying no to projects, but there's also nothing wrong with saying yes to like one of the biggest problems I think for uh young and upcoming producers is um they only want to say yes if Steven Spielberg calls, like that they're waiting on you know Warner Brothers to call them, right? And it's like, no, your friend is producing a podcast, maybe you should say yes to that. Uh one just because they're your friend, not just any Yahoo, but or you know, you have a buddy who you like and they're making a short film and they need your help. Like, there's there's places that we need we need to develop our skills, and we should utilize the relationships that we have and the the contact the context that we're in. So for you, I mean you went to UCLA, but um do you feel like um you kind of learned from school of hard knocks, just um learning through doing? Do you like what where do you think you began to kind of um really start to get a grasp on on film specifically? Uh was it was it in school or or was it through when you've some of your earlier projects?
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think it uh I think it goes back to I've always been a naturally curious person and I'm always someone who's willing to just like jump in and learn as I go and figure it out along the way. And so UCLA was a great sort of safe space between sort of my previous career and the one I was trying to to do, and it and it gave me some credibility so I could just pick up the phone and call people and get meetings and meet new people. And so um, and uh certainly I learned things there, but you know, until you put those things to practice, you don't know how it all works. Um and so yeah, I mean it is just it is learn as you go, but I think it really just requires like always being a student, you know. I think as a producer, it's my job to know a little bit about everything that's happening in every department. And if you think that you're too good for some role of responsibility or you're just not interested, like it's not gonna go well for you. And I think that that curiosity really does help build and breed empathy. And if you are curious and an empathetic person, I think it allows you to develop closer relationships and so that when the the problems and challenges arise, you can meet them. And and that also means that you say, you know, I'll be the first one to raise my hand and say, I don't know. I don't know what that means, or I don't know how to do this thing, but I'm committed to figuring it out, you know, and and that's something it's the same commitment that I make my kids as I do the the people on the crew, which is uh, whatever the problem is, I am committed to figuring it out with you. Just don't hide it from me. Like, just tell me, you know, like I may get upset, but I'd rather have someone who is upset and committed to sticking with me to figuring out the solution to a problem, than someone who is just chill and uh uninterested in you know in who I am and or someone who just doesn't care enough to to want to stick it out.
James Duke:That's good. I I I'm curious. We often hear uh I'll you know, I'll ask interviewing different people about this kind of stuff in terms of uh what do you you know what do you think makes a good producer or or whatever. But let me ask you this what do they not know about producing that you want them to know? What what is it that they should be considering that maybe up to now they haven't when it comes to making um film?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, uh, I think a few things. I mean, one, I think that nothing wants to be created, like everything wants to not be created, like everything in the world wants to tell you no, like you have to force creation, like creation is a violent act, and so you have to have that perseverance and commitment and determination to just see it through.
James Duke:Yeah, I think a lot of people who who's that quote? I can't remember films are not made, they're born. I can't oh I love that. I don't know who that is.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so that's that's a big one, and then I think the other thing is people shouldn't wait to create. And I hate that that rhymes and it really upsets me. Um that's the title of this podcast episode. Wait to create. Don't wait to create. Don't wait to and uh it's we especially as producers, is like we'll create almost these insurmountable obstacles, and it's like, wait, is there another way to make this thing? Like, how do I just get this thing generated? So do I need to narrow the scope, narrow the focus? Also, like what do I have at my disposal? Like, I like to play the game with myself. Like, if I had to make a film with my phone in my yard, what would it be? Right. And you start to like give yourself these narrow parameters and challenges, kind of shrink the box, and and you can come up with all kinds of creative ideas and they're makeable, you know. I think uh one of my favorite books on filmmaking is the Duplas Brothers book, like brothers. And regardless of whether you're a fan of their films or whatever, like their practical approach to filmmaking, like make something that costs zero dollars in your dining room, submit it to a film festival, then if it, you know, like just kind of expand from there. And then also the idea that the Calvary is not coming, like you have to be the Calvary. And so I think for producers, filmmakers, writers, we often wait for permission to do things, and you can't. You cannot wait for permission. You have to find ways to just keep moving things forward, and it doesn't mean you don't hit dead ends, and sometimes projects fall apart and things happen, but uh you have to just keep pushing.
James Duke:Such good advice. I yes, keep pushing forward, keep doing stuff, but Nick, I keep failing, right? Like I I I I I can't seem to to make it work, I can't seem to right like my stuff isn't connecting with people. I um, you know, you you hear people who are struggling for whatever reason. And uh, you know, look, I know you're a man of faith. Um you've obviously, you know, part of like you were talking about this business, the highs and the lows. One of the big things that I think doesn't get discussed enough if you want to work in this business is you have to have very thick skin. Yeah. And you have to uh be able to weather the really bad storms, uh deal with disappointment. So for you, how have you dealt with disappointment? How have you dealt with you you're obviously you're a family guy, you have kids you have to take care of. Um, have there been seasons in your life where you've wanted to pack things in, pack things up and what what how have you dealt with disappointment?
SPEAKER_02:Well, I mean, yeah, I mean, absolutely, you know, having uh spiritual foundation is is very helpful in terms of you know having something that you can rely on in dark times. But yeah, I mean, there's been so many seasons of disappointment. I mean, uh in 2015, started two companies and immediately found myself wrapped up in a lawsuit for a year. Like I thought that was it, you know, and it got settled and learned a lot in the process. Um, but you know, that was a moment where I thought it was over. I was, you know, fresh out of grad school, writer's assistant on a TV series, thought I was on the first rung of the ladder of becoming a writer, writer, producer. And a year later, the show gets canceled late. None of us could find jobs. I had three kids. The pilot I was developing with fancy producers didn't sell and was out of work for six months, and I could see the end of the bank account, and I had to go take a job. And so I had to dust off the resume and go get a job in marketing and and uh got to work for a very cool marketing company down in Playa Del Rey, but that was an hour to sometimes two-hour commute. And I remember every day driving to work saying, Thank you for this job. I do not want this job. And it was just this, like, you know, uh yes, I mean it was just heavy. And so having community around you that you can weather those storms is really helpful. And then, you know, you said thick skin. I think part of it is yes, thick skin, but also just not taking it personally, knowing that it's not personal. And you know, uh, I I would like to believe that people are trying the best they can. I don't know if that's always true, but at least I try to believe that about people, and and we don't know why things don't happen, right? You know, for an actor like they don't know why on that day they didn't get picked, you know, it's not a meritocracy, this whole business. And so you've got to find purpose outside of the work, you know, and whether that's a faith or uh uh, you know, a pursuit, an enjoyment, a pastime, I don't know, you know, like I think you gotta choose carefully what you're gonna give that imports in your life to, but you know, whatever that is for people, uh, you know, they gotta test that out and and see what can hold them up in the face of that kind of disappointment. But yeah, I mean, I've had so many movies that I thought were on the finish line that just never came, right? The money was there, the cast was there, and they go away, you know, and with the best of intentions. I mean, I had a film that we had set up at a studio in December of 2019. And come March of 2019 or of 2020, the pandemic hits, uh, all the execs get fired. The film never sees the light of day, you know. And it was with a great director and a great screenwriter, and we had great executives, and and you know, they're all people that I still you know consider to be friends. Um we all gave it our best, right? And and yet things out of our control, uh and and then the truth is nothing's in our control, right? I mean, we can only do the best we can with that day and what we have in front of us, and then everything else you like. I mean, regardless of people's, you know, personal uh beliefs or spiritual beliefs or whatever, like if we work in the film business, we all operate with a ton of faith. Like it is just it all of it is an exercise in faith because it every movie is gonna throw something at you, every creative endeavor is gonna throw some challenge at you, and you've got to find a way to just keep moving forward. I mean, on Sitting Bars with Cake, we were in our last week of production shooting at the Roosevelt Hotel. Uh, we had originally scheduled that shoot date in that location at the beginning of the shoot, but then they had a scheduling conflict, so it got pushed and pushed and pushed to our last week. And then we're out of time, like there's no more time past that week. And the Monday we show up to shoot, uh, it's the opening scene of the film. It's a it's a poolside cocktail party at night. It is pouring down rain. It's one of the few rainy days in Los Angeles. And we got there and it was like, oh, all right, what do what do we do? Like, talk about disappointment. And so we had we had some stuff to shoot in the interior that morning, and we're like, well, I guess we just set it up and see what happens. And sure enough, like we've we finished the first scene, we break for lunch, it's still pouring. You know, the grips are are like setting up C stands and tarping everything. We break for lunch, uh, and at five o'clock we come back. Uh, and for people not in the industry, lunch happens six hours after you start shooting. So sometimes you eat lunch at noon, sometimes you eat lunch at two in the morning. It doesn't matter. So on that day we had lunch at four o'clock in the afternoon. Uh, and at five o'clock, the skies parted. We got a free wet down of all the thing. And so some days it falls your way, and then other days, you know, I I've been on movies where you get the call in the middle of scouting and and the actor has an illness or the actor can't do it. And so yeah, yeah, I mean, disappointment is just is just a fact of the business. And so um, you've got to have good coping skills, good foundation, good community, um, and just expect that it's gonna come, right? Like, I mean, something's coming for all of us, just in life, whether it's illness or tragedy, and I mean, right, we look at the events happening in the world. I mean, whenever you listen to this, and I say the events happening in the world, you'll fill in some blank, right? And uh fortunately, yeah, right. And that's just that's that you know, it's easy enough to go, well, it is what it is, and yet we still have a choice and the agency to show up and respond to that. And so are we gonna respond with hope and are we gonna respond with love, or are we gonna respond with despair and and apathy, and the hard work is showing up, and that and that's what I endeavor to do. And I don't always do it well. And I mean, literally, was it uh yesterday? I was sitting on my back porch, trying trying to put together the next movie and just going, man, I am only getting what I need for this day and nothing more. Like, this is hard, you know, and like because I can't I can't control the elements and just sort of like sitting there in the sun, going like, all right, this is this is the day, you know, and sometimes you've sent all the emails you can send and you've made all the phone calls you can make and you've had all the meetings you can do, and then you just have to make like Princess Elsa and let it go.
James Duke:Yes, which I think is a superpower for some people. I don't know how they're able to do it, but yeah, if you can, whoo, baby, sometimes you just gotta let it go. That's really good. So you you've actually uh one of the things I think is really neat about your career is you've actually had like three or four of your films premiere at Sundance, which to me is that's Pretty cool. It's somewhat unusual. Um what's the Sundance process like for a filmmaker? You your very first film got into Sundance. Um, and uh what what's that like? And and does it have the same from your perspective? Does it carry the same um effect that it that it once did?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean, I haven't been there in a minute, so I you know, I still think it's one of the few really important film festivals um in the world. So I still think it does have an effect. Um, and I think it's finding new life post-pandemic. Um, we had submitted a girlwalk someone at night originally to the Venice Film Festival with a much longer cut. I think it was like a I don't know if it was the two or two and a half hour cut of the film, but we didn't get in. And so we made some hard choices, cut that thing down to its final runtime, which I think is an hour 45 or so, and we got into Sundance, and you find out typically the week right before the week after Thanksgiving, and then you scramble to finish the film and get your flights and get there. And and so it was, I mean, it's just so special to be there in the snow in Park City. You're surrounded by people who are there who love movies or who are making movies. Um, and so that was an incredible experience, and that was in 2014. And then, you know, a year, two years later, I don't have the next film going. I'm trying, right? You're developing things, and I saw how hard it was to get films made. And a buddy of mine had come up with this idea of uh essentially he he was a producer on Girl X Honey, and he saw how hard it was for films who get into those film festivals, whether it's Sundance or South by Southwest, um, to finish those films in time. And so he had this idea of like, well, what if you could raise some money as a finishing fund for festival films? That's a alliteration mouthful right there. So it was a film festival film finishing fund. And uh, and you know, you're de-risking it because the film's already gotten to a festival. You could sit alongside the other equity investors and and not be a predatory lender, and and kind of everyone wins, right? You get a credit on a movie, you help the film, jump filmmaker. And so in 2017, uh, I went out and started looking for that money and and found uh a film financier uh with a company called Public House. And so we started a film finishing fund. And so in 2018, when or 2017, uh November, when the announcements came out about Sundance 2018, we reached out to filmmakers and just said, hey, we've got money and we're here to help. And could we be of help? And so we then came on uh film called Madeline's Madeline from Josephine Decker, who's an amazing filmmaker. We came on um, or we we participated in uh the kindergarten teacher, the Maggie Gyllenhall film. Um, and then from there, so then we're at Sundance and we got to sort of enjoy the the Sundance process and accolades and credits, and then um, and then we helped a film uh called Framing John Jalorian that went to Tribeca and and so we just did this a few times and it was a way to uh gain credits, but also help films, and um, and they had already gotten into the film festival, and so it was a way to, you know, essentially uh in an honorable way ride those coattails and and benefit from it, you know. And they were still films that we really believed in and were of a quality mark. So that was yeah, I mean, that's that's how we did it. And then with Deidre and Laney Robert Train, that one, um, our filmmaker Sidney Freeland had come out of the Sundance Labs in the Native American labs and had had her first film, Drunk Town's Finest, at Sundance in 2014, the same year that we were there with Girl Walks on One at Night. And so she had a relationship with the film festival. We submitted the film to them, and then we premiered uh in 2017 with that film.
James Duke:That is really interesting. The that film funds is a whole other kind of rabbit hole we could rabbit trail we could go go down. But um, the satisfaction of seeing something, you know, from completion from beginning to end. That's that's one thing. But being able to come in and help a filmmaker um kind of finish things up, that that that feels you know different. That's a different type of uh maybe itch that you're scratching. Um, what was that like uh as a as a as a storyteller, as a filmmaker?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean, I loved it because you're helping someone in that last mile, right? When they're out of gas or out of money or you know, on fumes, and and you get to be this kind of jolt of energy that helps them to accomplish their goal. And so in that way, it's it's super satisfying. And then from that, you that becomes the start of the relationship, even though you're coming in at the end of the film, it's a new beginning for a new relationship. Um that I, you know, I've seen paid dividends uh already just in my career, and and it and it continues the narrative of kind of who I am as a producer, which is I am someone who I think operates with integrity and has strong character and really is a positive force. Like I'm there to help, and that's how people see me. And I'm also not afraid of a challenge. So for better and for worse, I get sent very challenging and difficult projects. And uh, and it's also because I have sometimes unique taste. Um, but to me, those are the fun ones, like those are the ones like you know, uh working hard to make something great that people love, like that's worth it, you know. And and uh I think we're in a we live in a time where there's so many different niche audiences, and so giving some creating something that a specific group of people just really, really loves, I think is a wonderful gift. I mean, this summer we saw this film uh Theater camp, which is this really fun mockumentary, and my wife and I went, you know, probably two weeks after it was out on a Tuesday night. We're like, hey, let's go see this movie, and we went to this movie theater, it was sold out. I mean, we we got tickets, but like it was a sold-out screening, and it was all of these like theater camp and theater enthusiasts who were just like so excited to feel seen and laugh at themselves and the jokes and that, and like seeing that, I was like, Oh, like there are so many audiences and and so many specific audiences, and I think that the more specific that filmmakers can make their film for an audience, the better it is. I think when you try to make something for everyone, you make something for no one. Um, and there's exceptions, right? I mean, you know, films like uh Barbie or Oppenheimer connected on a huge level this year. Um, but even those films are made with a lot of specificity, like that the the those weren't just crowd pleasers, so to speak. Like there's a lot of artistic intent in them. And and especially in a film like Barbie, it's harder to see because of the the glossiness to the whole thing.
James Duke:But um But there's a div there's a defined POV in both of those films. Like Barbie, Barbie is clearly coming from not just any filmmaker. I think what you're I think I think what I'm taking for what you're saying is it's that particular filmmaker's POV. Now, that particular filmmaker's POV could be someone like uh Christopher Nolan, yeah, who is like the modern day Spielberg, even though Spielberg's still around. I'm not disrespecting Spielberg. Uh but he is he is a you know, Nolan makes, you know, he's a popular, right? He makes populist films, right? For for for just like Spielberg kind of just made films, these big kind of big films that everyone wants to go see. And Greta Gerwig has now entered into that realm. Amazing. Yeah. But you're right. I mean, uh, I love I love that advice about being specific because it's really about it really is about that POV. I I I think it was I've I've maybe said this before on the podcast, but I think it was Steve McQueen or someone who's the the filmmaker Steve McQueen who said um film film is film are empathy machines. And the idea of of soliciting and invoking empathy between the audience and the subject matter, um, that is something that we all strive when we sit in front of when we go to the movie theater to watch something. We're looking to go into a world, enter into a world, but that world is from a very particular point of view. And you may agree with it or not agree with it, but the one thing you have to in order for it to be a good film is we have to feel something. Yep. Right? We have to feel something. And uh, and I think that uh all all great filmmakers know that, and they're willing to go there with their audience. And I think that's that's a it's a simple truth, but a profound truth for aspiring filmmakers. Tell us, don't just tell us a story, tell us the story from your perspective, tell us that story from your opinion, right?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean, one of the best examples I've seen of it recently was the FX series Reservation Dogs. That show is unbelievable. So my wife and I watched the first season. Um, you know, Sterling Harjo's a creator, along with uh Taekwite TD, exec producing, and that first season was just cool. It just felt like jazz, just like here's someone doing something cool, really specific to this native culture in Oklahoma. And it was fun just to kind of like watch and walk in that world. And then we kind of slept on season two. It was it came out when I was making sitting in bars with cake, and then they just wrapped up their third and final season. So we went back and watched season two and three, and like that show is so specific and so inside baseball into native culture, and yet, like, just the themes of community and love and friendship and relationship, like by the end, like we were crying, and then I was also I didn't want to watch the last episode because I didn't, I didn't want to say goodbye to these characters. It's like, oh my gosh, like I love this community, I love these people, and I'm not Native American and I uh don't have a lot of experience with that culture and that that people group. And even though there was all sorts of stuff that was very uh foreign to me as a viewer, uh the love and care that that the the creators of that show had for the character, for the authenticity, for the specificity is what drew us in. And I think that so you know, watching something like that is is just so rewarding and compelling. And and like, you know, like you said, it's that empathy machine.
James Duke:Yes. I feel that way. My wife and I just finished the bear, the bear, season two of the bear. Absolutely. And I so good. The first first season there were a couple episodes when I thought Richie was kind of funny, but after a while, Richie started to get on my nerves. Sure. But but by the end of season season two, it's like I would die on a hill for Richie. I just it's like, you know, you just come to love these characters. Uh uh, yeah, it's just uh uh that's that's that's the sign I think of really good, really good filmmaking, really good writing.
SPEAKER_02:Um and I think it speaks to the moment we're in, which is we're we we celebrate, and and look, I think those are hard shows and films and things to get made, but like that specificity, that point of view is so important. So for filmmakers, for producers, for writers, whatever it is, like bring yourself, like that is what people want. And also go live life and experience things that that give you that strong of a point of view. Like, you know, so whatever your interest in, whatever your weird wiring and ingredients are in your makeup, like bring that, you know, like that's what people want. And you know, back to an earlier point you made in terms of like, you know, some people find that they're failing over and over, things aren't clicking. Well, like then make it for you, or find people whose feedback you trust and and figure out really like what is going on, like what am what am I missing? Like, what's not connecting? And we do that even on films. I mean, that's why we screen films for audiences and and get feedback. Like, there just are times when you're too in the weeds of your own creativity to know what is and isn't working. And so having you know, thoughtful, trusted, constructive voices around you who will give you honest feedback about your artistic work, but sometimes also just about yourself. Like, yeah, dude, you're a jerk, or you are no fun to work with, or you've got to, you know, stop being so serious. And and it's always hard for us to have objectivity about ourselves, but I think having those voices uh around us is so important.
James Duke:Amen. I I couldn't agree more. In fact, I often say, um, especially to our Act One alums and students, I say, you know what, surround yourself with people who are better than you. Like you're just you're not going to get better if you're constantly around people who are at your level or below. Um, surround yourself with people, be the least talented person in the room. And it forces you. Like I remember when I was a kid, that's how I learned how to play basketball was I always had to play with the older kids. And everyone was bigger and taller and stronger than me. And I and if I wanted to compete, I had to, I had to get better. Like I had to learn how to, when somebody who was bigger than me bumped me off the blocks, I had to be learn how to stand my ground. It took time, but eventually, I was a bean pole back then. I've changed a lot, but um, but uh and that and I feel like it's the same way as filmmakers, as storytellers, like is get in there and compete in the with the in the in the realm of ideas and the realm of story with people who are just really, really good at it, and it will it will make you better over time.
SPEAKER_02:For sure. And you know, don't pretend you know everything, like you don't have to, it's okay, you know. So I'm I was so lucky on Deidre and Laney, Robert Train to get to work with Susan Cartonas. I mean, she was a studio executive and had been in a producer, studio films, independent films, and I just got to learn so much from just watching her work, listening to her on a phone call, watching her handle herself. And in that way, you know, I it it just taught me a ton. But then also part of that, you know, relationship was I will do uncomfortable grunt work things, I will take the the you know unsexy parts of particularity if you will share your wisdom for me. And so I think you know, making whatever those relationships are mutually beneficial is also really important too. And uh I think you know people can forget that.
James Duke:You talked a little bit about well, actually, we didn't talk. I wanna wanna I want to touch basis on um sitting in bars with cake. Um, you know, it's on Amazon, and then of course, uh some of your other films. Um, you have some on Netflix. I I'd love for you to talk about just the current world we're living in right now with distribution, um, the challenges of making something and getting it out there to the audience because uh it's like we're gonna record this podcast and 50 things are gonna change by the time it comes out. Absolutely. It's just it's just constantly evolving and changing. Um, so one, how did you got because you said you went with Amazon Studios. That's I'm assuming that's why it ended up ended up on their platform. But what a lot of people don't understand is there's a there's a challenge to the streamers. And I wonder if you can kind of talk a little bit about this, and that when a film gets put into theaters, uh, you know, prior to streamers. So prior to streamers, the goal was to get movies into into theaters. And if you got into theaters, then you would then you could then exploit the film later through a uh uh and so ancillary markets, whether it's foreign or DVD sales, whatever, eventually television, all that kind of stuff. Um, and with that came the opportunity to maybe make money in all those different categories, uh, maybe some more lucrative than others. With streamers, it's a little bit different. What's the pros and cons, in your opinion, and just just living the real world, the films that you have put out there, of uh getting your film out in the marketplace uh with streamers via streamers versus via the more traditional route or maybe some other way, um, just in terms of the economics of it, how it works and how it doesn't work?
SPEAKER_02:Sure, yeah. I mean, I think with the the pro to the streamers like a Netflix or Amazon is it's a one-stop shop. So you know from the beginning that you have distribution, you know that the checks are gonna clear. It's you know, one you know, one studio, one buyer, uh it yeah, it's just super simple in that way. And they all do they also have their own internal infrastructure for marketing and all those kind of things. Economically, you give up potential upside. Um you know, there is no back end, there's no sort of reward in success. Um they'll sometimes do uh essentially a a buyout, um, which gives you a little bit more than what you would have made normally. And you know, so to use a sports analogy, uh, you know, unless you're a really, really top big producer for those streamers, you know, it's a single or a double, right? You get to you made your thing, you probably get to make another one if it's well made. Um and there you go, you know, and and like and they those platforms have giant audiences, and so there is a potential picture many more people than you might be able to theatrically. However, uh sometimes it's sort of like if a tree falls in the woods, doesn't make a sound, you know. These things come out, there's so much stuff that comes out that it's really easy to miss them. And you know, especially in a moment where we have uh labor strikes in Hollywood, like there's no actors to promote these things. And so how do you get eyeballs on things? It's it's very challenging. I think that with the theatrical model, um, you have to really be thoughtful about uh how much you're spending on the film because you're gonna maybe spend double that in marketing. And then is there an audience that'll support that? And do they come to theaters? And so more risk, more reward. You know, if you make uh Barbie that makes$1.5 billion, well, that was worth every it went on it and you know, tenfold. But then you make a movie like The Creator, which has a ton of artistic merit, it just didn't find its audience, and you know, that's gonna be uh a write down in probably the the tens of millions. I mean, maybe it finds another life on streaming or whatever, but um that's tricky. And then independent film, you know, I'm my next film, like we are building it old school independent, where it's you know, you we're selling territories one by one. Here's the domestic sale. Here's Greece. Here's you know, the Middle East and Spain. And and then you're finding a senior lender to lend against those pre-sales. And then you've got to find your equity investors. And then you've got to, you know, build your cast. And, you know, it's it's a much more modestly budgeted film. And yeah, you might get lucky and that film is a little sunshine or something that just you know explodes and goes crazy and and you know makes everyone a ton of money. But more likely it's about you know starting a filmmaker's career and and making something that you then get to make the next thing with, or developing relationships with these actors. So it's it's very, very difficult. I think that um we're seeing new distribution platforms, we're seeing new uh ways of making films. I think some of the stuff that uh Angel Studios is doing with crowdfunding is uh interesting. We'll see if it's sustainable and and what it does. So I think I I'm always interested in people who are innovating. Um but yeah, it's it's it's it's all tricky and it's not easy. And as a producer, you know, we don't get paid until the film goes into production. So that's you know, I I tell people I have nothing but free time, meaning all my time is for free because I ain't getting paid.
James Duke:Um literally, literally free time free time. That's funny. Now, like, and and just to help people understand, uh obviously you don't have to give specific numbers, but um for it's like uh streamers will do to help people understand, right? They'll do like cost plus right. So they'll do cost plus 30. So say for instance your film cost a million dollars, a streamer would would then purchase that film um in perpetuity uh for 1.3 million dollars, which means all the cost. So if the cost of your film was a million dollars, uh you now get$300,000 that gets split among whoever gets right.
SPEAKER_02:Investors, producers, the talent, yeah.
James Duke:So this is why the numbers aren't as big as some people assume, um, especially in the indie world. Uh, and and and then you can't you then can't take the film and exploit it with DVD sales or Blu-ray sales um uh to make kind of extra money. And so that's why you want to get that really good deal and why you have to weigh, right? That go in the streamers route because you get, you know, whatever it is, 120 million eyeballs. People who would never even have a chance maybe to see your film now get a chance to watch your film, but it might be at the cost of maybe, just maybe, like you said, kind of throwing that dice and maybe making potentially making more if you want another route. That's right. That's such a that's just a bigger gamble.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's a bigger gamble, and sometimes you don't have the choice except to take the thing that's right in front of you, like you know, like I've made plenty of not great deals in to just get things made. And you hopefully, as you you know, as your career develops and you progress, you can make increasingly less worse deals.
James Duke:And and a lot and a lot of investors might at this point prefer streamers because everybody can see what they helped make, as opposed to maybe if it if it came out on in a theater in Sheboygan, they not everybody gets to see it or something, right?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, for sure. And I mean my job as a producer is you know not only deliver the film at the highest quality level I can, it's also to get my investors their money back, you know. So you've got to be pragmatic.
James Duke:It's a business, yeah. You know, it's the movie, it's the business part of the movie business. I wanted to ask you about this kind of little fun project that you did. A lot of people don't know. You were talking about how, you know, you've got to, you know, if if if in between projects you're waiting on something and you know, you gotta pay the bills, you gotta get something done. And I remember you and I were talking, it was I think during the pandemic, and a little project came your way, and a lot of people might not be aware that you were a part of it, but there was a brief period of time when I I'm pretty sure you were the producer, I think it was the biggest podcast in the world for at least a brief period of time. Uh, you want to talk about that experience? You you you did a podcast with Bill Gates and Rashida Jones?
SPEAKER_02:I I did, yeah. So um, you know, my background in marketing and advertising in Seattle uh did a lot of work with um Microsoft, and um one of my uh sort of bosses and mentors was this guy, Ian Saunders, up in Seattle, and uh he had sold his agency after we had moved to LA, and he has been working for um Gates Ventures, which is Bill's uh creative content company, um, separate from the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation uh for about the last decade. And we'd stayed in touch and done a few little projects here and there, some editorial stuff. And uh in I think July of 2020, I get a call out of the blue and essentially said, Yeah, uh Bill wants to do a podcast, do you want to produce it? And I said, uh, yes, except if I were you, I would not be my first phone call because I've not produced a podcast, and essentially said, Well, you know, we trust you, we know that you'll figure it out and and we'll figure it out together. And so um, we brought in an amazing experienced podcast team um as the team behind the podcast criminal, and uh and then we brought in Rashida Jones as a co-host, and so we did six episodes of Bill Gates and Rashida Jones Ask Big Questions, which yes, for a time was the number one podcast on Apple. And um, you know, there there were a number of other great producers on that podcast, including uh David Sanger and some of the other team from Gates Ventures. Um and so you know, I was one part of that team that got to produce this thing, and it really was just about you know, how do we facilitate vital conversations at a time when people were really struggling for interesting and and quality information? And and Bill is really an optimist about the world and um complicated guy for sure, but he really does endeavor to want to do uh good things and see change and and help people. And so we had um Dr. Fauci on when we were in the middle of the pandemic, and and that's what I was gonna ask you.
James Duke:Was it in the middle of uh like so? Were you guys were you guys in the room together at all, or were you remote?
SPEAKER_02:So it was all yeah, it was all done via Zoom and it and we recorded it between August and uh October, November of 2020, and it came out in November of 2020.
James Duke:So, what kind of challenges did you have to face working remotely? I mean, obviously a podcast is not a film, but but um that must have that m that must have had some unique challenges. Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Well, first of all, everyone's all over the world, and how do you get uh microphones and headsets and things? So in our we had an amazing sound engineer and mixing team, and so they found this very specific set of gaming headphones. Uh, in fact, one set that I'm uh utilizing right now for this podcast. And so we had to, you know, I was responsible for shipping it to uh you know Yuval Harari in Israel and a little shtdel outside of Jerusalem, and to Bono in, I think he was in the UK or Dublin at the time, and then uh to uh you know, Kerry Washington, and I'm trying to think who else we had, you know, all kinds of people that we had on this podcast. It's season Dr.
James Duke:Fauci and uh and that was because and that was because it's a mic, I'm looking, they can't see you, right? It's just audio. So it's uh it's a headset with the microphones. The idea is everything had to be consistent, we can't control, so let's let's literally ship the microphone in the headset. That's fascinating.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, that they could put in the computer, and we recorded everything over Zoom, and uh yeah. So I I think Rashida was in a studio in Hollywood, Bill was at his office up in Washington State, and then our guest elsewhere, and we would do a I don't know, two-ish hour conversation that we'd cut down to about an hour, and then this last year they did a new podcast um called Unconfuse Me with Bill Gates, and so I got to play a smaller role helping out with uh with that podcast as well, and they had great guests. There's an amazing quest love episode and Seth Rogan and his wife Lauren. Um so yeah, I mean super interesting conversations, and uh again, just a new skill set that I got to learn as a producer, and um it was super rewarding and also you know really sparked an interest in audio as a medium and and why it's important and and you know that I mean there's podcasters like Phoebe and Lauren who do the criminal podcasts, like there is just as much artistry that goes into those podcasts as there is any feature film or TV series or anything. And and so to get to work with uh that level of of artist and craft person was just such a privilege.
James Duke:Yeah, there's some there's some really impressive things happening right now. It's it's it's uh you know, everything is cyclical, and uh it feels like these podcasts are it's back to it's back to the radio from the 1920s and 30s, and yeah, it's just it's just fascinating. Uh I I want to make sure before we leave, I want to give people heads up. I don't know when they'll listen to this podcast, but you've got another film coming out, and this one's gonna be in theaters in November. And uh this is a really interesting project. Can you tell uh tell people a little bit about uh a journey to Bethlehem?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so I'm an executive producer on Journey to Bethlehem, which is a stylized uh nativity musical from writer, director, songwriter, and so much more, Adam Anders. Um, Adam had produced all of the music for Glee and worked on Rock of Ages and all kinds of big musicals. And this was a passion project of his 15 years in the making. He and his wife uh co-wrote all of the songs. We've got um Milo Mannheim stars as Joseph, Fiona Paloma as Mary, Antonio Banderas plays King Herod, uh Lecrae plays the Angel Gabriel. I mean, it's it's it's really it's a it's a wonderful, really fun family film. It's a musical. Um and yeah, it's exciting to be a part of because it's you know, it's an intimity story, so obviously there are faith elements, but um I think we've avoided some of the pitfalls that um some of those types of films struggle with. You know, it's we hope that it's a film that people, regardless of their faith traditions, can enjoy because it's a really it's a sweet love story. There's no heavy-handed preachy message. Um it's I yeah, it's pretty exciting. So it comes out November 10th in theaters from uh Sonya firm films, uh, Monarch Media was the other uh production company on that film. And so yeah, Adam and I are now partnering in a new joint venture called Nightlight that we're looking to get after um family and then also films that you know are either you know sort of faith adjacent or or discuss conversations of faith in hopefully a really high quality and universally appealing way.
James Duke:And and did you get a how did you get connected to the film? Was it through you you were friends with Adam before? And like how did you how did you come on board?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so Adam and I had been talking about starting a company for a few years and were you know starting to put things together during the pandemic. I also have my company All Night Diner. Um and uh he was getting this movie off the ground and felt like I could be an additional uh asset on the the larger producing team and invited me to participate. And so they were making that film in Spain while we were in post on Sitting Bars with Cake. And so um just helped weigh in on casting and cuts. And um, you know, they had a number of other great producers on the film, but um, I'm I'm excited for people to get to see it. The first single uh is out right now in streaming platforms um called Can We Make This Work. And I think once people start to hear the music, it's gonna get them excited just because um yeah, I mean, just it's just such such great music.
James Duke:Excellent. Well, um, I'm looking forward to it, and I know my kids are looking forward to it as well. I've I showed them the trailer, I think it was last month or whatever it is that came out, and they were my kids were like, Wait, is that is that Puss in Boots? I was like, Yeah, that's Puss in Boots. Yeah, that's that's uh that's Lecrae. They got and and is that the guy from for King and Country? They got all excited. Yeah, exactly. It's it's it's fun. Yeah, well, hey, listen, this has been um just a fantastic conversation. I um I so love you and appreciate you. I just um everything you've got going on. I I just um uh you're just a man of integrity and honor, and I'm just grateful for your friendship. And um sitting in bars with cake is out right now. People need to watch it. And it's just a it's just a um it's a great film uh to just sit and relax in front of the TV at Amazon and uh turn on your Amazon Prime and um and just watch this kind of beautiful story unfold of these two friends and uh what they go through and and uh and everyone be on the lookout for Journey to Bethlehem when it comes out in November.
SPEAKER_02:Thanks, Jimmy. It's such a privilege and uh and thanks for creating just a platform for this type of conversation. It's a it's a service to so many.
James Duke:Nick, um, I always like to uh pray for my guests before we leave. Would you allow me to do that? Please. Heavenly Father, thank you for uh just this time uh today. Thank you for Nick. Thank you for everything you've got going on in his life. Uh, we just uh we just pray right now a blessing, um, a blessing on him and his family, God. I pray that you would um um watch over his family. I pray that you would protect uh him and his wife and his kids. Pray you would um strengthen their relationships and um fill them full of courage. And um, God, I just uh we pray for the projects he's got going on. God, we pray that um uh you would just uh these projects would find the audiences that you uh that that need them. And and God, I specific we specifically pray for uh, as Nick described, that he'd be able to create beauty, that he'd be get to be a part of projects that that um that uh create beauty in the world and put beauty out there in the world. And and God, we just pray that that um uh he would sense your presence in uh in all those opportunities. And uh we love you, God. We pray this in Jesus' name and your promises we stand. Amen. Thank you for listening to the Act One podcast, celebrating over 20 years as the premier training program for Christians in Hollywood. Act One is a Christian community of entertainment industry professionals who train and equip storytellers to create works of truth, goodness, and beauty. The Act One program is a division of Master Media International. To financially support the mission of Act One or to learn more about our programs, visit us online at Act OneProgram.com. And to learn more about the work of Master Media, go to MasterMedia.com.